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gunns
03-06-2013, 11:26 AM
I just said this yesterday. One of the stupidest, over paid contracts ever. Get it done!


Broncos | Want Elvis Dumervil to restructure deal
Wed, 06 Mar 2013 10:47:23 -0800

The Denver Broncos would like DE Elvis Dumervil to restructure his contract because they do not want to pay him $12 million next season. The team could decide to release Dumervil if he does not agree to restructure his deal.

Source: CBSSportsline Jason LaCanfora

chickennob2
03-06-2013, 11:27 AM
To be fair, they specifically set up his contract to overpay him this year. I think his deal sees him getting 12 mil this year, and then 8 and 6 in the next two. If we can make it through this year, he gets wayyyy cheaper in the very near future.

I just said this yesterday. One of the stupidest, over paid contracts ever. Get it done!


Broncos | Want Elvis Dumervil to restructure deal
Wed, 06 Mar 2013 10:47:23 -0800

The Denver Broncos would like DE Elvis Dumervil to restructure his contract because they do not want to pay him $12 million next season. The team could decide to release Dumervil if he does not agree to restructure his deal.

Source: CBSSportsline Jason LaCanfora

Traveler
03-06-2013, 11:31 AM
First Bronco player news in weeks and LaCanfora sugeests he could get cut if he declines. Can't remember if DDumervil's contract was pre-Elway or not.

SonOfLe-loLang
03-06-2013, 11:32 AM
First Bronco player news in weeks and LaCanfora sugeests he could get cut if he declines. Can't remember if DDumervil's contract was pre-Elway or not.

Def pre elway

crush17
03-06-2013, 11:34 AM
It was the year he tore his pec.
McDaniel's 2nd season.

mopatt24
03-06-2013, 11:35 AM
No surprise here. Got the feeling he may actually restructure. If he doesn't though, he can be replaced and we could get something nice in return for him. That Revis ( rumor ) could grow some legs

Requiem
03-06-2013, 11:43 AM
A million per sack? No thanks. Restructure pls.

crush17
03-06-2013, 11:43 AM
Oh and "in your face" to everyone who called me stupid for bringing up this topic a few weeks ago.

;)

http://www.orangemane.com/BB/showthread.php?t=110082

ND Bronco Fan
03-06-2013, 11:45 AM
Does a restructure make it easier to move him in the event of a trade? No smartass aholes either, I dont know the answer.........

TheReverend
03-06-2013, 11:54 AM
I just said this yesterday. One of the stupidest, over paid contracts ever. Get it done!

http://menversus.com/images/bertstare.jpg

NFLBRONCO
03-06-2013, 11:55 AM
He'll restructure no problem. Esp with Manning lets get our team finished as possible and shoot for 2-3 legit sb run. As I said, before this is the biggest offseason for FO.

gunns
03-06-2013, 11:57 AM
Oh and "in your face" to everyone who called me stupid for bringing up this topic a few weeks ago.

;)

http://www.orangemane.com/BB/showthread.php?t=110082

Sorry crush, never saw that. I don't know where I've been because I had no idea his contract was that much. I was looking at a site the other day that detailed the salary cap hits for each player on each team and it showed Doom's hit this year is 16 mil. So I'm wondering which it is 12 or 16. Either way it's got to go.

LetsGoBroncos
03-06-2013, 12:00 PM
I just said this yesterday. One of the stupidest, over paid contracts ever. Get it done!


Broncos | Want Elvis Dumervil to restructure deal
Wed, 06 Mar 2013 10:47:23 -0800

The Denver Broncos would like DE Elvis Dumervil to restructure his contract because they do not want to pay him $12 million next season. The team could decide to release Dumervil if he does not agree to restructure his deal.

Source: CBSSportsline Jason LaCanfora

Wait, so you mean what I said last week and people jumped on me for is echoed by the Broncos front office? Weird

Requiem
03-06-2013, 12:03 PM
We have prophets on this forum. You guys should play the lotto.

LetsGoBroncos
03-06-2013, 12:03 PM
Oh and "in your face" to everyone who called me stupid for bringing up this topic a few weeks ago.

;)

http://www.orangemane.com/BB/showthread.php?t=110082

Same here.

http://www.orangemane.com/BB/showthread.php?t=110276

DBroncos4life
03-06-2013, 12:12 PM
A guy with high contract and everyone thinks they are magical for thinking they will be asked to restructure!!

gunns
03-06-2013, 12:13 PM
http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap1000000147387/article/denver-broncos-want-elvis-dumervil-to-take-pay-cut

RunSilentRunDeep
03-06-2013, 12:15 PM
Dumervil should be begging to get cut. He could go from $30.2M non-guaranteed over three years to a nice chunk of upfront money in the FA market.

crush17
03-06-2013, 12:21 PM
A guy with high contract and everyone thinks they are magical for thinking they will be asked to restructure!!

Dude I was just messing around hence the winking emoticon -----> ;)

MagicHef
03-06-2013, 12:21 PM
Fun fact:

Hali will be paid more next season, as well as over the course of his remaining contract, than Dumervil.

BroncoBeavis
03-06-2013, 12:21 PM
Only thing they might accomplish is spreading out some guaranteed cash over the next 3 years in exchange for a lower cap hit this year.

But you can't cut the guy.

BroncoInferno
03-06-2013, 12:23 PM
To be fair, they specifically set up his contract to overpay him this year. I think his deal sees him getting 12 mil this year, and then 8 and 6 in the next two. If we can make it through this year, he gets wayyyy cheaper in the very near future.

I thought Doom signed a 4 year deal following the 2009 season? If so, this would be the final year of the deal. I could be wrong, though.

EDIT: I was wrong, it was a 6 year deal.

ColoradoDarin
03-06-2013, 12:23 PM
Doom will be paid at least what he's due on his current contract. Restructure = paid right now and spread the cap hit out. If they really wanted to pay him less it goes like this: cut -> re-sign at a lower amount.

DivineLegion
03-06-2013, 12:27 PM
LaConduche thinks every player who is asked to restructure will be released. Two weeks ago he was speculating Champ was going to be released.

This is his template for reporting:


Player (x) was asked to restructure his contract, if team (x) and player (x) fail to reach an agreement, player (x) could be released.

-Cross eyed douche (ex-Redskin speculation analyst) CBS Sports

NFLBRONCO
03-06-2013, 01:02 PM
New info: NFL sources tell the Broncos WILL explore a deal with Dwight Freeney if they can't work things out with Elvis.

Bigdawg26
03-06-2013, 01:03 PM
Dumervil should be begging to get cut. He could go from $30.2M non-guaranteed over three years to a nice chunk of upfront money in the FA market.

I know right! Taking a "pay cut" is not that bad when all you are doing is getting your money up front instead of on the bad end when you might not get it. I would take one too and get more money up front for the team's "best interest."

NickStixx
03-06-2013, 01:21 PM
Doom will be paid at least what he's due on his current contract. Restructure = paid right now and spread the cap hit out. If they really wanted to pay him less it goes like this: cut -> re-sign at a lower amount.

This is what I initially thought as well. But now the report is that they want to get a straight up pay cut, or else he could be cut.... This could get messy.

Drunken.Broncoholic
03-06-2013, 01:24 PM
Freeney in place of dumervil is downgrading a position of huge importance on this team IMO.

BroncoBeavis
03-06-2013, 01:25 PM
New info: NFL sources tell the Broncos WILL explore a deal with Dwight Freeney if they can't work things out with Elvis.

This would be great. Straight from whining about a guy making a million dollars a sack to bringing in one who made a million dollars a tackle.

Heyneck
03-06-2013, 01:43 PM
Freeney in place of dumervil is downgrading a position of huge importance on this team IMO.

Yup, he is an older broken down Doom and really sucks bad at playing the run.

Agamemnon
03-06-2013, 01:43 PM
If they cut him and don't proceed to use that money to sign some big time free agents I am going to be irate. I get that he's a bit overpaid, but elite pass rushers don't grow on trees.

orange crusher
03-06-2013, 01:45 PM
It would be really stupid to cut him.

SlyEli
03-06-2013, 01:47 PM
New info: NFL sources tell the Broncos WILL explore a deal with Dwight Freeney if they can't work things out with Elvis.

what sources?

Rascal
03-06-2013, 01:53 PM
freaking tight ass owner, not liking this....

bronco militia
03-06-2013, 01:53 PM
New info: NFL sources tell the Broncos WILL explore a deal with Dwight Freeney if they can't work things out with Elvis.

where did you get this info?

Rascal
03-06-2013, 01:54 PM
A league source tells the Denver Post the Broncos will pursue free agent Dwight Freeney if they can't get RE Elvis Dumervil to take a pay-cut.
Per beat writer Mike Klis, the Broncos believe they'd be better off paying Freeney $5 million instead of Dumervil's currently scheduled $12 million. Dumervil is the more productive player at this stage of their careers, but is grossly overpaid. A return to a 4-3 defense could also help Freeney rebound from a rough 2012. This won't be the last we hear of Freeney potentially reuniting with Peyton Manning.

http://www.rotoworld.com/headlines/nfl/256983/report-broncos-considering-run-at-freeney

Heyneck
03-06-2013, 01:55 PM
what sources?

Who other than Klis. He also said a few days ago we are expected to tender Lance Ball. Plus it all comes from a source that told him. Lol.

Klis is like a monkey throwing **** at the wall and expecting some of it to stick.

NFLBRONCO
03-06-2013, 01:55 PM
where did you get this info?

light rail

bronco militia
03-06-2013, 01:58 PM
Dwight Freeney would be on Broncos radar if they canít work out new deal with Elvis Dumervil

By Mike Klis The Denver Post


If the Broncos canít work a pay reduction with Elvis Dumervil, a league source said the team would be interested in pursuing former Indianapolis Colt pass rusher and Peyton Manning teammate Dwight Freeney.

The Colts have already announced they would allow Freeney to enter free agency when the market opens Tuesday.

Freeney at 33 is no longer considered the pass rusher that Dumervil is at 29. Freeney had 5 and 8.5 sacks the past two seasons; Dumervil had 11 and 9.5. But the thinking would be the Broncos might be better off getting Freeney at, say, $5 million than Dumervil at $12 million, and using the $7 million difference on players that could fill needs elsewhere on the roster.

For now, the Broncosí first wish is for Dumervil to return on a reduced salary. But with the franchise tag for defensive ends at $11.175 million ó or $825,000 less than what Dumervil is scheduled to make in 2013 ó he doesnít figure to be receptive to a substantial cut.

NFLBRONCO
03-06-2013, 01:59 PM
Klis and Legwold are paper John Claytons

yerner
03-06-2013, 02:00 PM
this is starting to worry me. just outright dumping doom is crazytalk.

pricejj
03-06-2013, 02:11 PM
McDaniels is a freaking idiot. He signs Dumervil to a 6 year $60M deal in 2010 and only pays him $1M in the first year. Piling basically $15M per year on the next several years.

If McDaniels would have paid Elvis the going rate in 2010, we wouldn't have this problem today. What an utter moron.

At least it will be resolved by March 17th. Dumervil's salary becomes fully guaranteed on that date.

BroncoInferno
03-06-2013, 02:16 PM
I wonder who the Broncos are trying to sign that they need Dumervil to take a pay cut? Does it have to do with Revis?

At least it will be resolved by March 17th. Dumervil's salary becomes fully guaranteed on that date.

Champ is set to make $10.5M...I wonder if that is their target figure? That would indicate a pay cut of $3M. Cutting Elvis would not be smart. Dead money is $4.5M. They would sign Freeney and only save $3M. Not a good move.

The article posted earlier suggests it doesn't have anything to do with cap space. They just don't want to pay him $12 million this season. Probably goes back to the "operating budget" Elway has referred to in the past.

SpringStein
03-06-2013, 02:17 PM
light rail

Love it! You're the best, Paul!!

Rascal
03-06-2013, 02:22 PM
Like I said, a cheap ass owner. He gets another golden ticket and he is going to **** it up. unbelievable.

DBroncos4life
03-06-2013, 02:27 PM
Like I said, a cheap ass owner. He gets another golden ticket and he is going to **** it up. unbelievable.

The fact that they would be replacing the amount they save with another player makes what you are saying pretty silly.

Drunken.Broncoholic
03-06-2013, 02:27 PM
I don't see where releasing him benefits this team in any way if freeney is the replacement. He didnt struggle cause of a 3-4, he struggled cause his best days are long gone. Will be interesting to see what cliff Avril brings to the table. His contract will be more or less than doom? He's the best there is IMO.

Rascal
03-06-2013, 02:29 PM
The fact that they would be replacing the amount they save with another player makes what you are saying pretty silly.

You sure about that (i.e. they will spend the $12mil that would have gone to Doom)???

pricejj
03-06-2013, 02:31 PM
Like I said, a cheap ass owner. He gets another golden ticket and he is going to **** it up. unbelievable.

It's not that. It's McDaniels and Xanders. Elvis signed a 6 year $60M contract, which only had a cap hit of $1M the year McDaniels was fired.

This is the last vestige of McDaniels efforts to bury the Broncos. Except now we need another RB (to replace Knowshon), another DT (to replace Ayers), and another CB (to replace Alphonso Smith).

Rascal
03-06-2013, 02:33 PM
I don't see where releasing him benefits this team in any way if freeney is the replacement. He didnt struggle cause of a 3-4, he struggled cause his best days are long gone. Will be interesting to see what cliff Avril brings to the table. His contract will be more or less than doom? He's the best there is IMO.

Yeah, we are not getting Avril. He turned down a $10mil/season deal last year and has previously stated he wants mario williams money.

DBroncos4life
03-06-2013, 02:40 PM
You sure about that (i.e. they will spend the $12mil that would have gone to Doom)???

I don't think for one second they are making the move just to save money. They are doing it either to sign big time guys i.e, Revis and Freeney. No way can they sign those guys or other guys to go with Freeney for less then what they save with Doom.

ludo21
03-06-2013, 02:41 PM
dont mind if he restructures and gets some guaranteed money. but not just to outright release a GREAT pass rusher for old man river Freeney. yuck

Freeney would be an 'ok' stop gap if we can get revis i guess

eddie mac
03-06-2013, 02:42 PM
Doom will be paid at least what he's due on his current contract. Restructure = paid right now and spread the cap hit out. If they really wanted to pay him less it goes like this: cut -> re-sign at a lower amount.

It wont mean that in this case. They're asking for a paycut.

Br0nc0Buster
03-06-2013, 02:46 PM
I highly doubt the FO is entertaining the idea of outright releasing Doom

I do think this adds legitimacy of the Revis rumors though

Freeney talk is just posturing
Freeney is pretty much done, he cant replace Doom in really any capacity

pricejj
03-06-2013, 02:58 PM
Vic Lombardi broke the story 5 hours ago.

Vic Lombardi ‏@VicLombardi
Elvis due to make $12m in '13, $10m in '14 and $9m in '15. Hence, they want him to restructure

Vic Lombardi ‏@VicLombardi
With Elvis due 31mill over the next three years, I can see Broncos asking him to restructure to similar money over 4-5 years. Pretty common

Vic Lombardi ‏@VicLombardi
And I can see Elvis being perfectly agreeable to that. He knew this was coming.

Vic Lombardi ‏@VicLombardi
And I'm told Elvis IS open to restructuring.

BroncoBeavis
03-06-2013, 03:04 PM
I don't think for one second they are making the move just to save money. They are doing it either to sign big time guys i.e, Revis and Freeney. No way can they sign those guys or other guys to go with Freeney for less then what they save with Doom.

God I hope they don't consider Freeney 'big time'

We're all bitching about 11 sacks last year and DF's only managed more than 11 (13.5) once in the last 7 years.

And that was 4 years ago. Ick.

Drunken.Broncoholic
03-06-2013, 03:17 PM
Vic Lombardi broke the story 5 hours ago.

Vic Lombardi ‏@VicLombardi
Elvis due to make $12m in '13, $10m in '14 and $9m in '15. Hence, they want him to restructure

Vic Lombardi ‏@VicLombardi
With Elvis due 31mill over the next three years, I can see Broncos asking him to restructure to similar money over 4-5 years. Pretty common

Vic Lombardi ‏@VicLombardi
And I can see Elvis being perfectly agreeable to that. He knew this was coming.

Vic Lombardi ‏@VicLombardi
And I'm told Elvis IS open to restructuring.

This is encouraging

extralife
03-06-2013, 03:31 PM
The team has ZERO leverage. If they cut him he'd make MORE on the open market, not less.

Bigdawg26
03-06-2013, 04:05 PM
Vic Lombardi broke the story 5 hours ago.

Vic Lombardi ‏@VicLombardi
Elvis due to make $12m in '13, $10m in '14 and $9m in '15. Hence, they want him to restructure

Vic Lombardi ‏@VicLombardi
With Elvis due 31mill over the next three years, I can see Broncos asking him to restructure to similar money over 4-5 years. Pretty common

Vic Lombardi ‏@VicLombardi
And I can see Elvis being perfectly agreeable to that. He knew this was coming.

Vic Lombardi ‏@VicLombardi
And I'm told Elvis IS open to restructuring.

Case is pretty much close. I wouldn't mind getting my money as a signing bonus instead of waiting til the season. I would be open to that too!

Rascal
03-06-2013, 04:06 PM
Hope it works out where we can keep him. I'd rather have him than Freeney.

Smilin Assassin
03-06-2013, 04:30 PM
Ian Rappaport says word is Elvis isn't open to the idea, and this could be a fight between The Broncos & Dumervil.

I can't see this front office letting someone like Elvis go. Just can't see it.

TonyR
03-06-2013, 04:34 PM
Denver is indeed looking for Elvis Dumervil to take a paycut. It's not his cap number ($13.6M) but his salary ($12M) that's the problem. So with Dumervil and Denver, this likely wouldn't be a restructure. He's simply making too much money relative to his production now. Remember, Denver's cap has been managed well. They'll have room to take care of guys like Decker, Thomas and Miller in coming yearshttps://twitter.com/AlbertBreer/status/309371182120046593

Broncos like pass rusher Elvis Dumervil, but not at $12M/year. They are seeking a lower deal, and situation could end up with his release. Broncos paying Manning $20M/year, Bailey is around $10M, and Von Miller will be getting paid huge soon enough.https://twitter.com/JasonLaCanfora/status/309365622800801792

Good rundown of the whole thing here: http://www.itsalloverfatman.com/broncos/entry/broncos-may-cut-elvis-dumervil-or-his-pay

gunns
03-06-2013, 04:37 PM
Freeney in place of dumervil is downgrading a position of huge importance on this team IMO.

I'd draft Werner....if he's there.

gunns
03-06-2013, 04:40 PM
The team has ZERO leverage. If they cut him he'd make MORE on the open market, not less.

Well if it's totally about the money for him and not the Lombardi, buh bye. He'd still get his money, just over a longer period.

SonOfLe-loLang
03-06-2013, 04:45 PM
Well if it's totally about the money for him and not the Lombardi, buh bye. He'd still get his money, just over a longer period.

just a question:

How would you like it if your employer asked you to take a paycut to be a team player? A paycut of, i assume, 10% of your salary...regardless of how much you make.

Agamemnon
03-06-2013, 04:46 PM
A league source tells the Denver Post the Broncos will pursue free agent Dwight Freeney if they can't get RE Elvis Dumervil to take a pay-cut.
Per beat writer Mike Klis, the Broncos believe they'd be better off paying Freeney $5 million instead of Dumervil's currently scheduled $12 million. Dumervil is the more productive player at this stage of their careers, but is grossly overpaid. A return to a 4-3 defense could also help Freeney rebound from a rough 2012. This won't be the last we hear of Freeney potentially reuniting with Peyton Manning.

http://www.rotoworld.com/headlines/nfl/256983/report-broncos-considering-run-at-freeney

I really hope our FO isn't that stupid.

SonOfLe-loLang
03-06-2013, 04:51 PM
I really hope our FO isn't that stupid.

If you could turn Doom into Freeney and 2 other pieces it might not be the dumbest thing in the world.

that said, i hope they restructure and free up some cash.

gunns
03-06-2013, 04:58 PM
just a question:

How would you like it if your employer asked you to take a paycut to be a team player? A paycut of, i assume, 10% of your salary...regardless of how much you make.

They aren't asking him to take a pay cut per se, he'll still get his money and he's making enough, even with less over a longer period, that I doubt it would effect him to the extent it would effect me. And with the sequester it may happen to me, losing 2 days a pay period. I'm just glad to have a job.

SouthStndJunkie
03-06-2013, 05:00 PM
I'd draft Werner....if he's there.

Bjoern Werner will be gone in first 5 or 10 picks.

I'll eat a can of moist cat food if Bjoern Werner lasts until the 28th pick.

Cito Pelon
03-06-2013, 05:00 PM
They should ask Peymeaton one-and-done-meister to take a cut also.

Bacchus
03-06-2013, 05:01 PM
So does this mean the Broncos will increase all the player's play who overperformed their contracts, like Woodyard, Harris, Carter, and Decker? I guess they are all getting big raises right?

If i was Doom I'd tell them to suck it and cut me. He is going to make more in FA plus he'll get another signing bonus.

winstoncup bronco
03-06-2013, 05:08 PM
So does this mean the Broncos will increase all the player's play who overperformed their contracts, like Woodyard, Harris, Carter, and Decker? I guess they are all getting big raises right?

If i was Doom I'd tell them to suck it and cut me. He is going to make more in FA plus he'll get another signing bonus.

I find it hard to believe he gets cut outright. Some team will make a lowball offer to kick off negotiations, so they can get him at his current salary before his value goes up as an UFA.

SonOfLe-loLang
03-06-2013, 05:11 PM
They aren't asking him to take a pay cut per se, he'll still get his money and he's making enough, even with less over a longer period, that I doubt it would effect him to the extent it would effect me. And with the sequester it may happen to me, losing 2 days a pay period. I'm just glad to have a job.

it appears its not the cap figure that's bothering them, but the salary...so they'd be asking him to take a pay cut if thats true. And thats not an apples to apples comparison. A lot of people are taking a hit with the sequester. if all broncos got their salaries docked because of something, i'm sure it'd be a diff story.

Abqbronco
03-06-2013, 05:13 PM
just a question:

How would you like it if your employer asked you to take a paycut to be a team player? A paycut of, i assume, 10% of your salary...regardless of how much you make.

You're right! It's exactly the same.

Also, this happens all the time. Work four days a week to keep everyone employed. People don't like it but they often do it for the "team."

SonOfLe-loLang
03-06-2013, 05:16 PM
You're right! It's exactly the same.

Also, this happens all the time. Work four days a week to keep everyone employed. People don't like it but they often do it for the "team."

But if you were asked to take the paycut, full well knowing you might be able to get a better deal elsewhere, would you?

misturanderson
03-06-2013, 05:21 PM
They aren't asking him to take a pay cut per se, he'll still get his money and he's making enough, even with less over a longer period, that I doubt it would effect him to the extent it would effect me.

Yes they are, the thing you wrote immediately after that is the definition of a pay cut.

They are asking him to get paid less for the next 3 years then get the rest of his money over 2 additional years instead of making that money over 3 years and then getting paid additional money for the following years, even if it's for league minimum. That doesn't even get into losses associated with not having that money invested for the extra 2-3 years or the fact that the last 2 years won't be guaranteed.

gunns
03-06-2013, 05:23 PM
Bjoern Werner will be gone in first 5 or 10 picks.

I'll eat a can of moist cat food if Bjoern Werner lasts until the 28th pick.

I know, I know. But I have all kinds of dreams and hopes, just like 83 when we had the 4th pick and I kept hoping the first 3 wouldn't take Elway.

Abqbronco
03-06-2013, 05:23 PM
But if you were asked to take the paycut, full well knowing you might be able to get a better deal elsewhere, would you?

Ah... The rules of the game have changed.

If I "knew full well", then probably not.

If I "knew full well I MIGHT", then I would have to consider it. Being on a 13-3 team, with a solid team, etc. Might sway me.

"if I knew full well i might be able to get a better deal", I would just be confused and unable to make up my mind.

gunns
03-06-2013, 05:30 PM
Yes they are, the thing you wrote immediately after that is the definition of a pay cut.

They are asking him to get paid less for the next 3 years then get the rest of his money over 2 additional years instead of making that money over 3 years and then getting paid additional money for the following years, even if it's for league minimum. That doesn't even get into losses associated with not having that money invested for the extra 2-3 years or the fact that the last 2 years won't be guaranteed.

I'm not going to check that out (the last sentence) because frankly I'm lazy right now and don't care. I can say I won't cry for him if it happens. I guess it's a matter of what you want more. And if he doesn't I have faith that the Broncos want that Lombardi enough to fill that position with something good. Hell the only player I wouldn't feel this way about is Von. Anybody else, take one for the team. I think Freeney is an assumption by the media.

SonOfLe-loLang
03-06-2013, 05:42 PM
Ah... The rules of the game have changed.

If I "knew full well", then probably not.

If I "knew full well I MIGHT", then I would have to consider it. Being on a 13-3 team, with a solid team, etc. Might sway me.

"if I knew full well i might be able to get a better deal", I would just be confused and unable to make up my mind.

Im not changing the rules, you know how football works. If you want to compare it to real life, and your boss asked you to take a paycut and you had opportunities elsewhere, you may well tell him to get ****ed.

I dont know how much they'd ask him for, but if youre trying to set up the rest of your life, your kids lives, and so forth, you might want to make as much as possible in your brief career.

SportinOne
03-06-2013, 05:44 PM
There's absolutely no way Dumervil is cut or traded. The front office knows how valuable he is. You people are crazy, I'll say it again. If you really think that sacks are a good measure of how well he played this year, you're not watching the game the right way.

With that said, being financially smart is one thing but I would be very surprised if Bowlen is sparing any expense to get all the players that we need this offseason.. or at least those that are open to coming here, which is probably a very long list.

We are in win-now, Pat. Spend that money.

SimonFletcher73
03-06-2013, 05:44 PM
I wouldn't blame Elvis for refusing. He sucked it up and played 4 years making 4th round pick money and played at a high level. I don't remember him holding out. Better make that money while he still can (here or elsewhere). Hope this doesn't turn into a Trevor Pryce situation.

Drunken.Broncoholic
03-06-2013, 05:51 PM
Is all this Xander's fault?

Abqbronco
03-06-2013, 05:56 PM
Im not changing the rules, you know how football works. If you want to compare it to real life, and your boss asked you to take a paycut and you had opportunities elsewhere, you may well tell him to get ****ed.

I dont know how much they'd ask him for, but if youre trying to set up the rest of your life, your kids lives, and so forth, you might want to make as much as possible in your brief career.

Sure you did, but that's ok.

I do know how football works. Fact is that Doom had a really good season. It wasn't great though and he has a similar skill set to Von, who is much better and younger. I hope the Broncos and Doom work it out but it doesn't look good.

Another fact about football (and other pro sports): It doesn't matter how much many of these guys make, they typically don't set up anything for the rest of their lives. They frequently end up in debt and owing a bunch of money to the IRS. So to use your analogy of comparing it to real life-you can't. It simply isn't the same thing which goes back to your original point of an employer asking the employees to take a 10% pay cut and how we would all feel about it. It isn't the same thing and doesn't have any merit when discussing a DE approaching 30 years old and their club suggesting he take a pay cut.

Atwater His Ass
03-06-2013, 05:58 PM
It's business, don't see why Doom would take a flat out pay cut. I wouldn't.

Any player is only 1 play away from losing it all, and you only get one shot to make your money over a very short career, so maximize it the best you can. If Doom doesn't think he can get a comparable deal elsewhere is the only reason he should stay. And if he does think he can get a new deal elsewhere, he gets another signing bonus.

Broncojef
03-06-2013, 06:11 PM
Dumerville is a good player, he's not worth $12 million or a tenth of this team's salary cap next year. If he wants to come back for less great otherwise cut bait and fill holes with the cap we save. Bottom line is we can make this team very good in areas now in need of help through this move. Get on or off the bus Mr. Dumerville, we have a Championship to win.

gunns
03-06-2013, 06:15 PM
There's absolutely no way Dumervil is cut or traded. The front office knows how valuable he is. You people are crazy, I'll say it again. If you really think that sacks are a good measure of how well he played this year, you're not watching the game the right way.

With that said, being financially smart is one thing but I would be very surprised if Bowlen is sparing any expense to get all the players that we need this offseason.. or at least those that are open to coming here, which is probably a very long list.

We are in win-now, Pat. Spend that money.

I don't want Doom traded, I just want what you said afterward, whatever is going to get it done.

barryr
03-06-2013, 06:32 PM
Dumervil has his moments, but also his moments far too often where he does nothing to be considered anything close to an elite player. He needs to take a pay cut. If Miller wasn't around, one could guess how more often Dumervil would disappear.

Rascal
03-06-2013, 06:33 PM
just a question:

How would you like it if your employer asked you to take a paycut to be a team player? A paycut of, i assume, 10% of your salary...regardless of how much you make.

Well, the feds just took 20% of mine. I'm thrilled to help out the rich and the poor simultaneously. Not to mention those Egyptians!!!

txtebow
03-06-2013, 06:42 PM
How much would John Abraham cost?

DBroncos4life
03-06-2013, 06:49 PM
The Broncos want to win the SB. Sometimes to do that you have to ask high priced players to rework their contract for the good of the team. I'm not sure why fans are SHOCKED or even ANGRY about this. It happens every year and every off season posters get all butt hurt about this issue like "how dare they try and take that mans money".

SoCalBronco
03-06-2013, 07:17 PM
The Broncos want to win the SB. Sometimes to do that you have to ask high priced players to rework their contract for the good of the team. I'm not sure why fans are SHOCKED or even ANGRY about this. It happens every year and every off season posters get all butt hurt about this issue like "how dare they try and take that mans money".

It has nothing to do with a SB run. Denver us already about 10m under. I'm certain they will get rid of DJ so they'll be at about 16 under. And they want Doom to take a haircut too? Its not about a run. They've got plenty of space to make moves. Plenty. Its about the same BS every year.

SonOfLe-loLang
03-06-2013, 07:21 PM
Sure you did, but that's ok.

I do know how football works. Fact is that Doom had a really good season. It wasn't great though and he has a similar skill set to Von, who is much better and younger. I hope the Broncos and Doom work it out but it doesn't look good.

Another fact about football (and other pro sports): It doesn't matter how much many of these guys make, they typically don't set up anything for the rest of their lives. They frequently end up in debt and owing a bunch of money to the IRS. So to use your analogy of comparing it to real life-you can't. It simply isn't the same thing which goes back to your original point of an employer asking the employees to take a 10% pay cut and how we would all feel about it. It isn't the same thing and doesn't have any merit when discussing a DE approaching 30 years old and their club suggesting he take a pay cut.

Uh, I didn't, but that's OK. And regardless of what other players in his profession do, you don't know how he lives his life. The Broncos signed him to a contract, and if they don't want to honor that contract and he thinks he can get something similar on the open market, then he's not a dick for telling them to get ****ed.

At the end of the day, a contract is a contract. If he's expecting that income and suddenly is asked to give some of it up, it doesn't mean he's not a "team player" for agreeing. It might be more commonplace in the NFL for this sort of thing to happen, but he doesnt have to agree if he feels he can get his money elsewhere (whether its true or not)

DENVERDUI55
03-06-2013, 08:35 PM
It has nothing to do with a SB run. Denver us already about 10m under. I'm certain they will get rid of DJ so they'll be at about 16 under. And they want Doom to take a haircut too? Its not about a run. They've got plenty of space to make moves. Plenty. Its about the same BS every year.

Minus Clady s money and signing a few others to keep around. Denver's cap room isnt as large as it seems.

BroncoBeavis
03-06-2013, 08:55 PM
Yes they are, the thing you wrote immediately after that is the definition of a pay cut.

They are asking him to get paid less for the next 3 years then get the rest of his money over 2 additional years instead of making that money over 3 years and then getting paid additional money for the following years, even if it's for league minimum. That doesn't even get into losses associated with not having that money invested for the extra 2-3 years or the fact that the last 2 years won't be guaranteed.

Except that he could have a career ending injury this year and not see another dime. Guarantees add some value. You could ask him to take a moderate cut this year for some guaranteed money over the next two. Tough balance though. You can't lowball those later years because he has to feel like it competes with what he could get elsewhere if you were otherwise forced to cut him. They can't cut his pay in half or anything, but they may be able to shave 2-3 million off his cap hit this year.

BroncoBeavis
03-06-2013, 08:59 PM
The Broncos want to win the SB. Sometimes to do that you have to ask high priced players to rework their contract for the good of the team. I'm not sure why fans are SHOCKED or even ANGRY about this. It happens every year and every off season posters get all butt hurt about this issue like "how dare they try and take that mans money".

I only get mad when I hear names like Freeney thrown out there. That grass is definitely not greener.

Bigdawg26
03-06-2013, 09:06 PM
Is all this Xander's fault?

No because Bowlen is a gutless drunk! lol

eddie mac
03-06-2013, 09:23 PM
So does this mean the Broncos will increase all the player's play who overperformed their contracts, like Woodyard, Harris, Carter, and Decker? I guess they are all getting big raises right?

If i was Doom I'd tell them to suck it and cut me. He is going to make more in FA plus he'll get another signing bonus.

The NFL takes care of the that to an extent. Woodyard's base was increased by $1m for 2013 and Decker's by $700k due to performance in 2012.

eddie mac
03-06-2013, 09:40 PM
It's not about cap with the Broncos anymore it's about cash spent in any given league year.

They dont want to push money back in his deal by turning base salary into signing bonus. They want to pay him less this year at least and use that money to strengthen the team in other areas.

Broncos have some $115m being paid to players this season. We rarely go over $130m-$135m cash in the one year.

4 Bronco players took paycuts last year and I doubt Dumervil will be the last to be asked either. I see Kuper and Mays on that list if they even decide to keep both.

So in essense they'll be targetting $26m worth of base salaries for Doom, DJ, Mays and Kuper and attempting to drastically reduce that number I'd say by at least 50%.

ZONA
03-07-2013, 12:43 AM
Oh and "in your face" to everyone who called me stupid for bringing up this topic a few weeks ago.

;)

http://www.orangemane.com/BB/showthread.php?t=110082

I said near the end of the regular season he was having a good year but not a great year and just about everybody here tore me a new one. I still like his game, but he's a sack specialist. He's not an all around dominant DE but he's paid like one, well this coming year anyhow. I agree with Broncos, he's playing well but not worth 12 million. Get that number in single digits or trade him if you can. I think Ayers (who's coming into his 5th year) really showed some improvement last year and I think he could be ready. Hunter also looked really solid last year before injury.

And since we're on the DL subject, who here likes Malik Jackson? He's listed as DL and I think I've seen him in preseason line up as both DT and DE. Honestly, he's got the prototype DE body at 6'5 275. Got long arms. I like what he showed in preseason. Obviously needs to groom his rushing but I thought he played the run well and showed some ability. I just don't see us trying to turn him into a DT. To me he is more of a DE. Look forward to him having a much bigger impact this year for us now going into this 2nd year.

broncosteven
03-07-2013, 10:59 AM
I would rather see Kruger brought in than Freeney if they did decide to cut Doom.

DBroncos4life
03-07-2013, 11:03 AM
Robert Kraft frees up money and is a hero.
Pat Bowlen frees up money and is called a broke drunk.

A six you say Jay????

TonyR
03-07-2013, 11:13 AM
I would rather see Kruger brought in than Freeney if they did decide to cut Doom.

I don't think anyone would disagree, but Kruger will get big $$$.

TonyR
03-07-2013, 11:15 AM
Its about the same BS every year.

For you and the rest of the Cutler fanboys:

http://deadspin.com/5988885/what-gift-should-you-buy-from-jay-cutler-and-kristin-cavallaris-wedding-registry

Hercules Rockefeller
03-07-2013, 11:42 AM
For you and the rest of the Cutler fanboys:

http://deadspin.com/5988885/what-gift-should-you-buy-from-jay-cutler-and-kristin-cavallaris-wedding-registry

Sweet, SoCal can send them a gift now

bronco militia
03-07-2013, 11:59 AM
Robert Kraft frees up money and is a hero.
Pat Bowlen frees up money and is called a broke drunk.

A six you say Jay????

Kraft didn't cut Brady

DBroncos4life
03-07-2013, 12:00 PM
Kraft didn't cut Brady

Doom's been cut? Link??? **** this is huge news. I need to turn on NFL network for the details.

bronco militia
03-07-2013, 12:03 PM
Doom's been cut? Link??? **** this is huge news. I need to turn on NFL network for the details.

meh....that's the rumor.

Talk of cutting Doom and trading draft picks for Revis is a terrible plan A.

:cuss:

DBroncos4life
03-07-2013, 12:09 PM
meh....that's the rumor.

Talk of cutting Doom and trading draft picks for Revis is a terrible plan A.

:cuss:

So the same guy that said Champ could be cut and a twitter troll start rumors and people get pissed at the owner of our favorite team???

Also there hasn't been a player on the Pats team that hasn't been cut or traded regardless of their talent.

ol#7
03-07-2013, 12:11 PM
I dont like the direction this is headed. Reworking the contract to lower the cap hit/bring in more players is a move a team trying to win a SB makes.

Asking a star in his prime to take less than he could get on the open market, just because they dont feel like paying that much, bad move.

DENVERDUI55
03-07-2013, 12:30 PM
I'd be okay with swapping Doom for Revis and saving 6 mil a year. Tag Revis next two years and that would be less than 30 mil for 3 years. There are plenty of players that could fill in for Doom for less cash. A player like Freeney might not be as effective but the overall effect of Revis and him is greater than Doom and whoever the CB would be.

Jetmeck
03-07-2013, 12:30 PM
I said near the end of the regular season he was having a good year but not a great year and just about everybody here tore me a new one. I still like his game, but he's a sack specialist. He's not an all around dominant DE but he's paid like one, well this coming year anyhow. I agree with Broncos, he's playing well but not worth 12 million. Get that number in single digits or trade him if you can. I think Ayers (who's coming into his 5th year) really showed some improvement last year and I think he could be ready. Hunter also looked really solid last year before injury.

And since we're on the DL subject, who here likes Malik Jackson? He's listed as DL and I think I've seen him in preseason line up as both DT and DE. Honestly, he's got the prototype DE body at 6'5 275. Got long arms. I like what he showed in preseason. Obviously needs to groom his rushing but I thought he played the run well and showed some ability. I just don't see us trying to turn him into a DT. To me he is more of a DE. Look forward to him having a much bigger impact this year for us now going into this 2nd year.



Said this dozens of times and will keep seeing it, we need a consistent pass rush...................CONSISTENT

ol#7
03-07-2013, 12:36 PM
Said this dozens of times and will keep seeing it, we need a consistent pass rush...................CONSISTENT

You know, our pass rush would have been more consistent if the Ref's had called holding once in awhile. Doom and Von were absolutely mugged on several occasions and nothing was called.

Not to beat a dead horse, but Baltimore had, what, one holding penalty the entire playoffs.

BroncoBeavis
03-07-2013, 12:36 PM
I'd be okay with swapping Doom for Revis and saving 6 mil a year. Tag Revis next two years and that would be less than 30 mil for 3 years. There are plenty of players that could fill in for Doom for less cash. A player like Freeney might not be as effective but the overall effect of Revis and him is greater than Doom and whoever the CB would be.

You can't tag Revis. It's in his contract.

Rabb
03-07-2013, 12:38 PM
You can't tag Revis. It's in his contract.

It's in his Jets contract. That wouldn't transfer to us in a trade scenario.

gyldenlove
03-07-2013, 12:46 PM
I'd be okay with swapping Doom for Revis and saving 6 mil a year. Tag Revis next two years and that would be less than 30 mil for 3 years. There are plenty of players that could fill in for Doom for less cash. A player like Freeney might not be as effective but the overall effect of Revis and him is greater than Doom and whoever the CB would be.

You can't tag Revis, his current contract prevents a franchise tag.

gyldenlove
03-07-2013, 12:46 PM
It's in his Jets contract. That wouldn't transfer to us in a trade scenario.

Not true, we would take over his contract from the Jets with all provisions in tact.

bronco militia
03-07-2013, 12:53 PM
So the same guy that said Champ could be cut and a twitter troll start rumors and people get pissed at the owner of our favorite team???

Also there hasn't been a player on the Pats team that hasn't been cut or traded regardless of their talent.

where there's smoke, there's fire. I have a friend of a friend that gave me the scoop on peyton manning coming to denver two weeks before Incarcerated Bob "broke" the news.

hey, we'll see. :kiss:

Rabb
03-07-2013, 12:54 PM
Ah ok, for some reason I was thinking it didn't but I stand corrected then.

winstoncup bronco
03-07-2013, 12:55 PM
According to this AP story, The Denver Broncos are asking defensive end Elvis Dumervil to take a pay cut so they can create more salary cap room for free agency.

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/9028280/denver-broncos-ask-elvis-dumervil-take-pay-cut-according-reports

DENVERDUI55
03-07-2013, 01:06 PM
You can't tag Revis, his current contract prevents a franchise tag.

Well forget that the article I read on that changed and said they were wrong and he can't be franchised. Well then that scenerio doesn't work.

DENVERDUI55
03-07-2013, 01:09 PM
You can't tag Revis. It's in his contract.

Yes you can if you trade for him.

BroncoBeavis
03-07-2013, 01:11 PM
Doesn't carry over in a trade.

Yes it does. Otherwise Al Davis would've spent his last 30 years running some sort of league double-trade contract laundering service. :)

BroncoBeavis
03-07-2013, 01:28 PM
Why do you think he wants a new deal if he gets traded?

Uh, because he's unhappy with his current deal and would like more money?

In reality no team will trade for him WITHOUT reaching a new deal first because he's holding all the leverage with that no-franchise tag clause.

Requiem
03-07-2013, 01:30 PM
Beavis owned again.

BroncoBeavis
03-07-2013, 01:34 PM
Beavis owned again.

So you also think players lose their contractual rights whenever they're traded?

gyldenlove
03-07-2013, 02:11 PM
Yes you can if you trade for him.

No, when a player is traded his contract is assigned to the new team who - and I quote from the CBA:

...assignee club will pay Playerís necessary traveling expenses in reporting to it and will faithfully perform this contract with Player.

BroncoBeavis
03-07-2013, 02:24 PM
http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/blog/pat-kirwan/21791586/why-a-trade-for-darrelle-revis-will-be-difficult-to-pull-off

From the day he was drafted money has been an issue. He got a rookie deal over the slot he was in and it sent a bad message. He threatened a long holdout a few years later and got an above-market deal, again sending the wrong message. That deal had a "no franchise" clause in it which makes it tough to trade him under this contract.

SoCalBronco
03-07-2013, 02:31 PM
Sweet, SoCal can send them a gift now

I just got my invitation two weeks ago !Booya!

Damn Tux rental is more expensive than I thought tho.

elsid13
03-07-2013, 02:52 PM
I just got my invitation two weeks ago !Booya!

Damn Tux rental is more expensive than I thought tho.

I highly recommend you let Hotrod style you for the wedding and go with something like this:

http://ak1.ostkcdn.com/images/products/P13101039.jpg

Lestat
03-07-2013, 02:53 PM
According to this AP story,

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/9028280/denver-broncos-ask-elvis-dumervil-take-pay-cut-according-reports

hmm... something doesn't wash. Elway doesn't believe in spending big in FA unless it's a stud like PM. so who would be so enticing? Jackson to pair with Manning for a title?

DENVERDUI55
03-07-2013, 02:55 PM
No, when a player is traded his contract is assigned to the new team who - and I quote from the CBA:

Yes I read that didn't you read my post where I said I was wrong on that? The radio was wrong I was listening to and I read a BS article on it.

gyldenlove
03-07-2013, 03:52 PM
Yes I read that didn't you read my post where I said I was wrong on that? The radio was wrong I was listening to and I read a BS article on it.

Sorry, must have missed it.

Requiem
03-07-2013, 04:31 PM
hmm... something doesn't wash. Elway doesn't believe in spending big in FA unless it's a stud like PM. so who would be so enticing? Jackson to pair with Manning for a title?

Uh, the Broncos brought in one of the biggest FA landings ever in Manning.

It's quite obvious the Broncos will go after big named guys IF the price is right.

They were close last year. You don't think they are interested in adding good players to the roster? Lol.

ZONA
03-07-2013, 05:12 PM
Okay so nobody has an opinion on Jackson? Don't ignore me you friggen tools.......hahahaha, JK - gotta a nice Thursday buzz going. Sometimes instead of watching a good comedy movie I come here and read instead. Same affect, lol.

Bmore Manning
03-07-2013, 05:24 PM
Okay so nobody has an opinion on Jackson? Don't ignore me you friggen tools.......hahahaha, JK - gotta a nice Thursday buzz going. Sometimes instead of watching a good comedy movie I come here and read instead. Same affect, lol.

What do you mean, the entire forum minus some negative nancies would love to have SJax.. Are you late arriving to the party?

By the way, the Ravens playing with emotion was a really stupid comment I made now.. Right?

Lestat
03-07-2013, 05:55 PM
Uh, the Broncos brought in one of the biggest FA landings ever in Manning.

It's quite obvious the Broncos will go after big named guys IF the price is right.

They were close last year. You don't think they are interested in adding good players to the roster? Lol.

so you completely gloss over the fact that i said they don't believe in going heavily into FA unless it's a stud like PM(Peyton Manning) and then use PM to make a point i already made?

not understanding that. Elway has said he wants to build the team through the draft and not necessarily FA. so my question was who in FA would be big enough to be similar to Manning if they want Doom to restructure to free up cap to go into FA.

Rascal
03-07-2013, 06:05 PM
People owe Beavis an apology, or at the least admitting they are wrong.

http://www.itsalloverfatman.com/broncos/entry/you-got-served-tying-darrelle-revis-to-elvis-dumervil

Unfortunately, I screwed this one up. Clauses such as the one the Jets gave Revis (waiving their right to use their franchise tag on him) do transfer in a trade. Any team that acquires Revis will either have him for 2013 and lose him to free agency, or they'll have to come to terms with Revis on a longer term deal of their own. Like the Jets, they will not be able to tender Revis.

Requiem
03-07-2013, 06:09 PM
There are plenty of players the team could look at to help out the squad. I figure we will have some decent room to play with. Them wanting Dumervil to ease things up signals to me there are players in FA they would like to have. They might not be big named guys, but they are players who are better than what we had last year at spots:

Terrance Knighton, DT -- JDR selection, obvious fit for the defense. Legit starter. Young.

Michael Bennett -- Not as good of a pass rusher as Dumervil, but a better defender against the run. Would make sense going forward if Dumervil somehow (unlikely) is released/traded.

William Moore or Dashon Goldson -- Would be pricey, but we need longevity in the secondary. They provide this.

Alan Branch -- Did nothing to start his career, but NT for Seahawks the past two. Could help DT rotation.

Dannell Ellerbe -- Cut Mays, cut DJ -- get him?

Derek Cox, Daryl smith -- JDR connection.

Maybe Jackson or Bradshaw at RB.

we could afford one or two of these guys lol

eddie mac
03-07-2013, 06:10 PM
People owe Beavis an apology, or at the least admitting they are wrong.

http://www.itsalloverfatman.com/broncos/entry/you-got-served-tying-darrelle-revis-to-elvis-dumervil

Unfortunately, I screwed this one up. Clauses such as the one the Jets gave Revis (waiving their right to use their franchise tag on him) do transfer in a trade. Any team that acquires Revis will either have him for 2013 and lose him to free agency, or they'll have to come to terms with Revis on a longer term deal of their own. Like the Jets, they will not be able to tender Revis.

One of the many reasons teams aren't considering giving anywhere near one 1st rd pick for him right now, well that and the ridiculous $16m per year contract wanted, oh and I forgot the ACL.

eddie mac
03-07-2013, 06:12 PM
Robert Kraft frees up money and is a hero.
Pat Bowlen frees up money and is called a broke drunk.

A six you say Jay????

Yeah but Kraft didn't free it up by releasing Brady.:giggle:

gyldenlove
03-07-2013, 06:17 PM
Okay so nobody has an opinion on Jackson? Don't ignore me you friggen tools.......hahahaha, JK - gotta a nice Thursday buzz going. Sometimes instead of watching a good comedy movie I come here and read instead. Same affect, lol.

I am pretty meh on Jackson, I don't think he will be an upgrade over Mcgahee as a runner, although he is a definite upgrade as a receiver. It has been 6 full seasons since he had double digit TDs in a season, which is a long time for a guy who has about 300 touches per year. His per carry average is not great and it doesn't look like it will improve.

For any team who goes and gets Jackson, I think there has to be an understanding that he is pretty close to his "best before" day, so giving him a big contract with a lot of guaranteed money is a big risk to take.

I think there are better places to spend money in free agency for both short and long term gains. If we really need a RB, I think the 2nd round of the draft is going to give us some really solid options for guys to complement Ronnie Hillman.

SlyEli
03-07-2013, 06:20 PM
I am pretty meh on Jackson, I don't think he will be an upgrade over Mcgahee as a runner, although he is a definite upgrade as a receiver. It has been 6 full seasons since he had double digit TDs in a season, which is a long time for a guy who has about 300 touches per year. His per carry average is not great and it doesn't look like it will improve.

For any team who goes and gets Jackson, I think there has to be an understanding that he is pretty close to his "best before" day, so giving him a big contract with a lot of guaranteed money is a big risk to take.

I think there are better places to spend money in free agency for both short and long term gains. If we really need a RB, I think the 2nd round of the draft is going to give us some really solid options for guys to complement Ronnie Hillman.

agreed. I'd rather get bradshaw.

eddie mac
03-07-2013, 06:20 PM
Broncos RE Elvis Dumervil's agent says his client is open to restructuring his deal.
Dumervil is not open to a pay cut, though. "If we can meet on some common ground there's a potential we can get it done. If we can't, then they'll have to make a decision," said Dumervil's agent. "Elvis wants to return as a Bronco if it all possible, and that's what we're trying to do." Dumervil's $12 million salary becomes guaranteed on March 16, but Denver is likely to make a decision by the start of free agency on Tuesday.

Requiem
03-07-2013, 06:23 PM
So what can we do to keep Elvis and give us more room this year? Eddie?

Cap dude tell us!!!

DBroncos4life
03-07-2013, 06:32 PM
Yeah but Kraft didn't free it up by releasing Brady.:giggle:

How many players have the Pats cut to keep the Patriot way going? Also when was Doom cut???

gunns
03-07-2013, 06:38 PM
What do you mean, the entire forum minus some negative nancies would love to have SJax.. Are you late arriving to the party?

By the way, the Ravens playing with emotion was a really stupid comment I made now.. Right?

Negative Nancy here :egbgb:

gunns
03-07-2013, 06:42 PM
Broncos RE Elvis Dumervil's agent says his client is open to restructuring his deal.
Dumervil is not open to a pay cut, though. "If we can meet on some common ground there's a potential we can get it done. If we can't, then they'll have to make a decision," said Dumervil's agent. "Elvis wants to return as a Bronco if it all possible, and that's what we're trying to do." Dumervil's $12 million salary becomes guaranteed on March 16, but Denver is likely to make a decision by the start of free agency on Tuesday.

Now wait a minute, I was told that restructuring was a pay cut. That I was being really inconsiderate expecting a guy to take a pay cut and essentially restructuring was just that.

Luucccy!

eddie mac
03-07-2013, 06:43 PM
So what can we do to keep Elvis and give us more room this year? Eddie?

Cap dude tell us!!!

They could basically save $7.33m this year if they wanted to but they wont. They could turn $11m of his $12m base into a signing bonus then prorate it over the remaining 3 years of his contract, saving $7.33m this year but then adding $3.7m to his cap numbers in 2014 and 2015.

I very much doubt Elway will do that but you never know. It seems to me we're not trying to create caproom as such but to find more actual cash spending money this year. ESPN and the others haven't got a ****ing clue when it comes to actual spending.

Lestat
03-07-2013, 06:48 PM
There are plenty of players the team could look at to help out the squad. I figure we will have some decent room to play with. Them wanting Dumervil to ease things up signals to me there are players in FA they would like to have. They might not be big named guys, but they are players who are better than what we had last year at spots:

Terrance Knighton, DT -- JDR selection, obvious fit for the defense. Legit starter. Young.

Michael Bennett -- Not as good of a pass rusher as Dumervil, but a better defender against the run. Would make sense going forward if Dumervil somehow (unlikely) is released/traded.

William Moore or Dashon Goldson -- Would be pricey, but we need longevity in the secondary. They provide this.

Alan Branch -- Did nothing to start his career, but NT for Seahawks the past two. Could help DT rotation.

Dannell Ellerbe -- Cut Mays, cut DJ -- get him?

Derek Cox, Daryl smith -- JDR connection.

Maybe Jackson or Bradshaw at RB.

we could afford one or two of these guys lol

i agree that we can afford those guys, but the quote was that they wanted to free money up for free agency. Elway is on record as wanting to build through the draft and has passed on top tier free agents in the past outside of Manning.
everyone else has been reclamation projects, aging vets who have a bit left in the tank or lower tier low risk signings.
now maybe the philosophy has changed because Manning has only so many years left and it's a championship or bust mantra now.

so my thought was that there is likely one key guy they see that they want to chase and think it might take up some cap room and want to have additional flexibility if they can land him.

i assume it's Steven Jackson since it would provide Manning with a dynamic RB he hasn't had since James in Indy.

Bmore Manning
03-07-2013, 06:55 PM
Ellerbe is not very strong in coverage.. We need to cross him off the list as a MLB free agent target.. But I like the options out there and your list Req.

Rascal
03-07-2013, 06:55 PM
They could basically save $7.33m this year if they wanted to but they wont. They could turn $11m of his $12m base into a signing bonus then prorate it over the remaining 3 years of his contract, saving $7.33m this year but then adding $3.7m to his cap numbers in 2014 and 2015.

I very much doubt Elway will do that but you never know. It seems to me we're not trying to create caproom as such but to find more actual cash spending money this year. ESPN and the others haven't got a ****ing clue when it comes to actual spending.

like I said earlier, pat doesn't want to spend the $$

Bmore Manning
03-07-2013, 07:09 PM
While I liked the Clady approach, I don't like the way this is being handled. I also don't like tendering Clark, Ball, and Colquitt..

rugbythug
03-07-2013, 07:19 PM
While I liked the Clady approach, I don't like the way this is being handled. I also don't like tendering Clark, Ball, and Colquitt..

No Idea what that means? You don't like how speculative bull**** occurs?

BroncosfanGuy
03-07-2013, 07:27 PM
While I liked the Clady approach, I don't like the way this is being handled. I also don't like tendering Clark, Ball, and Colquitt..

half joking, but Colquitt could have been team MVP 2 years ago the way he was pinning teams back when Denver was basically playing small ball and playing the field position game every week. I like the Colquitt tender. I agree with you on Ball though.

Heyneck
03-07-2013, 07:41 PM
Steven Jackson FTW!!! Nuff said!!!

Rascal
03-07-2013, 07:47 PM
They informed us they want to do a restructure. I'm not classifying this as a pay cut. I'm going ahead with this being a restructure. If we can meet on some common ground, there's a potential we can get it done. If we can't, they'll have to make a decision. But we're definitely in good faith going to try to negotiate this out. Elvis wants to return as a Bronco if it all possible, and that's what we're trying to do ó make the client happy and try to appease the team.

Translation: Denver's going to have to pony up a lot more guaranteed money for my client to accept a lower salary.

cutthemdown
03-07-2013, 09:37 PM
Sounds like Doom wants to redo a deal that allows him to stay.

Bacchus
03-07-2013, 09:44 PM
If I was Doom, I'd tell Elway to shove it and let me go to FA. He'll get another big contract with a signing bonus. Some 3-4 team will pay him big bucks.

cutthemdown
03-07-2013, 09:50 PM
Doom probably likes Denver and with only 2 yrs on deal left will exchange some of that base salary for some extra yrs and garaunteed money etc. Broncos on the verge of being really good I doubt players want to leave right now.

Bacchus
03-07-2013, 09:58 PM
Doom probably likes Denver and with only 2 yrs on deal left will exchange some of that base salary for some extra yrs and garaunteed money etc. Broncos on the verge of being really good I doubt players want to leave right now.

I don't think so, They went to Doom with this two weeks ago and the deadline is coming. So what if Doom likes it in Denver. 75% of all football players are broke 5 years after leaving the NFL. Doom has another chance to sign his "big" contract. He needs to take advantage of this.

Taco John
03-07-2013, 10:26 PM
If I was Doom, I'd tell Elway to shove it and let me go to FA. He'll get another big contract with a signing bonus. Some 3-4 team will pay him big bucks.


If you were Dumervil, you'd be a member of the team, and you'd have the feeling that everyone in that locker room has right now: we can win it all.

This is a business, sure - but there isn't a guy in that locker room who doesn't want to go out of this game without a ring. Not a single one. Dumervil will get his payday on the open market soon enough. If I were him, I'd do exactly what they're indicating: restructure the deal, make it work for both parties, and play like hell the next couple years and try to win a ring and cash in.

Bacchus
03-07-2013, 10:53 PM
If you were Dumervil, you'd be a member of the team, and you'd have the feeling that everyone in that locker room has right now: we can win it all.

This is a business, sure - but there isn't a guy in that locker room who doesn't want to go out of this game without a ring. Not a single one. Dumervil will get his payday on the open market soon enough. If I were him, I'd do exactly what they're indicating: restructure the deal, make it work for both parties, and play like hell the next couple years and try to win a ring and cash in.

He is 29, right now he is still in his prime. If he plays another two years in denver and then becomes a FA he'll be 31 and on the downside of his career. Not many players get to cash in twice and he can. He probably could get a 4 year contract for $35 million with a $12 million signing bonus. The Broncos are not going to offer him another signing bonus and that ius the most important thing in the contract.

R-Mac
03-07-2013, 11:52 PM
He probably could get a 4 year contract for $35 million with a $12 million signing bonus.

Dumervil can get much more than this as a free agent. He'd be the top 3-4 OLB available and one of the top DEs. He has as many career sacks as Mario Williams. I'd compare Dumervil's value to Tamba Hali and Hali signed a five-year, $57.5 million contract with $35 million guaranteed ($12.25 million salary in 2013). Anthony Spencer with the tag: $10.627 million salary. People think Cliff Avril will make a lot of money and Dumervil would be right there with Avril. A 3-4 team would have Dumervil as a high priority. There is a conflict in Denver because of the 4-3 defense where Von Miller has become the main piece. It's risky to ask a healthy, 29-year old Pro Bowler/All-Pro to take a pay cut. Dumervil knows he can compete for a Super Bowl in Denver, but he also knows he can join another contender and get paid.

DBroncos4life
03-07-2013, 11:58 PM
He is 29, right now he is still in his prime. If he plays another two years in denver and then becomes a FA he'll be 31 and on the downside of his career. Not many players get to cash in twice and he can. He probably could get a 4 year contract for $35 million with a $12 million signing bonus. The Broncos are not going to offer him another signing bonus and that ius the most important thing in the contract.

Where do you pull these numbers out of? Chris Clemens signed a 3 year 22 million dollar contract with a 6.5 million dollar signing bonus just last year at the age of 30. To say Dumervil won't be able to get at least that at age 31when his contract is up is laughable at best (baring injury).

eddie mac
03-08-2013, 12:21 AM
Vic Lombardi ‏@VicLombardi

Elvis saw this coming. He's always been willing to restructure. His agent is doing his job, fighting the good fight. It'll work out.

cutthemdown
03-08-2013, 01:13 AM
there is no reason that there cant be a bonus of upfront money for Doom if he restructures. Broncos just don't like the 12 million base salary. The will probably convert half of that, 5-6 million into a bonus. Extend his contract out 2 yrs with a manageable base salary etc etc. Doom gets his money, Broncos get relief and another ring!

Broncojef
03-08-2013, 04:17 AM
If I was Doom, I'd tell Elway to shove it and let me go to FA. He'll get another big contract with a signing bonus. Some 3-4 team will pay him big bucks.

Doom simply isn't worth what he is getting paid. He can tell Elway to shove it out of anger but he's not going to get $12 mill elsewhere. Game changers like Von and Watts are and will demand huge money in the years to come but Doom isn't in that category.

BroncoInferno
03-08-2013, 05:35 AM
Doom simply isn't worth what he is getting paid. He can tell Elway to shove it out of anger but he's not going to get $12 mill elsewhere.

Maybe not in base salary, but he'd land somewhere in the $12-$18 million range in terms of guaranteed money if he hit the open market. Especially considering the pass rushers in this years draft class all have big question marks.

Atwater His Ass
03-08-2013, 06:27 AM
If you were Dumervil, you'd be a member of the team, and you'd have the feeling that everyone in that locker room has right now: we can win it all.

This is a business, sure - but there isn't a guy in that locker room who doesn't want to go out of this game without a ring. Not a single one. Dumervil will get his payday on the open market soon enough. If I were him, I'd do exactly what they're indicating: restructure the deal, make it work for both parties, and play like hell the next couple years and try to win a ring and cash in.

It doesn't work that way anymore. I don't believe most players are in it for championships any longer or management. It's all about profits, which is why the owner absolutely love Goodell.

I hope they work it out and he stays, but I don't really see what doom gains by taking a pay cut, unless the restructure maintains his money over the next couple of years and even then, that's not gaining that's just treading water. The reality is he could stand firm and if they deal or cut him, sign another big contract with another team, which would seem the way to go. Everyone on that locker room would understand that because 9 out of 10 of them would do the same thing if in the same position. The time line to play pro ball is so short, you'd be stupid to take your own leverage away when you have it. He doesn't owe the Broncos anything and the team has zero leverage over him.

It's way too big a risk to just put off another big deal until a season or two down the road. Any kind of injury is just around the corner, and he'll be on the wrong side of 30.

All this talk about Doom not being worth what he is being paid is also, while true, complete rubbish. Players are retroactively paid all the time. It's how it works. Just look at Flacco for the latest example. There is absolutely zero obligation on his end to help out the team financially. Especially when it's not in his best interest.

Bacchus
03-08-2013, 06:59 AM
Where do you pull these numbers out of? Chris Clemens signed a 3 year 22 million dollar contract with a 6.5 million dollar signing bonus just last year at the age of 30. To say Dumervil won't be able to get at least that at age 31when his contract is up is laughable at best (baring injury).

I was being conservative with the numbers showing that there is little financial reason why Doom should stay with the Broncos over them cutting him and going into FA.

TonyR
03-08-2013, 07:01 AM
I tend to agree with IAOFM's take linked below. Elvis is gone.

http://www.itsalloverfatman.com/broncos/entry/dumervils-agent-elvis-willing-to-restructure

Broncojef
03-08-2013, 07:04 AM
Maybe not in base salary, but he'd land somewhere in the $12-$18 million range in terms of guaranteed money if he hit the open market. Especially considering the pass rushers in this years draft class all have big question marks.

Nah I don't buy it. Hopefully we don't find out but no one will give Doom that kind of money per year, it just won't happen. Doom has good numbers but he's not a Von/Watts game changer.

CEH
03-08-2013, 07:04 AM
Not a agent but a restructure in Elvis' mind may not be the same to ELway

Denver does/will not pay Elvis $31 MM over the next 3 years. Maybe $31 over 5 but the FO will not pay Elvis $10MM or more at any point in the next 3 years

Adjusting to contract to a signing bonus will not solve the issue either

Denver's looking to pay a player of Elvis' caliber about $6 MM a year thus Freeney comes into play

And Elvis is just one of many players in this situation so all is not lost if Elvis walks.

Heyneck
03-08-2013, 07:07 AM
Doom simply isn't worth what he is getting paid. He can tell Elway to shove it out of anger but he's not going to get $12 mill elsewhere. Game changers like Von and Watts are and will demand huge money in the years to come but Doom isn't in that category.

Uhh... You remeber the 20-0 beating we were getting by the Chargers? When we started to come back, it was Dooms strip sack fumble (the one carter picked up and ran for the TD) changed the hole momentum of that game, and season.

Guess you haven't watched to many Bronco football to say Doom is not a game changer. Lol, some people around here are just dumb. Is he worth12 mil on our part? In my opinion he is. But if he is cut, trust me, he wont worry about getting another 10+ contract on the market.

g6matty
03-08-2013, 07:09 AM
doom shines against ****ty tackles but doesnt do anything against top competition

i like the guy but he should be around 7 mil a year


whats the going rate for one trick ponies

Bacchus
03-08-2013, 07:12 AM
What are the odds Doom ends up in NE with their 3-4 defense?

Bacchus
03-08-2013, 07:13 AM
Not a agent but a restructure in Elvis' mind may not be the same to ELway

Denver does/will not pay Elvis $31 MM over the next 3 years. Maybe $31 over 5 but the FO will not pay Elvis $10MM or more at any point in the next 3 years

Adjusting to contract to a signing bonus will not solve the issue either

Denver's looking to pay a player of Elvis' caliber about $6 MM a year thus Freeney comes into play

And Elvis is just one of many players in this situation so all is not lost if Elvis walks.

LOL.... Freeney is not of Doom's caliber. Check out their sack totals the last three years. Not even close.

CEH
03-08-2013, 07:18 AM
LOL.... Freeney is not of Doom's caliber. Check out their sack totals the last three years. Not even close.

I'm taking salary range not player. How much Denver is willing to pay for a sack specialist opposite Miller. It won't be $12 MM for Elvis

TonyR
03-08-2013, 07:23 AM
.... Freeney is not of Doom's caliber. Check out their sack totals the last three years. Not even close.

Clearly. But the goal isn't to replace Doom with Freeney (or whoever they might bring in). The goal is to take Doom's money and address other needs. They probably feel they can replace Doom's production with a combination of multiple players. I think they know what they're doing.

Heyneck
03-08-2013, 07:27 AM
I'm taking salary range not player. How much Denver is willing to pay for a sack specialist opposite Miller. It won't be $12 MM for Elvis

You think Elway is going to pay Doom 6 mill per year? Then Doom is as good as gone.

And I don't get this change Doom for Freeney thing? If most of you that say and b**** about Doom is weak against the run, just wait until teams start running at Freeney every time he hits the field. Freeney is an old and injured dino that will only get a contract on the 5+ mill range just because he is a has been.

SlyEli
03-08-2013, 07:28 AM
doom shines against ****ty tackles but doesnt do anything against top competition

i like the guy but he should be around 7 mil a year


whats the going rate for one trick ponies

exactly. i believe the majority of his sacks came against the charger's terrible tackle they picked up off the street

Requiem
03-08-2013, 07:28 AM
Michael Bennett over Freeney.

TonyR
03-08-2013, 07:35 AM
Then Doom is as good as gone.

He most likely is. Unless he and his agent back down, which is very unlikely.

yerner
03-08-2013, 07:42 AM
What are the odds Doom ends up in NE with their 3-4 defense?

dear god no.

Broncojef
03-08-2013, 07:46 AM
Uhh... You remeber the 20-0 beating we were getting by the Chargers? When we started to come back, it was Dooms strip sack fumble (the one carter picked up and ran for the TD) changed the hole momentum of that game, and season.

Guess you haven't watched to many Bronco football to say Doom is not a game changer. Lol, some people around here are just dumb. Is he worth12 mil on our part? In my opinion he is. But if he is cut, trust me, he wont worry about getting another 10+ contract on the market.

Well I guess the Broncos management watched different games than you as well and will be considered dumb along with me. Doom made some big plays and I like him but you are clueless if you think he is worth roughly a tenth of our salary cap this year. He will not get 10 mill a year and if he does I hope he's not a bronco, he failed when he was needed most last season and we have holes to address.

Heyneck
03-08-2013, 07:48 AM
exactly. i believe the majority of his sacks came against the charger's terrible tackle they picked up off the street

3 sacks against SD. Other than that he had sacks against HOU, NE, CIN, CAR, BAL, CLE (all this teams have good to great OT, and the sacks he had against OAK.). He rode Joe Thomas like his bitch. Sure... Dooms sacks only come against terrible tackles.

I wanna see what people think about Doom when he is off the team and we aren't getting to push the pocket like previous years.

PS... so that you know... Von had 4 sacks against that same crappy SD OT's.

CEH
03-08-2013, 07:48 AM
You think Elway is going to pay Doom 6 mill per year? Then Doom is as good as gone.

And I don't get this change Doom for Freeney thing? If most of you that say and b**** about Doom is weak against the run, just wait until teams start running at Freeney every time he hits the field. Freeney is an old and injured dino that will only get a contract on the 5+ mill range just because he is a has been.

Freeney is an example. Who knows whom they replace him with if he walks but it won't be another $12 MM player.

I suggested Doom will still get his $31 MM just over 5 years not 3 so yes Elway will pay Elvis $6 MM a year

Heyneck
03-08-2013, 07:50 AM
Well I guess the Broncos management watched different games than you as well and will be considered dumb along with me. Doom made some big plays and I like him but you are clueless if you think he is worth roughly a tenth of our salary cap this year. He will not get 10 mill a year and if he does I hope he's not a bronco, he failed when he was needed most last season and we have holes to address.

I am not saying he is going to get 10 mil from the Broncos, I am saying he will easily find suitors that are willing to pay that or more for a premium PASS RUSHER.

yerner
03-08-2013, 07:57 AM
I'm calling it now, Doom goes to New England and sacks Peyton 3 times in the playoffs next season. All you guys worried about his paycheck are silly.

Broncojef
03-08-2013, 08:03 AM
I am not saying he is going to get 10 mil from the Broncos, I am saying he will easily find suitors that are willing to pay that or more for a premium PASS RUSHER.

We'll see I guess just don't see people breaking the bank to get to doom.

Heyneck
03-08-2013, 08:03 AM
I'm calling it now, Doom goes to New England and sacks Peyton 3 times in the playoffs next season. All you guys worried about his paycheck are silly.

I could really see him going to NE. They are going to be active in FA. Their lack of pass rush would make Doom and instant target. Hope this doesn't happen.

Broncojef
03-08-2013, 08:04 AM
I'm calling it now, Doom goes to New England and sacks Peyton 3 times in the playoffs next season. All you guys worried about his paycheck are silly.

Well seeing him get a sack in the playoffs would be a nice change I guess.

BroncoBeavis
03-08-2013, 08:13 AM
I am not saying he is going to get 10 mil from the Broncos, I am saying he will easily find suitors that are willing to pay that or more for a premium PASS RUSHER.

If they dump Doom without using every last dime of cap space on other needs, it's going to nail the coffin when it comes to the broke-ass Bowlen debate.

Heyneck
03-08-2013, 08:13 AM
We'll see I guess just don't see people breaking the bank to get to doom.

Well lets see, he has the same amount of sacks, 50 less tackles, way more FFs, 1 more safety, 1 more INT and 4 less passes defended than Mario Williams. All this while playing 1 full season less than him. (both picked in 06).

As you would know, Mario is the highest paid def player in the league right now. You think Doom won't easily get 10 mil per year on the open market? Then I must be right and you don't watch a lot of football.

BroncoBeavis
03-08-2013, 08:15 AM
Well seeing him get a sack in the playoffs would be a nice change I guess.

1.5 in 3 games. Same as Von Miller.

Heyneck
03-08-2013, 08:18 AM
Well seeing him get a sack in the playoffs would be a nice change I guess.

He has 1.5 in 3 career playoff games, the same 1.5 Von Miller has in the same 3 career playoff games. Under your logic, we better not pay Von his money when the time comes because he is just as invisible as Doom in the playoffs. Lol. Try harder.

Johnykbr
03-08-2013, 08:23 AM
I'm calling it now, Doom goes to New England and sacks Peyton 3 times in the playoffs next season. All you guys worried about his paycheck are silly.

This frightens me much more than them getting Ed Reed or any other high caliber player.

Heyneck
03-08-2013, 08:29 AM
This frightens me much more than them getting Ed Reed or any other high caliber player.

Just imagine that. Doom next to a competent DT for once. Doom next to Wilfork would be complete ownage.

BroncoBeavis
03-08-2013, 08:29 AM
He has 1.5 in 3 career playoff games, the same 1.5 Von Miller has in the same 3 career playoff games. Under your logic, we better not pay Von his money when the time comes because he is just as invisible as Doom in the playoffs. Lol. Try harder.

:)

Drunken.Broncoholic
03-08-2013, 08:36 AM
Doom goes and this team will suffer. I can't count how many times he rushed a QB into a mistake. Incompletes due to doom. Olines and offenses have to account for him. You are not going to find a replacement that will garner the same impact he will have on this season. Maybe a few years down the road with a rookie developing but not now when Peyton is on the field.

They want to win a superbowl they need to open up the wallet for a couple years. Cheap teams don't win SuperBowls.

BroncoInferno
03-08-2013, 08:37 AM
Nah I don't buy it. Hopefully we don't find out but no one will give Doom that kind of money per year, it just won't happen. Doom has good numbers but he's not a Von/Watts game changer.

That's fine if you don't buy it, but you're wrong. Doom would absolutely get eight figures in guaranteed money on the open market. That's just a fact.

BroncosfanGuy
03-08-2013, 08:45 AM
all those years we wanted Denver to get players who can get after the QB and now we have 2 of them and some fans are saying Doom isn't that good? Doom's importance isn't limited to his own sack production. If he leaves you can bet Miller's production is going to dip as well. Hope this works out because having Von and Doom is a huge advantage with Peyton at QB.

Johnykbr
03-08-2013, 08:55 AM
all those years we wanted Denver to get players who can get after the QB and now we have 2 of them and some fans are saying Doom isn't that good? Doom's importance isn't limited to his own sack production. If he leaves you can bet Miller's production is going to dip as well. Hope this works out because having Von and Doom is a huge advantage with Peyton at QB.

I think Von's total goes down by at least 3 and I imagine possibly 5 if an equal replace of Doom isn't found.

TonyR
03-08-2013, 09:11 AM
Just imagine that. Doom next to a competent DT for once. Doom next to Wilfork would be complete ownage.

I'm open to being corrected but I'm not sure Doom would/could play end in a 3-4?

BroncosfanGuy
03-08-2013, 09:15 AM
I'm open to being corrected but I'm not sure Doom would/could play end in a 3-4?

ne plays a predominantly even front, iirc. 4-3

SleepingTiger
03-08-2013, 09:16 AM
all those years we wanted Denver to get players who can get after the QB and now we have 2 of them and some fans are saying Doom isn't that good? Doom's importance isn't limited to his own sack production. If he leaves you can bet Miller's production is going to dip as well. Hope this works out because having Von and Doom is a huge advantage with Peyton at QB.

exactly. Pay the man. I don't care if he disappeared in the playoffs. Guess what, the only guy that showed up was Holiday.

pricejj
03-08-2013, 09:17 AM
The Broncos better not have another season ruined by McDaniels/Xanders and their ridiculous middle-loaded contract.

Agamemnon
03-08-2013, 09:34 AM
We'll see I guess just don't see people breaking the bank to get to doom.

You're an idiot.

SleepingTiger
03-08-2013, 09:39 AM
all those years we wanted Denver to get players who can get after the QB and now we have 2 of them and some fans are saying Doom isn't that good? Doom's importance isn't limited to his own sack production. If he leaves you can bet Miller's production is going to dip as well. Hope this works out because having Von and Doom is a huge advantage with Peyton at QB.

exactly. Pay the man. I don't care if he disappeared in the playoffs. Guess what, the only guy that showed up was Holiday.

Broncojef
03-08-2013, 09:42 AM
You're an idiot.

Are you dooms agent or something? Good Lord dude

Requiem
03-08-2013, 09:42 AM
Did some of you just gloss over Med's post on Dumervil or was it too complicated to understand?

Heyneck
03-08-2013, 09:48 AM
I'm open to being corrected but I'm not sure Doom would/could play end in a 3-4?

Like BroncosFanGuy said, they moved last year to more of 4-3 defense. But they also switch on the go to a 3-4. Doom would own that scheme. Even if he was primarily playing in a 3-4 that front 3 would make him even more lethal.

peacepipe
03-08-2013, 10:13 AM
I'm open to being corrected but I'm not sure Doom would/could play end in a 3-4?

Non-issue really,he is a OLB in a 3-4 defense. I'm not sure why anyone would think he would stay at DE in a 3-4 scheme. He had 17+ sacks couple yrs ago when he played OLB in the 3-4 we ran then.

Atwater His Ass
03-08-2013, 11:32 AM
With the limited window we have with Manning, I'm not sure why Elway and co. just don't bite the bullet with Doom. He's in his prime and pass rushing guys get paid premium dollars. Even if they can replace his production, it won't be with a single guy, which will allow teams to focus a lot more on Von as the only consistent pass rush threat.

Just seems really stupid to me.

DENVERDUI55
03-08-2013, 11:37 AM
What ever defense Denver plays Doom is lined up with the same responsibilties whether a 3-4 or 4-3 under. People get too hung up on is it a 3-4 or 4-3 when there are so many variations of both. That being said Doom needs to help the team out and restructure if he really wants to win. A deal could be worked out that is good for both sides.

DBroncos4life
03-08-2013, 11:39 AM
I tend to agree with IAOFM's take linked below. Elvis is gone.

http://www.itsalloverfatman.com/broncos/entry/dumervils-agent-elvis-willing-to-restructure

Really it's shocking to see you agree with the writers of IAOFM. That is news in itself.

Lestat
03-08-2013, 11:44 AM
i just don't get this scenario. just lower the cap hit and let him keep his money.
he got off to a crappy start and still ended up with 11 sacks. why mess with your 2nd best pass rusher when DL is a semi weak point of the team? it's not like Wolfe plays exclusively DE nor is it like Ayers is gonna replace him.

ScottXray
03-08-2013, 11:49 AM
What ever defense Denver plays Doom is lined up with the same responsibilties whether a 3-4 or 4-3 under. People get too hung up on is it a 3-4 or 4-3 when there are so many variations of both. That being said Doom needs to help the team out and restructure if he really wants to win. A deal could be worked out that is good for both sides.

Agreed, but Doom has the cards here. The Broncos need to realise the CLUB made the contract problem, not Doom.

He will probably restructure some if the contract is guaranteed. 24 Mill guranteed over three years ( 8 per) and bonuses for performance that bring it back up to around 28 mill if needed. Then a 2 year extension at another 6-7 mill per , not guaranteed, and both sides should be happy. He will get at least that if they cut him, and possibly more, and would be giving a home team discount, and about 4 mill cap space to the club.
Asking for more by the Broncos would be stupid. If Doom gets injured it means some dead money, but thats a chance you take on any player.

Rabb
03-08-2013, 11:57 AM
Agreed, but Doom has the cards here

Not really, I really believe that if it came down to it we would release him and save some cheddar. Sure, I would love him to stay but he's expendable.

ol#7
03-08-2013, 12:01 PM
Not really, I really believe that if it came down to it we would release him and save some cheddar. Sure, I would love him to stay but he's expendable.

This I dont get. In what way is a 29 year old, double digit sack specialist expendable?

It is the pressure upfront that kept our secondary from imploding earlier. Also lets them move Von around to be even more disruptive. Bet most of the sacks the interior guys got happened with Doom getting double teamed as well.

Rabb
03-08-2013, 12:07 PM
This I dont get. In what way is a 29 year old, double digit sack specialist expendable?

It is the pressure upfront that kept our secondary from imploding earlier. Also lets them move Von around to be even more disruptive. Bet most of the sacks the interior guys got happened with Doom getting double teamed as well.

You're confusing his playing abilities with money. I will say it again, I like Doom...want him to stay. But paying this sort of money for exactly what you said, a sack specialist, isn't smart business. The money that would be saved by releasing him (I will say again, I really hope this doesn't happen) would go a long way to making smarter financial moves with not much impact I would bet.

Maybe I am wrong, I am just saying...there are probably 3 guys on the team that aren't expendable. Maybe 4 tops. Outside of Manning and Miller it could be a good debate honestly.

The defensive cornerstone here, isn't Doom, despite what people seem to think. He's a complimentary player IMO.

ol#7
03-08-2013, 12:16 PM
You're confusing his playing abilities with money. I will say it again, I like Doom...want him to stay. But paying this sort of money for exactly what you said, a sack specialist, isn't smart business. The money that would be saved by releasing him (I will say again, I really hope this doesn't happen) would go a long way to making smarter financial moves with not much impact I would bet.

Maybe I am wrong, I am just saying...there are probably 3 guys on the team that aren't expendable. Maybe 4 tops. Outside of Manning and Miller it could be a good debate honestly.

The defensive cornerstone here, isn't Doom, despite what people seem to think. He's a complimentary player IMO.

How do you save money and not lose production? He is a hell of alot more than a complimentary player. DJ Williams is a complimentary player.

You cant save money and get equal production. That guy doesnt exist. Save a few bucks to bring in a broken down Freeney? I thought we were trying to win a SB?

The worst part is, all this seems to be coming from left field.

Bacchus
03-08-2013, 12:17 PM
I'm calling it now, Doom goes to New England and sacks Peyton 3 times in the playoffs next season. All you guys worried about his paycheck are silly.

Exactly, If Denver cuts Doom for his salary they better make some huge FA acquisitions that they could not have made. I'm talking Mike Wallace, Percy Harvin type top shelf players. Because Doom and NE makes just too much sense.

Bacchus
03-08-2013, 12:19 PM
Doom goes and this team will suffer. I can't count how many times he rushed a QB into a mistake. Incompletes due to doom. Olines and offenses have to account for him. You are not going to find a replacement that will garner the same impact he will have on this season. Maybe a few years down the road with a rookie developing but not now when Peyton is on the field.

They want to win a superbowl they need to open up the wallet for a couple years. Cheap teams don't win SuperBowls.

I so agree

Broncojef
03-08-2013, 12:22 PM
You're confusing his playing abilities with money. I will say it again, I like Doom...want him to stay. But paying this sort of money for exactly what you said, a sack specialist, isn't smart business. The money that would be saved by releasing him (I will say again, I really hope this doesn't happen) would go a long way to making smarter financial moves with not much impact I would bet.

Maybe I am wrong, I am just saying...there are probably 3 guys on the team that aren't expendable. Maybe 4 tops. Outside of Manning and Miller it could be a good debate honestly.

The defensive cornerstone here, isn't Doom, despite what people seem to think. He's a complimentary player IMO.

The next obnoxious contract will be Von's and he will break the bank, cause like you said he's the cornerstone not Doom.

BroncoBeavis
03-08-2013, 12:27 PM
Exactly, If Denver cuts Doom for his salary they better make some huge FA acquisitions that they could not have made. I'm talking Mike Wallace, Percy Harvin type top shelf players. Because Doom and NE makes just too much sense.

Well put. If we cut Doom for a little extra Bowlen Scotch Fund slush, things are gonna get real up in the OM.

Drunken.Broncoholic
03-08-2013, 12:40 PM
Well put. If we cut Doom for a little extra Bowlen Scotch Fund slush, things are gonna get real up in the OM.

I just don't understand the logic of releasing him and getting zero in return. When we get good players we don't want to pay them? id rather have great players getting their money than a roster full of rookies has beens and what ifs.


I'm starting to believe that when dumervil a contract was made they thought the TV deals would sky rocket the cap 30-50 million

Anyone know what Von or Wolfes production was when Dumervil wasn't on the field?

TonyR
03-08-2013, 12:51 PM
Really it's shocking to see you agree with the writers of IAOFM.

What do you disagree with?

Heyneck
03-08-2013, 12:53 PM
If they are going straight for the pay cut this is over. Doom is out of here. And good ridance. Get the **** away as you can from a team that paid you pennies for 4 great years to start your career, only to sign you to a contract extension and then want to tear it up while you are still keeping your end of the bargain. I am in the build through the draft strategy. But unless we are keeping the talent we are developing it's for naught. If Doom is gone, and God for bid, Von gets injured, this defense will turn to ****.

crush17
03-08-2013, 01:02 PM
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BroncoBeavis
03-08-2013, 01:08 PM
Based on some of the logic in this thread, just about every one of these guys should get cut.

http://www.spotrac.com/top-salaries/nfl/cap-hit/defensive-end/

TheReverend
03-08-2013, 01:08 PM
...Why in Gods name would Heyneck be on anyone's ignore list?

DBroncos4life
03-08-2013, 01:08 PM
What do you disagree with?

Well I don't think it is as cut and dry as they are making it out to be. Also that it is impossible for both sides to reach a deal and the idea that the ONLY reason it's in the media means that the talks are ugly is foolish.

LetsGoBroncos
03-08-2013, 01:09 PM
If they are going straight for the pay cut this is over. Doom is out of here. And good ridance. Get the **** away as you can from a team that paid you pennies for 4 great years to start your career, only to sign you to a contract extension and then want to tear it up while you are still keeping your end of the bargain. I am in the build through the draft strategy. But unless we are keeping the talent we are developing it's for naught. If Doom is gone, and God for bid, Von gets injured, this defense will turn to ****.

I have a good solution I think....if we think these next couple years are our best chance to win a title then just restructure with him right now...don't make him take a pay cut. Push the money back a couple years to give us cap room now and then after this season or next season when he has a high cap number re-evaluate where you are at as a team and either cut him or keep him and pay him then.

BroncoBeavis
03-08-2013, 01:16 PM
...Why in Gods name would Heyneck be on anyone's ignore list?

Not an ass man is all I got.

BroncoBeavis
03-08-2013, 01:19 PM
I have a good solution I think....if we think these next couple years are our best chance to win a title then just restructure with him right now...don't make him take a pay cut. Push the money back a couple years to give us cap room now and then after this season or next season when he has a high cap number re-evaluate where you are at as a team and either cut him or keep him and pay him then.

You have to pony up on the guarantees though. They're not retarded. You don't trade away all your leverage now for a 'maybe' 3 years down the road.

TheReverend
03-08-2013, 01:20 PM
Not an ass man is all I got.

Right? And he doesn't say dumb ****, and isn't over the top on opinions in either direction.

LetsGoBroncos
03-08-2013, 01:33 PM
You have to pony up on the guarantees though. They're not retarded. You don't trade away all your leverage now for a 'maybe' 3 years down the road.

Right, maybe they get him to come a little more their way this year on the guarantees, then more his way the next couple years. At least we get this year out of him.

TonyR
03-08-2013, 01:38 PM
Well I don't think it is as cut and dry as they are making it out to be. Also that it is impossible for both sides to reach a deal and the idea that the ONLY reason it's in the media means that the talks are ugly is foolish.

I don't know, call me a cynic but it doesn't look good. I have very little confidence that Doom ends up a Bronco next season. Hope I'm wrong.

Bacchus
03-08-2013, 01:41 PM
I just don't understand the logic of releasing him and getting zero in return. When we get good players we don't want to pay them? id rather have great players getting their money than a roster full of rookies has beens and what ifs.


I'm starting to believe that when dumervil a contract was made they thought the TV deals would sky rocket the cap 30-50 million

Anyone know what Von or Wolfes production was when Dumervil wasn't on the field?

I don't either but he has to be cut or traded by the 16th I believe. Maybe teams are just waiting for him to be cut.

Bacchus
03-08-2013, 01:44 PM
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WHy would you ignore him? He has a sweet avatar

Requiem
03-08-2013, 01:49 PM
WHy would you ignore him? He has a sweet avatar

Yeah it's from BangBros.

Heyneck
03-08-2013, 02:00 PM
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Ahhhhhhh....
http://media1.break.com/dnet/media/2013/3/1/64f955e7-3102-427e-8a67-d7b604901ea7.gif

jerseyboiler120
03-08-2013, 03:31 PM
Heyneck's avatar is great.

Atwater His Ass
03-08-2013, 04:04 PM
Not really, I really believe that if it came down to it we would release him and save some cheddar. Sure, I would love him to stay but he's expendable.

And then he signs with another team and more than likley, makes more than what he's currently slated. How is that a loss for anyone other than the Broncos?

Cito Pelon
03-08-2013, 04:06 PM
Elway said a week ago, "We're not trying to restructure anybody." In the literal sense, I guess that was true.

Bmore Manning
03-08-2013, 04:10 PM
I may have wanted Revis, but I would not advise outright cutting Doom..

Agamemnon
03-08-2013, 04:20 PM
Are you dooms agent or something? Good Lord dude

You "don't see teams breaking the bank" for a top 10 pass rusher. I don't need to be Doom's agent to think you are an idiot.

Cito Pelon
03-08-2013, 06:52 PM
Elway is starting to feel some heat, IMO. Others may disagree, but if you pay a guy $40 million in two years to QB your team, you better find a way to win a Lombardi. Going one and done the first year of $40 million puts some massive pressure on year two.