Now that the election is over ..... Iraq

[Spider]

Now that the election is over and we are all Americans , how do we best win the peace in Iraq ?

[Bronco_Beerslug]

Now that the election is over and we are all Americans , how do we best win the peace in Iraq ?
There will be no peace in Iraq as long as there are U.S. troops there. As soon as we leave the religious radical nutbags will take control, if not sooner.

[baja]

We are in a lose lose situtation just like many said we would be BEFORE Bush sent the order to attack with out a real coalition.

[watermock]

It's not a matter of a coalition. It's a matter that the Muslims listen to their Mullahs. It was letting the Genie out of the box and Bush and Rummy totally miscalculated. I warned about this as soon as we went in. I still think it was good to take out Hussein the mass murder, but now we have a new crop.

I have literally no respect whatsoever for that religion and their ignorance. We bail them out and it's just going to fall into a theocracy. I said a long time ago to let the Kurds have their turf, and to go into Syria. Iranians will pour into Basara and try to create a **** theocracy. It's like Bad, Badder and Worst in that craphole unlike Sears, who would give you Good, Better, Best.

[Spider]

well way I see it is , we cant pull out , Mock is right there , who knows what kind of Iraq we would have , those soldiers that died there would have died in vain , that isnt an option ......... Now that we are in there , we have to win , thats the bottom line ..... I stated my plan on another thread , it wasnt well recieved , but that was the only way I saw for us to get out .........

[baja]

It's not a matter of a coalition. It's a matter that the Muslims listen to their Mullahs. It was letting the Genie out of the box and Bush and Rummy totally miscalculated. I warned about this as soon as we went in. I still think it was good to take out Hussein the mass murder, but now we have a new crop.

I have literally no respect whatsoever for that religion and their ignorance. We bail them out and it's just going to fall into a theocracy. I said a long time ago to let the Kurds have their turf, and to go into Syria. Iranians will pour into Basara and try to create a **** theocracy. It's like Bad, Badder and Worst in that craphole unlike Sears, who would give you Good, Better, Best.

Maybe that had something to do with lack of global support. Hell we even offered Turkey something like 17 billion to use afew acres of their land as a staging plae and they turned us down cold. The fact that they are dirt poor and call the area home yet said no to 17 billion says a lot IMO

[baja]

I don't think anyone, even Dean, said we should just pull out.

The solution lays in the UN and a coalition of free nations and that has always been the only solution.

[watermock]

Turkey was worried about the Kurds for some damn reason. They are just trying to survive. There is a Kurd contingent in Turkey, but they have not raised a finger. Turkey dropped the ball and it cost billions to move the 3rd Division thru Suez and move it thru Basra.

Turkey can go screw themselves. They were going thru an election so whatever. The Kurds were not going to invade Turkey. It's typical Muslim mentality. We put alot of pressure on them, but in the long run, it's better they didn't lose the election anyway. It's all so screwed up there, you never know what will happen next. Luckily, the Kurds were able to hold their ground so they have solid ground. What happens when the Shia take over who knows.

I wanted a partition a long time ago. The Kurds already have their own, functioning, peacefull government. If Turkey wanted to be pricks, screw them and let the Kurds govern themselves, they allready are. Worry about the bottom 2/3's of Iraq.

[Billy Clyde Puckett]

No 1 - we cannot pull out cold. We need to see them through the election and help them set up their own security.

I understand from my Muslim friends (mostly from Pakistan) that a good portion of those fighting us in Iraq are extremist from other countries that have come to Iraq tho fight a holy war and that the vast majority of Muslims do not support them. We need to stop attacking their religion and hunt down the extremist leaders. We have to understand that their culture is different than ours and work within those boundries. there are plenty of little things we can do to help in that regard. For instance, whether we agree or not, women are subsurviant in their society. They are insulted that we have women soldiers in uniform commanding our men and their's. I don't have a problem with women in the military, but maybe it would help if we did not have them visible on their soil. We are only going to be able to do this if we get the cooperation of the leaders of most of those countires and isolate the rest. I think it is extemely important that when Arafat dies, probably in the next few days, that we insure a peaceful transition of power by offering support to the moderate palastinians and keeping the lid on Isreal.

[Crushaholic]

We'll probably be there through next year, depending on how smoothly the January elections go. They'll elect a transitional government in January and have longer term elections in December of next year. We can't let them go at it alone just yet.

[Rock Chalk]

To win the peace replace the Iraqi's with Americans ;D

Im sorry, but when fanatical bastards are still out there there will never be peace, not in iraq, not in Israel, not in the US. No where. Attack the root of the problem not the foliage. Going after the leaves will do very little good if the roots remain to spring them up anew.

[TheDave]

To win the peace replace the Iraqi's with Americans ;D

Im sorry, but when fanatical bastards are still out there there will never be peace, not in iraq, not in Israel, not in the US. No where. Attack the root of the problem not the foliage. Going after the leaves will do very little good if the roots remain to spring them up anew.


Here comes our resident genius with those Human Vs. Plant analogies.... :hitself:

[Rock Chalk]

Its an analogy Dave.

Would you rather I said cut off the serpents head and the tail won't flick?

Whatever.

And yes, I am a genius. Thanks for noticing.

[enjolras]

I really beleive we're going to be in Iraq for at least another decade.. Building a country takes time. From what I've seen and read it seems like what's going on in Iraq is less holy war, and more extreme frusturation. When the news organizations talk to Iraqi's opposing the U.S. they never talk about religion.. they talk about security, looting, and running water.

The Iraqi people beleive that we are there simply to steal their oil.. they think we don't care about them or their lives. Two years later they feel like we haven't really done anything to help them get things back together.. this creates a climate where the true extremists (who ARE fighting some kind of insane holy war) to blend in. We HAVE to win these hearts and minds...we need to get our beurocrats out of the way and send in people who can actually achieve some damn results. If we can get the support and confidence of the Iraqi people.. it becomes MUCH more difficult for the terrorists to operate and they will be quickly rooted out.

Until then those people are going to be grasping at whatever straws they can find, and that currently seems to be power hungry religious leaders...

I also beleive taking a proactive role in fixing what's going on in Isreal might be the key. In order for the Iraqi's to beleive that we are on their side, they need to see that we don't have a side in THAT conflict. Bush needs to make good on his promise to work towards a true palestinian state... not in principle, but with clear goals in mind. Set a deadline and force both sides to the table... and get a deal done.

[Cito Pelon]

The best we can do is keep money and weapons out of the region. That requires international cooperation.

It's time for the big weapons-exporting countries to begin cooperating instead of competing. It would be easy to shut down Iran and N. Korea with cooperation in the UN Security Council. Trouble is there's no trust.

So who's going to f*ck up the rest of them? Show them who's boss? I was worried it would come down to that, and it pretty much has. There's still some wiggle room, but the lines have pretty much been drawn. The US is pissed off, and Europe, instead of saying "OK, just relax, we'll help you take care of the problem," says "We resent your power." Having a fat-mouthed punk as President doesn't help the situation, but there we are.

And China doesn't help the situation at all. The Chinese culture believes they are the Middle Kingdom - they stand between Heaven and Earth - and that attitude isn't going to fade away with giving them economic benefits.

It seems to me that it's coming down to who can kick who's ass. There's plenty of nations that want to see the US's downfall. Powerful nations. So we need tax revenue.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

We are in a lose lose situtation just like many said we would be BEFORE Bush sent the order to attack with out a real coalition.

Bingo.

And there are actually people in America who voted for four more years of the same village idiot who conned us into this thing in the first place?

Unreal.

Well, I guess the one bright side is that when things really turn to sh*t, the rethugs won't be able to blame Kerry (although they'll undoubtedly find some way to make it Clinton's fault.)

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

I really beleive we're going to be in Iraq for at least another decade.. Building a country takes time.

Time and money.

For a guy who said he was against "nation building," the Mad Cowboy sure seems to be in a hurry to bankrupt America with never-ending spending for his nation building enterprise.

As for the time issue, as soon as there are indicators that the bush mafia wants to establish permanent military bases in Iraq, a permanent war with islamic terrorist groups is all but guaranteed.

Smirk may want the US to stay in Iraq for at least another decade and to have his own Viet Nam experience, but can we afford it? How will we pay for it?

So far, the answer from Team Smirk is 'greater and greater deficit spending.'