Street & Smith's Rate the AFC west

[Kaylore]

Some interesting takes. Take it for what its worth. There is no link. I'm just going to type what I can right out of the mag. Pretty favorable to the good guys. They like the Clarett pickup, but aren't fond of the Browncos.

Broncos
AFC West pick: 1st

Power Rankings (out of possible five)

O-line: 4
QB: 3
Running Backs: 4
Receivers: 4
Defensive Line: 4
Linebackers: 4
Secondary: 3
Special Teams: 3
Management: 4

Overall: 90 (out of 100 possible)

-Mind you this is pre-Sauerbrun and rice, so they would probably rank our special teams higher

Chargers
AFC west pick: 2nd

Power Rankings

O-line: 3
QB: 4
Running Backs: 5
Receivers: 4
Defensive Line: 3
Linebackers: 5
Secondary: 3
Special Teams: 3
Management: 4

Overall: 88

-I think they have their receiving corps rated too high, as well as their management. I guess recently that has been good, though. (lots of picks.)

Chiefs

AFC West pick: 3rd

Power Rankings

O-line: 5
QB: 4
Running Backs: 5
Receivers: 3
Defensive Line: 2
Linebackers: 3
Secondary: 3
Special Teams: 3
Management: 3

Overall: 86

-Their D-line was better than a "2" last season. That's a bit harsh.

Butt Holes
AFC West pick: 4th

Power Rankings

O-line: 4
QB: 3
Running Backs: 4
Receivers: 5
Defensive Line: 2
Linebackers: 2
Secondary: 2
Special Teams: 3
Management: 3

Overall: 81

-We still don't know how the switch back to a 4-3 will work for the team. I suspect that Their D-line will do better, but outside that and their one good corner, their Defense doesn't look very scary.

[TheReverend]

Great article... I'd say out LBs are better than the Chargers and I'm EXTREMELY homer on the Browncos.

[Kaylore]

Great article... I'd say out LBs are better than the Chargers and I'm EXTREMELY homer on the Browncos.
I'm more cautiously optimistic about the Browncos, but I'd take our Linebacker group against any others right now.

[bloodsunday]

Seems a bit early for these type of predictions, but I am glad to see that someone gives us some positive pub.

[baja]

They all should be out this week

[Bronco LB 59]

The 4 rating for the Denver defensive line is extremely generous.

[yavoon]

I'm more cautiously optimistic about the Browncos, but I'd take our Linebacker group against any others right now.

I think the broncos have too much invested in their LB's. they just signed wilson, then just signed gold. now true dj williams is on his rookie contract, but what happens when that ends? both gold's and wilsons contracts will be mature and williams will be asking for bank.

not good stuff.

[Hercules Rockefeller]

I think the broncos have too much invested in their LB's. they just signed wilson, then just signed gold. now true dj williams is on his rookie contract, but what happens when that ends? both gold's and wilsons contracts will be mature and williams will be asking for bank.

not good stuff.

They'd have too much invested in their LBs if DJ wasn't on his rookie deal, and you're also assuming that one (Gold) will actually see the end of his deal. As it stands now, both AW and IG are signed through '10 and DJ through '09. Even if all were still here at the end of '09 and DJ was re-signed, he still wouldn't have that significant of a cap hit for '10 when the other two 'Backers deals' expire.

[yavoon]

They'd have too much invested in their LBs if DJ wasn't on his rookie deal, and you're also assuming that one (Gold) will actually see the end of his deal. As it stands now, both AW and IG are signed through '10 and DJ through '09. Even if all were still here at the end of '09 and DJ was re-signed, he still wouldn't have that significant of a cap hit for '10 when the other two 'Backers deals' expire.

and DJ wont holdout? sure u could cut gold but that'd just be another cap hit.

unless DJ levels off its unlikely he will see the end of his deal either.

[-Slap-]

Broncos
AFC West pick: 1st

Power Rankings (out of possible five)

O-line: 4
QB: 3
Running Backs: 4
Receivers: 4
Defensive Line: 4
Linebackers: 4
Secondary: 3
Special Teams: 3
Management: 4

Overall: 90 (out of 100 possible)

Their rankings seem to suggest quarterback is our weak link on offense.

[clarker]

Does anyone have link to this?

[sirhcyennek81]

Broncos defensiveline has been fairly consistent the last 3 seasons against the run. then again, when you have wilson behind you, you dont have to do to much. Guessing street and smith are looking at potential, coupled with the continued good health of pryce and brown.

[clarker]

Broncos defensiveline has been fairly consistent the last 3 seasons against the run. then again, when you have wilson behind you, you dont have to do to much. Guessing street and smith are looking at potential, coupled with the continued good health of pryce and brown.If Pryce and Brown stay healthy for the whole year, the D-line should be pretty good, no matter how the rest of the ex Browns turn out.

[lookin' glass]

Speaking of Street & Smiths how do you guys view their publication? Do you think they're more fair than say Sports Ill? I have their most recent draft guide and they seem to have done a very good job. They liked Darrent Williams (no. 8 cb) a lot other than his size. They had a player like Cody McCarty (no. 4 te) rated highly, who I was hoping the Broncs would take a shot on. Jason Brown of North Carolina, the no. 4 center was an interesting read, unfortunately he went to B-moreorless in the 4th rd.
Thoughts?

[Pendejo]

Their rankings seem to suggest quarterback is our weak link on offense.

You can make a pretty good argument that that has been the case since the great John Elway took his final bow.

[gunns]

Does anyone have link to this?

Buy the magazine. That's where you'll find it.

[clarker]

Buy the magazine. That's where you'll find it.
Thanks. I didn't know any of the annual preseason magazines were out yet.

[Hercules Rockefeller]

and DJ wont holdout? sure u could cut gold but that'd just be another cap hit.

unless DJ levels off its unlikely he will see the end of his deal either.

Start listing the Broncos that were extended before their rookie deals expired.

Wait, I'll do it for you:

TD
Trevor
MA

3 guys in 10 years, and only 1 1st round pick.

[yavoon]

Start listing the Broncos that were extended before their rookie deals expired.

Wait, I'll do it for you:

TD
Trevor
MA

3 guys in 10 years, and only 1 1st round pick.

then DJ might be playing for someone else. its all well and good to strongarm players on rookie contracts but its going to cause attrition.

[watermock]

It's all Portis' fault.

Is DJ's agent the shark?

[eddie mac]

I'd also envisage that the 3 for Special Teams was submitted before we acquired Todd Sauerbrun aka missile launcher.

[Drek]

then DJ might be playing for someone else. its all well and good to strongarm players on rookie contracts but its going to cause attrition. Really trying to spin it in a negative light, huh? Sorry, doesn't really work, since DJ will play all or most of his rookie deal, at least until '08. I doubt Gold will still even be on the team by then, if I recall his deal makes him almost a lock to get cut about mid way through, when all the signing bonus is paid and his base starts to escalate.

[elsid13]

DJ has already shown that is more interested in the team then alot of the U guys. He went to Denver to workout for the off season, not down to FL. Beside, Shanny always takes care of those players he thinks are important to the team. DJ is the future on D.

[Odysseus]

The 4 rating for the Denver defensive line is extremely generous.

I am VERY optimistic about the Browncos but where the rubber meets the road is game time. I'll let you know if it's real after I see Mini camp. I so stoked to see that!

[Atlas]

Their rankings seem to suggest quarterback is our weak link on offense.

Who wouldn't agree with that???

[KansasBronco]

Nice read. Thanks for your information. If we stay healthy, I like our chances even with a tough schedule this year.

[Jason in LA]

They gave the faider RBs a 4. Based on what? They have four career backups at that position.

[Paladin]

What the article tells me is that, on the whole, the Broncos are being recognized as a legitimate candidate for the Division. Further, they are recognized as being a fairly potent organization and team from the Brain Trust on down. Despite the ranting and ravings of the chievie fans and the faider fans, the Broncos are a pretty good team overall. As Woodie says: they are certianly entertaining, and that's what is the ultimate importance.

As for specific ratings; the comparisons are of importance. To rank Plummer as a 3 begs the question: compared to whom? I have always contended that the QB position in Shanahan’s scheme needs to be just “at least average” for his O to work well. The fact tha tElway had some "upper echelon skills" simply made the scheme work better. But Plummer did give a good performace last year, overshadowed by a couple of bummers. His ability to move around is the equalizer. Teams have to scheme and plan for the roll outs. and They have to watch when he takes off because he can get 30 or more yards on a run. To me, his skills are Herculean comared to Greise and others. He is at leat average, and that is perfect for Shanahan's system. What is more important to the system is the RB, and we all take excellence from that position for granted, and the rest of the league does too. "RBs R Us" is not about to be less than a ten win season.

I liked the article. Not only because it correctly defined the Broncos, but it also gave clear descriptions of the weaknesses of the other West teams.

[bloodsunday]

Their rankings seem to suggest quarterback is our weak link on offense.
Frankly, its hard to argue based on last season. If Jake can cut out about 1/3 of those turnovers, that number will be a 4 next year.

[bloodsunday]

Start listing the Broncos that were extended before their rookie deals expired...3 guys in 10 years, and only 1 1st round pick.
This is one flaw in our personnel managment, IMO. If you wait too long, then you end up bidding for your own players. Conversly, its tough to extend guys when you are turning over such a huge part of your roster and so tight against the cap every season. Based on the '06 projections I have seen, it won't get much better next year either.

[bloodsunday]

It's all Portis' fault.

Is DJ's agent the shark?
No, I believe that only Walls has Rosenhaus currently. We gotta keep DJ here in the offseason since Rosenhoaus trolls around Miami.

[bloodsunday]

I am VERY optimistic about the Browncos but where the rubber meets the road is game time. I'll let you know if it's real after I see Mini camp. I so stoked to see that!
You know what, if Pryce is healthy and Warren even plays at his normal level, this line deserves a 4. We have depth and a good history against the run. Now, if C Brown stays healthy and Warren improves his level of play, this could be a 5 star d-line.

[yavoon]

Really trying to spin it in a negative light, huh? Sorry, doesn't really work, since DJ will play all or most of his rookie deal, at least until '08. I doubt Gold will still even be on the team by then, if I recall his deal makes him almost a lock to get cut about mid way through, when all the signing bonus is paid and his base starts to escalate.

why? if ur outperforming ur rookie deal its a HUGE risk for a player to just keep going on it. signing bonus is alays amertized over the length of the contract as far as I know which just means gold will be dead money.

I dont see why its even selfish to want to get paid what ur worth in football, its just smart.

[Jason in LA]

Frankly, its hard to argue based on last season. If Jake can cut out about 1/3 of those turnovers, that number will be a 4 next year.

We had a 67 page, 1657 post thread about that. The thread was called "The Jake's not to Blame Thread".

If you have a little time to kill...well, I should say a lot of time to kill, here's the link. http://66.49.247.155/BB/showthread.php?t=21928&highlight=fault

[Mediator12]

why? if ur outperforming ur rookie deal its a HUGE risk for a player to just keep going on it. signing bonus is alays amertized over the length of the contract as far as I know which just means gold will be dead money.

I dont see why its even selfish to want to get paid what ur worth in football, its just smart.

We know yavoon. You have been extremely clear on that point I believe.

I think it makes the most sense to resign these guys the offseason of their final contract year. Lock them up before FA hits if they want. The problem is always agents wanting to wait anohter year to get FA dollars plus inflation. Most team attempt to do it that way, Its the Agents promising big paydays next year that gets most guys Franchised or leaving teams IMHO.

[bloodsunday]

We had a 67 page, 1657 post thread about that. The thread was called "The Jake's not to Blame Thread".

If you have a little time to kill...well, I should say a lot of time to kill, here's the link. http://66.49.247.155/BB/showthread.php?t=21928&highlight=fault
I'm not trying to create a Holy War or participate in one. I think the general consensus on Jake is that he has the ability, but makes too many mistakes. Thus, if you take out the mistakes, then you are left with an above average QB.

[yavoon]

We know yavoon. You have been extremely clear on that point I believe.

I think it makes the most sense to resign these guys the offseason of their final contract year. Lock them up before FA hits if they want. The problem is always agents wanting to wait anohter year to get FA dollars plus inflation. Most team attempt to do it that way, Its the Agents promising big paydays next year that gets most guys Franchised or leaving teams IMHO.

well yes agents(being the ppl that negotiate in the best interests of the players) are usually the reason players dont sign cheap and stay w/ the same team.

:)

[Mediator12]

well yes agents(being the ppl that negotiate in the best interests of the players) are usually the reason players dont sign cheap and stay w/ the same team.

:)


Not cheap, but fair. Al Wilson's deal was fair but not cheap. Trevor Pryce's deal was outrageous and done before FA. He is still the highest paid DL in football. The precedent's are there.

DJ needs to be outstanding and not just above average to renegotiate his rookie deal before the final year. I am all for that though :pray:

[rbackfactory80]

Great article... I'd say out LBs are better than the Chargers and I'm EXTREMELY homer on the Browncos.

Our linebackers are better by far!

[Hercules Rockefeller]

This is one flaw in our personnel managment, IMO. If you wait too long, then you end up bidding for your own players. Conversly, its tough to extend guys when you are turning over such a huge part of your roster and so tight against the cap every season. Based on the '06 projections I have seen, it won't get much better next year either.

That's how most teams do it with Philly being the only real exception. Every team locks up players like TD and Trevor if those guys outperform their rookie deals. After this next season, Rod will be the only old player with a long-term deal so that aspect of cap management will be improved.

Exactly what projections have you seen? The "s" implies multiple ones, and the only one I've seen is Clayton's. However writers for both the local rags have said the Broncos' cap situation improves next year. To simply go off of Clayton's statement that their over is complete oversimplification and a refusal to go deeper. Clayton doesn't say how far over they are, and it's already been mentioned here at this board that there are number of deals that void among other things.

[yavoon]

Not cheap, but fair. Al Wilson's deal was fair but not cheap. Trevor Pryce's deal was outrageous and done before FA. He is still the highest paid DL in football. The precedent's are there.

DJ needs to be outstanding and not just above average to renegotiate his rookie deal before the final year. I am all for that though :pray:

who's the arbiter of fairness? I assume when a player holds out its not because he loves his contract.

[Paladin]

TO's holdong out is the result of stupidity. Or his agent or whatever. He just got big bucks. Got what he wanted. Now he wants a do over? get real.

I think players can be greedy. They deserve the chance to make as much as they can, but there is a limit to the whole process. I'd like TO to just sit out a year. Give back a bunch of the bonus he got. Let's see who is smart then, eh?

[yavoon]

TO's holdong out is the result of stupidity. Or his agent or whatever. He just got big bucks. Got what he wanted. Now he wants a do over? get real.

I think players can be greedy. They deserve the chance to make as much as they can, but there is a limit to the whole process. I'd like TO to just sit out a year. Give back a bunch of the bonus he got. Let's see who is smart then, eh?

not saying TO is right to holdout, and it certainly doesn't look like he is going to win right now but the NFLPA warned him against signing the contract and he ignored them.

[dbroncos31]

**Butt Holes**
AFC West pick: 4th

Power Rankings

O-line: 4
QB: 3
Running Backs: 4
Receivers: 5
Defensive Line: 2
Linebackers: 2
Secondary: 2
Special Teams: 3
Management: 3

Overall: 81

i just sprayed mountain dew all over my computer. you caught me by surprise. ha. butt holes. hahahaha

[Crow]

Broncos
AFC West pick: 1st

Power Rankings (out of possible five)

O-line: 4
QB: 3
Running Backs: 4
Receivers: 4
Defensive Line: 4
Linebackers: 4
Secondary: 3
Special Teams: 3
Management: 4

Overall: 90 (out of 100 possible)

RBs: 4? Who exactly makes this unit rate so highly? If we're talking about "the system", then the O-line should be the group getting all the love.

D-line: 4? That's so far fetched, not even Bronco fans buy it.

Management: 4? Eh. I would give Mike a 3 at best.

Overall: 90? Heh. C'mon now.

This guy was clearly a Bronco fan.

Chargers
AFC west pick: 2nd

Power Rankings

O-line: 3
QB: 4
Running Backs: 5
Receivers: 4
Defensive Line: 3
Linebackers: 5
Secondary: 3
Special Teams: 3
Management: 4

Overall: 88

D-line: 3? That seems a little low to me. Definitely gotta give this group a 4.

LBs: 5? Generous. They're really good, but that good? Debatable.

Receivers: 4? McCardell is really good. Gates is the sh/t. Parker and Caldwell looked good last year while they were healthy. I dunno. Maybe.

Management: 4? No comment.

Chiefs

AFC West pick: 3rd

Power Rankings

O-line: 5
QB: 4
Running Backs: 5
Receivers: 3
Defensive Line: 2
Linebackers: 3
Secondary: 3
Special Teams: 3
Management: 3

Overall: 86

Receivers: 3? Gonzalez and who?

DL: 2? Yeah, that's about right. Other than the rookie Jared Allen, I wouldn't give any of these guys a 2nd look.

I think 4 is a little high for Trent Green, but I'll let him make it this time.

Greatness
AFC West pick: 4th

Power Rankings

O-line: 4
QB: 3
Running Backs: 4
Receivers: 5
Defensive Line: 2
Linebackers: 2
Secondary: 2
Special Teams: 3
Management: 3

Overall: 81

RB: 4? Looks like this guy is as high on Jordan as I am.

DL: 2? Looks like he's as down on Sapp and Ted as I am. That said, 2 does seem a shade low.

LBs: 2? Well, I guess Danny Clark can only do so much for you.

Secondary: 2? When they give KC and Denver a 3? Suspect.


If Denver wins the division and Oakland comes in last, I'll eat my hat and post pictures. Hard to believe this guy got paid to write this stuff.

[DBroncos4life]

RBs: 4? Who exactly makes this unit rate so highly? If we're talking about "the system", then the O-line should be the group getting all the love.

D-line: 4? That's so far fetched, not even Bronco fans buy it.

Management: 4? Eh. I would give Mike a 3 at best.

Overall: 90? Heh. C'mon now.

This guy was clearly a Bronco fan.



D-line: 3? That seems a little low to me. Definitely gotta give this group a 4.

LBs: 5? Generous. They're really good, but that good? Debatable.

Receivers: 4? McCardell is really good. Gates is the sh/t. Parker and Caldwell looked good last year while they were healthy. I dunno. Maybe.

Management: 4? No comment.



Receivers: 3? Gonzalez and who?

DL: 2? Yeah, that's about right. Other than the rookie Jared Allen, I wouldn't give any of these guys a 2nd look.

I think 4 is a little high for Trent Green, but I'll let him make it this time.



RB: 4? Looks like this guy is as high on Jordan as I am.

DL: 2? Looks like he's as down on Sapp and Ted as I am. That said, 2 does seem a shade low.

LBs: 2? Well, I guess Danny Clark can only do so much for you.

Secondary: 2? When they give KC and Denver a 3? Suspect.


If Denver wins the division and Oakland comes in last, I'll eat my hat and post pictures. Hard to believe this guy got paid to write this stuff.



Let me get this straight here. Jordan a career backup is ok to get a 4 but Denver who turns out 1200 yard backs like vivid turns out porn videos is ranked too high? Hmmmmm odd

[frerottenextelway]

Power Rankings (out of possible five)

O-line: 4
QB: 3
Running Backs: 4
Receivers: 4
Defensive Line: 4
Linebackers: 4
Secondary: 3
Special Teams: 3
Management: 4

Overall: 90 (out of 100 possible)


O-line: 3.5
QB: 3
Running Backs: 4
Receivers: 3.5
Defensive Line: 3
Linebackers: 5
Secondary: 3.5
Special Teams: 3
Management: 4

If 3 is league average, those are my rankings.

[Crow]

Let me get this straight here. Jordan a career backup is ok to get a 4 but Denver who turns out 1200 yard backs like vivid turns out porn videos is ranked too high? Hmmmmm odd

Go back and read again, hoss.

Jordan: "Obviously this guy thinks highly of him."

Denver RB: "The line deserves the credit."

What didn't make sense?

[DBroncos4life]

Go back and read again, hoss.

Jordan: "Obviously this guy thinks highly of him."

Denver RB: "The line deserves the credit."

What didn't make sense?


RB: 4? Looks like this guy is as high on Jordan as I am.

DL: 2? Looks like he's as down on Sapp and Ted as I am. That said, 2 does seem a shade low.

LBs: 2? Well, I guess Danny Clark can only do so much for you.


Again hoss to me this means you think that NO Broncos back is worth a 4. Fact is he COULD be just as high on Bell as he is Jordan you fool. System or not I would always ranked Denvers running game higher then the Raiders. Jordan has done nothing in the NFL to jump that ranking to a 4. Nothing.

Secondary: 2? When they give KC and Denver a 3? Suspect.


If Denver wins the division and Oakland comes in last, I'll eat my hat and post pictures. Hard to believe this guy got paid to write this stuff.


To me hoss this means you think he should be ranked a 4.

RBs: 4? Who exactly makes this unit rate so highly? If we're talking about "the system", then the O-line should be the group getting all the love.

D-line: 4? That's so far fetched, not even Bronco fans buy it.

Management: 4? Eh. I would give Mike a 3 at best.

Overall: 90? Heh. C'mon now.

This guy was clearly a Bronco fan.

[orange 4 life]

Who wouldn't agree with that???

anyone with half a brain.