"With the number 1 pick: The Broncos select Leinhart"

[fontaine]

Some pretty amusing stuff from http://www.footballoutsiders.com/ramblings.php?p=2632&cat=16

Washington Redskins
Draft Roundup
The Redskins were faced with a tough job this off-season. With over $16 million in dead money on the cap, Washington couldn’t make much noise in free agency. What little cap room they had was needed to re-sign their own players like Chris Samuels and Santana Moss to contract extensions. Washington would need to look to the draft to address their biggest weaknesses from 2004.

No weakness was more pronounced for the 2004 Redskins than at starting quarterback. Only Chicago, Miami, Arizona, and Atlanta had worse passing offenses than Washington did with Mark Brunell and Patrick Ramsey behind center. Without a drastic improvement at the quarterback position, the Redskins would have no chance to compete for a playoff spot in the wide-open NFC. Quarterback was therefore an obvious position for Washington to target in the first round.

But with over $5 million in cap space already committed to the quarterback position in 2005, Washington had to be smart about where they drafted their new QB. With only the number nine pick in the first round, the Redskins risked having both of the consensus top two quarterbacks taken before them. Without a second-round pick, Washington would be forced to either risk that the player they really wanted would drop to them in the third round, or reach for that player with the ninth pick and pay more than they really could afford to in order to fill out the position.

Shrewdly, Washington packaged a third round pick this year and two future draft picks to grab the 25th pick in this year’s draft from the Denver Broncos. With that pick, the Redskins knew that they would have a great chance at grabbing Auburn quarterback Jason Campbell, the player they really wanted all along. After leading Auburn to an undefeated season in his senior year, Campbell displayed the kind of winning attitude that Washington was severely lacking at the most important position on the football field. Plus, as a later first round selection, Campbell would demand a much more modest signing bonus than he would have if Washington selected him with the ninth overall pick. This gave Washington a little more flexibility with their rookie pool salary cap to address some other areas where they could stand to improve. With Campbell likely to take over from Ramsey and Brunell early on in the season, Washington is poised to make a big run in the NFC this fall.

How was that? Are you convinced? Yeah, me neither. As hard as I might try to create a decent argument, I still have no idea what the hell Washington was doing by trading three draft picks so they could add yet another quarterback to their roster.

_i_O_i_

And it’s not like they’re grabbing Peyton Manning here, either. A year ago, you’d be hard pressed to find people who thought Campbell would be drafted at all, let alone in the first round. But thanks to great years from his two running backs and his defense, Campbell was put in a great position to succeed in 2004 and didn’t waste the opportunity.

This team has holes all over their lineup because of player departures (linebacker, cornerback, wide receiver), injuries (linebacker, offensive line), and potential holdouts (any player with “College: Miami (Fla.)” on their player page). Yet, Washington decides to trade away three picks, including their first-rounder next year, to add someone to the one position where they arguably had the most depth. Washington’s draft day war room better be in an undisclosed bunker somewhere next season, because I wouldn’t want to be in a crowd of 10,000 Redskin fans when Denver selects Matt Leinart with the number one pick of the 2006 draft.

Post-Draft
Washington is reportedly negotiating with recently cut former Chicago Bear defensive back R.W. McQuarters. Only Washington would try to spend their remaining 68 cents of cap space on a cornerback, where they already have Shaun Springs, Walt Harris, and first round pick Carlos Rogers. The Redskins brought in a number of undrafted rookie free agents, including Princeton linebacker Zak Keasey. Somewhat coincidentally, Keasey played on the same Princeton team as Redskin assistant head coach/defense Gregg Williams’ son.

FredEx Update
What would an NFC East edition of Four Downs be without a mention of future Toronto Argonaut star wide receiver Freddie Mitchell. The People’s Champ was finally let go by Philadelphia after the draft. So, what is the FredEx update doing in the Washington section? Well, the Redskins are one of a few teams that have been rumored to have interest in signing the outspoken former first round pick. Just what Washington needs.

[fontaine]

Predraft Report from said website:

Washington Redskins
Free Agency Roundup
When you have $16 million in dead money on your cap, you’re not going to make too much noise in free agency. But your players will make some noise as they leave for more money elsewhere or talk to the media about their unhappiness in Washington. Coming in are center Casey Rabach and wide receivers Santana Moss and David Patten. Gone are LB Antonio Pierce, CB Fred Smoot and the traded WR Laveraneus Coles. Making noise about their frustrations with their current contracts and/or the way they have been treated by the Redskins are Lavar Arrington, Sean Taylor, and Moss.

Since the Redskins had the fifth-worst offensive DVOA last season, you would think they might want to do more than adding a center and an aging wide receiver. But Washington destroyed any chance they had at making additions during free agency when they swapped Coles for the inferior Moss, taking a $9 million cap hit in the exchange. If the Redskins are going to make big improvements to their offensive personnel, it will have to be done through the draft.

Draft Outlook
Although Washington could use players pretty much everywhere on offense, it’s highly unlikely the Redskins will pick anyone other than a cornerback with the #9 pick in the draft. The strength of the Washington defense in 2004 was their ability to shut down opponent’s top receivers. After losing Smoot to free agency, Washington needs to draft someone who can step in and start opposite Shawn Springs. Either Pac Man Jones or Antrel Rolle will find themselves wearing maroon and gold in 2005.

In the off chance that neither is available at #9, the Redskins could try to trade down to pick up additional picks. Joe Gibbs has hinted that the Redskins could be interested in picking up a linebacker to fill in for the departed Pierce and still recovering Arrington. There should be plenty of decent linebackers in the middle to the end of the first round for Washington to choose from if they can find a trading partner.

Washington doesn’t have a second round pick, so unless they make a trade, they’ll have 67 picks worth of time to decide who to take at #76. The Redskins almost have to go with offense here, with offensive line being the teams’ biggest need. With Jon Jansen attempting to come back from a ruptured Achilles tendon and 83-year old Ray Brown re-signed for another season, Washington could use some young depth at the tackle position. I’d look for Washington to grab Florida State’s Ray Willis here.

Recent Draft History
Despite having only seven picks over the past two seasons, the Redskins managed to draft three players who should be starting for them in 2005. Last year’s first round pick Sean Taylor was impressive at safety, but is currently sitting out trying to negotiate a new deal to replace the one he signed less than a year ago. Tight end Chris Cooley was a nice pickup in round three and should be a bigger part of the Redskins’ offense in 2005. 2003 third-round pick Derrick Dockery has started at left guard since Week 7 of his rookie year.

Maybe these past two drafts have been so successful because Washington had so few picks to concentrate on each year. They certainly fared much better with only seven picks over two years than they did with ten picks in 2002. Only first round pick Patrick Ramsey is expected to start for Washington this season. The Redskins did manage to grab two decent backup running backs in Ladell Betts and Rock Cartwright, although they won’t really reap the reward from the underrated Cartwright if they won’t put him on the field. The less said about their other seven selections the better.

[Northman]

I dont know why we would take Leinart, we already have our Qb of the future according to some.

[Traveler]

I'm a big believer in karma. With so many folks already saying we'll get a top ten choice next year, the odds of that happening don't seem too good. Can we please stop "counting our chickens before they're hatched?" :pray:

[fontaine]

I don't care. I just hope the Redskins season goes down in burgundy and gold flames.

It's been a nice start with trading Cole for Moss, Sean Taylor holding out, Arrington publicly lambasting the organisation, and a draft which yielded only one player who could immediately help them in Rogers. The QB is a questionable pick, and the rest of the draft was spend on RBs/LBs when they already have Portis.

[fontaine]

I'm a big believer in karma. With so many folks already saying we'll get a top ten choice next year, the odds of that happening don't seem too good. Can we please stop "counting our chickens before they're hatched?" :pray:

NO! It's got nothing to do with Karma and everything to do with my hatred for the redskins. Hoping for a top ten pick is yet another reason to root against them, and definitely not the only one.

[RhymesayersDU]

NO! It's got nothing to do with Karma and everything to do with my hatred for the redskins. Hoping for a top ten pick is yet another reason to root against them, and definitely not the only one.

hahah, same here! One of my best friends from high school is a diehard Deadskins fan, and I love seeing him squirm every year. The year they went 8-0 to start and then still missed the playoffs, oh man, that was a meltdown of epic proportions.

[Garcia Bronco]

hahah, same here! One of my best friends from high school is a diehard Deadskins fan, and I love seeing him squirm every year. The year they went 8-0 to start and then still missed the playoffs, oh man, that was a meltdown of epic proportions.


They went 7-1

[Mediator12]

Actually, this would be an unbelieveable position to be in next year. If they were to end up with a first they would probably trade down a few spots for more picks and more trades IMHO. Get as many Good players as possible next year in the older positions. Rodrique Wright or Mathias Kiwanuka as a young Pryce replacement and best player available later. They could have two first's and two second's in a move down next year in a deep draft. Or they could have the player of choice that Shanahan has never been able to do in a draft since he has been here.

[Taco John]

The Redskins fans have been in the same position. They traded Sean Gilbert to Carolina for a first rounder. They sure as hell rooted against the Panthers that year.

[Taco John]

Actually, this would be an unbelieveable position to be in next year. If they were to end up with a first they would probably trade down a few spots for more picks and more trades IMHO.



No way baby...

http://img122.exs.cx/img122/818/fattyleinartbig7fi14wl.gif


Number Eleven or Bust!

[Northman]

No way baby...

http://img122.exs.cx/img122/818/fattyleinartbig7fi14wl.gif


Number Eleven or Bust!


we dont need number 11. we got jake. :~ohyah!:

[watermock]

Denver will get a top 5 pick next year.

If Portis goes down like the rented mule Gibbs thinks he is, we are looking at close to the top of the draft.

It has been said...let it be done...

16 million of dead money, and we are eating IHOP.

How amusing.

[watermock]

I've allready called Wal-Mart to hold a new computer for me on draft day.

This place is going to buzz regardless of what happens.

Meck77's Bus has to take the cake for most outrageous. You talk about making a silk purse out of sows ear, we all saw it.

We are all salivating over next years draft allready.

We have a zillion question marks, All the way down the line. It's comical.

All the way from Jake to Hape...

I know this much. To think that Shanahan will walk away at this point is ludicrous. He's got it totally whipped in his mansion on Cherry Creek Golf Course.

When I see Shanahan non-motivated, then he has to walk away.

As you know, I'm not a big fan of Pubiak, but Shanahan has loyalty, and hopefully, our offense won't have to count on the Great White Hape in the redzone with Rice and Putz (hopefully) on the field.

Kubiaks redzone playcalling has been an issue for several years.

The press can bash all they want about picking up MoC and Rice, but a triumverate of Rod Smith, Rice, and MoC, sprinkle in some Lelie....and the ability of Plummer to move...I like our chances better than the pundits.

Jerry Rice doesn't have to be "open" to catch the ball.

[Needa Pass Rush]

Denver will get a top 5 pick next year.

If Portis goes down like the rented mule Gibbs thinks he is, we are looking at close to the top of the draft.

It has been said...let it be done...

16 million of dead money, and we are eating IHOP.

How amusing.

The 'Skins owe us next years #1 to atone for not locking up IHOP to a contract early so we didn't have a chance to sign him. Bastids!

[Traveler]

The 'Skins owe us next years #1 to atone for not locking up IHOP to a contract early so we didn't have a chance to sign him. Bastids!


LOL

Other than getting jinxed, my only concern is that Shanahan will pull off one of his head scratching picks with the choice from the Skins, no matter if it's a high choice or not.

[watermock]

Washington took a QB with our pick. That isn't going to show dividends next year. They have Santana Moss under a rediculous contract and lost Coles.

They can't keep pounding Portis in a scheme that is totally wrong, he's going to break eventually, altho he too a brutal beating last year. You can't say Portis doesn't try, I just wonder how long the guy can hold up. Portis has to be frustrated, but he's got his aquarium bedroom, so how can he bitch?

Maybe it's wishfull thinking, but I don't even think Gibbs heart is in his job, I think he wants to go back to NASCAR. He allready has said as much. I think he is honoring his contract, but I don't really think his heart is in it.

When I said San Fransisco might go without a win, I was close.

With Philly..(TO will play, he's just posturing), and Dallas improved, Washington might win two games in their division.

Both Champ Bailey and Smoot are gone.

If Portis breaks down, this team could go 3-13.

[watermock]

LOL

Other than getting jinxed, my only concern is that Shanahan will pull off one of his head scratching picks with the choice from the Skins, no matter if it's a high choice or not.

Exactly. We are allready wringing our hands over the draft, and it's not even training camp.

I think we allready know who Taco wants.

This year, above no other watching Denver, it's a three ring circus.

So far, other than Alexander, it's full steam ahead.

I like it. I like the transitions. Let them fight like cats in the street.

I look up and down the roster and the weakness is in the secondary. Maybe backup QB.

anyone have a word on any big name releases today?

[Garcia Bronco]

Leinhart has bust written all over him...but he's still got a year to go.

[Jason in LA]

From the article:

With Campbell likely to take over from Ramsey and Brunell early on in the season, Washington is poised to make a big run in the NFC this fall.



That should go into Mock's homer thread. Rookie QBs take their lumps, not lead their team to the playoffs. Of course there are exceptions to the rule. Ben Rothlesburger (I'm sure I spelt that wrong) did well, but he had a very good team around him. Most rookie QBs don't have that, and struggle. Campbell won't have that. So why would anybody thing he's going to lead them on a big run?

[Traveler]

Leinhart has bust written all over him...but he's still got a year to go.


Leinart is more pure pocket passer, correct? If that's the case, he doesn't fit our system. We remember the SOB experiment all to well! Please, no Leinart!

[Jason in LA]

Can we please stop "counting our chickens before they're hatched?" :pray:

Going into last year I thought the Chargers were going to make a run at 0-16. They dropped their "talented" players and took the cap hit right then. I didn't see how they could compete.

Point is, we never know what might happen.

[Traveler]

Going into last year I thought the Chargers were going to make a run at 0-16. They dropped their "talented" players and took the cap hit right then. I didn't see how they could compete.

Point is, we never know what might happen.


Exactly! REP!

[scorpio]

http://www.digicana.com/monkeyeats.jpg

[Atlas]

I dont know why we would take Leinart, we already have our Qb of the future according to some.

If Leinart is available you grab him. Or of course you could trade him away for a bounty of picks.

[Ray Finkle]

http://www.digicana.com/monkeyeats.jpg

??? :saywhat:

[DBroncos4life]

Leinart is more pure pocket passer, correct? If that's the case, he doesn't fit our system. We remember the SOB experiment all to well! Please, no Leinart!



See while other teams win while building there team AROUND the QB we struggle to build a QB around the OLine. Hmmmmm I wonder why?

[yavoon]

Actually, this would be an unbelieveable position to be in next year. If they were to end up with a first they would probably trade down a few spots for more picks and more trades IMHO. Get as many Good players as possible next year in the older positions. Rodrique Wright or Mathias Kiwanuka as a young Pryce replacement and best player available later. They could have two first's and two second's in a move down next year in a deep draft. Or they could have the player of choice that Shanahan has never been able to do in a draft since he has been here.

I think u have to take leinhart. now I dont know if he will be as good as billed. but when u have a chance at a franchise qb u jump in and take. u dont gamble that position out on filling out other things.

[Play2win]

Leinart is more pure pocket passer, correct? If that's the case, he doesn't fit our system. We remember the SOB experiment all to well! Please, no Leinart!

Actually I think he could fit our system very well. Not our past, mobile only QB system. (it is changing) Our current system. Here's why:

Leinart's game is all about accuracy. Short, Medium and deep ACCURACY. Many times he delivers the ball just before a defender delivers a blow or makes a play. Somewhat like, but different, than Brady. But with Leinart, its all about accuracy.

With the WRs and TEs we have we can really do some damage across the whole football field if we had someone that would get the ball to the right person with a high degree of accuracy. Jake does the best he can. Lienart, would do a better job. His accuracy is extremely good.

There is a reason USC has been able to run the type of Offense they have the last few years. QB play. Carson Palmer finally got it (finally got the Good coaching) and Lienart pretty much stepped right in. Its a great system, but the QBs have got to perform. Especially on the deep through. Those two, over the last couple of year, have displayed an uncanny down the field accuracy, and the ability to connect on the deep throw.

The big question with Leinart is how he will deal with the SPEED of the PRO GAME, and how will adjust to the NFL PASS RUSH.

I think we are changing some of our philosophies on the O-LINE. And if we are going to get Leinart we definitely will have to change some things. But we are ALREADY changing those things. I think our line is in transition become a much bigger, still athletic O-Line. I think one main reason is in today's NFL size and serious strength to with stand the NFL pass rushes of today.

I welcome to, again, see the Quick-Slant, the Medium-Slant and the Deep-Slant. I believe these are the types of passes Leinart could excel at delivering. I think Shanahan envisions alittle more of a WCO here, partly because of the new DB rules, and Leinart is someone that could deliver that in a big way.

But it all comes down to our pass blocking ability and Leinart's ability to deal with a REAL pass rush. If Shanahan can manage our Pass-blocking with Leinart's abilities effectively it could be a real good match. But thats a big IF, and that why I will studying him more this year than in many years. Really it is going to all depend on how he performs THIS YEAR.

[RhymesayersDU]

That should go into Mock's homer thread. Rookie QBs take their lumps, not lead their team to the playoffs. Of course there are exceptions to the rule. Ben Rothlesburger (I'm sure I spelt that wrong) did well, but he had a very good team around him. Most rookie QBs don't have that, and struggle. Campbell won't have that. So why would anybody thing he's going to lead them on a big run?

Exactly. My boy has been telling me all these reports about how Campbell is a stud, Washington got a steal in the draft, etc... And that's all well and good, but as for this year, which is the only one we care about, they're not going to be that good.

Plus, their division is tough. Philly will beat them twice. I think the Giants will split with them, maybe beat them twice, depending on how Eli is coming along. Dallas will probably split with them, again, there's at least a decent possibility of Dallas beating them twice.

Plus, they have a bye week in week 3, which could spell trouble from them down the stretch. I get the whole "don't count your chickens before they're hatched" deal, but the Skins don't have a quarterback, and their schedule does them no favors.

[Rascal]

So do we take Leinart with our #1 pick, or do we trade down 3 spots and get an all pro offensive tackle or an all pro defensive tackle? Decisions, decisions, decisions.

[RhymesayersDU]

So do we take Leinart with our #1 pick, or do we trade down 3 spots and get an all pro offensive tackle or an all pro defensive tackle? Decisions, decisions, decisions.

If Jake turns out to be the guy this year, and we don't need a QB, I'd love to see us draft somebody solid on the D-Line that we could watch, coach, etc and turn into a stud.

Edit: Or we could always draft three CB's... That works too. ;)

[Rascal]

They don't have a QB and they don't have a WR. Santana Moss is about as worthless as Bob.

[DrFate]

Assuming the Skins are really bad this year the whole Mane will devolve into 2 camps

"Leinart or bust"

and

"Leinart is a bust"

Taco will be team captain for the pro-Leinart brigade.

Oh, the humanity...

[Atlas]

They don't have a QB and they don't have a WR. Santana Moss is about as worthless as Bob.

If I was Moss I would file slander charges on you for that one.

[Play2win]

Assuming the Skins are really bad this year the whole Mane will devolve into 2 camps

"Leinart or bust"

and

"Leinart is a bust"

Taco will be team captain for the pro-Leinart brigade.

Oh, the humanity...

what about the Camp:

"Leinarts got to prove it this year, first."

[Garcia Bronco]

What has Leinhart done in college? Beat sub-standard west coast teams and over-hyped central teams. Has he won the ACC? I don't think so.


(stir)

[Ballhawk]

What has Leinhart done in college? Beat sub-standard west coast teams and over-hyped central teams. Has he won the ACC? I don't think so.


(stir)

Im not that high on Leinhart either.

With Jake set to play 3 more years, we could trade away our 1st again for a 2007 1st and a 2nd rounder in 2006.

Put off the Franchise QB for another year.

[TheReverend]

We'll trade our #1 overall next year for 4 overall and a late first rounder... oh this could be such a good year

[SoCalBronco]

Id be firmly on Telluride's Fire Shanny bandwagon if we spend either first or our second on Leinart (yes, i know he wont drop that far but even if he did). Throwing away a third is merely par for the course so i could live with that.

[Arkie]

Strike the enemy's groin with an open mouth, jaw locked in the Tiger Fang style or Hungry Squirrel Position. The impact will lift the enemy off the ground. Yikes!

[Taco John]

Actually I think he could fit our system very well. Not our past, mobile only QB system. (it is changing) Our current system. Here's why:

Leinart's game is all about accuracy. Short, Medium and deep ACCURACY. Many times he delivers the ball just before a defender delivers a blow or makes a play. Somewhat like, but different, than Brady. But with Leinart, its all about accuracy.

With the WRs and TEs we have we can really do some damage across the whole football field if we had someone that would get the ball to the right person with a high degree of accuracy. Jake does the best he can. Lienart, would do a better job. His accuracy is extremely good.

There is a reason USC has been able to run the type of Offense they have the last few years. QB play. Carson Palmer finally got it (finally got the Good coaching) and Lienart pretty much stepped right in. Its a great system, but the QBs have got to perform. Especially on the deep through. Those two, over the last couple of year, have displayed an uncanny down the field accuracy, and the ability to connect on the deep throw.

The big question with Leinart is how he will deal with the SPEED of the PRO GAME, and how will adjust to the NFL PASS RUSH.

I think we are changing some of our philosophies on the O-LINE. And if we are going to get Leinart we definitely will have to change some things. But we are ALREADY changing those things. I think our line is in transition become a much bigger, still athletic O-Line. I think one main reason is in today's NFL size and serious strength to with stand the NFL pass rushes of today.

I welcome to, again, see the Quick-Slant, the Medium-Slant and the Deep-Slant. I believe these are the types of passes Leinart could excel at delivering. I think Shanahan envisions alittle more of a WCO here, partly because of the new DB rules, and Leinart is someone that could deliver that in a big way.

But it all comes down to our pass blocking ability and Leinart's ability to deal with a REAL pass rush. If Shanahan can manage our Pass-blocking with Leinart's abilities effectively it could be a real good match. But thats a big IF, and that why I will studying him more this year than in many years. Really it is going to all depend on how he performs THIS YEAR.


Boy, I couldn't have said it any better myself... From Leinart's accuracy, to our growing trend of bigger Oline-men... We are making changes.

[GoHAM]

Leinart is just waiting to be the next in a long list of Heisman QB busts.

C Palmer may be the exception to the list, as he looked decent in '04.

[Taco John]

Im not that high on Leinhart either.

With Jake set to play 3 more years, we could trade away our 1st again for a 2007 1st and a 2nd rounder in 2006.

Put off the Franchise QB for another year.



Jake isn't set to play three more years. He's got two and he's gone.

Hear me now and believe me later. Jake will be cut in June 2007.

We need a QBOTF period...

[listopencil]

Monkey Eats The Peach. Brutal. Effective, but brutal.

[GoHAM]

I knew there was a reason why i don't like peaches.

[SoCalBronco]

Jake isn't set to play three more years. He's got two and he's gone.

Hear me now and believe me later. Jake will be cut in June 2007.

We need a QBOTF period...

OK Taco, lets accept this as true. Wouldnt we be better off, if we had to select a QB in Round 1 this year with a guy like Vincent Young of Texas as opposed to Leinart. Young is very mobile, which fits our system, has great athletic ability, is accurate, and has a very good arm. He also can take over games by himself. Now to be sure, your boy Leinart is more polished as a pure dropback passer, but Young took a big leap from last year to this year. He just took over games and started tearing apart good defenses like Michigan in the Rose Bowl. Leinart cannot make plays by himself and has very limited upside. He is smart and pretty accurate, but he has no mobility and even last year i saw him play several below average games...against mediocre competition. He looked very poor in the first half against clubs like Stanford and Notre Dame. He did not look good against UCLA or Virginia Tech. Another problem with Matt is that i think, while he is a good decisionmaker, he can get rattled and thrown off kilter. There are two other problems. First, he hasnt played in a pro style offense. You might say, what a minute, USC under Coach Norm Chow ran a sophisticated passing offense but thats not quite true. Dating back to his BYU days, Chow's offense has always been very, very simple. The core of the passing game is a set of 10 passes, thats it. Just 10, with some tags and different formations. And these are concepts that have been around since the beginning of time. Strong side floods, weak side floods, option routes, mesh routes, middle routes. They do alot of repetition and teach it well but the offense itself is not sophisticated at all and the playbook is barely 100 pages. That is a far cry from a complex NFL playbook. To be fair to Matt though, because he is a bright guy, i dont think this is a bar to his future or anything but it is definitely a question mark at least. The other problem is that Matt has always benefitted from great talent around him, going back to HS.
I think if had to pick a QB next year in Round 1, which is something i dont really want to do, i would go for the more raw, but far more talented Vincent Young as opposed to Leinart. Right now, i do not have either ranked as first round talents (see the College Football forum "Top 5 guys for the Broncos" thread for my top 32 currently) but i think Young is an early second in my book, and with his expected progression in technique he will vault himself into at least the middle of round 1.

I understand your frustrated with Jake and all, but if we are too pick a franchise QB, i think the 2007 draft would be far better for QBs, with my eye on Brian Brohm of Louisville or, if early indications from spring are accurate, my boy Kyle Wright from the U. But Brohm is very special.

[Tombstone RJ]

Vince Young, he's my pick if the Broncos take a QB in round one next draft.

[Clockwork Orange]

Leinart would need to get real mobile real fast if he wanted to survive behind this Broncos O-line that isn't exactly known for stellar pass blocking.

Say what you will about Plummer, his legs make him a nice fit for the system here. I'd prefer our QBOTF to be one who can scramble or cut & run if the situation calls for it.

[Taco John]

What kind of decision-maker is Vince Young?

If he makes decisions like Steve Young, I'm all upons...

But everybody already knows what kind of decisionmaker Lienart is, especially when he's comfortable with the offense. And if Shanahan and Kubiak have shown anything with their development of Jake is that they learned from past mistakes, and can limit the offense to take advantage of a quarterback's weaknesses.

Lienart isn't the most mobile quarterbck, you're right. But he's at least as mobile as Elway was his last two years with the team. And mobility isn't everything, as proven by guys like Plummer and Vick. I'd rather see us invest in the kind of offensive linemen we had in the Elway days (ala. Zimmerman, T-Jones, and Schlereth), and find a quarterback who is accurate and can make the deep throw than a guy who needs a lot of polish, and can scramble with the best of them. I think that the book on scramblers is written, and it's that big time scramblers make big time mistakes when under pressure. With, of course, the exceptions of the great Steve Young (who was his OC, btw?) and even greater John Elway.

More than that, I see intangibles in Lienart that you can't coach. There is an air of confidence in this kid that I think is contagious. But we'll see. This season is going to be a huge test of this kid's character and poise, because no one in college is going to have more pressure on them.

I'll be open to evaluating other movers and shakers this year. But there is no other quarterback in the college game who has played as consistently as Lienart for the amount of time that he has... And that's consistently at such a high level that he could walk away from the college game as the most accomplished college QB in the history of the game...

[Tombstone RJ]

Boy, I couldn't have said it any better myself... From Leinart's accuracy, to our growing trend of bigger Oline-men... We are making changes.

Griese was accurate too, but very immobile. Shanny didn't go to bigger olinemen to help SOB out, what makes you think he is getting bigger olineman now for Leinart?

I think Shanny will only take bigger olineman if they are as fast as the smaller olineman, and can get to the second level as fast as smaller olineman. I think that is one reason the Broncos took Foster because they felt he had quicker mobility than some other tackles in that draft.

Still, a mobil QB is paramount to winning in Shanny's system. Think of the two QB's that Shanny won SBs with: Elway and Young. Both mobil, both were smart, and both could make great throws in and out of the pocket.

If Vince Young puts together a great year at Texas, he could be the perfect QB for the Broncos. Leinart is nice, but if he can't avoid a sack, he's gonna be very mediocre and inconsistent in the Broncos system.

[Taco John]

Griese was accurate too, but very immobile. Shanny didn't go to bigger olinemen to help SOB out, what makes you think he is getting bigger olineman now for Leinart?


Uh... There's been a shift toward bigger linemen for a couple years now...

[Hercules Rockefeller]

Might not be Leinhart and it might not be with the higher of the 2 1sts, but the Broncos are going to select a QB in the 1st next year. The lower 1st is going to be a pure potential pick too.

[epicSocialism4tw]

I would love to see Young or McNeal from A&M in orange and blue. Brad Smith from Missou is also another one to keep an eye on. If Young has a solid year for the Longhorns, you might not hear too much more about Leinart. Young has Vick ability for sure. He has a monster arm and open field elusiveness. He just needs to learn to play smart and accurate.

[Taco John]

I'm not going to rule out Young...

But Lienart is my boy. In fact, I'm going to watch the Orange Bowl tonight... ;D

[FADERPROOF]

OK Taco, lets accept this as true. Wouldnt we be better off, if we had to select a QB in Round 1 this year with a guy like Vincent Young of Texas as opposed to Leinart. Young is very mobile, which fits our system, has great athletic ability, is accurate, and has a very good arm. He also can take over games by himself. Now to be sure, your boy Leinart is more polished as a pure dropback passer, but Young took a big leap from last year to this year. He just took over games and started tearing apart good defenses like Michigan in the Rose Bowl. Leinart cannot make plays by himself and has very limited upside. He is smart and pretty accurate, but he has no mobility and even last year i saw him play several below average games...against mediocre competition. He looked very poor in the first half against clubs like Stanford and Notre Dame. He did not look good against UCLA or Virginia Tech. Another problem with Matt is that i think, while he is a good decisionmaker, he can get rattled and thrown off kilter. There are two other problems. First, he hasnt played in a pro style offense. You might say, what a minute, USC under Coach Norm Chow ran a sophisticated passing offense but thats not quite true. Dating back to his BYU days, Chow's offense has always been very, very simple. The core of the passing game is a set of 10 passes, thats it. Just 10, with some tags and different formations. And these are concepts that have been around since the beginning of time. Strong side floods, weak side floods, option routes, mesh routes, middle routes. They do alot of repetition and teach it well but the offense itself is not sophisticated at all and the playbook is barely 100 pages. That is a far cry from a complex NFL playbook. To be fair to Matt though, because he is a bright guy, i dont think this is a bar to his future or anything but it is definitely a question mark at least. The other problem is that Matt has always benefitted from great talent around him, going back to HS.
I think if had to pick a QB next year in Round 1, which is something i dont really want to do, i would go for the more raw, but far more talented Vincent Young as opposed to Leinart. Right now, i do not have either ranked as first round talents (see the College Football forum "Top 5 guys for the Broncos" thread for my top 32 currently) but i think Young is an early second in my book, and with his expected progression in technique he will vault himself into at least the middle of round 1.

I understand your frustrated with Jake and all, but if we are too pick a franchise QB, i think the 2007 draft would be far better for QBs, with my eye on Brian Brohm of Louisville or, if early indications from spring are accurate, my boy Kyle Wright from the U. But Brohm is very special.


You lost me at "Vince Young is accurate." He is accurate as long as he tucks the ball, doesn't throw, and runs, but when he lets it go, only God knows where it is going to end up.

[Play2win]

You lost me at "Vince Young is accurate." He is accurate as long as he tucks the ball, doesn't throw, and runs, but when he lets it go, only God knows where it is going to end up.
Yeah, I was wondering what Vince Young he was talking about, because it sure wasn't the one that I was watching last year.

[Taco John]

You lost me at "Vince Young is accurate." He is accurate as long as he tucks the ball, doesn't throw, and runs, but when he lets it go, only God knows where it is going to end up.


Vince Young

http://www.nflfuture.com/vinceyoung.html

[SoCalBronco]

You lost me at "Vince Young is accurate." He is accurate as long as he tucks the ball, doesn't throw, and runs, but when he lets it go, only God knows where it is going to end up.

I thought he improved as the season went on in the area of mechanics and accuracy and stuff. He is obviously not as accurate as Leinart but he is more accurate than say Chris Leak. Its adequate and it will get better. I know Young is raw, which is why i do not have him in my top 32 in the other thread yet, but he has great ability and is improving rapidly.

[FADERPROOF]

Vince Young

http://www.nflfuture.com/vinceyoung.html

I know all about Vince Young, don't need to read an instruction manual on the guy.

But please, check out what Jeremy Osborne says his weaknesses are:

Vince must develop his passing skills. That is what makes a NFL quarterback of course. He seems to have a very strong arm, and looks almost effortless in throwing the football, but he must prove he can make plays in the air. Once he gets that down he will also have to prove he is a great leader and competitor. That is one of the major questions I have of him, does he have a nasty side to him?
---------------------------------------------------

[FADERPROOF]

I thought he improved as the season went on in the area of mechanics and accuracy and stuff. He is obviously not as accurate as Leinart but he is more accurate than say Chris Leak. Its adequate and it will get better. I know Young is raw, which is why i do not have him in my top 32 in the other thread yet, but he has great ability and is improving rapidly.

I saw some improvement, but I'm not ready to call him accurate yet. He has a nice arm and can throw a deep ball, but arm strength doesn't mean much if he is overthrowing his receivers.

[Taco John]

I won't rule him out. Giving him the benefit of a doubt, I'll compare him to the extreme in this league and say he's the next Michael Vick. On the other side, let's project Matt in the other extreme, giving him the full benefit of a doubt that we're giving Young, and say that Leinart is the next Peyton Manning... Style-wise, I don't think we're very far off... And as far as pedigree goes, aside from Peyton's name, you've got to think that Leinart and Manning rank pretty competitively against eachother in their scouting reports coming out of college.

So ultimately this is a question of, "giving what you know now, would you rather have Peyton Manning or Michael Vick in the Broncos offense?" Yes, it's a presumptuous question. Sure it probably puts each guy in a little box that they don't want to be in. I'm sure it's entirely unfair. But what the hell? Why not?

And I'll tell you what... I'm taking Peyton Manning.

[Play2win]

I won't rule him out. Giving him the benefit of a doubt, I'll compare him to the extreme in this league and say he's the next Michael Vick. On the other side, let's project Matt in the other extreme, giving him the full benefit of a doubt that we're giving Young, and say that Leinart is the next Peyton Manning... Style-wise, I don't think we're very far off... And as far as pedigree goes, aside from Peyton's name, you've got to think that Leinart and Manning rank pretty competitively against eachother in their scouting reports coming out of college.

So ultimately this is a question of, "giving what you know now, would you rather have Peyton Manning or Michael Vick in the Broncos offense?" Yes, it's a presumptuous question. Sure it probably puts each guy in a little box that they don't want to be in. I'm sure it's entirely unfair. But what the hell? Why not?

And I'll tell you what... I'm taking Peyton Manning.

Yeah, I would definitely take Pay-Me-A-Ton also.
(if given the choice)

[epicSocialism4tw]

Yeah, I would definitely take Pay-Me-A-Ton also.
(if given the choice)

Vick is constantly hurt, but that is a tough choice anyhow.

[Billy Clyde Puckett]

So do we take Leinart with our #1 pick, or do we trade down 3 spots and get an all pro offensive tackle or an all pro defensive tackle? Decisions, decisions, decisions.

I pick door number two. Can never have enough Big Guys.

[Billy Clyde Puckett]

I would love to see Young or McNeal from A&M in orange and blue. Brad Smith from Missou is also another one to keep an eye on. If Young has a solid year for the Longhorns, you might not hear too much more about Leinart. Young has Vick ability for sure. He has a monster arm and open field elusiveness. He just needs to learn to play smart and accurate.


McNeal in the mid rounds - maybe.
Brad Smith - no way - has half the talent of VanPelt and half the brain of Ron Mexico.

[Play2win]

I pick door number two. Can never have enough Big Guys.

Ha-HA!! Except on this message board!!!

J/K ;D

[epicSocialism4tw]

McNeal in the mid rounds - maybe.
Brad Smith - no way - has half the talent of VanPelt and half the brain of Ron Mexico.


McNeal will go first day. So will Brad Smith. Both of those guys have enormous upside and McNeal is the closest thing to McNabb to come out in a while.

[SpringStein]

I think u have to take leinhart. now I dont know if he will be as good as billed. but when u have a chance at a franchise qb u jump in and take. u dont gamble that position out on filling out other things.

Agree! How often do we get a chance to get a franchise QB? I doubt Young will come out after his junior year, if the history for UT players is any indication. Here are 4 of the top QB's as of right now. At this point a pretty big drop-off from the top 2. No one is talking about Omar Jacobs - it's going to be interesting to follow his development this year.

1 Matt Leinart Sr. USC 6-5 225
2 Omar Jacobs Jr. Bowling Green 6-3 230
3 Paul Pinegar Sr. Fresno State 6-4 220
4 Reggie McNeal Sr. Texas A&M 6-2 210

[ozomulsion]

McNeal will go first day. So will Brad Smith. Both of those guys have enormous upside and McNeal is the closest thing to McNabb to come out in a while.

A lot of people just don't realize how good McNeil is. Smith has a chance to make it as well. I just don't see him being as good as McNeil. I don't see Young being as good as either of those two. All three will be gone by round 2 at the latest.

[dbroncos31]

plummer will have a great year, and we will all forget about leinert and draft D'Brickashaw with the 2nd pick, followed by Devin Hester with the 32nd. i can dream, can't i?

[SoCalBronco]

plummer will have a great year, and we will all forget about leinert and draft D'Brickashaw with the 2nd pick, followed by Devin Hester with the 32nd. i can dream, can't i?

id love to have Devin as a Bronco. If he came out next year, he would undoubtedly be the best overall athlete in the draft, but he has a long way to go to become a polished cornerback. I was disappointed that he didnt make alot of strides in the spring.

[DB-Freak]

id love to have Devin as a Bronco. If he came out next year, he would undoubtedly be the best overall athlete in the draft, but he has a long way to go to become a polished cornerback. I was disappointed that he didnt make alot of strides in the spring.
Doesnt he play WR and returner too?

[baja]

We will not need a high # 1 next year I say we trade it back to Washington for their 1 and 2 in 07

[SoCalBronco]

Doesnt he play WR and returner too?

He played WR in 2003 but he was moved to corner in 04. Yes, he is an electric returner. Had 4 or 5 TDs in the return game last year.

[DB-Freak]

He played WR in 2003 but he was moved to corner in 04. Yes, he is an electric returner. Had 4 or 5 TDs in the return game last year.
Is he deltha like?

[SoCalBronco]

Is he deltha like?

No. He is 10x the athlete Deltha was and as we know Deltha was pretty athletic. Also, he doesnt fall apart and lose confidence when things go bad like Deltha did. He is pretty confident. Devin is a real ballhawking playmaker and had a couple INTs last year as the nickel corner. But he is raw as a corner prospect. Although they moved him from WR to CB last year, they put in special packages where he played RB and WR at times last year and he made plays. He is absolutely awesome in the return game. Rolle said he is the best athlete ever to play at Miami. But he does need alot of work in his techniques at corner.

[DB-Freak]

No. He is 10x the athlete Deltha was and as we know Deltha was pretty athletic. Also, he doesnt fall apart and lose confidence when things go bad like Deltha did. He is pretty confident. Devin is a real ballhawking playmaker and had a couple INTs last year as the nickel corner. But he is raw as a corner prospect. Although they moved him from WR to CB last year, they put in special packages where he played RB and WR at times last year and he made plays. He is absolutely awesome in the return game. Rolle said he is the best athlete ever to play at Miami. But he does need alot of work in his techniques at corner.
Wouldn't he just be better at WR then?

Or he is just as raw on WR too.

[clarker]

I'm a big believer in karma. With so many folks already saying we'll get a top ten choice next year, the odds of that happening don't seem too good. Can we please stop "counting our chickens before they're hatched?" :pray:
Even if the pick from the Redskins in not a top ten choice, it will give us ammo for a trade if their is a player they like that would be a top 5-10 pick.

[SoCalBronco]

Wouldn't he just be better at WR then?

Or he is just as raw on WR too.

Yeah he struggled getting the offense down at WR in 03.

[DB-Freak]

Yeah he struggled getting the offense down at WR in 03.
Another Desmond Howard I guess. Although I thought DH was a pretty good WR in college.

[SoCalBronco]

Another Desmond Howard I guess.

I dunno about that freek. Id be extremely surprised if Devin was anything but a star in the league. His natural abilities are really off the charts even for a Miami player.

[labronx]

I dunno about that freek. Id be extremely surprised if Devin was anything but a star in the league. His natural abilities are really off the charts even for a Miami player.

wow!

one can only wonder

hey socal just start naming MIA players of the top of your head and it starts to get ridiculous i bet.

I mean for Rolle to say he is the best physically?

thats nuts!

he must be really gifted!

I think you have to find a way to make him an offensive player or some kind of Super Cover Safety not a CB.

The way the league is going CBs are no longer welcomed and not really given a chance to use their physical abilities anymore.

The league is really protecting it's star MARKETABLE players such as QBs and WRs.

[Jason in LA]

Vick is constantly hurt, but that is a tough choice anyhow.

Vick has only had one major injury. He only missed one game in '02 and one in '04. I think the game him missed last year was a meaningless game, where he was held out.

[SoCalBronco]

wow!

one can only wonder

hey socal just start naming MIA players of the top of your head and it starts to get ridiculous i bet.
Yep, there will be some guys coming out a couple years from now who should be pretty good.
I mean for Rolle to say he is the best physically?

thats nuts!

he must be really gifted!

I think you have to find a way to make him an offensive player or some kind of Super Cover Safety not a CB.
Yeah i think when he gets to the league his team will try and use him in many capacities just to have him on the field making plays although i doubt the Miami coaches will move him anymore since they already moved him before and i think they feel guilty about helping to ruin a career of another talented guy a few years back named Jason Geathers who they kept switching from RB and WR.
The way the league is going CBs are no longer welcomed and not really given a chance to use their physical abilities anymore.

The league is really protecting it's star MARKETABLE players such as QBs and WRs.

[Billy Clyde Puckett]

McNeal will go first day. So will Brad Smith. Both of those guys have enormous upside and McNeal is the closest thing to McNabb to come out in a while.

Smith looked at coming out this this year and based on his poor performance in 2004, he was told he might not even be taken in the draft. He has to have a good year in 2005 to even get a chance.

[Jason in LA]

Uh... There's been a shift toward bigger linemen for a couple years now...

The Bronocos have only played one of those bigger O linemen. All the rest of the starters have been under 300 lbs. The only young O lineman that's expected to crack the starting lineup in the future is Myers, who is at 300 lbs. All these big O linemen, except for Foster, are sitting on the bench, and it doesn't look like they'll be taking anybody's starters job.

[wabbit]

Mike Shanahan with two 1st round draft choices...oh Lord

Someone please tell me there's not a 'can't miss' CB lurking out there

[Clockwork Orange]

Mike Shanahan with two 1st round draft choices...oh Lord

Someone please tell me there's not a 'can't miss' CB lurking out there

You had to go and say it, didn't you? :cuss:

Good lord, if they draft a corner with either 1st rounder next year someone's gonna have to talk me off the ledge.

[SoCalBronco]

Mike Shanahan with two 1st round draft choices...oh Lord

Someone please tell me there's not a 'can't miss' CB lurking out there

Dont worry Wabbit, not only does there not appear to be a truly elite corner coming out, but its also an even numbered year draft so we should be okay. :thumbsup:

[Taco John]

I expect we'll either combine those picks to trade up, or stay where they are and take a QB and a DE.

[baja]

I expect we'll either combine those picks to trade up, or stay where they are and take a QB and a DE.

Not if one of those picks is #1

[Hercules Rockefeller]

We will not need a high # 1 next year I say we trade it back to Washington for their 1 and 2 in 07

The best players stayed in school this year and with the uncertainty of the CBA ending you're probably going to get a ton of juniors declaring. Next year is going to be a good year to have a lot of picks.

[wabbit]

I expect we'll either combine those picks to trade up, or stay where they are and take a QB and a DE.

Denver is a good team. We don't necessarily need to grabbing for that cornerstone player (who would likely become a colossal contract headache 4 years from now...assuming he isn't a bust)

Also, from what I've read, this USC kid is anything BUT a 'can't miss'.

I just don't see Shanahan as the QB guru he was once touted as being, and I don't see him drafting someone who can't help him right away...franchice QB or not.

If this staff is really smart, they could parlay that 'Skins pick into all kinds of help...I say again; IF someone uses their brain

Then again, multiple teams have had multiple #1's, and in nearly all cases, they ended up having to make the selections.

[Hercules Rockefeller]

Denver is a good team. We don't necessarily need to grabbing for that cornerstone player (who would likely become a colossal contract headache 4 years from now...assuming he isn't a bust)


At this point, there really isn't anyone on the Broncos you can call a cornerstone player except maybe Champ. That's why they continue to make the playoffs/barely miss every year, they don't have any elite talent that is going to take them to the next level. Most of those guys are found near the top of the 1st round.

I for one would love to actually have a franchise player on his rookie deal and the possibility of a contract headache when it comes time to re-sign him. I don't understand the desire by some people to spread the cap money around relatively evenly. You build around a core few players. You make sure those guys are signed to whatever it takes, and then worry about signing/drafting the rest of the team. The Broncos are hurting because most of their big deals are currently older players like Nalen and Rod, or not worth the money at this point like Trevor and even Jake is borderline in that category. Al and Champ being the obvious exceptions, as two young guys locked up long-term.

[yavoon]

Denver is a good team. We don't necessarily need to grabbing for that cornerstone player (who would likely become a colossal contract headache 4 years from now...assuming he isn't a bust)

Also, from what I've read, this USC kid is anything BUT a 'can't miss'.

I just don't see Shanahan as the QB guru he was once touted as being, and I don't see him drafting someone who can't help him right away...franchice QB or not.

If this staff is really smart, they could parlay that 'Skins pick into all kinds of help...I say again; IF someone uses their brain

Then again, multiple teams have had multiple #1's, and in nearly all cases, they ended up having to make the selections.

I dont see how passing up a highly touted franchise qb can be good. if it came down to leinhart or shanny i'd fire shanny. but honestly it shouldn't come down to that, shanny is supposedly a good coach. of course on this forum everyone makes it sound like shanny is a one trick pony.

[sirhcyennek81]

the man who won us superbowls...or the college prospect...yeah. tough decision there. being that its not april, 2006, what does it matter? focus on this season

[KillerBronco#76]

isnt it somthing like 22 of the 32 starting qbs were first round picks but no qb picked in the first round has won the superbowl since dilfer(2000)? i heard somthin like that on nfl network today i thought it was an interesting stat.

[yavoon]

the man who won us superbowls...or the college prospect...yeah. tough decision there. being that its not april, 2006, what does it matter? focus on this season

TD is going to coach?

[DBroncos4life]

Im telling you Chris Leak will be the guy. Under Myers he will become a great QB.

[SoCalBronco]

Im telling you Chris Leak will be the guy. Under Myers he will become a great QB.

So a QB with poor accuracy and poor height to begin with will become a great NFL QB by running an old option and veer offense from the shotgun?

Come on DB.

[DBroncos4life]

So a QB with poor accuracy and poor height to begin with will become a great NFL QB by running an old option and veer offense from the shotgun?

Come on DB.


Hes completing just under 60% of his passes and had a 144 rating last year. His 29 tds and 3000 plus yards are not that bad either. His size is bad. I didn't know he was only 6'0". Next.

[Pat Bowlen]

Did somebody actually say that Brad Smith wasn't as talented as Van Pelt?

[baja]

TD is going to coach?

good one

[epicSocialism4tw]

Denver is a good team. We don't necessarily need to grabbing for that cornerstone player (who would likely become a colossal contract headache 4 years from now...assuming he isn't a bust)

Also, from what I've read, this USC kid is anything BUT a 'can't miss'.

I just don't see Shanahan as the QB guru he was once touted as being, and I don't see him drafting someone who can't help him right away...franchice QB or not.

If this staff is really smart, they could parlay that 'Skins pick into all kinds of help...I say again; IF someone uses their brain

Then again, multiple teams have had multiple #1's, and in nearly all cases, they ended up having to make the selections.

I agree about Leinart, from what I've seen I don't think that he is a Shanny QB. I would rather see Vince Young if he improves this season.

Ultimately, Denver is in an excellent position to deal around the league with the Skins 4th rounder (was it their 3rd that we used this season?) and their 1st. We should also receive comp picks for Hayward and Kennedy. At least one of which has a good chance of being a first day pick.

If Denver wants a player, they have the firepower to get him via trade. Barring a miracle, that Skins pick looks like a sure-fire top ten.

[Atlas]

Future QB of the Denver Broncos

http://athletics.mines.edu/Sports/Football/pictures/Chad.jpg

[FADERPROOF]

Im telling you Chris Leak will be the guy. Under Myers he will become a great QB.


LOL

Man that made my day right there, good joke man!

Almost as good as SoCal telling me that Hester is a better returner than Ted Ginn.

[rbackfactory80]

I think u have to take leinhart. now I dont know if he will be as good as billed. but when u have a chance at a franchise qb u jump in and take. u dont gamble that position out on filling out other things.

Listen I like Leinhart but for some reason am very skeptical of him being left handed and aslo lacking in the mobility department. Sitting here trying to figure out who is a good left handed qb in this league and I can not. Brunnell sucks Vick sucks, and I am only talking about throwing the football. Something about left handed quaterbacks, yes Steve young was great and there were other good left handed qb's but I am very questionable about them. Dont really no why.

[baja]

How about Plummer he throws left handed sometimes

[rbackfactory80]

How about Plummer he throws left handed sometimes

Yeah and unfortunately those are some of his best passes, but when you r the snake you can do whatever you want.

[Taco John]

Listen I like Leinhart but for some reason am very skeptical of him being left handed and aslo lacking in the mobility department. Sitting here trying to figure out who is a good left handed qb in this league and I can not. Brunnell sucks Vick sucks, and I am only talking about throwing the football. Something about left handed quaterbacks, yes Steve young was great and there were other good left handed qb's but I am very questionable about them. Dont really no why.


Steve Young was a pretty decent left hander, no?

Plus, we've already got a damn good Right Tackle to watch his back side...

[rbackfactory80]

Steve Young was a pretty decent left hander, no?

Plus, we've already got a damn good Right Tackle to watch his back side...

Yeah I said Steve Young was great but he was also a scrambler!

[Cito Pelon]

I don't see the problem with an accurate, 6'5" QB from a big-time program. It's a good starting point, anyway.

On the other hand, Ryan Leaf was 6'6, accurate and played in a top program.

So maybe in the pre-draft interviews a team should do a good-cop/bad-cop scenario.
Have one coach really ride the prospect's ass, get all over him, criticize him, show him film of all his bad plays, laugh at his mistakes, tell the other coaches in the interview he doesn't think the kid has any chance at all. And see how the kid reacts.

i don't know how the team conducts its interviews now, but I'd try something like that on the #1's and especially QB's. And hire an investigator to shadow the kid. If he finds out and doesn't handle it well, that's another thing you consider.

[DB-Freak]

What is so franchise about Leinhart?

I know he is a winner in college, but I don't see any tremendous qualities that I would consider franchise.

[baja]

I don't see the problem with an accurate, 6'5" QB from a big-time program. It's a good starting point, anyway.

On the other hand, Ryan Leaf was 6'6, accurate and played in a top program.

So maybe in the pre-draft interviews a team should do a good-cop/bad-cop scenario.
Have one coach really ride the prospect's ass, get all over him, criticize him, show him film of all his bad plays, laugh at his mistakes, tell the other coaches in the interview he doesn't think the kid has any chance at all. And see how the kid reacts.

i don't know how the team conducts its interviews now, but I'd try something like that on the #1's and especially QB's. And hire an investigator to shadow the kid. If he finds out and doesn't handle it well, that's another thing you consider.

I think a better test would be to take him to IHOP at 3 AM and have a skinny guy in line behind him tell him his girl has facial hair and no breasts.