Kreiger makes fun of Broncos offseason to date

[eddie mac]

http://www.rockymountainnews.com/drmn/sports_columnists/article/0,1299,DRMN_83_4555553,00.html

Broncos consumed by fixation on Browns
Dave Krieger

Musings for a Monday morning on the beginning of the Kenard Lang Era and other promising omens . . .
• Was that a parade I saw Friday night on Larimer Street or just last call?

• Adding Lang to Courtney Brown, Gerard Warren and Michael Myers gives the Broncos the entire 2004 Browns starting defensive line.

• Of course, the 2004 Browns went 4-12.

• How that happened is just a mystery.

• My sources tell me the Broncos feel their big mistake last year was starting three former Browns instead of four.

• So they let Trevor Pryce move on to . . . Baltimore?

• It should have been Cleveland.

• Including Ebenezer Ekuban, the Broncos now have five former Browns linemen on the roster.

• Not only that, they were trying to schedule Lou Groza for a physical later this week until they found out he was dead.

• Lang is not exactly John Abraham, the Jets pass rusher now caught in a tug of war between Atlanta and Seattle. Abraham, 27, has recorded at least 9.5 sacks in four of his six NFL seasons.

• Lang, 31, never has recorded that many in a season, although he did have eight once and seven twice. Last year, the Browns moved him to outside linebacker. He lost 25 pounds and recorded two sacks.

• So now he's back to defensive end. Presumably, he has spent the off-season eating.

• The Broncos will tell you it's crazy to pay big bucks in free agency. Smarter to pay reasonable prices for undervalued assets like, say, linebacker Nate Webster, who has played four games in the past two seasons.

• Lots of upside there. If the guy gets on the field, he's overachieving.

• But help me here. From last season's 13-3 team, the Broncos have lost regulars Pryce, Mike Anderson and Jeb Putzier. They have added Lang and Webster.

• Defensive coordinator Larry Coyer said after the loss in the AFC Championship Game that he needed to get pressure on the quarterback from the front four. Then the Broncos whiffed on Abraham and Andre Carter, the best pass rushers available.

• True, if Lang gets back to seven or eight sacks that will be more than any Broncos lineman had last season, so he might get a parade after all.

• Can't say I blame the Broncos for dropping out of the T.O. sweeps. The Cowboys' $5 million signing bonus was $5 million more than T.O. deserved.

• If not for Jerry Jones, maybe the league could have enforced a Jerk Rule with a contract that required T.O. to shut up and play. But after disrupting two teams in two tries, he didn't deserve a dime of guaranteed money up front.

• It's a gamble that might work out for Jones, but it was exactly the wrong message to send. Act like an egomaniac, twice, and you still get a big payday if you're talented enough.

[fontaine]

We re-signed Warren/Lepsis and now signed Lang/Webster for depth.

Fine. Not great, not bad.

The Draft will determine it all.

[Odysseus]

Broncos brought in Dinger which will actually bring some impact on passing offense. He actually knows the Broncos offense. Sweet. We promoted Dennison to OC which maintains continuity and OL integrity. We didn't lose our key starters. We did lose our aging ones. Jeb is replaceable. How many big guys who run fast and but can't block are in the NFL?

Let's compare....

Chiefs swapped Dick for Herm and stood pat on the sinking ship defense. Oh goodie. Of course their aging offensive line is not going to be a problem.

Chargers tossed there entire season on an untested rookies arm. Whose the backup QB there again? Talk about throwing your future in the Brees.

Raiders did the dead zombie approach raiding the coaching cemetary for a blast from the past.

Gosh darn Andy! Things sure are going swell!

[chrisp]

I agree - the Broncos offseason activities look pretty poor.....untill you have a look at some of the local competition that is....:giggle:

[delany]

Its a marathon not a sprint Kreiger.

[Arkansas Bronco]

Funny take on the off-season so far but it is going to be better then what he is making it out to be.

[Rascal]

Broncos brought in Dinger which will actually bring some impact on passing offense. He actually knows the Broncos offense. Sweet. We promoted Dennison to OC which maintains continuity and OL integrity. We didn't lose our key starters. We did lose our aging ones. Jeb is replaceable. How many big guys who run fast and but can't block are in the NFL?

Let's compare....

Chiefs swapped Dick for Herm and stood pat on the sinking ship defense. Oh goodie. Of course their aging offensive line is not going to be a problem.

Chargers tossed there entire season on an untested rookies arm. Whose the backup QB there again? Talk about throwing your future in the Brees.

Raiders did the dead zombie approach raiding the coaching cemetary for a blast from the past.

Gosh darn Andy! Things sure are going swell!

Who cares about our AFC West buddies? They still suck. Our goal is the SB...not the AFC West title.

[fontaine]

Krieger cleary hasn't heard about our new secret weapon Corey Jackson, who's so good that we've just signed on yet another DE in Kenard Lang.

[Dagmar]

That article is pretty funny though. I do wish we'd signed Carter.

[2KBack]

I don't see the humor, it's the same old BRowns lineman suck joke, which was old by game 3 lasts season

[Odysseus]

Who cares about our AFC West buddies? They still suck. Our goal is the SB...not the AFC West title.

I watch the season one game at a time. We still have to prove it each Sunday. If you want to have homefield advantage you have to whip the crap out of your AFC West buddies. I think getting the AFCW crown two years in a row isn't a bad goal to start with this early in the off season.

[ludo21]

I LOVE our offseason thus far. Great job by Shanny, the naysyaers will be eating crow next season. BUT, this was funny!

Lots of upside there. If the guy gets on the field, he's overachieving

[Rascal]

I watch the season one game at a time. We still have to prove it each Sunday. If you want to have homefield advantage you have to whip the crap out of your AFC West buddies. I think getting the AFCW crown two years in a row isn't a bad goal to start with this early in the off season.

I could care less about the AFC west title. SB or bust.

[TD30]

I could care less about the AFC west title. SB or bust.

Amen

[Clockwork Orange]

Kreiger just wishes that his column was anywhere near as witty as the one Bob Kravitz used to put out there. It isn't.

[12th man]

I don't like this guy. Always the pessimist. He reminds me of the sports caster on the movie Any Given Sunday. He looks at our coach/team in a negative way, and he tries to sound wity doing. Well, it's not funny or witty making fun of the "browncos." that got old real quick. the fact of the matter is they did real good here and Kreiger is talking out of his ass. When he writes his ****, it sounds like he makes himself sound smarter than the Mastermind himself. Krieger dosn't have a fvckin clue. He's just a b1tch writter. We have a hall of fame coach, a top notch organization, and a pretty dominant team, yet he b1tches. he's a fag.

[eddie mac]

Thought the Webster stab was amusing.

"Lot's of upside there. If he hits the field he's overachieving."

[JCMElway]

Who cares? Krieger's always been a pessimistic prick.

[Popps]

The off-season has been ho-hum, thus far. Glad to see Lepsis and Warren staying, but we need some major help... and I'm just not sure it's going to come from the draft. Once again, how many quick-impact D-linemen go in the late first round every year? Not to mention that Shanahan seems to hate the idea of using 1st round picks to improve the d-line.

Right now, we've got one solid player in the middle of that line, no one worth a squirt at the ends... and don't even have another starting tackle.

Considering the line is our biggest weakness, I'd say it's been a bit disappointing so far.

[Odysseus]

I could care less about the AFC west title. SB or bust.

Geez. Are you guys going to start getting all queened out again weeping bitter tears because Pat hasn't delivered you any jewelry? It's not even pre season and already misty eyed? I guess I should set up the suicide hotlines for the draft day.

[Hercules Rockefeller]

With Kizla and Lincicome in town it should take work to be Denver's worst sports columnist, and yet Krieger takes the title with ease. Who cares what he thinks?

[spdirty]

With Kizla and Lincicome in town it should take work to be Denver's worst sports columnist, and yet Krieger takes the title with ease. Who cares what he thinks?


I think Linicome is the worst. I cannot read anything he writes, for fear of wasting priceless minutes of my life. Kiszla is a chump, but I like reading him every time the local teams do well, just to see him eat crow. Krieger sucks, but I'll read him every now and then. He's just trying to stir the pot and piss everyone off.

I miss Paige and Kravitz. At least they were somewhat fair, although I heard when Paige first started he was worse than Kiszla.

[Archie]

I think Linicome is the worst. I cannot read anything he writes, for fear of wasting priceless minutes of my life. Kiszla is a chump, but I like reading him every time the local teams do well, just to see him eat crow. Krieger sucks, but I'll read him every now and then. He's just trying to stir the pot and piss everyone off.

I miss Paige and Kravitz. At least they were somewhat fair, although I heard when Paige first started he was worse than Kiszla.

I agree - I think Linicome is a waste of ink. Bad enough to do it once or twice - every paper does that. But to have this guy as the lead sports editorialist for the last almost 10 years is ridiculous. I just want someone who is interesting and fun to read and at least occasionally makes valid points. If Linicome has made a valid point in the last couple of years I missed it because he lost he so long ago...

[maven]

Funny take on the off-season so far but it is going to be better then what he is making it out to be.

It should get better from here. Other than re-signing a few players, the only FA activity has been two backup players.

[watermock]

I never thought I would say this, but I miss Woody. (Professor Screwloose)...He tranfered to the camera well.

Abraham was too pricey, but I'm kinda baffled about Carter. Dallas stepped on their dick for a dick so that was amusing. He's talented and he will be a model citizen for say...12 weeks. He's got to be humbled...oh wait...was that him in that white pimp suit mugging for the camera?

I honestly thought we would of made at least one major signing. But lets get real, J. Lewis looked like a turd last year. I would of liked Carter and Archuletta.

As noted, it's a marathon and there will still be some cuts ect. We might still make a trade...there is the draft... I think many of us are kinda confused why we have gotten an impact player to "put us over the top" since we came so close last year. I'm happy for "spittin' Bill", because he's worked tirelessly and he's old school. I just didn't like it at our expense. It's no shame to get to the AFC game and lose to the eventual champ. It just seemed like all the pieces were in place...low body count, home field, I was so exausted by the time the game started, then when we fell behind 24-3, I had to lay down and woke up in the third quarter. We had the ball down 24-10...hope was there...then it fell apart again.

[Odysseus]

I never thought I would say this, but I miss Woody. (Professor Screwloose)...He tranfered to the camera well.

My best sports news comes from right here. Screw the mainstream press.

[Rascal]

Geez. Are you guys going to start getting all queened out again weeping bitter tears because Pat hasn't delivered you any jewelry? It's not even pre season and already misty eyed? I guess I should set up the suicide hotlines for the draft day.

Where did I say I was misty eyed or that the offseason had been a bust?

I simply said I don't care if the rest of the AFC west goes down the drain. Fact is we haven't made any improvements from last year that would result in us going up the next level. We are close no doubt, but as of yet we have yet to make the jump.

Oh....and the worst is burger bill easily.

[Hulamau]

Who cares about our AFC West buddies? They still suck. Our goal is the SB...not the AFC West title.


Absolutely agree Rascal, we should not judge our success by beating out our AFC fodder for which team made has the least crappy FA decisions!

We are on the verge of winning the whole league and yet we have definitely been more tentative and have taken a few steps back ... SO FAR ... relative to some of the genuine contenders out there.

The draft is fine and all and key to the future, but rarely do you get a playmaker at #22 or #29 that makes a major difference in his rookie year, so I really feel our two remaining chances to really improve substaintially from here ... for this season ... is via a big trade, either during draft day or before June cuts, or by bundling some draft picks from this year and possibly next to move up for a Mario Williams or a Vernon Davis type guy who stands a reasonable, but not certain, chance of starting and making a big impact right away.

[bendog]

I dunno. I'd take Tubbs or Woolfork.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/football/2004/draft/breakdowns/by_round/1.html

Wouldn't mind Joseph or Brayton either.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/football/2003/draft/breakdowns/by_round/1.html

some decent te's there too.

[yavoon]

if we could actually start engleberger and lang I'd be ok w/ it. there is IMO a more insidious problem then straight talent(though surely our line is not greatly talented) and that is this idea that "our lineman aren't suppose to get sacks." if this is true and our line's job is to look for the run when they should be trying to get to the qb then we have a much deeper problem then whoever we walk out there.

[RMT]

That article is pretty funny though. I do wish we'd signed Carter.


the Redskins overpaid for Carter. He wasn't worth half of what he got. I'm glad we let him go. Plus, we know what Carter brought to the table (not much) so a rookie couldn't fare much worse (and he'll come cheaper).

[yavoon]

the Redskins overpaid for Carter. He wasn't worth half of what he got. I'm glad we let him go. Plus, we know what Carter brought to the table (not much) so a rookie couldn't fare much worse (and he'll come cheaper).

carter did get 12.5 sacks his sophomore season.

[RMT]

carter did get 12.5 sacks his sophomore season.

That's called a "one hit wonder" ... I prefer to think about Janet Jackson's song "what have you done for me lately"? Not a whole lot.

[yavoon]

That's called a "one hit wonder" ... I prefer to think about Janet Jackson's song "what have you done for me lately"? Not a whole lot.

drowned on a bad team w/ a few injuries and a position change. Its not like u'd EVER be able to stomach paying a player who actually has done something lately anyway:)

[Garcia Bronco]

Kreger sounds like a dumbass...please...if anyone knows him...tell him I said so.

[Garcia Bronco]

My best sports news comes from right here. Screw the mainstream press.


REP!

[Merlin]

Is not just the AFCW chumps who have done nothing to get better. The so called teams in the next level ALL got weaker. Pitts got weaker, as did Indy and NE. Of the three players lost only Putz was probably a factor. However, Denver's young players will be even better next yr, so I expect the D to get better. Also the O will continue to progress (especially if there is something to Terrel). Remember, despite the whining, Denver's 3rd down performance in the last half of the season was actually in the top 10 in both O and D. They stunk against Pitt, but I think that may have something to do with the DL philosophy, and I am hoping that was related to the youth and injuries at CB. With just a couple of good acquisitions (not necessarily all world) through the draft, trade, or players hired after the cuts, this team could get enough parts to go all the way.

Until Indy, Pitt and/or NE start improving (instead of losing critical players), then I think Denver should not be considered second tier to them.

[Atlas]

We re-signed Warren/Lepsis and now signed Lang/Webster for depth.

Fine. Not great, not bad.

The Draft will determine it all.

THat's a little more opportunistic than you usually are?? What's up with that?:poke:

and by the way I agree. The offseason has just started and people better prepare to eat crow when Denver comes through.

[Atlas]

the Redskins overpaid for Carter. He wasn't worth half of what he got. I'm glad we let him go. Plus, we know what Carter brought to the table (not much) so a rookie couldn't fare much worse (and he'll come cheaper).

Carter has 18 sacks the last 3 years............. and that is worth $6 million a year??thwack

If that is the case than Abe is worth at least $11 million a year with a $20 million signing bonus.

[manchambo]

My best sports news comes from right here. Screw the mainstream press.

So you consider a bunch of diehard Broncos fans chanting "all is well, all is well," to be sports news. Interesting.

[Requiem]

We'll be able to find playmakers at the #22 and #29 picks. Atleast, I hope. With the depth of this draft, we certainly should be able to. Hell, we came out big with Williams (2nd) and Foxworth (3rd) last year. With all the picks we have, I'm sure we'll land a guy or two who can play a big role for us.

[Garcia Bronco]

So you consider a bunch of diehard Broncos fans chanting "all is well, all is well," to be sports news. Interesting.

That's not the news...that's the reaction to the news.

[Edskins_RVA]

Carter has 18 sacks the last 3 years............. and that is worth $6 million a year??thwack

If that is the case than Abe is worth at least $11 million a year with a $20 million signing bonus.
He was moved to OLB for the last 2 seasons, which brought his sack totals way down.. Also keep in mind that he played for the niners.. C'mon, the niners!.. Ha! Check out the stats from his first couple of years..

By the way, he's Rubin Carter's kid and has a soft spot for Denver, who clearly wanted him also. Skins just know how to "woo" the players they want.. :strong:

[Vegas_Bronco]

All is well, all is well...

[Atlas]

. Skins just know how to "woo" the players they want..

Yeah they know how to woo. They gave an average player $30 million

[maher_tyler]

I don't see the humor, it's the same old BRowns lineman suck joke, which was old by game 3 lasts season

No kidding...i'm sick of hearing the term browncos

[Mediator12]

He was moved to OLB for the last 2 seasons, which brought his sack totals way down.. Also keep in mind that he played for the niners.. C'mon, the niners!.. Ha! Check out the stats from his first couple of years..

By the way, he's Rubin Carter's kid and has a soft spot for Denver, who clearly wanted him also. Skins just know how to "woo" the players they want.. :strong:

1. One year at OLB.

2. Bryant Young had more sacks at DT for the NINERS than any Redskin or Bronco for that matter. Fundamental Attribution error. One does not have any connection to an athlete's value.

3. Daniel snyder's Idea of wooing is more $ than a player is worth outside of Champ Bailey.

[Kaylore]

By the way, he's Rubin Carter's kid and has a soft spot for Denver, who clearly wanted him also. Skins just know how to "woo" the players they want.. :strong:
Uhh What is it with you? Every thread that points out Snyder overpaid for Carter (surprise) you swoop in and have to explain he's the greatest offseason acquisition ever.

I thought you might have different than other Redskin fans but you all eventually show you adhere to the same sacred code:

1.) Blindly defend every off-season acquisition, no matter how overpriced, curious or plain stupid as pure genius. Despite more than a decade of mediocrity from your organization, never change your stance in this regard.

2.) Defend every member of your team as immediate pro-bowl quality, and at least top three at his respective position. Any poor performance in previous years is directly related to that player not being a Redskin. Simply being a 'Skin means you are better than other players. Complain when any Redskin starter isn't named to the pro-bowl.

3. Any player that leaves Washington to play for another team, especially for more money, is to be considered a horrible player and/or person. They are immediately to be considered bad players, and liabilities in whatever it was that they did. All such players are to be ridiculed regularly. All evidence of said player performing above poor levels should be dismissed as "one play" and media hype.

[Atlas]

Uhh What is it with you? Every thread that points out Snyder overpaid for Carter (surprise) you swoop in and have to explain he's the greatest offseason acquisition ever.

I thought you might have different than other Redskin fans but you all eventually show you adhere to the same sacred code:

1.) Blindly defend every off-season acquisition, no matter how overpriced, curious or plain stupid as pure genius. Despite more than a decade of mediocrity from your organization, never change your stance in this regard.

2.) Defend every member of your team as immediate pro-bowl quality, and at least top three at his respective position. Any poor performance in previous years is directly related to that player not being a Redskin. Simply being a 'Skin means you are better than other players. Complain when any Redskin starter isn't named to the pro-bowl.



Well, Kahn you have to admit if Denver overpaid for both Carter and Archueleta this place would be going nuts too with S.B. talk. It doesn't make it right. If I was a Redskin fan I would be very eager for this season to begin. Afterall who knows what the Redskins will look like next year.

[Kaylore]

Well, Kahn you have to admit if Denver overpaid for both Carter and Archueleta this place would be going nuts too with S.B. talk. It doesn't make it right. If I was a Redskin fan I would be very eager for this season to begin. Afterall who knows what the Redskins will look like next year.
Injuries, luck, and their conference got better. It won't be a cake walk. eventually some of those high firsts all those NFC teams have been getting are going to turn their teams around. Look at the Bears.

And actually I'd be upset if we threw that much at Carter. If we spent a ton of dough on a position we need no help at like Safety I'd be throwing things.

Our "let's wait and see" line holds true for being overly optimistic. I'm not prepared to judge this team (or the Redskins) until I see the final product.

[Atlas]

Injuries, luck, and their conference got better. It won't be a cake walk. eventually some of those high firsts all those NFC teams have been getting are going to turn their teams around. Look at the Bears.

And actually I'd be upset if we threw that much at Carter. If we spent a ton of dough on a position we need no help at like Safety I'd be throwing things.

Our "let's wait and see" line holds true for being overly optimistic. I'm not prepared to judge this team (or the Redskins) until I see the final product.

I agree. I'm not sold on the Redskins. I don't like their Q.B. or their LBs. But if your a Skin fan you have reason to be opptimistic.

I also agree seeing Denver's cap shape and how money is being spent they are just better off looking for bargins and maybe making a trade. Watch their pennies this year then they can be more active next year.

[fontaine]

there is IMO a more insidious problem then straight talent(though surely our line is not greatly talented) and that is this idea that "our lineman aren't suppose to get sacks." if this is true and our line's job is to look for the run when they should be trying to get to the qb then we have a much deeper problem then whoever we walk out there.

Why do you think that?

You can't bring talent and speed when there is little there to begin with. Our DL last year was good against the run since we had three "power" type players in Brown/Warren/Myers who are strong and stout enough to do it. However, we didn't have enough speed, especially outside.

The bull rush techniques, IMO, are getting old since most QBs are asked to throw the ball in around 3 secs or less. We can generate pressure and we did. Our QB hurries were up there, but they weren't due to Brown or Pryce for that matter storming from the outside using their blazing quickness but from an overall push using strength from guys like Warren/Brown. This is where we missed a closer, a speed rusher from the outside that could get a lot of cleanup sacks from the bull rush and interior rush. Guys like Berry, Heywerd could do this for us, but Pryce wasn't a speed rusher. Ever.

Also our rookie CBs played 8-10 yards off so it became much easier for the QB to throw the quick pass on a three step drop to a bigger WR and hope he got YAC but our CBs did a solid job in tackling we got loads of ints that way as well.

I don't think there's a attitude or philosophy of neglecting pass rush. If anything, the FO has been guilty of not paying pass rushers (Berry, Heywerd), their market value. That is a problem considering the guys we signed to replace them were usually worthless in that area. The draft will give ample opportunity for the FO to start building up our speed rush and I expect us to target two pass rushers in this area.

[Edskins_RVA]

Uhh What is it with you? Every thread that points out Snyder overpaid for Carter (surprise) you swoop in and have to explain he's the greatest offseason acquisition ever.

I thought you might have different than other Redskin fans but you all eventually show you adhere to the same sacred code:

1.) Blindly defend every off-season acquisition, no matter how overpriced, curious or plain stupid as pure genius. Despite more than a decade of mediocrity from your organization, never change your stance in this regard.

2.) Defend every member of your team as immediate pro-bowl quality, and at least top three at his respective position. Any poor performance in previous years is directly related to that player not being a Redskin. Simply being a 'Skin means you are better than other players. Complain when any Redskin starter isn't named to the pro-bowl.

3. Any player that leaves Washington to play for another team, especially for more money, is to be considered a horrible player and/or person. They are immediately to be considered bad players, and liabilities in whatever it was that they did. All such players are to be ridiculed regularly. All evidence of said player performing above poor levels should be dismissed as "one play" and media hype. Alright, here we go again..

1. Blindly defend?! I belive I provide reasons for my opinions.. You can disagree, but let's be ridiculous or "blindly" criticize my opinions just because you do disagree.. I've already stated on this board numerous times that I agree Dan has made numeroud FA mistakes in the past. However (once again), Joe is now is charge and doing things right.. We did go the 2nd round of the playoffs last year people!! This is NOT 5 years ago...

2. Never done that... I have of course heard Bronco fans say similar things about their favorite players, but I have I called anyone out on that?!.. No..

3. Definitely not true.. I was just telling someone here the other day about how much I still like and admire Champ.. I'll also always love Lavar...

4. Let' not act like many in Denver didn't want Carter. He is a good, YOUNG, up&coming player.. I never stated he was a super-star.. Obviously he's got some talent and is considered a rising star.. Of course we have to wait until reality plays out to see what actually happens.. However, it's no more logical to say we overpaid for him than to assume he will kick a$$.. None of us know the answer to that yet...

5. He is NOT making $6m a year!! Those are contract #'s... I've explained how Skins structure contracts these days on numerous ocassions on this board.. How about getting a little knowledge before spouting off like the ignoramuses Len Pastabelly or Peter Queen... :~ohyah!:

[Edskins_RVA]

Injuries, luck, and their conference got better. It won't be a cake walk. eventually some of those high firsts all those NFC teams have been getting are going to turn their teams around. Look at the Bears.

And actually I'd be upset if we threw that much at Carter. If we spent a ton of dough on a position we need no help at like Safety I'd be throwing things.

Our "let's wait and see" line holds true for being overly optimistic. I'm not prepared to judge this team (or the Redskins) until I see the final product. Sorry Kay, didn't see this post before I responded to the other one.. Sounds like I overreacted to the last one...:kiss:

[extralife]

As a Niners fans, I'll let you guys onto a secret: Carter is basically a stiff. A softey. Whatever you want to call him besides 30 million dollar man.

[Edskins_RVA]

As a Niners fans, I'll let you guys onto a secret: Carter is basically a stiff. A softey. Whatever you want to call him besides 30 million dollar man. Why? Becuase he played out of position on the crappiest team in the league?! Of course you would say he sucks as he walks out the door.. Explain how he had 12.5 sacks at DE his 2nd year in the league? Wasn't he a first round draft pick?!

As I said before, he's NOT a super-star.. However, the Skins brain trust see the potential for him to be a super-star.. At this point, I'll trust Joe and Gregg. I think they might know what they are doing...

Good D-line play does run in his family afterall.. :wiggle:

[extralife]

Please try and find me a single Niners fan sad to see Carter go.

[Edskins_RVA]

Please try and find me a single Niners fan sad to see Carter go. Are there any left?! :~ohyah!:

Who cares.. I'm glad we got him! We need a good speed-rusher and I think Gregg Williams & Greg Blache will be able to maximize his potential... He will be playing DE and told to go get the QB.. All we need..

[eddie mac]

I agree. I'm not sold on the Redskins. I don't like their Q.B. or their LBs. But if your a Skin fan you have reason to be opptimistic.

I also agree seeing Denver's cap shape and how money is being spent they are just better off looking for bargins and maybe making a trade. Watch their pennies this year then they can be more active next year.

The cap isn't the issue Atlas. it's cash/signing bonuses. Looks like Pat has spent his dosh this year on Lepsis and Warren, ($20m or thereabouts). They obviously didn't feel Carter was worth $10m up front or Owens was worth the same. That may well have an effect on how much he's prepared to dish out next year and in reality the only players we'll need to re-sign are Cooper Carlisle and Ash who'll get the basic tender because he was a 1st rd pick anyway. Unless he totally breaks out this season in the yds/td categories no-one will give up a 1st rounder for him.

[Odysseus]

I have never heard anything bad about Carter before. Interesting.

The Broncos did a big spending spree awhile back after the stadium was completed and it didn't pan out. We went after players instead of chemistry and suffered.

For all we know the Broncos were just helping drive up the kid's market value.

[Hercules Rockefeller]

Ashley will be a UFA. he's not eligible to be an RFA.

[Edskins_RVA]

I have never heard anything bad about Carter before. Interesting.

The Broncos did a big spending spree awhile back after the stadium was completed and it didn't pan out. We went after players instead of chemistry and suffered.

For all we know the Broncos were just helping drive up the kid's market value.
I hadn't heard anything bad about him either, until he went to the Skins.. ;)

I understand what everyone has been saying about bringing in FA and it not working out because of problems with motivation, chemistry, etc. The Skins were a perfect example of this during Dan's early day. I still maintain that Dan has "grown up" and learned how to be a better owner. Getting Joe back is the best example of this. Dan has turned the keys over to Joe and is letting him drive (Dan's car of course:)). Joe is known for his ability to put a "team" together and build the right mentality. When it comes to players, he looks for character first and skill second.. If you go back and look at the old Skins teams from Joe's first tenure, you will not see a collection of the most skilled players. You will see a team of all-around solid players, w/ a few superstars, who had good character and heart.. Joe is an excellent motivator of people and knows how to build winning organizations (see NASCAR for another example).

The whole point of this rant is that you guys have to get out of the "old redskin" mindset and realize that the team is trying to do things the "right" way these days. We are just fortunate to have an incredibly wealthy owner who is willing to spend to make his team better and happens to be as big a Redskin fan as me! :wiggle:

Also, (from Carter himself), AC was only interviewing with the Skins and Broncs. This was out of deference to his dad (Rubin) who only had connections to these 2 teams (coached the Skins for a couple of years). Carter says that the Skins did more to make him feel "at home" and "wanted" than the Broncos, though he still loves and admires them as well (classy guy)... I don't think you guys would have been going after him so hard (and be so disappointed about it) if he really is an "average" player.. However, I do understand if Denver didn't want to pay his price. Dan will as long as it fits Joe's cap structure..

[Hercules Rockefeller]

I don't think you guys would have been going after him so hard (and be so disappointed about it) if he really is an "average" player..

Yeah, I'm terribly disappointed that Denver couldn't sign Carter. He might have had 12.5 sacks his second season, but he's only had 13 over the past 3. Regardless of how the deal is structured, $10M upfront and an average of $6M per is an overpayment for that level of production.

and simply getting Carter to visit does not mean Denver was going hard after him. He wasn't in town that long, which leads me to believe they found out what the Skins' offer was and told him good luck in DC.

[Odysseus]

So you consider a bunch of diehard Broncos fans chanting "all is well, all is well," to be sports news. Interesting.

You apparently weren't here last offseason. It was like watching a bunch of people turn into cannibals because they got stuck in traffic and had just missed lunch. It was like the suburban version of Apocalypse Now.

If you hear "all is well" you might want to look up from your keyboard and see where you are because you probably aren't here. This is a discussion group that is willing to take things on unlike the mainstream press.

Krieger was probably pissed because he was late on a deadline and just blew through it without thinking about it. He's a sports writer. He doesn't have to be accountable for what he says. Oddly enough around here you actually do.

[Edskins_RVA]

Yeah, I'm terribly disappointed that Denver couldn't sign Carter. He might have had 12.5 sacks his second season, but he's only had 13 over the past 3. Regardless of how the deal is structured, $10M upfront and an average of $6M per is an overpayment for that level of production.

and simply getting Carter to visit does not mean Denver was going hard after him. He wasn't in town that long, which leads me to believe they found out what the Skins' offer was and told him good luck in DC.
Very possible..

Those numbers, when stated that way, obviously don't seem good. But if he moves back to his natural position of DE on an already potent defense and gets his sack totals up to between 7-10 (with plenty of hurries), then he is definitely worth the money. The main weakness of the D last year was QB pressure. The more pressure we get from the DL, the more creative GW can be with his blitz packages and coverages.. If Carter fills this one gap, the whole team is better and our chances of getting farther improve..

Everything is about context.. :thumbsup:

[broncohaven]

Let's look at FA in reality. A lot of high end FAs have been signed, but by who? Look at the playoff teams from last year, and what have they done.

Colts-Lost their franchise runningback, and starters David Thornton and Larry Triplett. Have signed no one.

Steelers- Lost their Hall of Fame RB to retirement. Lost S Chris Hope. Lost Antwaan Randle El. Lost Kemo Von Oelhoffen. Added Rodney Bailey.

Washington- Lost S Matt Bowen. Lost LB Lavar Arrington. Lost S Ryan Clark. Lost CB Walt Harris. Lost TE Robert Royal. Lost S Omar Stoutmire. Added WR Antwaan Randle El. Added DE Andre Carter. Added QB Todd Collins. Added S Adam Archuleta.

Seahawks-Lost their best player in Steve Hutchinson. Lost WR Joe Jurevicious. Lost DE Rodney Bailey. Lost S Marquand Manuel. Lost LB Anthony Simmons. Added Russell Davis.

Bengals- Huge questions surrounding Franchise QB. Lost backup Jon Kitna. Lost TE Matt SChobel. Lost WR Kevin Walter. Added WR Antonio Chatman. Added S Dexter Jackson.

Patriots- Lost LB Willie McGinest. Lost WR David Givens. Lost WR Andre Davis. Lost LB Matt Chatham. Added Reche Caldwell.

Carolina- Lost S Marlon Mcree. Lost CB Dante Wesley. Lost LB Will Witherspoon. Added Maake Kemoeatu. Added DT Damione Lewis. Added C Justin Hartwig.

Giants-Lost CB Will Allen. Lost DT Kendrick Clancy. Lost G Jason Whittle. Lost S Shaun Williams. Added CB RW McQuarters. Added S Quentin Harris. Added CB Jason Bell.

Tampa Bay- Lost FB Jameel Cook. Lost S Dexter Jackson. Added G Toniu Fonoti.

Chicago- Added CB Dante Wesley.

Jacksonville- Lost LB Akin Ayodele. Added T Stockar Mcdougle. Added T Mike Williams. Added CB Brian Williams.

Denver- Lost perrenial underachiever DE Trevor Pryce. Lost Journeyman RB Mike Anderson. Added DE Lang.

It's hard to find a team on their that has made huge leaps forward. Everyone will argue the Skins, but they've lost depth. They're one tired knee away from starting Campbell at QB, and let's get real we're talking about Daniel Snyder here. He's signed every FA available in years past only to fail miserably. The homers will point to their savior Gibbs, but you can't develop cohesiveness with the way Snyder operates.

I don't see how Denver has lost ground to any of these teams, and they're the only team with two first round picks to work with. I don't get why we're so worried. We had the 2nd best record in the league last year, and we haven't lost ground to anyone who was in contention.

[Edskins_RVA]

Washington- Lost S Matt Bowen. Lost LB Lavar Arrington. Lost S Ryan Clark. Lost CB Walt Harris. Lost TE Robert Royal. Lost S Omar Stoutmire. Added WR Antwaan Randle El. Added DE Andre Carter. Added QB Todd Collins. Added S Adam Archuleta.

You fogot: Added WR Brandon Lloyd, TE Christian Fauria
Let's see..
S Matt Bowen - Was injured or a backup for most of last 2 seasons
S Ryan Clark - Upgraded to Adam Archulta
TE Robert Royal - Upgraded to Christian Fauria
S Omar Stoutmire - Not lost yet - may be offered new contract (had 1 year deal)
CB Walt Harris - Overpaid nickel back who got burned or run over more often than not - This is an area that still needs to be addressed and will through draft and maybe lower lever FA (Jamar Fletcher is being pursued)
LB Lavar Arrington - Unfortunately, divorce had to happen.. (Still crying like the kid stuck in the middle) - This position also needs to be addressed in FA or Draft. (We still have Washington and Marshall in the other slots)
BL & ARE - Obvious upgrades at WR. Who else did we have other than Moss?!
Todd Collins - There for depth and knowledge (knows Saunders system)
Andre Carter - Upgrades & provides depth at the weakness of our D

I can't really see how weve lost anything here..


It's hard to find a team on their that has made huge leaps forward. Everyone will argue the Skins, but they've lost depth. They're one tired knee away from starting Campbell at QB, and let's get real we're talking about Daniel Snyder here. He's signed every FA available in years past only to fail miserably. The homers will point to their savior Gibbs, but you can't develop cohesiveness with the way Snyder operates.

See previous posts.. Already rebutted..


I don't see how Denver has lost ground to any of these teams, and they're the only team with two first round picks to work with. I don't get why we're so worried. We had the 2nd best record in the league last year, and we haven't lost ground to anyone who was in contention.

You shouldn't be worried! Denver will be, and is usually, one of the best teams in the AFC. I'm not here to try and convince any of you to like or love the Skins.. Just want to talk football with knowledgable fans and "set the record straight" when it comes to misconceptions about my team..

Afterall, I really do believe there is a good chance we might get to see a rematch in the SB! :thumbsup:

[eddie mac]

Ashley will be a UFA. he's not eligible to be an RFA.

Does his last year void then Herc because he's on the books for 2007?

2002 500000.00
2003 300000.00
2004 425000.00
2005 475000.00
2006 600000.00
2007 725000.00

[eddie mac]

You fogot: Added WR Brandon Lloyd, TE Christian Fauria
Let's see..
S Matt Bowen - Was injured or a backup for most of last 2 seasons
S Ryan Clark - Upgraded to Adam Archulta
TE Robert Royal - Upgraded to Christian Fauria
S Omar Stoutmire - Not lost yet - may be offered new contract (had 1 year deal)
CB Walt Harris - Overpaid nickel back who got burned or run over more often than not - This is an area that still needs to be addressed and will through draft and maybe lower lever FA (Jamar Fletcher is being pursued)
LB Lavar Arrington - Unfortunately, divorce had to happen.. (Still crying like the kid stuck in the middle) - This position also needs to be addressed in FA or Draft. (We still have Washington and Marshall in the other slots)
BL & ARE - Obvious upgrades at WR. Who else did we have other than Moss?!
Todd Collins - There for depth and knowledge (knows Saunders system)
Andre Carter - Upgrades & provides depth at the weakness of our D

I can't really see how weve lost anything here..



See previous posts.. Already rebutted..



You shouldn't be worried! Denver will be, and is usually, one of the best teams in the AFC. I'm not here to try and convince any of you to like or love the Skins.. Just want to talk football with knowledgable fans and "set the record straight" when it comes to misconceptions about my team..

Afterall, I really do believe there is a good chance we might get to see a rematch in the SB! :thumbsup:

Stoutmire has already signed with another team. Cant remember who but it might have been the Saints.

[Edskins_RVA]

Stoutmire has already signed with another team. Cant remember who but it might have been the Saints.
Missed that! Sorry..

[broncohaven]

You fogot: Added WR Brandon Lloyd, TE Christian Fauria
Let's see..
S Matt Bowen - Was injured or a backup for most of last 2 seasons
S Ryan Clark - Upgraded to Adam Archulta
TE Robert Royal - Upgraded to Christian Fauria
S Omar Stoutmire - Not lost yet - may be offered new contract (had 1 year deal)
CB Walt Harris - Overpaid nickel back who got burned or run over more often than not - This is an area that still needs to be addressed and will through draft and maybe lower lever FA (Jamar Fletcher is being pursued)
LB Lavar Arrington - Unfortunately, divorce had to happen.. (Still crying like the kid stuck in the middle) - This position also needs to be addressed in FA or Draft. (We still have Washington and Marshall in the other slots)
BL & ARE - Obvious upgrades at WR. Who else did we have other than Moss?!
Todd Collins - There for depth and knowledge (knows Saunders system)
Andre Carter - Upgrades & provides depth at the weakness of our D

I can't really see how weve lost anything here..



See previous posts.. Already rebutted..



You shouldn't be worried! Denver will be, and is usually, one of the best teams in the AFC. I'm not here to try and convince any of you to like or love the Skins.. Just want to talk football with knowledgable fans and "set the record straight" when it comes to misconceptions about my team..

Afterall, I really do believe there is a good chance we might get to see a rematch in the SB! :thumbsup:I didn't say you lost any ground, but despite all the money Snyder has doled out I don't think you've leapt ahead. The fact remains that your QBs status is tenuous at best. Brunell was basically out of football until he was resurrected out of necessity last year. He's another year older, and was riding a bum knee towards the end of your run.

Getting a bunch of new faces to work as a unit is harder than you might imagine. We've seen this approach by Snyder too many times to count, and it hasn't worked at all. Why is this year different?