The Shanahan move nobody mentions - Delta

[baja]

Did Shanahan make a huge miscalculation in letting Deltha go after insisting he play wide receiver.

Looks to me like Delta was right and Shanny was dead wrong on this one.

Comments?

[dbroncos31]

idk. deltha did let us get DJ, but yeah...those 9 ints would look mighty good paried with champ's 8

[Garcia Bronco]

What people don't get is that this jackass was done here. He played like ****. He earned it to get traded. He's manned up and made something of himself. Coach Shanahan made the right choice getting rid him and moving up to do it to take DJ Williams. I'm tired of hearing this bull****.

[Garcia Bronco]

idk. deltha did let us get DJ, but yeah...those 9 ints would look mighty good paried with champ's 8


It doesn't work like that.

[sirhcyennek81]

Deltha has not changed. He guesses too much, most of his picks were a result of multi-pick games, and he still gets burned on multiple move routes. His 9 int's would be nice to pair with Bailey's 8, but you cant worry about what you don't have. When deltha played for us, he sucked.

[dbroncos31]

i know, but still. teams would have no one to throw it o. i agree, deltha was a whiny bitch here that last year, and he couldn't cover for ****

[El Guapo]

It doesn't work like that.

yeah, it would have been completely different. and thats given that deltha would even play the same caliber football here.

[Northman]

What people don't get is that this jackass was done here. He played like ****. He earned it to get traded. He's manned up and made something of himself. Coach Shanahan made the right choice getting rid him and moving up to do it to take DJ Williams. I'm tired of hearing this bull****.


Yea, Deltha didnt choose to go to the Bengals. he was traded for a pick and Deltha decided to revitalize his career there, he wanted to prove something to Cincy. Something he failed to do in his last couple of years with us.

[Sideburn]

I said it then, and I'll say it now. It wasn't the players, it was the schemes we were running. Hell you still see them from time to time. Soft zones, lack of bump and run, 10 yard cushions then fall into man. I don't know who comes up with some of these, but they flat out suck. Pair these poor schemes with hard hitting safeties instead of cover safeties and you get what we have. A secondary that can be taken advantage of. We see it week in and week out, wideouts putting up year high numbers against us. And, as long as we play these schemes against the colts, manning is going to torch us for 350+ and 4 touchdowns on their way to the SB.

[sirhcyennek81]

The Deltha we traded to Cinci was not the player we had drafted, he had no confidence, and its telling that two undrafted free agents in Herndon and Walls outplayed him. I wish him all the luck in the world in Cinci, but i like what we have.

[Bronco Bob]

Deltha has one more pick. But Champ is a far superior tackler and better at breaking up plays. I go with Champ any day.

[Garcia Bronco]

yeah, it would have been completely different. and thats given that deltha would even play the same caliber football here.


I'm just saying....you can't take two mutually exclusive situation....take the better parts.....and create an all new inclusive situation. You can't do that. Least we forget the O'Neal's best int game with us was against the Chiefs with 4. I think he did the same thing this year....3 or 4 Int of those 9 came in one game.

[Rock Chalk]

Did Shanahan make a huge miscalculation in letting Deltha go after insisting he play wide receiver.

Looks to me like Delta was right and Shanny was dead wrong on this one.

Comments?
Did you see Deltha O'Neal play for the Broncos?

WHatever he is doing in Cincy is fine for him, but in Denver he flat out sucked balls.

Did Romeo Crennell make a mistake in getting rid of Warren? No. He wasnt a good fit there. He is here.

Did Arizona make a mistake in getting rid of Plummer? No. He was not the answer for them, he is for us.

Questioning personell moves because a player has went on to do well elsewhere is ****ing stupid. Why? Different schemes match up with different people better. While Deltha sucked in our scheme, he is doing well in Cincy's and I see no reason to doubt Shanny's decision on the matter, especially after Tom Brady threw that TD pass to win the game against a Danny K led Denver team.

[Bronx33]

water under the bridge.....

[watermock]

Man...do you have ADD? You forget his celebration like he just won the SuperBowl when Seattle had murdered us? He would sit in the back row of the plane joking and laughing after a loss.

Against NE, with the game on the line, he threw up the most lethargic play off all time to lose the game, and acted nonchalont...that was his last play at corner for Denver...I was furious...

Give me Champ and the two rooks that actually come to play...and seem to care...sure, Deltha got a wakeup call, and is in a good scheme, and it's never been a matter of talent...he was just plain a slacker here...that doesn't cut it with Shanahan...

[dbroncos31]

the only time you can really question a move is when you give away a 1st or 2nd year guy who was good for your team but really blossoms somewhere else. like the skins giving up bailey...b/c he was really good with was. and is GREAT with us.

[Garcia Bronco]

I said it then, and I'll say it now. It wasn't the players, it was the schemes we were running. Hell you still see them from time to time. Soft zones, lack of bump and run, 10 yard cushions then fall into man. I don't know who comes up with some of these, but they flat out suck. Pair these poor schemes with hard hitting safeties instead of cover safeties and you get what we have. A secondary that can be taken advantage of. We see it week in and week out, wideouts putting up year high numbers against us. And, as long as we play these schemes against the colts, manning is going to torch us for 350+ and 4 touchdowns on their way to the SB.


True indeed....David Gibbs getting let go also tells you what you need to know. A few games after Champ got here that guy got the boot. The scuttlebutt was that Champ got him kicked out....I think Champ had an idea and he sold it....bye-bye Gibbs after the Atlanta game.

[dbroncos31]

Against NE, with the game on the line, he threw up the most lethargic play off all time to lose the game, and acted nonchalont...that was his last play at corner for Denver...I was furious...

the worst part is that deltha had given us the lead with a 57 yard punt return TD, and it looked good for him. then he misplays the safety kick which meant we got it on the 15, giving NE great field position and then again on the Td. wasn't there a drop on third and 5 before NE got the ball back? i remember being pissed that we passed, but it aslmost worked. do i remember correctly?

[watermock]

water under the bridge.....

Exactly...it's not the way to run a team...you always focus on the next obstacle...it's ok for fans to second guess, but as an organization, you review last weeks game, not last years...point out mistakes, and try to correct them for the next opponent.

[Bronco Vixen]

Did you see Deltha O'Neal play for the Broncos?

WHatever he is doing in Cincy is fine for him, but in Denver he flat out sucked balls.

Did Romeo Crennell make a mistake in getting rid of Warren? No. He wasnt a good fit there. He is here.

Did Arizona make a mistake in getting rid of Plummer? No. He was not the answer for them, he is for us.

Questioning personell moves because a player has went on to do well elsewhere is ****ing stupid. Why? Different schemes match up with different people better. While Deltha sucked in our scheme, he is doing well in Cincy's and I see no reason to doubt Shanny's decision on the matter, especially after Tom Brady threw that TD pass to win the game against a Danny K led Denver team.

exactly. deltha came into the league with exceptional athletic ability, which helped masked his subpar and undisciplined coverage skills. he also appeared to have an attitude problem with respect to learning and that was clearly not a good fit for denver at the time, and particularly shannahan.

he was however a perfect fit for cincy, who at the time was struggling with their secondary and had a defensive minded/player friendly coach in lewis who had the patience to work with him and help rebuild his confidence. again, all about timing and fit.

[dbroncos31]

<TABLE cellSpacing=1 cellPadding=2 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR class=bg2 vAlign=center align=right height=17><TD class=away align=left colSpan=2>New England Patriots at 02:49</TD></TR><TR class=bg2 vAlign=center align=right height=17><TD class=bg3 align=left colSpan=2>K.Walter kicks 64 yards from NE 20 to DEN 16. D.O'Neal to DEN 15 for -1 yards (T.Banta-Cain).</TD></TR><TR class=bg2 vAlign=center align=right height=17><TD class=home align=left colSpan=2>Denver Broncos at 02:46</TD></TR><TR class=bg2 vAlign=center align=right height=17><TD class=bg3 align=left>1-10-DEN15</TD><TD class=bg3 align=left>(2:46) C.Portis right guard to DEN 17 for 2 yards (R.Lyle).</TD></TR><TR class=bg2 vAlign=center align=right height=17><TD class=bg3 align=left>2-8-DEN17</TD><TD class=bg3 align=left>(2:41) PENALTY on DEN-M.Lepsis, False Start, 5 yards, enforced at DEN 17 - No Play.</TD></TR><TR class=bg2 vAlign=center align=right height=17><TD class=bg3 align=left>2-13-DEN12</TD><TD class=bg3 align=left>(2:41) C.Portis up the middle to DEN 19 for 7 yards (M.Vrabel).</TD></TR><TR class=bg2 vAlign=center align=right height=17><TD class=bg3 align=left>3-6-DEN19</TD><TD class=bg3 align=left>(2:31) D.Kanell pass incomplete to A.Lelie (T.Law).</TD></TR><TR class=bg2 vAlign=center align=right height=17><TD class=bg3 align=left>4-6-DEN19</TD><TD class=bg3 align=left>(2:26) M.Knorr punts 48 yards to NE 33, Center-M.Leach. T.Brown to NE 42 for 9 yards (K.Burns).</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>there is the pass to lelie, but it says that ty law batted it away.

[dbroncos31]

and in that game, elam was hurt, and we punted from field goal range twice

[dbroncos31]

<TABLE cellSpacing=1 cellPadding=2 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR class=bg2 vAlign=center align=right height=17><TD class=bg3 align=left>4-3-NE33</TD><TD class=bg3 align=left>(7:57) M.Knorr punts 33 yards to end zone, Center-M.Leach, Touchback.</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=1 cellPadding=2 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR class=bg2 vAlign=center align=right height=17><TD class=bg3 align=left>4-4-NE35</TD><TD class=bg3 align=left>(3:17) M.Knorr punts 34 yards to NE 1, Center-M.Leach, downed by DEN-M.Leach.
damn...those were long kicks, but i think that a healthy elam would have made at least 1
</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

[watermock]

Both those times we should of gone for it on 4th down if Elam was out. Punting at the 33 when you needed only 3 yards? WTF was that? I remember that, I was furious....I'm pretty sure it went into the endzone..(how couldn't it) so we got a net of 13 yards...whoooptie doo!

Freaking kickoffs end up around the 28 for christ sake...thanks for bringing up bad nightmares...

[Garcia Bronco]

In life at any given moment...you are the sum of your experiences...these guys that leave here and do better elsewhere.....cut their teeth with us. We built the foundation.

[terry251973]

remember who deltha has picked off this year.nfc north doesnt exactly qualify for great achievements.

[dbroncos31]

Both those times we should of gone for it on 4th down if Elam was out. Punting at the 33 when you needed only 3 yards? WTF was that? I remember that, I was furious....I'm pretty sure it went into the endzone..(how couldn't it) so we got a net of 13 yards...whoooptie doo!

Freaking kickoffs end up around the 28 for christ sake...thanks for bringing up bad nightmares...
yo my fault, but it was just as bad for me to look it up...but its over and done with, and we beat them this year, and we'll beat either them or cincy or indy in the playoffs.

[Natedogg]

Man...do you have ADD? You forget his celebration like he just won the SuperBowl when Seattle had murdered us? He would sit in the back row of the plane joking and laughing after a loss.

Against NE, with the game on the line, he threw up the most lethargic play off all time to lose the game, and acted nonchalont...that was his last play at corner for Denver...I was furious...

Agreed. What pick did we end up getting for him, anyways? Was it a 4th rounder?

On a different note. I think Torry James was the true loss. I always liked him here (of course hated him in oakland :raiderssu ) and like him again at cincy. Seems to me that despite what statistics say he's a better corner than deltha.

[dbroncos31]

also, did you guys read about deltha in SI? he was talking about tauting shanahan during a play, and he risked a fumble just to piss on shanahan.

[Odysseus]

I think it's cool that Tory James lines up across from Deltha O'Neal. Good for both of them. Deltha needed the change as did Tory James. Broncos picked up a player that wasn't "needed" by the Redskins. I don't have any regrets abouts Champ Bailey or Portis either. It worked out.

I sometimes wonder what REALLY happened with Quitterson.

[CUBuffman08]

I'll take DJ and Darrent over Deltha and Jashon Sykes

[baja]

In life at any given moment...you are the sum of your experiences...these guys that leave here and do better elsewhere.....cut their teeth with us. We built the foundation.

Or Failed them.....

Kenninson

Monte Regor

Deltha O'Neal

[dbroncos31]

what a dick

[Moon§hiner]

I'd rather have Tory James back than Deltha...before his torn MCL I thought he would be a lifer here

[baja]

what a dick

Rather you like it or not Shanahan's long suit is not nurturing troubled players which is why he should leave the Clerrets of the world to the Vermeils of the world.

[Garcia Bronco]

Or Failed them.....

Kenninson

Monte Regor

Deltha O'Neal


More like failed themselves...but you're liberal like that...it's somebody else's fault. :P

[Cito Pelon]

What a dick.

[ozomulsion]

Is giving your opinion being a dick? Count me in on the dick parade!

[dbroncos31]

deltha's the dick...not anyone here...cept cheffie, fader, and chugger fans

[Cito Pelon]

You like dick parades?

[SoCalBronco]

Believing Deltha would have done the same thing here that he is doing in Cincy is like believing Gerard Warren would be just as effective as he is now had he stayed with the Browns. Neither is the same player. Both of them needed a fresh new environment.

[ozomulsion]

deltha's the dick...not anyone here...cept cheffie, fader, and chugger fans

OK sorry!

[Atlas]

Did Shanahan make a huge miscalculation in letting Deltha go after insisting he play wide receiver.

Looks to me like Delta was right and Shanny was dead wrong on this one.

Comments?

who cares.

[-Slap-]

Rather you like it or not Shanahan's long suit is not nurturing troubled players which is why he should leave the Clerrets of the world to the Vermeils of the world.
What a selective memory.


Alfred Williams was a gigantic disappointment before he got to Denver. In fact, Alfred is the only opponent I ever remember John Elway harshly criticizing in an interview. Said the Great Man, "If there's one player I don't like, its Alfred Williams. He talks and talks and he's not even any good."


Darrien Gordon came to Denver as a bust first round pick and left with two Rings as a starting cornerback.


Bubby Brister was considered a washed up drunk and he was out of football when Shanahan picked his career out of the gutter. Brister was an integral part of the Championship team in 1998.


Chester McGlockton was a surly overpaid prick in Los Angeles and Kansas City. In Denver, he was transformed into a positive lockerroom presence at a cap friendly price. He credits his career rejuvenation in Denver to being able to play for the coach he's always respected.


Bertrand Berry was nothing in this League for four years until he came to Denver, got an opportunity, and flourished. Bertrand repaid Shanahan by talking crap about him walking out the door, even though Mike's hands were tied by the salary cap.


Of course, Mike is used to being unappreciated by people who should be singing his praises. I guess if Mike threw his unconditional love and support behind scumbags like Leonard Little, he could be mentioned in the same breath as great humanitarians like Dick Vermiel.

[dbroncos31]

Darrien Gordon came to Denver as a bust first round pick and left with two Rings as a starting cornerback.


Bubby Brister was considered a washed up drunk and he was out of football when Shanahan picked his career out of the gutter. Brister was an integral part of the Championship team in 1998.

darrien gordon is my favorite corner of all-time, though champ is catching up. he was so good at returns in real life and in madden. also, bubby was SO huge when john was out, and no one seems to realize that. he had to play like 6 games or something and he was 6-0. he was KEY in many victories...though many qbs could be good with TD behind them. but yeah darrien gordon=the man.

[Atlas]

What a selective memory.


Alfred Williams was a gigantic disappointment before he got to Denver. In fact, Alfred is the only opponent I ever remember John Elway harshly criticizing in an interview. Said the Great Man, "If there's one player I don't like, its Alfred Williams. He talks and talks and he's not even any good."


Darrien Gordon came to Denver as a bust first round pick and left with two Rings as a starting cornerback.


Bubby Brister was considered a washed up drunk and he was out of football when Shanahan picked his career out of the gutter. Brister was an integral part of the Championship team in 1998.


Chester McGlockton was a surly overpaid prick in Los Angeles and Kansas City. In Denver, he was transformed into a positive lockerroom presence at a cap friendly price. He credits his career rejuvenation in Denver to being able to play for the coach he's always respected.


Bertrand Berry was nothing in this League for four years until he came to Denver, got an opportunity, and flourished. Bertrand repaid Shanahan by talking crap about him walking out the door, even though Mike's hands were tied by the salary cap.


Of course, Mike is used to being unappreciated by people who should be singing his praises. I guess if Mike threw his unconditional love and support behind scumbags like Leonard Little, he could be mentioned in the same breath as great humanitarians like Dick Vermiel.

Ed MacCaffery was a low round pick with like 18 catches the previous year in S.F.

Neil Smith was old and washed up.

Keith Traylor was lazy and an underachiever

[baja]

What a selective memory.


Alfred Williams was a gigantic disappointment before he got to Denver. In fact, Alfred is the only opponent I ever remember John Elway harshly criticizing in an interview. Said the Great Man, "If there's one player I don't like, its Alfred Williams. He talks and talks and he's not even any good."


Darrien Gordon came to Denver as a bust first round pick and left with two Rings as a starting cornerback.


Bubby Brister was considered a washed up drunk and he was out of football when Shanahan picked his career out of the gutter. Brister was an integral part of the Championship team in 1998.


Chester McGlockton was a surly overpaid prick in Los Angeles and Kansas City. In Denver, he was transformed into a positive lockerroom presence at a cap friendly price. He credits his career rejuvenation in Denver to being able to play for the coach he's always respected.


Bertrand Berry was nothing in this League for four years until he came to Denver, got an opportunity, and flourished. Bertrand repaid Shanahan by talking crap about him walking out the door, even though Mike's hands were tied by the salary cap.


Of course, Mike is used to being unappreciated by people who should be singing his praises. I guess if Mike threw his unconditional love and support behind scumbags like Leonard Little, he could be mentioned in the same breath as great humanitarians like Dick Vermiel.

All i'm saying and only because we don't have a game today is Shanahan has let some good players walk because he was unwilling or unable to help them over some rough personal issue spots whereas other coaches have struck gold by being a coach in the complete sense of the word. Would I want another coach here, NO. Could Shanahan improve in the area of player relations, clearly IMO.

BTW Seems you called out Shanny pretty good when in your opinion he did not know what he was doing when he signed Gold yet no one questioned your respect of Shanahan.

[flair]

Man...do you have ADD? You forget his celebration like he just won the SuperBowl when Seattle had murdered us? He would sit in the back row of the plane joking and laughing after a loss.

Against NE, with the game on the line, he threw up the most lethargic play off all time to lose the game, and acted nonchalont...that was his last play at corner for Denver...I was furious...

Give me Champ and the two rooks that actually come to play...and seem to care...sure, Deltha got a wakeup call, and is in a good scheme, and it's never been a matter of talent...he was just plain a slacker here...that doesn't cut it with Shanahan...

Check last years Monday night game VS the Bengels last year where he was punked out. If you have the game on tape watch as the game is over and Champ is smilling like a teenager with their new car. Made me sick.

Champs Picks have for the most part been lucky ones as well. I will say he can tackle better than Deltha but for what he is getting paid he should be able to slow down Chad if he couldnt stop him.

When Deltha was here our D was on prevent mode and we had no pass rush though it is not much better now it can at least stop the run

[uk bronco]

one of my friends is a bengals fan and he rips on deltha all the time. yeah he does get ints but he gets burnt for big plays a lot too. he is trying to set up an i hate deltha oneal website.

[dbroncos31]

ok...he got burned a couple times last year...who's beat him this year (other than owens, who could be the best WR in the game)

[ozomulsion]

Check last years Monday night game VS the Bengels last year where he was punked out. If you have the game on tape watch as the game is over and Champ is smilling like a teenager with their new car. Made me sick.

Champs Picks have for the most part been lucky ones as well. I will say he can tackle better than Deltha but for what he is getting paid he should be able to slow down Chad if he couldnt stop him.

When Deltha was here our D was on prevent mode and we had no pass rush though it is not much better now it can at least stop the run

Hey man, this is a what have you done for me lately league. Do you remember what happened in last years' playoff game? Manning threw away from Champ the entire first half. Champ has kicked ass all of this year as well. You need to shut up.

[Odysseus]

one of my friends is a bengals fan and he rips on deltha all the time. yeah he does get ints but he gets burnt for big plays a lot too. he is trying to set up an i hate deltha oneal website.

I didn't get to say Welcome so....Welcome!

I don't think Deltha was universally hated here. I always thought he would prove himself better but he has always played a little too loose for me. Champ is light years ahead of Deltha.

[flair]

Hey man, this is a what have you done for me lately league. Do you remember what happened in last years' playoff game? Manning threw away from Champ the entire first half. Champ has kicked ass all of this year as well. You need to shut up.

Yeah and I remember we had a rookie playing the backfield so what would you do. I am not saying Champ is horriable but he isnt worth what he is making

[dbroncos31]

uhhh...8 picks,including 2 that won us games says he is worth the money...and his outstanding playing despite injury says he is totally worth what we're paying him.

[baja]

He's under paid

[dbroncos31]

He's under paid
honestly, even though he is getting a ton of money, he might be. without him we are 9-5 at best...maybe worse.w/o him we lose dallas and SD...he won those games almost single-handedly

[Garcia Bronco]

Yeah and I remember we had a rookie playing the backfield so what would you do. I am not saying Champ is horriable but he isnt worth what he is making


Who is worth what they're making? Really....good or bad...I know I'm not worth what I'm making.....I'm worth more.

[-Slap-]

All i'm saying and only because we don't have a game today is Shanahan has let some good players walk because he was unwilling or unable to help them over some rough personal issue spots whereas other coaches have struck gold by being a coach in the complete sense of the word. Would I want another coach here, NO. Could Shanahan improve in the area of player relations, clearly IMO.

BTW Seems you called out Shanny pretty good when in your opinion he did not know what he was doing when he signed Gold yet no one questioned your respect of Shanahan.

If you can produce a post where I promote Dick Vermiel over Mike Shanahan in any way, I would like to read it. If only to discern what kind of chemical imbalance must have afflicted me that day.

BTW, bringing up Ian Gold weakens your case, since Ian cussed Shanahan harshly walking out the door, then he had a very mediocre season in Tampa Bay. Mike's willingness to trust his assistant coaches was evidenced here, as its obvious that Larry Coyer firmly believes that Ian Gold is an important cog in his scheme.

Mike showed the same trust in Bobby Turner and it resulted in Maurice Clarett. You win some, you lose some. I think Mike's long suit is in deferring to the judgement of people he trusts in these situations. Andre Patterson's pound puppies from Cleveland come to mind. In fact, I should have bullet pointed Gerard Warren and Courtney Brown in my previous post.

[baja]

If you can produce a post where I promote Dick Vermiel over Mike Shanahan in any way, I would like to read it. If only to discern what kind of chemical imbalance must have afflicted me that day.

BTW, bringing up Ian Gold weakens your case, since Ian cussed Shanahan harshly walking out the door, then he had a very mediocre season in Tampa Bay. Mike's willingness to trust his assistant coaches was evidenced here, as its obvious that Larry Coyer firmly believes that Ian Gold is an important cog in his scheme.

Mike showed the same trust in Bobby Turner and it resulted in Maurice Clarett. You win some, you lose some. I think Mike's long suit is in deferring to the judgement of people he trusts in these situations. Andre Patterson's pound puppies from Cleveland come to mind. In fact, I should have bullet pointed Gerard Warren and Courtney Brown in my previous post.

I'm not talking about troubled players he brings in my point is players he already has that he gives up on. We could really use an Eddie kenninson on this team and we had him. No one will ever know what went down in Shanahan's office that Saturday night but had it been worked out we would have that third wide receiver we have sought for ever. There has never been that perfect coach. Say what you want but Vermeil is better than Shanahan at getting those players that need a little understanding to play their hearts out for him. Like I said in the previous post I want Shanahan as my Broncos coach but I am not naive enough to think players play for him because they love him although they do respect him and that may be better but it does not bode well for the Kenninsons of the world, they go on the play their hearts out for the vermeils of the world.

[Garcia Bronco]

All i'm saying and only because we don't have a game today is Shanahan has let some good players walk because he was unwilling or unable to help them over some rough personal issue spots whereas other coaches have struck gold by being a coach in the complete sense of the word. Would I want another coach here, NO. Could Shanahan improve in the area of player relations, clearly IMO.

BTW Seems you called out Shanny pretty good when in your opinion he did not know what he was doing when he signed Gold yet no one questioned your respect of Shanahan.


Before there was Lenny Wall's disease(Chest Pounding Dropped Passes)....there was O'Neal's staff infection....the guy had to go. I don't know reagors deal other than he couldn't beat out the guy in front of them....and Kennison was talking retirement the night before a game. You help the people you can...but you don't have to, nor can you help everybody. And sometimes you have toi cut a man loose....thin the roster....drop the dead weight.....can I think of another one....no....I'm done.........cut of your noise to spite....no that doesn't really work.

[Wes Mantooth]

Did Shanahan make a huge miscalculation in letting Deltha go after insisting he play wide receiver.

Looks to me like Delta was right and Shanny was dead wrong on this one.

Comments?
Delta... err Deltha was never consistent at Denver. Does anyone remember the first year the Pats won the SB and we played them on MNF? We lost because Deltha was nowhere to be found. Delta...Force was consistently getting burned and cost us several games.

[Kaylore]

Only someone who hasn't watched Deltha play could make a post like this one. He's always been a ball hawk but gets lost in coverage. He's having a good season, but I think letting him go was the right move.

[baja]

Before there was Lenny Wall's disease....there was O'Neal's staff infection....the guy had to go. I don't know reagors deal other than he couldn't beat out the guy in front of them....and Kennison was talking retirement the night before a game. You help the people you can...but you don't have to, nor can you help everybody. And sometimes you have toi cut a man loose....thin the roster....drop the dead weight.....can I think of another one....no....I'm done.........cut of your noise to spite....no that doesn't really work.

It started this thread to generate some controversy. My position on Deltha is the same as yours he had backed himself into a corner in Denver and really had to move on. Could he have been "saved", I don't know but we used a first a second and 2 thirds trying to replace him. As for Monte Regor we used a second round pick on him when we needed D linemen very badly kept him a couple of years and let him go while we still desperately needed D linemen. What does he do? Sign with the Colts and proceed to play lights out, Could he have been "saved", I don't know. Eddie Kenninson was a highly sought after receiver when we signed him and we desperately needed a #3 receiver. Could he have been "saved', I don't know but he did go on to become a good #1 receiver for a rival team.

[Cito Pelon]

Who is worth what they're making? Really....good or bad...I know I'm not worth what I'm making.....I'm worth more.

If fat-mouthed jackasses were worth their weight in gold, you'd be in demand.

[Garcia Bronco]

If fat-mouthed jackasses were worth their weight in gold, you'd be in demand.



I'm hit!!! Agghh..cough, hack, wease,......(Thump!)

[Cito Pelon]

I'm sure you'll resurrect yourself.

[baja]

I'm hit!!! Agghh..cough, hack, wease,......(Thump!)

Not to worry Garcia he's leaving for Mars shortly

[Garcia Bronco]

It started this thread to generate some controversy. My position on Deltha is the same as yours he had backed himself into a corner in Denver and really had to move on. Could he have been "saved", I don't know but we used a first a second and 2 thirds trying to replace him. As for Monte Regor we used a second round pick on him when we needed D linemen very badly kept him a couple of years and let him go while we still desperately needed D linemen. What does he do? Sign with the Colts and proceed to play lights out, Could he have been "saved", I don't know. Eddie Kenninson was a highly sought after receiver when we signed him and we desperately needed a #3 receiver. Could he have been "saved', I don't know but he did go on to become a good #1 receiver for a rival team.


Lights out? Get the heck outta here...lights out he says...not true. Their success on defense starts at one place and it ain't Reagor. Their defense the last few years has been a letdown. Highly sought after? Come on dude...he signed and preceded to get arrested in New Orleans. He walked up to Coach the night before a game and said he wanted to retire. He could be the best in the league...but he's not on a team going to the playoffs for the 3rd time in three years.

[Cito Pelon]

Not to worry Garcia he's leaving for Mars shortly

Be a good fag, Baja. If you're not going to give me head, get lost.

[Garcia Bronco]

Be a good fag, Baja. If you're not going to give me head, get lost.


I'm out on that one.

[baja]

Be a good fag, Baja. If you're not going to give me head, get lost.

You have turned out to be quite the ass hole haven't you Cito Peion.

You're the one that wants to colonize Mars, I say fine have a nice trip.

[Cito Pelon]

You have turned out to be quite the a-hole haven't you Cito Peion.

You're the one that wants to colonize Mars, I say fine have a nice trip.

Now you're being a better fag. If you cry, I'll be nicer to you.

[baja]

Now you're being a better fag. If you cry, I'll be nicer to you.

When you stop to think about it there is no sanity requirement to post on the internet.

Don't let the atmosphere hit you in the ass on the way out.

[-Slap-]

This thread suddenly turned into a Mike Tyson press conference.

[-Slap-]

"You know you're a transvestite, Razor. You want to kiss me with those big lips of yours", a line delivered, ironically enough, with a pronounced lisp.

[clean]

"To make matters worse, O'Neal misjudged where the ball was coming down on a punt return on a free kick after Denver got a safety with 2:51 left in the game, and had to rush back to recover it. He landed on the ball at the 15, giving Denver poor field position when the Broncos needed it most trying to run out the clock.

"It's always touch when you get one-on-one coverage and you get beat," Shanahan said. "It is the nature of the position. I was more disappointed when he didn't field that punt. That was 25 or 30 yards of field position."

O'Neal had no comment after the game, blowing off reporter's questions.

O'Neal began the season as the team's starting cornerback, but was eventually replaced after ineffectual play by second year starter Kelly Herndon.

O'Neal's downward spiral continued when he fumbled two punts against Kansas City, one that resulted in a Kansas City touchdown."

http://www.greeleytrib.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20031104/SPORTS/111040054/-1/FRONTPAGE

[baja]

So I start a thread on an off Sunday questioning if letting Deltha go was a good decision and proceed to be called a dick twice and a fag and accused of not watching Deltha play. Sure is fun be be posting here - boy has this place gone down hill in the last few months. As to the question would I pay for premium service on the mane - A year ago without a doubt. The mane these days, No

[Cito Pelon]

When you stop to think about it there is no sanity requirement to post on the internet.

Don't let the atmosphere hit you in the ass on the way out.


Mmmmmm, atmosphere! So long, pal. I can only be an asshole for a short time. My good natural disposition takes over sooner or later. I just can't help it. I'd like to keep riding your silly ass, but you're worthless, so there is no point in riding you.

[Cito Pelon]

"To make matters worse, O'Neal misjudged where the ball was coming down on a punt return on a free kick after Denver got a safety with 2:51 left in the game, and had to rush back to recover it. He landed on the ball at the 15, giving Denver poor field position when the Broncos needed it most trying to run out the clock.

"It's always touch when you get one-on-one coverage and you get beat," Shanahan said. "It is the nature of the position. I was more disappointed when he didn't field that punt. That was 25 or 30 yards of field position."

O'Neal had no comment after the game, blowing off reporter's questions.

O'Neal began the season as the team's starting cornerback, but was eventually replaced after ineffectual play by second year starter Kelly Herndon.

O'Neal's downward spiral continued when he fumbled two punts against Kansas City, one that resulted in a Kansas City touchdown."

http://www.greeleytrib.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20031104/SPORTS/111040054/-1/FRONTPAGE

Hey, the guys father died unexpectedly, and then Shanny treats him like crap, like he was supposed to be the season savior after his father died. Shanny lost his cool, as he has done many times before at inappropriate times.

[bronco militia]

Did Shanahan make a huge miscalculation in letting Deltha go after insisting he play wide receiver.

Looks to me like Delta was right and Shanny was dead wrong on this one.

Comments?


what's the matter baja, tired of starting SOB threads?

I'd like to kick Deltha Oneal in the nuts for the Monday night Pats game in 2003.

\

[rbackfactory80]

What people don't get is that this jackass was done here. He played like ****. He earned it to get traded. He's manned up and made something of himself. Coach Shanahan made the right choice getting rid him and moving up to do it to take DJ Williams. I'm tired of hearing this bull****.


Yeah for real. It is the same thing with the Browns players we brought in. They would have still been playing like **** if they stayed in Cleveland. Deltha would have always sucked on Denver. Can we get on with our lives.

[rbackfactory80]

what's the matter baja, tired of starting SOB threads?

I'd like to kick Deltha Oneal in the nuts for the Monday night Pats game in 2003.

\


take a number.

[Garcia Bronco]

Hey, the guys father died unexpectedly, and then Shanny treats him like crap, like he was supposed to be the season savior after his father died. Shanny lost his cool, as he has done many times before at inappropriate times.


Is that what happened? I don't think that's right. And that's not what he asked...he didn't ask to go be with his father...he said he wanted to retire. He let Traylor go be with his family...same with Howard.

[Garcia Bronco]

Kennison's retirement surprises Broncos

NFL.com wire reports

DENVER (Nov. 11, 2001) -- Receiver Eddie Kennison told Broncos coach Mike Shanahan of his plan to retire about 16 hours before Denver kicked off against the San Diego Chargers on Sunday.

"He said his heart was not in it and he wanted to retire," Shanahan said. "I've never had a guy retire the night before a game. It caught me by surprise."

Shanahan said Kennison can't return to the team.

The 28-year-old Kennison, who moved into a starting role after Ed McCaffrey broke his leg in the season opener, caught 15 passes for 169 yards and a touchdown this season.

Kennison, who was in his sixth NFL season, also played for St. Louis, New Orleans and Chicago.

"It's unfortunate. I feel for him. I don't know all the circumstances of what's going on," quarterback Brian Griese said.

"I have my best wishes for him, (but) I don't think that I could, personally, do something to my team like that the night before a game."

Shanahan was upset that Kennison quit after taking part in all of last week's practices, leaving the second-team receivers without any work at the position.

"To do that the night before the game is something that is inexcusable," Shanahan said. "I'm very disappointed in the way it happened. Obviously, we move on."

Shanahan put Scottie Montgomery and Chris Cole in Kennison's spot.

Montgomery caught one pass for 23 yards before he twisted his left knee in the first half of Denver's 26-16 victory over the Chargers. Cole didn't have any receptions.

Shanahan said Kennison told team-leading receiver Rod Smith that he was experiencing some family problems.

"But when I asked him, he just told me he did not want to play," Shanahan said. "I think he was embarrassed to tell the players that he just didn't want to play any more."



AP NEWS
The Associated Press News Service

[clean]

Hey, the guys father died unexpectedly, and then Shanny treats him like crap, like he was supposed to be the season savior after his father died. Shanny lost his cool, as he has done many times before at inappropriate times.

If you have an issue with the article, I encourage you to send your comments to the following:

Greeley Tribune
Attention: Matt Schuman
P.O. Box 1690
Greeley, CO 80632

Denver Broncos
Attention: Mike Shanahan
13655 Broncos Parkway
Englewood, CO 80112

[Garcia Bronco]

When Kennison rescinded his retirement a week later...the team voted him off the island.

[baja]

what's the matter baja, tired of starting SOB threads?

I'd like to kick Deltha Oneal in the nuts for the Monday night Pats game in 2003.

\

I have checked the threads on that site of yours and there are some pretty sorry topics so I wouldn't be so critical if I were you

[Garcia Bronco]

I have checked the threads on that site of yours and there are some pretty sorry topics so I wouldn't be so critical if I were you


What site?

[baja]

The one he advertises in his sig.

[Cito Pelon]

I was talking about Deltha, not Kennison, as the article referred to. And ya know what, if you want to talk about Kennison, I still think Shanny blew his top, lost his cool when a player came to him in distress. What, as a manager you can't talk a good player into taking a little time off to get his family together, then welcome him back?

Shanny lost his cool, and that's a recurring thing. Shanny lost his cool just last night - again - wasted all kinds of time arguing with Bernie Kukar when he's supposed to have his head in the game calling O plays. If Shanny wasn't the relay to Plummer for O-plays I wouldn't make a big deal out of it, but Shanny has to relay the plays to Plummer, and he's fing around with the referee? That's losing your cool, and costing your team.

[Garcia Bronco]

The one he advertises in his sig.



Man that's some of our DPO brothers and sisters.

[Clockwork Orange]

I was talking about Deltha, not Kennison, as the article referred to. And ya know what, if you want to talk about Kennison, I still think Shanny blew his top, lost his cool when a player came to him in distress. What, as a manager you can't talk a good player into taking a little time off to get his family together, then welcome him back?

Shanny lost his cool, and that's a recurring thing. Shanny lost his cool just last night - again - wasted all kinds of time arguing with Bernie Kukar when he's supposed to have his head in the game calling O plays. If Shanny wasn't the relay to Plummer for O-plays I wouldn't make a big deal out of it, but Shanny has to relay the plays to Plummer, and he's fing around with the referee? That's losing your cool, and costing your team.

You might have a point if that's what actually happened with Quittison. Quittison came to Shanahan on the eve of a game and said he was retiring.....and wouldn't say why. Shanahan specifically asked him if it was family related and Quittison wouldn't tell him. He simply said he didn't want to play anymore, so what was Shanahan supposed to do? He has a player saying that he doesn't want to play anymore and that player won't so much as divulge a reason why. Then he comes back a few days later and says he changed his mind, still not giving Shanahan the reason why he walked out. Shanahan leaves it up to the players to decide if he was welcome back or not and they wanted him gone.

So how exactly is that Shanahan's fault?

[baja]

Man that's some of our DPO brothers and sisters.

true but that doesn't mean they don't have a few bad threads on the forum much as I love um

Besides he called me out two ways on a day i'm tired of being called out

[Garcia Bronco]

:poke: true but that doesn't mean they don't have a few bad threads on the forum much as I love um

Besides he called me out two ways on a day i'm tired of being called out


I'm calling you out!!!:poke:

[baja]

You might have a point if that's what actually happened with Quittison. Quittison came to Shanahan on the eve of a game and said he was retiring.....and wouldn't say why. Shanahan specifically asked him if it was family related and Quittison wouldn't tell him. He simply said he didn't want to play anymore, so what was Shanahan supposed to do? He has a player saying that he doesn't want to play anymore and that player won't so much as divulge a reason why. Then he comes back a few days later and says he changed his mind, still not giving Shanahan the reason why he walked out. Shanahan leaves it up to the players to decide if he was welcome back or not and they wanted him gone.

So how exactly is that Shanahan's fault?

Truth is only Shanahan and Kennison know what happened that fateful Saturday night

[baja]

:poke:


I'm calling you out!!!:poke:

If you don't stop I'm going to throw my laptop out the window

[Garcia Bronco]

If you don't stop I'm going to throw my laptop out the window


:garcia:

[FADERPROOF]

So I start a thread on an off Sunday questioning if letting Deltha go was a good decision and proceed to be called a dick twice and a fag and accused of not watching Deltha play. Sure is fun be be posting here - boy has this place gone down hill in the last few months. As to the question would I pay for premium service on the mane - A year ago without a doubt. The mane these days, No

you fag.

[Cito Pelon]

You might have a point if that's what actually happened with Quittison. Quittison came to Shanahan on the eve of a game and said he was retiring.....and wouldn't say why. Shanahan specifically asked him if it was family related and Quittison wouldn't tell him. He simply said he didn't want to play anymore, so what was Shanahan supposed to do? He has a player saying that he doesn't want to play anymore and that player won't so much as divulge a reason why. Then he comes back a few days later and says he changed his mind, still not giving Shanahan the reason why he walked out. Shanahan leaves it up to the players to decide if he was welcome back or not and they wanted him gone.

So how exactly is that Shanahan's fault?

There's two sides to every story. That's the Shanny side of the story. Kennison's side of the story came out later, and was derided because he was "Quitterson".

My point is Shanny loses his cool way too much. The Broncs are in a Title hunt, that has to stop. If Shanny would not have lost his cool last night at Buffalo, I wouldn't be harping on this so much. But he lost his cool over nothing. And the challenge on McGahees TD was a waste. If Denver wants to get over the top, Shanny has to keep his head in the game better.

If Shanny wasn't the relay to Plummer, I wouldn't be after him so much. But he's the OC on the field, and he's yanking the headset off to argue over every little thing with the referee? That's a detriment to the Title hunt.

[Clockwork Orange]

Truth is only Shanahan and Kennison know what happened that fateful Saturday night

http://www.orangemane.com/BB/showthread.php?t=31676&highlight=Kennison

This article has been posted twice here by Chef fans. Some of the more interesting points.

There are many renditions of what happened after that. On Saturday night, 16 hours before kickoff, Eddie pulled Denver coach Mike Shanahan aside and told him that he wanted to retire from football, that he’d lost his love for the game. He offered to play on Sunday, because he had taken all the snaps in practice that week, but Shanahan would later decide that Eddie should leave the team hotel and never return.

Shanahan even asked Kennison if it was because of his family. Eddie elected not to say.

“I didn’t want to give an excuse,” Kennison says. “I just said I’m not going to be able to play. Nobody knew she was in the hospital dealing with this issue, pregnant and unconscious.”

“Oh my God, Eddie,” is what Eddie’s agent, John Hamilton, said when he found out Kennison didn’t divulge everything to Shanahan. Even Shimika didn’t understand what Eddie was doing.

“I felt bad,” Shimika says. “I said, ‘Please go and play.’ I didn’t want to be a hindrance to his career. I was in the hospital. There was nothing he could do.”

With the people close to him telling him to play football again, he went back to Shanahan the following Monday and told him he was “unretiring.” But with a locker room full of fuming teammates who viewed him as a quitter, Eddie had no chance. The Broncos released Eddie, who suddenly had a sick wife and no job.

Again, how is this Shanahan's fault?

[FADERPROOF]

There's two sides to every story. That's the Shanny side of the story. Kennison's side of the story came out later, and was derided because he was "Quitterson".

My point is Shanny loses his cool way too much. The Broncs are in a Title hunt, that has to stop. If Shanny would not have lost his cool last night at Buffalo, I wouldn't be harping on this so much. But he lost his cool over nothing. And the challenge on McGahees TD was a waste. If Denver wants to get over the top, Shanny has to keep his head in the game better.

If Shanny wasn't the relay to Plummer, I wouldn't be after him so much. But he's the OC on the field, and he's yanking the headset off to argue over every little thing with the referee? That's a detriment to the Title hunt.

I must've missed it, but did we lose to Buffalo last night?

I saw that it was 28-17 in favor of the Broncos, what did you see?

[Moon§hiner]

I must've missed it, but did we lose to Buffalo last night?

I saw that it was 28-17 in favor of the Broncos, what did you see?

Stop making sense dammit!!

[Garcia Bronco]

There's two sides to every story. That's the Shanny side of the story. Kennison's side of the story came out later, and was derided because he was "Quitterson".

My point is Shanny loses his cool way too much. The Broncs are in a Title hunt, that has to stop. If Shanny would not have lost his cool last night at Buffalo, I wouldn't be harping on this so much. But he lost his cool over nothing. And the challenge on McGahees TD was a waste. If Denver wants to get over the top, Shanny has to keep his head in the game better.

If Shanny wasn't the relay to Plummer, I wouldn't be after him so much. But he's the OC on the field, and he's yanking the headset off to argue over every little thing with the referee? That's a detriment to the Title hunt.


Yeah...Kennison's story came out just after he realized he was about to get jammed for his signing bonus.

[baja]

http://www.orangemane.com/BB/showthread.php?t=31676&highlight=Kennison

This article has been posted twice here by Chef fans. Some of the more interesting points.

There are many renditions of what happened after that. On Saturday night, 16 hours before kickoff, Eddie pulled Denver coach Mike Shanahan aside and told him that he wanted to retire from football, that he’d lost his love for the game. He offered to play on Sunday, because he had taken all the snaps in practice that week, but Shanahan would later decide that Eddie should leave the team hotel and never return.

Shanahan even asked Kennison if it was because of his family. Eddie elected not to say.

“I didn’t want to give an excuse,” Kennison says. “I just said I’m not going to be able to play. Nobody knew she was in the hospital dealing with this issue, pregnant and unconscious.”

“Oh my God, Eddie,” is what Eddie’s agent, John Hamilton, said when he found out Kennison didn’t divulge everything to Shanahan. Even Shimika didn’t understand what Eddie was doing.

“I felt bad,” Shimika says. “I said, ‘Please go and play.’ I didn’t want to be a hindrance to his career. I was in the hospital. There was nothing he could do.”

With the people close to him telling him to play football again, he went back to Shanahan the following Monday and told him he was “unretiring.” But with a locker room full of fuming teammates who viewed him as a quitter, Eddie had no chance. The Broncos released Eddie, who suddenly had a sick wife and no job.

Again, how is this Shanahan's fault?

A question for you, substitute Vermiel for Shanahan do you think the outcome would have been the same or would Vermiel have taken the time to have drawn him out and than fixed it. Old fish eye is a hard case and sometimes that is not the best approch.

[FADERPROOF]

Stop making sense dammit!!

You mean, you don't think the whole "let's rip Shanahan for winning last night" doesn't make sense?

;)

[Garcia Bronco]

There's two sides to every story. That's the Shanny side of the story. Kennison's side of the story came out later, and was derided because he was "Quitterson".

My point is Shanny loses his cool way too much. The Broncs are in a Title hunt, that has to stop. If Shanny would not have lost his cool last night at Buffalo, I wouldn't be harping on this so much. But he lost his cool over nothing. And the challenge on McGahees TD was a waste. If Denver wants to get over the top, Shanny has to keep his head in the game better.

If Shanny wasn't the relay to Plummer, I wouldn't be after him so much. But he's the OC on the field, and he's yanking the headset off to argue over every little thing with the referee? That's a detriment to the Title hunt.


You guys that call out the coach frickin kill me. You're either with us or against us. Which is it?

[baja]

Yeah...Kennison's story came out just after he realized he was about to get jammed for his signing bonus.

Another hard ass, what if that were your wife laying in the hospital would you feel like playing football the next day, Sure he should have told Shanny but to label him a quitter is not fair either. In watching him play these last couple of years he is anything but a quitter and he should be a bronco if Shanny had taken the time to do a little probing which is what good coaches do.

[Cito Pelon]

Stop making sense dammit!!

Yeah, stop making sense, damn you! I was on a roill and you f'd it up, jerk!

You're correct, gotta keep things in perspective.

[FADERPROOF]

Another hard ass, what if that were your wife laying in the hospital would you feel like playing football the next day, Sure he should have told Shanny but to label him a quitter is not fair either. In watching him play these last couple of years he is anything but a quitter and he should be a bronco if Shanny had taken the time to do a little probing which is what good coaches do.

How is it not fair to label someone who quit, a quitter?

[Clockwork Orange]

A question for you, substitute Vermiel for Shanahan do you think the outcome would have been the same or would Vermiel have taken the time to have drawn him out and than fixed it. Old fish eye is a hard case and sometimes that is not the best approch.

How could he have handled it differently? He had a player saying he didn't want to play anymore, that he'd lost his passion for the game. He asked him directly if it was family related and he said no. At that point, what else is there to do? You can't put a gun to the guys head and make him play.

By the time he came back the locker room had turned against him (something that likely wouldn't have happened had he told the truth from the beginning) and didn't want him back. What was Shanahan supposed to do?

No, I don't think that any coach would have handled it any differently. Had Quittison explained the situation from the beginning, things very likely would have turned out a lot different.

[baja]

You guys that call out the coach frickin kill me. You're either with us or against us. Which is it?

I wouldn't trade Shanahan for any other coach but he is not perfect and he fuucked up with the kenninson thing and I bet he would say he wishes he had handled it differently because he's smart and learns from his mistakes.

[Garcia Bronco]

Another hard ass, what if that were your wife laying in the hospital would you feel like playing football the next day, Sure he should have told Shanny but to label him a quitter is not fair either. In watching him play these last couple of years he is anything but a quitter and he should be a bronco if Shanny had taken the time to do a little probing which is what good coaches do.


Wouldn't happen that way...the way it did with Kennison.....because I'd tell coach what was going on and not 16 hours before a game. Kennison made his bed...now he can lay in it...missing the playoffs again. Bottomline is the guy retried the night before a game...when we needed him. Now sow up your bleeding heart and realize Kennison not being a Bronco is squarely Kennison's fault. Not the fault of the greatest Coach/GM in the game. Like it, hate it....sit down and look at it...because it's the best thing going today...WHOOOO!

[Taco John]

I don't know how this topic got on Eddie, but I do know that Deltha was pretty gutless when he was here and played nothing like he's playing in Cinci.

[bronco610]

Yes vermeil would have babied him. Lets see the chiefs are going to be out of the play offs, vermeil is going to be out of kc. Hmmm wich coach is better ??????

[Clockwork Orange]

I wouldn't trade Shanahan for any other coach but he is not perfect and he fuucked up with the kenninson thing and I bet he would say he wishes he had handled it differently because he's smart and learns from his mistakes.

So it's Shanahan's fault that Quittison wasn't honest with him from the get go? Sure.::)

[Garcia Bronco]

I wouldn't trade Shanahan for any other coach but he is not perfect and he fuucked up with the kenninson thing and I bet he would say he wishes he had handled it differently because he's smart and learns from his mistakes.



I disagree...he did the right thing. Those are the tough choices you have to make when you're a leader. Mike Shanahan, DEnver Bronco Head Coach, made the right choice.

[Garcia Bronco]

I don't know how this topic got on Eddie, but I do know that Deltha was pretty gutless when he was here and played nothing like he's playing in Cinci.


I'll tell you why...because Coach is successful and people don't like it, but htey're supposedly on the bandwagon. "Awe...I can't get'em with O'Neal....maybe Kennison will work".

[baja]

How could he have handled it differently? He had a player saying he didn't want to play anymore, that he'd lost his passion for the game. He asked him directly if it was family related and he said no. At that point, what else is there to do? You can't put a gun to the guys head and make him play.

By the time he came back the locker room had turned against him (something that likely wouldn't have happened had he told the truth from the beginning) and didn't want him back. What was Shanahan supposed to do?

No, I don't think that any coach would have handled it any differently. Had Quittison explained the situation from the beginning, things very likely would have turned out a lot different.

There are levels of sensitivity to every conversation and there countless ways we communicate beyond words. It is a good possibility that Shanahan failed to read these signs with the kenninson case therefore failing the young man as his coach.

[baja]

Yes vermeil would have babied him. Lets see the chiefs are going to be out of the play offs, vermeil is going to be out of kc. Hmmm wich coach is better ??????

There are some real sharp tacks showing up here.

[Clockwork Orange]

There are levels of sensitivity to every conversation and there countless ways we communicate beyond words. It is a good possibility that Shanahan failed to read these signs with the kenninson case therefore failing the young man as his coach.

Ahh, so it's Shanahan's fault for not being a mind reader. Gotcha.

Forget the fact that he asked him specifically if he was having family problems, he should have been able to look into his eyes and know exactly what was going on.

[Cito Pelon]

Another hard ass, what if that were your wife laying in the hospital would you feel like playing football the next day, Sure he should have told Shanny but to label him a quitter is not fair either. In watching him play these last couple of years he is anything but a quitter and he should be a bronco if Shanny had taken the time to do a little probing which is what good coaches do.

I have to agree with that. I've managed a lot of people, and there is no way Kennison leaves my office before I have a complete explanation of what the story is. I bet the true story is somewhere in between. Kennison was probably uncommunicative, Shanny was busy, both made some remarks they regret now, and neither was going to back down from them. Tough business, winning AFC titles. And then you have to win the Super Bowl.

[Garcia Bronco]

There are levels of sensitivity to every conversation and there countless ways we communicate beyond words. It is a good possibility that Shanahan failed to read these signs with the kenninson case therefore failing the young man as his coach.


Dude...Shanahan isn't his daddy...he's his employer....he hired him to do a job. Only when he realized he had to give back the cash...de he..."Oh ****" and want to come back to work.

[baja]

I'll tell you why...because Coach is successful and people don't like it, but htey're supposedly on the bandwagon. "Awe...I can't get'em with O'Neal....maybe Kennison will work".

Well I can't remember about you Garcia but TJ was ready to run Shanahan out of town not to long ago.

[FADERPROOF]

I don't know how this topic got on Eddie, but I do know that Deltha was pretty gutless when he was here and played nothing like he's playing in Cinci.


I've never seen Courtney Brown play like he has this year, for years I watched him here in Cleveland(when he was healthy) and he was a softie that got pushed around by tight ends and looked afraid to get in there and knock someone on their ass. Now he's creating pressure on the QB and getting aggressive in there and contributing to a very good defense, he looks like a totally different player out there.

The thing with Brown and O'Neal IMO, is that whenever someone gets traded or cut, they take a look at themselves in the mirror and think,"why did this team not want me?" That makes them comeback with a new fire in their eyes and something to really prove, they hit the weights more, take more time watching films, just everything changes them so they can get back on that field and prove their worth.

[FADERPROOF]

There are levels of sensitivity to every conversation and there countless ways we communicate beyond words. It is a good possibility that Shanahan failed to read these signs with the kenninson case therefore failing the young man as his coach.

You'e officially lost it.

Shanahan is a head coach in the NFL, not a psychologist.

[baja]

Dude...Shanahan isn't his daddy...he's his employer....he hired him to do a job. Only when he realized he had to give back the cash...de he..."Oh ****" and want to come back to work.

great coaches play many roles and on occasion one of them is daddy to these young men

[Clockwork Orange]

Shanahan is a head coach in the NFL, not a psychologist.

Or a psychic.

[Garcia Bronco]

Well I can't remember about you Garcia but TJ was ready to run Shanahan out of town not to long ago.



Not I....you'd be hard pressed to find me against the coach because there is no one I would rather have...no one.

[Garcia Bronco]

The thing with Brown and O'Neal IMO, is that whenever someone gets traded or cut, they take a look at themselves in the mirror and think,"why did this team not want me?" That makes them comeback with a new fire in their eyes and something to really prove, they hit the weights more, take more time watching films, just everything changes them so they can get back on that field and prove their worth.


Exactly. They grow up. O'Neal...had to say to himself..."Man...I got drafted in the first round to play defense...and now they want me to be the 4th receiver."

[FADERPROOF]

great coaches play many roles and on occasion one of them is daddy to these young men

grown men, not young men.

Acting like father figure is something that college coaches need to be, you are expected to be man enough in the NFL so the head coaches do not have to be like that.

[baja]

How is it not fair to label someone who quit, a quitter?

Circumstances, your wife is laying unconscious in the hospital wanta play some football?

[Garcia Bronco]

great coaches play many roles and on occasion one of them is daddy to these young men


Not 16 hours before a game. Kennison put himself in that position...no one else.

[Garcia Bronco]

Circumstances, your wife is laying unconscious in the hospital wanta play some football?


wait....I thought his father was sick...probably both...the legend grows.

[baja]

grown men, not young men.

Acting like father figure is something that college coaches need to be, you are expected to be man enough in the NFL so the head coaches do not have to be like that.

There are times in all our lives when we need to lean on someone and if it hasn't happened to yet it will. kenninson was failed in his time of need.

[Clockwork Orange]

Circumstances, your wife is laying unconscious in the hospital wanta play some football?

No. But you tell your head coach about it, get an excused absence and avoid turning your teammates against you.

The truth is a good thing.

[Garcia Bronco]

grown men, not young men.

Acting like father figure is something that college coaches need to be, you are expected to be man enough in the NFL so the head coaches do not have to be like that.


You mean be a professional.

[FADERPROOF]

Circumstances, your wife is laying unconscious in the hospital wanta play some football?


If something like that happened to me, I'd go up to my boss and say that I can't work for a little while and would like to take a leave of absence because my wife needs me by her side right now.

I wouldnt just tell him that I'm not going to work anymore and not give him a reason as to why, and they wouldn't take me back if I came calling for my job back.

[Garcia Bronco]

There are times in all our lives when we need to lean on someone and if it hasn't happened to yet it will. kenninson was failed in his time of need.


By himself though...he failed himself.

[DBroncos4life]

what reason did Kennison have in not telling Mike the truth and what reason did Mike have not to believe Kennison when he said it wasn't about his family? All he had to do is say, yes Mike its about my family. I don't want to get into this arguement but its pretty clear that Mike had a idea of what was wrong but Eddie wouldn't open up. Either way it was left to the team and they are the ones that told him to take a hike.

[baja]

Ahh, so it's Shanahan's fault for not being a mind reader. Gotcha.

Forget the fact that he asked him specifically if he was having family problems, he should have been able to look into his eyes and know exactly what was going on.

In a work, yes!

[DBroncos4life]

No. But you tell your head coach about it, get an excused absence and avoid turning your teammates against you.

The truth is a good thing.


yeah what reason did he have to lie?

[Garcia Bronco]

In closing.....remember...

"We're gonna hang sumptin on they ass."


Ghettio ****er.....get the hell outta town.

[baja]

If something like that happened to me, I'd go up to my boss and say that I can't work for a little while and would like to take a leave of absence because my wife needs me by her side right now.

I wouldn't just tell him that I'm not going to work anymore and not give him a reason as to why, and they wouldn't take me back if I came calling for my job back.

We are all wired differently.

When the truth came out a day or two later via his agent things could have been handled differently

[Garcia Bronco]

We are all wired differently.

When the truth came out a day or two later via his agent things could have been handled differently



Once you squeeze toothpaste out the tube...you can't put it back in.

[baja]

Once you squeeze toothpaste out the tube...you can't put it back in.
Brilliant!!!!

[Garcia Bronco]

Brilliant!!!!



:)

[baja]

what reason did Kennison have in not telling Mike the truth and what reason did Mike have not to believe Kennison when he said it wasn't about his family? All he had to do is say, yes Mike its about my family. I don't want to get into this arguement but its pretty clear that Mike had a idea of what was wrong but Eddie wouldn't open up. Either way it was left to the team and they are the ones that told him to take a hike.

I all seems so easy miles away from the situtation but the bottom line is the kid had a trouble spot but was not ready to retire and is a top nocth receiver in the league today. He has already proved himself not to be a quiter so that leaves other issues responsible for his Saturday night visit and not one of us will ever know what went down in that office, end of story.

[Cito Pelon]

wait....I thought his father was sick...probably both...the legend grows.

You don't even know what you're talking about. Jaysus.

[Garcia Bronco]

I all seems so easy miles away from the situtation but the bottom line is the kid had a trouble spot but was not ready to retire and is a top nocth receiver in the league today. He has already proved himself not to be a quiter so that leaves other issues responsible for his Saturday night visit and not one of us will ever know what went down in that office, end of story.


The proof is in the pudding because the Team knew what happened...and they voted him off the island.

[DBroncos4life]

The proof is in the pudding because the Team knew what happened...and they voted him off the island.


pretty much. Mike left it in the hands of the team and they said no thanks.

[baja]

The proof is in the pudding because the Team knew what happened...and they voted him off the island.

If the story about the wife is true the team could not have known about it because they would have made a different decision had they known the truth if in fact it is the truth.

[baja]

Put it this way if one of my kids comes tome and says they want to quit a position they had worked for most of their life I would do some pretty deep digging before I gave the decision my blessing.

[Moon§hiner]

Fire Shanny...he is an uncaring bastage!!

[Clockwork Orange]

Put it this way if one of my kids comes tome and says they want to quit a position they had worked for most of their life I would do some pretty deep digging before I gave the decision my blessing.

He's not Shanahan's kid, he was one of his receivers. Just a bit of difference there.

[Clockwork Orange]

Fire Shanny...he is an uncaring bastage!!

No kidding. Let's run him out of town.

The fact that people are even bringing this **** up shows that it's a pretty slow year for the Shanahan bashers. That 11-3 record must be killing them.

[Garcia Bronco]

Put it this way if one of my kids comes tome and says they want to quit a position they had worked for most of their life I would do some pretty deep digging before I gave the decision my blessing.

It's apples and oranges...while I don't know what you do...I would say that your business is different from that of a multi-billion dollar business such as the NFL. Plus, these guys get a lot of jack for what they do. I'm comparing the demand of 16 hours before a game vs what you do day-to-day.

[DBroncos4life]

It's apples and oranges...while I don't know what you do...I would say that your business is different from that of a multi-billion dollar business such as the NFL. Plus, these guys get a lot of jack for what they do.
game planning, practice, team sport, and a player that quits 12 hours before a game. Thats not the real world and shouldn't be compared to it. Its not like someone not showing up to cook at burger king.

[baja]

No kidding. Let's run him out of town.

The fact that people are even bringing this **** up shows that it's a pretty slow year for the Shanahan bashers. That 11-3 record must be killing them.

Screw you. You have been here long enough to know I am no Shanahan basher as a matter of fact I have always supported him even this off season when many here including you were calling him crazy for the moves he was making (i liked them and said so), now when we are winning and the moves proved good you are his best friends again trying to take a small personal decision that I take issue with and blow it up into a 'he hate shanahan' pile of crap. How short your memories are.

Remember the PLAN you all loved so much.

[baja]

It's apples and oranges...while I don't know what you do...I would say that your business is different from that of a multi-billion dollar business such as the NFL. Plus, these guys get a lot of jack for what they do. I'm comparing the demand of 16 hours before a game vs what you do day-to-day.

Bull shiit the analogy is a good one and if you don't know that you know less about football than I thought

[Garcia Bronco]

Screw you. You have been here long enough to know I am no Shanahan basher as a matter of fact I have always supported him even this off season when many here including you were calling him crazy for the moves he was making (i liked them and said so), now when we are winning and the moves proved good you are his best friends again trying to take a small personal decision that I take issue with and blow it up into a 'he hate shanahan' pile of crap. How short your memories are.

Remember the PLAN you all loved so much.


I'm calling you out doubter...:poke:

[Clockwork Orange]

Screw you. You have been here long enough to know I am no Shanahan basher as a matter of fact I have always supported him even this off season when many here including you were calling him crazy for the moves he was making (i liked them and said so), now when we are winning and the moves proved good you are his best friends again trying to take a small personal decision that I take issue with and blow it up into a 'he hate shanahan' pile of crap. How short your memories are.

Remember the PLAN you all loved so much.

Please show me where I was calling him crazy for the moves he made in the offseason. Since you pointed me out specifically, you should have no problem coming up with specific examples.

Oh yeah, screw you too buddy. :thumbsup:

[Garcia Bronco]

Bull shiit the analogy is a good one and if you don't know that you know less about football than I thought


It's really not unless we're talking about huge sums of money.

[baja]

Fire Shanny...he is an uncaring bastage!!

Shanahan has proved himself a great coach I just not sure he is a great personal relations person.

[terry251973]

its nice to see somebody else bickering and getting jumped on.i get jumped on everytime i bash the chuggers.you would think this was a chugger board.

[baja]

Please show me where I was calling him crazy for the moves he made in the offseason. Since you pointed me out specifically, you should have no problem coming up with specific examples.

Oh yeah, screw you too buddy. :thumbsup:

If you wern't one of the dooms dayers that i'm sorry. It is easier to remember the wait and see group because it was so small and I don't remember you being in it.

[Clockwork Orange]

If you wern't one of the dooms dayers that i'm sorry. It is easier to remember the wait and see group because it was so small and I don't remember you being in it.

The only move I wasn't fond of was the re-signing of Ian Gold because I wasn't crazy about the idea of DJ Williams being moved to a position he'd never played before. I've since admitted I was wrong about that one.

The rest of the moves (including the ill-fated Clarett pick) I was willing to wait and see on. They were all low risk, high reward moves and I was one of the ones who was willing to see how things played out before declaring the offseason a flop.

My apologies for lumping you in with the Shanahan bashers.

[Odysseus]

its nice to see somebody else bickering and getting jumped on.i get jumped on everytime i bash the chuggers.you would think this was a chugger board.

Shut up! You are stoopid and don't know what you are talking about?

You mean like that? :angel: Feel better? Ha!

You guys are like family. You talk too much crap and don't know the first thing about each other. You should finish the trifecta by eating food out of each others refridgerator, borrowing money and not repaying and promising to keep in touch but never doing it.

[Moon§hiner]

Shanahan has proved himself a great coach I just not sure he is a great personal relations person.
He may not be the Dick Vermiel type of coach when it comes to understanding players but I'll take his personnel descisions over his personal decisions over Dicks every day of the week....I wasn't posting to screw with ya baja, I just can't believe how even when we are winning there has to be controversy....I guess that's why guys like fireshannahan.cum thrive.

[Odysseus]

If you wern't one of the dooms dayers that i'm sorry. It is easier to remember the wait and see group because it was so small and I don't remember you being in it.


I want to make up a bright orange T Shirt. "I survived the Broncos off season on the Orange mane 2004-2005"

I want a coin, a badge, a tattoo, and maybe a private party to celebrate. Lap dances for everybody.

I don't ever want to go through a off season skull fvcking like that ever again.

[Odysseus]

The only move I wasn't fond of was the re-signing of Ian Gold because I wasn't crazy about the idea of DJ Williams being moved to a position he'd never played before. I've since admitted I was wrong about that one.

What a dick!

(I'm kidding. If you read earlier in the thread it's really funny seeing all these dicks flopping around and no Blart anywhere around. Sorry. It was funny to me. :giggle: )

[FADERPROOF]

Shanahan has proved himself a great coach I just not sure he is a great personal relations person.

Who gives a **** as long as we're winning?

I mean seriously, even if it was Shanahan's fault that Delta and Kennison are not on this team anymore, are we losing games and not winning the division because of it?

[Willynowei]

If we traded D-lines with Cincinnati Champ Bailey would have 18 interceptions and Delta would be a free agent some where.

[baja]

Who gives a **** as long as we're winning?

I mean seriously, even if it was Shanahan's fault that Delta and Kennison are not on this team anymore, are we losing games and not winning the division because of it?

It's called discussion, you know what you do on a dicussion board.

Are you guys so insular that you can not seperate a discussion about Shanahan's ability to handle sensitive player relations and the fact he is a great coach. Do you realize how parochial your "but we are winning" arguement is? Boring!

[baja]

I want to make up a bright orange T Shirt. "I survived the Broncos off season on the Orange mane 2004-2005"

I want a coin, a badge, a tattoo, and maybe a private party to celebrate. Lap dances for everybody.

I don't ever want to go through a off season skull fvcking like that ever again.


quiettiger is the only other guy besides myself that I remember supporting Shanahan this off season now we got a whole slew of Shanahan band wagoners screeming blasfemy at the mention of maladroitness on the part of the now unimpeachable Mike Shanahan.

[Man-Goblin]

He had a pretty similar year for the Broncos in 2001, his second as a pro.

Year Team G GS Int DTD STY SACK TK ATK DFR FF PDef
2005 CIN 13 12 9 0 0 0 49 8 1 0 7
2001 DEN 16 16 9 1 0 0 62.0 7 0 0 16

Everyone remembers that Patriots game as the last straw with O'neal, but it was clear well before then that his head just wasn't in the game anymore. We'll probably never know what happened between his 2nd and 4th years that spawned such a change.

He needed a change of scenery; it just happens sometimes in sports. Broncos fans should know as well as anyone that players with chips on their shoulders can be very dangerous.

That being said, things could have only gotten worse if the Broncos didn't trade him two years ago. Chances are he would have left when his contract expired, and the Broncos wouldn't have moved up in the '04 draft. The trade was a good move for both parties involved.

[baja]

He had a pretty similar year for the Broncos in 2001, his second as a pro.

Year Team G GS Int DTD STY SACK TK ATK DFR FF PDef
2005 CIN 13 12 9 0 0 0 49 8 1 0 7
2001 DEN 16 16 9 1 0 0 62.0 7 0 0 16

Everyone remembers that Patriots game as the last straw with O'neal, but it was clear well before then that his head just wasn't in the game anymore. We'll probably never know what happened between his 2nd and 4th years that spawned such a change.

He needed a change of scenery; it just happens sometimes in sports. Broncos fans should know as well as anyone that players with chips on their shoulders can be very dangerous.

That being said, things could have only gotten worse if the Broncos didn't trade him two years ago. Chances are he would have left when his contract expired, and the Broncos wouldn't have moved up in the '04 draft. The trade was a good move for both parties involved.

Good post Jones!

[FADERPROOF]

It's called discussion, you know what you do on a dicussion board.

Are you guys so insular that you can not seperate a discussion about Shanahan's ability to handle sensitive player relations and the fact he is a great coach. Do you realize how parochial your "but we are winning" arguement is? Boring!

I certainly seperated it, and said "who gives a **** about how he handles player relationships?"

And they do go together, if he ****ed up those situations and the Broncos are now not successful, people would point to how he handled it and would start talking about how he needs to go as coach because he obviously is bad at making personnel decisions and doesnt handle the responsibility well.

And one more thing, are you just going to bitch at everyone for not agreeing with you? I'm insular, Garcia is a hard ass, Clockwork was apart of the "This offseason sucks" group, can you just have your little discussion without crying about other people?

[FADERPROOF]

We'll probably never know what happened between his 2nd and 4th years that spawned such a change.



Trent Green stopped throwing his way.

[Moon§hiner]

quiettiger is the only other guy besides myself that I remember supporting Shanahan this off season now we got a whole slew of Shanahan band wagoners screeming blasfemy at the mention of maladroitness on the part of the now unimpeachable Mike Shanahan.
Please feel free to find where I have been anti Shanahan...see ya in a few hours of fruitless searching

[FADERPROOF]

Please feel free to find where I have been anti Shanahan...see ya in a few hours of fruitless searching

He'll find it right away, since Baja is so much better than everyone here.

[baja]

<b>I certainly seperated it, and said "who gives a **** about how he handles player relationships?"</b>

And they do go together, if he ****ed up those situations and the Broncos are now not successful, people would point to how he handled it and would start talking about how he needs to go as coach because he obviously is bad at making personnel decisions and doesnt handle the responsibility well.

And one more thing, are you just going to b**** at everyone for not agreeing with you? I'm insular, Garcia is a hard ass, Clockwork was apart of the "This offseason sucks" group, can you just have your little discussion without crying about other people?

Maybe this is not a discussion for you than.

The rest is not worth a response.

[Man-Goblin]

I certainly seperated it, and said "who gives a **** about how he handles player relationships?"

And they do go together, if he ****ed up those situations and the Broncos are now not successful, people would point to how he handled it and would start talking about how he needs to go as coach because he obviously is bad at making personnel decisions and doesnt handle the responsibility well.

And one more thing, are you just going to b**** at everyone for not agreeing with you? I'm insular, Garcia is a hard ass, Clockwork was apart of the "This offseason sucks" group, can you just have your little discussion without crying about other people?

How is one to deduce who is a sensitive player and who is not? The only ones we, the public, know about are the ones that don't work out and can't keep their mouth shut.

[baja]

Please feel free to find where I have been anti Shanahan...see ya in a few hours of fruitless searching

That would be why I said,

Originally Posted by baja fan
quiettiger is the only other guy besides myself<b> that I remember </b> supporting Shanahan this off season now we got a whole slew of Shanahan band wagoners screeming blasfemy at the mention of maladroitness on the part of the now unimpeachable Mike Shanahan.

[TD4HOF]

Good thread. From what I remember about Kennison is mostly that the story came out he'd retired on us a day before a game. It wasn't until much later that details about Eddie's problems came out. Which, ladies and gentlemen, drops the full weight of responsibility solely on Kennison's shoulders. It was a communication error on his part, in large part due to duress but still a grevious misstep.

There's a reason the Bronco organization has been so consistent over the years. It starts up top. We don't play it like that around here.

However, I certainly don't hold it against him. Frankly, I find these Quitterson quips to be in very bad taste. What, you've never had a moment in your life where it could've, would've been better but it didn't so you had to grow as a human being from it? If not, I feel sorry for you.

As for Deltha, oh please...I don't know the members here that well but anyone who says we should've worked it out with him is kidding themselves. He grew full of himself, thought he was Deion, got tossed, woke up and now plays closer to his ability on a, emphasis, consistent ability. Over the course of time, good organizations will pick up more of those than they lose. Maybe I'm a homer, but I'd say we're in the black.

[FADERPROOF]

Maybe this is not a discussion for you than.

The rest is not worth a response.

Maybe football is not the sport for you then.

[baja]

He'll find it right away, since Baja is so much better than everyone here.

This is the next logical direction of attack one would anticipate.

dur GO BRONCOS

[maven]

That would be why I said,

Originally Posted by baja fan
quiettiger is the only other guy besides myself<b> that I remember </b> supporting Shanahan this off season now we got a whole slew of Shanahan band wagoners screeming blasfemy at the mention of maladroitness on the part of the now unimpeachable Mike Shanahan.

Geez, you're a Shanny supporter at the beginning of the season.. Wow, what a leap of faith. :unamused:

[FADERPROOF]

This is the next logical direction of attack one would anticipate.

dur GO BRONCOS

I'm just following your suit.

[baja]

Good thread. From what I remember about Kennison is mostly that the story came out he'd retired on us a day before a game. It wasn't until much later that details about Eddie's problems came out. Which, ladies and gentlemen, drops the full weight of responsibility solely on Kennison's shoulders. It was a communication error on his part, in large part due to duress but still a grevious misstep.

There's a reason the Bronco organization has been so consistent over the years. It starts up top. We don't play it like that around here.

However, I certainly don't hold it against him. Frankly, I find these Quitterson quips to be in very bad taste. What, you've never had a moment in your life where it could've, would've been better but it didn't so you had to grow as a human being from it? If not, I feel sorry for you.

As for Deltha, oh please...I don't know the members here that well but anyone who says we should've worked it out with him is kidding themselves. He grew full of himself, thought he was Deion, got tossed, woke up and now plays closer to his ability on a, emphasis, consistent ability. Over the course of time, good organizations will pick up more of those than they lose. Maybe I'm a homer, but I'd say we're in the black.

I agree we are in the black just pointing out for the sake of discussion we might be wired to miss a few. Is it a fatal flaw, hell no.

[baja]

Geez, you're a Shanny supporter at the beginning of the season.. Wow, what a leap of faith. :unamused:

I really hope I am irritating you maven because then I know I an doing something right.

[Moon§hiner]

[QUOTE=baja fan]That would be why I said,

Originally Posted by baja fan
quiettiger is the only other guy besides myself<b> that I remember </b> supporting Shanahan this off season now we got a whole slew of Shanahan band wagoners screeming blasfemy at the mention of maladroitness on the part of the now unimpeachable Mike Shanahan.[/QUOTE
Nothing wrong with someone defending their position...as you said, that's what message boards are all about...I just resent it when it's a Chief fan saying that Bronco fans are all alike or a Bronco fan saying that everyone that doesn't agree with them are hypocrites

[maven]

I really hope I am irritating you maven because then I know I an doing something right.

Don't worry, you're not. I enjoy reading the crap you write. Laughing is good for the soul.

[TD4HOF]

I agree we are in the black just pointing out for the sake of discussion we might be wired to miss a few. Is it a fatal flaw, hell no.

Hey, an *sic* all-pro corner is worth discussing. No minus points for you there whatsoever.

He's still horribly overrated. I'll take a consistent, rarely-mentioned guy over a gambling showboater everyday.

When you think about it, CBs are probably the most interesting pro athletes around. For one thing, it's so difficult to truly ascertain who's good and who's not. There's probably a corner somewhere having a top 10 type season and no one's ever heard of him. Add on the individual flamboyance and quirky nature of their profession (you, get in there and stop Chad Johnson from catching the ball, and you can't touch him!) and you've got quite a cast of characters.

[TD4HOF]

Don't worry, you're not. I enjoy reading the crap you write. Laughing is good for the soul.

Oh, just shut up. If you don't have something of substance to add, stay on the sidelines where you belong. Good God, man..now I remember why I left sports sites like this for a good while. People with nothing better to do than aggravate. There's bars for y'all to go get drunk in and harrass waitresses.

[baja]

[QUOTE=baja fan]That would be why I said,

Originally Posted by baja fan
quiettiger is the only other guy besides myself<b> that I remember </b> supporting Shanahan this off season now we got a whole slew of Shanahan band wagoners screaming blasphemy at the mention of maladroitness on the part of the now unimpeachable Mike Shanahan.[/QUOTE
Nothing wrong with someone defending their position...as you said, that's what message boards are all about...I just resent it when it's a Chief fan saying that Bronco fans are all alike or a Bronco fan saying that everyone that doesn't agree with them are hypocrites

I don't think I am saying that at all. Seems to me in most responses it never got to agreeing or disagreeing, more like calling me out to dare to question the almighty Shanahan when we are 11 and 3 mostly by guys that were screaming for Shanahan's head a few months ago, that's where the hypocrisy comes in IMO.

[baja]

Hey, an *sic* all-pro corner is worth discussing. No minus points for you there whatsoever.

He's still horribly overrated. I'll take a consistent, rarely-mentioned guy over a gambling showboater everyday.

When you think about it, CBs are probably the most interesting pro athletes around. For one thing, it's so difficult to truly ascertain who's good and who's not. There's probably a corner somewhere having a top 10 type season and no one's ever heard of him. Add on the individual flamboyance and quirky nature of their profession (you, get in there and stop Chad Johnson from catching the ball, and you can't touch him!) and you've got quite a cast of characters.

I started this thread mainly to have something to discuss given our team played yesterday. I do agree Deltha got to a point where he needed to move on. What I wonder is could he have been "saved". I realize this is a minor caveat to a sensational season and figured not many would have the interest to post here but i did not expect to be called a dick and a fag for raising the question or does that come with the territory?

[Atlas]

However, I certainly don't hold it against him. Frankly, I find these Quitterson quips to be in very bad taste. What, you've never had a moment in your life where it could've, would've been better but it didn't so you had to grow as a human being from it? If not, I feel sorry for you.

.

You don't understand football then. You don't quite on your team the day before a game. You suck it up and quite after the game. HE forced Denver into a tough situation on a road game of a division opponent.

Calling him Quiterson is being too kind only Al Swerengon could put the proper words in context to adequately describe what a &$^$*%*(%^&$ person Kennison was or how he *&(%&%^%%(**(%) Denver so bad.