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Raider Bill
11-11-2004, 08:30 PM
How to Be Rich
Making money the new-fashioned way.

Rabbi Aryeh Spero

Every so often as I travel past Shea Stadium, I pass one of the colossal New York Times facilities. Hailing from the Midwest, I can attest to how the mammoth size of these plants equals and, in many cases, dwarfs the factories in Pittsburgh, Cleveland, and Detroit.


The drawings of the Times's future $550 million West Side corporate headquarters unveil a superstructure more opulent than the corporate offices of just about any Midwest manufacturer. Undoubtedly the Times and its liberal acolytes are comfortable, indeed proud, of their numerous sprawling complexes.

This is ironic given that liberal America, and the establishment newspaper and media outlets that advance its message, have demonized American corporations as the root of so many of our nation's problems. We went to Iraq, they say, to enrich corporations, and our health care is expensive, and our environment polluted owing to corporations.

Indeed, the Kerry duet, with thunderous applause from Democrat-convention delegates, boastfully finger-pointed not only at oil and drug companies but "those" corporations which, according to Kerry and colleagues, "do not pay their fair share of taxes." One would think they are Kerry's version of President Bush's "axis of evil."

Paramount's recent adaptation of The Manchurian Candidate is yet another in a never-ending series of Hollywood films depicting the "dangers" lurking behind Corporate America. But what is Paramount itself if not an Inc.? Evidently, in the liberal view, there are good corporations and bad ones.

Those "excessive" profits we always hear about cannot be what places a particular company on the black list, for, when looking at 2004's first-half net income, the East Coast New York Times earnings of $134 million is six times that of Halliburton's $22 million, located in Texas. Yet nary a complaint about the Times profits, while when in liberal precincts, a cocktail guest need only utter the simple word "Halliburton" and all concur with knowing, fraternal disgust. Diebold, Inc. of Canton, Ohio, a steel-lock manufacturer, whose CEO supports Republican candidates, has been pounded this year by liberals as "one of those corporations." Yet this Midwest manufacturer's first-half net income is a paltry $72 million compared to Disney's $1.23 billion. Some superstar actors and producers match Diebold's net!

Apparently, the good corporations are those that liberals either own, lead, or that pay their salaries. To name a few: computers, software, internet-related, media and publishing, entertainment, marketing, financial/investments services, apparel and, of course, trial lawyers. Liberal elites, and their children, are more likely to work in or own these services. As they often hint, this is where the smart and socially responsible people are — an updated version of their characterization of themselves as "the best and the brightest" when on campus during the 60s and 70s.

The old-line manufacturers they do not control, that do not attract and employ liberal elitists nor deliver the liberal message, and are located in certain regions of the country, are the Bad Ones. They are: oil, steel, mining, certain drug companies, beef, heavy machinery, utilities, autos, "male" recreationaries, forestry. Those on the Upper East Side and Santa Monica do not make their living logging, oil-rigging, or dressing steer carcasses.

Prior to the 80s, corporations and profits were reviled by student elitists. Now that they have grown into and endorse commerce — indeed, lead much of it — they have separated business categories along lines that allow them to retain their self-vaunted status as, always, "better." Many are now found among the recently announced "200 John Kerry Business Supporters."

This division by today's elitists as to what constitutes good or bad, itself a form of haute discrimination, is more than the perennial old-line vs. new-line or, in this case, pre-80s vs. post-80s. It goes even beyond the construct of what "we" — liberals — control vs. what "they" control. It is a value judgment based on who "we" are. Because our politics is liberal we are better people, and consequently the businesses we choose to lead or work in are ipso facto the most enlightened and worthwhile.

There is something unusually selfish in those who do not see the value, necessity, and social complexities inherent in industries labeled by the anointed as "socially irresponsible" — though they benefit from these products daily. This may be the first time in U.S. history that an attitudinal referendum toward money-making has been predicated on the sense of superiority born of one's politics.

Bygone blue-collar Democrats and their leaders, such as Harry Truman and Hubert Humphrey, were regular people. Their type no longer controls the Democrat party. Current leadership and behind-the-scenes shakers are of a different breed. Today's Democrat liberal elites imbibe and exude a classism that telegraphs that in whatever world we choose to participate, be it business or politics, we are the moral high ground, simply because of who we are, because we espouse a neo-socialist political outlook. Only "ours" is good.

That what is ours determines acceptability is best illustrated when listening to liberals deride the 80s as "the decade of greed." If so, the 90s were surely an even greater decade of greed and speculative frenzy! Obviously, whereas profits made during the Reagan decade constituted greed — bad-money — profit during "our" decade, the Clinton years, is good money.

Truth be told, the 80s was not a period of greed but of genuine growth. The stocks of the more traditional Dow Jones companies that boomed during the 80s are down only about 15-20 percent from their highs, and remain robust.
Contrast this with the speculative Internet bubble of the 90s which culminated in an historic wipeout. Yet no indictment of the 90s as a decade of greed has been forthcoming. In other words, these were politically correct companies from Democrat-heavy Silicon Valley. No "evil" there. Ironically, liberals hailed the profits of the 90s as reason to continue its administration — through the election of Al Gore.

Beyond that, there is a liberal intellectual pompousness that pontificates that money earned by Republican individuals and corporations, and tax revenues received during a Republican administration, will not be spent "correctly." However, tax revenues collected during a Democrat administration will be allocated "wisely" and money made by the "responsible" class, or by their businesses, and will be used for noble and compassionate projects.

There is a curious prism through which many liberal journalists and Hollywood types look at "out-of-favor" corporations. Listening to them, one would believe there is no intrinsic value to these companies except to provide jobs. Its particular product and very existence as a manufacturer of goods is viewed as secondary, almost unnecessary. Even oil!

But to their own product, which is the proliferation of the liberal message, they ascribe intrinsic importance, regardless if it creates jobs or not. They are convinced that, unlike other industries, what they in the media and Hollywood do is in itself entirely for the social good. Thus their self-righteousness and willingness to be paid the kind of mind-boggling salaries they find unacceptable when given to industrial CEOs.

Exorbitant trial-lawyer fees that generally provide meager pay-offs to class-action plaintiffs are never criticized by media types inasmuch as they, too, are perceived as enhancing the social good by going after the "terrible" corporations. Besides, through romanticized trial lawyers, Democrats reach into the pockets of those out-of-favor corporations that may not normally donate to them. The selective corporate attacks by Democrats and their media allies is an unexpressed election strategy.

But the self-righteous rarely revisit their sins, nor correct the falsehoods they propagate.

How many small community hospitals have been shut down, competent doctors railroaded out of their practice, and businesses and jobs shut down forever because of trial lawyers? Not to mention the damaged reputations and lives of those with conservative beliefs the media have set out to destroy. Hollywood may consider itself "green," but it has polluted the mental and social environment.

Political self-righteousness never demands introspection, and leads to "the end justifies the means." It is dangerous. Of Michael Moore's propagandary, Fahrenheit 911, while columnist Paul Krugman of the New York Times concedes that, in many regards, it is misleading and inaccurate, the "need" to expose President Bush overrides the usual requisite for factual truth. A neo-Com need only answer to his political agenda, not classical virtue.

To be sure, many wealthy liberal pretenders who condemn certain corporations do so as a way of assuaging their guilt and turning the wealth-spotlight away from them. For example, as in John Edwards's distortion: "Two Americas." They criticize not despite their wealth but precisely because of it. They have proven they can successfully do this without impairing their own grandiose lifestyle. But as in Orwell's Animal Farm, they are themselves the epitome of what they criticize.

History is still open as to what constitutes the greatest danger to society, the middle class, and traditional institutions. Is it an elitist class who sees in social engineering the answer to its hunger for self-purpose, control, and alleviation of guilt? Or is it the smugness of those who feel that whatever they do is correct and moral because of the liberalism they espouse, because of who they are?

Such self-righteousness and arrogance spawn a cult of personality, a class that sees itself above regular law. Its law is power, purchased through its own colossal wealth.

— Rabbi Aryeh Spero is host of the radio talk show Talking Sense with Rabbi Aryeh Spero and president of Caucus for America.

Spider
11-11-2004, 08:35 PM
LOL ...... Gee i expect the We hate LABF crowd to be jumping all over you ....... After all you are doing the same things he did ..........

enjolras
11-12-2004, 12:07 PM
THis guy did a fundamentally awesome job of ignoring the real argument made on the left. While there are, undoubetedly, those who beleive that corporations and wealth are bad (see the guy arguing for 80% tax rates on the wealthy on this board).. that isn't really the popular line.

The concern among the people is that corporate interests are being put ahead of the interests of the American people. There are a lot battles being fought today (IE: patents, copyrights, liability, etc..) that the PEOPLE seem to lose on. The perception is that government has become about representing the interests of the corporations and the corporations only. It's not that the people have a problem with wealth, but simply a problem with wealth at the expense of the rights of the citizens.

When they complain about Haliburton, it's not about the fact that Haliburton makes money.. it's about the fact that they received a contract under extremely dubious circumstances to clean up after a war shrouded in controversy.

Thus, there is no problem with a rich man being a liberal. There are many CEO's that have a serious problem with the amount of influence these corporations have in government(I've met several over the last few years). It's not some liberal conspiracy to assauge their guilt, but rather a true political belief about how a nation should fundamentally be ran. As it stands today it's far to easy to BUY influence in government, a concern that is most definitely shared on both sides of the aisle.

Billy Clyde Puckett
11-12-2004, 12:33 PM
The concern among the people is that corporate interests are being put ahead of the interests of the American people. There are a lot battles being fought today (IE: patents, copyrights, liability, etc..) that the PEOPLE seem to lose on. The perception is that government has become about representing the interests of the corporations and the corporations only. It's not that the people have a problem with wealth, but simply a problem with wealth at the expense of the rights of the citizens.

.

What you are forgetting is that corporations are not Scooge McDuck sitting on a pile of gold. The responsibility of a corporation is to provide profits for its investors so it must protect its property and any competative advantage that is legal. Who are those investors - probably you either directly or indirectly. In addition, without profits companies cannot grow and hire more people. Yes there are bad guys out there in the business world the same way there are bad lawyer, politicians, educators, truck driver (come on spider, there are at least one or two), bar tenders, etc.

I agree there is way too much money influencing our elections. I don't have any solutions other than a complete overhaul of our electoral system.

Spider
11-12-2004, 12:52 PM
Yes there are bad guys out there in the business world the same way there are bad lawyer, politicians, educators, truck driver (come on spider, there are at least one or two), bar tenders, etc.
What? No way ;D
As a democrat Let me explain the way I think it should be , and why I think the Democratic party is bestter despite it's flaws ..........
I am not against rich people , In fact I have alot of Reletives that are in the way upper class around Denver , Parker , Central city/ Black hawk area .....
The world needs rich people ,and the world needs ditch diggers , one is just as valueble as the other , when it comes to the economic circle ,Now what i stand for is making the Ditch Diggers life an easier one , Dont kid yourself , I know alot of Rich People , I know if they can screw you out of a Nickle they will just on principal ..... But the Rich Hire the Poor to work the fields , Manage other workers on and on ...... Now I support some forms of Coperate Welfare , just as I support some private sector Welfare , Both forms of Welfare are an investment , But the Private sector doesnt repay with raising thier Kids right , and you have Companies still laying off workers while taking a Hiring tax break ... but it is still worth a shot ...........
Now here is one Problem I see right now , we have Job Growth , it is all great , but the Job Growth doesnt pay what the old job did ..... I know I cant stop outsourcing , but we can restrict it by encouraging economic expansion ......
we need the good paying Jobs back ........
What I stand for is , Here Big guy you worked your ass off today , here is a little somthing extra in your Pay check , here take this help with Health care , and while we are at it , here are some breaks on your grocery bill .......
I know this wont make you rich , but what it will do is allow you to put a few $$ 's away for a rainy day or retirement ........

W*GS
11-12-2004, 01:06 PM
As it stands today it's far to easy to BUY influence in government, a concern that is most definitely shared on both sides of the aisle.

If the government wasn't attempting to regulate every millisecond of every aspect of our existence, then there would a lot less influence-peddling.

"When buying and selling are legislated, the first things bought and sold are legislators." -- P.J. O'Rourke

patteeu
11-12-2004, 01:11 PM
LOL ...... Gee i expect the We hate LABF crowd to be jumping all over you ....... After all you are doing the same things he did ..........

No one jumps on Beerslug or Rohirrim for posting articles. LABF gets abused because (a) a good portion of his posts are nothing but mocking cartoons, (b) very few of his posts contain original, thoughtful comments, and (c) when he does comment he spices up his commentary with gratuitous namecalling (that I find humorous, but inevitably have the effect of diminishing his arguments in most cases). Beyond that, LABF rarely engages in dialogue, but instead either talks past those who would engage him or jumps immediately to namecalling. It's his style, and that's OK with me, but you ought to be able to draw a few distinctions between what njbil is doing here and what LABF normally does.

Spider
11-12-2004, 01:16 PM
No one jumps on Beerslug or Rohirrim for posting articles. LABF gets abused because (a) a good portion of his posts are nothing but mocking cartoons, (b) very few of his posts contain original, thoughtful comments, and (c) when he does comment he spices up his commentary with gratuitous namecalling (that I find humorous, but inevitably have the effect of diminishing his arguments in most cases). Beyond that, LABF rarely engages in dialogue, but instead either talks past those who would engage him or jumps immediately to namecalling. It's his style, and that's OK with me, but you ought to be able to draw a few distinctions between what njbil is doing here and what LABF normally does.
I see , so basicaly if you agree with it Spam is ok , or if the said Spammer shows respect , then Spamming is welcomed , but if said Spammer post somthing you disagree with , then he is deranged lunitic on welfare ......... does that cover it ?

patteeu
11-12-2004, 01:49 PM
I see , so basicaly if you agree with it Spam is ok , or if the said Spammer shows respect , then Spamming is welcomed , but if said Spammer post somthing you disagree with , then he is deranged lunitic on welfare ......... does that cover it ?

uh... no.

Did I call njbil's post spam? If I did, it was a mistake.

But you are on to a small piece of the truth. If a poster shows a lack of respect, [s]he will probably get a lack of respect in return.

TexanBob
11-12-2004, 02:04 PM
All throughout the McCain-Feingold CFR debate, we heard proponents claim that passing that bill would "take the money out of politics".

Yeah, that's why George Soros is now able to dump billions into assorted 527 companies in an effort to affect the election. And yet when the Swift Boat Veterans got a measley amount of seed money to start their attacks on Kerry, you would have thought it was a constitutional crisis.

And I don't believe for a minute that the pols did not know what they were setting up when they created this debacle. In the top five things I hope the new Congress does, one should be repealing this miserable bill.

Spider
11-12-2004, 02:05 PM
uh... no.

Did I call njbil's post spam? If I did, it was a mistake.

But you are on to a small piece of the truth. If a poster shows a lack of respect, [s]he will probably get a lack of respect in return.
of course you didnt call NJBils post spam you agree with it , only proves my point ........ as for a small part of the truth ... Hilarious! if that is a small part , then your denial is larger then i thought ..........

Raider Bill
11-12-2004, 02:49 PM
TJ's definition of spam is when your name is the author of almost every thread on the first page. I thought this was a good article that would fuel some debate nothing more. At least the author wasn't wearing a tin foil hat when he wrote it. It's a serious article from a serious conservative author. LABF rarely posts anything from a serious liberal, usually the tin foil hat crowd.


Also there was no need to bump my own thread (an extremely weak tactic LABF employs constantly) with 15 photoshops... so the article served it's purpose.

Spider
11-12-2004, 02:58 PM
TJ's definition of spam is when your name is the author of almost every thread on the first page. and he found out that was weak cause people responed to LABF threads ....... I thought this was a good article that would fuel some debate nothing more. well good thing you are not paid to think ...... At least the author wasn't wearing a tin foil hat when he wrote it. Dont knock the tin foil hat untill you have tried it ... It's a serious article from a serious conservative author. LABF rarely posts anything from a serious liberal, usually the tin foil hat crowd. so says you , we have already seen where your thinking leads to , you're a Raider fan enough said on that .... those Articals LABF Posted were the same difintion to him as you just gave me about youres ....


Also there was no need to bump my own thread (an extremely weak tactic LABF employs constantly) with 15 photoshops... so the article served it's purpose.
Bumping your own thread , but if he doesnt he gets blamed for starting to many threads ..... your Logic lives up to Raider fan standards ...... and the only reason you didnt like the cartoons was they bashed Bush ...... I got a cartoon for you , please feel free to tell me if this is Spam . I bet 99.9% of the Bronco fans will say this isnt spam . and it is funny .......

Raider Bill
11-12-2004, 03:55 PM
and he found out that was weak cause people responed to LABF threads .......

Mainly LABF..


....... well good thing you are not paid to think ...... Dont knock the tin foil hat untill you have tried it ... so says you , we have already seen where your thinking leads to , you're a Raider fan enough said on that .... those Articals LABF Posted were the same difintion to him as you just gave me about youres .... .......


"Artical" "difinitoin" "youres".. dude, you're borderline illiterate. I wouldn't go knocking anyone elses critical thinking skills.



....... Bumping your own thread , but if he doesnt he gets blamed for starting to many threads ..... your Logic lives up to Raider fan standards ...... and the only reason you didnt like the cartoons was they bashed Bush ...... I got a cartoon for you , please feel free to tell me if this is Spam . I bet 99.9% of the Bronco fans will say this isnt spam . and it is funny .......

Again "cartoons was"? Here in the English speaking world you would use the plural verb "were" since the object of the sentence is also plural.

About the cartoon though. I'm sure Denver fans would find it funny, but there are two points I'd like to make.

1. What the hell does it have to do with this thread?

2. Spam to me would imply multiple bumping of a thread with several of such said cartoons etc because the original post was too weak to stay on the front page.

Spider
11-12-2004, 04:05 PM
Mainly LABF..
you said Originally Posted by njbil
TJ's definition of spam is when your name is the author of almost every thread on the first page.
So whats he to do ? you Biatch about too many threads , then you Biatch about him Bumping the ones he already made ........ astounding


.


"Artical" "difinitoin" "youres".. dude, you're borderline illiterate. I wouldn't go knocking anyone elses critical thinking skills. uh oh .Spelling smack Ha! Nice way to dodge everything I said .....



.

Again "cartoons was"? Here in the English speaking world you would use the plural verb "were" since the object of the sentence is also plural.
ooooooo throwing out the big guns ...... Grammer smack ......

About the cartoon though. I'm sure Denver fans would find it funny, but there are two points I'd like to make.

1. What the hell does it have to do with this thread?
Ha! The point was , you didnt like it , but others would so it wouldnt be spam

2. Spam to me would imply multiple bumping of a thread with several of such said cartoons etc because the original post was too weak to stay on the front page.

Again ..........So whats he to do ? you Biatch about too many threads , then you Biatch about him Bumping the ones he already made ........ I think you should just stick with Sniffing Truckers assholes NJBil , Remember you telling me you did that .........

Raider Bill
11-12-2004, 04:33 PM
you said
So whats he to do ? you Biatch about too many threads , then you Biatch about him Bumping the ones he already made ........ astounding .........


Either way the end result is the same, the entire page is littered with LABF posts..


.





.


ooooooo throwing out the big guns ...... Grammer smack ..............

Irony ... ain't it a bitch.


Ha! The point was , you didnt like it , but others would so it wouldnt be spam.........

It wouldn't be spam here or there in a thread. To me the quantity not the subject of the pics is at issue... Either way, this isn't my board so this argument is strictly academic.



Again ..........So whats he to do ? you Biatch about too many threads , then you Biatch about him Bumping the ones he already made ...........

If noone feels compelled to respond to a thread, just let it die. That's my belief, but again, ,it's not my board so this discussion is purely academic.

...... I think you should just stick with Sniffing Truckers assholes NJBil , Remember you telling me you did that .........

Yea, sure I did. Perhaps you should stop nailing your fat sister. I think that was discussed before in other threads so it must be true. :threadjac

Spider
11-12-2004, 04:54 PM
Either way the end result is the same, the entire page is littered with LABF posts..
LOL justify ........


.




Irony ... ain't it a bitch.
Yeah it is you biatching about spam beats all I ever seen




It wouldn't be spam here or there in a thread. To me the quantity not the subject of the pics is at issue... Either way, this isn't my board so this argument is strictly academic. . you need to huddle up with the other Anti LABF crowd and get some understanding .......





If noone feels compelled to respond to a thread, just let it die. That's my belief, but again, ,it's not my board so this discussion is purely academic.
I wasnt going to respond but I just couldnt resist taking a shot .....


Yea, sure I did. Perhaps you should stop nailing your fat sister. I think that was discussed before in other threads so it must be true. :threadjac
Differnce is I never admitted to nailing my sister ....... But then my fat sister would be the best piece of ass you ever had ;D

Raider Bill
11-12-2004, 05:00 PM
Differnce is I never admitted to nailing my sister ....... But then my fat sister would be the best piece of ass you ever had ;D


The implication being that your knowledge of your sisters sexual prowess is from first hand experience.

Spider
11-12-2004, 05:01 PM
The implication being that your knowledge of your sisters sexual prowess is from first hand experience.
Ha! everyone knows my sister ...............