I just have to say ............

[Spider]

Bush broke the law , the very law he took an oath to protect ......I was watching clips over @ http://www.crooksandliars.com/ about this and I couldnt believe what Dana Rohrabacher said ......If a Nuclear bomb goes off in New York or LA , the constitution will be another piece of Paper ......I thought , Men and Women have died fighting for that piece of Paper , that piece of Paper is more then a Piece of Paper ................ We need to impeach Bush and get that halfbaked Drug store Cowboy out of Office and back in Texas where he cant do much damage ...............
I have never seen anyone so open about attacking the Constitution as these Republicans..............

[Rigs11]

Yep and now he is blaming the new york times and saying what he did is ok. I mean seriously anyone that voted for this scumbag should be kicking their own ass right now.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

Yep and now he is blaming the new york times and saying what he did is ok.

After everything the NY Times has done to cover his ass.

Ingrate!

;)

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

I have never seen anyone so open about attacking the Constitution as these Republicans..............

Yep.

Nothing gets in the way of government by the rich/corporations for the rich/ corporations than all that "we the people" crap.

;)

[Garcia Bronco]

"I couldnt believe what Dana Rohrabacher said ......If a Nuclear bomb goes off in New York or LA , the constitution will be another piece of Paper "

It's a true statement in a way...look at the social break down by the people in New Orleans.

[Spider]

"I couldnt believe what Dana Rohrabacher said ......If a Nuclear bomb goes off in New York or LA , the constitution will be another piece of Paper "

It's a true statement in a way...look at the social break down by the people in New Orleans.
So we piss on the Constitution ? Amazing how much people are willing to give up in the name of Bush ...........So basicaly the Republicans stance is America was a bad Idea ........

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

So we piss on the Constitution ? Amazing how much people are willing to give up in the name of Bush ...........So basicaly the Republicans stance is America was a bad Idea ........

Exactly.

The Constitution is an impediment to the BushCo agenda.

...the taxpayers and and voters would not be able to look to the government for any services whatsoever, but also that they would not have any control over the government does. The drowned and strangled government, having ceased to exist, would not only offer no benefits to citizens, it would offer no obstacle to those who wished to break the laws (for example against internal spying), because there would be no law to break. It is for this reason that the Bush administration pays absolutely no attention to the polls--they have already discounted the preferences of the citizens. When the government has been shrunk to nothing and drowned in the bathtub, the citizenry will be entirely powerless--that is the real goal, not an unintended consequence.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/jane-smiley/a-tenstep-program_b_12451.html

[Garcia Bronco]

So we piss on the Constitution ? Amazing how much people are willing to give up in the name of Bush ...........So basicaly the Republicans stance is America was a bad Idea ........
I guess it's all how you take it.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

I guess it's all how you take it.

Take it anyway you want, but Bush still broke the law.

[Garcia Bronco]

Take it anyway you want, but Bush still broke the law.


right..right...he's been breaking the law since 2000....so did Clinton....so did his Dad...so did Reagan....gotcha...they're all crooks.

[Spider]

right..right...he's been breaking the law since 2000....so did Clinton....so did his Dad...so did Reagan....gotcha...they're all crooks.
That they are ......... Bush needs to pay the same price as the others .....

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

right..right...he's been breaking the law since 2000....so did Clinton....so did his Dad...so did Reagan....gotcha...they're all crooks.

This is an example of another tactic used by the right to get Bush off the hook and to avoid accountability, viz., "we're all dirty, therefore there's no reason to take GeeDubya to task for anything."

"Move along, folks - nothing to see here."

[Garcia Bronco]

This is an example of another tactic used by the right to get Bush off the hook and to avoid accountability, viz., "we're all dirty, therefore there's no reason to take GeeDubya to task for anything."

"Move along, folks - nothing to see here."

I'm saying you've got no credibilty on any issue because no matter what the President does it's wrong in your eyes...you're already spent. Every two term President in my life time has been a crook. Samn bitching...different guy.

[Blueflame]

Bush broke the law , the very law he took an oath to protect ......I was watching clips over @ http://www.crooksandliars.com/ about this and I couldnt believe what Dana Rohrabacher said ......If a Nuclear bomb goes off in New York or LA , the constitution will be another piece of Paper ......I thought , Men and Women have died fighting for that piece of Paper , that piece of Paper is more then a Piece of Paper ................ We need to impeach Bush and get that halfbaked Drug store Cowboy out of Office and back in Texas where he cant do much damage ...............
I have never seen anyone so open about attacking the Constitution as these Republicans..............

See, my interpretation of this is that an event like a nuke detonation in a major city would give this administration an excuse to declare martial law... in which case, the Constitution could become essentially irrelevant.

[Garcia Bronco]

See, my interpretation of this is that an event like a nuke detonation in a major city would give this administration an excuse to declare martial law... in which case, the Constitution could become essentially irrelevant.

Another point of view that's correct.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

I'm saying you've got no credibilty on any issue because no matter what the President does it's wrong in your eyes...

There's the same old right-wing "attack the messenger and pretend you've discredited the message" fallacy again.

My "credibility" (or your perception thereof) has no bearing on the fact that Bush broke the law and committed an impeachable offense.

you're already spent. Every two term President in my life time has been a crook.

Even if this is true, it doesn't excuse Bush here and now like you want it to.

Samn b****ing...different guy.

Same right-wing CYA, different day.

[Blueflame]

Another point of view that's correct.

But... doesn't it bother you just a little bit if the corporate media is suggestiing scenarios in which martial law and loss of civil rights (any and all Constitutional protections) might be generally accepted?

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

But... doesn't it bother you just a little bit if the corporate media is suggestiing scenarios in which martial law and loss of civil rights (any and all Constitutional protections) might be generally accepted?

All Smirk has to do is say "9/11, 9/11, 9/11" often enough and he can frighten the red state sucker base into surrendering every last one of their civil liberties.

(Which is precisely the BushCo agenda: to disempower American citizens, dismantle the Constitution, destroy every last vestige of representative government, and replace it with a corporatist plutocracy.)

An American citizen who grew up in the old Soviet Union put it into perspective on C-SPAN earlier: facsism creeps up on the populace gradually (in little increments like the Patriot Act) and continues to metastasize until it gets out of control....but by then it's too late to stop it.

http://img483.imageshack.us/img483/5844/bushshadybunch7kg.jpg

[W*GS]

An American citizen who grew up in the old Soviet Union put it into perspective on C-SPAN earlier: facsism creeps up on the populace gradually (in little increments like the Patriot Act) and continues to metastasize until it gets out of control....but by then it's too late to stop it.

You're just now learning this?

America's flirtations with authoritarianism didn't begin when Bush became President. There have been elements of what you misguidedly call "fascism" existing (off and on) for decades. If your time horizon and ideology of hate for authoritarianism extended to before Jan 2001, you could come up with a long list of examples.

- Excepting Venezuela under Chavez, whose authoritarianism is just fine with you, since he's from the Left...

[Garcia Bronco]

You're just now learning this?

America's flirtations with authoritarianism didn't begin when Bush became President. There have been elements of what you misguidedly call "fascism" existing (off and on) for decades. If your time horizon and ideology of hate for authoritarianism extended to before Jan 2001, you could come up with a long list of examples.

- Excepting Venezuela under Chavez, whose authoritarianism is just fine with you, since he's from the Left...

I'm gonna have to correct that post and call well before 1/1/01...more like 6/01/00

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

You're just now learning this?

Did I say that?

America's flirtations with authoritarianism didn't begin when Bush became President. There have been elements of what you misguidedly call "fascism" existing (off and on) for decades.

But your beloved Smirky McChucklenuts has probably done more to remove the impediments to fascism (gotta chuckle when pro-bush goobers like W*GS replace words like "fascism" with euphemisms like "authoritarianism") than any pResident since Hoover.

If your time horizon and ideology of hate for authoritarianism extended to before Jan 2001, you could come up with a long list of examples.

If your "time horizon" didn't end on 1/2001 then you might actually have some relevant thoughts about current events.

Excepting Venezuela under Chavez, whose authoritarianism is just fine with you, since he's from the Left...

I know you hate Chavez because he's a threat to your Ayn Randian wet dream whereby all representative democracies are replaced with a multinational corporate fifedom, but that's no reason to lie through your teeth about the man.

Let's debunk your bullsh_t:

Hugo Chavez myths and propaganda debunked

http://vheadline.com/readnews.asp?id=46279

MYTH #1: HUGO CHAVEZ IS A DICTATOR

FACT: Hugo Chavez has promoted more citizen participation in political processes than any other President, including those excluded or left out in the past for economic reasons. No other Venezuelan government has allowed as much transparency and citizen participation in its political system. President Hugo Chavez won the 1998 presidential elections with more than 56% of the votes, after he had promoted the creation of a new constitution historically ratified by popular referendum with over 70% support; he then won elections again in 2000 accounting for 59% of the votes. In 2004, a recall referendum, a provision set forth in the new constitution, was called against the Venezuelan leader, but he again made of with 60% of the votes, ratifying his government. All these elections were witnessed by numerous international observers, including the Carter Center and the Organization of American States (OAS), which found electoral processes in Venezuela to be free and transparent.

MYTH #2: CHAVEZ IS A COMMUNIST AND IS CENTRALIZING POWER

FACT: The Venezuelan political system is characterized as participatory democracy. Citizens may participate in political processes now more than ever before. The rights to private property, international investment, freedom of speech and association are enshrined in the Venezuelan Constitution. Current endogenous development programs are means for communities to become self-reliant and to govern themselves at a local level; they are true expression of decentralization of power towards local authorities. Add, setting up work committees to implement new environmental, media, property, and other important laws, involving citizen participation at all levels. The 1999 Constitution of the Bolivarian Republic of Venezuela implements five powers instead of the former three: the Executive, Legislative, Judicial, Moral, and Electoral. These five powers are autonomous and are not controlled by the Executive. President Chavez recently promoted a new concept called "21st Century Socialism", which is aimed at developing a new social-democratic model of government which guarantees social, economic, cultural, political and civil rights to all Venezuelans and allowing the country to prosper economically in the international arena.

[Rigs11]

Wigged is just bent because Chavez helps the poor while his hero Bush favors the rich.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

Wigged is just bent because Chavez helps the poor while his hero Bush favors the rich.

Exactly.

Chavez's success exposes his "free market as government" ideology as total bunk.

Bush Vows to Keep Breaking the Law, Violating the Constitution and Spying on US! And Since He Could Have Gotten Permission to Spy Legally if It Was an Issue of National Security, You Know that a Lot of This Spying Was Political. Otherwise, Why Not Go Through the Secret Spy Approving Court? This Guy is a Threat to Democracy and America.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20051219/ap_on_go_pr_wh/bush;_ylt=Aq1z9bR1e2NQhIsh5dWz0V.s0NUE;_ylu=X3oDMT A2Z2szazkxBHNlYwN0bQ--

[W*GS]

But your beloved Smirky McChucklenuts has probably done more to remove the impediments to fascism (gotta chuckle when pro-bush goobers like W*GS replace words like "fascism" with euphemisms like "authoritarianism") than any pResident since Hoover.

Your man Clinton did more than his fair share - his continued prosecution of the failed War on Drugs, his attempts to demolish more of our rights in response to the OKC bombing, and his use of the executive branch to de facto legislate are all examples of Clinton's expansion of federal power at the expense of our liberty.

Do you deny any of those things?

I know you hate Chavez because he's a threat to your Ayn Randian wet dream whereby all representative democracies are replaced with a multinational corporate fifedom, but that's no reason to lie through your teeth about the man.

Let's debunk your bullsh_t:

I've already outed "VHeadline" as nothing more than a pro-Chavez propaganda outlet. They claimed (among many other ridiculous things) that there was more press freedom in Venezuela than anywhere in the world - I then showed "Reporters without Frontiers"'s ranking of Venezuelan press freedom as below that of Kuwait.

You'd do your pro-Chavez arguments a lot of good by abandoning "VHeadline" as a source.

See

http://www.orangemane.com/BB/showpost.php?p=847390&postcount=21

and

http://www.orangemane.com/BB/showpost.php?p=847380&postcount=20

For proof of VHeadline's lies and its cosying up to dictators.