Police Apologize, Drop Charge Vs. Sheehan

[Bronco_Beerslug]

But of course, not in time for her and the congressman's wife to attend the State of Union Address.

-------------------------------------------------------
Police Apologize, Drop Charge Vs. Sheehan
By LAURIE KELLMAN, Associated Press Writer 17 minutes ago

WASHINGTON - Capitol Police dropped a charge of unlawful conduct against anti-war activist Cindy Sheehan on Wednesday and apologized for ejecting her and a congressman's wife from
President Bush's State of the Union address for wearing T-shirts with war messages.

"The officers made a good faith, but mistaken effort to enforce an old unwritten interpretation of the prohibitions about demonstrating in the Capitol," Capitol Police Chief Terrance Gainer said in a statement late Wednesday.

"The policy and procedures were too vague," he added. "The failure to adequately prepare the officers is mine."

The extraordinary statement came a day after police removed Sheehan and Beverly Young, wife of Rep. C.W. "Bill" Young, R-Fla., from the visitors gallery Tuesday night. Sheehan was taken away in handcuffs before Bush's arrival at the Capitol and charged with a misdemeanor, while Young left the gallery and therefore was not arrested, Gainer said.

"Neither guest should have been confronted about the expressive T-shirts," Gainer's statement said.

Gainer added that he was asking the U.S. attorney's office to drop the charge against Sheehan. The statement also said he apologized to the Youngs and "share the department's plans for avoiding this in the future."

"A similar message has been left with Mrs. Sheehan," Gainer said.

For his part, Bill Young said he was not necessarily satisfied.

"My wife was humiliated," he told reporters. He suggested that "sensitivity training" may be in order for Capitol Police.

A foreign-born American citizen who was the guest of Rep. Alcee Hastings (news, bio, voting record), D-Fla., also was taken by police from the gallery just above the House floor, Hastings said Wednesday.

The congressman met with Gainer and said he also requested a meeting with House Speaker
Dennis Hastert, R-Ill., about the incident.

"I'd like to find out more information," Hastings said in an interview, identifying the man only as being from Broward County in Florida. "He is a constituent of mine. I invited him proudly."

Sheehan's T-shirt alluded to the number of soldiers killed in
Iraq: "2245 Dead. How many more?" Capitol Police charged her with a misdemeanor for violating the District of Columbia's code against unlawful or disruptive conduct on any part of the Capitol grounds, a law enforcement official said. She was released from custody and flew home Wednesday to Los Angeles.

Young's shirt had just the opposite message: "Support the Troops — Defending Our Freedom."

The two women appeared to have offended tradition if not the law, according to several law enforcement and congressional officials. By custom, the annual address is to be a dignified affair in which the president reports on the state of the nation. Guests in the gallery who wear shirts deemed political in nature have, in past years, been asked to change or cover them up.

Rules dealing mainly with what people can bring and telling them to refrain from reading, writing, smoking, eating, drinking, applauding or taking photographs are outlined on the back of gallery passes given to tourists every day.

However, State of the Union guests don't receive any guidelines, Hanley said. "You would assume that if you were coming to an event like the State of the Union address you would be dressed in appropriate attire," she said.

___

Associated Press writer Liz Sidoti contributed to this report.
http://tinyurl.com/7easx

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

Hmmmm....I wonder if they would still be backpedalling if the wife of a republican congressman hadn't been with Sheehan?

[Bronco_Beerslug]

You know that free speech isn't really free these days don't you?


http://www.foxnews.com/images/191783/1_21_013106_sheehan_sotu.jpg
Anti-war activist Cindy Sheehan was arrested for wearing a t-shirt that said "2245 Dead. How many more?"

[Hogan11]

I'm surprised that Sheehan was invited at all.

[Rigs11]

How convenient that after she was made to leave and was arrested that they realized they had made a mistake.And that lady with the "support our troops" shirt wasn't arrested?

[Garcia Bronco]

LMAO...I'm glad they tossed her out.

"However, State of the Union guests don't receive any guidelines, Hanley said. "You would assume that if you were coming to an event like the State of the Union address you would be dressed in appropriate attire," she said."

And this part hits the nail on the head.

[Rigs11]

LMAO...I'm glad they tossed her out.

"However, State of the Union guests don't receive any guidelines, Hanley said. "You would assume that if you were coming to an event like the State of the Union address you would be dressed in appropriate attire," she said."

And this part hits the nail on the head.

That's the nazi spirit.Hilarious! By the way the same person who seated her and approved of her attire grabbed her and took her to a squad car when she unzipped her coat.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

I'm surprised that Sheehan was invited at all.

I'm not.

She has become the same sort of hated figure to the wingnuts as Michael Moore.

Rove knows he can use that to rally the faithful.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

That's the nazi spirit.

Exactly.

People like GB get upset when you use the word "nazi," but that's exactly the mindset they are representing.

I wonder what GB would say if the shoe was on the other foot and one of his cultural heroes was thrown out of the capitol for wearing a t-shirt that said "screw affirmative action" or some other right-wing slogan?

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

http://www.bartcop.com/lois-superman.jpg

[clarker]

Hmmmm....I wonder if they would still be backpedalling if the wife of a republican congressman hadn't been with Sheehan?Just like if Sheehan wasn't there at all you would give a damn if they threw out a Republican congressman's wife.

[RaiderH8r]

That's the nazi spirit.Hilarious! By the way the same person who seated her and approved of her attire grabbed her and took her to a squad car when she unzipped her coat.
House rules state that you can not protest from the gallery. It's in order to keep decorum. If you could sit up in the gallery and scream, and bitch and moan all day long Congress wouldn't get squat done. Senators and Representatives are told, repeatedly, to take their conversations off of the floor. This is ridiculous. I'm glad they bounced Sheehan, I'm glad they bounced Rep. Young's wife. Wear something appropriate for the occasion people. How truly lame.

[Bronco_Beerslug]

House rules state that you can not protest from the gallery. It's in order to keep decorum. If you could sit up in the gallery and scream, and b**** and moan all day long Congress wouldn't get squat done. Senators and Representatives are told, repeatedly, to take their conversations off of the floor. This is ridiculous. I'm glad they bounced Sheehan, I'm glad they bounced Rep. Young's wife. Wear something appropriate for the occasion people. How truly lame.
Another Bush lemming who approves of police action even though no law was broken. No wonder this country is so f*cked up!
They didn't "bounce" her they ARRESTED her.

I don't agree with half the stuff she is doing but Bush's repression of dissent is more dangerous than anything she could do.
She was arrested for wearing a shirt with the number of dead in Bush's war on it. She didn't say a word. Think about that.
There are NO laws that prohibit the wearing of a T-shirt to that forum.

And the congressman's wife on CNN today admitted to being so mad she blurted out obsenities to the officers. Sheehan never did any such thing. The congressman's wife was never arrested but Sheehan was.

[ak1971]

Cindy Sheehan in a T Shirt should be a crime no matter what the circumstances..lol

[El Guapo]

you liberals cry foul over EVERYTHING. Ha! I assume you all caught south park last night?? It was PERFECT! matt and trey hit both sides on the head, it was hilarious.

[Rascal]

House rules state that you can not protest from the gallery. It's in order to keep decorum. If you could sit up in the gallery and scream, and b**** and moan all day long Congress wouldn't get squat done. Senators and Representatives are told, repeatedly, to take their conversations off of the floor. This is ridiculous. I'm glad they bounced Sheehan, I'm glad they bounced Rep. Young's wife. Wear something appropriate for the occasion people. How truly lame.

Bingo. May not have been a law but it was the house rules and as such she must adbide by them while she was there. Since she wasn't obeying them she got tossed...Good. Maybe she shouldn't have been arrested, but she most certainly should have been kicked out.

[Bronco_Beerslug]

you liberals cry foul over EVERYTHING. Ha! I assume you all caught south park last night?? It was PERFECT! matt and trey hit both sides on the head, it was hilarious.
And the Bush lemmings defend anything he does including trampling over the "it's just a goddamned piece of paper".

Sad that so many in this country don't realize what they're giving up by supporting people who are stripping them of the very thing that made this country so great.

[Bronco_Beerslug]

Bingo. May not have been a law but it was the house rules and as such she must adbide by them while she was there. Since she wasn't obeying them she got tossed...Good. Maybe she shouldn't have been arrested, but she most certainly should have been kicked out.

Would you post the "rules" so we can all see them?

[Rascal]

http://www.rules.house.gov/

[Bronco_Beerslug]

This is the Bush world that Rascal and other Bush supporters are condoning.

Repress and hide all dissent even if that includes arresting them or herding them into temporary holding areas until Bush passes through or finishes speaking.

--------------------------------------------------
WASHINGTON – Responding to the number of examples of American voters being turned away, or removed from George W. Bush’s visits to their cities and states, Democratic National Committee Chairman Terry McAuliffe hosted a national conference call with Oregon teachers who were kicked out of an Oct. 14 Medford Bush rally for wearing T-shirts saying, "Protect Our Civil Liberties."

http://www.bend.com/images/cache/article/18754_1.jpg
Three Medford-area schoolteachers Janet Voorhees, Candice Julian, and Tania Tong were ejected from a Bush rally in Central Point, Oregon for wearing these shirts, which Bush event staff called.
http://tinyurl.com/9y7pt

[Bronco_Beerslug]

http://www.rules.house.gov/
Like I said, post the rules that state no T-shirt may be worn at the State of the Union Address.

[Rascal]

You are an idiot Slug. Where did I say "repress and hide all dessent"?

I said she broke the house rules as such she should have been kicked out, but I also said that she shouldn't have been arrested. Learn to read and comprehend.

[Rascal]

Like I said, post the rules that state no T-shirt may be worn at the State of Union Address.

I posted the rules like you asked. Look it up yourself.

[Bronco_Beerslug]

You are an idiot Slug. Where did I say "repress and hide all dessent"?

I said she broke the house rules as such she should have been kicked out, but I also said that she shouldn't have been arrested. Learn to read and comprehend.
For the third time post the rule that says no T-shirt may be worn at The State of the Union Address or is it possible you don't have a clue if there is such a thing?

[Rascal]

For the third time read the rules yourself.

Hell, you can't claim she was targeted especially as they kicked out the republican senators wife who had a T-shirt saying "suport the troops".

[Bronco_Beerslug]

For the third time read the rules yourself.

Hell, you can't claim she was targeted especially as they kicked out the republican senators wife who had a T-shirt saying "suport the troops".

You said there was a rule that says no one can wear a T-shirt, were you just making that up?

[Rascal]

Eat it slug.

Members should dress appropriately, which has traditionally been considered to include a coat and tie for male Members and appropriate attire for female Members; Members should not wear overcoats or hats on the floor while the House is in session. No eating, drinking, or smoking is permitted. The use of personal electronic equipment, including cellular phones and laptop computers, is banned on the floor of the House.

http://www.rules.house.gov/archives/debate_conduct.htm

note at the bottom says: All of the same cautions and prohibitions mentioned above with respect to conduct during debate in the Committe of the Whole ALSO APPLY TO CONDUCT IN THE HOUSE.

[Bronco_Beerslug]

Members should dress appropriately, which has traditionally been considered to include a coat and tie for male Members and appropriate attire for female Members; Members should not wear overcoats or hats on the floor while the House is in session. No eating, drinking, or smoking is permitted. The use of personal electronic equipment, including cellular phones and laptop computers, is banned on the floor of the House.

http://www.rules.house.gov/archives/debate_conduct.htm

note at thh bottom says: All of the same cautions and prohibitions mentioned above with respect to conduct during debate in the Committe of the Whole ALSO APPLY TO CONDUCT IN THE HOUSE.


Since you haven't posted anything that backs your original statement I'll go ahead and post something that does mine.

On Wednesday afternoon, U.S. Capitol Police Chief Terrance Gainer said neither woman should have been removed from the chamber. "We made a mistake," he told CNN.

He said an apology was made to Bill and Beverly Young, and the congressman has been told that Capitol officers will receive better training. He said they are operating under outdated guidance on House rules regarding demonstrations.
http://tinyurl.com/7byv9

[Rascal]

What are you talking about...I just posted something. Learn to read!!!

[Bronco_Beerslug]

What are you talking about...I just posted something. Learn to read!!!
Hilarious!
Once again, show me wear T-shirts are not permitted.

[Rascal]

uh...were it says appropriate attire. Coat and tie for men and similar attire for women. Your fishing trip is over.

[Antilles]

Picking fights over idiotic stuff like this is how the democratic party loses credibility. Ok, I understand that its not fair that she was arrested while what's his face's wife was merely escorted out. That's BS. Of course, we don't exactly know all the facts surrounding the arrest either. Maybe she was quasi-resisting? Who knows? She was there 4 hours and won't be charged. I've waited longer than 4 hours on a speeding ticket. But to turn this into a free-speech argument is ridiculous. There are TPM restrictions on speech for a reason. From what I can tell, the restrictions were applied more or less universally, if not correctly. The state of the union is not an appropriate venue for general public speech, nor should it be. It serves an important purpose, even if, like me, you can't stand the current administration, and it needs to remain distraction free. Chirst, our government has enough credibility issues without turning the SOTU into a damn circus.

[Rascal]

How dare you use logic...you're obviously a Bush leming. LOL

[Bronco_Beerslug]

uh...were it says appropriate attire. Coat and tie for men and similar attire for women. Your fishing trip is over.

Once again for the hearing and vision impaired......

on Wednesday afternoon, U.S. Capitol Police Chief Terrance Gainer said " he told CNN.






neither woman should have been removed from the chamber. "We made a mistake...He said they are operating under outdated guidance on House rules regarding demonstrations.,

[Rascal]

AGAIN FOR THE DUMBASS...
Members should dress appropriately, which has traditionally been considered to include a coat and tie for male Members and appropriate attire for female Members

SHE BROKE THE RULE ABOUT HER ATTIRE, I NEVER SAID ANYTHING ABOUT HER BREAKING THE RULE ABOUT DEMONSTRATION.

GET IT YET DUMMY?.

[Rascal]

You would argue with a dead horse that the earth is flat Slug if it suited your political agenda. You refuse to accept blatant facts that have been layed out in front of you. The rule says quite plainly that appropriate attire is required. Using common sense it would be obvious that T-shirts are not considered appropriate attire (since coat and tie was explicitly mentioned). If you want to be a dumb ass and continue to argue the earth is flat fine. I'm not going to waste any more of my time argueing with a leming.

[Bronco_Beerslug]

You would argue with a dead horse that the earth is flat Slug if it suited your political agenda. You refuse to accept blatant facts that have been layed out in front of you. The rule says quite plainly that appropriate attire is required. Using common sense it would be obvious that T-shirts are not considered appropriate attire (since coat and tie was explicitly mentioned). If you want to be a dumb ass and continue to argue the earth is flat fine. I'm not going to waste any more of my time argueing with a leming.

What a piece of work!. The police chief says the guidance is outdated and no one should have been removed and you are arguing A point that says "should" not it's a rule, or law, or anything else.

Face it, you have not shown anything that says T-shirts are not permitted. And just because you lost the argument and became angry doesn't mean you are any less wrong.

I do derive some pleasure in seeing you lose control on a message board though. :thumbs:

[Rascal]

Yeah I'm the one that lost my temper...whatever dude.

You are the one that first resorted to namecalling and first to use large font. If anything you are the one who lost control...i don't find it humorous I find it pitiful :(

The police chief said the guidance was outdated for demonstration...not the attire guidance. I said she shouldn't have been arrested, but she should have been kicked out.

So if your company at work says appropriate attire is suit and tie, you don't expect to be reprimanded or told to change should you show up in a t-shirt. You obviously have no corporate experience.

[alkemical]

obviously she wasn't in a 'free speech zone'.

[Rascal]

obviously she wasn't in a 'free speech zone'.

She should not have been arrested, but like the wife of the republican she was not in appropriate attire. As such they were correct in kicking them both out (regardless of what was on the t-shirt).

I wonder how much of an uproar you liberal lemings would be throwing if Cindy was never there, but the republican wife was thrown out for her t-shirt. I'm guessing this wouldn't even be a thread.

[alkemical]

Oh shut up you facist bootlicking neo-conservative nazi.

[Rascal]

Oh shut up you facist bootlicking neo-conservative nazi.

Hilarious!

[alkemical]

I'm actually serious.

I'm not a lefty. I was pointing out she wasn't in a free speech zone. Not to mention the new provisions in the new patriot act that allow police to arrest people for protest.

[Rascal]

I'm actually serious.

I'm not a lefty. I was pointing out she wasn't in a free speech zone. Not to mention the new provisions in the new patriot act that allow police to arrest people for protest.

I'll assume you are serious about standing in a free speech zone instead of the insult laden previous post :)

I agree with you about the free speech zone. I think it's a load of **** and against our constitutional rights.

[alkemical]

actually i'm serious. I'm sick and tired of all the finger pointing goes on while my country is getting raped by those who are (s)elected.

[Bronco_Beerslug]

Yeah I'm the one that lost my temper...whatever dude.

You are the one that first resorted to namecalling and first to use large font. If anything you are the one who lost control...i don't find it humorous I find it pitiful :(

The police chief said the guidance was outdated for demonstration...not the attire guidance. I said she shouldn't have been arrested, but she should have been kicked out.

So if your company at work says appropriate attire is suit and tie, you don't expect to be reprimanded or told to change should you show up in a t-shirt. You obviously have no corporate experience.

Reading comprehension has eluded you today, no doubt about that. Where did I call you any names? And post the whole quote by the police chief ...

neither woman should have been removed from the chamber. "We made a mistake

[defenseman]

Wait until the truth comes out with respect to the surveillance leaks, and the fact that, the democratic senate has pointed the finger at the white house staffers. It will turn around and end up being the paper getting it from some source other than that. And, when the american public learns the damage done to the intelligence networks across the country, let alone the WORLD, well , I really hope the newspapers feel good about putting us all at risk, grave risk, again...thanks guys....dman

[Mile High Shack]

I need some popcorn

this has been a pretty good pimp slappin' fight

[RaiderH8r]

It absolutely IS a free speech zone. And her elected officials are free to speak on her behalf as they have been duly elected and empaneled to do. NOBODY is allowed to protest from the gallery so that Congress may actually get things done. You do not make a peep when sitting in the gallery, you will be asked to leave and escorted out. That's the facts. She was not singled out. Her free speech was not abriged. She was pulling a Fred Phelps, pissing on convention to suit her needs and get her mug on the TeeeVeee. She was bounced and rightfully so.

[defenseman]

You are allowed to make "funny, sarcastic, and contorted" faces. Just ask Hillary about her miltitudes of "disagreement" faces. What a disgrace she is, no class at all...dman

[Rigs11]

Wait until the truth comes out with respect to the surveillance leaks, and the fact that, the democratic senate has pointed the finger at the white house staffers. It will turn around and end up being the paper getting it from some source other than that. And, when the american public learns the damage done to the intelligence networks across the country, let alone the WORLD, well , I really hope the newspapers feel good about putting us all at risk, grave risk, again...thanks guys....dman
That's a copout.Do you honestly believe that AlQaeda doesn't know that their phones are being tapped?Is it really going to make us less safe for us to know that Bush is invading on our liberties?This administration has done a great job of instilling fear into anyone that questions their motives or decisions. "Don't ask about a plan to withdraw troops because that helps the terrorists in iraq". "Don't ask about the lies that took us to war because if you do you don't support the troops.""Don't ask about Abu Graib because that fuels the insurgency".It's a copout and it's silly.

[bronco_diesel]

this has got to be one of the dumbest arguments yet on the OM.

CS is a loose cannon. it was blatent stupidy on her part to show up wearing a t-shirt.

thats like showing up to a restaurant etc. (which enforces a dress code) with a t-shirt...like trying to get into a night club (which enforces a dress code) with the wrong attire....those are just the rules, and we all gotta play by them.

this is not a matter of free speech...this was about her wanting to create as scene and showing disrespect. it would have been a lot more powerful of her to show up in proper attire, behave, and afterward, you betcha she would have gotten air time to rebuttle....

she's got a flare for the dramatic, and in this case, it was against the rules.

cindy needs to be smarter...i can't believe people defend this.

[Bronco_Beerslug]

this has got to be one of the dumbest arguments yet on the OM.

CS is a loose cannon. it was blatent stupidy on her part to show up wearing a t-shirt.

thats like showing up to a restaurant etc. (which enforces a dress code) with a t-shirt...like trying to get into a night club (which enforces a dress code) with the wrong attire....those are just the rules, and we all gotta play by them.

this is not a matter of free speech...this was about her wanting to create as scene and showing disrespect. it would have been a lot more powerful of her to show up in proper attire, behave, and afterward, you betcha she would have gotten air time to rebuttle....

she's got a flare for the dramatic, and in this case, it was against the rules.

cindy needs to be smarter...i can't believe people defend this.
She didn't arrive wearing just a T-shirt. She wore a suit. She took her seat and then her and another woman took their jackets off. During the entire incident she never said a thing.

[epicSocialism4tw]

For the third time post the rule that says no T-shirt may be worn at The State of the Union Address or is it possible you don't have a clue if there is such a thing?

Dude, the state of the union address is meant to be a speech of the president and not a forum for political dissent.

It's pure redundancy that she was there at all. There was no purpose but to create a liberal emotional stir. You were fooled into it. Congrats.

[Bronco_Beerslug]

Dude, the state of the union address is meant to be a speech of the president and not a forum for political dissent.

It's pure redundancy that she was there at all. There was no purpose but to create a liberal emotional stir. You were fooled into it. Congrats.

Another Bush worshiper chimes in on the side of our dictator (and another vote for trashing the U.S. Constitution). And it's obvious the people who have been fooled are the ones still supporting a president who lied the country into war, spent us into bankruptcy and blindly vote party instead of individual.

[W*GS]

Another Bush worshiper chimes in on the side of our dictator (and another vote for trashing the U.S. Constitution). And it's obvious the people who have been fooled are the ones still supporting a president who lied the country into war, spent us into bankruptcy and blindly vote party instead of individual.

I nominate this for hysterical Post-of-the-Month.

[epicSocialism4tw]

Another Bush worshiper chimes in on the side of our dictator (and another vote for trashing the U.S. Constitution). And it's obvious the people who have been fooled are the ones still supporting a president who lied the country into war, spent us into bankruptcy and blindly vote party instead of individual.

Another extremist liberal ignores the discussion to wrap the uncomfortable truth into an undigestable glob of pie-in-the-sky shallow and misguided pseudomorality with no tangible hold in reality.

You bought what they are selling. Does at taste as good as you would like it to?

[epicSocialism4tw]

I nominate this for hysterical Post-of-the-Month.

That seems to be the generic quote from either that guy, LA Propaganda Machine, or LAPM's little protege.

Any discussion turns into an emotion driven spam fest.

[W*GS]

Any discussion turns into an emotion driven spam fest.

Bingo. Any dissent from their strident-liberal/lefty views always degenerates into loud denunciations, name-calling, insults, and all that crap. Even the concept of "agree to disagree" is anathema to them - either you're with 'em, or you're subject to vile garbage. And just over a political discussion. Sheesh.

[bronco_diesel]

Bingo. Any dissent from their strident-liberal/lefty views always degenerates into loud denunciations, name-calling, insults, and all that crap. Even the concept of "agree to disagree" is anathema to them - either you're with 'em, or you're subject to vile garbage. And just over a political discussion. Sheesh.

you must be a bush lemming :)

[Bronco_Beerslug]

Another extremist liberal ignores the discussion to wrap the uncomfortable truth into an undigestable glob of pie-in-the-sky shallow and misguided pseudomorality with no tangible hold in reality.

You bought what they are selling. Does at taste as good as you would like it to?

No one is selling anything, that's the point, although it's obvious you don't understand that.

Were Sheehan's constitutional right's violated, yes or no?

Unfortunately, those are the only guys on this site that represent their political views. Well, Spider and a couple of other guys are easier to converse with.

What is really unfortunate, is that much of their party populace seems to thrive in that "were right and you're stupid" mentality that is reminiscient of radicalist Islam. The only thing missing is suicide bombing.

LOL
You mean you don't like being called a Bush worshiper?

[epicSocialism4tw]

Bingo. Any dissent from their strident-liberal/lefty views always degenerates into loud denunciations, name-calling, insults, and all that crap. Even the concept of "agree to disagree" is anathema to them - either you're with 'em, or you're subject to vile garbage. And just over a political discussion. Sheesh.

Unfortunately, those are the only guys on this site that represent their political views. Well, Spider and a couple of other guys are easier to converse with.

What is really unfortunate, is that much of their party populace seems to thrive in that "were right and you're stupid" mentality that is reminiscient of radicalist Islam. The only thing missing is suicide bombing.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

Since you haven't posted anything that backs your original statement I'll go ahead and post something that does mine.

On Wednesday afternoon, U.S. Capitol Police Chief Terrance Gainer said neither woman should have been removed from the chamber. "We made a mistake," he told CNN.

He said an apology was made to Bill and Beverly Young, and the congressman has been told that Capitol officers will receive better training. He said they are operating under outdated guidance on House rules regarding demonstrations.

http://tinyurl.com/7byv9

Beerslug 7

Ditto Monkeys 0

[epicSocialism4tw]

No one is selling anything, that's the point, although it's obvious you don't understand that.

Were Sheehan's constitutional right's violated, yes or no?

Were Lee Harvey Oswald's constitutional rights violated?

[epicSocialism4tw]

No one is selling anything, that's the point, although it's obvious you don't understand that.

Were Sheehan's constitutional right's violated, yes or no?



LOL
You mean you don't like being called a Bush worshiper?

THAT'S WHAT YOU THINK, CLINTON KLINGON! KERRY LEMMING! GORE SPORE!

There...now we are having some nice discussion. Like mature adults should.

[Bronco_Beerslug]

Were Lee Harvey Oswald's constitutional rights violated?
Answer the question, if you can.
Does she have the right, as an American citizen, to wear that T-shirt or not?

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

That seems to be the generic quote from either that guy, LA Propaganda Machine, or LAPM's little protege.

Any discussion turns into an emotion driven spam fest.

angrydramaqueen got his ass handed to him in this debate and now he's in name-calling mode (something he's supposedly above.)

How predictable.

[epicSocialism4tw]

Answer the question, if you can.
Does she have the right, as an American citizen, to wear that T-shirt or not?

Do you have the right to walk into your state legislature meetings and sit there with a "our state governor is a murderer" shirt on?

It's rediculous and it shows how little class that you have. You might as well bring your infant, your favorite spitoon, and ride into the room on your broken down moped.

[epicSocialism4tw]

angrydramaqueen got his ass handed to him in this debate and now he's in name-calling mode (something he's supposedly above.)


Here's the substantive discussion that this forum has come to appreciate so much.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

Dueling Quotes:

Here's the substantive discussion that this forum has come to appreciate so much.

That seems to be the generic quote from either that guy, LA Propaganda Machine, or LAPM's little protege.

- Angrydramaqueen, pretending he's above name-calling and pretending he occupies some sort of high ground

[epicSocialism4tw]

Answer the question, if you can.
Does she have the right, as an American citizen, to wear that T-shirt or not?

That question is more complicated than you are letting on. Your rights are relative. Any misconception that you have about your rights as a citizen is born from a pie-in-the-sky understanding of what natural rights you have and how you are endowed to them. You have bought the poisoned wine that the mass media has been feeding you. Ultimately, you are at the mercy of your superiors. Cindy Sheehan is at the mercy of her superiors.

[Bronco_Beerslug]

Do you have the right to walk into your state legislature meetings and sit there with a "our state governor is a murderer" shirt on?

It's rediculous and it shows how little class that you have. You might as well bring your infant, your favorite spitoon, and ride into the room on your broken down moped.

So you equate the Iraq war as Bush =s murderer? Her shirt listed the # of dead since the Iraq invasion and occupation.

Anyway, since you know the answer to the question is yes, her freedom of speech rights were violated, as evidenced by the apologies issued by the various authorities, do you condone repressing American's right of speech?

I was never told that I couldn't wear that shirt into the Congress. I was never asked to take it off or zip my jacket back up. If I had been asked to do any of those things...I would have, and written about the suppression of my freedom of speech later... Cindy Sheehan

[alkemical]

Do you have the right to walk into your state legislature meetings and sit there with a "our state governor is a murderer" shirt on?

It's rediculous and it shows how little class that you have. You might as well bring your infant, your favorite spitoon, and ride into the room on your broken down moped.


you should have the right to, but personally i wouldn't. I'd wear a shirt that said "mass murderers look better in thousand dollar suits"

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

Answer the question, if you can.
Does she have the right, as an American citizen, to wear that T-shirt or not?

The capitol police have admitted that she does have the right, and have admitted that they made a mistake in removing her - yet those folks still slobbing Bush's knob remain in denial.

Unreal. :pity:

[epicSocialism4tw]

So you equate the Iraq war as Bush =s murderer? Her shirt listed the # of dead since the Iraq invasion and occupation.

Anyway, since you know the answer to the question is yes, her freedom of speech rights were violated, as evidenced by the apologies issued by the various authorities, do you condone repressing American's right of speech?

That's just a load of spin by both parties involved. Sheehan and the dems knew that there was a cheap media opportunity at hand, and they exploited it knowing full well that she would be removed from the room. The repubs got her out of the room and issued an "apology" later. Glorification of this event into a political statement is unnecessary. You bought what they sold. You were waiting and willing for something like this to occur, and you accepted it at face value.

[epicSocialism4tw]

you should have the right to, but personally i wouldn't. I'd wear a shirt that said "mass murderers look better in thousand dollar suits"

How about: "Hey, Im in the room too...can I be above the law?"

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

Answer the question, if you can.
Does she have the right, as an American citizen, to wear that T-shirt or not?

Chirp, chirp, chirp...

http://www.petdiscounters.com/files/images/d_3742.jpg

[Bronco_Beerslug]

That question is more complicated than you are letting on. Your rights are relative. Any misconception that you have about your rights as a citizen is born from a pie-in-the-sky understanding of what natural rights you have and how you are endowed to them. You have bought the poisoned wine that the mass media has been feeding you. Ultimately, you are at the mercy of your superiors. Cindy Sheehan is at the mercy of her superiors.

ROFL!

I have only one superior, she has had many faces but all have the one thing that can make me buy them presents, take them to exotic lands and indulge in gourmet cousine.
I bow down to my superior :~ohyah!:

And oh yeah, why was Sheehan arrested for her T-shirt and the republican's wife not arrested for her T-shirt?

[W*GS]

Were Sheehan's constitutional right's violated, yes or no?

If you're contending "yes", then prove it.

[epicSocialism4tw]

I have only one superior, she has had many faces but all have the one thing that can make me buy them presents, take them to exotic lands and indulge in gourmet cousine.
I bow down to my superior
And oh yeah, why was Sheehan arrested for her T-shirt and the republican's wife not arrested for her T-shirt?

Because she was there using the State of the Union as her own political platform. That does not prove that her "rights" were violated. She made a questionable and ill-advised decision. She was removed and charges were dropped. Things were handled diplomatically. She brought her little campaign into the court of the king, and the kings men showed her the door.

Have you ever been given a ticket? Did you know that you can be charged with generic offenses to give the police enough power to make judgments in a number of odd circumstances? Our legal system is set up to accomodate law and order and to deny chaos. Even at the expense of individual rights. It may not sit well with us peons, but that's the way it is.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

And oh yeah, why was Sheehan arrested for her T-shirt and the republican's wife not arrested for her T-shirt?

Sheehan was arrested for wearing the shirt she'd worn all day.

Later, during the speech -- after Sheehan had already been arrested -- the wife of a Republican Congressman from Florida, Bill Young, was politely asked to leave the chamber for wearing a T-shirt in support of our troops.
Her shirt said "Support the Troops Defending Our Freedom."

She was not arrested for wearing the shirt, she was not held for hours in detention, nor roughed up. She does not face any legal charges or legal fees in connection with the incident that we know about. And, as far as we know,
did not also make the ultimate sacrifice of giving the life of her child for this country.

Bush claims, "Debate is healthy, we welcome all points of view," but he only arrests the voices who disagree with him.

http://www.bradblog.com/archives/00002357.htm

[epicSocialism4tw]

Sheehan was arrested for wearing the shirt she'd worn all day.

Later, during the speech -- after Sheehan had already been arrested -- the wife of a Republican Congressman from Florida, Bill Young, was politely asked to leave the chamber for wearing a T-shirt in support of our troops.
Her shirt said "Support the Troops Defending Our Freedom."

She was not arrested for wearing the shirt, she was not held for hours in detention, nor roughed up. She does not face any legal charges or legal fees in connection with the incident that we know about. And, as far as we know,
did not also make the ultimate sacrifice of giving the life of her child for this country.

Bush claims, "Debate is healthy, we welcome all points of view," but he only arrests the voices who disagree with him.

http://www.bradblog.com/archives/00002357.htm

That sounds all nice and neat if you completely ignore the context of the arrest. And you ignore how the arrest was handled after Sheehan was removed.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

That does not prove that her "rights" were violated.

http://www.ohanaed.com/images/4533.gif

The capitol police have already admitted that her rights were viloated.

Yet you spin on and on...:pity:

[epicSocialism4tw]

The capitol police have already admitted that her rights were viloated.

Yet you spin on and on...:pity:

Nah...they just told you what you wanted to hear.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

That sounds all nice and neat if you completely ignore the context of the arrest. And you ignore how the arrest was handled after Sheehan was removed.

Perhaps repetition is the key to comprehension for you:

On Wednesday afternoon, U.S. Capitol Police Chief Terrance Gainer said neither woman should have been removed from the chamber. "We made a mistake," he told CNN.

He said an apology was made to Bill and Beverly Young, and the congressman has been told that Capitol officers will receive better training. He said they are operating under outdated guidance on House rules regarding demonstrations.

[epicSocialism4tw]

Perhaps repetition is the key to comprehension for you:

On Wednesday afternoon, U.S. Capitol Police Chief Terrance Gainer said neither woman should have been removed from the chamber. "We made a mistake," he told CNN.

He said an apology was made to Bill and Beverly Young, and the congressman has been told that Capitol officers will receive better training. He said they are operating under outdated guidance on House rules regarding demonstrations.

Sure buddy...I bet that they are really sorry for removing
Sheehan.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

Nah...they just told you what you wanted to hear.

Nah, you are just ignoring the legal and constitutional questions and making it up as you go along like most bushbots.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

Sure buddy...I bet that they are really sorry for removing
Sheehan.

Way to dodge the legal and constitutional questions.

[epicSocialism4tw]

Way to dodge the legal and constitutional questions.

Well, we're not strict constructionists here, LA. The constitution is freely "adapted" to suit the wishes of the modern corporate.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

"How can we claim to be fighting on behalf of freedom around the world, making the world safe for freedom when we are smothering freedom here at home?"

- Cindy Sheehan

It does look mighty hypocritical for Bush to be giving lofty speeches about freedom when wearing a T-shirt can get you arrested...

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

Well, we're not strict constructionists here, LA. The constitution is freely "adapted" to suit the wishes of the modern corporate.

First semi-truthful statement I've heard from you in a long time.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

First Amendment, two shirts — Cindy and Beverly

Two shirts, together, could cut through some of Washington's mealy-mouthed pieties about freedom of speech.

Cindy Sheehan wore one of them to the State of the Union speech Tuesday night, and was hauled out of the building and busted for demonstrating in a t-shirt that read "2245 Dead -- How Many More?"

The other shirt is in the wardrobe of Beverly Young, the wife of Florida Republican congressman Bill Young. She said she was kicked out of her gallery seat six rows away from Laura Bush for wearing a shirt reading "Support the Troops -- Defending Our Freedom." In this case, the police said, she didn't get ejected -- she was just asked to leave, and she did.

If there's any issue these women might make common cause over, it's free speech. If they're truly peeved about this, and believe that their mute, cotton-blend statements and anyone else's should be welcome during the State of the Union speech, they should join forces and file a First Amendment lawsuit together.

[Now, if Capitol police were to start expelling people from Congress for their fashion sense, I could go for that -- the floor of the House would be virtually empty. Did you ever get an eyeful of Ohio Rep. Jean Schmidt's Olympic gymnast ensemble?]

But I wish this nugget were getting as much press as Mmes. Sheehan and Young:

Fox News says a new provision slipped into the Patriot Act by Arlen Specter, the Pennsylvania Republican, would give the Secret Service virtually unchecked authority to make felony arrests of demonstrators inside a security perimeter at any "special event of national significance," even when the star of the show -- like Bush or Cheney -- isn't present. This would apply at any designated "National Security Special Events," even when the president is dead [Ronald Reagan's funeral procession] or not there [the Super Bowl.] What as once ranked as misdemeanor trespassing would be elevated to a federal felony. This is on top of FAA flight restrictions dictating that private pilots can't fly above Cheney's new Chesapeake Bay neighborhood even when the VP isn't home.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/pat-morrison/first-amendment-two-shir_b_14943.html

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

Rep. Lynn Woolsey denounces arrest of Cindy Sheehan, who vows to sue

Cindy Sheehan was a guest of U.S. Rep. Lynn Woolsey for the State of the Union Address, and the Congresswoman is not happy about the way her guest was treated.

"Since when is free speech conditional on whether you agree with the President?" Rep. Woolsey asked.

Capitol police dragged Sheehan out of the gallery for wearing a shirt that said: "2245 Dead. How many more." She was arrested for "unlawful conduct," and was held for four hours, Sheehan says.

"Cindy Sheehan, who gave her own flesh and blood for this disastrous war, did not violate any rules of the House of Representatives. She merely wore a shirt that highlighted the human cost of the Iraq War and expressed a view different than that of the President," Rep. Woolsey said. "Free speech and the First Amendment exist to protect dissenting statements like Ms. Sheehan's." (Woolsey italicized the word "exist" in her press release.)

http://progressive.org/mag_mc020106

[Bronco_Beerslug]

Because she was there using the State of the Union as her own political platform. That does not prove that her "rights" were violated. She made a questionable and ill-advised decision. She was removed and charges were dropped. Things were handled diplomatically. She brought her little campaign into the court of the king, and the kings men showed her the door.

Ah, you admit we are now governed by a king and not a democratically elected leader, good for you!
And being arrested for writing on a T-shirt is indeed repression of freedom of speech, something Bush is widely known for.


Have you ever been given a ticket? Did you know that you can be charged with generic offenses to give the police enough power to make judgments in a number of odd circumstances? Our legal system is set up to accomodate law and order and to deny chaos. Even at the expense of individual rights. It may not sit well with us peons, but that's the way it is.
I've been locked up for manslaghter so I know a little something about how the legal and court system works.

Our legal system is set up to provide for individual's rights not repress them.

[epicSocialism4tw]

First semi-truthful statement I've heard from you in a long time.


This is what I mean when I say that ordinary dems have unrealistic (pie-in-the-sky)views of their surrounding political atmosphere. They are pawns in the game and dont even know it.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

This is what I mean when I say that ordinary dems have unrealistic (pie-in-the-sky)views of their surrounding political atmosphere. They are pawns in the game and dont even know it.

Wrong.

However, this is an issue that's seperate from the legal and constitutional questions again, isn't it?

Deflect on.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

Ah, you admit we are now governed by a king and not a democratically elected leader, good for you! And being arrested for writing on a T-shirt is indeed repression of freedom of speech, something Bush is widely known for.

Part of what got our nation into this mess is too many of us being civil and behaving ourselves while watching, politely, the dismantling of our democratic republic by a criminal cabal.

I'm with Cindy, and anyone else who would speak out, anywhere and everywhere, and stand up for all of our rights before they are gone, gone, gone.

Her attempt to exercise her Constitutional rights, and what has happened as a result, does have value for those of us who don't want to lose it all.

[Bronco_Beerslug]

And just for Rascal, who can't quite understand what the police chief meant when he said ...

"We made a mistake," he told CNN.

He said an apology was made to Bill and Beverly Young, and the congressman has been told that Capitol officers will receive better training. He said they are operating under outdated guidance on House rules regarding demonstrations.

--------------------------------------

Unlike the grounds surrounding the Capitol, which historically have been the site of
numerous demonstrations, there has been a ban on demonstrations inside the Capitol since 1946 when
Congress decreed: “It shall be unlawful for any person or group of persons willfully and knowingly -- .
. to parade, demonstrate, or picket within any of the Capitol Buildings.”

40 U.S.C. § 193f(b)(7).
The United States Capitol Police are responsible for enforcing this ban. 40 U.S.C. § 212a. Believing that
the Capitol Police needed guidance in determining what behavior constitutes a “demonstration,” the
United States Capitol Police Board issued a regulation that interprets “demonstration activity” to
include:

parading, picketing, speechmaking, holding vigils, sit-ins, or other expressive conduct that convey[s] a message supporting or opposing a point of view or has the intent, effect or propensity to attract a crowd of
onlookers, but does not include merely wearing Tee shirts, buttons orother similar articles of apparel that convey a message.

http://www.dcd.uscourts.gov/97-1337c.pdf

[Rigs11]

How about: "Hey, Im in the room too...can I be above the law?"

What law? What part of the "we made a mistake" can't you comprehend?If you want to see someone above the law google "incompetent" and see how many hits you get.

[Garcia Bronco]

That's the nazi spirit.Hilarious! By the way the same person who seated her and approved of her attire grabbed her and took her to a squad car when she unzipped her coat.

Dude...tell me you'd show up to the SOTU wearing a a politcal statment on a t-shirt.Ha!

[Garcia Bronco]

Exactly.

People like GB get upset when you use the word "nazi," but that's exactly the mindset they are representing.

I wonder what GB would say if the shoe was on the other foot and one of his cultural heroes was thrown out of the capitol for wearing a t-shirt that said "screw affirmative action" or some other right-wing slogan?

I'd be of the opinion that it serves them right for dressing like a toad to hear our President speak in person in the Capital

[Garcia Bronco]

Just like if Sheehan wasn't there at all you would give a damn if they threw out a Republican congressman's wife.

The wife..got up and left without and arguement I believe...nut-job Cindy was a little less nice about it

[Garcia Bronco]

this has got to be one of the dumbest arguments yet on the OM.

CS is a loose cannon. it was blatent stupidy on her part to show up wearing a t-shirt.

thats like showing up to a restaurant etc. (which enforces a dress code) with a t-shirt...like trying to get into a night club (which enforces a dress code) with the wrong attire....those are just the rules, and we all gotta play by them.

this is not a matter of free speech...this was about her wanting to create as scene and showing disrespect. it would have been a lot more powerful of her to show up in proper attire, behave, and afterward, you betcha she would have gotten air time to rebuttle....

she's got a flare for the dramatic, and in this case, it was against the rules.

cindy needs to be smarter...i can't believe people defend this.

Amen

[Bronco_Beerslug]

The wife..got up and left without and arguement I believe...nut-job Cindy was a little less nice about it

You, apparently, haven't read anything about what happened.
Sheehan and the congressman's wife were dressed in suits and seated. They both took their jackets off after being seated. The congressman's wife cursed the security personnel who escorted her out repeatedly, Sheehan didn't resist.

Of course, neither woman broke any laws or rules which is the point.

[Garcia Bronco]

You, apparently haven't read anything about what happened.
Sheehan and the congressman's wife were dressed in suits and seated. They both took their jackets off after being seated. The congressman's wife cursed the security personnel who escorted her out repeatedly, Sheehan didn't resist.

See I heard the night it happened being the other way around.

But answer this...would you Bronco_Beerslug wear a politcal statement on a t-shirt to hear the President speak in the Captial?

[epicSocialism4tw]

What law? What part of the "we made a mistake" can't you comprehend?If you want to see someone above the law google "incompetent" and see how many hits you get.

It's almost 9 o'clock here...I think its past your bedtime!

[Taco John]

I can't believe this happened in America.

[Bronco_Beerslug]

See I heard the night it happened being the other way around.

But answer this...would you Bronco_Beerslug wear a politcal statement on a t-shirt to hear the President speak in the Captial?
If I did, would you defend my right of freedom of speech as an American citizen or not?

[epicSocialism4tw]

I can't believe this happened in America.

I'm surprised that she didnt pick up a chair and hurl it towards the podium, setting off a chair-throwing and fist-flinging battle.

[epicSocialism4tw]

If I did, would you defend my right of freedom of speech as an American citizen or not?

I would say that you made a poor choice with obvious ramifications.

[Garcia Bronco]

If I did, would you defend my right of freedom of speech as an American citizen or not?

In this case...no....I would be perturbed that you Bronco_Beerslug, misguided Bronco Fan, was arrested. But I would not feel an ounce of sympathy for you showing up at our Nations Capital dressed like that to hear our President speak to the nation and address congress. It's a big deal.

[Garcia Bronco]

I can't believe this happened in America.

It happens all the time...though maybe not the arrested part...but I remember having to turn shirts inside-out because of messages on them in public school

[epicSocialism4tw]

In this case...no....I would be perturbed that you Bronco_Beerslug, misguided Bronco Fan, was arrested. But I would not feel an ounce of sympathy for you showing up at our Nations Capital dressed like that to hear our President speak to the nation and address congress. It's a big deal.

Yeah..and it's no place to introduce protest propaganda. There is a thing called decorum that you have to aknowledge there.

[Garcia Bronco]

We do things a little different here in Virginia. In Berkley Cal for example, they might cater to kids staging a sit-in at the school building. In Virginia, we'll rip the doors off...haul everybody off to jail...and then expel them from school for life.

[Bronco_Beerslug]

In this case...no....I would be perturbed that you Bronco_Beerslug, misguided Bronco Fan, was arrested. But I would not feel an ounce of sympathy for you showing up at our Nations Capital dressed like that to hear our President speak to the nation and address congress. It's a big deal.

And that would be the difference between you and I. I would defend your right to free speech no matter how much I disagreed with your message.

They broke no laws or rules but were censored because of their words. These are the kinds actions defining countries like Cuba and communist China.

[Garcia Bronco]

And that would be the difference between you and I. I would defend your right to free speech no matter how much I disagreed with your message.

They broke no laws or rules but were censored because of their words. These are the kinds actions defining countries like Cuba and communist China.


Overkill, it's not the message on the t-shirt...it's that it was a t-shirt with a message on it. Cuba and China are DBA communist countries

[Garcia Bronco]

From the Chiefs Planet political forum

In the early days of the Senate's impeachment trial of President Bill Clinton in January 1999, a Pennsylvania man named Dave Delp was removed by the Capitol police from the Senate gallery for wearing a t-shirt that said, "Clinton doesn't inhale, he sucks."

A Pennsylvania school teacher was yanked out of a VIP Senate gallery and briefly detained last week during the impeachment trial for wearing a T-shirt with graphic language dissing President Clinton.

Dave Delp, 42, of Carlisle, Pa., and a friend had just settled into their seats when four Capitol security guards approached them. Delp said at the time that he was ordered to button his coat and follow the guards. Outside the chamber, he was told "several people felt threatened by your shirt."

Even after establishing that Delp was a guest of Sen. Rick Santorum (R-Pa.), the guards wouldn't let him back in and escorted him to a basement security area, where they questioned and photographed him.

After being given one of the photos as a souvenir, Delp said he was banned from the Capitol for the rest of the day. "They were polite and professional," Delp added, "but they really did scare me. I think I should have been given the chance to cover up."


http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=364&topic_id=292507&mesg_id=292507

[Rigs11]

It's almost 9 o'clock here...I think its past your bedtime!
Bravo!! Nice rebuttal. Did your little brother teach you that one or did you come up with it all by your wittle self?

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

Of course, neither woman broke any laws or rules which is the point.

Which is why the bushbots need to keep deflecting.

[Garcia Bronco]

Which is why the bushbots need to keep deflecting.


President Bush doesn't run the Capitial Police.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

In the early days of the Senate's impeachment trial of President Bill Clinton in January 1999, a Pennsylvania man named Dave Delp was removed by the Capitol police from the Senate gallery for wearing a t-shirt that said, "Clinton doesn't inhale, he sucks."

A Pennsylvania school teacher was yanked out of a VIP Senate gallery and briefly detained last week during the impeachment trial for wearing a T-shirt with graphic language dissing President Clinton.

Dave Delp, 42, of Carlisle, Pa., and a friend had just settled into their seats when four Capitol security guards approached them. Delp said at the time that he was ordered to button his coat and follow the guards. Outside the chamber, he was told "several people felt threatened by your shirt."

Even after establishing that Delp was a guest of Sen. Rick Santorum (R-Pa.), the guards wouldn't let him back in and escorted him to a basement security area, where they questioned and photographed him.

After being given one of the photos as a souvenir, Delp said he was banned from the Capitol for the rest of the day. "They were polite and professional," Delp added, "but they really did scare me. I think I should have been given the chance to cover up."


http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=364&topic_id=292507&mesg_id=292507

Somebody on the board where you found this has the correct answer:

It was a trial, so it was not even under Clinton's authority that Delp was removed.

OTOH, the SOTU is a totally BushCo venue.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

I'd be of the opinion that it serves them right for dressing like a toad to hear our President speak in person in the Capital

Which only underscores your inability to get that pesky First Amendment thing.

(Not to mention your inability to understand that your opinion re: how someone dresses is just that: your opinion.)

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

President Bush doesn't run the Capitial Police.

Another deflection/non-sequitur.

You're going for a new record, apparently.

[Garcia Bronco]

Which only underscores your inability to get that pesky First Amendment thing.

(Not to mention your inability to understand that your opinion re: how someone dresses is just that: your opinion.)


Alright LABiff...would you wear a t-shirt to hear the President to address the nation in congress?

[Garcia Bronco]

Another deflection/non-sequitur.

You're going for a new record, apparently.

Is the President in charge of the Capital Police?

[Garcia Bronco]

Somebody on the board where you found this has the correct answer:

It was a trial, so it was not even under Clinton's authority that Delp was removed.

OTOH, the SOTU is a totally BushCo venue.


Either way jack arse it's the Capital and the Capital Police.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

Alright LABiff...would you wear a t-shirt to hear the President to address the nation in congress?

The pretender who is currently squatting in the WH is not a legitimate president, so, yeah - no problem.

[Rigs11]

Alright LABiff...would you wear a t-shirt to hear the President to address the nation in congress?
So it was because of a t-shirt? That's your reasoning? Well what if it was a dress shirt with the same message on it what then?

[Garcia Bronco]

The pretender who is currently squatting in the WH is not a legitimate president, so, yeah - no problem.


LOL...no you wouldn't

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

Either way jack arse it's the Capital and the Capital Police.

But the event you cited was a trial - not a SOTU address, dumbass.

Further, it's the Bush administration - not the Clinton administration - that has a long and distinguished record of trampling on the First Amendment.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

LOL...no you wouldn't

Whatever you say, Miss Cleo.

I wore Broncos gear while playing a gig in Oakland once, so that should tell you something. :D

[Garcia Bronco]

So it was because of a t-shirt? That's your reasoning? Well what if it was a dress shirt with the same message on it what then?

It's more about respect...you don't disrespect the President. Further more...you don't disrespect the President and Congress in the Capital by trying to provoke a political demonstration. Which...they can throw her out for...but arresting her was perhaps taking it too far....but she had it coming. She was messing with the Bull.

[Garcia Bronco]

Whatever you say, Miss Cleo.

I wore Broncos gear while playing a gig in Oakland once, so that should tell you something. :D

Yeah...nobody was there. :P

[Garcia Bronco]

But the event you cited was a trial - not a SOTU address, dumbass.

Further, it's the Bush administration - not the Clinton administration - that has a long and distinguished record of trampling on the First Amendment.


LMAO...yet you remain un-scathed...there's a ray of sunshine

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

Yeah...nobody was there. :P

Thus spake the crystal ball...:spit:

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

LMAO...yet you remain un-scathed...

For today, anyway.

Three more years of Team Thug to go....

[Garcia Bronco]

For today, anyway.

Three more years of Team Thug to go....


Don't worry...the next President will be much more moderate..perhaps McCain or George Allen...maybe even a Democrat will step up to the table worht voting for...someone like Wes Clark.

[Rigs11]

It's more about respect...you don't disrespect the President. Further more...you don't disrespect the President and Congress in the Capital by trying to provoke a political demonstration. Which...they can throw her out for...but arresting her was perhaps taking it too far....but she had it coming. She was messing with the Bull.

Her shirt had the question that she has been asking Bush since last august. He has failed to answer it.Since when is questioning the president disrespecting him?

[Garcia Bronco]

Her shirt had the question that she has been asking Bush since last august. He has failed to answer it.Since when is questioning the president disrespecting him?

Come on dude...she wasn't questioning him...she was there as a political demonstration and in doing so was disrespecting the President, Congress, and the Capital of the United States by wearing such a garment.

[epicSocialism4tw]

Come on dude...she wasn't questioning him...she was there as a political demonstration and in doing so was disrespecting the President, Congress, and the Capital of the United States by wearing such a garment.

Garcia, your point is well taken. Everyone and their dog knows why this women was at the demonstration wearing that shirt. It definately wasnt to take in the State of the Union.

That's why she got removed. It's easy and its not that big of a deal. It's definately not a human rights issue. If she is so concerned about human rights, she should take her politically motivated behind back down to Venezuela to see what's going down underneath her boy Chavez and his buddy Castro.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

Since when is questioning the president disrespecting him?

Exactly.

The message on her shirt makes no reference to the president.

But that's beside the point. She didn't violate any law by wearing the shirt.

Why is this so hard for the bush lemmings to understand?

[Bronco_Beerslug]

Garcia, your point is well taken. Everyone and their dog knows why this women was at the demonstration wearing that shirt. It definately wasnt to take in the State of the Union.

That's why she got removed. It's easy and its not that big of a deal. It's definately not a human rights issue. If she is so concerned about human rights, she should take her politically motivated behind back down to Venezuela to see what's going down underneath her boy Chavez and his buddy Castro.
Only for those who believe in arresting people for wearing a T-shirt (see China, Cuba, etc...).

And she was arrested not "got removed".

Easy to see you are supporter of the Bush free speech zones and his unconditional spying on Americans.

The country is in sad shape when people openly support a dictatorship.

[gunns]

Sheehan's T-shirt alluded to the number of soldiers killed in
Iraq: "2245 Dead. How many more?" Capitol Police charged her with a misdemeanor for violating the District of Columbia's code against unlawful or disruptive conduct on any part of the Capitol grounds, a law enforcement official said. She was released from custody and flew home Wednesday to Los Angeles.

Young's shirt had just the opposite message: "Support the Troops — Defending Our Freedom."

I don't see how these are opposites, seems they both care about our troops, although I do question the "Defending Our Freedom". Maybe if they were going after Osama.......

Amazes me that someone can be arrested for asking a question on their T-shirt, yet you can freely step on people's civil liberties and lie in an official capacity and not a damn thing is done. And then people talk about disrespecting the same people that do those things. Sometimes I think I woke up in another country.

[Rascal]

Overkill, it's not the message on the t-shirt...it's that it was a t-shirt with a message on it. Cuba and China are DBA communist countries

It's not the fact it had a mesage on it, it's the fact it was a t-shirt. I posted the house rules which dictated what the appropriate dress was, suit and tie for men and similar attire for women. She did not dress appropriately, or the senators wife, and they were thrown out as they should have been.

[Bronco_Beerslug]

It's not the fact it had a mesage on it, it's the fact it was a t-shirt. I posted the house rules which dictated what the appropriate dress was, suit and tie for men and similar attire for women. She did not dress appropriately, or the senators wife, and they were thrown out as they should have been.
Once again, your reading comprehension is piss poor. There is NO RULE or LAW against weaing a T-shirt.

http://tinyurl.com/cfdr4

[Rascal]

Let me guess the moron still thinks that suit and tie requirement means t-shirt is okay...LOL

Have to appreciate your stubborness but your stupidity is reaching a whole new level slug. Ha!

You have obviously never worked in a corporate environment.

[Mile High Shack]

Once again, your reading comprehension is piss poor. There is NO RULE or LAW against weaing a T-shirt.

http://tinyurl.com/cfdr4

there is no law in my place of work that appropriate dress does not include a tshirt, but that doesn't mean a tshirt is considered appropriate either

[Bronco_Beerslug]

there is no law in my place of work that appropriate dress does not include a tshirt, but that doesn't mean a tshirt is considered appropriate either

Finally, someone gets it!

It's not considered appropriate in the SOTUA but no one can be removed or arrested because they did in fact, wear a T-shirt.

if I wore a tshirt to work, I'd be asked to leave
See above.

[Mile High Shack]

Finally, someone gets it!

if I wore a tshirt to work, I'd be asked to leave

[RaiderH8r]

Once again, your reading comprehension is piss poor. There is NO RULE or LAW against weaing a T-shirt.

http://tinyurl.com/cfdr4
There IS a rule against protesting or speaking in the gallery. Christ I have answered this over and over again. Her free speech is exercised by the individual, in her case Rep. Woolsey, who speaks on her behalf as he was duly elected and empaneled to do. CS was there to spark conflict, much like Fred Phelps at gay funerals. And, like Phelps, was classless in conduct.

[Rigs11]

if I wore a tshirt to work, I'd be asked to leave
Would you be arrested for it?

[Mile High Shack]

Would you be arrested for it?

LOL

no, but I'm sure the loss of pay would be worse to me due to my financial situation

[Bronco_Beerslug]

There IS a rule against protesting or speaking in the gallery. Christ I have answered this over and over again. Her free speech is exercised by the individual, in her case Rep. Woolsey, who speaks on her behalf as he was duly elected and empaneled to do. CS was there to spark conflict, much like Fred Phelps at gay funerals. And, like Phelps, was classless in conduct.

Once again, what rule or law did she break?

[RaiderH8r]

Once again, what rule or law did she break?
It's posted when you enter.

[W*GS]

Further, it's the Bush administration - not the Clinton administration - that has a long and distinguished record of trampling on the First Amendment.

Whereas Clinton's attempts to trample the Second Amendment get a pass from you.

When are you liberals gonna wake up?

[Bronco_Beerslug]

It's posted when you enter.

So it says No T-shirts allowed?

[RaiderH8r]

So it says No T-shirts allowed?
While a member of the Galleries, they will not act as an agent in the prosecution of claims, and will not become engaged or assist, directly or indirectly, in any lobbying, promotion, advertising, or publicity activity.

[Bronco_Beerslug]

While a member of the Galleries, they will not act as an agent in the prosecution of claims, and will not become engaged or assist, directly or indirectly, in any lobbying, promotion, advertising, or publicity activity.
No T-shirts allowed?

We made a mistake," he told CNN.

He said an apology was made to Bill and Beverly Young, and the congressman has been told that Capitol officers will receive better training. He said they are operating under outdated guidance on House rules regarding demonstrations.

[RaiderH8r]

No T-shirts allowed?
I've never suggested T-shirts aren't allowed. I've always maintained that it was a matter of decorum. Removal: Yes, Arrest: No. And, in this case, removal was not selectively enforced as evidenced by Rep. Young's wife being asked to leave the gallery as well.

[TailgateNut]

I've never suggested T-shirts aren't allowed. I've always maintained that it was a matter of decorum. Removal: Yes, Arrest: No. And, in this case, removal was not selectively enforced as evidenced by Rep. Young's wife being asked to leave the gallery as well.

Not selectively enforced? One was arrested, the other was asked to leave and escorted out!
Always looking at the world with goverment issued glasses!

[RaiderH8r]

Not selectively enforced? One was arrested, the other was asked to leave and escorted out!
Always looking at the world with goverment issued glasses!
Perhaps I should reiterate the part of my post where I said, "Removal: Yes, Arrest: No."

Government issued glasses or not, at least I'm not blind.

[Bronco_Beerslug]

I've never suggested T-shirts aren't allowed. I've always maintained that it was a matter of decorum. Removal: Yes, Arrest: No. And, in this case, removal was not selectively enforced as evidenced by Rep. Young's wife being asked to leave the gallery as well.
But decorum doesn't allow for removal and or arrest (at present).

If it were up to me I would find a way (politely, with rules in place that would make it clear on dress) to make sure the SOTUA doesn't turn into hundreds of people wearing T-shirts or other dress to state their political beliefs.

[Rascal]

But decorum doesn't allow for removal and or arrest (at present).

If it were up to me I would find a way (politely, with rules in place that would make it clear on dress) to make sure the SOTUA doesn't turn into hundreds of people wearing T-shirts or other dress to state their political beliefs.

Rules are in place dumbass. I showed you them. I guess to make it understandable to a simpleton such as yourself one needs to make a list of what is allowed and what is not. People such as yourself have to be told exactly what they can and cannot do/allowed...pathetic.

[RaiderH8r]

But decorum doesn't allow for removal and or arrest (at present).

If it were up to me I would find a way (politely, with rules in place that would make it clear on dress) to make sure the SOTUA doesn't turn into hundreds of people wearing T-shirts or other dress to state their political beliefs.
Decorum absolutely does allow for removal. The arrest is a different issue, and there's plenty of speculation and rumor behind that and probably worthy of its own thread.

And you hit precisely on the logic behind the rules of decorum. Congress is supposed to get things done. It shouldn't be a venue for a shouting match between opposing views.

I'm somewhat astonished that any individual would wear anything but a suit/tie or appropriate clothing attire for females to something of this nature. Tourists coming in to the gallery is one thing. It's hot, muggy, and such in DC so t-shirts are a must. But the SOTU is an invitation affair, you know where you're going and how you're getting there. Appropriate dress shows a level of respect for the instution rather than the representatives.

Amusing anecdote reported in roll call from the SOTU:


A Tender Moment. We were wondering what in the world President Bush and Senate Minority Whip Dick Durbin (D-Ill.) were talking about so cheerily when Bush walked out of the House chamber Tuesday night. Believe it or not: taxes.
Durbin is convinced that Bush plays a little game with him each year during his State of the Union address, according to Durbin spokesman Joe Shoemaker. The president seeks out Durbin in the crowd and makes eye contact with the Senator at least once. This year, it was during Bush’s bit about tax cuts.
When Bush walked out of the chamber, he was seen grabbing Durbin’s arm and chatting, rather happily. According to Shoemaker, here’s what they said to each other:
“Come on, Mr. President, are you really serious about making those tax cuts permanent?”
“Richard, I’ve been trying to do that for four years and I’ve heard there are some in Congress who just don’t see it my way,” Bush replied. “If I see any of those guys, I’ll let ’em know you’re looking for them,” Durbin answered.

[Bronco_Beerslug]

Decorum absolutely does allow for removal. The arrest is a different issue, and there's plenty of speculation and rumor behind that and probably worthy of its own thread.
Show me any rule or law that says if you wear a T-shirt you can be removed from the SOTUA.


Rules are in place dumbass. I showed you them. I guess to make it understandable to a simpleton such as yourself one needs to make a list of what is allowed and what is not. People such as yourself have to be told exactly what they can and cannot do/allowed...pathetic.

Hilarious!

He's back, the guy who thinks the louder he yells and the more he curses the better he sounds.

[RaiderH8r]

Show me any rule or law that says if you wear a T-shirt you can be removed from the SOTUA.
I cited the rule pertaining to decorum in the gallery. This never was about t-shirts during the SOTU address. "will not act as an agent in the prosecution of claims, and will not become engaged or assist, directly or indirectly, in any lobbying, promotion, advertising, or publicity activity"

Precisely what Sheehan was doing. It's not a clothing issue, it's an activity issue.

[Bronco_Beerslug]

I cited the rule pertaining to decorum in the gallery. This never was about t-shirts during the SOTU address. "will not act as an agent in the prosecution of claims, and will not become engaged or assist, directly or indirectly, in any lobbying, promotion, advertising, or publicity activity"

Precisely what Sheehan was doing. It's not a clothing issue, it's an activity issue.

The paragraph is vague (and does not address demonstration) and nowhere does it state anyone will be removed.


This does...
United States Capitol Police Board issued a regulation that interprets “demonstration activity” to
include:

parading, picketing, speechmaking, holding vigils, sit-ins, or other expressive conduct that convey[s] a message supporting or opposing a point of view or has the intent, effect or propensity to attract a crowd of
onlookers, but does not include merely wearing Tee shirts, buttons orother similar articles of apparel that convey a message.

http://www.dcd.uscourts.gov/97-1337c.pdf

[TheDave]

Oh what the hell....

Who really cares. CS was there to as a symbol of protest...Wrong place wrong time. I completely agree that she should not of been arrested, but she should of been removed from the building just as anyone else wearing improper attire...

I realize everyone wants to turn this into a freedom of speech issue but in my opinion... just as you can't yell "Fire" in a crowded theater you don't get to heckle the president at the SOTU address. There is a time and place for most things. Again, wrong place... wrong time.

This entire CS thing has gotten really sad. She begun as a peaceful protester questioning a war that many of us do as well. I supported what she did then and defended her actions accordingly. Since then she seems to have become nothing but a pawn in everyone else's political game. In my opinion she has lost her voice/credibility and i would be just as happy if she left the spotlight.

[W*GS]

Yeah, I kinda figured her 15 minutes of fame was over a long time ago.

[Rascal]

Oh what the hell....

Who really cares. CS was there to as a symbol of protest...Wrong place wrong time. I completely agree that she should not of been arrested, but she should of been removed from the building just as anyone else wearing improper attire...

I realize everyone wants to turn this into a freedom of speech issue but in my opinion... just as you can't yell "Fire" in a crowded theater you don't get to heckle the president at the SOTU address. There is a time and place for most things. Again, wrong place... wrong time.

This entire CS thing has gotten really sad. She begun as a peaceful protester questioning a war that many of us do as well. I supported what she did then and defended her actions accordingly. Since then she seems to have become nothing but a pawn in everyone else's political game. In my opinion she has lost her voice/credibility and i would be just as happy if she left the spotlight.

Quoted for truth.

[Bronco_Beerslug]

Oh what the hell....

Who really cares. CS was there to as a symbol of protest...Wrong place wrong time. I completely agree that she should not of been arrested, but she should of been removed from the building just as anyone else wearing improper attire...

I realize everyone wants to turn this into a freedom of speech issue but in my opinion... just as you can't yell "Fire" in a crowded theater you don't get to heckle the president at the SOTU address. There is a time and place for most things. Again, wrong place... wrong time.

This entire CS thing has gotten really sad. She begun as a peaceful protester questioning a war that many of us do as well. I supported what she did then and defended her actions accordingly. Since then she seems to have become nothing but a pawn in everyone else's political game. In my opinion she has lost her voice/credibility and i would be just as happy if she left the spotlight.


Many, many people care.

There is no enforceable dress code.

The senator's wife didn't "heckle" Bush nor did CS.

So now you support repressing her rights because she's involved in events you don't approve of?

[RaiderH8r]

Many, many people care.

There is no enforceable dress code.

The senator's wife didn't "heckle" Bush nor did CS.

So now you support repressing her rights because she's involved in events you don't approve of?
Sheehan's ENTIRE existence has become a "publicity activity" so, on those grounds she was shown the door.

But, all seriousness aside, the Dave has a point.

[TheDave]

Many, many people care.

There is no enforceable dress code.

The senator's wife didn't "heckle" Bush nor did CS.

So now you support repressing her rights because she's involved in events you don't approve of?

No I'm not for suppressing her "rights"...

But i am for suppressing her perceived "right" to mock/heckle/protest the president of the United States during his SOTUA. I don't like or agree with Bushii anymore than you do. Yet the fact remains, this was the wrong place and wrong time for protest.

If you want to turn this into a human rights issue, have at it... but for the sake of credibility I would choose my dance partners more carefully. JMO.

[Rascal]

No I'm not for suppressing her "rights"...

But i am for suppressing her perceived "right" to mock/heckle/protest the president of the United States during his SOTUA. I don't like or agree with Bushii anymore than you do, but the fact is, this was the wrong place and wrong time.

If you want to turn this into a human rights issue, have at it... but for the sake of credibility I would choose my dance partners more carefully. JMO.

You are a BUSH LEMING!!! :rofl:

[TheDave]

You are a BUSH LEMING!!! :rofl:

http://www.orangemane.com/BB/image.php?u=2080&dateline=1126795965

Please never change your avatar!

[Rascal]

Why?

[TheDave]

Why?


because it obviously gives me an easy way to cut/paste/ and flip your ass off from time to time ;)

[Rascal]

because it obviously gives me an easy way to cut/paste/ and flip your ass off from time to time ;)


:notworthy

[Bronco_Beerslug]

No I'm not for suppressing her "rights"...

But i am for suppressing her perceived "right" to mock/heckle/protest the president of the United States during his SOTUA. I don't like or agree with Bushii anymore than you do. Yet the fact remains, this was the wrong place and wrong time for protest.

If you want to turn this into a human rights issue, have at it... but for the sake of credibility I would choose my dance partners more carefully. JMO.

It's a freedom of speech issue which the DC chief of police admitted they erred on. There exists no law or rule that prohibits anyone from wearing a T-shirt in the House with writing or no writing on it. It's real easy to fix but as of right now it's not.

And as far as the wrong place, wrong time, I couldn't disagree with you more. It was exactly the right place to demonstrate against the Iraq invasion and occupation.

[alkemical]

but she wasn't in a free speech zone.

[Rascal]

Be quiet Josh neither are you.

[W*GS]

It was exactly the right place to demonstrate against the Iraq invasion and occupation.

Was it?

Do you think folks who hold up big pictures of aborted fetuses outside abortion clinics are in "exactly the right place"?

[Bronco_Beerslug]

Was it?

Do you think folks who hold up big pictures of aborted fetuses outside abortion clinics are in "exactly the right place"?
To get publicity, it was perfect!

[W*GS]

To get publicity, it was perfect!

Those who agree with her 100% (like you) think the whole thing was perfect.

Those who don't agree with her think she's nothing more than a cheap media whore who's being manipulated by anti-Bush/hard-leftists.

In short, what did she accomplish besides strengthening the beliefs of her followers and her detractors?

[Rascal]

So I guess you support those religious wackos who have been going to soldiers funerals and saying how God hates america, the dead soldier is going to hell, etc since it gets them publicity.

Nice.

[RaiderH8r]

To get publicity, it was perfect!
Exactly, you're almost there. Her presence and attire was strictly for publicity and therefore a "publicity activity" expressly stated in my numerous earlier posts as prohibited under rules of decorum in the House Chamber.

She got the boot and the coverage so she has accomplished her goals. However, she should be back in California prepping her primary run against Senator Feinstein. Ha!

And your credibility in mocking the Fred Phelps type activity has taken a serious plop in the crapper since the beginning of this thread.

[Bronco_Beerslug]

Those who agree with her 100% (like you) think the whole thing was perfect.

Where did I say I supported her? I said it was the best possible way to get publicity for her cause, if you can't understand that I can't enlighten you any further.

Exactly, you're almost there. Her presence and attire was strictly for publicity and therefore a "publicity activity" expressly stated in my numerous earlier posts as prohibited under rules of decorum in the House Chamber.

According to the DC police chief she was demonstrating which she had every right to be doing.

[alkemical]

Be quiet Josh neither are you.


I guess not with the law that states an "e-annoyance" is a fed. crime. :)

[Rascal]

I guess not with the law that states an "e-annoyance" is a fed. crime. :)

Bingo, and people think it is just a coincidence. Scary times.

[alkemical]

I just like harping on the free speech zones, et al - as well as the fed's grip on the internet.

To me those are just dangerous ideas.

Now for her tshirt in the gallery. I don't care. But if they left her alone (and the other lady as well) - it wouldn't have made it this far. I personally could care less about this issue in some regard.

I just find it funny that in a building we paid for, and people that supposidly work for us, tell US what to do.

[W*GS]

Where did I say I supported her?

Puhleeze.

[Bronco_Beerslug]

Puhleeze.

"I do not agree with what you have to say, but I'll defend to the death your right to say it." - Voltaire

[W*GS]

"I do not agree with what you have to say, but I'll defend to the death your right to say it." - Voltaire

And?

What of:

It was exactly the right place to demonstrate against the Iraq invasion and occupation.

Do you think folks who hold up big pictures of aborted fetuses outside abortion clinics are in "exactly the right place"?

[Bronco_Beerslug]

And?

What of:
And, what does your abortion analogy have to do with anything here. I'm pretty sure PP clinics don't host SOTUAs on national TV.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

It's a freedom of speech issue which the DC chief of police admitted they erred on. There exists no law or rule that prohibits anyone from wearing a T-shirt in the House with writing or no writing on it.

This should have been the last word on the subject, but here we are - eight pages later - and the bush faithful still don't get it.

Nevertheless, you have to admit that the reaction Cindy Sheehan elicits from the wingnuts is pretty entertaining. She gets under their collective skin almost as much as Michael Moore. If there was no truth to what she (or Moore) says, then there wouldn't be such an intense emotional reaction from the righties.

[gunns]

How was the writing on her T-shirt a protest? It said nothing about Bush or the government. It was a question....one that seems to make some uneasy.

[Garcia Bronco]

How was the writing on her T-shirt a protest? It said nothing about Bush or the government. It was a question....one that seems to make some uneasy.


At the SOTU in our Nations Captial Building it's a political demonstration, which is not allowed there at all.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

At the SOTU in our Nations Captial Building it's a political demonstration, which is not allowed there at all.

No - her actions didn't qualify as a 'political demonstration.'

The capitol police have already acknowledged this - why can't you?

[Bronco_Beerslug]

At the SOTU in our Nations Captial Building it's a political demonstration, which is not allowed there at all.
Actually, they are, in the form she demonstrated in, as I posted.

United States Capitol Police Board issued a regulation that interprets “demonstration activity” to
include:

parading, picketing, speechmaking, holding vigils, sit-ins, or other expressive conduct that convey[s] a message supporting or opposing a point of view or has the intent, effect or propensity to attract a crowd of
onlookers, but does not include merely wearing Tee shirts, buttons orother similar articles of apparel that convey a message.

http://www.dcd.uscourts.gov/97-1337c.pdf

[Broncos1]

Wow! Bronco Beerslug, you have been taken to school. The only thing you left to do is change the subject or shut up. Everytime you try and defend yourself you make yourself sound more ignorant and blinded by your far left bias.

[Bronco_Beerslug]

Wow! Bronco Beerslug, you have been taken to school. The only thing you left to do is change the subject or shut up. Everytime you try and defend yourself you make yourself sound more ignorant and blinded by your far left bias.

Hilarious!

Errant, is that you?

[Spider]

Cindy and the arrest .............. She got what she wanted ,Bush got what he wanted .........Whats the problem ???

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

Wow! Bronco Beerslug, you have been taken to school. The only thing you left to do is change the subject or shut up.

Um, no, monkey:

It's your fellow bush sheep who keep deflecting and changing the subject while BB keeps trying to bring them back to the thread topic, viz., Police Apologize, Drop Charge Vs. Sheehan.

Hint: They apologized and dropped the charges because they were wrong.

Everytime you try and defend yourself you make yourself sound more ignorant and blinded by your far left bias.

Hilarious!

Oh, the irony.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

Cindy Sheehan and Beverly Young aren't the first to get booted for t-shirts

The booting of Cindy Sheehan and Beverly Young from the Capitol during the State of the Union Address because of their T-shirts was not an isolated event.

In the Bush Age, such hostility to free speech has become all too common. Students have been booted from school, shoppers from malls, protesters from Bush rallies, simply as a result of the shirts on their fronts.

Stephen F. Downs, the chief lawyer for New York State's Commission on Judicial Conduct, was arrested on March 3, 2003, for refusing to take off a peace T-shirt in a mall near Albany.

The shirt said "Peace on Earth" on one side and "Give Peace a Chance" on the other. He had just purchased the shirt in Crossgates Mall, the same mall that ordered him to remove it.

When the mall's security guards told him to take the shirt off or leave the premises, Downs refused. They called the police, and he was handcuffed, arrested, and charged with trespassing.

Downs pleaded not guilty, and the mall later dropped the charges.



Bretton Barber was a junior at Dearborn High School in Michigan on February 17, 2003. That day, he was wearing a T-shirt that had a picture of Bush on it and the words "International Terrorist." "At lunch, the vice principal came and said I had to turn it inside out or go home," Barber told The New York Times on Feb. 26. Barber went home--and called the ACLU.

A judge later ruled that Barber must be allowed to wear the shirt in school.

Nicole and Jeff Rank were in Charleston, West Virginia, on July 4, 2004, to protest a visit by President Bush to the state capitol.

The Ranks, who are from Corpus Christi, Texas, gathered outside the capitol. People near them "wore pro-Bush T-shirts and Bush-Cheney campaign buttons, some of which were sold on the capitol grounds," according to the Charleston Gazette.

Not the Ranks. They were wearing T-shirts that read "Love America, Hate Bush," the Gazette reported.

The police evidently did not take kindly to that.

"Law enforcement officers told the couple to take the shirts off, cover them, or get out," AP reported. "When they refused and sat down, they were arrested." Two weeks later, the city apologized.

Jayson Nelson is a county supervisor in Wisconsin. On July 14, 2004, President Bush came to Wisconsin and gave a speech in a town called Ashwaubenon, and Jayson Nelson wanted to hear him.

He was wearing a "Kerry for President" T-shirt underneath his buttoned up blue denim shirt.

As he approached the final screening point, Nelson says a Republican event staffer demanded that he step out of the line and take off his top shirt.

"At first, I thought she wasn't even talking to me," he recalls, "because who tells you that stuff? So I ignored her and kept going forward and then she told me again, 'You, you, you, step out of line. You've got to take off your shirt.' "

She told the police to look at his T-shirt, and the police told him he couldn't be there and to get going, Nelson remembers.

On his way out, the Secret Service also stopped him. "They took my driver's license and wrote down my Social Security number and telephone number," he says. "I started to ask, 'What's going on here? Is a T-shirt illegal?' "

My favorite story, if you can call it that, is of three teachers in Oregon who were sent packing from a Bush rally for wearing shirts that said ”Protect Our Civil Liberties.”

On October 14, 2004, they decided to attend a Bush rally at the Jackson County Fairgrounds near Medford, where they teach. They wanted to see their President, and they also wanted to stand up for First Amendment rights, since they had heard on NPR that the Bush campaign was curtailing such rights all along the trail.

So they came up with an ingenious idea. They obtained tickets for the event, and they made and wore T-shirts that said, "Protect Our Civil Liberties." Alas, they were not allowed to hear the President. In fact, they were threatened with arrest.

I talked with two of the three teachers, Tania Tong and her sister, Candice Julian, both of whom teach special education to elementary school children in Medford. The third is a student teacher named Janet Voorhies, who works with Tong.

"We didn't want to come up with anything that was offensive or antagonistic," says Julian, who says it was her idea to have the shirts say, "Protect Our Civil Liberties."

"We were concerned about stories we had heard about people trying to go to participate in rallies and being denied access because they had paraphernalia that said something about Kerry," Tong explains. "We wanted to voice our opinion in a way that wasn't degrading to anybody.

The shirt was really kind of benign."

At the fairgrounds, they showed their driver's licenses and tickets at the first checkpoint. Campaign officials "were scrutinizing our T-shirts," Julian says, but they let the three in.

At the second checkpoint, which consisted of a metal detector staffed by the Secret Service, more questions arose.

"People came up and said, 'Do you know this is a Bush rally? We're concerned about your T-shirts,' " recalls Tong.

"We asked them why.

"They said, 'We don't want anything that's going to cause a disruption.'

"Then they asked, 'Are you going to vote for Bush?'

"And I said that I was undecided and my sister Candice said she was choosing not to answer because it's a personal decision."

The campaign officials said they could go in if they could guarantee they would not make a scene, Tong says. "We assured them that we did not come with any intention of being disorderly, so they said fine and said they respected our differing opinions," she recalls.

At that point, the three teachers assumed they were in, and that they could take their seats and listen to the President.

No such luck.

Campaign officials soon told all three women to leave.

One official called their shirts "obscene," Tong recalls.

The police then threatened them with disorderly conduct if they didn't take off.

http://progressive.org/mag_wx020206

[Bronco_Beerslug]

Cindy Sheehan and Beverly Young aren't the first to get booted for t-shirts



But that's OK (denying Americans freedom of speech) for Bush supporters. No one should ever question authority, how dare they!

[epicSocialism4tw]

sheesh. you guys make me laugh!

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

No one should ever question authority, how dare they!

This is exactly the message coming from angrydrama and the rest of the bush defenders and cheerleaders for fascism.

[epicSocialism4tw]

This is exactly the message coming from angrydrama and the rest of the bush defenders and cheerleaders for fascism.

___________ and the fascist Bush lemmings ________!!!!!:rofl: LOL Ha!

I'm beginning to think that you guys are just software.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

___________ and the fascist Bush lemmings ________!!!!!:rofl: LOL Ha!

I'm beginning to think that you guys are just software.

Says the guy who has spent the last nine pages defending fascism. :rofl:

[epicSocialism4tw]

Says the guy who has spent the last nine pages defending fascism. :rofl:

My security software doesnt prevent your popups from entering the threads...

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

My security software doesnt prevent your popups from entering the threads...

Do you have software that prevents reality from intruding on your thought processes as well?

[epicSocialism4tw]

Do you have software that prevents reality from intruding on your thought processes as well?

That program must have a Fozzy Bear subengine. Hmmm...Wocka Wocka??

[W*GS]

And, what does your abortion analogy have to do with anything here. I'm pretty sure PP clinics don't host SOTUAs on national TV.

You missed the point.

Are you a free speech absolutist? If so, then you must fund the restrictions on anti-abortion protesters anathema.

[W*GS]

If there was no truth to what she (or Moore) says, then there wouldn't be such an intense emotional reaction from the righties.

Projecting, again, I see.

[defenseman]

LMFAO!!!!!!! Man does the "extreme left" make themselves look bad. They are their own worst enemy. Then again , the "extreme right" needs to clean up their act also. I'm in the middle somewhere, depends on the issue. I do know, it's nothing to get your blood pressure up over. It works out in the end, always does...dman

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

Quote of the Day

Rep. Bill Young (R-FL) said he wouldn't be so mad if it were just Cindy Sheehan, because he disagrees "with everything she stands for," but by removing his wife, officers clearly "acted precipitously."

http://nationaljournal.com/avantgo/wakeup.htm

Like all Republicans, Young believes freedom of speech only applies to people he agrees with.

http://www.bartcop.com/ricodog-handjob2.jpg

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

http://www.bartcop.com/t-shirt-squad.gif