Mario Williams(trade up or stay put)

[OrangeShadow]

id love to trade up to get him if it means giving up our 2 1sts for a high first. this guy is a absolute monster. but would you guys rather stay with 2 low 1sts or trade up to get him

[meangene]

id love to trade up to get him if it means giving up our 2 1sts for a high first. this guy is a absolute monster. but would you guys rather stay with 2 low 1sts or trade up to get him

TRADE UP! If we can get him for the two firsts. The draft is becoming so deep that we can fill other needs with later picks. There is a dropoff at DE after him. Some others I like but not with his combo of speed AND size.

[27atwater]

trade a #1 this year and a #1 next...plus later pix if necessary. I'd rather not use both this year on 1 guy.

[OrangeShadow]

i woudnt mind that either^ but if we could land that guy id be estatic!

[meangene]

trade a 31 this year and a #1 next...plus later pix if necessary. I'd rather not use both this year on 1 guy.

I doubt that would get it done. I'm not sure both 1's this year would get us to the 5th or 6th pick necessary to get Williams. How about this?

1. Williams
2. M. Bush
3. Blackman / Stovall

[Drek]

I think we address WR and DL heavy in this draft. I don't think that means dumping two firsts on one guy though. I really like Mario Williams, but if his combine isn't impressive his draft stock will get a quick jolt of reality, since his collegiate on-field performance was very up and down. If he doesn't put up a good 40 and/or bench reps he could slide hard.

On that same thought path, the same could be said for all the DEs in this draft, including Kiwanuka. The 'skins will give us an early 20's pick, which is ideal slide position. I say sit back and wait to see what steal slides to us. Same with the 2nd 1st, sit back and see what exceptional talent falls because of "need" concerns. Guys always do, I'd prefer to be the team taking advantage of that.

I think Chad Jackson or Derek Hagan (I'd prefer the later) would both make excellent 1B picks. A lot of DLs would make a good 1A fit, though we need to see who's left come our pick. Too hard to predict that now before the pro days and combine.

[Billy Clyde Puckett]

I think we address WR and DL heavy in this draft. I don't think that means dumping two firsts on one guy though. I really like Mario Williams, but if his combine isn't impressive his draft stock will get a quick jolt of reality, since his collegiate on-field performance was very up and down. If he doesn't put up a good 40 and/or bench reps he could slide hard.

On that same thought path, the same could be said for all the DEs in this draft, including Kiwanuka. The 'skins will give us an early 20's pick, which is ideal slide position. I say sit back and wait to see what steal slides to us. Same with the 2nd 1st, sit back and see what exceptional talent falls because of "need" concerns. Guys always do, I'd prefer to be the team taking advantage of that.

I think Chad Jackson or Derek Hagan (I'd prefer the later) would both make excellent 1B picks. A lot of DLs would make a good 1A fit, though we need to see who's left come our pick. Too hard to predict that now before the pro days and combine.

Pretty much agree Drek. Broncs get two DL, two players to upgrade the passing game, at least one good OL and a little depth at a few other positions and they have a good draft. Need to wait for the real evaluations to come in from the combine and the workouts before jumping off any cliff. The only certrain things in life are death taxes and bad predictions by web draft analysts.

[meangene]

I think we address WR and DL heavy in this draft. I don't think that means dumping two firsts on one guy though. I really like Mario Williams, but if his combine isn't impressive his draft stock will get a quick jolt of reality, since his collegiate on-field performance was very up and down. If he doesn't put up a good 40 and/or bench reps he could slide hard.

On that same thought path, the same could be said for all the DEs in this draft, including Kiwanuka. The 'skins will give us an early 20's pick, which is ideal slide position. I say sit back and wait to see what steal slides to us. Same with the 2nd 1st, sit back and see what exceptional talent falls because of "need" concerns. Guys always do, I'd prefer to be the team taking advantage of that.

I think Chad Jackson or Derek Hagan (I'd prefer the later) would both make excellent 1B picks. A lot of DLs would make a good 1A fit, though we need to see who's left come our pick. Too hard to predict that now before the pro days and combine.

I agree that at least one of the top DE's could slide to us at 1a (i.e. Hali, Kiwi) and I think we could get a good receiver at 1b. I'm just not sold on any of the late first round receivers as being much better than some of the later round guys. And, Williams brings size at DE that the others don't. He is another Julius Peppers IMO. I think his stock will go up at the combine. We're on the same page as far as draft needs (WR, DL).

[27atwater]

I doubt that would get it done. I'm not sure both 1's this year would get us to the 5th or 6th pick necessary to get Williams. How about this?

1. Williams
2. M. Bush
3. Blackman / Stovall


i didn't mean 31...i must have missed the "#" sign...i was speaking of the skins pick.

[27atwater]

I still want Santonio Holmes somehow, regardless of whatever else we do early...and 1 or both of the Minnesota linemen in the 2nd and/or 3rd.

[meangene]

I still want Santonio Holmes somehow, regardless of whatever else we do early...and 1 or both of the Minnesota linemen in the 2nd and/or 3rd.

I like Santonio Holmes too. Don't think he lasts until our 1a though. But, with all the underclassmen who knows?

[Rascal]

According to my scenario Mario will probably be picked by either San Fran, Oakland, or the Packers. Recent report have the packers entralled with with Lindell White. If the 49'ers win the coin flip with Oakland, we could possibly trade with them. But even both of our firsts would not be of enough value to trade with them, as we would need to throw in something else.

[Rascal]

I still want Santonio Holmes somehow, regardless of whatever else we do early...and 1 or both of the Minnesota linemen in the 2nd and/or 3rd.

I agree with the minnesota lineman.

[meangene]

According to my scenario Mario will probably be picked by either San Fran, Oakland, or the Packers. Recent report have the packers entralled with with Lindell White. If the 49'ers win the coin flip with Oakland, we could possibly trade with them. But even both of our firsts would not be of enough value to trade with them, as we would need to throw in something else.

I think you're probably right. That's why I said I wasn't sure both our 1's would do it. Worth a shot, though, IMO. Maybe throw in a later round pick next year.

[27atwater]

I agree with the minnesota lineman.


They are at the top of my list after the first round. Great fit for us, and they would already have a chemistry. Although this would never happen, noone has really talked too much about us going after Maroney...a zone back. We land all 3 of those guys, a first round WR or DE and we are looking real solid for the future.

[Rascal]

I think I would pass on WR in this draft as the depth is just not there, especially in the first day. I would like to pick up Moulds though in FA. Him with Rod and Lelie would be an impressive WR core.

If we get Mario, and one or both of the Minnesota lineman in the draft I think that would be incredible.

[RocBronc]

I don't think our 2 first round picks would be enough to get into the 3-5 range to get Williams and I don't know if it would be worth it to go get him with what it would cost, but it certainly is tempting.

[27atwater]

A few weeks ago there was a report that Shanny was gonna makes some changes to the WR corps this offseason. I dunno if it's draft, FA or both, but I would like to see a guy like Moulds and Holmes...or maybe jackson or Hester in the 2nd as a nice vet/youth combo. Cuz even if we do get Moulds or a guy like Jurevicous, they too are fetting up in age. I think no mattre what we do, we need an infusion of young talent.

[Traveler]

At some point, OL has to be addressed. Even though the OL has played well, Denver should start looking for replacements.

I would love to somehow get Williams and defense has been the focus for the last couple of years. Time to address to offense. Especially WR, OT, C, or OG with one of the first rounders.

[Rascal]

A few weeks ago there was a report that Shanny was gonna makes some changes to the WR corps this offseason. I dunno if it's draft, FA or both, but I would like to see a guy like Moulds and Holmes...or maybe jackson or Hester in the 2nd as a nice vet/youth combo. Cuz even if we do get Moulds or a guy like Jurevicous, they too are fetting up in age. I think no mattre what we do, we need an infusion of young talent.

Rod is going to be 36 and Moulds will be 32 I think (maybe 33). But older WR's maintain their value much more, especially possession type WR's such as Moulds and Rod, then older WR's who are big play type WR's.

It typically takes a WR at least three years to become anything of value, and by then Rod may be in crutches so we don't have the time to wait for that amount of time.

I agree we need to get some younger talent at WR but this draft is not very good in terms of WR talent and in order to get any we would have to reach more then likely. Plus I know for sure I don't want us to be the first team to select a WR has they have the propensity for being busts.

[RocBronc]

I think Holmes is over rated... Hagan, IMO is the best WR in the draft, IMO...

[Rascal]

I think Holmes is over rated... Hagan, IMO is the best WR in the draft, IMO...

I don't want either one of them. They would have to be taken with a first and that is reaching IMO. In previous years draft they would have been second rounders, but with this week WR class they are first rounders. There is a lot of depth in other areas in this draft that we could use some help on, and we should take advantage of it.

[27atwater]

I really think Holmes camn be a difference maker. he has been compared to steve smith, but is faster and a bit bigger. if he learns the field and game like smith, he's gonna be a star. watched him for a while now and he is electric.

[phibacka31]

I love Holmes and Hagen. I also like some of the WRS that will go in the third. Rodgers(TCU), the Miami(OH) Wr, etc.
Another thing why not trade up and get Ngata if we can get that high. Woud you take williams instead of Ngata?

[Clockwork Orange]

This could really depend on the coin flip between the 49ers and Fade. If the 49ers get the 6th pick, we could be in position to make a deal. Rumor has it that they're interested in trading down and stocking up picks, of which the Broncos have plenty to offer. But if the Fade get that 6th pick, they'll take Williams and that will be that.

[Rascal]

This could really depend on the coin flip between the 49ers and Fade. If the 49ers get the 6th pick, we could be in position to make a deal. Rumor has it that they're interested in trading down and stocking up picks, of which the Broncos have plenty to offer. But if the Fade get that 6th pick, they'll take Williams and that will be that.

They may take AJ Hawk.

[meangene]

On the WR free agency front I have always been a big fan of David Givens. I think he has #1 receiver ability. He was on his way to a big year this year before being sidelined with a knee injury. TD in six straight playoff games. Team player.

[RocBronc]

Yes it is a down year for WR's but I think Hagan would be good value with our 1B pick... Which if I understand things will be no lower than the 30th pick, regardless of how the playoffs shake out.

The reason I like Hagan so much is he isn't just an athlete, he's a receiver. Alot of first round receivers get picked because of their athletic abilty, ie speed, quickness and size which can be shut down at the NFL level unless the player learns to be a good route runner and learns all of the nuances that it takes to be a good receiver. From everything I've read, Hagan has these things but doesn't have blazing speed or quickness. Remember, coming out of college Jerry Rice wasn't a physically dazzling receiver but we know how he turned out.

[meangene]

I love Holmes and Hagen. I also like some of the WRS that will go in the third. Rodgers(TCU), the Miami(OH) Wr, etc.
Another thing why not trade up and get Ngata if we can get that high. Woud you take williams instead of Ngata?

Ngata is a beast but I really think we need that edge rusher at DE more. We've got to turn those pressures into sacks. I do think we could get him later than Williams though.

[NFLBRONCO]

I'd love Williams here no doubt. With all the players declaring I think we should stay put and fill 2 holes early. I think we can land a S DL with those picks. I think Denver needs both a stud DT and a speed rushing DE. Warren needs help to free him up more. To be honest if we do trade up I would hope it would be for a DE because we've needed one for decades.

[Clockwork Orange]

They may take AJ Hawk.

I can't see Hawk slipping out of the top 5, but if he was there Greasy Al would probably consider it.

[NFLBRONCO]

Anyone know off the top of their heads who needs a S and a TE ahead of us?

[Hercules Rockefeller]

Stay put, this draft is too good. Use the picks.

[Billy Clyde Puckett]

Stay put, this draft is too good. Use the picks.

Agree. In fact I wouldn't be opposed to trading one of next years picks for one this year since next year now looks pretty thin.

[lookin' glass]

Drek posted earlier that Wash. would get Denver an early 20's pick. What did he mean and if he's referring to the 1st wouldn't that pick be near the end of the 1st rd?

[OrangeShadow]

it depends on how far they go in the playoff^

[lookin' glass]

Thanks OS. I've been reading this often and wasn't sure as the Deadskins are this far in the playoffs.

[Lestat]

so long as we don't have to give up both 1sts to get him i'd love to see him in a Broncos uni

[-Slap-]

If we could land Williams with 1A and 1B, I would be ecstatic.

[Drek]

Drek posted earlier that Wash. would get Denver an early 20's pick. What did he mean and if he's referring to the 1st wouldn't that pick be near the end of the 1st rd? They've only made it past the WC round so far, the 'skins need to basically have a real SB run, including beating Seattle, to drop further in round 1 than somewhere between 21-25 I'd estimate, depending on coin flips and other playoff ramifications.

I personally think Hagan and Holmes are very underrated as WRs. Guys with both size and speed are increadably rare and go very, very early. Short of picking in the top 10 a team needs to bet on a WR maturing and developing his game at the NFL level more than probably any other position in the league except QB. Some do it, some don't. A few years ago Dante Stallworth and Ashley Lelie were the only 1st round WRs taken, I'd put Holmes above both of them because he's shown more than just elite speed, which he has, but also a reciever's mindset of attacking the ball and making plays when its in his hands. The last time we had a first we were looking at Mike Clayton, now playing for Tampa Bay. I'd consider Hagan a better WR than him when both were leaving college as well.

Holmes and Hagan are two WRs who understand their position. They both track the ball in flight and aproach catching it more agressively than many starting NFL WRs, thats a skill you just can't teach (see Lelie, Ashley, for example of failed attempt). Holmes' height and Hagan's speed is the only attributes keeping each of them from being top 10 picks. Me personally, I think 40 times and tape measurements are over blown to **** when it comes to WRs. Steve Smith was the most dominant recieving force in the NFL this year without a good #2 WR compliment or a good QB. He's 2" shorter than Holmes, yet he runs sharp routes and attacks the ball. He's a reciever, not a track star or some tall lanky athlete. For our offense we need the later.

Hell, if Holmes was available at 1A I'd take a long look at the talent on the board, then probably have to take him as a "best available" pick. If Hagan was available with 1B its the same situation. They are both polished WRs from a skills standpoint. If we took either one I wouldn't be surprised to see him steal Lelie's job by mid-season, and I'm a big Lelie supporter!

Of course, Mario Williams is one of the ultimate prizes of this draft, and if he was to slide and if the 49ers would trade us their #7 pick and #7 in round 3 for our two firsts I'd be real happy with that, but then those are some big "ifs".

We're a damn good team with two 1sts, lets just sit back and see what this very deep draft is going to give us. All kinds of talent could slide to us that as of right now we have no idea about. Enjoy the game tommorow, come the combine we'll get a much clearer picture of all this.

[Mediator12]

I think I would pass on WR in this draft as the depth is just not there, especially in the first day. I would like to pick up Moulds though in FA. Him with Rod and Lelie would be an impressive WR core.

If we get Mario, and one or both of the Minnesota lineman in the draft I think that would be incredible.

Totally agree with that. Only problem is Jake would have to pass more!

[Billy Clyde Puckett]

Both of the Minn Linemen are very good, but don't forget and be disappointed if Broncs grab others. This draft is probably deeper at OL than any other position. There will be major bargains in the mid rounds.

[Lestat]

Broncos should wait on OL & take Derek Morris late, he'll be a steal in round 3 or so