Secondary dropping like flies brings up...

[Broncoman13]

OTHER CONCERNS!!!

I have no doubt that guys like Foxxy and Lenny *could* get the job done. IF we go into the game with the same game plan that worked wonders against the Cheaps.

My concern is that Coyer will go back to the zone blitz scheme and drop more DLinemen in coverage due to the lack of depth in the secondary. If that is the case I don't think we'll be as successful. Simply put, Coyer's game plan will determine our success. Put a lot of pressure on Lefty and our less experienced corners will fair well. Allow him time to make progressions and he will no doubt find one of the good trio of Williams, Smith, and Jones. Those guys can play. Fred Taylor can catch out of the backfield as well. Have DJ mirror Fred and put lots of pressure on Lefty...that will be key to "covering" for our secondary on Sunday.

Like several have said here recently, I too hope that Champ sits this one out. One game is not worth the risk of losing Champ for several weeks. Shanny may have to step in here and tell him what's going to happen, rather than letting Champ make his own decision.

I also don't like the idea of DWill returning Kicks with a questionable ankle. Give the rock to Adams on KR's. Then put Rod Smith in there for Punt returns and let him fair catch it all day long. This game will be close and we don't need Adams muffing a punt and giving the Jags the ball 40-50 yards up field! I'll settle for 0 PR yardage, so long as we don't turn the ball over. This is very important as it figures to be a close game. That being said, if we're down late then obviously you turn Charlie loose and hope for a big return. At that point the risk is worth the return.

My random thoughts... what kind of defensive game plan do you all figure we'll see against the Jags?

Wabbit, any input...maybe a little tidbit of more of last week or look for the Phins game plan... Something... Anything!

[fats]

coyer would be an idiot to go back to the zone dogs. not saying it won't happen. but with our line and lb's playing this well there's just no reason for any gimmicks.

good point about williams' ankle, but with adams' fumbles and rod's injury scare last week i'd be surprised if anyone else were back there.

[Odysseus]

I'm hoping for more turnovers. It's my mantra.

The Broncos aren't going to scare these guys unless they steal a couple of balls. This might not be as tough a game as I am thinking if Trevor blows up on them. The trick is going to be doing something they haven't done and that is getting the ball back for the offense.

They have to come out of this one healthy. A couple of ugly games ahead.

[Mediator12]

OTHER CONCERNS!!!

I have no doubt that guys like Foxxy and Lenny *could* get the job done. IF we go into the game with the same game plan that worked wonders against the Cheaps.

My concern is that Coyer will go back to the zone blitz scheme and drop more DLinemen in coverage due to the lack of depth in the secondary. If that is the case I don't think we'll be as successful. Simply put, Coyer's game plan will determine our success. Put a lot of pressure on Lefty and our less experienced corners will fair well. Allow him time to make progressions and he will no doubt find one of the good trio of Williams, Smith, and Jones. Those guys can play. Fred Taylor can catch out of the backfield as well. Have DJ mirror Fred and put lots of pressure on Lefty...that will be key to "covering" for our secondary on Sunday.

Like several have said here recently, I too hope that Champ sits this one out. One game is not worth the risk of losing Champ for several weeks. Shanny may have to step in here and tell him what's going to happen, rather than letting Champ make his own decision.

I also don't like the idea of DWill returning Kicks with a questionable ankle. Give the rock to Adams on KR's. Then put Rod Smith in there for Punt returns and let him fair catch it all day long. This game will be close and we don't need Adams muffing a punt and giving the Jags the ball 40-50 yards up field! I'll settle for 0 PR yardage, so long as we don't turn the ball over. This is very important as it figures to be a close game. That being said, if we're down late then obviously you turn Charlie loose and hope for a big return. At that point the risk is worth the return.

My random thoughts... what kind of defensive game plan do you all figure we'll see against the Jags?

Wabbit, any input...maybe a little tidbit of more of last week or look for the Phins game plan... Something... Anything!

Well, Foxworth and Paymah are horrible at Zone Coverage but above average in man. With Them likely to get a bunch of snaps this weekend, I think they play modified man zone coverage and pure man more than any straight zones. Plus the pressure that the front four has consistently provided means less blitzing and more pure coverages over the top I hope. Some Cover two Man with optional LB blitzes would work Ideally versus the Jags.

[Mediator12]

I'm hoping for more turnovers. It's my mantra.

The Broncos aren't going to scare these guys unless they steal a couple of balls. This might not be as tough a game as I am thinking if Trevor blows up on them. The trick is going to be doing something they haven't done and that is getting the ball back for the offense.

They have to come out of this one healthy. A couple of ugly games ahead.

And So Far they have provided a minimum of one a game. They will continue to get better as the Secondary gets healthy, but right now they are not taking as many risks. BTW, the offense has been provided the ball inside the scoring zone five times this season from TO's and Champ has an INT for A TD.

[Broncoman13]

And So Far they have provided a minimum of one a game. They will continue to get better as the Secondary gets healthy, but right now they are not taking as many risks. BTW, the offense has been provided the ball inside the scoring zone five times this season from TO's and Champ has an INT for A TD.


Exactly...and I'll start another OSKIE Kismit type thread tomorrow to bring the karma. So far so good. The only game that featured turnovers without them meaning something was the Miami game.

I was extremely happy that we took Larry Johnson's fumble and converted it to 7 almost immediately. We do that in this game and it WILL sway the decision!

[Broncoman13]

Well, Foxworth and Paymah are horrible at Zone Coverage but above average in man. With Them likely to get a bunch of snaps this weekend, I think they play modified man zone coverage and pure man more than any straight zones. Plus the pressure that the front four has consistently provided means less blitzing and more pure coverages over the top I hope. Some Cover two Man with optional LB blitzes would work Ideally versus the Jags.


Very good points. I didn't figure Paymah into this equation too much and I assume you're probably referring more to his zone coverage than Foxxy's. Not that either are particularly good in zone coverage...

I hope you're right. I'd prefer to see Al Wilson, DJ Williams, and John Lynch going after Lefty. Then allow Brandon, Fergy, and Ian to drop into coverage. I think that's the best way for us to operate. That and make damn sure we're telling the DL to go after Lefty. Screw the run, the LB's and Safeties "got yo back", we don't want Lefty having more than 2 seconds to throw the ball. If he goes 5 step somebody should be in his face by the time he looks at his hot receiver!

I expect to see a lot of drop offs to Taylor. DJ and Al will be very important this game. Our LB's have played lights out this year....very impressive! I hate to say it, but the weakest link on defense right now is probably Safety. Sucks b/c Fergy and Lynch are too of my favorites. I think Brandon brings a lot to the table.

Long ways off, but with Brandon and Browner in the future we'll have a good set of safties!

[elsid13]

Long ways off, but with Brandon and Browner in the future we'll have a good set of safties!


I still not sold on Brandon. He looked good before then disappeared. This being his contract year also might be the reason for his good play. I'm on the wait and see with him

[Drek]

I'm not worried about causing turnovers. We have talented DBs now who will actually capitalize on a QB mistake, we just need the DL pressure to force those mistakes.

Its all about the DL, forget the zone blitz as the foundation of the D, build the attack around the front 4 getting good pressure and let the DBs play tight man-man coverage with help from the LBs and safeties. We'll do just fine if we stick with that and throw the zone blitz in as a change of pace.

[Rohirrim]

I think the keys to this one are:
1. Our front four on D are getting better every week.
2. Lefty holds on to the ball way too long.
3. Lefty isn't very durable.
4. Jason has got his groove back.

[DB-Freak]

This is the D-lines game to take.

Anything less I'll be disappointed.

[Broncoman13]

I think the keys to this one are:
1. Our front four on D are getting better every week.
2. Lefty holds on to the ball way too long.
3. Lefty isn't very durable.
4. Jason has got his groove back.


Good points, but the first 3 could be negated if we go back to the Zone Blitz scheme that brought very little pressure vs the Phins and ALL OF THE PAST FEW YEARS! That exact same scheme is what supposedly got Ray Ray run out of town... I think he was a scape goat, but the scheme was to blame. Yet we see almost identical scheming from Coyer until the 2nd half of the Chargers game. I've been happy as hell with Coyer over the past two games... I'm just afraid he'll get worried about the secondary and try to compensate by dropping lineman and going back to the zone blitz scheme.

GIVE ME THE BIG NICKEL! lmao

[Merlin]

I think the keys to this one are:
1. Our front four on D are getting better every week.
2. Lefty holds on to the ball way too long.
3. Lefty isn't very durable.
4. Jason has got his groove back.
5. Jags OL is poor, making 1, 2, and 3 more critical

[Blueflame]

OTHER CONCERNS!!!

I have no doubt that guys like Foxxy and Lenny *could* get the job done. IF we go into the game with the same game plan that worked wonders against the Cheaps.

My concern is that Coyer will go back to the zone blitz scheme and drop more DLinemen in coverage due to the lack of depth in the secondary. If that is the case I don't think we'll be as successful. Simply put, Coyer's game plan will determine our success. Put a lot of pressure on Lefty and our less experienced corners will fair well. Allow him time to make progressions and he will no doubt find one of the good trio of Williams, Smith, and Jones. Those guys can play. Fred Taylor can catch out of the backfield as well. Have DJ mirror Fred and put lots of pressure on Lefty...that will be key to "covering" for our secondary on Sunday.

Like several have said here recently, I too hope that Champ sits this one out. One game is not worth the risk of losing Champ for several weeks. Shanny may have to step in here and tell him what's going to happen, rather than letting Champ make his own decision.

I also don't like the idea of DWill returning Kicks with a questionable ankle. Give the rock to Adams on KR's. Then put Rod Smith in there for Punt returns and let him fair catch it all day long. This game will be close and we don't need Adams muffing a punt and giving the Jags the ball 40-50 yards up field! I'll settle for 0 PR yardage, so long as we don't turn the ball over. This is very important as it figures to be a close game. That being said, if we're down late then obviously you turn Charlie loose and hope for a big return. At that point the risk is worth the return.

My random thoughts... what kind of defensive game plan do you all figure we'll see against the Jags?

Wabbit, any input...maybe a little tidbit of more of last week or look for the Phins game plan... Something... Anything!

If I never, ever see Rod playing special teams again, it wouldn't hurt my feelings a bit... and particularly when he gave us such a scary moment last Monday night, there has to be someone else who can handle that duty. Maybe Adams or Watts... or even Q...

[Merlin]

If I never, ever see Rod playing special teams again, it wouldn't hurt my feelings a bit... and particularly when he gave us such a scary moment last Monday night, there has to be someone else who can handle that duty. Maybe Adams or Watts... or even Q...
Although I agree about Rod, your suggestion of Watts is way out there. As it is, he has shown some trouble with passes. Placing him in such a precarious position risks destroying whatever self-confidence he has managed to repair since the last preseason game. (Not to mention it risks given the opposition the opportunity for a few easy points).

[ozomulsion]

If I never, ever see Rod playing special teams again, it wouldn't hurt my feelings a bit... and particularly when he gave us such a scary moment last Monday night, there has to be someone else who can handle that duty. Maybe Adams or Watts... or even Q...

Watts and Q have never returned a punt in their lives. Maybe high school.

[Sassy]

Mmm...Where is Devoe? Is he hurt?

[ozomulsion]

Mmm...Where is Devoe? Is he hurt?

Yes, hamsting. Believe he's listed as probable. I think he retuned punts in college. So, that would be a better answer than Q or (the claw) Watts.

[Broncoman13]

If I never, ever see Rod playing special teams again, it wouldn't hurt my feelings a bit... and particularly when he gave us such a scary moment last Monday night, there has to be someone else who can handle that duty. Maybe Adams or Watts... or even Q...


Notice that I said Rod Smith taking FAIR CATCHES. Not asking him to run a punt back...just making sure we have sure hands back there. Charlie Adams has fumbled on more than just a couple occassions. Dominick Adams or Charlie Davis... take your pick! If it comes to a point that a big punt return is needed then put in Adams and take the chance at that point...until then you have to realize that a muffed punt could be the difference maker in a game that *should* be low scoring!

[Drek]

Notice that I said Rod Smith taking FAIR CATCHES. Not asking him to run a punt back...just making sure we have sure hands back there. Charlie Adams has fumbled on more than just a couple occassions. Dominick Adams or Charlie Davis... take your pick! If it comes to a point that a big punt return is needed then put in Adams and take the chance at that point...until then you have to realize that a muffed punt could be the difference maker in a game that *should* be low scoring! Is a muffed punt really such a threat to a professional level team that we need to give up yards in fear of it? This isn't college, you have to expect these players to hang onto the ball.

Adams gets the full time duty at both KR and PR in my opinion, Q should be activated as the second option, since he's saddly the best guy with return experience we have left. Adams needs to really scare me to make me pull him though for punt situations.

[Blueflame]

Notice that I said Rod Smith taking FAIR CATCHES. Not asking him to run a punt back...just making sure we have sure hands back there. Charlie Adams has fumbled on more than just a couple occassions. Dominick Adams or Charlie Davis... take your pick! If it comes to a point that a big punt return is needed then put in Adams and take the chance at that point...until then you have to realize that a muffed punt could be the difference maker in a game that *should* be low scoring!

Yeah, I realize we need someone sure-handed back there... but it seems to me that there has to be a better option than risking our #1 WR... I absolutely hate seeing Rod playing special teams. Others may see it differently, but from my viewpoint, an injury to Rod would be positively devastating to the Broncos' season hopes.

[ludo21]

Is a muffed punt really such a threat to a professional level team that we need to give up yards in fear of it? This isn't college, you have to expect these players to hang onto the ball.

Adams gets the full time duty at both KR and PR in my opinion, Q should be activated as the second option, since he's saddly the best guy with return experience we have left. Adams needs to really scare me to make me pull him though for punt situations.

Agreed. Altho im already scared every time Adams is back there, i still like him there, he does a good job and learning by fire is the only way. Let him do it.

[ozomulsion]

Darrent on punts and Adams on kicks. This is the only viable option I can see.

[Broncoman13]

Darrent likely won't be back there...especially now that he's listed as questionable with a bum ankle.

The chances of Rod Smith getting hurt taking fair catches is minimal. The Faid had Tim Brown do it a couple years ago in a similar situation. One of the smarter decision I've seen by the faid. Must have been Gruden! :D

As for Drek's question. I realize this isn't the NCAA. I also realize that we're playing the 2nd ranked defense in the NFL. Points will be at a premium...for both teams. If we put the ball on the ground on a punt return it pretty much guarantees 3 points for them...possibly a TD if it's deep in our territory. In a game that I suspect will have less than 30 total points scored.... 3 points is enough to sway the decision. 7 points would be difficult to over come. Let me remind you that this team held us to 6 points last year and we were probably a better offensive team when we played them last year than we are at this point! They are also better defensively.

Now add to all of that the fact that Charlie Adams was benched last year for fumbling punts. Then he did it again in the preseason this year and last but not least he had TWO fumbles last week. If you're happy with that then yes have him return the punts. Personally, I'd rather not see him back there even if he is a homerun threat returning the ball. I know that he has the ability to take one the distance. I also know that I'd rather play it safe so long as the game is either in hand or within reach. Obviously if some things go wrong and we're down by 6 with a minute or two to go and they punt I'd like to see him get a chance to return one... other than that I just want sure hands and a fair catch. Unless DWill is healthy enough to return punts.

[ozomulsion]

Darrent likely won't be back there...especially now that he's listed as questionable with a bum ankle.


Darrent played on that "bum ankle" from the second quarter on last week. I believe he'll be able to participate in return duties if need be. If Shanny has him returning kicks though, I will question his judgement, no doubt. After all, it's kick returns that Darrent injured his ankle in the first place.

[BroncoBuff]

I think the keys to this one are:
1. Our front four on D are getting better every week.
2. Lefty holds on to the ball way too long.
3. Lefty isn't very durable.
4. Jason has got his groove back.
I thought those same things about Leftwich (#2 and #3 - remember that drama queeen in college - his o-lineman actually carried him upfield?) But this week on "Inside the NFL", Marino was just gushing about him - how's he's the 'best in the league' at looking downfield - keeping focused - while the pocket collapses around him. To be honest, I haven't seen him play enough to know.

I'm with quiettiger, though - on the road against a good team, you need a turnover or two to win.

[Dudeskey]

I think the keys to this one are:
1. Our front four on D are getting better every week.
2. Lefty holds on to the ball way too long.
3. Lefty isn't very durable.
4. Jason has got his groove back.

And don't forget the right side of the Jags' o-line is banged up too. Oh yeah and Lefty is playing on a groin injury, so he could be a real statue in the pocket...™

[Odysseus]

And So Far they have provided a minimum of one a game. They will continue to get better as the Secondary gets healthy, but right now they are not taking as many risks. BTW, the offense has been provided the ball inside the scoring zone five times this season from TO's and Champ has an INT for A TD.

Defenses start with the advantage but Offenses adjust as the season matures. If they don't keep heat on the ball what we are calling a hot start will end up as a cold finish. I think our defense, when healthy, can do better.

Unfortunately for our defense to have it's best opportunity it's going to rely on our offensive TOP and that depends on consistency on offense. I think we can run on this team but it will come down precision play. The mental mistakes kill us more than anything.

[Odysseus]

I'm not worried about causing turnovers. We have talented DBs now who will actually capitalize on a QB mistake, we just need the DL pressure to force those mistakes.

Its all about the DL, forget the zone blitz as the foundation of the D, build the attack around the front 4 getting good pressure and let the DBs play tight man-man coverage with help from the LBs and safeties. We'll do just fine if we stick with that and throw the zone blitz in as a change of pace.

Agreed. Do what works first then get turnovers is all I am asking.

[meangene]

This is a game our d-line must win. If we don't get pressure consistently from our front four we will not win. They are going to be short in their offensive line and Leftwich is banged up. The d-line should be able to dominate up front. If not, we lose.

Offensively, it will be tough to put up a lot of points on their d. But, we need to move the ball enough to control the time of possession. We are healthy offensively. It will take big plays to set up scoring opportunities. Time to break out the whole playbook. Time to see more of Bell, Dayne and Putzier.

This is a gut check game. I'm very interested to see how we respond.

[Broncoman13]

Damn... earlier in the week it was apparent that we'd have a depleted secondary. Today I have a sinking feeling. Somebody said that we didn't have to worry about Matt Jones. He's the one that is really scaring me right now. I hope we live in the Jags backfield defensively. If we get beat for the long one...so be it. I want pressure every play. Sell out! Ian, Al, and DJ should each have atleast 5 blitzes... some on mad-dog style blitzes. 3rd and long we better make it so that Lefty doesn't have the time for his WR's to get 10 yards!!!!! BRING THE HEAT!

Ball, oskie, cover, block, cut and slice, pursue and gang tackle... for this is the WINNING EDGE.