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mhgaffney
06-09-2013, 05:05 PM
Paranoid delusions?

Oh were that the case. No, it's the regrettable reality.

Still don't believe it? Check this out.
MHG

Top NSA Whistleblower Spills the Beans on the Real Scope of the Spying Program

http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article35212.htm

mhgaffney
06-09-2013, 05:11 PM
Guess what? Two Israeli firms are helping the NSA to do it.

Oh and btw, the two firms use proprietary software that almost certainly has back door to the Mossad.

MHG

What was the Israeli Involvement in Collecting U.S. Communications Intel for NSA?

for the links go to
http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article35215.htm

Israeli high-tech firms Verint and Narus have had connections with U.S. companies and Israeli intelligence in the past, and ties between the countries' intelligence agencies remain strong.

By Haaretz, The Associated Press and Reuters

June 08, 2013 "Information Clearing House - "Haaretz" - Were Israeli companies Verint and Narus the ones that collected information from the U.S. communications network for the National Security Agency?

The question arises amid controversy over revelations that the NSA has been collecting the phone records of hundreds of millions of Americans every day, creating a database through which it can learn whether terror suspects have been in contact with people in the United States. It also was disclosed this week that the NSA has been gathering all internet usage - audio, video, photographs, emails and searches - from nine major U.S. Internet providers, including Microsoft and Google, in hopes of detecting suspicious behavior that begins overseas.

According to an article in the American technology magazine "Wired" from April 2012, two Israeli companies – which the magazine describes as having close connections to the Israeli security community – conduct bugging and wiretapping for the NSA.

Verint, which took over its parent company Comverse Technology earlier this year, is responsible for tapping the communication lines of the American telephone giant Verizon, according to a past Verizon employee sited by James Bamford in Wired. Neither Verint nor Verizon commented on the matter.

Natus, which was acquired in 2010 by the American company Boeing, supplied the software and hardware used at AT&T wiretapping rooms, according to whistleblower Mark Klein, who revealed the information in 2004. Klein, a past technician at AT&T who filed a suit against the company for spying on its customers, revealed a "secret room" in the company's San Fransisco office, where the NSA collected data on American citizens' telephone calls and Internet surfing.

Klein's claims were reinforced by former NSA employee Thomas Drake who testified that the agency uses a program produced by Narus to save the personal electrical communications of AT&T customers.

Both Verint and Narus have ties to the Israeli intelligence agency and the Israel Defense Forces intelligence-gathering unit 8200. Hanan Gefen, a former commander of the 8200 unit, told Forbes magazine in 2007 that Comverse's technology, which was formerly the parent company of Verint and merged with it this year, was directly influenced by the technology of 8200. Ori Cohen, one of the founders of Narus, told Fortune magazine in 2001 that his partners had done technology work for the Israeli intelligence.

International intel

The question of whether intelligence communities outside the United States were involved has been raised. According to The Guardian, the Government Communications Headquarters (GCHQ), Britain's intelligence agency, secretly collected intelligence information from the world's largest Internet companies via the American program PRISM. According to a top secret document obtained by The Guardian, GCHQ had access to PRISM since 2010 and it used the information to prepare 197 intelligence reports last year. In a statement to the Guardian, GCHQ, said it "takes its obligations under the law very seriously."

According to The Guardian, details of GCHQ's use of PRISM are set out in a 41-page PowerPoint presentation prepared for senior NSA analysts, and describe a "snooping" operation that gave the NSA and FBI access to the systems of nine Internet giants, including Google, Facebook, Microsoft, Apple, Yahoo and Skype.

Given the close ties between U.S. and Israeli intelligence, the question arises as to whether Israeli intelligence, including the Mossad, was party to the secret.

W*GS
06-09-2013, 06:19 PM
Dem damned Jews again, right, Herr gaffe?

mhgaffney
06-09-2013, 07:04 PM
James Bamford (not me) reported on this in his third book about the NSA -- THE SHADOW FACTORY...

Of course, W*gs would prefer that none of us know about it.

MHG

W*GS
06-09-2013, 07:24 PM
James Bamford (not me) reported on this in his third book about the NSA -- THE SHADOW FACTORY...

Of course, W*gs would prefer that none of us know about it.

I want every American to know that the government is spying on us.

Blaming the Jews isn't necessary, but is par for the course for you.

You're so far gone into Naziland that you wreck every post of yours and your own credibility with your hatred of Jews.

The Lone Bolt
06-09-2013, 08:04 PM
This program certainly has potential for abuse. Whether it will be abused remains to be seen.

Dr. Broncenstein
06-10-2013, 07:59 AM
The limited contitutional republic by and for the people is here to serve you, citizen.

Smiling Assassin27
06-10-2013, 11:16 AM
And here I was buying extra storage space for my computer when the government was doing it for me the whole friggin' time...

Smiling Assassin27
06-10-2013, 11:17 AM
This program certainly has potential for abuse. Whether it will NOT be abused remains to be seen.


Given the track record, I went ahead and FIFY.

Dr. Broncenstein
06-10-2013, 11:19 AM
If you have nothing to hide you have nothing to fear, citizen.

mhgaffney
06-10-2013, 01:00 PM
I want every American to know that the government is spying on us.

Blaming the Jews isn't necessary, but is par for the course for you.

You're so far gone into Naziland that you wreck every post of yours and your own credibility with your hatred of Jews.

The Israeli paper Ha'aretz -- not me -- is asking questions about the role of the Israeli spy firms. I gave the link.

You really are a one trick pony.

MHG

Rigs11
06-10-2013, 02:08 PM
and yet millions of americans voluntarily join websites like facebook, where corporations gather their data. Oh noes!

TonyR
06-11-2013, 11:05 AM
Far too many people get their notions of what our government is all about from Hollywood; the paranoid thrilled is a wonderful form of entertainment, but it’s a fantasy. The idea that our government is some sort of conspiracy, that it’s a somehow foreign body intent on robbing us of our freedoms, is corrosive and dangerous to our democracy. This remains, and always will be, an extremely libertarian country; it’s encoded in our DNA. We now face a constant, low-level terrorist threat that needs to be monitored. A great many lives are potentially at stake…and our national security is more important than any marginal–indeed, mythical–rights that we may have conceded in the Patriot Act legislation. In the end, the slippery slope, all or nothing, arguments advanced by extreme civil libertarians bear an uncomfortable resemblance to the slippery slope, all or nothing, arguments advanced by the National Rifle Association. http://swampland.time.com/2013/06/10/the-civil-liberties-freakout/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+timeblogs%2Fswampland+%28TIME %3A+Swampland%29

BroncoBeavis
06-11-2013, 11:44 AM
http://swampland.time.com/2013/06/10/the-civil-liberties-freakout/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+timeblogs%2Fswampland+%28TIME %3A+Swampland%29

Even if there were never any conspiracy anywhere ever, building and housing a superdatabase of everyone's personal and legally private information for the reference of a bunch of federally-employed and/or contracted bumble****s is anything but a good idea.

Rohirrim
06-11-2013, 12:31 PM
http://swampland.time.com/2013/06/10/the-civil-liberties-freakout/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+timeblogs%2Fswampland+%28TIME %3A+Swampland%29

Here's what I wonder: Is the threat worth the risk? Can a terrorist act bring down our country? Of course not. What is the status of the terrorist threat at this point in time? We've taken down the majority of big Al Queda operators over the last ten years. They seem to be reduced to small scale, limited actor eruptions like the Boston bombing. What's more dangerous, a bomb in a railway station, a shooting in a mall, a plane being crashed, or a massive, trillion dollar military industrial complex having control of an enormous, combined corporate/government/military/spy agency surveillance apparatus?

Like I say, once the apparatus is in place it's only the mere flipping of a switch to turn the emphasis in another direction. Or perhaps, simply redefine the meaning of the word, "Terrorist?" This whole "Security in exchange for liberty" argument has a unique smell to it. I'm surprised Klein is making it. Perhaps he has spent too much time in Washington?

Dr. Broncenstein
06-11-2013, 12:39 PM
We are recording your every bit, citizen. This is for your protection against people like those guys who bombed the marathon a couple of years after the Russians warned us about them.

TonyR
06-11-2013, 12:59 PM
Even if there were never any conspiracy anywhere ever, building and housing a superdatabase of everyone's personal and legally private information for the reference of a bunch of federally-employed and/or contracted bumble****s is anything but a good idea.

I certainly understand the hesitation. But come on, corporations have been doing this for years. People willingly give companies their personal info in various ways every day. Big employers spy on their employees. Now we're surprised and outraged that the NSA is doing it? And they're not reading our emails. They're just getting scanned/filtered. Personally I'm not all that concerned about it and think it's well worth the small "invasion of privacy". But there's no conspiracy here.

BroncoBeavis
06-11-2013, 01:16 PM
I certainly understand the hesitation. But come on, corporations have been doing this for years. People willingly give companies their personal info in various ways every day. Big employers spy on their employees. Now we're surprised and outraged that the NSA is doing it? And they're not reading our emails. They're just getting scanned/filtered. Personally I'm not all that concerned about it and think it's well worth the small "invasion of privacy". But there's no conspiracy here.

There's a principled reason to oppose any of this, Tony. But also a practical one that you've already forgotten (since the days when you rightfully regarded this sort of thing as "appalling")

http://www.orangemane.com/BB/showpost.php?p=3405223&postcount=1

The weapons you give to your political friends will eventually be wielded by your political enemies. Neither side needs to know what you believe, where you live, and how long it's been since you've been audited.

TonyR
06-11-2013, 01:20 PM
There's a principled reason to oppose any of this, Tony.

Again, I understand "opposition". But I don't fully understand the surprise and outrage, other than perhaps the partisan nature of it. Did you really think our intelligence agencies weren't doing this?

BroncoBeavis
06-11-2013, 01:25 PM
Again, I understand "opposition". But I don't fully understand the surprise and outrage, other than perhaps the partisan nature of it. Did you really think our intelligence agencies weren't doing this?

Really? You went from "appalling" even before any of these even dirtier details came out

to

"Personally I'm not all that concerned about it and think it's well worth the small "invasion of privacy"

That's a shocking amount of partisan ball gargling. We need to break out of this.

TonyR
06-11-2013, 01:32 PM
Really? You went from "appalling" even before any of these even dirtier details came out...

You're cherry picking just a little bit here, don't you think? Do I need to explain or are we going to have to bore everyone with an elongated argument that will have no conclusion?

BroncoBeavis
06-11-2013, 01:47 PM
You're cherry picking just a little bit here, don't you think? Do I need to explain or are we going to have to bore everyone with an elongated argument that will have no conclusion?

Guess you're going to tell me that you meant everything OTHER THAN the warrantless wiretapping stuff you copied and pasted was appalling. That part about surveillance you meant to call a totally-worth-it-small-invasion-of-privacy, but you just forgot. :)

TonyR
06-11-2013, 04:34 PM
Guess you're going to tell me that you meant everything OTHER THAN the warrantless wiretapping stuff you copied and pasted was appalling. That part about surveillance you meant to call a totally-worth-it-small-invasion-of-privacy, but you just forgot.

It's a bit more nuanced than that, but of course you don't deal in nuance but instead love to ladle on the generalities (particularly when you feel they support your viewpoint).

This is a "civil liberties" issue, just not one that I'm specifically up in arms about. That post showed the totality of Gingrich's civil liberties stances, not just one issue. It's clear which way he always leans. It's not clear what you're so concerned about.

BroncoBeavis
06-11-2013, 04:54 PM
It's a bit more nuanced than that, but of course you don't deal in nuance but instead love to ladle on the generalities (particularly when you feel they support your viewpoint).

This is a "civil liberties" issue, just not one that I'm specifically up in arms about. That post showed the totality of Gingrich's civil liberties stances, not just one issue. It's clear which way he always leans. It's not clear what you're so concerned about.

And no matter how hard the Obama administration tried to be corrupt they'd never top the fraudulent rush to war in Iraq and the ensuing torture regime and assault on civil liberties and the constitution orchestrated by the Bush administration. Get real.

LOL

Dr. Broncenstein
06-12-2013, 09:43 AM
<iframe width="640" height="360" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/Ax-2i71bqGw" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Free Obama phone comes with lifetime NSA wiretap service.

Pony Boy
06-12-2013, 10:06 AM
Free Obama phone comes with lifetime NSA wiretap service.

And a free Tattoo ..... Bracelets optional

Dr. Broncenstein
06-12-2013, 10:12 AM
And a free Tattoo ..... Bracelets optional

Cool ink, bro.

TonyR
06-12-2013, 01:07 PM
I stole this reader comment from this article: http://www.economist.com/blogs/freeexchange/2013/06/technology-and-freedom


The most Popular Person in the World is Santa Claus.
He gives gifts to all the good boys.
And lumps of coal to the bad boys.
Santa knows when you have been good or bad.
Of course he has an extensive 24/7 surveillance system with millions of ninja spying elves deployed worldwide in children's bedrooms.
As every child knows, Santa always had TOTAL INFORMATION AWARENESS.
_________________________
The American government gave valuable gifts as well that has made globalization, international travel, international business, the Information Age and the Social Media Twitterverse possible:
-Telegraph Technology
-Voice Telephone
-Long Distance Intercontinental Calling
-Modern Computers
-The Internet
-eMail
-Global Positioning System
-Commercial Global Passenger Airline System
-Worldwide Commercial Jet Service
-Cloud Storage of Data
-Mobile Phone Technology
-The Smart Phone
And like Santa Claus, it monitors bad boys from a northern fortress of solitude.
It doesn't read your thoughts....Just your Facebook.
_________________________
It is a reciprocal relationship.
In Love and War and Life: Nothing is for free.
It is the Santa Claus Effect.
All good boys and girls have nothing to fear.
You will continue to get amazing technology toys.
Keep your nose clean. ;)
_______________________
The greatest Pride of Men, is that they are held responsible for their Success.
The greatest Fear of Men, is that they are held responsible for their Crime.
Yes, we are responsible for our own actions.
Some will fear this. Others will feel vindicated.
Act as if all your actions will be observed, questioned, and judged.
Even if they aren't.
It is called being an 'adult'. Being responsible.
_________________________
Re Santa Claus:
***Hindus call him Vishnu
*** Catholics know him as an vengeful Archangel Angel
***Muslims may call him the angry Prophet Muhummad
***Agnostics may call him blind Justice with a scale and a sword
***Gamblers call him Lady Luck
***John Lennon called him Instant Karma
This is the basis for universal morality: Do good. Don't do evil.
Any way you call it, Santa Claus is Coming to Town.
Be good.

cutthemdown
06-12-2013, 01:33 PM
Computer password protection and email encryption are going to blow up now.

Smiling Assassin27
06-13-2013, 08:28 AM
This, if true, should be disturbing:

The White House assures that tracking our every phone call and keystroke is to stop terrorists, and yet it won't snoop in mosques, where the terrorists are.

That's right, the government's sweeping surveillance of our most private communications excludes the jihad factories where homegrown terrorists are radicalized.

Since October 2011, mosques have been off-limits to FBI agents. No more surveillance or undercover string operations without high-level approval from a special oversight body at the Justice Department dubbed the Sensitive Operations Review Committee.


http://news.investors.com/ibd-editorials/061213-659753-all-intrusive-obama-terror-dragnet-excludes-mosques.htm

barryr
06-13-2013, 08:57 AM
This, if true, should be disturbing:



http://news.investors.com/ibd-editorials/061213-659753-all-intrusive-obama-terror-dragnet-excludes-mosques.htm

Not surprising since spying on people is more for political purposes than for security of this nation, so this would make sense that muslims are excluded. Spy on 80 year old grandmas who visit conservative websites and go to bingo since they are deemed more dangerous. But Obama defenders will just make more excuses for even this idiocy.

DenverBrit
06-13-2013, 10:01 AM
Right, only Obama spied on US citizens. Naive child.

mhgaffney
06-13-2013, 11:43 AM
You guys miss the point. Read the latest piece by Paul Craig Roberts. He has it right.

Since 9/11 there have been what...two cases of domestic terrorism?

The absence of terrorism is the real story.

The expansion of FEMA, NSA surveillance and Homeland Security has much more to do with our expanding police state. Those willing to surrender liberty for security deserve what they get.

MHG

mhgaffney
06-13-2013, 11:54 AM
Ron Paul Warns US Government May Assassinate NSA Leaker Snowden

By Jonathan Easley

June 13, 2013 "Information Clearing House -- Former Rep. Ron Paul (R-Texas) said Tuesday he’s worried the U.S. government will assassinate Edward Snowden, the 29-year-old man who admitted to leaking information about two top-secret National Security Administration surveillance programs to the press.

“I’m worried about somebody in our government might kill him with a cruise missile or a drone missile,” Paul said on the Fox Business Network. “I mean, we live in a bad time where American citizens don’t even have rights, and that they can be killed, but the gentlemen is trying to tell the truth about what’s going on.”

The Justice Department is investigating Snowden’s admission. Snowden fled to Hong Kong before the revelations went public.

“[Snowden’s] not defecting, there are no signs of that happening,” Ron Paul continued Tuesday. “It’s a shame that we are in an age where people who tell the truth about what the government is doing gets into trouble.”

Paul’s son, Kentucky senator Rand Paul (R), led a high-profile filibuster last month against the Obama administration’s drone policies. Paul and others said American citizens should not be targeted by drones, even if they are believed to be engaged in terrorist activities overseas.

This article was originally published at The Hill

TonyR
06-13-2013, 12:17 PM
NSA Head Says Spy Programs Thwarted Terror Attacks

Read more: http://swampland.time.com/2013/06/12/nsa-director-programs-disrupted-dozens-of-attacks/#ixzz2W7agxZHK

Army Gen. Keith Alexander, in his first congressional testimony since disclosure of the secretive programs, offered few details on Wednesday about the disrupted terror plots but asserted that the two government programs — they have collected millions of telephone records and kept tabs on Internet activity — were imperative in the terror fight.

The director of national intelligence has declassified some details on two thwarted attacks — Najibullah Zazi’s foiled plot to bomb the New York subways and the case of David Coleman Headley, a Pakistani-American who used his U.S. passport to travel frequently to India, where he allegedly scouted out venues for terror attacks on behalf of the Lashkar-e-Taiba terrorist organization.

Alexander said he is pressing for the intelligence community to provide details on the other plots.

“I do think it’s important that we get this right and I want the American people to know that we’re trying to be transparent here, protect civil liberties and privacy but also the security of this country,” Alexander told a Senate panel.

He described the steps the government takes once it suspects a terrorist organization is about to act — all within the laws approved by Congress and under stringent oversight from the courts. He said the programs led to “disrupting or contributing to the disruption of terrorist attacks,” without offering specifics.

Rohirrim
06-13-2013, 12:51 PM
This, if true, should be disturbing:



http://news.investors.com/ibd-editorials/061213-659753-all-intrusive-obama-terror-dragnet-excludes-mosques.htm

Ha! That makes perfect sense.

mhgaffney
06-13-2013, 05:32 PM
Stuxnet was only the beginnning.

Bamford's article stood the hair up on the back of my neck. It shows just how far things have gotten out of hand. MHG

US prepares to wage cyberwar

by James Bamford

06.12.13

http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/2013/06/general-keith-alexander-cyberwar/all/