Who is the Greatest Hockey Player of all time?

[CanuckBroncofan]

Many an arguement can be made as to who is the best hockey player of all time.
Names like Wayne Gretzky, Gordie Howe, Bobby Orr are a few that come to mind. I am bias as I am from Bobby's home town. I think Bobby is the greatest hockey player to ever put on skates and in his mid fifties is in pretty good shape for a guy that's had a few major knee surgeries. This pic was taken this past summer at his charity golf tournament.

A friend of mine, his brother Lou Franceschetti and Orr.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v466/CanuckBroncofan/orr.jpg

[SoCalBronco]

Im going to go in full :homer: mode here. If it weren't for those back problems starting way back in '89 and then the cancer...

http://img320.imageshack.us/img320/3184/mariol0uw.th.jpg (http://img320.imageshack.us/my.php?image=mariol0uw.jpg)

[Bronx33]

Antti Laaksonen!!

[Clockwork Orange]

This is always an interesting discussion. By the numbers, Wayne Gretzky gets the nod. As far as a player who dominated and changed the game, you have to go with Bobby Orr. If you go by the most pure talent, it's gotta be Mario Lemieux.

Lemieux is the best I've ever seen (mind you that Orr's career ended when I was an infant).

[Bronx33]

This is always an interesting discussion. By the numbers, Wayne Gretzky gets the nod. As far as a player who dominated and changed the game, you have to go with Bobby Orr. If you go by the most pure talent, it's gotta be Mario Lemieux.

Lemieux is the best I've ever seen (mind you that Orr's career ended when I was an infant).


Ya it's kinda hard to call unless you were able to see orr play so i can't comment on him but i did get to see mario and gretzky is there a clear cut best? all of them had their strong points.

[-Slap-]

He might not be the best player ever, or even second best, but Gretzky's numbers were downright Ruthian. 92 goals one year. 163 assists another year. Over 200 points four times in five years.

Year Team GP G A Pts Pim
1979-80 Edmonton Oilers 79 51 86 137 21
1980-81 Edmonton Oilers 80 55 109 164 28
1981-82 Edmonton Oilers 80 92 120 212 26
1982-83 Edmonton Oilers 80 71 125 196 59
1983-84 Edmonton Oilers 74 87 118 205 39
1984-85 Edmonton Oilers 80 73 135 208 52
1985-86 Edmonton Oilers 80 52 163 215 46
1986-87 Edmonton Oilers 79 62 121 183 28
1987-88 Edmonton Oilers 64 40 109 149 24
1988-89 Los Angeles Kings 78 54 114 168 26
1989-90 Los Angeles Kings 73 40 102 142 42
1990-91 Los Angeles Kings 78 41 122 163 16
1991-92 Los Angeles Kings 74 31 90 121 34
1992-93 Los Angeles Kings 45 16 49 65 6
1993-94 Los Angeles Kings 81 38 92 130 20
1994-95 Los Angeles Kings 48 11 37 48 6
1995-96 Los Angeles Kings 62 15 66 81 32
1995-96 St. Louis Blues 18 8 13 21 2
1996-97 New York Rangers 82 25 72 97 28
1997-98 New York Rangers 82 23 67 90 28
1998-99 New York Rangers 70 9 53 62 14
NHL Totals 1487 894 1963 2857 577

[CanuckBroncofan]

here are bobby's stats. Remember he fried his knee in 1975.


Season Team Lge GP G A Pts PIM GP G A Pts PIM
1963-64 Oshawa Generals OHA 56 29 43 72 0
1964-65 Oshawa Generals OHA 56 34 59 93 0
1965-66 Oshawa Generals OHA 47 38 56 94 92
1966-67 Boston Bruins NHL 61 13 28 41 102 -- -- -- -- --
1967-68 Boston Bruins NHL 46 11 20 31 63 4 0 2 2 2
1968-69 Boston Bruins NHL 67 21 43 64 133 10 1 7 8 10
1969-70 Boston Bruins NHL 76 33 87 120 125 14 9 11 20 14
1970-71 Boston Bruins NHL 78 37 102 139 91 7 5 7 12 10
1971-72 Boston Bruins NHL 76 37 80 117 106 15 5 19 24 19
1972-73 Boston Bruins NHL 63 29 72 101 99 5 1 1 2 7
1973-74 Boston Bruins NHL 74 32 90 122 82 16 4 14 18 28
1974-75 Boston Bruins NHL 80 46 89 135 101 3 1 5 6 2
1975-76 Boston Bruins NHL 10 5 13 18 22 -- -- -- -- --
1976-77 Chicago Blackhawks NHL 20 4 19 23 25 -- -- -- -- --
1977-78 Did Not Play Statistics Unavailable
1978-79 Chicago Blackhawks NHL 6 2 2 4 4 -- -- -- -- --
NHL Totals 657 270 645 915 953 74 26 66 92 92

[Clockwork Orange]

here are bobby's stats. Remember he fried his knee in 1975.


Season Team Lge GP G A Pts PIM GP G A Pts PIM
1963-64 Oshawa Generals OHA 56 29 43 72 0
1964-65 Oshawa Generals OHA 56 34 59 93 0
1965-66 Oshawa Generals OHA 47 38 56 94 92
1966-67 Boston Bruins NHL 61 13 28 41 102 -- -- -- -- --
1967-68 Boston Bruins NHL 46 11 20 31 63 4 0 2 2 2
1968-69 Boston Bruins NHL 67 21 43 64 133 10 1 7 8 10
1969-70 Boston Bruins NHL 76 33 87 120 125 14 9 11 20 14
1970-71 Boston Bruins NHL 78 37 102 139 91 7 5 7 12 10
1971-72 Boston Bruins NHL 76 37 80 117 106 15 5 19 24 19
1972-73 Boston Bruins NHL 63 29 72 101 99 5 1 1 2 7
1973-74 Boston Bruins NHL 74 32 90 122 82 16 4 14 18 28
1974-75 Boston Bruins NHL 80 46 89 135 101 3 1 5 6 2
1975-76 Boston Bruins NHL 10 5 13 18 22 -- -- -- -- --
1976-77 Chicago Blackhawks NHL 20 4 19 23 25 -- -- -- -- --
1977-78 Did Not Play Statistics Unavailable
1978-79 Chicago Blackhawks NHL 6 2 2 4 4 -- -- -- -- --
NHL Totals 657 270 645 915 953 74 26 66 92 92

Ray Bourque is the NHL's all-time leading scorer amongst defensemen only because of Orr's knee problems. Had Orr been healthy, he would have put that record so far out of reach that Bourque would have had to play until he was 60 just to get close.

[JPEZ]

In the words of Mike Haynes

Peter 'The Great'........ Peter 'The Great'
Peter Forsberg

[CanuckBroncofan]

In the words of Mike Haynes

Peter 'The Great'........ Peter 'The Great'
Peter Forsberg

I like Forsberg, but he isn't even top 10 yet.

[Smiling Assassin27]

It's Gretzky and then a real good conversation for second between Orr, Howe, Hull (Daddy), Messier, and Yzerman.

[Breck Bronc]

http://hockeygoalies.org/bio/images/roy.gif

http://www.recoilmag.com/news/grfx/avalanche_coaches_may_have_known_0702.jpg

You always hear people say that goaltending is the most important position in hockey, particularly during the playoffs. Yet whenever I see debates on the best hockey player of all-time there are never any goaltenders mentioned.

Roy, Sawchuk, Hasek, Dryden, etc. are great players, too.

[Lidderer]

bondra or guy hebert, from what i've seen

[CanuckBroncofan]

http://hockeygoalies.org/bio/images/roy.gif

http://www.recoilmag.com/news/grfx/avalanche_coaches_may_have_known_0702.jpg

You always hear people say that goaltending is the most important position in hockey, particularly during the playoffs. Yet whenever I see debates on the best hockey player of all-time there are never any goaltenders mentioned.

Roy, Sawchuk, Hasek, Dryden, etc. are great players, too.

I saw Roy play while he was with Montreal...against the Leafs on a couple of occasions. He IMO is the best goalie ever. After Roy I would put goalies like Ken Dryden, Sawchuk, Johnny Bower, Tony Esposito and Jacques Plante.

[CanuckBroncofan]

Ray Bourque is the NHL's all-time leading scorer amongst defensemen only because of Orr's knee problems. Had Orr been healthy, he would have put that record so far out of reach that Bourque would have had to play until he was 60 just to get close.

He just had another knee surgery about a year ago his dad was telling me. If he was playing today I am quite sure they would have been able to take care of his knees.

[Swedish Extrovert]

Wow! Is this even a debate?


I havent evad all these posts... the answer is Gretzky.

Now lock the thread.

[CanuckBroncofan]

Wow! Is this even a debate?


I havent evad all these posts... the answer is Gretzky.

Now lock the thread.

Try not to cogitate too hard, it may kill you.

There are a lot more variables than just Wayne's point total to consider when annointing the greatest. How about how many teams were there when Bobby played?

[Hogan11]

No love for at all for Bobby Hull?

[CanuckBroncofan]

No love for at all for Bobby Hull?

He was awesome. I have his auto in a Hockey History mag and quite a few of his cards including his second year card.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v466/CanuckBroncofan/Hullfront.jpg

[Bronco LB 59]

19 posts in and no mention of The Honourable Joseph-Henri-Maurice "Rocket" Richard!

[alkemical]

Depends on how you want to judge....

i loved cam neely - i'm a pens fan so i love ronnie francis -

But mario has done so much for the pens on and off the ice - but messier was awesome.

[Al Wilson]

No contest...Great 1 is my vote.

[phillybroncosnut]

CanuckBronco, This is always a fun topic. This subject is always brought up this time of year. Slap, Clockwork, MT, Herc, Ames, along with others, including myself always have a good debate on this topic.

I will preface this by saying that I never had the privledge to see this guy play but my vote goes to Bobby Orr. I always compare Orr to Babe Ruth in Baseball. When Ruth was hitting 50 diggers, he was out homering other teams combined.
Same holds true for Orr. He was posted 50 goals when other teams defensman combined were only totally 10-15.

I believe he has one of the greatest +/- numbers in a career on top of that which speaks volumes for his defensive play.
Orr was an inovater. He changed the whole lanscape of blueline play.

Bobby Orr gets my vote.

[CanuckBroncofan]

CanuckBronco, This is always a fun topic. This subject is always brought up this time of year. Slap, Clockwork, MT, Herc, Ames, along with others, including myself always have a good debate on this topic.

I will preface this by saying that I never had the privledge to see this guy play but my vote goes to Bobby Orr. I always compare Orr to Babe Ruth in Baseball. When Ruth was hitting 50 diggers, he was out homering other teams combined.
Same holds true for Orr. He was posted 50 goals when other teams defensman combined were only totally 10-15.

I believe he has one of the greatest +/- numbers in a career on top of that which speaks volumes for his defensive play.
Orr was an inovater. He changed the whole lanscape of blueline play.

Bobby Orr gets my vote.

most of his stuff I've watched on video. He reminded me of a faster Paul Coffey. bobby had eyes in the back of his head. It's not that I don't think Gretz was good or Messier or Lemieux, it's just that I don't think they would have been able to put up the numbers that they did if they had to play in Orr's era. Whereas I do think Bobby would have been stronger and faster playing in the 80's and 90's and would certainly have had a longer career with the medical technology they have now.