Why draft day sucks this year!

[Mediator12]

1. No one here knows how the players ended up being graded from last season. The offense grades the defense and vice versa. These evaluations are the basis for the teams needs and not the wonderful observations of this board. The OM has some of the best entertainment and analysis going on the Teams needs. The result is mystifying on draft Day.

Case in point OG: While we are able to get reasonable looks at the starters and backups in most positions, OL is not really gradeable from our perspective. Most of the younger guys and Backups are only seen on the scout teams. Therefore, no one here really knows how Sewell and Clabo graded. If they are better than our OPINIONS then the OG position is not the need we percieve it to be to the team. There could be more sixth and seventh OL selected again.

2. Same thing for the teams scouting reports. The majority of draft sites out there regurgitate the same INFO and use others analysis to establish the pecking order of draftees. It is well established that this scouting staff has no qualms in making their own minds up with players and very rarely "toe the line" with perceived rankings. The broncos systems use different styles of players than the overall grades given to value players overall in most cases.

Case in point: Foster, Bell, And Watts were all drated above their perceived values the last two years. Most teams had Watts at the fourth round and he was not in Kipers Top 100. "The Reach" is another favorite term used to describe most of Shanahan's drafts and I am sure it will happen again!

3. Draft day movement. Denver has come up short recently in getting advantageous draft day maneuvers. Most people around here would love to move down from the first round and acquire another 2cd and 3rd pick. With so many of the teams in front of Denver envisioning the same thing, it will not likely happen. Denver has been outbid over and over for moving up, and this is a draft not to move up either.

4. The late first round pick means Denver fans wait four hours or so to get a look at what Denver will do. If they move up, most here may have coronaries or be calling the local store for new Monitor pricing. Conversely, if they do move down, that means waiting another two hours or so to see that first pick. And, every time one of the "Potential Targets" moves off the board, the level of anxiety increases exponentially.

5. The perceived needs will be slighted on the first day of the draft. Does anyone really think Denver will go OG, S, DL, and Punter on day one??? They will get some other positions in there based on BPA or other needs. This definitely will arise the anger of the masses on the board.

6. I have finals that Monday!

[bronco militia]

hehehehe

honestly, after 17 years as a Bronco fan, I don't know how any Broncos fan becomes a draft geek. The Broncos are notoriously boring on draft day.

oh well, to each his own.

[Mediator12]

60+ views and No comments outside Bmilitia? Meanwhile posts on the Nuggets, something about sexing Mutombo, and retreads on the Draft are still being discussed. So much for perspective from my point of View :dummy:

[Ray Finkle]

I agree with you but I am a glutton for abuse and always find a way to watch the draft...

[NFLBRONCO]

hehehehe

honestly, after 17 years as a Bronco fan, I don't know how any Broncos fan becomes a draft geek. The Broncos are notoriously boring on draft day.

oh well, to each his own.

As a Bronco draft geek I agree with our drafts being boring. I laugh at people who call us such wheeler dealers draft day none of the moves lately were EXCITING moves. Besides us being boring I love draft day and always will.

[bronco militia]

As a Bronco draft geek I agree with our drafts being boring. I laugh at people who call us such wheeler dealers draft day none of the moves lately were EXCITING moves. Besides us being boring I love draft day and always will.

that's cool...I enjoy watching the 1st round.

[stoxman]

that's cool...I enjoy watching the 1st round.

I agree with this. Years ago I was one of the BIGGEST draft day fans in the midwest--bar none! Given that I haven't really enjoyed a Bronco's draft in the past 10 years, I can no longer get as excited as I used to and will just try TRY to sit back and chill out on the big 2 days. I am done figuring out this front office and it's much easier on my blood pressure to just not worry about it.

Maybe when Shanny is gone I can get back into objective team needs and analysis and feel better about how we make our picks. I'm not even sure what it would take to get Mike outta here though. Not even a 3-13 season woudl be enough and Mike does just enough (missing playoffs by a game, or a very fast playoff loss to keep his job and inexplicably keep that mastermind label).

[FADERPROOF]

This is why I'm heading down to Columbus to watch Ohio State's spring game on April 23rd instead of being shacked up inside watching the NFL Draft.

[TheNextStep]

It'll probably be boring to me because the Raiders are in a position where they have to wait and let the draft fall to them. The boredom will be broken up every time I remember that the chances of the Raiders drafting somebody better than Randy Moss are pretty freakin' slim...

[Traveler]

I gave up wasting away a Saturday to watch the complete 1st round of the draft in the early/mid 90's. Too much aggrevation, especially after the Broncos choices. The Dan Reeves era was the worst, but Shanahan & Co are giving him a run for the money.

[Paladin]

On that day, I will be going up to Cheyenne to do a bit of shopping and dinner at the Little Bear Inn. there is a Lowe's up there and they carry Pella Doors and display several models on the floor. In this neck of the woods, there is a Home Depot.

I do nto sit and watch the Draft. I cannot stand to listen to the Hairboy jabber and jabber. I will catch the news and the Rocky Mountain Report later.

Good luck on your exams, Mediator.

[gunns]

I remember hyperventilating during two drafts. In one I heard the words Tommy Maddox instead of Carl Pickens and in the other I heard Ashley Lelie instead of Ed Reed. Everything after that is a blur.

[ro_50]

On draft day, I'll be covering the Western Michigan womens softball team for KZoo Gazette.

[DBroncos4life]

I love draft time. I just don't like watching the draft drunk or hung over. I can't keep up with the names.

[KansasBronco]

The draft is never boring for me. I think it's important to see what other teams get, especially in our division. This will be my 10 year draft annv. and I haven't missed a pick yet. I'm like a kid now waiting for Xmas.

[SoCalBronco]

The draft is the single biggest weekend sports event for me. I am up at 7 am a full two hours before the start of proceedings and i stay until 6 pm when the last pick of Round 3 is done. Day 2 my attention span starts to fade but i am always there within 6 or 7 picks of whenever Denver is picking till we pick.

[Play2win]

Draft Day Weekend Rocks. Next to the SuperBowl, It is one of the best weekends daytime time and beyond parties in all of sports.

When I say parties I don't mean just the drinking, I mean the RAZ you get from sports being sports. I love draft day weekend. Partly because you are inundated by a whole bunch of football talk from all directions. If you love football, I don't see how you cannot LOVE THE DRAFT!!! :militia:

Its the whole reason I even watch college football. ;D

[Atlas]

I remember hyperventilating during two drafts. In one I heard the words Tommy Maddox instead of Carl Pickens and in the other I heard Ashley Lelie instead of Ed Reed. Everything after that is a blur.

Those are nothing I remember in 1989 hearing the name Ted Gregory instead of Thurmon Thomas. All the experts were saying "Thomas is falling, Thomas is falling. Denver will surely select him if he falls that far." Denver selects Ted F_cking Gregory!! I think about that 1991 team that went 12-4 and wonder what would have happened if Thomas was Denver's RB. Oh yeah The Thurmon Thomas led Buffalo Bills beat Denver in the AFC Championship game that year.

[Billy Clyde Puckett]

I enjoy the draft. I am have been fortunate enough to watch a lot of college ball both in person and on TV and I kind of view it as watching my 5th graders on continuance day.

I do agree with your comment about the OL. No fan can tell what the OL is realy doing from TV or in person. The assignments are always well disguised and many times when you see a holding call or other obvious mistake it is because the guy called for it is trying to cover another's mistake.

[FADERPROOF]

The draft is the single biggest weekend sports event for me. I am up at 7 am a full two hours before the start of proceedings and i stay until 6 pm when the last pick of Round 3 is done. Day 2 my attention span starts to fade but i am always there within 6 or 7 picks of whenever Denver is picking till we pick.


Life...go get one.

[Mediator12]

I enjoy the draft. I am have been fortunate enough to watch a lot of college ball both in person and on TV and I kind of view it as watching my 5th graders on continuance day.

I do agree with your comment about the OL. No fan can tell what the OL is realy doing from TV or in person. The assignments are always well disguised and many times when you see a holding call or other obvious mistake it is because the guy called for it is trying to cover another's mistake.

Thanks big guy! The article started out as a perception altering attempt. Then I actually tried to make a few points about the nature of team needs from the differing perspectives of the team (in the know) and the fans (think they are in the Know). Finally, I tried to dispel the common thinking of ranking players for all 32 possible destinations versus specific team value of certain players that no one here is privy.

Good to see all this matriculate into draft day tailgating discussions Socal! :threadjac

[Tombstone RJ]

Its true that Shanahan runs a very strange show on draft day and that, for the most part, Denver's drafts are uneventful, but, its not like Shanny is completely boring on draft day. Just last year the Broncos traded up to #17 to get DJ, that was kinda exciting. The Broncos do move around a little on draft day, they do try to make deals. Shanahan is trying to wheel and deal on draft day, its just that he has not found any other teams that is buying what he is selling, for the most part.

Well, I still enjoy the draft because it is fun to see the experts break down each pick and the strengths and weaknesses of each player. Its exciting because each and every player taken has "potential" to be good or even great and on draft day, that potential greatness is what is so fun to imagine.

When the Broncos take some kid in the seventh round, like BVP, I inevitably say "cool, that kid has so much potential, he's a diamond in the rough, just wait, the Broncos KNOW WHAT THEY ARE DOING..."

Its that kind of "the future is great" feeling that the draft brings. I do get upset when the Broncos don't take the player I think they should take, that truly is disappointing. But, in all reality, the positives far out weigh the negatives for me on draft day.

[bilrob]

The most exciting part of the draft is the next day when you see which FA the Broncos bring in. Those not drafted.

[delany]

I think they should hold the draft behind closed doors.....and then air it in reverse order.

It is so anti-climatic with the way they do it now...

Actually, I love watching the first day of the draft...if for nothing else...it is football-related....although the NFL channel is filling my off-season Broncos jones very nicely now.

[azbroncfan]

I watch the first round and that's about all I can handle in one sitting. Usually its 80 degrees outside and too nice to stay in and watch Mel run his yapper.

[Cito Pelon]

60+ views and No comments outside Bmilitia? Meanwhile posts on the Nuggets, something about sexing Mutombo, and retreads on the Draft are still being discussed. So much for perspective from my point of View :dummy:

Well, what exactly were you getting at? There wasn't really a point to comment on.

[UltimateHoboW/Shotgun]

The only thing thats going to make this draft suck, is the fact this draft won't have a party at the "Penthouse Showclub" this year.

[Cito Pelon]

The draft is never boring for me. I think it's important to see what other teams get, especially in our division. This will be my 10 year draft annv. and I haven't missed a pick yet. I'm like a kid now waiting for Xmas.

I hear ya. I can fell the excitement rising. The draft is a big day in the NFL. I like to see what the AFC West does, also. The first day is a big day for me.

[Kaylore]

I hear ya. I can fell the excitement rising. The draft is a big day in the NFL. I like to see what the AFC West does, also. The first day is a big day for me.
So true. Half the excitement is who your rivals get. It always makes it more intense knowing that they get new players too.

[SpringStein]

To reinforce Mediator's take, this was an interstung article from NextLevel Scouting:

There is at least one team had has AKRON quarterback CHARLIE FRYE rated ahead of one or both Aaron Rodgers and Alex Smith... there is at least one team that has FRYE as the top-rated quarterback in the draft... there is at least one team that has either LOUISVILLE junior running back ERIC SHELTON or TENNESSEE senior running back CEDRIC HOUSTON among the Top-5 RB's in the draft... there is at least one team that has GEORGIA senior wide receiver REGGIE BROWN rated above his teammate, FRED GIBSON, and also have him with a first round grade... there is at least one team that does not have one TIGHT END graded out with a third round grade... having the "Second Tier" tight end run starting between the fourth and fifth round... there is at least one team that has former NEBRASKA offensive lineman RICHIE INCOGNITO rated among the Top-3 centers in the draft... there is at least one team that has MICHIGAN senior DAVID BAAS not rated among the Top-5 offensive guards in the draft... but instead has him as the top-rated center... there is at least one team that has VIRGINIA senior offensive guard ELTON BROWN as the top-rated guard in the draft... but several teams have said he has "Day One" game film... but question his strength, commitment and post-season choices... there is at least one team that has WASHINGTON senior offensive tackle KHALIF BARNES rated as the #1 tackle in the draft... there is at least one team that has either/both TENNESSEE TECH senior offensive tackle FRANK OMIYALE and SAGINAW VALLEY STATE senior offensive tackle TODD HERREMANS rated among the Top-10 tackles in the draft... there is at least one team that does not have WISCONSIN senior defensive end ERASMUS JAMES rated among the Top-3 DE's in the draft... there is at least one team that has NORTHWESTERN senior defensive tackle LUIS CASTILLO rated among the Top-2 DT's in the draft... there is at least one team that does not have FLORIDA STATE senior defensive tackle TRAVIS JOHNSON rated among the Top-5 defensive tackles in the draft... there is at least one team that has given TEXAS senior linebacker DERRICK JOHNSON less than a first round grade... there is at least one team that does not have FLORIDA junior linebacker CHANNING CROWDER rated among the Top-5 inside linebackers in the draft... there is at least one team that has CONNECTICUT senior linebacker ALFRED FINCHER rated among the Top-3 inside linebackers in the draft... there is at least one team that has VIRGINIA junior linebacker DARRYL BLACKSTOCK rated as high as a late first round choice in the draft... however, there is also at least one team that has BLACKSTOCK rated as between a third-to-fourth round choice in the draft... there is at least one team that has MISSOURI senior cornerback SHIRDONYA MITCHELL with a mid-round grade inspite of the ACL injury he suffered at his Pro Day... which may force him to miss his entire rookie campaign... there is at least one team that has MARYLAND senior cornerback DOMONIQUE FOXWORTH rated as high as a second round choice in the draft... there is at least one team that has DUKE senior safety ALEX GREEN rated among the Top-10 safety prospects in the draft... there is at least one team that has OHIO STATE senior kicker MIKE NUGENT rated as a second round choice in the draft.

[plummershelper]

Alot of people have been discussing the Bronco's futile draft efforts. Here's a piece that compares first day draft selections from 1999 - 2002. Albeit it's not totally current it does show the Broncos as 3rd in the league for day one hits. It surprised me quite a bit.
FIRST-DAY IMPACT





Teams that had the most, and least, success with their first-day draft choices from 1999-2002 -- based on percentage of impact players from total picks:

TOP 10

<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=2 width=472 border=0><TBODY><TR vAlign=top><TD>Team</TD><TD>Picks</TD><TD>Players</TD><TD>Percentage</TD></TR><TR vAlign=top><TD>Ravens</TD><TD>9</TD><TD>5</TD><TD>.556</TD></TR><TR vAlign=top><TD>Saints</TD><TD>9</TD><TD>5</TD><TD>.556</TD></TR><TR vAlign=top><TD>Broncos</TD><TD>15</TD><TD>7</TD><TD>.467</TD></TR><TR vAlign=top><TD>Jaguars</TD><TD>13</TD><TD>6</TD><TD>.461</TD></TR><TR vAlign=top><TD>Jets</TD><TD>13</TD><TD>6</TD><TD>.461</TD></TR><TR vAlign=top><TD>Eagles</TD><TD>13</TD><TD>6</TD><TD>.461</TD></TR><TR vAlign=top><TD>Panthers</TD><TD>11</TD><TD>5</TD><TD>.455</TD></TR><TR vAlign=top><TD>Redskins</TD><TD>11</TD><TD>5</TD><TD>.455</TD></TR><TR vAlign=top><TD>Falcons</TD><TD>9</TD><TD>4</TD><TD>.445</TD></TR><TR vAlign=top><TD>Steelers</TD><TD>14</TD><TD>6</TD><TD>.429</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

BOTTOM 10

<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=2 width=472 border=0><TBODY><TR vAlign=top><TD>Team</TD><TD>Picks</TD><TD>Players</TD><TD>Percentage</TD></TR><TR vAlign=top><TD>Browns</TD><TD>15</TD><TD>2</TD><TD>.133</TD></TR><TR vAlign=top><TD>Vikings</TD><TD>13</TD><TD>2</TD><TD>.154</TD></TR><TR vAlign=top><TD>Chiefs</TD><TD>11</TD><TD>2</TD><TD>.182</TD></TR><TR vAlign=top><TD>Cardinals</TD><TD>15</TD><TD>3</TD><TD>.200</TD></TR><TR vAlign=top><TD>Bears</TD><TD>14</TD><TD>3</TD><TD>.214</TD></TR><TR vAlign=top><TD>Bengals</TD><TD>12</TD><TD>3</TD><TD>.250</TD></TR><TR vAlign=top><TD>Seahawks</TD><TD>15</TD><TD>4</TD><TD>.267</TD></TR><TR vAlign=top><TD>Cowboys</TD><TD>11</TD><TD>3</TD><TD>.273</TD></TR><TR vAlign=top><TD>Patriots</TD><TD>11</TD><TD>3</TD><TD>.273</TD></TR><TR vAlign=top><TD>Chargers</TD><TD>7</TD><TD>2</TD><TD>.286</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>-- Clare Farnsworth
http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/football/219724_draft12.html

[-Slap-]

To reinforce Mediator's take, this was an interstung article from NextLevel Scouting:

There is at least one team had has AKRON quarterback CHARLIE FRYE rated ahead of one or both Aaron Rodgers and Alex Smith... there is at least one team that has FRYE as the top-rated quarterback in the draft... there is at least one team that has either LOUISVILLE junior running back ERIC SHELTON or TENNESSEE senior running back CEDRIC HOUSTON among the Top-5 RB's in the draft... there is at least one team that has GEORGIA senior wide receiver REGGIE BROWN rated above his teammate, FRED GIBSON, and also have him with a first round grade... there is at least one team that does not have one TIGHT END graded out with a third round grade... having the "Second Tier" tight end run starting between the fourth and fifth round... there is at least one team that has former NEBRASKA offensive lineman RICHIE INCOGNITO rated among the Top-3 centers in the draft... there is at least one team that has MICHIGAN senior DAVID BAAS not rated among the Top-5 offensive guards in the draft... but instead has him as the top-rated center... there is at least one team that has VIRGINIA senior offensive guard ELTON BROWN as the top-rated guard in the draft... but several teams have said he has "Day One" game film... but question his strength, commitment and post-season choices... there is at least one team that has WASHINGTON senior offensive tackle KHALIF BARNES rated as the #1 tackle in the draft... there is at least one team that has either/both TENNESSEE TECH senior offensive tackle FRANK OMIYALE and SAGINAW VALLEY STATE senior offensive tackle TODD HERREMANS rated among the Top-10 tackles in the draft... there is at least one team that does not have WISCONSIN senior defensive end ERASMUS JAMES rated among the Top-3 DE's in the draft... there is at least one team that has NORTHWESTERN senior defensive tackle LUIS CASTILLO rated among the Top-2 DT's in the draft... there is at least one team that does not have FLORIDA STATE senior defensive tackle TRAVIS JOHNSON rated among the Top-5 defensive tackles in the draft... there is at least one team that has given TEXAS senior linebacker DERRICK JOHNSON less than a first round grade... there is at least one team that does not have FLORIDA junior linebacker CHANNING CROWDER rated among the Top-5 inside linebackers in the draft... there is at least one team that has CONNECTICUT senior linebacker ALFRED FINCHER rated among the Top-3 inside linebackers in the draft... there is at least one team that has VIRGINIA junior linebacker DARRYL BLACKSTOCK rated as high as a late first round choice in the draft... however, there is also at least one team that has BLACKSTOCK rated as between a third-to-fourth round choice in the draft... there is at least one team that has MISSOURI senior cornerback SHIRDONYA MITCHELL with a mid-round grade inspite of the ACL injury he suffered at his Pro Day... which may force him to miss his entire rookie campaign... there is at least one team that has MARYLAND senior cornerback DOMONIQUE FOXWORTH rated as high as a second round choice in the draft... there is at least one team that has DUKE senior safety ALEX GREEN rated among the Top-10 safety prospects in the draft... there is at least one team that has OHIO STATE senior kicker MIKE NUGENT rated as a second round choice in the draft.

"Opinions vary" might have been more concise.......:)

[bendog]

Taking all of Clev's busts should negatively effect Den's success rate (-:

[fontaine]

I'm loving this draft because there are multiple RBs that all could fit very well in Denver and could be had outside the first two rounds like:

Morency, Cedric Houston, Frank Gore, Reyes etc.

There's loads of depth there and some very good cutback runners who will be available in Day two of the draft. Hopefully Denver can score some 2nd day picks and draft one of these players. I wouldn't mind going RB in the 3rd round either.

[Arkie]

Alot of people have been discussing the Bronco's futile draft efforts. Here's a piece that compares first day draft selections from 1999 - 2002. Albeit it's not totally current it does show the Broncos as 3rd in the league for day one hits. It surprised me quite a bit.
FIRST-DAY IMPACT





Teams that had the most, and least, success with their first-day draft choices from 1999-2002 -- based on percentage of impact players from total picks:

TOP 10

<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=2 width=472 border=0><TBODY><TR vAlign=top><TD>Team</TD><TD>Picks</TD><TD>Players</TD><TD>Percentage</TD></TR><TR vAlign=top><TD>Ravens</TD><TD>9</TD><TD>5</TD><TD>.556</TD></TR><TR vAlign=top><TD>Saints</TD><TD>9</TD><TD>5</TD><TD>.556</TD></TR><TR vAlign=top><TD>Broncos</TD><TD>15</TD><TD>7</TD><TD>.467</TD></TR><TR vAlign=top><TD>Jaguars</TD><TD>13</TD><TD>6</TD><TD>.461</TD></TR><TR vAlign=top><TD>Jets</TD><TD>13</TD><TD>6</TD><TD>.461</TD></TR><TR vAlign=top><TD>Eagles</TD><TD>13</TD><TD>6</TD><TD>.461</TD></TR><TR vAlign=top><TD>Panthers</TD><TD>11</TD><TD>5</TD><TD>.455</TD></TR><TR vAlign=top><TD>Redskins</TD><TD>11</TD><TD>5</TD><TD>.455</TD></TR><TR vAlign=top><TD>Falcons</TD><TD>9</TD><TD>4</TD><TD>.445</TD></TR><TR vAlign=top><TD>Steelers</TD><TD>14</TD><TD>6</TD><TD>.429</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

BOTTOM 10

<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=2 width=472 border=0><TBODY><TR vAlign=top><TD>Team</TD><TD>Picks</TD><TD>Players</TD><TD>Percentage</TD></TR><TR vAlign=top><TD>Browns</TD><TD>15</TD><TD>2</TD><TD>.133</TD></TR><TR vAlign=top><TD>Vikings</TD><TD>13</TD><TD>2</TD><TD>.154</TD></TR><TR vAlign=top><TD>Chiefs</TD><TD>11</TD><TD>2</TD><TD>.182</TD></TR><TR vAlign=top><TD>Cardinals</TD><TD>15</TD><TD>3</TD><TD>.200</TD></TR><TR vAlign=top><TD>Bears</TD><TD>14</TD><TD>3</TD><TD>.214</TD></TR><TR vAlign=top><TD>Bengals</TD><TD>12</TD><TD>3</TD><TD>.250</TD></TR><TR vAlign=top><TD>Seahawks</TD><TD>15</TD><TD>4</TD><TD>.267</TD></TR><TR vAlign=top><TD>Cowboys</TD><TD>11</TD><TD>3</TD><TD>.273</TD></TR><TR vAlign=top><TD>Patriots</TD><TD>11</TD><TD>3</TD><TD>.273</TD></TR><TR vAlign=top><TD>Chargers</TD><TD>7</TD><TD>2</TD><TD>.286</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>-- Clare Farnsworth
http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/football/219724_draft12.html

That's interesting. The Browns took Couch #1 overall, C. Brown #1 overall, G. Warren #3 overall, and William Green #16 overall during that time span. Their average selection was #5.75. Denver's was #22.25. Not only did we do better with later picks, we got C. Brown and G. Warren from Cleveland. Note the Bengals and Cardinals had early selections during those years too.

[plummershelper]

That's a great take Bosko. It makes me see that as dismal as things may appear here sometimes, there are others that are much worse off. I am truly greatful to all of the busts of others that divert attention away from our probs

[Billy Clyde Puckett]

The "Broncos can't draft" hype is just crap propigated by talk show hosts to generate calls. Only the truly uninformed would believe it without looking at reality

[Cito Pelon]

The "Broncos can't draft" hype is just crap propigated by talk show hosts to generate calls. Only the truly uninformed would believe it without looking at reality

Few studs, bud. And that's the trouble. Starters, ok, the FO gets starters, but awesome studs? Not often. Pryce was a stud pick, but that was long ago. Since then? Portis and DJ Williams. Mike Anderson, ok, I'll buy that. Al Wilson has had his moments. This has not been a productive FO on draft or FA. People can point to other teams and show how they've had dumb moves also, but that's immaterial to the bottom-line.

I remember when Denver picked Kennedy and Gold in the second round, Shanny said, hey these guys were good picks because they can be great special-team guys on a roster that is already Super Bowl quality roster. Yeah, well, they were special-team type of guys. Nothing spectacular.

Why draft guys that are special-teamers in the second round? Shanny, Bobby Beathard, same thing, different names.

[delany]

Few studs, bud. And that's the trouble. Starters, ok, the FO gets starters, but awesome studs? Not often. Pryce was a stud pick, but that was long ago. Since then? Portis and DJ Williams. Mike Anderson, ok, I'll buy that. Al Wilson has had his moments. This has not been a productive FO on draft or FA. People can point to other teams and show how they've had dumb moves also, but that's immaterial to the bottom-line.

I remember when Denver picked Kennedy and Gold in the second round, Shanny said, hey these guys were good picks because they can be great special-team guys on a roster that is already Super Bowl quality roster. Yeah, well, they were special-team type of guys. Nothing spectacular.

Why draft guys that are special-teamers in the second round? Shanny, Bobby Beathard, same thing, different names.

Would you also argue that a .300 hitter in baseball sucks because he only hits safely 1 in 3 times at the plate?

What kind of success rate do you want?!?

To say that it is 'immaterial to the bottom-line' what other clubs do is asinine. Everything is relative.

Going back to the baseball analogy....A .300 hitter would SUCK if everybody else was averaging .400....but they aren't hitting .400....and other front offices are not finding 'studs' at the drop of a hat.

BTW....Beathard had a great draft/FA record when he was with the 'skins

[Cito Pelon]

Would you also argue that a .300 hitter in baseball sucks because he only hits safely 1 in 3 times at the plate?

What kind of success rate do you want?!?

To say that it is 'immaterial to the bottom-line' what other clubs do is asinine. Everything is relative.

Going back to the baseball analogy....A .300 hitter would SUCK if everybody else was averaging .400....but they aren't hitting .400....and other front offices are not finding 'studs' at the drop of a hat.

BTW....Beathard had a great draft/FA record when he was with the 'skins

Studs! Studs, I said. That was the point. The percentage of solid starters is there for the Bronco FO, but they need to get 1-2 studs a year, and they haven't done that.

That's the difference, that's why this team can't get over the hump. They've focused on addinng as many quality players as they can, and I can't say that the FO hasn't tried to add studs, but they've gone about their stud-finding in odd ways. They tried to add the studs in FA, and missed badly, and until last year they had not traded up in the first-round for years, and you have to move up in the first-round sometimes to add those few special players. High First-rounders are cheaper than FA's these days.

[atwater58]

I know how David Baas seem to get quite a bit of pub around this site so I threw in a question to Pro Football Weekly on a chat earlier on espn.com- here it is


Mike (DC)
David Baas seems like an intriguing prospect- would it be too much of a reach for the Broncos to take him at #25 in the first round and fill an immediate need?

NOLAN NAWROCKI
Interior offensive lineman typically are not drafted in the first round, but the last guard to land in the first round out of Michigan - Steve Hutchinson - has proven worthy of the pick. I have talked to teams who think Baas could fit into the first round. His Combine workout really elevated his status, but he does not play as fast as he tests. The ability to play guard or center could intrigue a team enough to take in the first. The Broncos are a possibility, but he won't go much sooner than No. 25.

[Florida_Bronco]

I would like to see Denver pick up Richie Incognito if he's available in the 3rd round or later (which he may be).

I watched him play at Nebraska and he was a very very solid lineman and has loads of talent. He has some off the field problems but I think going to a generally high moral team like Denver will help him.

[DBroncos4life]

Studs! Studs, I said. That was the point. The percentage of solid starters is there for the Bronco FO, but they need to get 1-2 studs a year, and they haven't done that.

That's the difference, that's why this team can't get over the hump. They've focused on addinng as many quality players as they can, and I can't say that the FO hasn't tried to add studs, but they've gone about their stud-finding in odd ways. They tried to add the studs in FA, and missed badly, and until last year they had not traded up in the first-round for years, and you have to move up in the first-round sometimes to add those few special players. High First-rounders are cheaper than FA's these days.



name one team that drafts two STUDS a year?

[Mediator12]

name one team that drafts two STUDS a year?

Screw drafting, how about picks up and retains two studs every year period :kiddingme That is an insane objective!

Man, I know you are not with the program right now, but that is flat out ludicrous.

[Florida_Bronco]

I don't know many teams that have more than 2 or 3 studs PERIOD.