Deltha Oneal vs. Champ Bailey [Archive] - The Orange Mane

crazyhorse

11-03-2005, 05:22 AM

Deltha is also healthy and gets thrown at more because of tory james

I haven't notice people throwing away from Bailey so much. I know KC doesn't. I mean, they dont throw at him like they would a rook. But Bailey isn't shutting anything down. Oneal is. BTW, Bailey was healthy last season and he played pretty much the same as he has this season.

gunns

11-03-2005, 05:30 AM

Look at the offenses they have played, Cleveland, Minn, Chicago, Houston, Tenn, Jacksonville, GB. Look at the offenses Champ has played against. Champ did not play in two games yet has only 3 less INT's than O'Neal plus Champ has a forced fumble and a TD. Never did lose sleep about letting O'Neal go or for picking Champ up.

Hercules Rockefeller

11-03-2005, 05:30 AM

Deltha is also healthy and gets thrown at more because of tory james

and not everyone has gotten a chance to play Culpepper, Favre and Orton this season.

Rock Chalk

11-03-2005, 05:30 AM

I haven't notice people throwing away from Bailey so much. I know KC doesn't. I mean, they dont throw at him like they would a rook. But Bailey isn't shutting anything down. Oneal is. BTW, Bailey was healthy last season and he played pretty much the same as he has this season.
Really? Because TO is the only one that has scored on Bailey unless you remember something I don't. Im pretty sure that's shutting receivers down.

Hercules Rockefeller

11-03-2005, 05:32 AM

But Bailey isn't shutting anything down.

Then you haven't watched any Bronco games and are basing that off of the 2nd half last weekend.

Hercules Rockefeller

11-03-2005, 05:32 AM

Really? Because TO is the only one that has scored on Bailey unless you remember something I don't. Im pretty sure that's shutting receivers down.

Plax

Rock Chalk

11-03-2005, 05:33 AM

Plax
Oh yeah, push off Burress scored on him.

Ninjafied

11-03-2005, 05:34 AM

Deltha is staight up ballin'. Dont ya think?
So it G Warren, and the rest of the Browncos for that matter.
Some people just need a change of venue.

Jesterhole

11-03-2005, 05:35 AM

This thread is pretty funny. You are joking, right?

Deltha is a turd. He's a gambler, and gives up plays when he doesn't have help over the top.

Champ hasn't been healthy all year, and it sucks, because he is our best player. Understand that. Champ is better at his position than anyone on our team is at theirs.

Deltha is punk on a lucky streak.

crazyhorse

11-03-2005, 05:39 AM

Jesterhole

11-03-2005, 05:42 AM

Bailey has been hurt, which is why he hasn't looked good. When he is not hurt, he is the best corner in the NFL.

I'm curious, do you watch all the Cincy games, or do you only see the highlights?

Play2win

11-03-2005, 05:44 AM

Deltha gives up way more yards than Champ ever will. Especially when Deltha goes against any real talent. Once They go against a decent passing team, you will see how suspect Deltha actually is. Good teams will target him, and Deltha will be giving up yardage by the mile. Especially on 3rd down!!!

I am such a Happy Camper now that we have Neither DELTHA nor PORTIS are on our team. Those are players, in the long run that just make a team WEAKER...

Pat Bowlen

11-03-2005, 05:52 AM

I am such a Happy Camper now that we have Neither DELTHA nor PORTIS are on our team. Those are players, in the long run that just make a team WEAKER...
Tatum and Mike are nice, but I'd rather have Portis back.

Play2win

11-03-2005, 06:10 AM

Tatum and Mike are nice, but I'd rather have Portis back.
Not me. I genuinely like Mike. Tatum, though quiet, is fun to watch and buys into the team.

I genuinely extremely dis-like Portis. He IS a punk. And I got really sick of the 1, 2 and 3 yard gains (and minus yardage) 85% of the time, and then the occasional big play. Yeah, he had a great average, but you couldn't depend on him for substantial yardage on ANY GIVEN PLAY.

Did I mention he IS A PUNK. He is Poison. He needed to be removed. He was EXPELLED from the body, now the body is more healthy. THE TEAM IS NOW MORE STRONGER.

We wouldn't be the team we now are, with Portis still on it. We wouldn't have gelled like we have. We wouldn't be the balanced POWERHOUSE we are turning ourselves into. We would have been much weaker with Portis. We are much Stronger WITHOUT PORTIS!!!!!!!!!!!!

maven

11-03-2005, 06:16 AM

Not me. I genuinely like Mike. Tatum, though quiet, is fun to watch and buys into the team.

I genuinely extremely dis-like Portis. He IS a punk. And I got really sick of the 1, 2 and 3 yard gains (and minus yardage) 85% of the time, and then the occasional big play. Yeah, he had a great average, but you couldn't depend on him for substantial yardage on ANY GIVEN PLAY.

Did I mention he IS A PUNK. He is Poison. He needed to be removed. He was EXPELLED from the body, now the body is more healthy. THE TEAM IS NOW MORE STRONGER.

We wouldn't be the team we now are, with Portis still on it. We wouldn't have gelled like we have. We wouldn't be the balanced POWERHOUSE we are turning ourselves into. We would have been much weaker with Portis. We are much Stronger WITHOUT PORTIS!!!!!!!!!!!!

The team & players liked Portis. Portis wanted the money, and none of the players had a problem with that.

Maybe you as a fan didn't like Portis for whatever reason, but the Bronco players sure did like him.

meangene

11-03-2005, 06:20 AM

I agree. Selfish me-first players like Portis and O'Neal, though sometimes talented, are ultimately a cancer on your team. Portis is a great player and I don't have any complaints with his performance while in Denver. O'Neal flat out sucked in Denver and is a showboat gambler who ultimately will lose far more than he wins. I'm still undecided on Champ. Know he's hurt this year but didn't think he lived up to the billing last year. I'm not sure he'll be healthy the rest of this year either. I'm just not sold yet.

Pat Bowlen

11-03-2005, 06:26 AM

Did I mention he IS A PUNK. He is Poison. He needed to be removed. He was EXPELLED from the body, now the body is more healthy. THE TEAM IS NOW MORE STRONGER.

We wouldn't be the team we now are, with Portis still on it. We wouldn't have gelled like we have. We wouldn't be the balanced POWERHOUSE we are turning ourselves into. We would have been much weaker with Portis. We are much Stronger WITHOUT PORTIS!!!!!!!!!!!!
You should tell that to Rod.

Bronco_Beerslug

11-03-2005, 06:32 AM

No. Not joking.

I'm not talking about stats either. When Bailey is in, he has not looked as good as Deltha Oneal.
Don" ever get tired of trolling here? Don't you have to go to school, or work or something?

Play2win

11-03-2005, 07:05 AM

I am just going to leave it at this, I am very, very happy, **Ecstatic** with the team Shanahan has constructed. There really is not one player that I don't like. There are many that I think ROCK!!! I know, at times, I have been alittle critical of JAKE, but that was just in the hope that he gets it. And I think he, finally, is getting it.

There are no Brian Greise's, Deltha's or Portis's. Guys I just don't like, but I like what they do **Sometimes** on the field.

I love the additions of our Rooks (DWill & FOX), They are both talented kids that buy into the team and have a strong love and passion for the game. I think the roster Rocks, and the future is so bright, I've got to wear SHADES!! 8')

bendog

11-03-2005, 07:09 AM

Hmmm, what type of schemes does Cinny generally go to?

crazyhorse

11-03-2005, 07:10 AM

Don" ever get tired of trolling here? Don't you have to go to school, or work or something?

The name is Dan.

And what do you mean by troll? I am a contributing member of this board. When I say something nice everyone has nothing to say. But when I say something the populous doesn't agree with, then I am pissing in your oatmeal. Fact is, the premise of the post is 100% correct. Oneal has been better than Bailey this season. Also, Bailey wasn't playing any better last year. When he was healthy.

crazyhorse

11-03-2005, 07:13 AM

Hmmm, what type of schemes does Cinny generally go to?

Hmm. a 3-4?

crazyhorse

11-03-2005, 07:16 AM

Don" ever get tired of trolling here? Don't you have to go to school, or work or something?

Done learned it all, and earned it all.

Why, were you going to invite me to lunch?

NaptownChief

11-03-2005, 07:37 AM

No. Not joking.

I'm not talking about stats either. When Bailey is in, he has not looked as good as Deltha Oneal.

hell we already have one thread on this board establishing Tatum Bell and Mike Anderson both being better than Priest Holmes because of stats to date so I would say based on that logic it is very fair to say O'Neal is better than Bailey...not even close.

crazyhorse

11-03-2005, 07:43 AM

hell we already have one thread on this board establishing Tatum Bell and Mike Anderson both being better than Priest Holmes because of stats to date so I would say based on that logic it is very fair to say O'Neal is better than Bailey...not even close.

I am often reminded that stats mean nothing. So I tried not to use the stats against them. That way, they have 99% less chance of having an excuse that let's them continue to lie to themselves. It's very difficult however. Hell, Plummer flipped the fans off and the fans just say he was misunderstood.

I knew what he meant. ???

in awe

11-03-2005, 07:46 AM

Why does this guy keep saying champ had a bad year last year? Seeing how he was a starting pro bowl corner i'd wonder how bad the other corners would have been to be behind him.

Nate Clements is the only guy I can see catching champ as the best corner

Did anyone see Smoot last week?

in awe

11-03-2005, 07:50 AM

Plus it's stupid to compare corner stats.

The better the corner the less he gets thrown to.

crazyhorse

11-03-2005, 07:51 AM

crazyhorse

11-03-2005, 07:52 AM

Plus it's stupid to compare corner stats.

The better the corner the less he gets thrown to.

One of my points is that Champ actually get's thrown to quite a bit. Or it seems like it. Kennison punks him.

Hogan11

11-03-2005, 07:53 AM

Deltha just didn't work in Denver for some reason....the talent is there, but it never translated until Lewis got ahold of him.

And that's great for O'Neil...I'm happy for him....but to compare him to Bailey is insane. Unlike others here, I don't believe Bailey to be infalable, but that doesn't mean I don't recognize that he is one of , if not the, best at his position....Deltha has a way to go to match him.

NaptownChief

11-03-2005, 07:59 AM

One of my points is that Champ actually get's thrown to quite a bit. Or it seems like it. Kennison punks him.

I know the Bengals threw at him all day long last year with Chad Johnson and the Raiders matched up Jerry Porter on him last season and beat him down badly in addition to Kennison giving him a schooling. TO and Philly didn't throw away from him this year either. To Champs credit he is always matching up against the opponents best receiver but those guys have worked him pretty hard during his stay in Denver.

As for the Pro Bowl comment, that is nothing more than a popularity contest especially for non-stat positions like QB, WR and RB. Mike Alstott goes every year because he is the most popular name at FB yet he hasn't done anything worth mention for 5 or 6 years.

Atlas

11-03-2005, 08:01 AM

There's little arguement for Champ from where I'm standing. But thought I might get your perspective on it. Deltha is staight up ballin'. Dont ya think?
I heard that Oneils cover skills haven't really gotten any better. He is still getting beat, but he does have a knack for the INTs he always has. Once your in Shanny's doghouse ity's hard to get out.

I would like to compare Surtain to Champ intsead.

BroncoInferno

11-03-2005, 08:10 AM

IAs for the Pro Bowl comment, that is nothing more than a popularity contest especially for non-stat positions like QB, WR and RB. Mike Alstott goes every year because he is the most popular name at FB yet he hasn't done anything worth mention for 5 or 6 years.

True, but he was also first team All-Pro. The All-Pro team is usually a pretty accurate indicator of the best players from a particular season.

In terms of this season, other than TOs two big plays, no one has done much damage on him this year. Plexico had a decent game, and benefited from a couple of ticky-tack PI calls (not to mention getting away with offensive PI numerous times), but certainly didn't abuse Champ. He has pretty much dominated everyone else.

In his defense against TO, he had shut him down the whole game until the 91 yarder, where he reinjured the hammy. He was clearly laboring on the second big play, and really should not have been on the field.

Bronco_Beerslug

11-03-2005, 08:18 AM

The name is Dan.

And what do you mean by troll? I am a contributing member of this board. When I say something nice everyone has nothing to say. But when I say something the populous doesn't agree with, then I am pissing in your oatmeal. Fact is, the premise of the post is 100% correct. Oneal has been better than Bailey this season. Also, Bailey wasn't playing any better last year. When he was healthy.

Troll:often represented as of diminutive
size and fabled to inhabit caves,
hills, and like places;

It's only conjecture and not fact. Have you seen every play of every game that both have played in this year?

O'neal has 4 passes defended and 0 TDs in 8 games
Champ has 6 passes defended and a TD in 6 games.

Nothing more than a trollby that you're infamous for.

2KBack

11-03-2005, 08:20 AM

Deltha always had a nack for Int's, didn't he have like 8 one year? His athletic ability was never in question, he just seemed to lose concentration after a while. Things kind of snowballed on him while he was in Denver and he lost the confidence of Shanny and the team. Perhaps he is putting things together in Cincy.

if you are arguing without using stats that means you have to have watched Deltha play this year. That seems like it would be hard to do unless you are in ohio. Though any suggestion that Deltha is better than champ would also mean that you haven't been watching Champ this year, considering Champ has been lights out when not gimpy.

watermock

11-03-2005, 08:40 AM

There might a twinge of sellers remorse, but it let us move up to get Williams...the problem with Deltha was his attitue...you bring a bad attitude to everything Mike will show you the door. Everything Deltha did was minimal effort...kinda like Spicoli...from meetings, to the kid in the back of the bus laughing after a loss...to celebrating a punt TD when Seattle like he had just clinched the SuperBowl when the game was still out of reach, to giving up the winning TD to N.E. at home...now all corners get burned, but he gave zero effort and shrugged it off like it meant nothing..NE went on to win the SB, and we had them beat. That's when Mike said Deltha would never play corner again, gave him a token doghouse WR tag and started getting ready to shop him. There was never any intention to make him a WR...none...when Shanahan said that, his career here was over, because Mike knows you can't be WaffleBoy...the trade probably woke him up, and Lewis is a fine defensive coach...there was never a question of talent, but he WAS soft. Compared to how DW hits, he was an outright pussy. If he didn't have talent, he wouldn't of been drafted high...I never liked the pick, but it didn't look BAD....he's allways had a nose for interceptions, that was a known...the problem was he wouldn't give full effort both on and off the field. There wasn't exactly a lockerroom riot after the trade. Shanahan did him a favor...instead of his riding the pine, Dungy has apparently found his light switch. It's done and over...it wasn't working here.

epicSocialism4tw

11-03-2005, 08:43 AM

I haven't notice people throwing away from Bailey so much. I know KC doesn't. I mean, they dont throw at him like they would a rook. But Bailey isn't shutting anything down. Oneal is. BTW, Bailey was healthy last season and he played pretty much the same as he has this season.

Sure...Deltha O'Neal is pure greatness. Bailey gets burned all the time.

Whatever. :unamused:

TDmvp

11-03-2005, 08:48 AM

watermock

11-03-2005, 08:51 AM

Blown coverage...TD Patriots...Groundhog Day....Ha! Probably late and a game winner right?

Rock Chalk

11-03-2005, 08:54 AM

I know the Bengals threw at him all day long last year with Chad Johnson and the Raiders matched up Jerry Porter on him last season and beat him down badly in addition to Kennison giving him a schooling. TO and Philly didn't throw away from him this year either. To Champs credit he is always matching up against the opponents best receiver but those guys have worked him pretty hard during his stay in Denver.

As for the Pro Bowl comment, that is nothing more than a popularity contest especially for non-stat positions like QB, WR and RB. Mike Alstott goes every year because he is the most popular name at FB yet he hasn't done anything worth mention for 5 or 6 years.
Porter in the snow, Chad Johnson is just good and TO because of the hammy injury. Now Im not defending Champ's erratic play AT TIMES, but he also has SHUT DOWN receivers completely included Tony G last year. To pick and choose his worst games without even giving mention to those receivers he had great games against is just being biased.

Atlas

11-03-2005, 08:55 AM

Champ has it tough because teams game plan around him. They take all game to set up certain plays that work on him. Do you think any team's defensive gamplan revolves around Oneil? Nope they go right at him and he is athletic enough to make some things happen.

Smiling Assassin27

11-03-2005, 08:56 AM

give O'Neal credit, he's having a good year. Champ, however, is banged up and is willing to tackle--unlike Deltha. I'm sure the Chiefs would give their left nut for either...

epicSocialism4tw

11-03-2005, 08:57 AM

Porter in the snow, Chad Johnson is just good and TO because of the hammy injury. Now Im not defending Champ's erratic play AT TIMES, but he also has SHUT DOWN receivers completely included Tony G last year. To pick and choose his worst games without even giving mention to those receivers he had great games against is just being biased.

And then to ignore Deltha's checkered past and lack of coverage skills for a few games when QB's were tossing up balls all over the lot (not only to Deltha) is also biased.

SportinOne

11-03-2005, 09:30 AM

No. Not joking.

I'm not talking about stats either. When Bailey is in, he has not looked as good as Deltha Oneal.

You must be one of those Madden generation kids who doesn't care much for full length games. Just the highlights for you, huh?

I haven't seen every single Deltha pick, however 2 of the picks he had against GB, he was in the proccess of getting beat and was lucky that the ball was badly off target. I also remember this happening the last time he had a big 3 INT game. One in particular against GB would have gone for super yardage had Favre not screwed it up... Also, the play that James made when Favre rolled out and under threw it.. That was due for big yardage if he makes the throw.. This Cincy secondary is a fraud.. they have good hands, thats about it. Right now they are just finding themselves in the right place at the right time.

People say some things about Champ, but he IS the best at his position. So he had a bad game last year when he was healthy.. Hey, so did Ogden against Freeny. It's what happens when the best faces the best, someones gotta win.

If you gave any team in the league Champ Bailey, and then said, "We are offering you Deltha for Champ straight up, what do you think." No team would make that trade...

Liebs

11-03-2005, 09:33 AM

There's little arguement for Champ from where I'm standing. But thought I might get your perspective on it. Deltha is staight up ballin'. Dont ya think?
and the idiocy continues. I hope you're consciously trying to be this foolish, otherwise this is scary

yavoon

11-03-2005, 09:35 AM

True, but he was also first team All-Pro. The All-Pro team is usually a pretty accurate indicator of the best players from a particular season.

.
not really, especially on defense or offensive lines. they're ok though.

Liebs

11-03-2005, 09:35 AM

the funny part is, if Deltha was still a bronco, crazy unicorn would find something to hate on about him with the same numbers he has now

you should author a book titled "idiots guide to being an idiot"

Atlas

11-03-2005, 09:38 AM

and the idiocy continues. I hope you're consciously trying to be this foolish, otherwise this is scary

Why are you guys even responding to him?

TheDave

11-03-2005, 09:38 AM

sirhcyennek81

11-03-2005, 09:46 AM

O'Neal was talented, but would have serious lapses in concentration. When he did focus, or when he wanted to, he would have the 2-3-4 INT games. Those were few and far between. Bailey is more consistent, and i would prefer consistency over an INT parade.

NaptownChief

11-03-2005, 10:00 AM

Typical chef fan... The hope has already been drained from their season, so their left to trolling on other teams boards, in hopes of bringing us down to their misery... Word to the wise... DON'T FEED THE TROLLS!

You aren't kidding....the Chiefs are a whole game behind in the loss column to the mid-season Super Bowl Champion Donks and still have them coming to Arrowhead...This season is completely shot to hell.

orange crusher

11-03-2005, 10:02 AM

You aren't kidding....the Chiefs are a whole game behind in the loss column to the mid-season Super Bowl Champion Donks and still have them coming to Arrowhead...This season is completely shot to hell.

Actually, they're a game and half behind. Nyah!

NaptownChief

11-03-2005, 10:05 AM

Actually, they're a game and half behind. Nyah!

a game and a half behind in the loss column? I must have missed that .5 on the NFL Standings.

orange crusher

11-03-2005, 10:07 AM

a game and a half behind in the loss column? I must have missed that .5 on the NFL Standings.

The half you're missing will become a whole 1 when the Faid beats you down.

NaptownChief

11-03-2005, 10:09 AM

The half you're missing will become a whole 1 when the Faid beats you down.

And we will get 1 and a 1/2 back when the Donks come take their annual ritual beating in Arrowhead Dec 4th.

orange crusher

11-03-2005, 10:14 AM

And we will get 1 and a 1/2 back when the Donks come take their annual ritual beating in Arrowhead Dec 4th.

Very wishful thinking on your part.

NaptownChief

11-03-2005, 10:20 AM

Very wishful thinking on your part.

That is what I was hearing from you guys about this time last season also....

listopencil

11-03-2005, 10:35 AM

Laf ....
Ok . i live in cincy ..trust me deltha's not Champ ....
Champ might have 10 picks this year if he'd play some of the crap O's the benglas have played ...
I think all that really need to be said is this ...

Muffed punt .... blown coverage .... Touchdown Patriots.... any questions...

Yep. Pretty much. I haven't really been paying attention to O'Neal since he left but I remember what he looked like for us. Incredible physical tools, pea-sized brain, questionable heart. I would much rather have Bailey.

Bronco_Beerslug

11-03-2005, 10:41 AM

And we will get 1 and a 1/2 back when the Donks come take their annual ritual beating in Arrowhead Dec 4th.
How confident in that prediction are you?

NaptownChief

11-03-2005, 10:53 AM

How confident in that prediction are you?

Oh probably about 65/35 give or take...

bengalsown

11-03-2005, 10:55 AM

Hmm. a 3-4?

4-3

Deltha doesn't really get burned, and is completely the opposite of a "cancer".

I think I'd be happy if I had Champ Bailey on my team as well though...

Rock Chalk

11-03-2005, 10:56 AM

4-3

Deltha doesn't really get burned, and is completely the opposite of a "cancer".

I think I'd be happy if I had Champ Bailey on my team as well though...
Deltha got burned for a 99 yard TD last year. I mean, seriously owned.

Mile High Shack

11-03-2005, 11:08 AM

Deltha got burned for a 99 yard TD last year. I mean, seriously owned.
LOL

I guess that is why he qualified it with "never really"

like a 99 yarder to a cleveland scrub is "never really"

NaptownChief

11-03-2005, 11:10 AM

Deltha got burned for a 99 yard TD last year. I mean, seriously owned.

I would be hard pressed to believe he gave up more big plays than Roland.

Rock Chalk

11-03-2005, 11:13 AM

I would be hard pressed to believe he gave up more big plays than Roland.
Id be hard pressed to believe you believe half the **** you type.

Phantom

11-03-2005, 11:17 AM

McNabb was 12 for 34

Give credit where it's due. Owens had three catches.
Chiefs fan hatred for the Broncos tends to skew reality and perception. Instead of focusing on the two times the NFL's best receiver beat a gimpy Bailey, how about the 22 pass attempts where no one was open, or the fact that Owens was held to three grabs when McNabb chucked it 34 times.

Phantom

11-03-2005, 11:18 AM

Ask a non AFC West fan who is better. There's your answer.

Drek

11-03-2005, 11:18 AM

Deltha at this point is quickly becoming one of, if not the, most overrated player in the NFL. He's a mediocre tackler, poor instincts on the run, and has pretty mediocre 1 on 1 cover skills. He had a 9 pick season for us and made the pro-bowl, I knew he wasn't half that good then, he's not half that good now. When properly motivated in the right system Deltha is exactly what you'd want in a #2 CB, a guy who can hold up decently while giving the occasional big play.

Champ however is the best corner in the league. Watch how differently our D plays when we have a healthy Champ in there (or when Coyer is play calling it that way anyhow). Champ goes 1 on 1 with the best WRs in the NFL and more often than not wins. Does he create the huge turnover numbers? No, because if a QB isn't being careful when passing in Champ's direction at the start of a game Bailey quickly gives him a reason to start. No QB should ever throw two picks to Champ in one game, let alone a hat trick.

Turnover numbers by players are very circumstantial, all stats are really, on a player level, for football.

Phantom

11-03-2005, 11:23 AM

And we will get 1 and a 1/2 back when the Donks come take their annual ritual beating in Arrowhead Dec 4th.

Honestly, have you watched both teams play this year? I will spot you seven points for home field advantage at Arrowhead (that is high), but the Broncos are still the better club this year. I am more confident with our chances this year to complete the sweep - than years previous. You know it and it is eating you alive. Hilarious!

Taco John

11-03-2005, 11:24 AM

I'd take Bailey over Gutless Oneal any day of the week.

Phantom

11-03-2005, 11:27 AM

How come we're not comparing Surtain to Champ - like we heard all offseason?

Oh, that's right - Surtain sucks.

bronco militia

11-03-2005, 11:33 AM

I'd take Bailey over Gutless Oneal any day of the week.

no doubt...but I expected more from Champ...

GreatBronco16

11-03-2005, 11:40 AM

Wait a minute, Oneal isn't Cincys #1 CB. Doesn't he cover either the number two or nickle WR? I would love to have Oneal here with Bailey having Oneal covering a #2 or #3 WR. He could do that, he just couldn't go up against the best every week.

How often does Oneal have help over the top from a saftey? Plenty How often does Bailey get it? None, never, he didn't even get it against TO and Bailey has been battling a bad hammy all year.

So please, lets not compare someone like Oneal to Bailey. None of the NFL players that were asked even mentioned Oneals name when aske who they thought the best CB in the NFL was. Bailey was #1 on that list. Oneal couldn't even make the last name.

GreatBronco16

11-03-2005, 11:42 AM

no doubt...but I expected more from Champ...

Like what? Champ is not gonna go out there and defend the TOs and Chad Johnsons of the NFL and just shut them down every single time. Champ has done his job, and he has played hurt this year when other CBs would just call it a season. I do say he is overpaid for a CB, but he is doing his job.

Somebody try to find the stat that shows how many times Bailey has been thrown at, how many completion he has alloud, and how many TDs he has given up.

NaptownChief

11-03-2005, 11:52 AM

Honestly, have you watched both teams play this year? I will spot you seven points for home field advantage at Arrowhead (that is high), but the Broncos are still the better club this year. I am more confident with our chances this year to complete the sweep - than years previous. You know it and it is eating you alive. Hilarious!

Right the Donks are the greatest squad of all time...Looked infallible especially against the great Fins squad. Uhh

bronco militia

11-03-2005, 11:58 AM

Like what? Champ is not gonna go out there and defend the TOs and Chad Johnsons of the NFL and just shut them down every single time. Champ has done his job, and he has played hurt this year when other CBs would just call it a season. I do say he is overpaid for a CB, but he is doing his job.

Somebody try to find the stat that shows how many times Bailey has been thrown at, how many completion he has alloud, and how many TDs he has given up.

I expected him to be the 2nd coming of Deon Sanders, except we got another Ray Crockett ( pre 1999)

Dean

11-03-2005, 11:58 AM

Right the Donks are the greatest squad of all time...Looked infallible especially against the great Fins squad. Uhh

I don't think that phantom said that the Broncos are the greatest squad of all time. He merely stated the obvious that they are superior to the Chiefs. Did they look infallible to you when they played KC earlier in the season?:~ohyah!:

GreatBronco16

11-03-2005, 12:02 PM

I don't think that phantom said that the Broncos are the greatest squad of all time. He merely stated the obvious that they are superior to the Chiefs. Did they look infallible to you when they played KC earlier in the season?:~ohyah!:

I wonder if he noticed that KC didn't really start throwing the ball well until the second half when Champ was out and they still didn't mount much of anything until Walls had to make a tackle.

Gcver2ver3

11-03-2005, 12:17 PM

There's little arguement for Champ from where I'm standing. But thought I might get your perspective on it. Deltha is staight up ballin'. Dont ya think?

I'm not gonna hate on Deltha...it upsets me that he didn't play like that for us but then again he is coached by Marvin Lewis...THE REAL REASON the Ravens won a Super Bowl

Lewis is an unbelievable when it comes to coaching a defense.

Deltha is no Champ by any means...let's not forget that Cincy has played QB's that just chuck it up for grabs(Favre,Culpepper, & Orton to name a few)

but Deltha is still doing well...good for him

Rock Chalk

11-03-2005, 12:20 PM

I expected him to be the 2nd coming of Deon Sanders, except we got another Ray Crockett ( pre 1999)
I'll take that and smile all the way to back to back Superbowl championships again too ;D

bronco militia

11-03-2005, 12:22 PM

I'll take that and smile all the way to back to back Superbowl championships again too ;D

I'd just take a healthy Champ at some point this season...those rookies are going to hit that "wall" at some point this season.

crazyhorse

11-03-2005, 01:06 PM

Like what? Champ is not gonna go out there and defend the TOs and Chad Johnsons of the NFL and just shut them down every single time. Champ has done his job, and he has played hurt this year when other CBs would just call it a season. I do say he is overpaid for a CB, but he is doing his job.

Somebody try to find the stat that shows how many times Bailey has been thrown at, how many completion he has alloud, and how many TDs he has given up.

You forgot about the Eddie Kennisons of the NFL. They burn him on a regular basis. As a matter of fact, I dont blame Champ for pulling up lame every time he get's beat. It's tough to live up to the reputation he has.

Maybe I should try that.

Honey....could you get me a beer? I pulled my hamstring.

Rock Chalk

11-03-2005, 01:08 PM

You forgot about the Eddie Kennisons of the NFL. They burn him on a regular basis. As a matter of fact, I dont blame Champ for pulling up lame every time he get's beat. It's tough to live up to the reputation he has.

Maybe I should try that.

Honey....could you get me a beer? I pulled my hamstring.
Regular basis eh?

Kennison had a good game once, TO had a good game once, Chad Johnson had a good game once and Pushoff Burress had a good game once and Jerry Porter had a good game once.

5 Receivers out of what, 25? Regular basis?

bronco militia

11-03-2005, 01:09 PM

GreatBronco16

11-03-2005, 01:22 PM

You forgot about the Eddie Kennisons of the NFL. They burn him on a regular basis. As a matter of fact, I dont blame Champ for pulling up lame every time he get's beat. It's tough to live up to the reputation he has.

Maybe I should try that.

Honey....could you get me a beer? I pulled my hamstring.

Eddie and his one game against Champ? Wait, did Champ cover Kennison in the first game this season? I know Kennison did jackdick in the first half when Bailey was playing.

Bronx33

11-03-2005, 01:25 PM

You forgot about the Eddie Kennisons of the NFL. They burn him on a regular basis. As a matter of fact, I dont blame Champ for pulling up lame every time he get's beat. It's tough to live up to the reputation he has.

Maybe I should try that.

Honey....could you get me a beer? I pulled my hamstring.

Quit pretending you know the extent of champs injury ok horsecrazy (YOU DON'T KNOW)

chrisp

11-03-2005, 01:46 PM

People have short memories. It was only a few years ago that Deltha came into the league and got a bucketload of interceptions for us his first year. 9 interceptions earned him a pro-bowl spot but couldn't earn the Broncos a playoff spot: we finished 8-8 and 3rd in our division.

There was never any doubt about Deltha's athleticism, but since that 1st year he never really developed his game, in fact, he went backwards, showing an alarming tendency to lose focus and take plays off.

Deltha has benefited from a new environment and a new coach, but he's not playing any better or worse than he did for us in 2001. The big question is not about whether he's playing well or not, but where does he go from here? Does he develop his game and become more consistent, or does he remain what he's always been: a great athelete but an inconsistent player.

His sheer physical prowess will keep him in the league for some time, and his gaudy INT numbers will probably mean there's always going to be someone prepared to offer him a fat deal, but he has yet to show that he has what it takes to be a top CB in this league.

Leading the league in Ints will get you into the pro bowl, but it doesn't make you one of the greats. Not everything that counts can be counted and not everything that can be counted counts.

To compare him with Champ, who is a consummate professional, always giving 100% full speed and total concentration every play, is just a joke.Hilarious!

OrangeShadow

11-03-2005, 01:54 PM

Yeah champ only turned our entire season around with his pick 6 in the san diego game

Bronco_Beerslug

11-03-2005, 01:56 PM

Oh probably about 65/35 give or take...

Great! I'll take your 2-1 odds. What's the stakes?

ScotchTanShan

11-03-2005, 02:02 PM

I don't think Deltha had a problem when he played you guys on Monday Night last year.

Truth is that Champ hasn't been worth what Portis gave in rushing threat.

epicSocialism4tw

11-03-2005, 02:04 PM

I don't think Deltha had a problem when he played you guys on Monday Night last year.

Truth is that Champ hasn't been worth what Portis gave in rushing threat.

What?

Ha!!! ROFL!

Have you seen our rushing attack lately? Have you seen Champ play before?
I dont think that theres any question as to who got the better end of that deal.

Clockwork Orange

11-03-2005, 02:07 PM

Truth is that Champ hasn't been worth what Portis gave in rushing threat.

Yeah, our rushing attack hasn't done much since Portis left. I mean it's not like the Broncos turned the 2nd rounder they got in that deal into a RB who's outplaying Portis this season or anything. And it's not like Champ was an All Pro last year or anything.

Oh wait.......

Alkazar

11-03-2005, 02:29 PM

No. Not joking.

I'm not talking about stats either. When Bailey is in, he has not looked as good as Deltha Oneal.

This is interesting considering a teammate of Deltha's, one Chad Johnson, recently said that "Hands down" Champ is the best cover corner in the league. you might want to line up your opinions with the facts.

Taco John

11-03-2005, 02:47 PM

no doubt...but I expected more from Champ...

I personally think that given the new passing rules, Champ has performed very admirably. I don't see Champ getting burnt anymore than any other top rated CB in the league. And if Detha Oneal is the standard that we're using to measure the next best thing, I have no complaints at all...

Taco John

11-03-2005, 02:48 PM

I expected him to be the 2nd coming of Deon Sanders, except we got another Ray Crockett ( pre 1999)

I think you're underrating Champ, but that said, Ray Crockett was a hell of a CB in his prime.

Taco John

11-03-2005, 02:56 PM

I don't think Deltha had a problem when he played you guys on Monday Night last year.

Truth is that Champ hasn't been worth what Portis gave in rushing threat.

You'd have a point if we had given up anything in the rushing game. I'm as big a Portis fan as anybody on this board, and still like the guy despite what a fruit the guy is. And the only thing that's been given up are 500 yards he didn't get anyway (ie. I think he could have been a 2000 yard back in our system.) But despite the guess that he'd be all that in our system, we're sitting on a one two punch that some are wondering will break 1000 yards apiece themselves. I don't see how we gave anything up. To the contrary.

I'd love to have Portis, but not at the cost of Champ Bailey. I think people who are down on him are nuts and just don't fully appreciate how much the new rules have changed the game in favor of the offense.

Clockwork Orange

11-03-2005, 03:01 PM

I think people who are down on him are nuts and just don't fully appreciate how much the new rules have changed the game in favor of the offense.

Those are the people who love to point out the three games in which he got beat while completely ignoring the 13 other games in which he was outstanding.

Taco John

11-03-2005, 03:04 PM

Those are the people who love to point out the three games in which he got beat while completely ignoring the 13 other games in which he was outstanding.

Meanwhile we can't even come up with three games that Oneal was outstanding in the entire time he was here...

Gcver2ver3

11-03-2005, 03:06 PM

Say what you want about Champ but this is for sure.......

If it weren't for Champ Bailey's int return for a touchdown against S.D. we wouldn't even be in first place in our division...that you can mark as fact fellas

Turned our whole season around...AND he was playin with bad shoulder

BroncoSoja

11-03-2005, 03:20 PM

I genuinely extremely dis-like Portis. He IS a punk. And I got really sick of the 1, 2 and 3 yard gains (and minus yardage) 85% of the time, and then the occasional big play. Yeah, he had a great average, but you couldn't depend on him for substantial yardage on ANY GIVEN PLAY.
Did I mention he IS A PUNK.

I wonder how much of a Punk he would be if you were standing infront of him. I think we know who the PUNK would be.

But back to teh topic some people must have nevered played injured before cause if they do they would know its extremly hard. I cant even imagine playing agianst some of the best players in the world injured. I didnt like the Champ for Portis trade and still dont to this day but you cannot deny that Champ is a winner adn perhaps the best Corner in the NFL. And im glad he is a Bronco.

ludo21

11-03-2005, 03:23 PM

Champ is the BEST corner in the league. He proved that last week after limiting TO the whole first half to 0 cathches. Obviously has the game wore on, so did his hammy.

He has got beat by CJ, Quitterson, and others. But he also stopped a ton of other number 1 WR's. He did a good job on Plax altho he got beat for a score.

Deltha is having a great season so far so this is a fair assessment, some players thrive when they switch teams, some suck. He is doing well and im glad, but he is still not the corner Champ is.

Ill take Champs all aorund game every day of the week over a gambler like Deltha.

GreatBronco16

11-03-2005, 03:36 PM

I wonder how much of a Punk he would be if you were standing infront of him. I think we know who the PUNK would be.

Why do people just assume that every NFL player can beat up anybody not in the NFL, esp every fan?

Portis doesn't strike me as someone who can defend himself one on one. I for one wouldn't be affraid to call him a punk if given the chance to his face. I'm sure I'd call him a few other things too. Then at the same time, I'm sure he really wouldn't care one way or the other.

crazyhorse

11-03-2005, 06:14 PM

I wonder how much of a Punk he would be if you were standing infront of him. I think we know who the PUNK would be.

1st I would bust his lip, then I would snatch that dude bald headed.

You hear?

Champ dont want none of this my friend.

Play2win

11-03-2005, 06:21 PM

I wonder how much of a Punk he would be if you were standing infront of him. I think we know who the PUNK would be.
Yeah, both me and Portis would know who the punk would be, and it would be you.

epicSocialism4tw

11-03-2005, 06:45 PM

1st I would bust his lip, then I would snatch that dude bald headed.

You hear?

Champ dont want none of this my friend.

Oh gosh.

Crazyhorse is looking to kick some butt. Oh no. Look out. :hitself:

Message board rowdy-talk. ::)

Willynowei

11-03-2005, 08:57 PM

No. Not joking.

I'm not talking about stats either. When Bailey is in, he has not looked as good as Deltha Oneal.

Let me clue you in on something...

If you're serious, You know nothing about football. Nuff said.

DomCasual

11-03-2005, 09:09 PM

I haven't read through this thread. Everytime I go to do it, the title stands out as being so stupid, I find myself distracted.

Surely, it was made by someone who never suffered through the Deltha years.

Surely.

The Snake

11-03-2005, 11:21 PM

Then you haven't watched any Bronco games and are basing that off of the 2nd half last weekend.
You must've have missed that 91 yard TD reception. Champ Bailey is overrated.

The Snake

11-03-2005, 11:22 PM

Let me clue you in on something...

If you're serious, You know nothing about football. Nuff said.
All Chump does it give up big yards. I hope he breaks his legs during the bye week, because we CAN win without him.

TDmvp

11-03-2005, 11:37 PM

this thread gets my vote of the pants loaf of the week...

if we kept Portis ... Al Wilson is probally a Raider now . CUZ they was stalking him
Lynch is who knows where..
Id say Golds still in Tampa ..
We still have Middlebrooks and Kelly ,Deltha... /shiver
MA is gone ..count on it... + no Bell
We dont have DJ cuz he came from the Deltha Trade with Bungals,
and to top it off ...
we would have a PINK fur hat wearing,championship belt carrying,stuck on himself little Flavor clown still on are team....

why would we want him at his price when we are the #1 rushing team without him at prob half the cost or one 3rd and stacked on D, which we wouldnt have been with him ... ?????????

the post before this by "the snake" has to be in the top 5 dumbest things i'v heard on this board in the 3 or so years iv been hanging...

epicSocialism4tw

11-03-2005, 11:45 PM

All Chump does it give up big yards. I hope he breaks his legs during the bye week, because we CAN win without him.

Yikes. This is right up there with troll posts.

GreatBronco16

11-03-2005, 11:51 PM

All Chump does it give up big yards. I hope he breaks his legs during the bye week, because we CAN win without him.

Jesus Majik is that you? I just hope this is reverse karma or something, if not, you sure are one dumb SOB.

The Snake

11-03-2005, 11:56 PM

Jesus Majik is that you? I just hope this is reverse karma or something, if not, you sure are one dumb SOB.
I have to keep reminding mostly everyone here because they're all Chump leg humpers.

TDmvp

11-03-2005, 11:57 PM

Hit find more post by The Snake after clicking his name ... you'll see his a real positive guy .. I mean dude i never just pick fights on forums but you B@tch and moan like a 13 year old girl with a skinned knee.Looking back i see you have taken your time to yell about the sky is falling and Champs trash , and we will lose this game and that game . I mean like 8 outa 10 post whine and moan non F'en STOP ...
... hell id just root for another team...

Clockwork Orange

11-03-2005, 11:57 PM

All Chump does it give up big yards. I hope he breaks his legs during the bye week, because we CAN win without him.

I'd call you a ****ing idiot but I don't want to offend the ****ing idiots of the world by lumping them in with you.

GreatBronco16

11-03-2005, 11:58 PM

I have to keep reminding mostly everyone here because they're all Chump leg humpers.

Then I take it that the majority of NFL players are Chump leg humpers too being that the majority of them put Champ Bailey as the best CB in the NFL.

The Snake

11-04-2005, 12:19 AM

The Snake

11-04-2005, 12:21 AM

I'd call you a ****ing idiot but I don't want to offend the ****ing idiots of the world by lumping them in with you.
http://www.hostmypiconline.com/images/seriousbusiness4.jpg

The Snake

11-04-2005, 12:21 AM

Then I take it that the majority of NFL players are Chump leg humpers too being that the majority of them put Champ Bailey as the best CB in the NFL.
Take it how you want, but that's just my opinion.

Clockwork Orange

11-04-2005, 12:33 AM

Take it how you want, but that's just my opinion..

Blart

11-04-2005, 12:36 AM

Bailey has to wear a shoulder harness all season, incase you didn't know. It's not going to be a good year for him.

Taco John

11-04-2005, 12:57 AM

All Chump does it give up big yards. I hope he breaks his legs during the bye week, because we CAN win without him.

http://www.daveallsop.co.uk/early/Crazy%20Alien.jpg

"That's just crazy."

The Snake

11-04-2005, 01:03 AM

.
nice name, it's fitting both ways lol.

Clockwork Orange

11-04-2005, 01:05 AM

nice name, it's fitting both ways lol.

Spoken like someone who's got experience in going both ways.

Ballhawk

11-04-2005, 01:38 AM

Bailey has to wear a shoulder harness all season, incase you didn't know. It's not going to be a good year for him.

It has been a good year for him. He turned the game around against SD, yes he gave up a TD to Plax on a pushoff, but then had an INT that should have won the game. He gave up 2 catches to TO (one a 2 yard catch).

Some just can not see the improvement he brings to our D when he is playing healthy. Even at 80% he shut TO down for 1/2 the game, you know that half where we built a 28-7 lead. That half the McNabb started out 0-11.

Blart

11-04-2005, 01:40 AM

It has been a good year for him. He turned the game around against SD, yes he gave up a TD to Plax on a pushoff, but then had an INT that should have won the game. He gave up 2 catches to TO (one a 2 yard catch).

Some just can not see the improvement he brings to our D when he is playing healthy. Even at 80% he shut TO down for 1/2 the game.

Notice I said not a good year for him. For any other CB in the league, it would be an awesome year :)

I just hope he'll be able to take the harness off for the playoffs.

Ballhawk

11-04-2005, 01:45 AM

Notice I said not a good year for him. For any other CB in the league, it would be an awesome year :)

I just hope he'll be able to take the harness off for the playoffs.

I hope all of our DBs are healthy for the playoffs, would be a nice change :)

Northman

11-04-2005, 02:24 AM

There's little arguement for Champ from where I'm standing. But thought I might get your perspective on it. Deltha is staight up ballin'. Dont ya think?

Indeed, Deltha is definitely getting it done now. whether he is motivated by getting traded or just flat out having a good year remains to be seen but so far he is paying dividends for the Bengals.

TDmvp

11-04-2005, 03:17 AM

I bet if we ask Marvin Lewis ... would you rather have D.J.
or Deltha, and he takes the LB ....
not even a point to asking him between champ and deltha cuz we know he take champ ... hell Chad johnson called champ the best CB in nfl 2 weeks ago on chads corner "local weekly chad thing on tv here"

OrangeShadow

11-04-2005, 03:46 AM

lets see deltha save a teams season with a pick on the first play of the 3rd quarter

crazyhorse

11-04-2005, 05:07 AM

lets see deltha save a teams season with a pick on the first play of the 3rd quarter

I believe that could be somewhat overstated. However, on this thread, you wouldn't be alone.

DBroncos4life

11-20-2005, 10:50 PM

Arkie

11-20-2005, 11:11 PM

Champ is younger and already been to 5 straight pro bowls. I wouldn't trade him for any CB in the league.

epicSocialism4tw

11-20-2005, 11:26 PM

Champ is younger and already been to 5 straight pro bowls. I wouldn't trade him for any CB in the league.

There is a reason that Champ is scrutinized by the media after every game. He's the best in the game and the other NFL players tell us so.

Look at the year he's had with two nagging injuries. The guy cant be denied.

Willynowei

11-21-2005, 01:17 AM

No. Not joking.

I'm not talking about stats either. When Bailey is in, he has not looked as good as Deltha Oneal.

this thread proves you have no football knowledge, this is the first and last time i will ever respond to your posts.

meangene

11-21-2005, 03:14 AM

Did anybody else notice that Champ seemed to be moving much better yesterday? Looked much more fluid and faster.

Jesterhole

11-21-2005, 04:15 AM

Any Bronco fan knows what Deltha is. He's a straight up gambler, who can certainly turn it on but will cost you in the long run.

He's good when he's in the right mental state, but as soon as things get tough he sulks and gets sloppy and ultimately ends up costing games.

Bailey is the finest corner in the game today. The two do not compare.

Atlas

11-21-2005, 04:18 AM

I haven't read much of this thread but now Champ is just one pick behind Oneal. Both are having career years number wise, just think what Champs numbers would look like if he wasn't hurt most of the year.

I think the only reason Champ has 5 ints is because he is hurt. Other teams are throwing at him. Testing him.

The MVPlaya

11-21-2005, 07:21 AM

Dealtha O'neal is one of the worst cover corners in the league, man on man. When he was in Denver he'd get owned almost every week. He may get picks, but he get's owned twice as much. We lost some games soley because he can't cover. Remember the NE monday night game?

I'm not saying I wouldn't want him in our secondary as a 2nd or 3rd, but you say he's good as Bailey is a joke. Darrent Williams and Foxworth are progressing well...can't wait to see how they play next season and the following...but...it's still this season and we still gotta work hard.

Go :Broncos: