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go_broncos
02-03-2014, 05:52 AM
How the hell did he win the Superbowl before?..
He is opposite of Elway in clutch situations.
I will take wilson or kaepernick over manning.

Not sure what Elway saw in manning.

Manning plays like **** in pressure situations.
Isray - your analysis is accurate.

If there is a Hall of shame/chokers, Manning and Champ will be in the top of the list.

Elway - please think hard and cut manning, Fox and the other chokers.

There is no place for good people in NFL..Players should be nasty and play with fire. There are no leaders in this team.Manning,Champ and Fox are too good people and we don't want them.

Need to have players like Sherman, Kapernick.

Action
02-03-2014, 05:57 AM
How the hell did he win the Superbowl before?..
He is opposite of Elway in clutch situations.
I will take wilson or kaepernick over manning.

Not sure what Elway saw in manning.

Manning plays like **** in pressure situations.
Isray - your analysis is accurate.

If there is a Hall of shame/chokers, Manning and Champ will be in the top of the list.

Elway - please think hard and cut manning, Fox and the other chokers.

There is no place for good people in NFL..Players should be nasty and play with fire. There are no leaders in this team.Manning,Champ and Fox are too good people and we don't want them.

Need to have players like Sherman, Kapernick.

Kaepernick, the QB that threw an interception on game deciding drives 2 years in a row?


****, you are a dumb ****

spiralism
02-03-2014, 06:04 AM
Rex Grossman. That's how he has a ring.

TheReverend
02-03-2014, 06:07 AM
Kaepernick, the QB that threw an interception on game deciding drives 2 years in a row?


****, you are a dumb ****

You realize Manning threw an interception on a game deciding drive last year and that this year he played so ****ing bad he didnt even have the opportunity to have a game deciding drive, right?

It seems by your expletives that you actually don't realize that.

RhymesayersDU
02-03-2014, 06:07 AM
Fun fact: we traded away the draft rights to Kaepernick.

Action
02-03-2014, 06:24 AM
You realize Manning threw an interception on a game deciding drive last year and that this year he played so ****ing bad he didnt even have the opportunity to have a game deciding drive, right?

It seems by your expletives that you actually don't realize that.

Did I mention anything about Manning or allude to anything in reference to the Denver Broncos in my post?

errand
02-03-2014, 06:25 AM
And so it begins.....

jmz313
02-03-2014, 06:27 AM
Manning got to and won his SB on timely Defensive Play. He was not well above average that playoff season at all. He won because the team played well.

Drunk Monkey
02-03-2014, 06:27 AM
This place won't be habitable for at least a week.

Raider9175
02-03-2014, 06:33 AM
How the hell did he win the Superbowl before?..
He is opposite of Elway in clutch situations.
I will take wilson or kaepernick over manning.

Not sure what Elway saw in manning.

Manning plays like **** in pressure situations.
Isray - your analysis is accurate.

If there is a Hall of shame/chokers, Manning and Champ will be in the top of the list.

Elway - please think hard and cut manning, Fox and the other chokers.

There is no place for good people in NFL..Players should be nasty and play with fire. There are no leaders in this team.Manning,Champ and Fox are too good people and we don't want them.

Need to have players like Sherman, Kapernick.

You can't come IN Eli Manning house , and try to out due your brother. (who has been money in the super bowl)

Here is my take. The two week layoff hurts offenses more than it does defense. Can't say they would have beat Seattle, but the game definitely would have been closer, if they played right after the Conference Championships.

Also finally not having R Clady and Von Miller finally caught up with them. Both could have been a big difference in that game.
Well lets just say there won't be too many fans wearing there Bronco uniforms today.(only kids in some other country- wearing Broncos super bowl Champs)

TheReverend
02-03-2014, 06:35 AM
Did I mention anything about Manning or allude to anything in reference to the Denver Broncos in my post?

Then why do you feel justified calling him a "stupid mother ****er" for wanting a guy who accomplished more the past two years and is over a decade younger?

go_broncos
02-03-2014, 06:36 AM
Kaepernick, the QB that threw an interception on game deciding drives 2 years in a row?


****, you are a dumb ****

I will take Kap over manning any time. Manning teams are soft.

stoxman
02-03-2014, 06:37 AM
Fun fact: we traded away the draft rights to Kaepernick.

AND we passed over Wilson to draft Oz!

oubronco
02-03-2014, 06:38 AM
This isn't just on Manning the coaches had a horrible gameplan and they just got their asses handed to them the blame goes to everybody

TheReverend
02-03-2014, 06:39 AM
This isn't just on Manning the coaches had a horrible gameplan and they just got their asses handed to them the blame goes to everybody

+1

This was a team [of slack-jawed pussies] effort.

go_broncos
02-03-2014, 06:41 AM
This isn't just on Manning the coaches had a horrible gameplan and they just got their asses handed to them the blame goes to everybody

Manning offenses are soft.there's a reason why he won only one SB despite going to playoffs almost every year.

I enjoyed Tebow year more than manning's and it's unfortunate.

oubronco
02-03-2014, 06:46 AM
I can understand disappointment but C'mon man

go_broncos
02-03-2014, 06:52 AM
Kaepernick, the QB that threw an interception on game deciding drives 2 years in a row?


****, you are a dumb ****

you do realize that Kap almost won the games for them.

Arkie
02-03-2014, 07:00 AM
QBs over the past 8 seasons....

Eli, Brady, and Ben took their teams to two Super Bowls each. Brees and Rodgers took their teams to one Super Bowl. Rivers, Romo, and Ryan haven't done ****.


PFM took his team to THREE SBs (two franchises, three head coaches)

CEH
02-03-2014, 07:20 AM
Manning and co will be a favorite again next year in the AFC. The true defenses play in the NFC.


You can blow it up and hope to follow a new blueprint or try to find a way to get the defense to generate some turnovers.

Dr. Broncenstein
02-03-2014, 07:23 AM
Welcome to reality. It's been a fun regular season but regular season star wars rules go out the window come January.

TheReverend
02-03-2014, 07:30 AM
Manning and co will be a favorite again next year in the AFC. The true defenses play in the NFC.


You can blow it up and hope to follow a new blueprint or try to find a way to get the defense to generate some turnovers.

Maybe then they can get their ass kicked slightly less.

We could try to petition the competition committee to take off pads and play with flags. Goodell would get behind that.

CEH
02-03-2014, 07:30 AM
Welcome to reality. It's been a fun regular season but regular season star wars rules go out the window come January.

IMO there are only two teams San Fran and Sea that play the true smash mouth defense. Even in 2012 Denver was #2 in Defense but in no way do I look at that defense and think SEA or San Fran


What to do? Pressure on the QB is a tried and true indicator a of great defense.

Can Denver somehow get that 4th qtr pass rush with this team's salary cap.

CEH
02-03-2014, 07:35 AM
Maybe then they can get their ass kicked slightly less.

We could try to petition the competition committee to take off pads and play with flags. Goodell would get behind that.

That fine but it's reality. Back in 97 all we heard was the AFC could not win the Super Bowl, I don't want to go get blown out like the last 3 times yada yada yada

Same thing is starting to happen again. That's fine I seen it before so it's nothing new to me.

B-Large
02-03-2014, 07:41 AM
And so it begins.....

It should begin though. Manning, while great and nobody questions that, eats up a **** load of cap room. Also, I think this team leans WAY to much on him to cover up up our weaknesses.

Maybe the league has changed, and you don't need a HOF QB, rather a fast aggressive blistering defense.

There should be healthy debate about moving on into another direction... I don't ever want to see that again. That was humiliating.

If Elway thinks bringing this whole team back as is next year with the thought that staying healthier is the recipe, I trust him in that move. If he decides a more balanced team is best and Manning is not in that scenario, again, I trust him.

As it stands, I think even healthy if that game is played 10 times we might lose 8 out of 10 times. Something needs to change.

Dr. Broncenstein
02-03-2014, 07:41 AM
IMO there are only two teams San Fran and Sea that play the true smash mouth defense. Even in 2012 Denver was #2 in Defense but in no way do I look at that defense and think SEA or San Fran


What to do? Pressure on the QB is a tried and true indicator a of great defense.

Can Denver somehow get that 4th qtr pass rush with this team's salary cap.

Teams that aren't immediately trying to build on the Seattle/San Francisco model are hosed. You can have all the regular season offense but without a mobile upper tier quarterback and a dominant defense, it won't matter. Defense gets away with murder in the post season. This has been the defensive model for beating Manning his entire career.

yerner
02-03-2014, 07:42 AM
His lack of athleticism was really striking last night. Dude is a statue. It is his fatal flaw and the reason he can't be considered the best of all time. His physical ability is just too limited and it's hurt him most in big games when the pocket collapses.

TheReverend
02-03-2014, 07:42 AM
That fine but it's reality. Back in 97 all we heard was the AFC could not win the Super Bowl, I don't want to go get blown out like the last 3 times yada yada yada

Same thing is starting to happen again. That's fine I seen it before so it's nothing new to me.

Back in 97 we had a well-coached and prepared team that had a chip on their shoulder that gave them the drive to compete.

This is not 1997 or 1998. Last night was a painful reminder of that.

LetsGoBroncos
02-03-2014, 07:48 AM
I can't believe how short sighted some of you are. We played an awful game all around, and Manning actually played better than most of his teammates. Aside from the one bad interception where he missed J.T. what are you guys blaming him for? We had to kickoff both halves of the game, and were behind from the opening snap. Unbelievable. We played AWFUL. End of story. Just a very bad time to do it

B-Large
02-03-2014, 07:49 AM
Back in 97 we had a well-coached and prepared team that had a chip on their shoulder that gave them the drive to compete.

This is not 1997 or 1998. Last night was a painful reminder of that.

The whole offense looked ambivalent....

The 97-98 teams would have embarassed this Broncos team head to head.

I can't think of a more gutless showing than last night. Every one of those Broncos players should be ashamed of that **** they took last night.

TonyR
02-03-2014, 07:54 AM
I can't believe how short sighted some of you are. We played an awful game all around, and Manning actually played better than most of his teammates. Aside from the one bad interception where he missed J.T. what are you guys blaming him for? We had to kickoff both halves of the game, and were behind from the opening snap. Unbelievable. We played AWFUL. End of story. Just a very bad time to do it

Yup, lots of stupid going on here. No, Manning didn't play well. But most of his mistakes were forced by a D that was in his face all game. Pocket passers generally struggle when under constant pressure. This isn't anything new and I'm surprised how many people don't seem to be even aware of it.

B-Large
02-03-2014, 07:55 AM
I can't believe how short sighted some of you are. We played an awful game all around, and Manning actually played better than most of his teammates. Aside from the one bad interception where he missed J.T. what are you guys blaming him for? We had to kickoff both halves of the game, and were behind from the opening snap. Unbelievable. We played AWFUL. End of story. Just a very bad time to do it

It's the same old story... Manning on an island, Nobody is helping Manning... He's like the perpetual ****ing victim. People are tired of hearing about it, hearing about his heroic perpetration and film room work... Because the result has become a pattern..

Mannings unit played like a bunch of scared, intimidated pussies that went through the motions last night. Sorry, I hold him accountable, that was a terrible performance of epic proportions.

SonOfLe-loLang
02-03-2014, 07:59 AM
It's the same old story... Manning on an island, Nobody is helping Manning... He's like the perpetual ****ing victim. People are tired of hearing about it, hearing about his heroic perpetration and film room work... Because the result has become a pattern..

Mannings unit played like a bunch of scared, intimidated pussies that went through the motions last night. Sorry, I hold him accountable, that was a terrible performance of epic proportions.

He played like ****. But he also got us to the Super Bowl. I don't see why "tearing down the team" is the answer. Why woukd that guarantee success? Football is not a rebuilding sport anymore

ColoradoDarin
02-03-2014, 07:59 AM
His lack of athleticism was really striking last night. Dude is a statue. It is his fatal flaw and the reason he can't be considered the best of all time. His physical ability is just too limited and it's hurt him most in big games when the pocket collapses.

There was one play that he got outside of the pocket and probably could have picked up 8-10 yards with his feet, think it was incomplete (I'm trying to block out this game from going into my permanent memory)

B-Large
02-03-2014, 08:00 AM
Yup, lots of stupid going on here. No, Manning didn't play well. But most of his mistakes were forced by a D that was in his face all game. Pocket passers generally struggle when under constant pressure. This isn't anything new and I'm surprised how many people don't seem to be even aware of it.

We pay the guy a Kings Ransom and the results are the same.

The excuses are getting thin. If he can't get his unit which he owns to step up and overcome even a stifling defense, what sense does it make to bring back the same plan next season?

B-Large
02-03-2014, 08:03 AM
He played like ****. But he also got us to the Super Bowl. I don't see why "tearing down the team" is the answer. Why woukd that guarantee success? Football is not a rebuilding sport anymore

I'm just asking the Devils Advocate questions today. We committed to Offense to win a Super Bowl... It hasn't worked, and appears more that Defense does in fact win big games.

Does the same thing next year yield a different result? Maybe?

DENVERDUI55
02-03-2014, 08:38 AM
I will take Kap over manning any time. Manning teams are soft.

This is nothing new. You wanted to cut Manning early into last year.

SonOfLe-loLang
02-03-2014, 09:05 AM
I'm just asking the Devils Advocate questions today. We committed to Offense to win a Super Bowl... It hasn't worked, and appears more that Defense does in fact win big games.

Does the same thing next year yield a different result? Maybe?

It was a "hit the reset button" kind of super bowl (in the sense when the computer ****s you in madden and everything in the first few min goes wrong). Obviously, our offense isnt THAT bad. I mean, it looked 3rd team preseason bad. And there is talent on our D, unfortunately a lot of it was injured.

I dunno, it all seems hopeless right now, i just don't think tearing it down is the answer.

Arkie
02-03-2014, 09:09 AM
Welcome to reality. It's been a fun regular season but regular season star wars rules go out the window come January.

The team played great in January.

GoDonkeys
02-03-2014, 09:10 AM
Wow you guys already calling for Peyton's head? Reality is, Peyton needs a good defense too. All those years with the colts, he only won the year that Sanders and Freeny stayed healthy.

Peyton needs a good offensive line and defense. That's where you need to fix things. Year after year, Peyton shows you can beat him when you get to him with a 4 man rush. He gets frustrated if he can't get into a rhythm. That's why he always has struggled with the chargers and ravens.

So eldest needs to take that weakness and fix it.

orinjkrush
02-03-2014, 09:19 AM
without Manning the Broncos are an 8-8 team. Just like Elway, Manning took an inferior team farther than they would have gone on their own.

Jay6Cutler
02-03-2014, 09:19 AM
The whole offense looked ambivalent....

The 97-98 teams would have embarassed this Broncos team head to head.

I can't think of a more gutless showing than last night. Every one of those Broncos players should be ashamed of that **** they took last night.

Your not kidding 97-98 would have embarass this team worse then last night

Action
02-03-2014, 09:19 AM
Then why do you feel justified calling him a "stupid mother ****er" for wanting a guy who accomplished more the past two years and is over a decade younger?

His post was based on not wanting Manning because Manning is a choker, when Kaep has "choked" on game winning drives 2 years in a row with an int. Thought that was fairly obvious.

lol @ Kaep getting all this credit. You do realize Niners have had the most physical defense for the past few years...along with one of the best coaching staffs in the league.

Let's not act like the defense and running game doesn't carry 49ers too. Anyone who watches 49ers know Kaep is a one read QB at the moment.

Action
02-03-2014, 09:22 AM
you do realize that Kap almost won the games for them.

Right because the rest of the team had nothing to do with that.

You simple minded dumb mother ****er :rofl:

Jay6Cutler
02-03-2014, 09:24 AM
Wow you guys already calling for Peyton's head? Reality is, Peyton needs a good defense too. All those years with the colts, he only won the year that Sanders and Freeny stayed healthy.

Peyton needs a good offensive line and defense. That's where you need to fix things. Year after year, Peyton shows you can beat him when you get to him with a 4 man rush. He gets frustrated if he can't get into a rhythm. That's why he always has struggled with the chargers and ravens.

So eldest needs to take that weakness and fix it.




Peyton is a mentle midget In big games. He couldnt beat fla losing record in bowl games. Hes 11-12 in the playoffs. He is what he is and Those are the facts

OABB
02-03-2014, 09:30 AM
Manning offenses are soft.there's a reason why he won only one SB despite going to playoffs almost every year.

I enjoyed Tebow year more than manning's and it's unfortunate.

I did too. I feared this would Happen. I don't blame manning. He's great, but clutch is not his strength.

CHEF LUIGI
02-03-2014, 09:31 AM
manning, worst QBR of his season. lousy gameplan, lousy play calling pathetic effort by the entire team all 3 phases.
yes, manning stunk, but his teammates added to the stench !
the seahawks were better prepared to beat the broncos running their predictable offense!
PREDICTABLE!!!
I said it would hurt us come play-off time, and sure enough.
same formations, samepersonnel group, the seahawks found it easy to play against what they knew was coming.

TheReverend
02-03-2014, 09:37 AM
His post was based on not wanting Manning because Manning is a choker, when Kaep has "choked" on game winning drives 2 years in a row with an int. Thought that was fairly obvious.

lol @ Kaep getting all this credit. You do realize Niners have had the most physical defense for the past few years...along with one of the best coaching staffs in the league.

Let's not act like the defense and running game doesn't carry 49ers too. Anyone who watches 49ers know Kaep is a one read QB at the moment.

Ultimately I agree, but let's not pretend like you don't know exactly where he's coming from too.

BroncoBeavis
02-03-2014, 09:44 AM
Mentle Midget? That has to be a new OM meme. LOL

TonyR
02-03-2014, 09:45 AM
Clearly getting rid of our best player is the way to go...

SonOfLe-loLang
02-03-2014, 09:50 AM
Clearly getting rid of our best player is the way to go...

I don't get why people want this...unless they just wanna distance themselves from this loss as much as possible. I assume its just emotion talking.

Meck77
02-03-2014, 09:53 AM
I will blame myself and the Millions of Broncos fans who opted to sit on their couch and point blame. Broncos fans out to have been out numbered 3 to 1.

If we want to point blame then let's do it right from the start. Seahawk fans controlled the very first snap. Set the tone with the safety. From there our nerves went down hill. See Manning's post game comments on the crowd noise and THAT PLAY. Speculate all you want. Manning laid down the facts.

So as you sulk in how much the Broncos sucked let's spread some of that suck to the internet fans out there who didn't show or in some cases maybe never ever show.

About the only positive thing I can think of is that this just reinforces how truly special 1997 was. Was fortunate enough to be apart of that one.

Carry on blaming whoever you want. My hat goes off to Seatle. They were better prepared. Manning and Co had a record setting year. Simply amazing what they did but in the end there is only one Superbowl champ.

Go Broncos! Here is to next year.

BroncoBeavis
02-03-2014, 09:53 AM
Sad fact is, we had a much more legit shot in 2012. This year's defense was a huge downgrade. Alot of that was injury related. But also some FA failure.

The weak state of the AFC blinded us somewhat. Manning shares the blame with his OL for a pathetic showing.

Maybe with Clady things might've looked a little different. But it's hard to see it changing the outcome. We just don't match up well against them.

go_broncos
02-03-2014, 09:54 AM
please tell me this never happened..I just can't believe this..scoring only 8 points..:(

24champ
02-03-2014, 10:07 AM
I will blame myself and the Millions of Broncos fans who opted to sit on their couch and point blame. Broncos fans out to have been out numbered 3 to 1.

If we want to point blame then let's do it right from the start. Seahawk fans controlled the very first snap. Set the tone with the safety. From there our nerves went down hill. See Manning's post game comments on the crowd noise and THAT PLAY. Speculate all you want. Manning laid down the facts.

So as you sulk in how much the Broncos sucked let's spread some of that suck to the internet fans out there who didn't show or in some cases maybe never ever show.

About the only positive thing I can think of is that this just reinforces how truly special 1997 was. Was fortunate enough to be apart of that one.

Carry on blaming whoever you want. My hat goes off to Seatle. They were better prepared. Manning and Co had a record setting year. Simply amazing what they did but in the end there is only one Superbowl champ.

Go Broncos! Here is to next year.

The offense was unprepared for the noise, that's on them and the coaching staff. They had two ****ing weeks to prepare and the fans are at fault? **** that noise.

I'm ready to move on from the Manning era, just a plethora of disappointments. He's not going to get it done for us. GREAT regular season QB but folds like a cheap chinese tent when the chips are down. Last year throws an INT in OT vs Baltimore and lays an egg in the big game. Everyone else was right about Manning, big game choker.

TonyR
02-03-2014, 10:11 AM
I'm ready to move on from the Manning era, just a plethora of disappointments. He's not going to get it done for us. GREAT regular season QB but folds like a cheap chinese tent when the chips are down. Last year throws an INT in OT vs Baltimore and lays an egg in the big game. Everyone else was right about Manning, big game choker.

Move on to what? Brock? Come on. I'd agree with your "choke" label if not for the fact that he killed it against SD and NE. The difference? He was under heavy pressure in this game. That doesn't excuse his performance, but it explains it.

SonOfLe-loLang
02-03-2014, 10:13 AM
Move on to what? Brock? Come on. I'd agree with you "choke" label if not for the fact that he killed it against SD and NE. The difference? He was under heavy pressure in this game. That doesn't excuse his performance, but it explains it.

If the reason they want to move on from the manning era is to lower expectations, then fine. But if they think thats some key to winning, they're out of their minds.

Willynowei
02-03-2014, 10:17 AM
Most playoff losses ever, and I don't believe he's ever had a post season with better numbers than his regular season of the same year... At what point does the blame fall on Manning?

3TD - 7INT = his stat line the year he won the Superbowl with Dungy.

If Joe Flacco put up 3TD, 7INTs during a superbowl run, how many people would call that a good run?

The guy's a choke, he's like Lebron in the NBA, although Lebron's gotten better.

Meck77
02-03-2014, 10:17 AM
The offense was unprepared for the noise, that's on them and the coaching staff. They had two ****ing weeks to prepare and the fans are at fault? **** that noise.

I'm ready to move on from the Manning era, just a plethora of disappointments. He's not going to get it done for us. GREAT regular season QB but folds like a cheap chinese tent when the chips are down. Last year throws an INT in OT vs Baltimore and lays an egg in the big game. Everyone else was right about Manning, big game choker.

Yup. I'm having flashbacks alright. It was hard to find a Broncos fan IN DENVER in the late 80's who wasn't ready to move on from the Elway Era also.

Perhaps find copies of the THREE superbowl losses we had and then rewatch to the 98/99 team. Pay particular close attention to how the TEAM performed.

We had the same "horse face", "loser", as a QB.

Anyway............This is a good lesson and reminder for Broncos fans. You got to pay your dues!

go_broncos
02-03-2014, 10:17 AM
If the reason they want to move on from the manning era is to lower expectations, then fine. But if they think thats some key to winning, they're out of their minds.

It's painful to lose games in the fashion that we lost for the past 2 years.
Manning was really lucky to win a SB..He just folds under pressure.
QB should a leader and his teams play soft.

Brock was drafted high and it might be that he doesn't choke in big games.
we need to give him a chance.

I am done with manning and fox.

BroncoBeavis
02-03-2014, 10:18 AM
What a long offseason this is going to be.

Powderaddict
02-03-2014, 10:19 AM
Yup. I'm having flashbacks alright. It was hard to find a Broncos fan IN DENVER in the late 80's who wasn't ready to move on from the Elway Era also.

Perhaps find copies of the THREE superbowl losses we had and then rewatch to the 98/99 team. Pay particular close attention to how the TEAM performed.

We had the same "horse face", "loser", as a QB.

Anyway............This is a good lesson and reminder for Broncos fans. You got to pay your dues!

Bull****, most fans were pissed when Reeves tried to "move on" from Elway when he drafted Maddox.

Radio hosts loved to bag on Elway, but the vast majority of the fans didn't want to move on.

TonyR
02-03-2014, 10:20 AM
Yup. I'm having flashbacks alright. It was hard to find a Broncos fan IN DENVER in the late 80's who wasn't ready to move on from the Elway Era also.

Perhaps find copies of the THREE superbowl losses we had and then rewatch to the 98/99 team. Pay particular close attention to how the TEAM performed.

We had the same "horse face", "loser", as a QB.

Anyway............This is a good lesson and reminder for Broncos fans. You got to pay your dues!

Great post. Perspective is powerful. This is right on the money.

TonyR
02-03-2014, 10:22 AM
Bull****, most fans were pissed when Reeves tried to "move on" from Elway when he drafted Maddox.

Radio hosts loved to bag on Elway, but the vast majority of the fans didn't want to move on.

Still, Elway wasn't considered a great QB because he kept "choking" in the Super Bowl. Got blown out 3 times. Guess what? It's a team game! Manning deserves some blame of course but he is far from the only problem we had last night. It all starts with the protection up front and our O-line got dominated.

SonOfLe-loLang
02-03-2014, 10:30 AM
What a long offseason this is going to be.

haha it already is.

24champ
02-03-2014, 10:32 AM
Move on to what? Brock? Come on. I'd agree with you "choke" label if not for the fact that he killed it against SD and NE. The difference? He was under heavy pressure in this game. That doesn't excuse his performance, but it explains it.


I don't know to who would take the reigns but I do know this system we're running doesn't win championships. It's a failed experiment, we can do patchwork **** this offseason but the results will be the same. That's the reality. Teams don't come back from an epic beatdown in the Super Bowl and win the following season. Raiders haven't recovered from theirs in 2002 and it took the Giants a few seasons (complete rebuild through the draft) to get back on top from their epic loss to the Ravens.

Also, the last three SB winners were Eli Manning, Joe ****ing Flacco, and now Russell Wilson. You don't need an elite QB to win SB's anymore. John Elway needs to roll up his sleeves and start building a real team, and model the rebuild from the way the New York Giants did it after their loss to the Ravens. At some point we are going to need a new staff, and rebuild the lines, get some grit and a QB that won't **** the bed in big games.

Manning is a great guy, always represented the league well but his time is over. I think that adds to my depression and shock. I just know its the end for him, and his legacy is in the garbage can, sad to say.

SonOfLe-loLang
02-03-2014, 10:33 AM
I don't know to who would take the reigns but I do know this system we're running doesn't win championships. It's a failed experiment, we can do patchwork **** this offseason but the results will be the same. That's the reality. Teams don't come back from an epic beatdown in the Super Bowl and win the following season. Raiders haven't recovered from theirs in 2002 and it took the Giants a few seasons (complete rebuild through the draft) to get back on top from their epic loss to the Ravens.

Also, the last three SB winners were Eli Manning, Joe ****ing Flacco, and now Russell Wilson. You don't need an elite QB to win SB's anymore. John Elway needs to roll up his sleeves and start building a real team, and model the rebuild from the way the New York Giants did it after their loss to the Ravens. At some point we are going to need a new staff, and rebuild the lines, get some grit and a QB that won't **** the bed in big games.

Manning is a great guy, always represented the league well but his time is over. I think that adds to my depression and shock. I just know its the end for him, and his legacy is in the garbage can, sad to say.

I know we lost, but the way people talk its like we went 5-11.

24champ
02-03-2014, 10:35 AM
Yup. I'm having flashbacks alright. It was hard to find a Broncos fan IN DENVER in the late 80's who wasn't ready to move on from the Elway Era also.

Perhaps find copies of the THREE superbowl losses we had and then rewatch to the 98/99 team. Pay particular close attention to how the TEAM performed.

We had the same "horse face", "loser", as a QB.

Anyway............This is a good lesson and reminder for Broncos fans. You got to pay your dues!

Are we seriously comparing an ancient Manning with 4 neck surgeries to a young Elway? Cmon man. :rofl:

TonyR
02-03-2014, 10:38 AM
Manning is a great guy, always represented the league well but his time is over.

I would agree if not for the fact that he just had perhaps his best year ever, and ran and offense that shattered a lot of records. Unfortunately we came up against a D that was perfectly designed to beat us.

24champ
02-03-2014, 10:39 AM
I know we lost, but the way people talk its like we went 5-11.

Folks, this team got butt****ed DRY in front of 7 billion people yesterday.

go_broncos
02-03-2014, 10:40 AM
I know we lost, but the way people talk its like we went 5-11.

8 points by the greatest offense in the history of NFL..We all should be pissed.
Golden opportunity missed.

DENVERDUI55
02-03-2014, 10:43 AM
Manning is a great guy, always represented the league well but his time is over. I think that adds to my depression and shock. I just know its the end for him, and his legacy is in the garbage can, sad to say.

Whatever dude. It's not like the team played great and he played terrible. He just had the best season ever for a QB. He has one bad game and it is time to turn him to horse glue. Denver fans really are out of touch with reality for the most part.

Denver had a lot of stuff go on this year. Suspensions, interm coach, a boat load of injuries (2 best players on the field that aren't PM). It is amazing they made it as far as they did and that is because the guy who you want to move on from elevates everyone's play.

24champ
02-03-2014, 10:45 AM
I would agree if not for the fact that he just had perhaps his best year ever, and ran and offense that shattered a lot of records. Unfortunately we came up against a D that was perfectly designed to beat us.


Nobody will remember the records broken this season, just like nobody remembers the run and records the Patriots set by going undeafeated until the big game. The loss overshadows it, scoring only 8 points in the SB overshadows it, having a bad snap on the first play of the game overshadows it.

Jay6Cutler
02-03-2014, 10:45 AM
I dont blame the defense near as much as I blame peyton.. all the greats impose there will in the playoffs.. we all know elway could and did.. elway at this stage had been to 5 super bowls winning 2 of them.. peyton got 9 one and dones and 11- 12 playoff record with one super bowl win against a team with a career back up im ready to move on from a guy who has choked in big games his whole football cereer

HELLHAMMER
02-03-2014, 10:47 AM
Manning won a SB because the Bears decided to play Grossman. Orton, the game manager, is the one that got them to the big game because Grossman was injured. They ran the ball and played elite defense. Sounds like the team that just won the last one. Then they decide Grossman will start in the SB and they went about trying to wing bombs all over field in the rain.

The Bears lost but it wasn't anything Manning did to cause it.

maven
02-03-2014, 10:50 AM
Yup. I'm having flashbacks alright. It was hard to find a Broncos fan IN DENVER in the late 80's who wasn't ready to move on from the Elway Era also.


What? I don't recall this ****. I don't know where in Denver you lived, but I didn't hear much of this talk.

24champ
02-03-2014, 10:50 AM
Whatever dude. It's not like the team played great and he played terrible. He just had the best season ever for a QB. He has one bad game and it is time to turn him to horse glue. Denver fans really are out of touch with reality for the most part.

Denver had a lot of stuff go on this year. Suspensions, interm coach, a boat load of injuries (2 best players on the field that aren't PM). It is amazing they made it as far as they did and that is because the guy who you want to move on from elevates everyone's play.

I'm not saying they were great and Manning sucked.

In fact my overall point is that this team, the way it is built and the system it has. Is clearly not designed to win a championship. Elway stated that his job is to bring championships to Denver, not regular season records. I don't think this team will be blown up this offseason but probably after next season when the writing is clearly on the wall for everyone to see.

Arkie
02-03-2014, 10:54 AM
I dont blame the defense near as much as I blame peyton.. all the greats impose there will in the playoffs.. we all know elway could and did.. elway at this stage had been to 5 super bowls winning 2 of them.. peyton got 9 one and dones and 11- 12 playoff record with one super bowl win against a team with a career back up im ready to move on from a guy who has choked in big games his whole football cereer

It's not Peyton vs. Grossman. This isn't tennis. The Bears were in the Super Bowl because of their defense. Manning has faced the #1 defense in the Super Bowl twice.

edog24
02-03-2014, 10:59 AM
Yup. I'm having flashbacks alright. It was hard to find a Broncos fan IN DENVER in the late 80's who wasn't ready to move on from the Elway Era also.

Perhaps find copies of the THREE superbowl losses we had and then rewatch to the 98/99 team. Pay particular close attention to how the TEAM performed.

We had the same "horse face", "loser", as a QB.

Anyway............This is a good lesson and reminder for Broncos fans. You got to pay your dues!

And what did it take to get us over the hump back then? A RB that ran for 2000 yards to complement the qb. I think it's time to recognize that Manning himself is not the answer- we need to gameplan expecting him to play like ass in big games. That means we need another playmaker out there that doesn't look to PM to make the plays.

That might mean we go after a big name RB, or better receivers, I don't know, but we need to start thinking about leadership on this team outside of PM.

McDman
02-03-2014, 11:50 AM
Manning played horribly but this isn't on one person. Our OL got dominated. Doesn't matter who the QB was. We were outcoached and outplayed.

I think the only peeson who played well was Trevathan. Ball didn"t play too poorly. He was getting hit in the backfield all day and did what he could.

B-Large
02-03-2014, 12:46 PM
It was a "hit the reset button" kind of super bowl (in the sense when the computer ****s you in madden and everything in the first few min goes wrong). Obviously, our offense isnt THAT bad. I mean, it looked 3rd team preseason bad. And there is talent on our D, unfortunately a lot of it was injured.

I dunno, it all seems hopeless right now, i just don't think tearing it down is the answer.

This is why I like having Elways, he WILL do whats best for the Broncos.

I do trust him. I would NOT want to be on the receiving end when he convenes the team to discuss that mess.

Drunken.Broncoholic2
02-03-2014, 12:52 PM
And what did it take to get us over the hump back then? A RB that ran for 2000 yards to complement the qb. I think it's time to recognize that Manning himself is not the answer- we need to gameplan expecting him to play like ass in big games. That means we need another playmaker out there that doesn't look to PM to make the plays.

That might mean we go after a big name RB, or better receivers, I don't know, but we need to start thinking about leadership on this team outside of PM.

The offense wasn't the problem this year. They **** the bed in the SB though. I still believe this team was star struck by the SB limelight and attention. Acting like the game was just a formality and the pre game festivities were the priority. It showed on the field almost every single play.

Cito Pelon
02-03-2014, 01:13 PM
It should begin though. Manning, while great and nobody questions that, eats up a **** load of cap room. Also, I think this team leans WAY to much on him to cover up up our weaknesses.

Maybe the league has changed, and you don't need a HOF QB, rather a fast aggressive blistering defense.

There should be healthy debate about moving on into another direction... I don't ever want to see that again. That was humiliating.

If Elway thinks bringing this whole team back as is next year with the thought that staying healthier is the recipe, I trust him in that move. If he decides a more balanced team is best and Manning is not in that scenario, again, I trust him.

As it stands, I think even healthy if that game is played 10 times we might lose 8 out of 10 times. Something needs to change.

Yup, when you're paying your QB 20 million/yr (what's that, 18% of the total cap?) you can't go out and get the top-tier FA's.

And, as for Manning being great, well, he's looked shall we say shaky in a few big games. I really dislike that cringing look he gets on his face when things aren't going well, like some little kid that had his candy stolen by a bigger kid and knows he can't do anything about it.

Myself, I was thinking (maybe trying to convince myself) that Seattle really isn't 35 points better than Denver. Denver just looked intimidated, uncomfortable, unprepared, shocked, stunned, and for some reason there was no rally in them, no fire, no anger, no determination.

That was the most disappointing thing - they didn't have the fortitude or the mental toughness to mount even the slightest challenge . . . .

Cito Pelon
02-03-2014, 01:36 PM
I can't believe how short sighted some of you are. We played an awful game all around, and Manning actually played better than most of his teammates. Aside from the one bad interception where he missed J.T. what are you guys blaming him for? We had to kickoff both halves of the game, and were behind from the opening snap. Unbelievable. We played AWFUL. End of story. Just a very bad time to do it

I'm not blaming Manning per se, but I think to myself, "you have all these weapons, and you threw for 5.5 YPA. In the Big Game. And you fumbled, and you overthrew an open JT and got intercepted."

Sure, the D kinda sucked, the ST's kinda sucked, the coaching kinda sucked, the OL kinda sucked. But Manning kinda sucked also.

CHEF LUIGI
02-03-2014, 01:41 PM
is there a single player or coach that can be proud of their performance leading up to and during the game yesterday?
WHO, should NOT be EMBARRASSED/
PFM, I want to know.

CHEF LUIGI
02-03-2014, 01:43 PM
Yup, when you're paying your QB 20 million/yr (what's that, 18% of the total cap?) you can't go out and get the top-tier FA's.

And, as for Manning being great, well, he's looked shall we say shaky in a few big games. I really dislike that cringing look he gets on his face when things aren't going well, like some little kid that had his candy stolen by a bigger kid and knows he can't do anything about it.

Myself, I was thinking (maybe trying to convince myself) that Seattle really isn't 35 points better than Denver. Denver just looked intimidated, uncomfortable, unprepared, shocked, stunned, and for some reason there was no rally in them, no fire, no anger, no determination.

That was the most disappointing thing - they didn't have the fortitude or the mental toughness to mount even the slightest challenge . . . .
peyton did a great ELI impersonation yesterday!
how bizarre each manning plays like his brother in the bug game.

Archer81
02-03-2014, 01:46 PM
peyton did a great ELI impersonation yesterday!
how bizarre each manning plays like his brother in the bug game.


Eli is 2-0 in Superbowls. Facts hurt, huh?


:Broncos:

BroncoBeavis
02-03-2014, 02:10 PM
Eli is 2-0 in Superbowls. Facts hurt, huh?


:Broncos:

I think what he's trying to say is that Eli plays like RS Peyton in the big games. And Peyton plays like RS Eli in the big games.

That is, if I'm translating the Luiginese correctly. :)

B-Large
02-03-2014, 02:24 PM
Yup, when you're paying your QB 20 million/yr (what's that, 18% of the total cap?) you can't go out and get the top-tier FA's.

And, as for Manning being great, well, he's looked shall we say shaky in a few big games. I really dislike that cringing look he gets on his face when things aren't going well, like some little kid that had his candy stolen by a bigger kid and knows he can't do anything about it.

Myself, I was thinking (maybe trying to convince myself) that Seattle really isn't 35 points better than Denver. Denver just looked intimidated, uncomfortable, unprepared, shocked, stunned, and for some reason there was no rally in them, no fire, no anger, no determination.

That was the most disappointing thing - they didn't have the fortitude or the mental toughness to mount even the slightest challenge . . . .

from that first catch DT had where he got jacked it was obvious Seattle was looking to make this a street fight. But yes, our finese Offense did NOT want any part of that. The sad part isn't we lost, its really hard to even get to a Super Bowl let alone win one... it was that we couldn't man up... they folded, easily.

I think it is 17-18% cap. Elway better get creative and find some Cats with fire and toughness, because I don't want to see what te NFCW does to this team next year.... once they know youre afraidm it only gets worse.

B-Large
02-03-2014, 02:26 PM
is there a single player or coach that can be proud of their performance leading up to and during the game yesterday?
WHO, should NOT be EMBARRASSED/
PFM, I want to know.

I would like to be a fly on the wall in Elways office the next few weeks. I bet he is ****ing pissed about that pile of **** he saw out there. I hope he holds no position, no player sacred when he does a deep introspection about this season and what to do next year.

CHEF LUIGI
02-03-2014, 03:05 PM
I think what he's trying to say is that Eli plays like RS Peyton in the big games. And Peyton plays like RS Eli in the big games.

That is, if I'm translating the Luiginese correctly. :)exactly.

BroncoMan4ever
02-03-2014, 04:50 PM
This place won't be habitable for at least a week.

Agreed. Going to take a break from here for a week or so and let the idiots tire themselves out.

TonyR
09-06-2014, 01:39 PM
Fun thread! Good times. Anyway, thought I'd leave this here.

Critics often say Manning is a good “regular season quarterback,” but not a great “playoff quarterback.” The theory is that there’s something about Manning’s game that makes him great at beating up on weak opponents, but that can’t handle the tougher, more complex defenses found commonly in playoff opponents.

I’ll confess, before looking into this myself, I thought it was a plausible-sounding theory.1 But for the most part, the reason Manning has had a harder time winning games in the playoffs is the same as it is for virtually everyone else: He has faced tougher opponents and tougher defenses. While it’s true that his teams haven’t won quite as many games as expected, and that he performs a little worse in the playoffs than in the regular season, he has actually performed better against playoff defenses that we would expect given the strength of those defenses.

To examine this, I looked at ESPN’s Total Quarterback Rating (QBR) from 2006 to the present.2 In the regular season, Manning’s average QBR per game3 was 74.8, while the average QBR for other quarterbacks who faced the same teams in the same season was 50.8. In the playoffs, Manning’s average QBR was 68.4, for a decline of 6.4 points. But the average QBR for other quarterbacks who played his playoff opponents was 41.9, an average decline of 8.9 points.http://fivethirtyeight.com/features/2014-nfl-preview-the-broncos-versus-the-hopefuls/#fn-1

DENVERDUI55
09-06-2014, 03:14 PM
Quality thread for sure.

mennonite
09-06-2014, 03:22 PM
His lack of athleticism was really striking last night. Dude is a statue. It is his fatal flaw and the reason he can't be considered the best of all time. His physical ability is just too limited and it's hurt him most in big games when the pocket collapses.

Tell me about it. I bet an athletic QB like Aaron Rodgers would have torched that Seahawks defense.




Edit: And i have to say I find it hilarious that after what happened to the Heat and the Broncos, Maven has switched to a soccer avatar.

Guess Who
09-06-2014, 05:13 PM
How the hell did he win the Superbowl before?..
He is opposite of Elway in clutch situations.
I will take wilson or kaepernick over manning.

Not sure what Elway saw in manning.

Manning plays like **** in pressure situations.
Isray - your analysis is accurate.

If there is a Hall of shame/chokers, Manning and Champ will be in the top of the list.

Elway - please think hard and cut manning, Fox and the other chokers.

There is no place for good people in NFL..Players should be nasty and play with fire. There are no leaders in this team.Manning,Champ and Fox are too good people and we don't want them.

Need to have players like Sherman, Kapernick.

Dude you are a ****ing idiot. You do realize Elway lost his first three SBs and everyone was calling him a choker.

BroncoMan4ever
09-06-2014, 05:20 PM
AND we passed over Wilson to draft Oz!

Wilson is a game manager nota game changer. He has a ring his defense and running game bought him. Krapernick is a run first option QB with average to below average passing ability.

rmsanger
09-06-2014, 05:32 PM
Dude you are a ****ing idiot. You do realize Elway lost his first three SBs and everyone was calling him a choker.

Really I remember him being the only reason why we got there. Maybe I was young and naive but I remember Elway being 2x the warrior that PFM is.

go_broncos
09-06-2014, 06:12 PM
Dude you are a ****ing idiot. You do realize Elway lost his first three SBs and everyone was calling him a choker.

You are a joke..comparing Elway with Manning. Manning is no where near Elway.

mennonite
09-06-2014, 06:18 PM
So "not as good as Elway" equals "****ty QB who needs to be cut"?

Smart take.

mennonite
09-06-2014, 06:22 PM
On a slightly less retarded subject: How would present-day Manning do if he was the QB of those 96,97,98 Broncos teams? Let's say he buys a Delorean and goes back to the Clinton era - what kind of numbers does he put up? Does he win a SB? 2? 3?

Chrissy Rules
09-06-2014, 06:22 PM
You are a joke..comparing Elway with Manning. Manning is no where near Elway.

You can't compare the 2..its completely two separate eras in the NFL..

whoeey
09-06-2014, 06:28 PM
You are a joke..comparing Elway with Manning. Manning is no where near Elway.

You are exactly right. Hell even tommy brady about to dust Elway tomorrow. PFM is light years ahead of both.

Kaylore
09-06-2014, 06:31 PM
Manning is better than Elway IMO.

mennonite
09-06-2014, 06:34 PM
They're both two of the best ever, but I would give Manning the slight edge too.

The bottom line is that it is a team game, and QB, no matter how great he is, can't win a game alone. You need a solid team and a solid coach to win it all. And a lot of luck. Injuries and fluke plays can take down the best of teams.

go_broncos
09-06-2014, 06:42 PM
This thread is created out of frustration. From my standpoint, Elway is better QB than manning.

I support our team and hoping Manning wins SB this year.

Brohemoth
09-06-2014, 06:43 PM
Two different quarterbacks that are difficult to compare.

Manning is probably better when his team executes the gameplan. On broken plays, Manning is useless.

Elway was less dependent on the execution. He could mend broken plays.

Gutless Drunk
09-06-2014, 06:43 PM
Manning is better than Elway IMO.

I said this before he became a Bronco. The correct phrasing is "nobody has played the position of Quarterback better than Manning"

Miss I.
09-06-2014, 06:44 PM
This thread is created out of frustration. From my standpoint, Elway is better QB than manning.

I support our team and hoping Manning wins SB this year.

I'm kind of hoping the DENVER BRONCOS win the Super Bowl this year. I like Manning, but as good as he is, I am pretty certain he can't win the Super Bowl by himself. ;D

go_broncos
09-06-2014, 06:46 PM
I'm kind of hoping the DENVER BRONCOS win the Super Bowl this year. I like Manning, but as good as he is, I am pretty certain he can't win the Super Bowl by himself. ;D

you are right.
I am hoping broncos win SB this year..:)

Chrissy Rules
09-06-2014, 06:47 PM
I said this before he became a Bronco. The correct phrasing is "nobody has played the position of Quarterback better than Manning"

Elway would approve of this message..:egbgb:

Rocket 7
09-06-2014, 06:49 PM
Two different quarterbacks that are difficult to compare.

Manning is probably better when his team executes the gameplan. On broken plays, Manning is useless.

Elway was less dependent on the execution. He could mend broken plays.

A few examples of what you are saying


<iframe width="640" height="480" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/f232bsuGKl0" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

<iframe width="640" height="480" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/L5qo7el6jts" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

<iframe width="640" height="480" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/s77wULlLqMU" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

mennonite
09-06-2014, 06:52 PM
Two different quarterbacks that are difficult to compare.

Manning is probably better when his team executes the gameplan. On broken plays, Manning is useless..

How soon you forget...


http://i.imgur.com/jxtYn5e.png

You don't need to "helicopter" into the endzone when the gravitational pull of your head can lift your feet over the defender.

Chrissy Rules
09-06-2014, 06:54 PM
How soon you forget...


http://i.imgur.com/jxtYn5e.png

You don't need to "helicopter" into the endzone when the gravitational pull of your head can lift your feet over the defender.

LOVE IT...:strong::strong::strong::strong:

R8R H8R
09-06-2014, 06:58 PM
This thread is created out of frustration. From my standpoint, Elway is better QB than manning.

I support our team and hoping Manning wins SB this year.

Then grow up and count to ten before you get behind a keyboard.

Miss I.
09-06-2014, 07:13 PM
you are right.
I am hoping broncos win SB this year..:)

Just remember he can't win or lose the game by himself. It's easy to make the QB the lightning rod for our discontent, especially one who is as exceptional as Manning, but it takes a team to win it all. Nobody is claiming Manning had a great game that dark day in February, but it isn't rocket science to figure out how to take out our QB. Disrupting and keeping Manning off balance cripples us. Seattle had a task and executed it well. Their defense won that game for them and based on what I saw vs Green Bay in the opening game they are still going to be tough to deal with, but we are better than Green Bay.

And the rest of you yahoos, not sure why this thread was resurrected, but nobody has any business judging someone 7 months after the fact for a emotion based thread. I've seen equally daft threads started by others in this forum for even lamer reasons then venting shared frustration over a game. Giving someone **** about comments made back in the heat of the moment seems silly. I really wish we'd let this thread die a natural death. It is one thing to throw Bob's threads back in his face, he's a Chiefs fan, but why do we eat our own kind?

Powderaddict
09-06-2014, 07:17 PM
Elway was the best of all time. I love Manning, It's 1a and 1b IMO, but I'm rolling with Elway.

LikeABoss5820
09-06-2014, 07:18 PM
Eli is 2-0 in Superbowls. Facts hurt, huh?


:Broncos:

Guess that makes Eli > Rodgers, Brees, Peyton, right?

2 > 1.

Bradshaw > Brady.

4 > 3.

Dilfer > Marino.

1 > 0.

Facts?

LikeABoss5820
09-06-2014, 07:20 PM
You are a joke..comparing Elway with Manning. Manning is no where near Elway.

You are a joke, probably 10 years old.

Chrissy Rules
09-06-2014, 07:30 PM
Elway was the best of all time. I love Manning, It's 1a and 1b IMO, but I'm rolling with Elway.

Gotta give it to Peyton my man Manning..looking at SB's ..take the 1st 3 all we really can take cause Peyton is still playing..he's 1-2 Elway was 0-3..not to mention Peyton is the ONLY QB with 5 MVP's 6 if you count the SB... Elway gets my vote for best GM...;)

mennonite
09-06-2014, 08:05 PM
<iframe width="420" height="315" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/2Mp59nuBwIg" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Brohemoth
09-06-2014, 08:17 PM
How soon you forget...


http://i.imgur.com/jxtYn5e.png

You don't need to "helicopter" into the endzone when the gravitational pull of your head can lift your feet over the defender.

I'm pretty sure that play shocked everyone watching. It was an anomaly. Beautiful, but an anomaly nonetheless.

rmsanger
09-06-2014, 08:42 PM
Elway and it's not even close IMO... He was just a winner where Peyton relies on timing. Elway had the gun, ability to make a play, and lead a game winning drive under pressure when it counts. I think PFM is easier to game plan for and when you disrupt his timing he's dunzo.

theAPAOps5
09-06-2014, 09:06 PM
This thread is created out of frustration. From my standpoint, Elway is better QB than manning.

I support our team and hoping Manning wins SB this year.

No it was created because you suck as a poster.

theAPAOps5
09-06-2014, 09:07 PM
Elway and it's not even close IMO... He was just a winner where Peyton relies on timing. Elway had the gun, ability to make a play, and lead a game winning drive under pressure when it counts. I think PFM is easier to game plan for and when you disrupt his timing he's dunzo.

Everyone has their opinion, no matter how wrong they are

DENVERDUI55
09-06-2014, 09:08 PM
Dude you are a ****ing idiot. You do realize Elway lost his first three SBs and everyone was calling him a choker.

No he doesn't. That was long before he was a fan.

Chrissy Rules
09-06-2014, 09:10 PM
Everyone has their opinion, no matter how wrong they are

Peyton is just SIMPLY AWESOME...enuff said...;D

LikeABoss5820
09-06-2014, 09:17 PM
Elway and it's not even close IMO... He was just a winner where Peyton relies on timing. Elway had the gun, ability to make a play, and lead a game winning drive under pressure when it counts. I think PFM is easier to game plan for and when you disrupt his timing he's dunzo.

You can say the same thing about every QB.

Get pressure with 4, drop 7, tight coverage, control the clock, limit the possessions in half.

Easier said than done though.

strafen
09-06-2014, 09:41 PM
AND we passed over Wilson to draft Oz!Ed Reed!!!!!!!!

delany
09-06-2014, 09:48 PM
What an awesome quandary to discuss.

We could be the Chiefs and argue between the merits of Croyle, Cassel, Bray etc.

strafen
09-06-2014, 10:04 PM
Elway and it's not even close IMO... He was just a winner where Peyton relies on timing. Elway had the gun, ability to make a play, and lead a game winning drive under pressure when it counts. I think PFM is easier to game plan for and when you disrupt his timing he's dunzo.Darn it man. And all this while I thought Manning was the perfect QB!
He does have flaws after all, huh? Ha!
Every QB has to have a superb cast around to win a SB. Elway won it when we had good ST, good defense, a kick[ass offensive line, a great FB and an awesome running back.
It turns out that all the teams contending for the SB they all possess those attributes, don't they?
When you look at the Broncos this year as a team, compared to last year's team that played in the SB, we have improved on those key areas.
We've got bigger and stronger at the OL, Clady is back, speed at WR, 3 RB's who are capable of playing at a high level, the best catching TE in the game, etc...
On defense we've got speed on the outside, beef and muscle inside the line, a pro-bowl safety and a good secondary; not too shabby!
The only area we're weak at is on ST. We're missing Prater!

The goal is to put it all together and carry out a good performance.
The first 3 games opening the season are tough but good for us...
We should at least wait for the first game and see what we have before creating pandemonium...
That's all I'm saying for now.

Shananahan
09-06-2014, 10:12 PM
Not sure what Elway saw in manning.
I feel like this should be a running gag or something.

Guess Who
09-06-2014, 10:25 PM
No he doesn't. That was long before he was a fan.

I am so glad there was no internet when Denver was losing SBs..... wow, that would have been horrible.

errand
09-06-2014, 10:26 PM
This thread is created out of frustration.

I support our team and hoping Manning wins SB this year.

LOL LOL....lie to your mom, but please stop lying to us.

whoeey
09-07-2014, 03:40 AM
Elway and it's not even close IMO... He was just a winner where Peyton relies on timing. Elway had the gun, ability to make a play, and lead a game winning drive under pressure when it counts. I think PFM is easier to game plan for and when you disrupt his timing he's dunzo.

If you are calling "game plan" a collapsing oline then I will agree. Last two qb's with the "ability to make a play" against the seahawks didn't fare so well.

As much as I hate to reference anything Stephan a smith spewed, he had a great analogy about the sb. He stated that PFM had to work out of a phone booth all night, that is true.

Archer81
09-07-2014, 07:07 AM
Guess that makes Eli > Rodgers, Brees, Peyton, right?

2 > 1.

Bradshaw > Brady.

4 > 3.

Dilfer > Marino.

1 > 0.

Facts?


Yes. Because I said that.

Context, son.

:Broncos:

boppool
09-07-2014, 07:19 AM
What an awesome quandary to discuss.

We could be the Chiefs and argue between the merits of Croyle, Cassel, Bray etc.

Hey! Don't forget about the up and coming superstar, Ricky "Yes, We Canzi" Stanzi.

GoneFishin'
09-07-2014, 08:22 AM
Everyone has their favorite QB and mine will always be #7 John Elway. All day every day. I've just seen him do the impossible too many times.

CEH
09-07-2014, 08:37 AM
I am so glad there was no internet when Denver was losing SBs..... wow, that would have been horrible.

^^This sums up the thread in a nutshell.

I love Elway but let's not pretend he was considered a winner all this career.
This argument that Elway is a winner and Manning is not seems ill-founded. John was a 3 time Super Bowl loser , in blow out fashion none the less, until year 15 then basically rode TD and his defense to a Super Bowl championship.

I consider both Manning and Elway top 5 all time and would be comfortable with either leading our team into a Super Bowl game.

rmsanger
09-07-2014, 09:06 AM
I'll flip it... Put Elway on those Colts teams vs. Brady in the playoffs where PFM always got his ass handed to him and Elway wins more than 50%.

Put Manning on the 3 SB losers that Elway had and they don't even make the SB.

Gutless Drunk
09-07-2014, 09:15 AM
I'll flip it... Put Elway on those Colts teams vs. Brady in the playoffs where PFM always got his ass handed to him and Elway wins more than 50%.


Well since Manning is 2-2 against Brady and the Patriots in the playoffs (including 2-1 in Championship games)saying Elway wins more than 50% is not really saying much. lol

"got his ass handed to him in the playoffs" :oyvey:

rmsanger
09-07-2014, 09:24 AM
Well since Manning is 2-2 against Brady and the Patriots in the playoffs saying Elway wins more than 50% is not really saying much. lol

"got his ass handed to him in the playoffs" :oyvey:

Yet he's 1-2 as a Colt which is what I specified. Secondly the more important part is PFM would not have have even sniffed the SB in '86, '87, or '89.

Gutless Drunk
09-07-2014, 09:26 AM
Yet he's 1-2 as a Colt which is what I specified. Secondly the more important part is PFM would not have have even sniffed the SB in '86, '87, or '89.

lol..ok. 1-2 is "always got his ass handed to him" ?

LikeABoss5820
09-07-2014, 09:29 AM
I'll flip it... Put Elway on those Colts teams vs. Brady in the playoffs where PFM always got his ass handed to him and Elway wins more than 50%.

Put Manning on the 3 SB losers that Elway had and they don't even make the SB.

I doubt it.

Love Elway but not even he would change much then.

NE could pretty much bearhug the receivers all game.

Push the receivers in the stands, hold the receiver 15-20 yards down field, etc, etc.

I mean, hard to win when they can get away with murder out there.

chanesaw
09-07-2014, 09:42 AM
Are we really arguing over who is better Elway or Manning. Once a player reaches a certain level of greatness it is kinda pointless to argue this stuff. Only a few players ever reach this level.. Elway, Manning, Unitas, Montana, Marino, Brady, Favre (one day Luck will be in this realm), and once they do, they are all so great it is pointless to talk about the greatest. Kinda like arguing over the hottest girl in the world.

With that being said, Elway was better than all those other chumps.

Powderaddict
09-07-2014, 09:45 AM
Kinda like arguing over the hottest girl in the world.




CHALLENGE ACCEPTED

Kate Upton

http://us.cdn281.fansshare.com/photos/kateupton/kate-upton-slps-nov-1168180301.jpg

mennonite
09-07-2014, 09:52 AM
She has a fantastic rack but there are a lot of women who are hotter than her.

Just one man's opinion.

One lonely, horny, desperate man who will probably spend the next few hours scouring the internet for women hotter than Kate Upton.

Powderaddict
09-07-2014, 09:55 AM
She has a fantastic rack but there are a lot of women who are hotter than her.

Just one man's opinion.

One lonely, horny, desperate man who will probably spend the next few hours scouring the internet for women hotter than Kate Upton.

In these debates, often the journey is its own reward.

Gutless Drunk
09-07-2014, 10:04 AM
PFM would not have have even sniffed the SB in '86, '87, or '89.

This is subjective. Why do you say this? Do you think Manning could not have matched Elway's production of 3500 yards and 19 TD's (the high of those years) in that era?

or do you think he is incapable of game winning drives? (although he is #1 all time in that) http://www.pro-football-reference.com/leaders/gwd_career.htm

or maybe he can't make 4th quarter comebacks? (although he is #1 all time in that) http://www.pro-football-reference.com/leaders/comebacks_career.htm

Why wouldn't he have "even sniffed" the Super Bowl?

Shananahan
09-07-2014, 10:16 AM
Man, that's a horrible picture of Kate Upton.

rmsanger
09-07-2014, 10:19 AM
This is subjective. Why do you say this? Do you think Manning could not have matched Elway's production of 3500 yards and 19 TD's (the high of those years) in that era?

or do you think he is incapable of game winning drives? (although he is #1 all time in that) http://www.pro-football-reference.com/leaders/gwd_career.htm

or maybe he can't make 4th quarter comebacks? (although he is #1 all time in that) http://www.pro-football-reference.com/leaders/comebacks_career.htm

Why wouldn't he have "even sniffed" the Super Bowl?

Manning would have struggled in that era of the nfl based upon the pass defense rules and ability to hit the qb. Secondly the quality of the OL was porous compared to our current lineup and our Wrs we the JV team compared to our unit.

Elway had to run for his life and gun sling epic game winning drives on his feet and his rocket arm. manning can sip lattes and throw to HOF quality receivers in a league that doesn't allow them or the qb to be really anything other than two hand touched.

mennonite
09-07-2014, 10:27 AM
Elway had to run for his life and gun sling epic game winning drives on his feet and his rocket arm.

55-10
39–20
42–10

In five Super Bowl appearances Elway managed only three touchdowns and eight interceptions. And that's counting the years when the team was loaded and had TD.

Gutless Drunk
09-07-2014, 10:29 AM
Secondly the quality of the OL was porous compared to our current lineup and our Wrs we the JV team compared to our unit.


Wait...I thought you were only comparing to the Indy days? What does our current oline have to do with it? Indy trotted out absolute trash on the oline for the majority of his time there and he elevated the Austin Collies of the world.

I believe Manning's knowledge and study of the game and uncanny accuracy would have translated just fine to that era. I love Elway - I watched his entire career... however saying Manning "got his ass handed to him" and "wouldn't have sniffed the SB" is just unfounded hyperbole

ram40ut
09-07-2014, 10:35 AM
I guess all the games he's won single handedly to get by my count, 8 of the 14 Indy teams he played for, and the first Denver team that WERE NOT playoff teams to the post season, didn't require any clutch play by him. It's mopes like this that make me want to
roll around in dog $hit, just to get the retard off of me from reading their nonsense.

I guess it was his fault that a starting NFL DB let a WR get behind him, AFTER he had just made clutch throw after clutch throw to get the lead. His 3rd down conversion late in the 4th against NE in the AFCCG wasn't clutch at all. Nah.

Name me one QB, not named Doug Williams that carried his team through the playoffs, and the SB. I'll wait on your answer.
Ban this fool.

mennonite
09-07-2014, 10:35 AM
Slightly off topic, but I think Elway is doing a better job as a GM than Polian did in Indy. Polian drafted some great players, but he had a ton of misses. And I can't think of any free agents that the Colts signed during that era that had any impact whatsoever. Some great players, but no depth. Reggie Wayne goes down and the next man up is Craphonso Thorpe.

Elway's drafts have been good, but he has truly excelled at bringing in great free agents and managing the cap.

ram40ut
09-07-2014, 10:41 AM
I've been reading message boards since Al Gore invented the internet, and Go broncos could possibly have made the most idiotic retard comment I've ever read.

I'm paraphrasing here:
"I enjoyed watching Tebow more than Manning"


Really? Watching a limp wristed, out of practice squad QB, with a rag arm, over the most prolific offensive player in the history of the game? It's mentalities like this that make me wonder
If we might have just now found the missing link.

Day drinking, copious amounts of cherry Kush, and mental retardation don't mix.

Wes Mantooth
09-07-2014, 10:43 AM
55-10
39–20
42–10

In five Super Bowl appearances Elway managed only three touchdowns and eight interceptions. And that's counting the years when the team was loaded and had TD.

That is inaccurate.

mennonite
09-07-2014, 10:43 AM
I've been reading message boards since Al Gore invented the internet, and Go broncos could possibly have made the most idiotic retard comment I've ever read.

I'm paraphrasing here:
"I enjoyed watching Tebow more than Manning"

It's mentalities like this that make me wonder
If we might have now found the missing link"

Day drinking, copious amounts of cherry Kush, and mental retardation don't mix.


go_broncos is really Chris Collinsworth. Think about it - you ever see them int eh same place at the same time?

rmsanger
09-07-2014, 10:47 AM
55-10
39–20
42–10

In five Super Bowl appearances Elway managed only three touchdowns and eight interceptions. And that's counting the years when the team was loaded and had TD.

Bro Elway took inferior teams and got superior results. Manning had superior teams and has gotten inferior results.

mennonite
09-07-2014, 10:49 AM
Superior results = losing three Super Bowls by a combined score of 136 to 40?

Archer81
09-07-2014, 11:00 AM
I guess all the games he's won single handedly to get by my count, 8 of the 14 Indy teams he played for, and the first Denver team that WERE NOT playoff teams to the post season, didn't require any clutch play by him. It's mopes like this that make me want to
roll around in dog $hit, just to get the retard off of me from reading their nonsense.

I guess it was his fault that a starting NFL DB let a WR get behind him, AFTER he had just made clutch throw after clutch throw to get the lead. His 3rd down conversion late in the 4th against NE in the AFCCG wasn't clutch at all. Nah.

Name me one QB, not named Doug Williams that carried his team through the playoffs, and the SB. I'll wait on your answer.
Ban this fool.


http://tinyurl.com/pw4vjah

:Broncos:

mennonite
09-07-2014, 11:03 AM
http://tinyurl.com/pw4vjah

:Broncos:

Wasn't the packers defense ranked in the top five that year?

broncocalijohn
09-07-2014, 11:13 AM
Then grow up and count to ten before you get behind a keyboard.

I would like no_broncos to count to 18,181,818 before posting in a thread.

stopgap
09-07-2014, 11:40 AM
I've been reading message boards since Al Gore invented the internet, and Go broncos could possibly have made the most idiotic retard comment I've ever read.

I'm paraphrasing here:
"I enjoyed watching Tebow more than Manning"


Really? Watching a limp wristed, out of practice squad QB, with a rag arm, over the most prolific offensive player in the history of the game? It's mentalities like this that make me wonder
If we might have just now found the missing link.

Day drinking, copious amounts of cherry Kush, and mental retardation don't mix.

I have go broncos on my ignore list but forgot why. It wasn't this topic for sure. It was something else. I know he doesn't care and shouldn't. All I know is he annoyed me enough to pull the trigger.

errand
09-07-2014, 11:56 AM
Man, that's a horrible picture of Kate Upton.

There are no horrible pictures of Kate Upton

errand
09-07-2014, 11:59 AM
Arguing over Elway vs Manning doesn't change the fact that go_broncos is an idiot

Archer81
09-07-2014, 12:24 PM
Wasn't the packers defense ranked in the top five that year?


Was that part of his question?


:Broncos:

mennonite
09-07-2014, 12:45 PM
I inferred from your response to his question that you believe Aaron Rodgers carried the Packers to their SB win.

I agree that he had a great year, but is team was very good on both sides of the ball. From Wikipedia (so grain of salt disclaimers apply):

The Packers offense ranked ninth in yards per game, tenth in total points, & fifth in passing yards. The defense ranked fifth in yards allowed and finished second in least amount of points allowed (240, second best in team history), sacks (47), and interceptions (24).

The Packers never lost a game by more than four points, and never trailed by more than seven the entire season, becoming the only team since the AFL-NFL merger in 1970 to accomplish this. All six of their regular season losses were by a combined 20 points.


http://i.imgur.com/CIm2aXl.png


http://i.imgur.com/JE1ZfuR.png

Not 85 Bears level D, but it looks like they did their share.

TheReverend
09-07-2014, 12:53 PM
Current players are generally much better than players from previous eras.

Better training, more preparation, higher investment into finding and developing big time athletes.

Also, way more drugs.