Plummer's "breakout" season?????

[Denver724]

22 for 48 with 2 picks, looks like the same old Jake the Fake to me. :moon:

[broncos love]

screw you man . Half of the promblem was guys were dropping the ball and his picks were late in the game and cant count them. Our promblem was when or 3cbs went out and shannys stupid play calling in the red zone.

[WaffleBoy]

22 for 48 with 2 picks, looks like the same old Jake the Fake to me. :moon:

Hilarious!

The Boy Wonder :super:

[Kaylore]

I actually think he did better about not forcing throws until the end when it was too late anyway. One of those picks it was on fourth down. At least he didn't pull a Trent Green and take a sack.

[Northman]

screw you man . Half of the promblem was guys were dropping the ball and his picks were late in the game and cant count them. Our promblem was when or 3cbs went out and shannys stupid play calling in the red zone.



sounds a lot like last year, where is the chemistry these guys are supposed to create?

[CoopDawg]

I can't be mad at Jake for the interceptions. It is just the same old red zone and third down bull****. Lelie needs to grow some balls and we need to get some plays for inside the 3 yard line that work.

[24champ]

I think its the end of the road for our Oline. They just got hammered by the dolphins front line and im not excusing Plummer either. He made some erratic throws and just makes me wonder what is doing or seeing there?

[orinjkrush]

jake was fine today. he was not the problem. he got the ball to people. they didnt step up.

[Taco John]

I thought Jake looked horrid. I was ready to see BVP by the end of the third quarter. I don't know if BVP can play at this level, but he couldn't do any worse than Plummer was doing out there. I'm a big fan of the "if your veteran plays like a rookie, why not start the rookie" philosophy.

[Hulamau]

I'm not as mad about the INTs , although that first one was terribly overthrown, but it looked to me just the opposite that Plummer was so concerned about throwing INTs early that he was tentative and not in any kind of rhythm and was throwing a lot of erratic balls as a results.

He seemed to lock right on to the primary receiver and follow him the whole way and still throw it to him even with two defenders drapped all over him.

Once again Shanny fails to have the team ready to play a team we are supposed to beat. Particularly in Florida.

And the decision to keep Ernster instead of another D-line man, O-lineman or veteran cornerback is looking mighty dumb.

[dumpy]

I think its the end of the road for our Oline. They just got hammered by the dolphins front line and im not excusing Plummer either. He made some erratic throws and just makes me wonder what is doing or seeing there?


BS. you live or die with Jake. Pubick need to let him throw. 4 attempts in the 1st quarter? His INTs came when there was nothing left to play for. He was so concerned about NOT throwing a int the he didn't throw much at all. Add in the fact that Lelie still looks like a freshman. Anyways, again offensive play claiing.

Oh yeah! The chiefs still BLOW!!!

[Breck Bronc]

I'd still like to see Jake run more when he's flushed out of the pocket or even on designed plays.

[Northman]

BS. you live or die with Jake. Pubick need to let him throw. 4 attempts in the 1st quarter? His INTs came when there was nothing left to play for. He was so concerned about NOT throwing a int the he didn't throw much at all. Add in the fact that Lelie still looks like a freshman. Anyways, again offensive play claiing.

Oh yeah! The chiefs still BLOW!!!

Not total BS. our O-line is small and some of the vets are starting to age. the last couple of years we have struggled to keep protection for our Qb's. people here like to pretend its not true but the only reason why Jake is fairing a little better than SOB is that Jake is mobile. we need to start getting some beef up there if we are going to successful in years to come.

[broncos love]

I thought Jake looked horrid. I was ready to see BVP by the end of the third quarter. I don't know if BVP can play at this level, but he couldn't do any worse than Plummer was doing out there. I'm a big fan of the "if your veteran plays like a rookie, why not start the rookie" philosophy.


Of course you think jake played horrible. Whats he supposed to do catch the balls for the receivers. NOBODY WAS OPEN and lelie stupid decison in the first quarter not to keep on running after jake threw it cost a td.:moody:

[24champ]

BS. you live or die with Jake. Pubick need to let him throw. 4 attempts in the 1st quarter? His INTs came when there was nothing left to play for. He was so concerned about NOT throwing a int the he didn't throw much at all. Add in the fact that Lelie still looks like a freshman. Anyways, again offensive play claiing.

Oh yeah! The chiefs still BLOW!!!

I didnt say anything about the INT he threw, two he was throwing into double coverage....i think he only threw 4 times in the first quarter because they didnt want him to be exhausted in the 4th quarter. Thats the only reason i can think of anyway.

[Popps]

I actually think he did better about not forcing throws until the end when it was too late anyway. One of those picks it was on fourth down. At least he didn't pull a Trent Green and take a sack.

Actually, Plummer took good care of the ball in the first half. There was NOTHING there. Our receivers couldn't get open and the run game was non-existent. He didn't take sacks, he didn't make stupid throws.

He did, however... put two balls in very catchable places (both for TDs) that Assley couldn't manage to take care of.

He wasn't great, but he kept us within 3 at the half. I suppose he should have come out and put up 32 points in the second half to make up for our garbage defense.

[Taco John]

Of course you think jake played horrible. Whats he supposed to do catch the balls for the receivers. NOBODY WAS OPEN and lelie stupid decison in the first quarter not to keep on running after jake threw it cost a td.:moody:

And the off target passes? The wobblers? Those go on the receivers too?

[Popps]

Not sure of the exact stats... but I'd guess that our first 5-7 runs went for less than a couple of yards each. Not exactly a way to scare off cheating LBs/DBs.

Then again, Miami has a REAL pass rusher in Taylor. They don't have to send futile blitzes on every other play like we do.

[Taco John]

He wasn't great, but he kept us within 3 at the half. I suppose he should have come out and put up 32 points in the second half to make up for our garbage defense.


Jake kept it within 3! LOL

Isn't that the defenses job? Jakes job isn't to keep the score close. That's not his job at all...

Dude.

[Popps]

And the off target passes? The wobblers? Those go on the receivers too?

He had some bad passes late in the game. Watch the tape, Taco. **** was out of hand by then and you know it. Jake was just throwing the ball up at that point... exactly what any QB would do when put in that kind of hole.

He took good care of the ball in the first half and put two balls up that Lelie could have easily scored on if he wasn't such a b1tch.

[Taco John]

I agree with everything you are saying about Lelie. He looked terrible. But I don't see how his performance was any worse than Jake's. I thought Jake looked like Bubby Brister on a poor day out there.

[ludo21]

I agree with everything you are saying about Lelie. He looked terrible. But I don't see how his performance was any worse than Jake's. I thought Jake looked like Bubby Brister on a poor day out there.


I agree, he looked poor, but Miami played good D, cant discount that. O line didnt give him much time. Foster just couldnt handle the speed rush of taylor and it forced Jake to move around a lot.

Lets see how he handles this.... this is a long season, you cant win it all in one game, nor can you lose it all in one game.

[broncos love]

I agree, he looked poor, but Miami played good D, cant discount that. O line didnt give him much time. Foster just couldnt handle the speed rush of taylor and it forced Jake to move around a lot.

Lets see how he handles this.... this is a long season, you cant win it all in one game, nor can you lose it all in one game.


I agree man and miami defense looked steller. Hell they beat new england at the end of the year and almost beat us in our yard. Denver will be ok with two home games coming up with divison rivals IMO.

[MajikMan7]

Atleast Jake didn't throw 3 INT's or any left handed ones.

[TheDave]

I thought Jake looked horrid. I was ready to see BVP by the end of the third quarter. I don't know if BVP can play at this level, but he couldn't do any worse than Plummer was doing out there. I'm a big fan of the "if your veteran plays like a rookie, why not start the rookie" philosophy.

Guess your still pissed about "14" not being our QB... Trust me BVP would of looked alot worse. This game was a complete offensive collapse, in my opinion nobody is without alot of blame here.

[GetReal]

And the off target passes? The wobblers? Those go on the receivers too?

No, but if given the opportunity to catch the rock then do so. Yes, Plummer didnt shine and give credit to the Dulphins D, however a few "key" passes were dropped!

[Taco John]

Guess your still pissed about "14" not being our QB... Trust me BVP would of looked alot worse. This game was a complete offensive collapse, in my opinion nobody is without alot of blame here.



Not at all... I had no allegiances to Brian. I just thought that he'd have been much better with an offensive line that could pass protect. He's a pocket quarterback, not a scrambler. Using our back-up center as a left tackle was a poor idea.

The fact that Jake sucked today has nothing to do with Brian Griese. If I cared about Griese, I'd be comparing his stats today with Jakes and making a fuss about it.

Brian's not on our team, and for good reason. We weren't able to play to his strengths and minimize his weaknesses. It was a bad fit.

[Popps]

I agree with everything you are saying about Lelie. He looked terrible. But I don't see how his performance was any worse than Jake's. I thought Jake looked like Bubby Brister on a poor day out there.

Let's be honest, Taco... you're looking for Jake to fail. He's the guy you're hard for, and that's fine. He had a bad game, but how could you expect anything else with no protection, absolutely no run game and a defense that can't even get in the way? Ashley dropped a TD in the endzone and fk'd up on another potential TD. One or both of those plays (that a pro should make) change the whole outlook of the game.

[Popps]

iginally Posted by TheDave
Guess your still pissed about "14" not being our QB

.. and we have a winnah!

[elsid13]

I guess I didn't watch the same game as some. I like Jake, but he was off all day on his passes. The pass to Putz in the end zone, was one of the worse profession passes I have every seen. IT was dead duck. Plus a lack of running game killed us today.

[Sideburn]

What about the lame duck 10 yard pass to Putz at the goaline. Not only did it wobble like retarded duck with one wing, it was two feet behind putz...AND IT WAS A 10 YARD DUMPOFF PASS! Was that Putz's fault? What about the 3rd and 5 and Jake throws the ball 120 mph on a slant to the slot receiver? Not only was it a bullet to a receiver 8 yards away, but it was 10 feet in the air. There were some drops, mainly Alexander, who couldn't catch a cold sitting in snow naked, but there were some really really piss poor passes. Jake couldn't even complete a god damn screen pass. It was pathetic. I officially want Jake gone. I don't care what records he puts up, I don't care what he does next week. The past 2 years, plus today is enough for me to give up on his worthless ass.

[Taco John]

Let's be honest, Taco... you're looking for Jake to fail. He's the guy you're hard for, and that's fine. He had a bad game, but how could you expect anything else with no protection, absolutely no run game and a defense that can't even get in the way? Ashley dropped a TD in the endzone and fk'd up on another potential TD. One or both of those plays (that a pro should make) change the whole outlook of the game.


Whatever. I'm not looking for any Bronco to fail. You can go to hell for even insinuating that. And don't come to me with your "no protection" arguments. That's a laugh given the history we have in this discussion. You don't own that argument. You have no claim on it. You were the one who told us that protection didn't matter if your quarterback was mobile.

[TheDave]

Not at all... I had no allegiances to Brian. I just thought that he'd have been much better with an offensive line that could pass protect. He's a pocket quarterback, not a scrambler. Using our back-up center as a left tackle was a poor idea.

The fact that Jake sucked today has nothing to do with Brian Griese. If I cared about Griese, I'd be comparing his stats today with Jakes and making a fuss about it.

Brian's not on our team, and for good reason. We weren't able to play to his strengths and minimize his weaknesses. It was a bad fit.

Fair enough... I still think this was a complete offensive implosion. How many damn times did we end up in 3rd & long? Take away Tatums one long run and we must of averaged less than 3 yards per carry. Add to that another 5+ drops and i would say there is plenty of blame to go around here. Did Jake have a bad game... absolutely, was it any worse than the O-Line? Just a crap game all around...

[GetReal]

I guess I didn't watch the same game as some. I like Jake, but he was off all day on his passes. The pass to Putz in the end zone, was one of the worse profession passes I have every seen. IT was dead duck. Plus a lack of running game killed us today.

Well, "lack of running game" What, the line or Great D by the Dolphins?
No really. Your oppinion.

[broncos love]

Let's be honest, Taco... you're looking for Jake to fail. He's the guy you're hard for, and that's fine. He had a bad game, but how could you expect anything else with no protection, absolutely no run game and a defense that can't even get in the way? Ashley dropped a TD in the endzone and fk'd up on another potential TD. One or both of those plays (that a pro should make) change the whole outlook of the game.


:dunk:

[Hulamau]

Popps, I just finished rewatching every offensive play of the first half and Plummer was very tentative and erratic. Lelie did misjudge that broken play when Plummer had run almost all the way to the side line and ythen threw a bomb at the last second, but Lelie wasnt running a pattern then and simply mijudged where the ball was coming and jumped too early, but he in no way 'quit on the play' as you claim.

It was his fault too for the misjudge, but the ball was so overthrown as well it would have been a real stretch to have caught it. Rerun the whole sequence including the moment the pattern broke down after Plummer broke and ran and look at where Lelie was when he broke from Madison and you can see the whole story. Even if he had judged it correctly it would have been a lunging dive and was far from an 'easy catch' thoughh he still should have had it.

Lelie did drop that first down right at the end of the half again on a badly thown ball in which he had to dive off the carpet but did have it until he hit the ground . Still should have caught that one too.

Plummer threw at least 7 balls very poorly in the first half and many more in the second

Even the announcers were laughing and commenting on a few of them.

The bottom line is the Lelie and PLummer and the rest of the team and coaches stunk today.

I just have very little confidence that Plummer can be consistent enough to make everyone else better as well. Its funny how a good steady QB can have that effect on a whole team.


Plummer has some talent for escaping that is very laudable and occasionally can make a great play but he'll turn around and give it all back on plays left on the ground as well.

We MUST get a new QB in next years draft if this kind of performance continues. Plummer has through the bye week I say to prove otherwise. If he cant become truly consistent he's not going to after 9 years and three years with this team.

I suspect Lelie will bounce back next week and Plummer some too, but we've lost Champ for at least several weeks according to Shanny saying he;s got the same kind of Shoulder separation injury as Walls had last year which pretty much finished his year so we are in a world of hurt at corner when we face a real passing team.

[x123z]

Thank god for Rod Smith. The rest looked like crap. The coaching staff really sucked.

[TheDave]

but we've lost Champ for at least several weeks according to Shanny saying he;s got the same kind of Shoulder separation injury as Walls had last year which pretty much finished his year so we are in a world of hurt at corner when we face a real passing team.

Great... exactly what i didn't want to hear...

[elsid13]

Well, "lack of running game" What, the line or Great D by the Dolphins?
No really. Your oppinion.


I have no idea what you are asking, so let me guess. When Denver fails to run the ball we lose. Today the running game was based upon sweeps outside that got little yardage on early downs. Putting Denver in position that requied then to drop back and pass with no option for play action. We should have continue to try to run maybe using counters or delays since right up gut wasn't working.

[GetReal]

I have no idea what you are asking, so let me guess. When Denver fails to run the ball we lose. Today the running game was based upon sweeps outside that got little yardage on early downs. Putting Denver in position that requied then to drop back and pass with no option for play action. We should have continue to try to run maybe using counters or delays since right up gut wasn't working.

Ok Well, then if we couldnt run at all then Miami's D was great.

So IF we couldnt run the ball then what?

[Hulamau]

ITs clear Teh fist team didnt get enough cahllenign work in the preseason. Lelie look ed all world agisnt the colts and for that one half with 7 catches and a 40 yrd TD but got very littel work otherwise.

They need toget they game time chemistry up to snuff this week.

Again poor coaching too not having the team ready.

[watermock]

How can you make the argument Jake "kept us in the game" when we scored 3 points all half? The time of possesion was so bad that the defense was absolutely exausted my the mid 3rd quarter and collapsed. Jake played very poorly. I'm not talking about the two late picks, they were inconsequential as the game was essentially over. He was overthrowing, he threw some way to hard with zero touch, some wobbled. He also could of run in that rollout but chickened out.

In retrospect, even the inactives were not proper. We were left with Bell. Dayne was inactive for some stupid reason, and Anderson hurt his ribs. We should of had more corners active in that heat as well.

Our goal line offense was absolutely horrific, yet we simply kept doing the same damn thing, Bell up the middle. Where was Gerald Warren? Why did it take a dozen stuffs to finally throw a swing pass to the FB?

I can't name one single thing positive about this game, it was disgracefull. Denver was flat, Jake was way off all day, injuries were all over the place, the team wasn't properly hydrated and honestly, we looked out of shape. Now I know that it was horrific conditions, if you have ever been down there in the summer it's a freaking sauna, but where were the swamp coolers...where were then sideline fans? I didn't see any. Denver was on the hot sideline. Still, if the offense had executed worth a damn, it would of been THEIR defense busting their asses out there on that steaming field. The play calling was completely attrocious. Why didn't Sapp get his number called? Why was Dayne inactive when we knew it was going to be so hot?

What happened to our depth at DL? We had 17 now we had 8 active today? I know we could only keep 10, maybe 11, but 6 freaking TE's if you count Carswell in an emergency?

This wasn't New England, Philly or even Baltimore or San Diego. It was freaking Miami, the second worst team in the NFL with a rookie coach, altho I have always felt Saban was the best out there as a prospective NFL Head Coach. Really surprising and dissapointing up and down the line.

[footstepsfrom#27]

This shouldn't be such a debate over who was to blame for this. They all stunk.

[elsid13]

Ok Well, then if we couldnt run at all then Miami's D was great.

So IF we couldnt run the ball then what?


We were able to run the ball in the first half. We gave up on it to soon.

[broncolife]

I thought Jake did as crappy as the rest of our O did. When Jake first came here he wouldnt hesitate to run the ball.One thing I hate about Jake now is that he looks afraid to run the ball. He looks like a child afraid of being scolded by his daddy. Damn, you Shanny let him loose.

[GetReal]

How can you make the argument Jake "kept us in the game" when we scored 3 points all half? The time of possesion was so bad that the defense was absolutely exausted my the mid 3rd quarter and collapsed. Jake played very poorly. I'm not talking about the two late picks, they were inconsequential as the game was essentially over. He was overthrowing, he threw some way to hard with zero touch, some wobbled. He also could of run in that rollout but chickened out.

In retrospect, even the inactives were not proper. We were left with Bell. Dayne was inactive for some stupid reason, and Anderson hurt his ribs. We should of had more corners active in that heat as well.

Our goal line offense was absolutely horrific, yet we simply kept doing the same damn thing, Bell up the middle. Where was Gerald Warren? Why did it take a dozen stuffs to finally throw a swing pass to the FB?

I can't name one single thing positive about this game, it was disgracefull. Denver was flat, Jake was way off all day, injuries were all over the place, the team wasn't properly hydrated and honestly, we looked out of shape. Now I know that it was horrific conditions, if you have ever been down there in the summer it's a freaking sauna, but where were the swamp coolers...where were then sideline fans? I didn't see any. Denver was on the hot sideline. Still, if the offense had executed worth a damn, it would of been THEIR defense busting their asses out there on that steaming field. The play calling was completely attrocious. Why didn't Sapp get his number called? Why was Dayne inactive when we knew it was going to be so hot?

What happened to our depth at DL? We had 17 now we had 8 active today? I know we could only keep 10, maybe 11, but 6 freaking TE's if you count Carswell in an emergency?

This wasn't New England, Philly or even Baltimore or San Diego. It was freaking Miami, the second worst team in the NFL with a rookie coach, altho I have always felt Saban was the best out there as a prospective NFL Head Coach. Really surprising and dissapointing up and down the line.


"This wasn't New England, Philly or even Baltimore or San Diego. It was freaking Miami, the second worst team in the NFL with a rookie coach, altho I have always felt Saban was the best out there as a prospective NFL Head Coach. Really surprising and dissapointing up and down the line"

"Freaking Miami" kicked our a$$ all over the field! Call it want you want but we got schooled today.
Time to look deeper then the coaches.

[ak1971]

i dont even wan to read this tread. Plummer sucks, coaching sucks....put in BVP

[DB-Freak]

"This wasn't New England, Philly or even Baltimore or San Diego. It was freaking Miami, the second worst team in the NFL with a rookie coach, altho I have always felt Saban was the best out there as a prospective NFL Head Coach. Really surprising and dissapointing up and down the line"

"Freaking Miami" kicked our a$$ all over the field! Call it want you want but we got schooled today.
Time to look deeper then the coaches.
I'm sick of people blaming the game planning and game time adjustments.

We have alot of posers playing in this team.

[Sassy]

This shouldn't be such a debate over who was to blame for this. They all stunk.
Yep! ::)

[bloodsunday]

I agree with everything you are saying about Lelie. He looked terrible. But I don't see how his performance was any worse than Jake's. I thought Jake looked like Bubby Brister on a poor day out there.

Everyone's right. The entire O played horrible, top to bottom. I think all the young guys BVP, Adams, and Devoe specifically deserved a chance. That was awful.

Today is one of the few days I have been truly embarassed to be a Broncos fan.

[DB-Freak]

I am never embarassed to be a Broncos Fan.

Regardless of that fact, Aside from Rod, almost every player is a poser in the offense.

It's time to step the **** up.

[Sideburn]

Hell, let's not stop there. We have a poser offensive set. The winged T is a better offense than what we run.

[Hulamau]

Let's be honest, Taco... you're looking for Jake to fail. He's the guy you're hard for, and that's fine. He had a bad game, but how could you expect anything else with no protection, absolutely no run game and a defense that can't even get in the way? Ashley dropped a TD in the endzone and fk'd up on another potential TD. One or both of those plays (that a pro should make) change the whole outlook of the game.

No question Popps Lelie had a really bad game , but rewind your TIVO to 3:26 of the 4th quarter just one of the number of time Lelie was wide open and Plummer totally over threw him . If Plummer had been on target that was likely 7 points right there as well. Same thing happend toward the end of the 3rd not to metionn the first INT in which Plummer threw a strike right to the Miami defender 10 yards behind Alexander and at least 7 or 8 other wounded ducks.

The problem with a guy like Plummer is its so hard to get much of a rhythm going with him. He'll be hot on a series only to come back and look like a junior high QB for the next two series and back to a stud again for a play or two.

Hes all over the map. One thing is for sure he needs a lot more game time chemistry work with Lelie, Smith, Tatum and Alexander.

Lets see what happens next week.

Right now we've got a serious problem at Corner with only a gimpy Walls, Darrent and Fox in the hole.

We need to speed dial Middlebrooks immediately for another warm body. At least he knows our system and can play special teams too.

[ZachKC]

least he didn't pull a Trent Green
You mean lead an offense to a solid game and a win?

[SoDak Bronco]

No question Popps Lelie had a really bad game , but rewind your TIVO to 3:26 of the 4th quarter just one of the number of time Lelie was wide open and Plummer totally over threw him . If Plummer had been on target that was likely 7 points right there as well. Same thing happend toward the end of the 3rd not to metionn the first INT in which Plummer threw a strike right to the Miami defender 10 yards behind Alexander and at least 7 or 8 other wounded ducks.

The problem with a guy like Plummer is its so hard to get much of a rhythm going with him. He'll be hot on a series only to come back and look like a junior high QB for the next two series and back to a stud again for a play or two.

Hes all over the map. One thing is for sure he needs a lot more game time chemistry work with Lelie, Smith, Tatum and Alexander.

Lets see what happens next week.

Right now we've got a serious problem at Corner with only a gimpy Walls, Darrent and Fox in the hole.

We need to speed dial Middlebrooks immediately for another warm body. At least he knows our system and can play special teams too.

As much as I, and every Bronco fan want him to be. Jake will never be an accurate qb, he'll have his moments, but lets face it. He has just as many shakey throws. The thing that sucks about plummer, is watching him, I have no confidence in him hitting an open WR and giving his guys a chance to run after the catch. I think we need to look to the future and draft someone next year.

[errand]

I thought Jake looked horrid. I was ready to see BVP by the end of the third quarter. I don't know if BVP can play at this level, but he couldn't do any worse than Plummer was doing out there. I'm a big fan of the "if your veteran plays like a rookie, why not start the rookie" philosophy.

Yeah start a virtual rookie in week two.....that makes sense.

[ROYC75]

Maybe you guys can get excemptions from the NFL and send your whole team to NFLE ?

[Mile High Shack]

it doesn't help that he has zero time to throw the ball

and when he did, no one was open usually

the whole offensive is to blame today..not just Jake, get over it haters

Jake looked bad

the oline looked bad

the running game wasn't used enough

the receivrs were dropping balls or cutting routes short

[errand]

And the off target passes? The wobblers? Those go on the receivers too?


No those go on the fact he had to throw practically every down while being chased all the time.

[WaffleBoy]

No those go on the fact he had to throw practically every down while being chased all the time.

Hey, Errand, wasn't Griese suppose to be out of the league by now? ;D

The Boy Wonder :super:

[errand]

Hey, Errand, wasn't Griese suppose to be out of the league by now? ;D

The Boy Wonder :super:

He's managed to keep himself in the NFL longer than I believed he could.....

......so tell me, what did you think of Frerotte's performance today....because if I recall you claimed he too would be out of the league by now.

[Sassy]

Mmm...for the record...Culpepper had 3 ints and 2 fumbles today.

[WaffleBoy]

He's managed to keep himself in the NFL longer than I believed he could.....

......so tell me, what did you think of Frerotte's performance today....because if I recall you claimed he too would be out of the league by now.

I never said Gus would be out of the league. I thought he was under appreciated in Denver. In fact, I was the one who said he should return to Denver.

The Boy Wonder :super:

[Mile High Shack]

Mmm...for the record...Culpepper had 3 ints and 2 fumbles today.

and I'd still take him over every QB except for 1 in today's NFL

can't say that about Plummer ;)

[Sideburn]

and I'd still take him over every QB except for 1 in today's NFL

can't say that about Plummer ;)
I'd take Griese and his dog over plummer right now.

[ZachKC]

I'd take Griese and his dog over plummer right now.
:laugh:

[Mile High Shack]

I'd take Griese and his dog over plummer right now.

what's funny is, they are still dinking and dunking, which is what SOB was good at

if SOB wouldn't of lost the team and gotten clocked in the face by Trevor, then maybe he'd still be here

[RhymesayersDU]

I'm personally waiting until the bye week to jump on the "New QB" bandwagon.

Although, if I get on that bandwagon, it'll be Leinart.

[Sideburn]

what's funny is, they are still dinking and dunking, which is what SOB was good at

if SOB wouldn't of lost the team and gotten clocked in the face by Trevor, then maybe he'd still be here
Someone needs to clock the fake! Sad thing about Trevor hitting Griese is that was the last time he's hit a qb.

[Odysseus]

Guess your still pissed about "14" not being our QB... Trust me BVP would of looked alot worse. This game was a complete offensive collapse, in my opinion nobody is without alot of blame here.

Agreed.

Starting BVP would be just stupid. Jake might not be all that but putting in BVP would be adding insult to injury.

[Goobzilla]

Someone needs to clock the fake! Sad thing about Trevor hitting Griese is that was the last time he's hit a qb.

I.O.U 1 rep LOL!

Signed,

Goob

[-Slap-]

I realized Jake was never going to be the guy exactly one year ago, by the football calendar. Once he threw that lefthanded pass from the end zone against KC, I started the deathwatch.

[Taco John]

Yeah start a virtual rookie in week two.....that makes sense.


You must not be too familiar with our head coach.

Let me introduce you to the man who once started a virtual rookie against the Dolphins in week one:

http://www.sportsecyclopedia.com/nfl/denver/ShanahanDen.jpg

[Taco John]

I realized Jake was never going to be the guy exactly one year ago, by the football calendar. Once he threw that lefthanded pass from the end zone against KC, I started the deathwatch.


I remember that...

[SoCalBronco]

We had to really calm slappy down in the chat room that night.

[Mile High Shack]

You must not be too familiar with our head coach.

Let me introduce you to the man who once started a virtual rookie against the Dolphins in week one:

http://www.sportsecyclopedia.com/nfl/denver/ShanahanDen.jpg

........when the Dolphins probably had a top 3 defense at that too

[-Slap-]

........when the Dolphins probably had a top 3 defense at that too
Zach must have punched Brian in the mouth five times that night by himself.

[Taco John]

The man has no fear. He just wants to win. And if Jake isn't doing it for him, I wouldn't put it past him to pull the trigger on BVP to see if a few weeks on the bench will straighten Jake out.

[Mile High Shack]

Zach must have punched Brian in the mouth five times that night by himself.

poor Eddie Mac got so hung out to dry by SOB in that game, he probably felt those hits the rest of the season

[Sideburn]

The man has no fear. He just wants to win. And if Jake isn't doing it for him, I wouldn't put it past him to pull the trigger on BVP to see if a few weeks on the bench will straighten Jake out.
Kordell is looking for a job right now. At the very least we could have him chase the fake around the locker room grabbing at his butt. Humility does wonders.

[-Slap-]

I just remember the Dolphins realized that nobody was blocking Zach on the blitz and they just kept sending him. I'll bet Thomas didn't blitz as much the whole rest of the year as he did that night.

[Sideburn]

poor Eddie Mac got so hung out to dry by SOB in that game, he probably felt those hits the rest of the season
I've heard that on a quiet still night in Denver, you can hear eddie scream out profanities about high passes over the middle from griese. The mostly come out at night....mostly.

[Mile High Shack]

Kordell is looking for a job right now. At the very least we could have him chase the fake around the locker room grabbing at his butt. Humility does wonders.

or just have him mysteriously show up in the shower whenever Jake does

just meat gazin'..........

[Pezman]

Yup... it about sums it up right...

http://denver.rockymountainnews.com/drew/090905drew.gif

[RhymesayersDU]

Yup... it about sums it up right...

http://denver.rockymountainnews.com/drew/090905drew.gif
Was that cartoon done in response to today's game?

If so, I kind of have an issue with that.

[watermock]

That wasn't the problem yesterday. The INT's came late after the game was over.

[RhymesayersDU]

That wasn't the problem yesterday. The INT's came late after the game was over.
Exactly what I'm saying. Jake played bad, the whole team played bad, but to try and make Jake's 2 INTs the reason we lost, which is how the cartoon comes off, is incorrect IMO.

[Taco John]

Was that cartoon done in response to today's game?

If so, I kind of have an issue with that.


What is the issue? I'm reading people pardoning Jake for the INTs because they were "thrown up during garbage time." I don't know why he gets a pardon for that. He was terrible the entire first half in which our defense held Miami to 6 points. If he can lead the offense there, and drive some points on the board, he's not in a situation late in the game where he's throwing up garbage INTs.

I doubt fans of other teams will give him a pardon when running their smack. I sure don't.

We should have had no less than 17 points in the first half.

[RhymesayersDU]

What is the issue? I'm reading people pardoning Jake for the INTs because they were "thrown up during garbage time." I don't know why he gets a pardon for that. He was terrible the entire first half in which our defense held Miami to 6 points. If he can lead the offense there, and drive some points on the board, he's not in a situation late in the game where he's throwing up garbage INTs.

I doubt fans of other teams will give him a pardon when running their smack. I sure don't.

We should have had no less than 17 points in the first half.
TJ, here's my problem. His first INT, he throws with like 6 seconds left in the first half. Just a hail mary. An INT like that, it's not as bad as say, the fade pass against San Diego last year.

Now I know, in the stat book, an INT is an INT, and that's fine. However, those INTs aren't what lost the game. If anything, that weight above Jake's head in the cartoon should say "accuracy" or "ability" or whatever word you want to critisize Jake. I mean you said it yourself, he had a terrible first half. I'd agree with that. But the INT wasn't the terrible part.

[Taco John]

TJ, here's my problem. His first INT, he throws with like 6 seconds left in the first half. Just a hail mary. An INT like that, it's not as bad as say, the fade pass against San Diego last year.

Now I know, in the stat book, an INT is an INT, and that's fine. However, those INTs aren't what lost the game. If anything, that weight above Jake's head in the cartoon should say "accuracy" or "ability" or whatever word you want to critisize Jake. I mean you said it yourself, he had a terrible first half. I'd agree with that. But the INT wasn't the terrible part.



I agree... I still think that almost any INT is bad, even if it doesn't penalize the team like it could otherwise because INTs serve as a symptom of a larger problem. I'd be much more forgiving if that INT was throw with 6 seconds left and we were leading by 10 and getting ready to head into the locker room. It's the difference between desperation and dominance.

[Pezman]

We had 3 drives of our 12 that ended in three and out or less, 10 of them that ended in either a Jake incomplete pass, fumble or INT. And even if it was garbage time near the end, the fact of the matter is, Jake gave our last three possessions away via turnover.

I'd say that cartoon is par for the course to say the least...

[RhymesayersDU]

I agree... I still think that almost any INT is bad, even if it doesn't penalize the team like it could otherwise because INTs serve as a symptom of a larger problem. I'd be much more forgiving if that INT was throw with 6 seconds left and we were leading by 10 and getting ready to head into the locker room. It's the difference between desperation and dominance.
I think we're basically just splitting hairs here. I guess my problem is, if you didn't see the game, you'd think it was same ol Jake, turning the ball over, that killed us, when it really wasn't that.

With that said, he played poorly. I just think to put interceptions on that weight is inaccurate... Again, I'd put lack of accuracy, lack of ability, whatever. Although it all goes hand in hand. Some of the off-target passes he threw today might have been picked off in another game, so I suppose it's all the same anyways.

And really, the whole team should be pictured there. I'm not trying to spin things for Jake, but outside #80, they all played like crap.

[-Slap-]

Semantics. He sucks.

[Sassy]

I think we're basically just splitting hairs here. I guess my problem is, if you didn't see the game, you'd think it was same ol Jake, turning the ball over, that killed us, when it really wasn't that.

With that said, he played poorly. I just think to put interceptions on that weight is inaccurate... Again, I'd put lack of accuracy, lack of ability, whatever. Although it all goes hand in hand. Some of the off-target passes he threw today might have been picked off in another game, so I suppose it's all the same anyways.

And really, the whole team should be pictured there. I'm not trying to spin things for Jake, but outside #80, they all played like crap.
Rod is taking the blame too...

"If we get that touchdown, we're up 7-6 going into the half, and the game is different," Smith said. "There's too many opportunities that we blew, and we blew them -- all 11 of us. It's not one guy, it's the entire offensive unit. We take blame for everything each other does."



Rod Smith was angry about the game, but kept his perspective. "The season is nowhere near over," he said. "We just can't go undefeated."

[-Slap-]

Rod gets to spend his twilight languishing among a bunch of guys who don't care half as much as he does.

[RunByDesign]

I've heard that on a quiet still night in Denver, you can hear eddie scream out profanities about high passes over the middle from griese. The mostly come out at night....mostly.

Great Alien reference....newt.

[Pezman]

Rod gets to spend his twilight languishing among a bunch of guys who don't care half as much as he does.

As sad as that statement is, its true ugh!~

[broncos love]

I agree... I still think that almost any INT is bad, even if it doesn't penalize the team like it could otherwise because INTs serve as a symptom of a larger problem. I'd be much more forgiving if that INT was throw with 6 seconds left and we were leading by 10 and getting ready to head into the locker room. It's the difference between desperation and dominance.


Unbeliveable.:Broncos:

[jbiel]

Hello all: Unfortunately, I just got back from Miami and had to sit through that crap yesterday. I'm not sure if anyone has questioned this, but my main problem was the play calling. I haven't watched the game on tape yet, but I do not recall seeing yesterday any 3 wide reciever sets with us actually using 3 wide receivers. I was bitching about it all day yesterday to my buddy, and when we used it late in the game, it was our only touchdown. I seem to lose more and more confidence in Shanahan every year. Why in the hell would we constantly line up Putz and Bell out as a wideout. Bell doesn't run routes and Putz is usually not going to beat a defensive back. Now, I don't care if Watts has dropped some balls, put him or Adams in when you are going to trying to run 3 wide and put Putz in the TE slot where he is much more effective.

Sorry if someone already complained out this, but I had to get it out of my system.

[errand]

You must not be too familiar with our head coach.

Let me introduce you to the man who once started a virtual rookie against the Dolphins in week one:

http://www.sportsecyclopedia.com/nfl/denver/ShanahanDen.jpg

...and that experiment led to what kind of great fortune?

[Rohirrim]

Plummer's breakout season? What are we talking about here - acne?

[DrFate]

How is it people watch the same game and see different things?

[Bronco9798]

sounds a lot like last year, where is the chemistry these guys are supposed to create?


I think Jake missed chemistry class.

[errand]

The man has no fear. He just wants to win. And if Jake isn't doing it for him, I wouldn't put it past him to pull the trigger on BVP to see if a few weeks on the bench will straighten Jake out.

The highlighted sentence is why you aren't thinking clearly....yeah, Mike wants to win. Which is why he's not stupid enough to play Van Pelt unless Jake get's injured.

And he knows as well as everyone on this freaking board knows, the QB on our roster who gives the Broncos the best chance to win games and make the playoffs is Jake Plummer.

If Van Pelt had shown Mike that he's anything more than a clipboard carrier.... then perhaps he'd be the gambler you call him and would have started Van Pelt this past week.

[errand]

How is it people watch the same game and see different things?

...because some of us know football...and others don't. :laugh:

[Circle Orange]

well, it IS a long season. As far as the picks by Jake go, the one that bothered me the most was on a (I think) rollout where he threw it straight into coverage. And the hail mary heave I can live with, but it still looked kinda careless like, "what the hell, everyone knows I'm just throwing it up".

This year more than any other will plot the future of Jake. A mediocre record with good stats won't cut it. :yep:

I think the only way the organization stays stable is if they win at least 10 games and make some noise in the playoffs. Otherwise, things could get pretty ugly thwack

[No1BroncoFan]

I think the only way the organization stays stable is if they win at least 10 games and make some noise in the playoffs. Otherwise, things could get pretty ugly thwack
Every time Shanny passes Bowlens office he should see a sign hanging on the door that says "Playoff win or bust." Every time Bowlen sees Shanny, he should remind him that a playoff win this season is mandatory. If Shanny can't win a playoff game for the seventh consecutive season he should be gone!

People keep pissing and moaning about Jake and seem to forget that he has more playoff wins than what Shanny has managed since Elway left. And, he did it with less talent around him than what he's got now.

If Shanny's such a fvcking mastermind then why hasn't this team done sh*t in over six years.

This year Shanny, this year!

Ben

[orange 4 life]

22 for 48 with 2 picks, looks like the same old Jake the Fake to me. :moon:

go take a long walk off a short pier.

its fans like you that tear apart the sea of orange and broncomania that used to run rampant in this town.

it was ONE game dude.
on top of that, BOTH the int's came in the 4th when the game was all but over.
one was 4th and ten when he had no choice but to hurl it up for grabs.

wouldnt it be nice if we didnt run a reeves like run, run, pass offense?

wouldnt it have been nice if lelie had caught that pass in the endzone? or not broke off his route on the early deep ball?

wouldnt it have been great if we couldve run the ball in the redzone?

or how about the third downs, which the first four were all over 7 yards.
wouldnt it have been great to be in third and SHORT yardage (the first short yardage was a 3rd and 1 and a completion to alexander)?

wouldnt it have been nice if our first THREE cornerbacks hadnt got hurt?

it was ONE stinking game.
one game that was poorly planned, prepared for, and played.
one game that EVERYONE is accountable for.
one game that has NO bearing on how plummers SEASON will turn out.

quit jumping to conclusions and jumping ship.
this game isnt one players fault. its on the whole team, and wait a few more weeks before judging that team and its quarterback.
go jake, go broncos.

jake

[ro_50]

Plummer's breakout season was back in 96 when he lead Arizona St. to the Rose Bowl and were seconds away from the national champ when they lost to THE Ohio St. University.

Come to think of it, that was the highlight of his career and he's regressed since (just kidding).

[GreatBronco16]

You know, if Denver can't start getting TDs in the redzone instead of FGs, then we might have to settle for the Mile High Salute to be done after field goals instead. :sickortir

[-Slap-]

How is it people watch the same game and see different things?

Free will? (http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/freewill/)

[Circle Orange]

Come to think of it, why did Jake have to throw 48 freaking times?!

[ro_50]

Jake threw the ball 48 times because we didnt have a running game.

Outside of Bell's 30-yard run, there were better running execution at the local Pop Warner game.

[watermock]

Good Lord. I must wipe the face of this spoil and flood it to make it's evil dominion perish from the face of the earth. This thread must die.

[fontaine]

I thought Jake looked horrid. I was ready to see BVP by the end of the third quarter. I don't know if BVP can play at this level, but he couldn't do any worse than Plummer was doing out there. I'm a big fan of the "if your veteran plays like a rookie, why not start the rookie" philosophy.

I completely agree. In the context of the first three quarters, I didn't see anything Plummer do (or failed to do) that BVP couldn't do either.

I've posted a lot of criticisms of Plummer based on his Miami game but in ALL of those posts I left out his play from the 4th quarter because the team was so far behind that he had to go for it. I'm not judging him on that.

But in the context of his play in the first three quarters when the game was still there to be had, I thought he constantly underthrew WRs, failed to find Jeb when he was open, and missed a ton of plays to open wideouts. He never looked comfortable and his first half passing was some of the worst I've seen from Denver in years.

I do know that he's a better QB than that and will play better but I've come to expect that Plummer will, four or five times a season have awful games. He'll play better, but the next time he repeats that Miami performance I'd rather Shanny put in BVP for a few series just to give Jake something to think about and let him know that he'll get kicked in the balls if he doesn't take his mistakes more seriously.

[fontaine]

Jake threw the ball 48 times because we didnt have a running game.

Outside of Bell's 30-yard run, there were better running execution at the local Pop Warner game.

You know, I've really struggled with people here heaping blame on our running game. Well let me apologize publicly for what I'm about to say in advance.

Screw all you dimwits who think the running game was part of the problem on Sunday. Anyone with a pulse and reasonable eyesight can watch the game again and see that Miami was stacking against the run. That is unless you only see what you want to. In that case you can go to hell. There, the mods can go ahead and ban me.

Miami's gameplan was to put 8 or more bodies in the box to clog the running lanes, keep shifting the LBs and Taylor to confuse Jake and see if Plummer could actually impersonate a QB and keep the chains moving.

Our running game suffered and will continue to suffer all season long because defenses know they can stack against the run and commit less players to the pass because Plummer is too erratic to take advantage of it. Our running game could have played better and play calling was certainly part of that problem I'll admit.

But the over-riding factor is that even if we execute great running plays, defenses will still be able to minimize our running game as long as Plummer can't force them into nickel and dime packages to defend the pass.

How often do you think defenses put in 8 men in the box for Brady, Manning, Culpeppar etc? The minute any defense lines up 8 in the box a good QB will audible to a pass play (if run was intended) and will have his burner WR go deep with another guy on the hot read so that he has at least two options and will make the defense regret the decision to stack against the run.

Any D-Coordinator would rather cut his balls off than do that against solid QBs but they can do it with impunity with Plummer because he's looked so bad impersonating a pocket passer.

[Spider]

I finaly watched the game .Half hearted , but still watched , Read every post here , 1 thing I saw was , no rhythm from the offense , This I will blame on Kubes/Shanny ...... When a QB starts out struggling , no Run Game , WR cant catch a cold , Kubes/Shanny needed to get tempo going , We had plenty of chances to put this game away .....
I still say we will have problems in the redzone untill we get power running ...... One thing is for sure our offense , is a hellva lot better then they showed vs the Dolphins .....
I still wonder if on Dayne is the answer ......

[listopencil]

I'm bumping this thread for mojo purposes.

[Bob's your Information Minister]

Heh...or jinxing purposes.

Funny stuff. I think my favorite part is Taco calling for BVP. ROFL!

[Rock Chalk]

1 game does not a season make.

[crush17]

ha ha nice.