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baja
07-06-2013, 10:53 AM
(NaturalNews) America is rapidly devolving into the oppressive police state we've been warning readers about. Right now, cops are exhibiting thuggish, out-of-control "mafia" behavior as they run loose across America, terrorizing innocent citizens, shooting up the vehicles of people who are merely driving cars on public roadways, taking warrantless blood draws from drivers, shooting pet dogs of people who are merely filming police, raiding farmers at gunpoint over raw milk and terrorizing young women for buying bottled water and cookie dough.

All of these are real and happening right now in America. The cause behind them? Police are being "militarized" through federal training while being given weapons of war through federal grants. Police departments across the country are now being handed armored assault vehicles, surveillance drones and full-auto assault rifles. Along with this equipment comes a training and engagement posture that is increasingly aggressive and militaristic, subjecting more and more Americans to the kind of "theater of war" engagement tactics that the U.S. military would typically use at a roadblock in Afghanistan, for example. (See latest example, below.)

Military tactics and equipment now used by your local police

"In recent years, police departments have widely adopted military tactics, military equipment (armored personnel carriers, flash-bang grenades) -- and, sometimes, the mindset of military conquerors rather than domestic peacekeepers," writes TimesDispatch.com.

President Obama famously said, during the gun control debate of 2012, that, "AK-47s belong in the hands of soldiers, not on the streets of America." Yet it is his administration that's putting weapons of war on the streets of America via local police departments. By arming police and training police in the hardware and tactics of military warfare, the Obama administrations is doing an end-run around Posse Comitatus and effectively putting wartime troops on the streets of America.

As part of all this, federal law enforcement have been training with so-called "no hesitation targets" that train them to instinctively shoot pregnant women, children, young moms and old men. These targets -- whose existence was first denied, and then downplayed when the denials didn't work -- offer irrefutable proof that the corrupt, criminal government currently running the USA is actively planning to engage women, children and senior citizens with weapons of war.

This is, of course, on top of the long-confirmed two billion rounds of ammunition the Department of Homeland Security has ordered (and partially acquired) in an attempt to stockpile enough ammunition for a twenty-year war with the American people. Once again, this stockpiling of hollow-point ammo by DHS was first denied, then downplayed, and now has been called a "conspiracy theory" even thought it is confirmed by the federal government iself which says it needs the ammo for "training purposes."

The IRS is now being trained with AR-15 rifles, and DHS has also purchased thousands of armored assault vehicles that are mine resistant and bulletproof.

Meanwhile, the Boston marathon bombing proved that local police will now act completely outside of law and initiate Martial Law in a manhunt for a teenager. It wasn't declared Martial Law, of course... it was called "shelter in place," meaning you could not leave your homes. Once the lockdown was in place, Boston police went door to door, yanking citizens out of their homes at gunpoint, screaming at them to put their hands up or be shot on sight. This was all done completely without any warrant or any suspicion of wrongdoing on the part of homeowners.

It later turned out that the entire Boston marathon bombing was meticulously planned in advanced by the Boston police and was run as a "terror drill" to terrorize Boston and give the police some much-needed practice in running a police state oppression scenario. This is all 100% confirmed and openly admitted. Even the Boston Globe reported, on June 8th:

The scenario had been carefully planned: A terrorist group prepared to hurt vast numbers of people around Boston would leave backpacks filled with explosives at Faneuil Hall, the Seaport District, and in other towns, spreading waves of panic and fear. Detectives would have to catch the culprits. ... But two months before the training exercise was to take place, the city was hit with a real terrorist attack executed in a frighteningly similar fashion.

Now, apparently, local law enforcement can simply utter the word "manhunt!" and completely ignore all citizens' rights, the Bill of Rights, due process and state and federal law. Police have become rogue gangs with complete immunity from all crimes even while they are the ones committing crimes on a massive scale. They can pull you over for no crime whatsoever, stick their fingers inside your anus and call it a "roadside search" while using the same glove on you that they just used on somebody else's anus. (

Learn more: http://www.naturalnews.com/041072_militarized_police_law_enforcement_paramili tary_training.html#ixzz2YHz87wZT

W*GS
07-06-2013, 10:54 AM
How many times did you orgasm from beating off while reading that?

baja
07-06-2013, 11:02 AM
How many times did you orgasm from beating off while reading that?

Lookie here the rouge government shill in first as usual. The Wags do they pay extra for first in? Plus it's the 4th of July holiday man you must be raking it in double time + first in post bonus. Remember this Wags. When the time comes they will kill you too. You are just a useful idiot to them for now.

baja
07-06-2013, 11:04 AM
As far as your gross adolescent sexual reference. I do not waste my vital force in that manner.

W*GS
07-06-2013, 11:08 AM
As far as your gross adolescent sexual reference. I do not waste my vital force in that manner.

Do you also deny women your essence?

When you did become aware of this profound sense of fatigue and emptiness?

W*GS
07-06-2013, 11:09 AM
Lookie here the rouge government shill in first as usual. The Wags do they pay extra for first in? Plus it's the 4th of July holiday man you must be raking it in double time + first in post bonus. Remember this Wags. When the time comes they will kill you too. You are just a useful idiot to them for now.

But I've got a bamboo cannon to protect myself against our reptilian overlords. You'll try sticks and wee little rocks.

You're a sad little blob.

GreatBronco16
07-06-2013, 09:35 PM
Well I guess it's a good thing you left the country.

Fedaykin
07-06-2013, 11:00 PM
As far as your gross adolescent sexual reference. I do not waste my vital force in that manner.

So, you're saying at least twice?

Rohirrim
08-16-2013, 06:25 AM
The raid on the Garden of Eden farm appears to be the latest example of police departments using SWAT teams and paramilitary tactics to enforce less serious crimes. A Fox television affiliate reported this week, for example, that police in St. Louis County, Mo., brought out the SWAT team to serve an administrative warrant. The report went on to explain that all felony warrants are served with a SWAT team, regardless whether the crime being alleged involves violence.

In recent years, SWAT teams have been called out to perform regulatory alcohol inspections at a bar in Manassas Park, Va.; to raid bars for suspected underage drinking in New Haven, Conn.; to raid a gay bar in Atlanta where police suspected customers and employees were having public sex; and to perform license inspections at barbershops in Orlando, Fla.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/08/15/texas-swat-team-conducts-_n_3764951.html

Pony Boy
08-16-2013, 07:36 AM
How to Start a Police SWAT Team With Federal Funding

With the many active shooting and terrorist attacks in recent years, many police departments have come to realize the usefulness of Special Weapons and Tactics teams. SWAT teams have more training in dealing with such special situations than other law enforcement officers. However, many departments feel they can't start a SWAT team because they lack funding. However, police departments can find funding from outside sources

http://www.ehow.com/how_6853954_start-swat-team-federal-funding.html

32701

barryr
08-16-2013, 03:51 PM
Just easy to notice how these things are deemed not worthy to discuss or be upset about when a democrat is in the WH. Instead the usual suspects just make ad hominem attacks on posters, while stating in other posts they never do such things of course. Whenever stories like this came out when Bush was in the WH, it was "evidence" of how out of control government was and it was all a republican take over of everyone's lives, etc. Now it's a no biggie. NSA. IRS. Patriot Act. Now these things are cool and necessary, since 2009 of course. One really has to dumb down to think like these people or make sense of their "logic."

houghtam
08-16-2013, 04:15 PM
Just easy to notice how these things are deemed not worthy to discuss or be upset about when a democrat is in the WH. Instead the usual suspects just make ad hominem attacks on posters, while stating in other posts they never do such things of course. Whenever stories like this came out when Bush was in the WH, it was "evidence" of how out of control government was and it was all a republican take over of everyone's lives, etc. Now it's a no biggie. NSA. IRS. Patriot Act. Now these things are cool and necessary, since 2009 of course. One really has to dumb down to think like these people or make sense of their "logic."

As opposed to being for it before you were against it like you?

How convenient.

DenverBrit
08-16-2013, 04:20 PM
Just easy to notice how these things are deemed not worthy to discuss or be upset about when a democrat is in the WH. Instead the usual suspects just make ad hominem attacks on posters, while stating in other posts they never do such things of course. Whenever stories like this came out when Bush was in the WH, it was "evidence" of how out of control government was and it was all a republican take over of everyone's lives, etc. Now it's a no biggie. NSA. IRS. Patriot Act. Now these things are cool and necessary, since 2009 of course. One really has to dumb down to think like these people or make sense of their "logic."

Couldn't decide between.....
http://i.imgur.com/0y7mb.jpg

or......
http://1-2knockout.typepad.com/.a/6a00e5505fc4968834010536e09336970b-800wi

nyuk nyuk
08-17-2013, 11:24 AM
Lookie here the rouge government shill in first as usual. The Wags do they pay extra for first in? Plus it's the 4th of July holiday man you must be raking it in double time + first in post bonus. Remember this Wags. When the time comes they will kill you too. You are just a useful idiot to them for now.

You have to understand Wog. He worships the US government when it comes to welfare state domestic policy. It's what the US government does overseas that he screams in rage about, because US policy for much of the last 70 years was geared toward stopping Soviet expansionism, how dare they.

nyuk nyuk
08-17-2013, 11:29 AM
Just easy to notice how these things are deemed not worthy to discuss or be upset about when a democrat is in the WH. Instead the usual suspects just make ad hominem attacks on posters, while stating in other posts they never do such things of course. Whenever stories like this came out when Bush was in the WH, it was "evidence" of how out of control government was and it was all a republican take over of everyone's lives, etc. Now it's a no biggie. NSA. IRS. Patriot Act. Now these things are cool and necessary, since 2009 of course. One really has to dumb down to think like these people or make sense of their "logic."

True enough. I recall in the summer of 2008 liberals cackling about how Bush was a "war criminal" and would be brought up on charges when Obama gets in office. These were the same people who howled - following media coverage of the time - about how scandalous it was how high the military suicide rate and use of drone attacks killing innocents were under Bush. But come swearing in day, they fell silent and Obama didn't lift a finger.

Unfortunately they forget their rightful howling about the Patriot Act, domestic spying, and the creation of the DHS silenced for good the second Obama was sworn in.

I never voted Obama but I had at least hoped these ridiculous programs would be gotten rid of... not expanded. I had hoped the cloud had some sort of silver lining, but it didn't.

SoCalBronco
08-17-2013, 11:33 AM
Thanks Pat

baja
08-17-2013, 11:42 AM
True enough. I recall in the summer of 2008 liberals cackling about how Bush was a "war criminal" and would be brought up on charges when Obama gets in office. These were the same people who howled - following media coverage of the time - about how scandalous it was how high the military suicide rate and use of drone attacks killing innocents were under Bush. But come swearing in day, they fell silent and Obama didn't lift a finger.

Unfortunately they forget their rightful howling about the Patriot Act, domestic spying, and the creation of the DHS silenced for good the second Obama was sworn in.

I never voted Obama but I had at least hoped these ridiculous programs would be gotten rid of... not expanded. I had hoped the cloud had some sort of silver lining, but it didn't.

I never dreamed I'd be saying this but Obama is worse than Bush because he is somehow magically cloaked. He is in some regards Bush on steroids yet the liberals can not see it. The police state is just about in place and few citizens even suspect it is happening.

houghtam
08-17-2013, 11:48 AM
True enough. I recall in the summer of 2008 liberals cackling about how Bush was a "war criminal" and would be brought up on charges when Obama gets in office. These were the same people who howled - following media coverage of the time - about how scandalous it was how high the military suicide rate and use of drone attacks killing innocents were under Bush. But come swearing in day, they fell silent and Obama didn't lift a finger.

Unfortunately they forget their rightful howling about the Patriot Act, domestic spying, and the creation of the DHS silenced for good the second Obama was sworn in.

I never voted Obama but I had at least hoped these ridiculous programs would be gotten rid of... not expanded. I had hoped the cloud had some sort of silver lining, but it didn't.

I bitch-slapped you before about this very topic.

Here, let me do it again.

http://www.orangemane.com/BB/showpost.php?p=3845336&postcount=25

There are also several examples of people from the left and right condemning Obama's drone policy. A win for selective reading right there.

nyuk nyuk
08-17-2013, 11:52 AM
I never dreamed I'd be saying this but Obama is worse than Bush because he is somehow magically cloaked. He is in some regards Bush on steroids yet the liberals can not see it. The police state is just about in place and few citizens even suspect it is happening.

The magic cloak is due to the media refusing to stop kissing his ass. The Socialists who were dumb enough to fall for that crap simply because he's a black liberal have learned the hard way and now have put him place with all the other hated war criminals, but liberals are largely under the spell, so...

W*GS
08-17-2013, 12:10 PM
You have to understand Wog. He worships the US government when it comes to welfare state domestic policy. It's what the US government does overseas that he screams in rage about, because US policy for much of the last 70 years was geared toward stopping Soviet expansionism, how dare they.

Typical idiot right-wing (but I repeat myself) "thinking".

I don't "worship" anything, and I'm more than intelligent enough to understand that some of what we did during the Cold War was immoral and reprehensible and far beneath our principles as a nation.

Too bad you can't achieve that level of intelligence.

nyuk nyuk
08-17-2013, 12:24 PM
I b****-slapped you before about this very topic.

Here, let me do it again.

http://www.orangemane.com/BB/showpost.php?p=3845336&postcount=25

There are also several examples of people from the left and right condemning Obama's drone policy. A win for selective reading right there.

I'm referring to my conversations online with liberals. There is a HUGE set of blinders going on. The same crowd of people who howled during Bush about these things are dead quiet after.

As far as media coverage goes, they overhyped the suicide rates in the Bush years (http://archive.redstate.com/stories/war/a_suicide_epidemic_among_veterans).

nyuk nyuk
08-17-2013, 12:25 PM
Typical idiot right-wing (but I repeat myself) "thinking".

I don't "worship" anything, and I'm more than intelligent enough to understand that some of what we did during the Cold War was immoral and reprehensible and far beneath our principles as a nation.

Too bad you can't achieve that level of intelligence.

Well if you think stopping Soviet expansionism and the multinational invasion of Israel was "immoral and reprehensible," then God help you. I think you were born in the wrong country, that's for sure.

houghtam
08-17-2013, 12:46 PM
I'm referring to my conversations online with liberals. There is a HUGE set of blinders going on. The same crowd of people who howled during Bush about these things are dead quiet after.

As far as media coverage goes, they overhyped the suicide rates in the Bush years (http://archive.redstate.com/stories/war/a_suicide_epidemic_among_veterans).

Cool story, bro. Why don't you link some of those conversations? Otherwise they're not really relevant when you're addressing a forum, of which the majority of the liberal contingent has at one point or another come out against many of Obama's policies, including the ones you listed.

Yes, please link that for us. I'd love to go through your post history on other sites so we can see your opinion on those things you hate so much before there was a black liberal to associate them with. My guess is its very similar to your boy barryr's.

Though I'm sure I could save us all some time and just post dramallama's...

W*GS
08-17-2013, 01:15 PM
Well if you think stopping Soviet expansionism and the multinational invasion of Israel was "immoral and reprehensible," then God help you. I think you were born in the wrong country, that's for sure.

Zeus help your reading skills and comprehension. I didn't say what you claim. I said some of what we did during the Cold War was immoral and reprehensible

Was absolutely everything we did in "stopping Soviet expansionism" completely moral and right? Please make your case.

And Israel's defense is Israel's problem, not ours. They're more than capable of defense.

nyuk nyuk
08-17-2013, 01:18 PM
Places where I usually speak with liberals, they are 100% blind partisan hacks and admit no wrongdoing, especially when that wrongdoing is discussed by conservatives. What dissent there is from Obama here is not the norm in my experience over a number of years. Most of these are chat rooms and there is no saved conversations or links to them. Unfortunately where liberals here digress from Obama is usually that he isn't liberal enough, that he's not enough of a partisan hack.

nyuk nyuk
08-17-2013, 01:21 PM
Zeus help your reading skills and comprehension. I didn't say what you claim. I said

Was absolutely everything we did in "stopping Soviet expansionism" completely moral and right? Please make your case.

And Israel's defense is Israel's problem, not ours. They're more than capable of defense.

I've already discussed US foreign policy in the Cold War with you. How can you have a discussion on this topic when your opponent's research into US interventionism is reduced to copy and pasting from anti-American lefty websites that condemn any and all US interventionism as it got in the way of the leftist agenda? I've not seen in one instance in which you were remotely willing to reserve judgment against your country on the grounds that it was legitimately stopping Soviet expansionism.

Part of international alliances is the defense of our neighbors and allies. Get used to the idea. Israel was being invaded by all of its neighbors and you howled at the US for having the audacity to intervene and putting a stop to a small part of that? Huh?!!

W*GS
08-17-2013, 01:25 PM
I've already discussed US foreign policy in the Cold War with you.

No, you just spewed the usual beat-the-Commies-at-any-cost crap so typical of neoBircher dorks.

How can you have a discussion on this topic when your opponent's research into US interventionism is reduced to copy and pasting from anti-American lefty websites that condemn any and all US interventionism as it got in the way of the leftist agenda? I've not seen in one instance in which you were remotely willing to reserve judgment against your country on the grounds that it was legitimately stopping Soviet expansionism.

I've not seen one instance of you even allowing that the US committed immoral acts during the Cold War. Speaking of blind nationalist hacks...

BTW, since when is judging one's country as falling short of its ideals a bad thing? Oh yeah - to conservatives, America is always right. Always. Anyone who dares question anything we do is automatically anti-America, a traitor, a scumbag, and ought to be deported or executed so they can burn in hell forever.

Damn, but you're one protofascist puke.

Part of international alliances is the defense of our neighbors and allies. Get used to the idea. Israel was being invaded by all of its neighbors and you howled at the US for having the audacity to intervene and putting a stop to a small part of that? Huh?!!

Our alliance with Israel is far more trouble than it's worth. Time for us to cut them off. They have no enemies that they can't handle. Yes, even Iran.

houghtam
08-17-2013, 01:25 PM
Places where I usually speak with liberals, they are 100% blind partisan hacks and admit no wrongdoing, especially when that wrongdoing is discussed by conservatives. What dissent there is from Obama here is not the norm in my experience over a number of years. Most of these are chat rooms and there is no saved conversations or links to them. Unfortunately where liberals here digress from Obama is usually that he isn't liberal enough, that he's not enough of a partisan hack.

How convenient. I didn't even know chat rooms existed anymore.

And gee. Do you really think its possible to think Obama isn't liberal enough WHILE disagreeing with things like his policy on drones?

You don't say.

nyuk nyuk
08-17-2013, 01:43 PM
How convenient. I didn't even know chat rooms existed anymore.

And gee. Do you really think its possible to think Obama isn't liberal enough WHILE disagreeing with things like his policy on drones?

You don't say.

Convenient? What is this, a conspiracy theory? You can look up plenty of chat rooms on a search engine. As far as I know the large AOL network is still up. Some partisan liberals there, too. :D

Meh, I'll be more impressed with the little disagreement on drone policy when they shout WAR CRIMINAL!! the way they did over Bush.

So let's hear it!

nyuk nyuk
08-17-2013, 01:49 PM
No, you just spewed the usual beat-the-Commies-at-any-cost crap so typical of neoBircher dorks.



I've not seen one instance of you even allowing that the US committed immoral acts during the Cold War. Speaking of blind nationalist hacks...

BTW, since when is judging one's country as falling short of its ideals a bad thing? Oh yeah - to conservatives, America is always right. Always. Anyone who dares question anything we do is automatically anti-America, a traitor, a scumbag, and ought to be deported or executed so they can burn in hell forever.

Damn, but you're one protofascist puke.



Our alliance with Israel is far more trouble than it's worth. Time for us to cut them off. They have no enemies that they can't handle. Yes, even Iran.

"Beating the Commies" is not crap, it was the bread and butter of US foreign policy for decades. Immoral acts in the Cold War? Yeah - narcotics trafficking.

Your problem is that you continue to blanket indict the US government for interventions and actions it took to justifiably stop the USSR from gaining a foothold outside its sphere of power without bothering to look at the context and background of them. As far as morals go, I don't see how anyone can make a moral argument against the US stepping in in Syria to stop that government from invading Israel, knowing what would happen to the population of Israel had the invasion been successful. Hitler treated them better than what they would have suffered at the hands of those people. Every single Jew in that country would have been butchered within a week. Period.

I didn't realize that resisting Marxist revolutionary movements backed by the USSR and Jew-hating nut jobs was a violation of American ideals. I stand corrected.

How on earth am I remotely fascist? I think I'd at least to have to admire people like Hitler and Mussolini first. If letting Jews be butchered is moral, why am I the one being called a fascist here?

W*GS
08-17-2013, 02:12 PM
"Beating the Commies" is not crap, it was the bread and butter of US foreign policy for decades. Immoral acts in the Cold War? Yeah - narcotics trafficking.

You're a dishonest turd, because you know you can't be honest and make your arguments work. You have to tell (at best) half-truths. You know it, I know it, and everyone else here knows it.

Drop the juvenile bull - GTFU and quit being so blatantly unprincipled.

The sole thing the US did during the Cold War that you find wrong is drug trafficking? Everything else was A-OK and right and moral and good? That's utter rubbish.

Your problem is that you continue to blanket indict the US government for interventions and actions it took to justifiably stop the USSR from gaining a foothold outside its sphere of power without bothering to look at the context and background of them.

Realpolitik strikes again. So long as the USSR was in **** 10 feet deep, we could sink to 9 feet 11 and 63/64ths inches and be the Good Guys.

We shoulda nuked Moscow sometime between '46 and '48, eh?

As far as morals go, I don't see how anyone can make a moral argument against the US stepping in in Syria to stop that government from invading Israel, knowing what would happen to the population of Israel had the invasion been successful. Hitler treated them better than what they would have suffered at the hands of those people. Every single Jew in that country would have been butchered within a week. Period.

Thanks for the hyperbole.

I didn't realize that resisting Marxist revolutionary movements backed by the USSR and Jew-hating nut jobs was a violation of American ideals. I stand corrected.

It was some of the things we did we in pursuit of those goals that were far below our ideals as nation. Do you honestly believe that absolutely every action undertaken by the US during the Cold War was moral and good? Every single one?

How on earth am I remotely fascist? I think I'd at least to have to admire people like Hitler and Mussolini first. If letting Jews be butchered is moral, why am I the one being called a fascist here?

Should the US have allied itself with Hitler before Nazi Germany invaded the USSR, because the USSR was the greater evil? Why not?

The defense of Israel is Israel's job, not ours. That doesn't mean I want Jews slaughtered. What an incredibly simplistic and dumbass belief. Typical of you, though.

nyuk nyuk
08-17-2013, 02:53 PM
Wog, you wanted an example of what the US did that was immoral in the Cold War, and you got an example. I could also add firebombings but that was pre-Cold War. As I said you can find no good in US foreign policy and take the leftist stance of hating all of it without distinction, co-opting their blanket indictments which originate with America's stance against the spread of radical leftism and nothing more. As I've said here many times, the moral arguments of the radical left come from politics, not morals. They morally condemn anyone in their way. Unfortunately you seem to have joined the many millions of those who have not known this and have taken their moralistic whining seriously. I was like that once, then I began to make some realizations. Copy and pasting their crap only makes you a dupe. It also makes you look like you have no argument of your own, which I've already gleaned from our discussions that that is the case.

I'd absolutely love to know how standing against Soviet aggression was "realpolitik" and not a valid ethical position. Your argument here reeks of something I would see from the radical left. If you're so concerned about a moral and ethical motivation, why do you keep throwing Israel under the bus per the invasions? Let the Syrians and their allies butcher the Jews because it's the moral thing to do? Whut?

My Israel statement was not hyperbole. Do you really think they'd have all come in and held a big party with the Jews? Perhaps played Twister? The Game of Life? Really?

Hitler was as aggressively expansionist as Stalin was, so why would the US have allied with Hitler?

houghtam
08-17-2013, 03:21 PM
Wog, you wanted an example of what the US did that was immoral in the Cold War, and you got an example. I could also add firebombings but that was pre-Cold War. As I said you can find no good in US foreign policy and take the leftist stance of hating all of it without distinction, co-opting their blanket indictments which originate with America's stance against the spread of radical leftism and nothing more. As I've said here many times, the moral arguments of the radical left come from politics, not morals. They morally condemn anyone in their way. Unfortunately you seem to have joined the many millions of those who have not known this and have taken their moralistic whining seriously. I was like that once, then I began to make some realizations. Copy and pasting their crap only makes you a dupe. It also makes you look like you have no argument of your own, which I've already gleaned from our discussions that that is the case.

I'd absolutely love to know how standing against Soviet aggression was "realpolitik" and not a valid ethical position. Your argument here reeks of something I would see from the radical left. If you're so concerned about a moral and ethical motivation, why do you keep throwing Israel under the bus per the invasions? Let the Syrians and their allies butcher the Jews because it's the moral thing to do? Whut?

My Israel statement was not hyperbole. Do you really think they'd have all come in and held a big party with the Jews? Perhaps played Twister? The Game of Life? Really?

Hitler was as aggressively expansionist as Stalin was, so why would the US have allied with Hitler?

Could you please expound on how Syria was planning on massacring every Jew in Israel? I'm curious what you're even talking about.

W*GS
08-17-2013, 03:28 PM
Wog, you wanted an example of what the US did that was immoral in the Cold War, and you got an example.

You used the phrase "narcotics trafficking" without specifics. How was it immoral? Are narcotics immoral?

But everything else - the undeclared wars, the wars-by-proxy, the support of dictators, the coups, the assassinations - were all A-OK by you.

Why?

As I said you can find no good in US foreign policy and take the leftist stance of hating all of it without distinction, co-opting their blanket indictments which originate with America's stance against the spread of radical leftism and nothing more.

You can find no wrong in US foreign policy and take the rightist stance of supporting all of it without distinction. You think America was so weak it couldn't sink to the level of the USSR and prevail. You support abandoning every single principle that America stands for. How does that your blind support of the US any different than the most committed Communist's blind support of the USSR? Anything to "win"? Why?

As I've said here many times, the moral arguments of the radical left come from politics, not morals.

Explain:

http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a81/kos102/2009/Rogues/rumsfeld-saddam.jpg

A pure example of politics, not morals. Was Rummy part of the "radical left"?

I'd absolutely love to know how standing against Soviet aggression was "realpolitik" and not a valid ethical position.

Some of what we did to fight the USSR was pure realpolitik. Immoral but served our political ends at the moment. Obliterations of everything that America stands for - or at least is supposed to, in clear difference to every other nation on the planet. You and your ilk are the ones who made a mockery of American exceptionalism, with your penchant for bottom-feeding and crude political games at the expense of our principles and the lives of endless numbers of innocents.

If you're so concerned about a moral and ethical motivation, why do you keep throwing Israel under the bus per the invasions? Let the Syrians and their allies butcher the Jews because it's the moral thing to do? Whut?

I've already explained. Israel's defense is Israel's problem. If you believe them incapable of protecting themselves, then move there and help 'em out.

Hitler was as aggressively expansionist as Stalin was, so why would the US have allied with Hitler?

We allied ourselves with Stalin to defeat Hitler. Was that wise?

W*GS
08-17-2013, 03:29 PM
Could you please expound on how Syria was planning on massacring every Jew in Israel? I'm curious what you're even talking about.

Me too. nyuk is obviously of the Israel-can-do-no-wrong school of hardcore conservatism.

nyuk nyuk
08-17-2013, 03:36 PM
Could you please expound on how Syria was planning on massacring every Jew in Israel? I'm curious what you're even talking about.

I am not going to review a debate on middle east history here. Use your search function.

houghtam
08-17-2013, 03:41 PM
I am not going to review a debate on middle east history here. Use your search function.

Are you referring to the Yom Kippur War? If so, your understanding of it is...cursory, at best.

LOL

houghtam
08-17-2013, 03:45 PM
Some of what we did to fight the USSR was pure realpolitik. Immoral but served our political ends at the moment. Obliterations of everything that America stands for - or at least is supposed to...

No, the obliteration of free speech was definitely not a dark day in our history, and DEFINITELY helped 'Murrica win the war against the commies.

nyuk nyuk
08-17-2013, 03:46 PM
You used the phrase "narcotics trafficking" without specifics. How was it immoral? Are narcotics immoral?

Why should I use specifics? Where have you? You pasted **** from a leftist website with no context of how ANY of those military actions were immoral.

Now in the hell is the immorality of narcotics trafficking not obvious?

But everything else - the undeclared wars, the wars-by-proxy, the support of dictators, the coups, the assassinations - were all A-OK by you.

Why?

Alzheimers or playing dumb? Even when valid context is applied and explained, you STILL reject every bit of it off-hand.


You can find no wrong in US foreign policy and take the rightist stance of supporting all of it without distinction. You think America was so weak it couldn't sink to the level of the USSR and prevail. You support abandoning every single principle that America stands for. How does that your blind support of the US any different than the most committed Communist's blind support of the USSR? Anything to "win"? Why?

What is this "rightist stance" nonsense? Do you think the Democrats are against this because they offer lip service to their sucker progressive voters while behind closed doors the torture machines at Gitmo keep whirring?

How is stopping Soviet expansionism "sinking to the level" of them? How did we sink? By backing such as the Contras to counter the Soviet-backed Nicaraguans and establish an even but small military presence in Costa Rica so that country - lacking a standing military - would be safe from being invaded by Nicaragua next door?

What principles am I abandoning? What principles do you think this country stands for? You keep saying that and not specifying while demanding specifics. What in the hell are you talking about?


Explain:

http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a81/kos102/2009/Rogues/rumsfeld-saddam.jpg

A pure example of politics, not morals. Was Rummy part of the "radical left"?

Garbage. Cold War. He was also a buffer against the terrorism-exporting Mullahs. In my opinion he should have been left in power.

Want an even more concerning one?

http://pub.mathaba.net/wp-content/uploads/2012/11/Obama-shakes-hands-with-Gaddafi-the-smile-from-a-Judas-300x200.jpg

What in the hell was Obama doing shaking hands with that creep?

Some of what we did to fight the USSR was pure realpolitik. Immoral but served our political ends at the moment.

Such as? I hope you have more than a vague list from a leftist website this time.


Obliterations of everything that America stands for - or at least is supposed to, in clear difference to every other nation on the planet. You and your ilk are the ones who made a mockery of American exceptionalism, with your penchant for bottom-feeding and crude political games at the expense of our principles and the lives of endless numbers of innocents.

More vague lectures. What of American exceptionalism have we mocked, other than all I can gather from your posting habits is that you seem to equate American exceptionalism with a liberal welfare state.


We allied with Stalin to defeat a lesser enemy. Sometimes in emergencies, AS I EXPLAINED SEVERAL TIMES, such things are required. Doing so saved lives. Don't tell me - this is "realpolitik" right?

W*GS
08-17-2013, 03:52 PM
Thanks for showing your hand, nyuk. You've played it exactly as I expected.

Here's you...

http://www.fantasiescometrue.com/images/medium/fct_a39e5ff862f9add.jpg

nyuk nyuk
08-17-2013, 04:04 PM
Are you referring to the Yom Kippur War? If so, your understanding of it is...cursory, at best.

LOL

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-vwZ2RaM2sIU/Tc7hNDd8Z3I/AAAAAAAADfs/G5kzIhJ2Bbo/s400/facepalm-homer.jpg

nyuk nyuk
08-17-2013, 04:04 PM
Thanks for showing your hand, nyuk. You've played it exactly as I expected.

Here's you...

http://www.fantasiescometrue.com/images/medium/fct_a39e5ff862f9add.jpg

Yes if all else fails you revert to ad hominem, as usual not bothering to explain yourself but argue in these vague concepts you refuse to define.

Help yourself, buddy.

W*GS
08-17-2013, 04:14 PM
Yes if all else fails you revert to ad hominem, as usual not bothering to explain yourself but argue in these vague concepts you refuse to define.

I ain't the one making America a bottom-feeder for purely political reasons, damn morality.

That's your schtick.

nyuk nyuk
08-17-2013, 04:26 PM
Wog, if you aren't going to debate your points faithfully instead of calling names, can you stay off my back?


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W*GS
08-17-2013, 04:32 PM
Wog, if you aren't going to debate your points faithfully instead of calling names, can you stay off my back?

I haven't engaged in any name-calling.

You've engaged in name-calling and blatant dishonesty.

Nothing is beneath you so long as you "win". The same "principle" as your view of America's foreign policy. We cannot possibly go too low and too wrong because hey, we're America, and we're always right (because God is on our side)!

W*GS
08-19-2013, 04:23 PM
CIA documents acknowledge its role in Iran's 1953 coup (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-23762970)

But according to 'nyuk', America did the Right Thing.

So much for our respect for self-determination.

alkemical
08-23-2013, 11:23 AM
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Meck77
08-23-2013, 11:31 AM
Lol at this thread. Yet the old paranoid guy lives in Mexico among the most corrupt police on the planet. *shrug*

The reality is if a cop so much as farts on someone in America he could end up on youtube within minutes. Beat someone down unjustly. They will be suspended and fired by the end of the week.

nyuk nyuk
08-23-2013, 11:38 AM
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So how do we do this when they want to ban every other gun out there?

Sounds to me like he's speaking of a well-regulated militia.

nyuk nyuk
08-23-2013, 11:39 AM
I haven't engaged in any name-calling.

You've engaged in name-calling and blatant dishonesty.

Nothing is beneath you so long as you "win". The same "principle" as your view of America's foreign policy. We cannot possibly go too low and too wrong because hey, we're America, and we're always right (because God is on our side)!

Whatever you say, boss. Namecalling is most of what you do here to everyone, not just me.

houghtam
08-23-2013, 11:45 AM
So how do we do this when they want to ban every other gun out there?

Sounds to me like he's speaking of a well-regulated militia.

http://www.factcheck.org/2008/11/obamas-national-security-force/

Old news. Buy a clue.

nyuk nyuk
08-23-2013, 11:49 AM
CIA documents acknowledge its role in Iran's 1953 coup (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-23762970)

But according to 'nyuk', America did the Right Thing.

So much for our respect for self-determination.

Yet again you attack the US for moving to block Soviet expansionism - in the name of decency, no less. Here's a funny one -

The United States played a crucial, even determining, role in keeping Iran's territorial integrity from Soviet designs. Keen on getting an oil concession for the northern provinces on Iranís Caspian coast, Stalin ordered the creation of two separatist movements in the country, and threatened to dismember Iran if he did not get the northern oil concessions. Many Iranian nationalists were opposed to the idea of any spoils to the Soviets. Truman issued a virtual ultimatum demanding that the Soviets withdraw from Iran in 1946. Eventually Soviet forces were withdrawn, making it the only instance in the postwar years when Stalin's Red Army occupied a territory and was forced to give it up. Without the United States, in other words, there might not have been the Iran we know today.

The Myth of Operation Ajax (http://nationalinterest.org/commentary/the-myth-operation-ajax-4761)




!Booya! :thumbsup: :thanku:

nyuk nyuk
08-23-2013, 11:51 AM
http://www.factcheck.org/2008/11/obamas-national-security-force/

Old news. Buy a clue.

That's rather daft. I never claimed he was trying to form a gestapo. Keep on topic, please? No strawmen, no caricatures?