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View Full Version : Flacco: Highest paid QB in NFL history


spdirty
03-01-2013, 06:49 PM
LOL 6 years 120 mil

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/9006059/joe-flacco-baltimore-ravens-reach-agreement-according-source

Quoydogs
03-01-2013, 06:58 PM
Hilarious!

ghostofjosh
03-01-2013, 07:01 PM
what a joke..if Rahim Moore tips that ball,nobody is even talking about Flacco..120 million..omfg

schaaf
03-01-2013, 07:12 PM
hahahaha

KipCorrington25
03-01-2013, 07:14 PM
what a joke..if Rahim Moore tips that ball,nobody is even talking about Flacco..120 million..omfg

Flacco really should wire Rahim an agent's cut, what 12%?

SportinOne
03-01-2013, 08:45 PM
That's really something.. truly a game of inches.

Tombstone RJ
03-01-2013, 08:57 PM
This is Flacco's team now. Ravens used to win with defense and Flacco benefitted from that. Now with all this money going into his pocket and the defense getting old, it's going to be interesting to see if the ratbirds can continue the winning. Ray-ray is gone, there's no more "win it all for Ray" to motivate this team.

Orange&BlueMohawk
03-01-2013, 10:24 PM
Flacco is terrible. At least the Ravens will be in the gutter for 6 years. One less team to deal with.

And the Ravens are stupid for paying that.

And now I do this. Hilarious!

RhymesayersDU
03-01-2013, 10:40 PM
Question: Did Joe Flacco just have the greatest contract year of all-time in any sport?

gunns
03-01-2013, 10:44 PM
This is Flacco's team now. Ravens used to win with defense and Flacco benefitted from that. Now with all this money going into his pocket and the defense getting old, it's going to be interesting to see if the ratbirds can continue the winning. Ray-ray is gone, there's no more "win it all for Ray" to motivate this team.

Exactly. I think the Ravens will regret this. I still am not a believer that Flacco is an elite QB. Double OT, Moore and nothing. The best part of the Pats is their offense and the defense took care of that. If we lob Flacco as an elite QB, what does that make Dilfer, Hostetler, or Brad Johnson? You can say yeah but or if or whatever, the defense did it and now the Ravens have put all their money on an illusion.

Houshyamama
03-01-2013, 10:49 PM
Joe "Livin' on a Prayer" Flacco will come back down to Earth. And so will the Ravens. What a horrible move.

extralife
03-01-2013, 11:10 PM
so does this mean Aaron Rodgers gets like 30 million a year when he's up for a new deal?

Taco John
03-01-2013, 11:11 PM
I am not as down on Flacco as everyone else. I think he's got some fine measurables, and he's finally started to grow into them as a pro. But to make him the highest paid player of all time. Wow. That seems excessive.

Broncos4Life
03-01-2013, 11:20 PM
Joe "Livin' on a Prayer" Flacco will come back down to Earth. And so will the Ravens. What a horrible move.

No ****! I can't imagine those prayers getting answered this season. I'm guessing we see a ton of those deep bombs picked off. That Raven offense sure will need some ref help like they got throughout the post season to make another run like that.

ZONA
03-01-2013, 11:36 PM
OMG - talk about over reaction to one nice post season. For real, 1 missed easy tip pass and that's like an 85-90 million dollar deal.

Can't blame the guy for getting the money but you sure can look at that FO and say WTF? Guess that team won't be signing many good FA's for a long time. They better draft like there's no tomorrow.

SouthStndJunkie
03-02-2013, 12:02 AM
Question: Did Joe Flacco just have the greatest contract year of all-time in any sport?

Matt Cassel parlayed the 2008 season in New England into a fat contract.

Dude had basically warmed the bench since he was in high school before that season.

ShutDownPoster
03-02-2013, 12:29 AM
15 mins

RhymesayersDU
03-02-2013, 05:17 AM
Matt Cassel parlayed the 2008 season in New England into a fat contract.

Dude had basically warmed the bench since he was in high school before that season.

Ooooh, yeah that's a great point. Flacco at least had played multiple seasons, been in the playoffs before, etc.

RhymesayersDU
03-02-2013, 05:19 AM
OMG - talk about over reaction to one nice post season. For real, 1 missed easy tip pass and that's like an 85-90 million dollar deal.

Can't blame the guy for getting the money but you sure can look at that FO and say WTF? Guess that team won't be signing many good FA's for a long time. They better draft like there's no tomorrow.

But did they have a choice? After a Super Bowl win do you risk another team grossly overpaying him? We know here that QBs don't just grow on trees.

I think they were ****ed either way.

elsid13
03-02-2013, 06:31 AM
All about timing. But what were the Ratbirds going to do, there was no way they could let the Super Bowl winning QB walk without a "Steve Young" back-up in wings.

rbackfactory80
03-02-2013, 07:37 AM
So we are paying the same thing without the result. Get some glasses bros, dude played a hell of a postseason and gave the Ravens their 2nd Superbowl tying them with a team who we all know pretty well.

Bacchus
03-02-2013, 08:05 AM
But did they have a choice? After a Super Bowl win do you risk another team grossly overpaying him? We know here that QBs don't just grow on trees.

I think they were ****ed either way.

I think you hit it on the head right there. They had no other choice. They have no back-up there are no FA QBs and the draft sucks. Flacco was playing himself out of a big contract all year last season. But he threw 11 TDs and 0 ints in the playoffs. No the Ravens have to hope the QB they saw in the playoffs is the one they get for the next 6 years.

Bacchus
03-02-2013, 08:06 AM
But did they have a choice? After a Super Bowl win do you risk another team grossly overpaying him? We know here that QBs don't just grow on trees.

I think they were ****ed either way.

I think you hit it on the head right there. They had no other choice. They have no back-up there are no FA QBs and the draft sucks. Flacco was playing himself out of a big contract all year last season. But he threw 11 TDs and 0 ints in the playoffs. No the Ravens have to hope the QB they saw in the playoffs is the one they get for the next 6 years.

Gutless Drunk
03-02-2013, 08:17 AM
Most of their big plays in the playoffs were "huck it up & hope" type plays. 50/50 balls where either the receiver made a good play or the DB is a ****ing dumb ass.

I guess they can hope that 4 game luck holds up & he is not what everyone saw over 16 games.

BroncoInSkinland
03-02-2013, 08:35 AM
Question: Did Joe Flacco just have the greatest contract year of all-time in any sport?

I don't know if I would say he had the best athletic performance in a contract year, but the other factors that went along with it made it a very favorable contract year. The Ravens are losing the face of thier franchise this year, along with two other possible hall of fame players. The team is in a state of transition coming off a super win. There is a lot of pressure on the management to maintain whatever stability they can on the roster. Add in the MVP and you have the perfect storm for the kind of money Flacco was able to demand.

That having been said, and while I don't think Flacco is good enough to justify that kind of money, this is not a contract based off a single game, or years performance. What I wonder is how much money the Broncos would be willing to spend on a 28 year old quarterback who has won a playoff game in every one of the 5 seasons since he started in the league as a rookie, won a superbowl, and is a career 9-4 in post season play.

Dedhed
03-02-2013, 08:43 AM
So we are paying the same thing without the result. Get some glasses bros, dude played a hell of a postseason and gave the Ravens their 2nd Superbowl tying them with a team who we all know pretty well.

He's been better in the playoffs than most QBs, and certainly better than ours. This thread should just be titled "Flacco most recent top-tier QB to sign a contract". The hyperbole is laughable.

LRtagger
03-02-2013, 09:02 AM
LOL they won't make the playoffs next year

spdirty
03-02-2013, 09:11 AM
They could have tagged him, and made him prove it over another season.

Drunken.Broncoholic
03-02-2013, 09:18 AM
I think Mark Sanchez has a winning postseason record.. And is tied for most road playoff wins ever. Does that mean he should get big money too?

DBroncos4life
03-02-2013, 09:24 AM
So we are paying the same thing without the result. Get some glasses bros, dude played a hell of a postseason and gave the Ravens their 2nd Superbowl tying them with a team who we all know pretty well.

Look at you hating on our QB. Last year must have sucked for you ramble ramble. You have a unhealthy hatred for our QB.

RhymesayersDU
03-02-2013, 09:25 AM
I think Mark Sanchez has a winning postseason record.. And is tied for most road playoff wins ever. Does that mean he should get big money too?

If he wins a Super Bowl he does/will get that money.

rbackfactory80
03-02-2013, 09:46 AM
Look at you hating on our QB. Last year must have sucked for you ramble ramble. You have a unhealthy hatred for our QB.

Hard for you to call a spade a spade bro. Peyton Manning sucks in the playoffs, that is a fact. Not even disputable at this point. Enjoy the meaningless regular season wins though. Unfortunately, they don't do a damn thing for me.

Hopefully we won't be experiencing deja vu this time next year.

Br0nc0Buster
03-02-2013, 09:47 AM
Flacco is not worth that kind of coin, but I get it
Superbowl MVP, still young, has made the playoffs every year he has been in the league

It was a move they had to make

Br0nc0Buster
03-02-2013, 09:49 AM
Look at you hating on our QB. Last year must have sucked for you ramble ramble. You have a unhealthy hatred for our QB.

I like it when the guys who hitched their wagon to Tebow talk **** on other qbs

Their bitterness is amusing

Drunken.Broncoholic
03-02-2013, 09:53 AM
If he wins a Super Bowl he does/will get that money.

Really? Brad Johnson didnt get the money. If they win a SB they do it in spite of Sanchez. Not because of him.

Drunken.Broncoholic
03-02-2013, 09:54 AM
Hard for you to call a spade a spade bro. Peyton Manning sucks in the playoffs, that is a fact. Not even disputable at this point. Enjoy the meaningless regular season wins though. Unfortunately, they don't do a damn thing for me.

Hopefully we won't be experiencing deja vu this time next year.

"We"?

You really talk like a broncos fan.

TheChamp24
03-02-2013, 11:01 AM
Flacco performed like an above average QB, I'd say top 15 for sure, maybe borderline top 10. Right there, that doesn't deserve $20 mil a year. Honestly, like $12-$15 mil a year at best.
He played very well in the playoffs, extraordinarily well, earned Super Bowl MVP. He basically had the Ravens by the balls, they couldn't let him go, the fan base would be in an uproar, the team wouldn't like it at all.
So he gets paid. This upcoming year, the Ravens are losing their defensive leader in Ray Lewis, and possibly Ed Reed. Those guys might have been declining, but they still had some game and leadership.

peacepipe
03-02-2013, 11:14 AM
Flacco performed like an above average QB, I'd say top 15 for sure, maybe borderline top 10. Right there, that doesn't deserve $20 mil a year. Honestly, like $12-$15 mil a year at best.
He played very well in the playoffs, extraordinarily well, earned Super Bowl MVP. He basically had the Ravens by the balls, they couldn't let him go, the fan base would be in an uproar, the team wouldn't like it at all.
So he gets paid. This upcoming year, the Ravens are losing their defensive leader in Ray Lewis, and possibly Ed Reed. Those guys might have been declining, but they still had some game and leadership.

Who takes 12-15,when they can get $20 million. I know you wouldn't. Don't get me wrong,I don't think he's a 20 mil a yr QB either,but can't hate on him for getting paid like one. Flacco had the leverage & he used it,any one of us would've used it.

RhymesayersDU
03-02-2013, 11:18 AM
Really? Brad Johnson didnt get the money. If they win a SB they do it in spite of Sanchez. Not because of him.

Believe me, I'm not saying it's right. But he'd get paid.

spdirty
03-02-2013, 12:34 PM
Hard for you to call a spade a spade bro. Peyton Manning sucks in the playoffs, that is a fact. Not even disputable at this point. Enjoy the meaningless regular season wins though. Unfortunately, they don't do a damn thing for me.

Hopefully we won't be experiencing deja vu this time next year.

Yeah, I guess it was a mistake to bring in Manning. We should just cut him, bring back Tebow, and enjoy the 9-9 years where we're actually a 5-11 team but can expect to continue to get an insane amount of luck in games and the division we play in to make the playoffs and just get absolutely destroyed by the true contenders.

I guess you would take that bull**** over having a true contender giving the team the best possible chance in the playoffs.

Again, if Rahim Moore does is job on that one play, Manning probably has 2 rings and Flacco none and Flacco isn't the highest paid quarterback in NFL history.

go_broncos
03-02-2013, 02:06 PM
Thank you Rahim Moore for screwing Broncos.
You made me lose interest in football.

TonyR
03-02-2013, 02:19 PM
Peyton Manning sucks in the playoffs, that is a fact. Not even disputable at this point.

Some educational reading for you linked below. The "sucks in the playoffs" thing is crap and this article explains it in detail.

http://www.coldhardfootballfacts.com/content/peyton-mannings-9-11-playoff-record-is-call-for-help/20867/

TonyR
03-02-2013, 02:25 PM
He's been better in the playoffs than most QBs, and certainly better than ours. This thread should just be titled "Flacco most recent top-tier QB to sign a contract". The hyperbole is laughable.

Yup, he played well in the playoffs. Have to give him that. But the guy was extremely mediocre, or worse, most of the year. He was 25th in QBR, and 12th in passer rating, in the regular season. He got hot and had a nice run in the playoffs. I'm not sure that's the kind of guy you want to give the NFL's largest contract. But, I understand why the Ravens did it. I just think it may come back to bite them in the ass some day.


http://espn.go.com/nfl/qbr/_/stats/expanded

http://espn.go.com/nfl/statistics/player/_/stat/passing/sort/quarterbackRating/year/2012/seasontype/2

Tombstone RJ
03-02-2013, 02:57 PM
I really hope this contract hamstrings the ratbirds.

Drunken.Broncoholic
03-02-2013, 02:58 PM
I really hope this contract hamstrings the ratbirds.

Will be interesting to see how they approach Ellerbe now

Tombstone RJ
03-02-2013, 03:00 PM
Ozzie knows how to draft, and draft defense. I'm betting he will be taking a MLB in this coming draft. I soooo want the Broncos to take a MLB but they probably won't. The Ratbirds will, the Broncos won't. Just watch.

Drunken.Broncoholic
03-02-2013, 03:08 PM
Ozzie knows how to draft, and draft defense. I'm betting he will be taking a MLB in this coming draft. I soooo want the Broncos to take a MLB but they probably won't. The Ratbirds will, the Broncos won't. Just watch.

I would love them taking one in the draft while the broncos swoop up Ellerbe. That ain't happenin though

Bacchus
03-02-2013, 04:22 PM
Thank you Rahim Moore for screwing Broncos.
You made me lose interest in football.

good....l e a v e

TD4HOF
03-02-2013, 04:28 PM
So that makes it a, what, $50 million dollar pass over Moore's head? Unbelievable.

It'll be interesting to see where the Broncos go from here. Either the pall will extend for years, a la my Mets of '06, '07 or they'll pull a '97 and double up.

rbackfactory80
03-02-2013, 06:05 PM
Some educational reading for you linked below. The "sucks in the playoffs" thing is crap and this article explains it in detail.

http://www.coldhardfootballfacts.com/content/peyton-mannings-9-11-playoff-record-is-call-for-help/20867/

Blah blah blah. To bad he can't make it happen when it counts. He had so many chance against Baltimore. He wanted no part of it. Keep looking at stats without watching the games though.

DBroncos4life
03-02-2013, 06:07 PM
Blah blah blah. To bad he can't make it happen when it counts. He had so many chance against Baltimore. He wanted no part of it. Keep looking at stats without watching the games though.

Ha!

Drunken.Broncoholic
03-02-2013, 07:06 PM
Blah blah blah. To bad he can't make it happen when it counts. He had so many chance against Baltimore. He wanted no part of it. Keep looking at stats without watching the games though.

If you had WATCHED the game as a broncos fan, instead of being bitter about tebow, you'd realize Manning led a 4th quarter 10 play 88 yard TD drive taking the lead. then Adams defending a 4th down batted pass from flacco, all but securing the win. How exactly is it Mannings fault that winning sequence of events didnt end in a win? Ask Rahim Moore and a coach playing regular season percentages.

spdirty
03-02-2013, 07:17 PM
If you had WATCHED the game as a broncos fan, instead of being bitter about tebow, you'd realize Manning led a 4th quarter 10 play 88 yard TD drive taking the lead. then Adams defending a 4th down batted pass from flacco, all but securing the win. How exactly is it Mannings fault that winning sequence of events didnt end in a win? Ask Rahim Moore and a coach playing regular season percentages.

Yeah none of em want to talk about what should have been the game winning drive. Or the people that really screwed the team that day. It's just shut up about rahim cuz manning sucks in the playoffs.

Agamemnon
03-02-2013, 07:36 PM
If you had WATCHED the game as a broncos fan, instead of being bitter about tebow, you'd realize Manning led a 4th quarter 10 play 88 yard TD drive taking the lead. then Adams defending a 4th down batted pass from flacco, all but securing the win. How exactly is it Mannings fault that winning sequence of events didnt end in a win? Ask Rahim Moore and a coach playing regular season percentages.

All good points. At the same time Manning had the ball multiple times in OT and ultimately only managed to turn it over and lose the game. There's plenty of blame to go around, and some of it is definitely on Manning.

spdirty
03-02-2013, 07:40 PM
All good points. At the same time Manning had the ball multiple times in OT and ultimately only managed to turn it over and lose the game. There's plenty of blame to go around, and some of it is definitely on Manning.

Well that settles it. We should just cut Manning now since he's obviously the Marty schottenheimer of quarterbacks right?

Agamemnon
03-02-2013, 07:46 PM
Well that settles it. We should just cut Manning now since he's obviously the Marty schottenheimer of quarterbacks right?

Yes that's precisely my point. I'm not simply pointing out that Manning was a part of why we lost. No I'm saying we should cut him and make Caleb Hanie our starter. ::)

spdirty
03-02-2013, 08:01 PM
Yes that's precisely my point. I'm not simply pointing out that Manning was a part of why we lost. No I'm saying we should cut him and make Caleb Hanie our starter. ::)

Yeah well, manning sucks in the playoffs and won't win us a super bowl, so time to move on right?

Drunken.Broncoholic
03-02-2013, 08:50 PM
All good points. At the same time Manning had the ball multiple times in OT and ultimately only managed to turn it over and lose the game. There's plenty of blame to go around, and some of it is definitely on Manning.

You are right OT was a bit of a different story. But OT should've never existed and manning did his job in the 4th to prevent a loss or OT. He just looked spent and tired in that OT. Certainly can question his int throw.

TomServo
03-03-2013, 12:54 AM
is al davis in charge of the ravens? if chucking the ball up and hoping works...god bless flacco

rbackfactory80
03-03-2013, 05:47 AM
If you had WATCHED the game as a broncos fan, instead of being bitter about tebow, you'd realize Manning led a 4th quarter 10 play 88 yard TD drive taking the lead. then Adams defending a 4th down batted pass from flacco, all but securing the win. How exactly is it Mannings fault that winning sequence of events didnt end in a win? Ask Rahim Moore and a coach playing regular season percentages.

Dude I have been a Broncos fan forever. Never been a Manning fan though. Just cause they wear Orange doesn't mean I like them. I am tired and frustrated and Manning isn't the only player on Denver I'm not into.


FWIW I didn't think he played a bad game until we couldn't score in OT.

broncobum6162
03-03-2013, 06:18 AM
LOL 6 years 120 mil

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/9006059/joe-flacco-baltimore-ravens-reach-agreement-according-source

The jocularity and ridiculousness that is today's NFL.....Good luck w/ that Ratbirds. We'll see how you feel about that in about 2 yrs..
:wiggle:

Tombstone RJ
03-03-2013, 07:59 AM
Dude I have been a Broncos fan forever. Never been a Manning fan though. Just cause they wear Orange doesn't mean I like them. I am tired and frustrated and Manning isn't the only player on Denver I'm not into.


FWIW I didn't think he played a bad game until we couldn't score in OT.

translation: "I have been a big Broncos fan since 1998!"

Dedhed
03-03-2013, 08:02 AM
Yeah well, manning sucks in the playoffs and won't win us a super bowl, so time to move on right?

umm....you already said that.

Dedhed
03-03-2013, 08:40 AM
The jocularity and ridiculousness that is today's NFL.....Good luck w/ that Ratbirds. We'll see how you feel about that in about 2 yrs..
:wiggle:

Are they gonna feel worse than we do in two years if Manning can't deliver? We're paying $40M guaranteed.

Gutless Drunk
03-03-2013, 08:48 AM
Flacco really should wire Rahim an agent's cut, what 12%?

I wonder what Bill Vinovich's cut should be?

Drunken.Broncoholic
03-03-2013, 09:17 AM
Dude I have been a Broncos fan forever. Never been a Manning fan though. Just cause they wear Orange doesn't mean I like them. I am tired and frustrated and Manning isn't the only player on Denver I'm not into.


FWIW I didn't think he played a bad game until we couldn't score in OT.

I wasn't bashing you for hating manning just don't understand how any bronco game can be rendered meaningless. It definetly hard to love every single player or coach on the team. Thats rare. I didnt like tebow and those regular season games were ugly but I never thought they were meaningless

rbackfactory80
03-03-2013, 09:24 AM
translation: "I have been a big Broncos fan since 1998!"

F no, way before that. Can't be certain though. My dad went away on business to Denver right around 1990 and brought me home gear. Fan ever since then.

Tombstone RJ
03-03-2013, 09:49 AM
the loss was a bitter pill to swallow for sure, but I'm confident that the Broncos will be back in the playoffs this coming season. I also am confident they will be better...

Agamemnon
03-03-2013, 11:59 AM
You are right OT was a bit of a different story. But OT should've never existed and manning did his job in the 4th to prevent a loss or OT. He just looked spent and tired in that OT. Certainly can question his int throw.

And they probably don't even get to OT without Trindon Holiday. Manning and the offense only managed 21 points.

Punisher
03-03-2013, 12:26 PM
Flacco is terrible. At least the Ravens will be in the gutter for 6 years. One less team to deal with.

And the Ravens are stupid for paying that.

And now I do this. Hilarious!

http://cdn.cinemagr.am/cine_1/14898190.gif

Bacchus
03-03-2013, 12:26 PM
Well that settles it. We should just cut Manning now since he's obviously the Marty schottenheimer of quarterbacks right?

Well, besides the fact that Manning has been to two superbowls and won one yes they are the same:spit::spit:

Jekyll15Hyde
03-03-2013, 09:54 PM
My best friend is a Bmore fan and after we beat them in the regular season, he was telling me that the consensus out there was that a minimum that they needed to bring in a veteran QB to challenge him and many were already writing him off altogether and ready to be done with him.

I honestly think that if Moore doesnt have the Buckner moment, something near the above happens. And if they do resign him, you are talking about 2-3 years, at 5M per. That makes the Moore play an 8-figure swing.

KCStud
03-03-2013, 10:35 PM
Manning is fortunate he got to play against the weakest SB QB in NFL history.

That's the only reason he won a SB.

SlyEli
03-03-2013, 10:44 PM
And they probably don't even get to OT without Trindon Holiday. Manning and the offense only managed 21 points.

But that's two few drives the offense had to score points...if anything it could be argued that holliday's points hurt the offense because it never allowed them to get into consistent rhythm

COWheatGrower
03-04-2013, 02:21 AM
The sour grapes in this thread is ridiculous.

Flacco had 11 TD to 0 INT in the postseason. Five years in the league, Flacco has at least one postseason win in each of those five seasons. He is tied with Peyton Manning with nine career postseason wins. So he isn't a one-hit wonder. What more do you want?

Nevermind, Flacco made a big league throw on that heave to Jacoby Jones. That's the reason why that play was made in the first place ---- very few QBs can make that kind of throw and Rahim Moore underestimated him.

COWheatGrower
03-04-2013, 02:29 AM
On top of that, six of Flacco's nine playoff wins are on the road! He's earned that check if you ask me.

COWheatGrower
03-04-2013, 02:39 AM
Just to put Flacco's six road playoff wins into context, the Denver Broncos have three road playoff wins in franchise history.

eddie mac
03-04-2013, 03:58 AM
$6.8m cap hit in 2013 so they're gonna be able to bring back Reed, Ellerbe and maybe even Kruger.

Beantown Bronco
03-04-2013, 06:22 AM
$6.8m cap hit in 2013 so they're gonna be able to bring back Reed, Ellerbe and maybe even Kruger.

Pretty amazing mathematical gymnastics they must've gone through there. $20 mil a year on average and only counts $6.8 in the first year.....unreal. That contract isn't going to be so much fun when he's counting $30 mil against the cap next year or the year after.

BroncoInferno
03-04-2013, 06:27 AM
Pretty amazing mathematical gymnastics they must've gone through there. $20 mil a year on average and only counts $6.8 in the first year.....unreal. That contract isn't going to be so much fun when he's counting $30 mil against the cap next year or the year after.

They'll just re-write the deal when the big cap-numbers come due:

The cap numbers in the first two years of the deal are approximately $6.8 million and $14.8 million, which should allow the Ravens to keep a player or two they really want to keep, such as wideout Anquan Boldin and left tackle Bryant McKinnie. I think defensive end Paul Kruger, a free agent, will get big money somewhere and won't return. I think it's looking more and more likely that the free-agent inside linebacker the team would like to keep, Dannell Ellerbe, will get a bigger offer elsewhere than the Ravens would be willing to pay. If so, he'll likely leave too.

• Baltimore will likely have to re-do the six-year Flacco contract after year three. Approximate cap number in year four: $29 million. With the cap estimated roughly to be about $130 million in that season, 2016, it's highly unlikely the Ravens would devote 22 percent of their cap to the quarterback.

Read More: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/nfl/news/20130304/joe-flacco-tom-brady-peter-king-monday-morning-quarterback/#ixzz2Ma8Js9aU

LetsGoBroncos
03-04-2013, 06:47 AM
They'll just re-write the deal when the big cap-numbers come due:



Read More: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/nfl/news/20130304/joe-flacco-tom-brady-peter-king-monday-morning-quarterback/#ixzz2Ma8Js9aU

I don't get it. So all you have to do now is give a player a crazy amount of money, make it where the first couple years don't count much against the cap, then re-do the deal a few years into it and make it cap friendly again? There are no consequences for giving someone a TON of money?

Beantown Bronco
03-04-2013, 06:48 AM
They'll just re-write the deal when the big cap-numbers come due:



Read More: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/nfl/news/20130304/joe-flacco-tom-brady-peter-king-monday-morning-quarterback/#ixzz2Ma8Js9aU

They can try all they want, but eventually it's got to bite them because he's guaranteed $62 mil over the first three years. I notice they give his cap hit for years one and two and say that they're re-write AFTER year three.....but what about year three itself? I'm sure he'll be willing to re-write, but he's not going to re-write for less than his guarantees.

Tombstone RJ
03-04-2013, 07:58 AM
I don't get it. So all you have to do now is give a player a crazy amount of money, make it where the first couple years don't count much against the cap, then re-do the deal a few years into it and make it cap friendly again? There are no consequences for giving someone a TON of money?

The first three years are guaranteed, as Beantown points out in the above post. That averages out to $20m per year. After the 3rd year the contract can be re-negotiated.

LetsGoBroncos
03-04-2013, 08:04 AM
The first three years are guaranteed, as Beantown points out in the above post. That averages out to $20m per year. After the 3rd year the contract can be re-negotiated.

I understand that. I'm saying people (Peter King for example) are acting like the Ravens structured the contract so that there isn't a huge cap hit these first couple years, and then when there will be a huge cap hit in a few years they will just re-negotiate. I'm saying if that is true it is a stupid system to be able to give a guy $100 million but never have it hurt your salary cap.

Tombstone RJ
03-04-2013, 08:10 AM
I understand that. I'm saying people (Peter King for example) are acting like the Ravens structured the contract so that there isn't a huge cap hit these first couple years, and then when there will be a huge cap hit in a few years they will just re-negotiate. I'm saying if that is true it is a stupid system to be able to give a guy $100 million but never have it hurt your salary cap.

I think the way the Ravens front office is trying to structure things is so that they can basically keep the team together for another run in the playoffs, hence the $6.8m cap hit this coming season. However, they are basically just pushing the big cap hit down the road and it will strangle them the third year and they cannot re-negotiate it then. They will absolutely have a huge cap hit, $30m+ for Flacco and they will have to pay it. It's only after the 3rd year and all of the guaranteed money is paid out ($62m) that they can open up a re-negotiation. At that time Flacco can tell them no and then baltimore will have to release him which might cause another cap hit/payment to occure.

Drunken.Broncoholic
03-04-2013, 08:11 AM
Just to put Flacco's six road playoff wins into context, the Denver Broncos have three road playoff wins in franchise history.

Mark Sanchez has four. Kind of waters down this point.

DBroncos4life
03-04-2013, 08:13 AM
I understand that. I'm saying people (Peter King for example) are acting like the Ravens structured the contract so that there isn't a huge cap hit these first couple years, and then when there will be a huge cap hit in a few years they will just re-negotiate. I'm saying if that is true it is a stupid system to be able to give a guy $100 million but never have it hurt your salary cap.

That is how agents get clients.

Year Base Salary Sign Bonus Misc. Bonus Cap Hit
2013 1,000,000 5,800,000 00000000 6,800,000
2014 6,000,000 5,800,000 4,750,000 16,550,000
2015 4,000,000 5,800,000 4,750,000 14,550,000

These three years will be renegotiated:
2016 18,200,000 5,800,000 4,750,000 28,750,000
2017 20,600,000 5,800,000 4,750,000 31,150,000
2018 20,000,000 00000000 4,750,000 24,750,000

BroncoBeavis
03-04-2013, 08:32 AM
Mark Sanchez has four. Kind of waters down this point.

Yeah when you think about it, great regular season teams don't tend to play tons of road playoff games.

TonyR
03-04-2013, 08:41 AM
They can try all they want, but eventually it's got to bite them...

Yup, it's like taking out a loan to pay off a loan. Eventually you have to pay the bill, it doesn't just vanish. You can only kick the can down the road so far.

TonyR
03-04-2013, 08:45 AM
The sour grapes in this thread is ridiculous.

Flacco had 11 TD to 0 INT in the postseason. Five years in the league, Flacco has at least one postseason win in each of those five seasons. He is tied with Peyton Manning with nine career postseason wins. So he isn't a one-hit wonder. What more do you want?

Nevermind, Flacco made a big league throw on that heave to Jacoby Jones. That's the reason why that play was made in the first place ---- very few QBs can make that kind of throw and Rahim Moore underestimated him.

Flacco has a great arm, always has. And you have to give the guy credit for how well he's played in the postseason. The problem is he's been very inconsistent, and sometimes just not very good, in the regular season. He played poorly quite a few times this past season. The Ravens barely made the playoffs. If you don't make the playoffs you can't win in them. We'll see if his performance this past postseason carries over into next season. Chances are he reverts back to something closer to the way he's played the last couple of regular seasons. And we'll find out if that's good enough.

FearLanier
03-04-2013, 08:57 AM
Aaron Rodgers has got to be smiling up in Green Bay. His contract is up next year and he's going to get so much money after this Flacco deal.

TonyR
03-04-2013, 09:01 AM
Manning is fortunate he got to play against the weakest SB QB in NFL history.

That's the only reason he won a SB.

The only reason? So getting there didn't have anything to do with it?

Also, you're not going to counterbalance your lame argument with the fact that his peak years were up against the Patriots during the heights of the Brady/Pats dynasty? It's almost comparable to every great player who "failed" during the Jordan/Bulls dynasty.

Tombstone RJ
03-04-2013, 09:07 AM
Aaron Rodgers has got to be smiling up in Green Bay. His contract is up next year and he's going to get so much money after this Flacco deal.

Yep, Flacco is now Rodgers' bff.

ludo21
03-04-2013, 10:03 AM
flacco earned it, but no way is he deserving of this much money....ouch Ravens paying out the rear for this SB.

Imagine if Moore just did his job.... flacco better pay that man

Dedhed
03-04-2013, 11:15 AM
Mark Sanchez has four. Kind of waters down this point.
And no SB. Kind of an important piece of the story.

eddie mac
03-04-2013, 11:42 AM
Never, ever pay attention to the total contract worth cos no-one else does. It's all about the guaranteed money these days and the majority of teams couldn't give a **** about the cap cos it's all a cash business now and the cap can be reworked to however a team likes.

Much like Denver and other teams, the New England Patriots have announced that they will only spend cash to cap this year, hence the major Brady pay reduction.

Flacco's real deal is basically 3 years $52m as $10m of his year 3 money isn't guaranteed and will likely be renegotiated at that point.

Beantown Bronco
03-04-2013, 11:58 AM
Flacco's real deal is basically 3 years $52m as $10m of his year 3 money isn't guaranteed and will likely be renegotiated at that point.

They're going to re-negotiate a 6 year deal after 2 years? That would have to be a record.

Dedhed
03-04-2013, 12:06 PM
Flacco has a great arm, always has. And you have to give the guy credit for how well he's played in the postseason. The problem is he's been very inconsistent, and sometimes just not very good, in the regular season. He played poorly quite a few times this past season. The Ravens barely made the playoffs. If you don't make the playoffs you can't win in them. We'll see if his performance this past postseason carries over into next season. Chances are he reverts back to something closer to the way he's played the last couple of regular seasons. And we'll find out if that's good enough.

I'd give up a few regular season wins for clutch in the playoffs and a Title every single year. You can cite regular season "inconsistencies" all you want, but it amounts to nothing but hyperbole and sour grapes.

Players are paid retroactively all the time in the NFL, and Flacco went out and got it done in a contract year and earned the contract he signed.

Bigdawg26
03-04-2013, 12:31 PM
flacco earned it, but no way is he deserving of this much money....ouch Ravens paying out the rear for this SB.

Imagine if Moore just did his job.... flacco better pay that man

So true! Or at least a thank you card!

TonyR
03-04-2013, 12:35 PM
...and Flacco went out and got it done in a contract year and earned the contract he signed.

Nobody will disagree with what Flacco did in the playoffs. But anyone who followed Baltimore football more closely knows that there was a lot of discussion during the regular season about what the long term solution was going to be at QB. There was a lot of doubt about Flacco and a lot of people were done with him. Do you recall how awful he was against the Broncos in the regular season game? He played extremely well in the postseason, but his defense (really stepped it up in the playoffs), WRs (they went up and got a lot of balls, particularly Boldin), and OL (remember the Broncos, who led the league in sacks, couldn't touch him) gave him a lot of solid support. Again, let's see what he does this coming year before we crown him.

BroncoInferno
03-04-2013, 12:45 PM
I'd give up a few regular season wins for clutch in the playoffs and a Title every single year.

Yeah, but until this season, Flacco had "won" in the playoffs in the same manner that Sanchez had....by riding the coattails of his teammates. He wasn't clutch in the playoffs until this season. That's not "sour grapes," it's simply a fact. Does one (admittedly) epic playoff run following a mediocre (borderline bad, really) regular season mean you deserve to be the highest paid player in NFL history? I don't think it does. You look at the total body of work, and it's not impressive. If Moore doesn't spazz out and properly defend the pass to Jones, the Ravens probably give Flacco the non-exlusive tag (~$14 million) and buy themselves a year before they have to make a long-term decision on him. You can't deny that luck played a factor here. If Flacco is able to continue his 2013 postseason play into next season and beyond, then it will prove worth it. But it's reasonable to question whether or not he can play that way consistently over the course of an entire season. He never has before.

Dedhed
03-04-2013, 01:27 PM
Nobody will disagree with what Flacco did in the playoffs. But anyone who followed Baltimore football more closely knows that there was a lot of discussion during the regular season about what the long term solution was going to be at QB. There was a lot of doubt about Flacco and a lot of people were done with him. Do you recall how awful he was against the Broncos in the regular season game? He played extremely well in the postseason, but his defense (really stepped it up in the playoffs), WRs (they went up and got a lot of balls, particularly Boldin), and OL (remember the Broncos, who led the league in sacks, couldn't touch him) gave him a lot of solid support. Again, let's see what he does this coming year before we crown him.
Fickle fans and past tense quibbling. Idiot fans are idiots, that's why the aren't coaches and GM's. Fan opinion and sports radio are driven by hyperbole. The defense in Baltimore was not the reason they have the Title in their hands. Flacco outplayed every QB he faced in the playoffs.

You can wait to crown him all you want, but it ,makes no difference; he's already been crowned. The opinion of fans who's teams Flacco tore apart on his way to a title is irrelevant.

Arkie
03-04-2013, 05:21 PM
Imagine how much money Flacco would make if he was a top 10 QB in any category besides sacks.

Tombstone RJ
03-04-2013, 05:33 PM
Fickle fans and past tense quibbling. Idiot fans are idiots, that's why the aren't coaches and GM's. Fan opinion and sports radio are driven by hyperbole. The defense in Baltimore was not the reason they have the Title in their hands. Flacco outplayed every QB he faced in the playoffs.

You can wait to crown him all you want, but it ,makes no difference; he's already been crowned. The opinion of fans who's teams Flacco tore apart on his way to a title is irrelevant.

Flacco had a nice run for sure, but the defense did step up too. And, as everyone has already pointed out, Rahim Moore certainly deserves a nice little slice of the Flacco pie as well.

TonyR
03-04-2013, 05:36 PM
Fan opinion and sports radio are driven by hyperbole.

Flacco's general mediocrity isn't remotely "hyperbole". Take a look at his stats the last few years. And there are hundreds of article on this topic. Here's a very good, short one you can educate yourself with, for example:

http://www.grantland.com/story/_/id/8434708/the-numbers-never-lie-ravens-fueled-their-defense

Bigdawg26
03-04-2013, 05:42 PM
I will say one thing about this contract is that it gets rid of one super bowl contender we have to worry about. The ravens paid a mediocre quarterback the highest QB contract which allowed them not to sign key free agents along with down the road his high cap number will affect them signing other free agents. For this, I would like to thank Rahim Moore for thinking long-term!

Drunken.Broncoholic
03-04-2013, 05:47 PM
I don't think many are questioning Flaccos late season run. I give some credit in Baltimore letting go of Cam. Flacco performed great this postseason. In the previous years that defense was the reason they were in postseasons, while flacco and the offense was the reason they couldn't get the ring. What's up for debate is that is one season enough to warrant most money ever? People say athletes perform the best in contract years. Kinda tells you what's most important for them

WolfpackGuy
03-04-2013, 05:50 PM
He's alright, but not worth 120 large.

Cito Pelon
03-04-2013, 05:52 PM
Flacco's general mediocrity isn't remotely "hyperbole". Take a look at his stats the last few years. And there are hundreds of article on this topic. Here's a very good, short one you can educate yourself with, for example:

http://www.grantland.com/story/_/id/8434708/the-numbers-never-lie-ravens-fueled-their-defense

The only defense I have for this deal is Flacco may have been average across all passing categories, but he's consistent and durable. No big highs or lows, just consistently average, and has started every single game since day one.

The big deal this postseason is Anquan Boldin finally made the catches they expected when they traded for him. Boldin pulled in the passes finally, and that made a lot of the wins this postseason.

rbackfactory80
03-04-2013, 06:17 PM
Flacco seems to up his game in the playoffs, much like Eli. Anyone who plays better in the playoffs is a QB you want on your team.

Oh, and the jealousy in this thread is unbelievable. Guy got it done and deserves props. So what he played like **** in the regular season. Just say to yourself--Indy->Denver->N.E.->S.F.

Helluva run!

Drunken.Broncoholic
03-04-2013, 06:46 PM
Flacco seems to up his game in the playoffs, much like Eli. Anyone who plays better in the playoffs is a QB you want on your team.

Oh, and the jealousy in this thread is unbelievable. Guy got it done and deserves props. So what he played like **** in the regular season. Just say to yourself--Indy->Denver->N.E.->S.F.

Helluva run!

Jealousy? I don't see any post in here that screams jealousy. But yours seem to be saturated in hatred/jealousy of a QB who kicked your hero out of town.

I checked out his playoff stats for his career and he's got some stinkers in there as well. Ain't all pristine. Against the steelers in 2010 he managed 125 yards. Houston in 2011 he was only 14-27 176 yards. 2009 against Indy his QB rating was only 48! In 2008, granted a rookie he was putting up QB ratings of 59 and 18.2.

GTFO saying he's been incredible in playoffs. That defense won alot of his games.

DBroncos4life
03-04-2013, 06:48 PM
Jealousy? I don't see any post in here that screams jealousy. But yours seem to be saturated in hatred/jealousy of a QB who kicked your hero out of town.

This.

COWheatGrower
03-04-2013, 08:22 PM
He's alright, but not worth 120 large.

If Albert Pujols, Prince Fielder and Joey Votto are making $200 million-plus in baseball, a $120 million contract for a Super Bowl-winning quarterback seems like a pretty good deal to me.

Is there a position in sports that means more to team success than what a quarterback does? One could argue a dominant player in the NBA, but other than that, nothing comes close.

COWheatGrower
03-04-2013, 08:27 PM
Flacco has a great arm, always has. And you have to give the guy credit for how well he's played in the postseason. The problem is he's been very inconsistent, and sometimes just not very good, in the regular season. He played poorly quite a few times this past season. The Ravens barely made the playoffs. If you don't make the playoffs you can't win in them. We'll see if his performance this past postseason carries over into next season. Chances are he reverts back to something closer to the way he's played the last couple of regular seasons. And we'll find out if that's good enough.

He has a 54-26 career regular season QB record. He has never done worse than 9-7. That seems pretty consistent to me.

His numbers won't knock one's socks off, but he has never thrown more than 12 interceptions in a season and he has 20+ plus touchdowns in four straight years.

COWheatGrower
03-04-2013, 08:35 PM
Yeah when you think about it, great regular season teams don't tend to play tons of road playoff games.

How many quarterbacks in NFL history have won a playoff game in each of their first five seasons?

The Ravens are the only NFL franchise that have made the playoffs in each of the last five seasons. They have two 12-win and one 11-win within that time span. They're not exactly chopped liver in the regular season.

Bacchus
03-04-2013, 09:05 PM
Flacco's general mediocrity isn't remotely "hyperbole". Take a look at his stats the last few years. And there are hundreds of article on this topic. Here's a very good, short one you can educate yourself with, for example:

http://www.grantland.com/story/_/id/8434708/the-numbers-never-lie-ravens-fueled-their-defense

The Ravens overpaid, but they did get a Superbowl ring which are very hard to get. They had no option, they had no back-up plan. They do not have a QB behind him, there are not any FA QBs better than him and the draft sucks. Their plan this whole year was to resign him. They were hoping his poor play would reduce their cost but then he wound up winning him a SB. So I imagine no one in Baltimore is too upset about the contract. They got their ring now all they can do is hope that he keeps it up.

Jekyll15Hyde
03-04-2013, 09:27 PM
Nobody will disagree with what Flacco did in the playoffs. But anyone who followed Baltimore football more closely knows that there was a lot of discussion during the regular season about what the long term solution was going to be at QB. There was a lot of doubt about Flacco and a lot of people were done with him. Do you recall how awful he was against the Broncos in the regular season game? He played extremely well in the postseason, but his defense (really stepped it up in the playoffs), WRs (they went up and got a lot of balls, particularly Boldin), and OL (remember the Broncos, who led the league in sacks, couldn't touch him) gave him a lot of solid support. Again, let's see what he does this coming year before we crown him.

I'm calling it now, esp without Ray-ray
http://www.robinsdocksideshop.com/Antique_Anchor_MP-678.jpg

rbackfactory80
03-05-2013, 04:16 AM
This.

LOL:wiggle:

eddie mac
03-05-2013, 04:51 AM
They're going to re-negotiate a 6 year deal after 2 years? That would have to be a record.

Renegotiate/restructure same thing, it will happen and does with nearly every large unguaranteed deal in this league.

After 2 years guarantees GONE

TonyR
03-05-2013, 06:03 AM
He has a 54-26 career regular season QB record. He has never done worse than 9-7. That seems pretty consistent to me.

His numbers won't knock one's socks off, but he has never thrown more than 12 interceptions in a season and he has 20+ plus touchdowns in four straight years.

He's a good QB. Above average. I've provided plenty of info in previous posts that support this. I'm not knocking the guy. He had a great postseason and his timing couldn't have been better from a financial perspective. But my hunch is that next season he'll look more like the better than average QB he's always been than the world beater some people think he is after this past run. Think Eli Manning.

Here's another really good read you should all check out. Read the whole thing. Chase Stuart does good work.

http://www.footballperspective.com/is-joe-flacco-elite/

TonyR
03-05-2013, 06:07 AM
From the article I linked above, further supporting the argument I've been making:

As you can see, with the exception of his great interception rate — which justifies its own post during this pre-Super Bowl period — Flacco’s career performance has been rather average. His touchdown rate, like those of many quarterbacks, has bounced up and down throughout his career. His sack rate was below average during his first three years, improved significantly in 2011, and landed right at the league average in 2012.

In the three main statistics — Y/A, NY/A, and ANY/A — Flacco has consistently finished in a tight window around the league average. His ANY/A has been slightly better than his NY/A thanks to that lofty interception rate, but suffice it to say Joe Flacco is, and has been for years, a league average quarterback.

If we look at ESPN’s Total QBR, Flacco ranked 27th as a rookie in 2008, 15th in 2009, and 12th in 2010, signaling a young quarterback improving and on the rise. In 2011, he ranked 14th, perhaps signaling a leveling off, and then this past season, he finished 25th. The positive spin would be that he’s a league-average quarterback, and the negative one (at least prior to this post-season) would have been that he was regressing.

Agamemnon
03-05-2013, 06:08 AM
But that's two few drives the offense had to score points...if anything it could be argued that holliday's points hurt the offense because it never allowed them to get into consistent rhythm

:spit:

Dedhed
03-05-2013, 08:37 AM
I don't think many are questioning Flaccos late season run. I give some credit in Baltimore letting go of Cam. Flacco performed great this postseason. In the previous years that defense was the reason they were in postseasons, while flacco and the offense was the reason they couldn't get the ring. What's up for debate is that is one season enough to warrant most money ever? People say athletes perform the best in contract years. Kinda tells you what's most important for them

My point is that the whole "MOST MONEY EVER!" thing is not an argument at all. He'll be the highest paid player until the next top level QB signs. It's called inflation; it's a meaningless title.

Dedhed
03-05-2013, 09:01 AM
The Ravens overpaid, but they did get a Superbowl ring which are very hard to get.

And they got a Super Bowl Ring for a bargain price. Players are compensated retroactively all the time. Flacco's never had a top-tier contract, he deserves one, and he got one.

Drunken.Broncoholic
03-05-2013, 09:05 AM
My point is that the whole "MOST MONEY EVER!" thing is not an argument at all. He'll be the highest paid player until the next top level QB signs. It's called inflation; it's a meaningless title.

Ya there's a few QBs coming up that will use Flaccos contract as a base. Pretty much that way in baseball too. Rogers and Matt Ryan will be asking for more than flacco. You're right "highest paid" only last for so long.

Drunken.Broncoholic
03-05-2013, 09:08 AM
And they got a Super Bowl Ring for a bargain price. Players are compensated retroactively all the time. Flacco's never had a top-tier contract, he deserves one, and he got one.

Ya I think that's how Dumervil got his amount. He performed great on a 4th round contract and he got compensated for those performances.

Dedhed
03-05-2013, 09:17 AM
Ya I think that's how Dumervil got his amount. He performed great on a 4th round contract and he got compensated for those performances.It's just the way things are, and it all generally evens out in the wash. Elvis outperformed his rookie contract, and he hasn't performed up to his current one. Overall though we've pretty much gotten what we've paid for.

I think the same will be true with Flacco.

maven
03-05-2013, 09:35 AM
Flacco's real deal is basically 3 years $52m as $10m of his year 3 money isn't guaranteed and will likely be renegotiated at that point.

Thanks for the numbers. I think after this run to the Super Bowl he's earned the 3 year contract. The Ravens should have been in the SB the previous year. While people mention Moore this and that, Flacco got it done.

kamakazi_kal
03-05-2013, 01:50 PM
that should keep is monster ego in check.

NUB
03-05-2013, 08:55 PM
From the article I linked above, further supporting the argument I've been making:

A cursory glance at Flacco's year this season and his past show this:

He threw 2 more TDs. Two less INTs. His TD% was up. His INT% was down. He threw more yards. He threw for a higher Y/A. His overall QB rating had gone up. Doesn't sound like regression unless you're a complete dumbass.

Flacco is a legit talent. Baltimore this year was more about offense than it was defense. It even ranked higher in terms of points (10th vs. 12th). People keep saying the latter was more important, but Flacco overcame two 30+ point games in the postseason. Yeah. That's some smashmouth ratbirds-D, am I right? Flacco carried Baltimore the past three offseasons. That's a lot more than Manning, perennial playoff choke-artist, has to say (considering, he played horribly the entire postseason when he finally got a ring, just being particular about it and all).

For the past three years Baltimore has been transitioning to being a more balanced team. It's why they won the Superbowl, because an aged, super slow Ray Lewis sure as hell isn't going to do it by himself. And Flacco has been a pretty integral part of that -- Baltimore could have made the Superbowl any one of the past three postseason; Denver just got the short end of the stick this past postseason, unfortunately.

He doesn't throw up huge numbers, but then again, why would he? Baltimore only recently dropped their horrendous offensive coordinator and they still operate a balanced team. Flacco isn't Tom Brady or Aaron Rodgers, but he's pretty damn good. And the past three postseason -- not just this one -- he displayed some pretty serious chops. I think this thread is embarrassing. I wish we could drop some dollars on a QB who wins the games that matter most, too.

DBroncos4life
03-05-2013, 09:28 PM
Who do you want to be our quarterback in 2012.

Peyton Manning
*WARHORSE*, Aftermath, alkemical, alpine, Ambiguous, Archie, Arkansas Bronco, Arkie, Asso Wilson, Atwater His Ass, ayjackson, bendog, Blart, Blueflame, BoiseBluTurf, bombay, bowtown, bronco610, broncocalijohn, Broncojef, BroncoLifer, BroncoMatt, BroncoSojia, Broncos_OTM, Bronkota, campocorto, chawknz, chickennob2, ColoradoBuff, Cpntrips, crawdad, Crushaholic, cutback, cutthemdown, DarkHorse30, DBroncos4life, DENVERDUI55, DenverDynamite, DomCasual, Dos Rios, Drunk idiot kicker, Drunk Monkey, Drunken.Broncoholic, Dukes, Durango, El Minion, elsid13, Endy, enjolras, errand, extralife, Fedaykin, flynzebra, Frisian, ghwk, gmp, GoBroncos DownUnder, GoHAM, gotfredson, GreeleyGrizzley, Gutless Drunk, hkbroncos, hookemhess, Houshyamama, Hulamau, Jack1118son, Jason7730, JCMElway, JCsuperstar, Jekyll15Hyde, kamakazi_kal, Kaylore, KevinJames, Kid A, Killericon, KipCorrington25, lod01, lvbronco, maher_tyler, Majik, maven, mellow mood, Mightysmurf, NFLBRONCO, oubronco, peacepipe, pokenation, Prodigal19, Que, randomtask, Ratboy, razorwire77, rdskier, Requiem, Rohirrim, Rolandftw, Ronnie Tsunami, Sassy, scannon, Schism, Shananahan, Shoemaker, SimonFletcher73, Sinedog, SJ Bronco, Slade, SonOfLe-loLang, SouthStndJunkie, spdirty, Spider, SpringStein, Stagger Lee, STBumpkin, Steve Sewell, stoxman, StugotsIII, Taco John, TheDave, theedge111, thevance_82, Tim, TonyR, Turd_Ferguson, v2micca, vancejohnson82, yerner, Ziggy
127 72.57%

Tim Tebow
55CrushEm, Aardvark, Agamemnon, BabyTO, Broncbow, BroncoBeavis, Broncobiv, broncogary, Broncoman13, Casper Bronco, Chris, Cito Pelon, ColoradoDarin, crazyhorse, DAN_BRONCO_FAN, Darkdoc, db56, dbfan21, Dedhed, Doggcow, El Jué, go_broncos, GreatBronco16, HighCountryBronco, jacob2125, Jay3, Jesterhole, jet19, jmz313, joe9999, lcbronco, lonestar, MacGruder, Marshall Dumervil, meangene, MileHighMagic, montrose, mustangtoby, myMind, NUB, rbackfactory80, sisterhellfyre, SoCalBronco, TD30, The Moops, TheFullTebow, winstoncup bronco, ~Crash~
48 27.43%

Look at the posters that are for Flacco's contract and see what they have in common. Ha!

Bacchus
03-06-2013, 06:16 AM
Who do you want to be our quarterback in 2012.

Peyton Manning
*WARHORSE*, Aftermath, alkemical, alpine, Ambiguous, Archie, Arkansas Bronco, Arkie, Asso Wilson, Atwater His Ass, ayjackson, bendog, Blart, Blueflame, BoiseBluTurf, bombay, bowtown, bronco610, broncocalijohn, Broncojef, BroncoLifer, BroncoMatt, BroncoSojia, Broncos_OTM, Bronkota, campocorto, chawknz, chickennob2, ColoradoBuff, Cpntrips, crawdad, Crushaholic, cutback, cutthemdown, DarkHorse30, DBroncos4life, DENVERDUI55, DenverDynamite, DomCasual, Dos Rios, Drunk idiot kicker, Drunk Monkey, Drunken.Broncoholic, Dukes, Durango, El Minion, elsid13, Endy, enjolras, errand, extralife, Fedaykin, flynzebra, Frisian, ghwk, gmp, GoBroncos DownUnder, GoHAM, gotfredson, GreeleyGrizzley, Gutless Drunk, hkbroncos, hookemhess, Houshyamama, Hulamau, Jack1118son, Jason7730, JCMElway, JCsuperstar, Jekyll15Hyde, kamakazi_kal, Kaylore, KevinJames, Kid A, Killericon, KipCorrington25, lod01, lvbronco, maher_tyler, Majik, maven, mellow mood, Mightysmurf, NFLBRONCO, oubronco, peacepipe, pokenation, Prodigal19, Que, randomtask, Ratboy, razorwire77, rdskier, Requiem, Rohirrim, Rolandftw, Ronnie Tsunami, Sassy, scannon, Schism, Shananahan, Shoemaker, SimonFletcher73, Sinedog, SJ Bronco, Slade, SonOfLe-loLang, SouthStndJunkie, spdirty, Spider, SpringStein, Stagger Lee, STBumpkin, Steve Sewell, stoxman, StugotsIII, Taco John, TheDave, theedge111, thevance_82, Tim, TonyR, Turd_Ferguson, v2micca, vancejohnson82, yerner, Ziggy
127 72.57%

Tim Tebow
55CrushEm, Aardvark, Agamemnon, BabyTO, Broncbow, BroncoBeavis, Broncobiv, broncogary, Broncoman13, Casper Bronco, Chris, Cito Pelon, ColoradoDarin, crazyhorse, DAN_BRONCO_FAN, Darkdoc, db56, dbfan21, Dedhed, Doggcow, El Jué, go_broncos, GreatBronco16, HighCountryBronco, jacob2125, Jay3, Jesterhole, jet19, jmz313, joe9999, lcbronco, lonestar, MacGruder, Marshall Dumervil, meangene, MileHighMagic, montrose, mustangtoby, myMind, NUB, rbackfactory80, sisterhellfyre, SoCalBronco, TD30, The Moops, TheFullTebow, winstoncup bronco, ~Crash~
48 27.43%

Look at the posters that are for Flacco's contract and see what they have in common. Ha!

How did I not vote in that poll?

TonyR
03-06-2013, 06:40 AM
A cursory glance at Flacco's year this season and his past show this:

He threw 2 more TDs. Two less INTs. His TD% was up. His INT% was down. He threw more yards. He threw for a higher Y/A. His overall QB rating had gone up. Doesn't sound like regression unless you're a complete dumbass.

Maybe understand the overall point being make, and read the whole article instead of taking a "cursory glance", before calling people "dumbass". The "regressing" comment was made based on QBR which you will see dropped in 2012 vs. 2011 in the link below.

http://espn.go.com/nfl/player/stats/_/id/11252/joe-flacco

But the overall point is that Flacco has been pretty much a league average QB in the regular season over his career. And these numbers show this.

I'm not a Flacco hater by any stretch. We both have the same alma mater for crying out loud, if anything I'm biased in his favor. I'm just pointing out reality. The guy hasn't been a special QB in the regular season throughout his career by any stretch. He had a great postseason this year and has been a pretty good postseason QB throughout his career. But the legend of Joe Flacco that some of you are creating because the Ravens won the Super Bowl and he got this huge contract is a bit much. Like I keep saying, let's see what he does this upcoming season. I'm betting he's more Eli Manning than Aaron Rodgers. Not that that's a bad thing.

TonyR
03-06-2013, 06:41 AM
Look at the posters that are for Flacco's contract and see what they have in common. Ha!

If that doesn't say a lot then I don't know what does!

NUB
03-06-2013, 04:39 PM
Maybe understand the overall point being make, and read the whole article instead of taking a "cursory glance", before calling people "dumbass". The "regressing" comment was made based on QBR which you will see dropped in 2012 vs. 2011 in the link below.

http://espn.go.com/nfl/player/stats/_/id/11252/joe-flacco

But the overall point is that Flacco has been pretty much a league average QB in the regular season over his career. And these numbers show this.

I'm not a Flacco hater by any stretch. We both have the same alma mater for crying out loud, if anything I'm biased in his favor. I'm just pointing out reality. The guy hasn't been a special QB in the regular season throughout his career by any stretch. He had a great postseason this year and has been a pretty good postseason QB throughout his career. But the legend of Joe Flacco that some of you are creating because the Ravens won the Super Bowl and he got this huge contract is a bit much. Like I keep saying, let's see what he does this upcoming season. I'm betting he's more Eli Manning than Aaron Rodgers. Not that that's a bad thing.

You're a dumbass if you think QBR means anything because it clearly does not. ESPN's totally made up, no-formula rating system is completely off the mark? Who could have guessed. And nobody should ever hang a debate on a rating system, QBR or passer, anyway. John Elway looks like crap if you do that, but anyone who watches this game knows there are things a little more important than a pretty stat line.


And yes, I'd take Flacco over Manning right now. He doesn't have one foot already out the door and he doesn't blow it in the playoffs. Eight one and dones? Five of those at home? Are you kidding? I like Manning and consider him arguably the finest pure passer ever, but he is a dud in the playoffs. Very easy choice, given the circumstances. (Not that QB is even the most important player on the team right now, that clearly goes to Miller at this point.)

Also, the people who voted Tebow, what's wrong with them? Last I checked Tebow totaled almost 400 yards of offense, three TDs and no turnovers to win a playoff game. Manning tore it the hell up in regular season, as he usually does, and then choked hard and threw a game-ending INT to kill the playoff run of a very, very strong Denver team. Manning is the superior quarterback, obviously no question. But what does Manning, who chokes in the playoffs and plays poorly in bad weather, have to bring to Denver, Colorado...?

You have no idea how badly I'm hoping Osweiler's upside comes to fruition...

TonyR
03-06-2013, 04:56 PM
You're a dumbass if you think QBR means anything because it clearly does not. ESPN's totally made up, no-formula rating system is completely off the mark? Who could have guessed. And nobody should ever hang a debate on a rating system, QBR or passer, anyway. John Elway looks like crap if you do that, but anyone who watches this game knows there are things a little more important than a pretty stat line.


And yes, I'd take Flacco over Manning right now. He doesn't have one foot already out the door and he doesn't blow it in the playoffs. Eight one and dones? Five of those at home? Are you kidding? I like Manning and consider him arguably the finest pure passer ever, but he is a dud in the playoffs. Very easy choice, given the circumstances. (Not that QB is even the most important player on the team right now, that clearly goes to Miller at this point.)

Also, the people who voted Tebow, what's wrong with them? Last I checked Tebow totaled almost 400 yards of offense, three TDs and no turnovers to win a playoff game. Manning tore it the hell up in regular season, as he usually does, and then choked hard and threw a game-ending INT to kill the playoff run of a very, very strong Denver team. Manning is the superior quarterback, obviously no question. But what does Manning, who chokes in the playoffs and plays poorly in bad weather, have to bring to Denver, Colorado...?

You have no idea how badly I'm hoping Osweiler's upside comes to fruition...

Your whole post is so bad I don't even know where to begin.

QBR means "nothing"? Stupid. It would be fair to say it doesn't mean "everything", but it doesn't mean "nothing". And it's not just QBR. His stats in general are not remotely elite. I don't know what more to tell you here, it's just a fact.

Flacco over Manning? I'm not aware that was the argument here. I'd only consider Flacco because he's younger, but he's not in the same league as Manning career wise, and never will be.

Tebow? Also not worth discussing. The guy will never be an NFL QB and his career is probably over. Get over it.

Osweiler? Finally, something we agree on?

As for how awful PM is in the postseason, educate yourself with the article linked below.

http://www.coldhardfootballfacts.com/content/peyton-mannings-9-11-playoff-record-is-call-for-help/20867/

jerseyboiler120
03-06-2013, 06:42 PM
Did Flacco give rahim $20million?

NUB
03-07-2013, 04:58 PM
Your whole post is so bad I don't even know where to begin.

QBR means "nothing"? Stupid. It would be fair to say it doesn't mean "everything", but it doesn't mean "nothing". And it's not just QBR. His stats in general are not remotely elite. I don't know what more to tell you here, it's just a fact.

Flacco over Manning? I'm not aware that was the argument here. I'd only consider Flacco because he's younger, but he's not in the same league as Manning career wise, and never will be.

Tebow? Also not worth discussing. The guy will never be an NFL QB and his career is probably over. Get over it.

Osweiler? Finally, something we agree on?

As for how awful PM is in the postseason, educate yourself with the article linked below.

http://www.coldhardfootballfacts.com/content/peyton-mannings-9-11-playoff-record-is-call-for-help/20867/

QBR just had a player who improved in almost every statistical category listed as "regressing." The same player who so regressed he plays a literally flawless postseason, winning the Superbowl. If QBR isn't stupid, then it is at the very least ****ing horrible at what it supposedly does. But wait, it gets way worse than that...

There is no formula out for QBR.

It is beyond stupid. It is worthless. A fantasy stat that means absolutely nothing.

As for the playoff record. Bro. The Colts had some seriously powerful, SB-contender teams for much of Manning's play there. You know you've got a bad argument if you nitpick the ebb and flow of every single game as if the world is out to get Manning. Yeah, Peyton Manning is the only QB in history to have NFL games swing back and forth on!

Fact: Manning has a 32:21 TD:INT ratio in the postseason. More than 25% of those TDs came courtesy of blowing Denver the hell out. The postseason he won the Superbowl, he threw 3TDs and 7INTs, eventually beating out Sexy Rexy Grossman in the big game. When he played in his second Superbowl, he nuked an evenly matched game by throwing a pick to Tracy Porter. What a boss.

Outside of picking apart crap defenses like Denver's and Kansas City, Peyton Manning looks like a totally different QB in the postseason. How could one argue differently? If he hits a tough defense he has a tendency to choke. If he plays in the cold he chokes. He is a sharp QB, but the dude has some very costly turnovers at the worst of times. (Spotting Baltimore 17-points, if I remember right, being the most recent of flubs, including the game-losing OT interception.)


By comparison, Tom Brady's TD-INT ratio is 42-22 in the postseason. Flacco 19-8. Aaron Rodgers 18-5. Eli Manning 17-8. Mark Sanchez 9-3 (lol).

When you think about the kind of super-high powered offenses Manning had for most of his career, his numbers look even uglier. Of course the worst is just the simple fact he has lost consistently and thoroughly, a sort of repetition of losing which cannot be ignored by playing patty-cake with the NFL gods or making up excuses as to why Vanderjagt missed a field goal (after Jerome Bettis miraculously fumbled it in the first place...). He doesn't even pass the eye test. I've watched the majority of Manning's playoff games and he never plays with the sort of intricate, killer-style he carries in the regular season. This is especially true if he's outside in the weather. A few games of screwing up is a fluke, an entire career of it is a pattern.

rbackfactory80
03-07-2013, 05:21 PM
QBR just had a player who improved in almost every statistical category listed as "regressing." The same player who so regressed he plays a literally flawless postseason, winning the Superbowl. If QBR isn't stupid, then it is at the very least ****ing horrible at what it supposedly does. But wait, it gets way worse than that...

There is no formula out for QBR.

It is beyond stupid. It is worthless. A fantasy stat that means absolutely nothing.

As for the playoff record. Bro. The Colts had some seriously powerful, SB-contender teams for much of Manning's play there. You know you've got a bad argument if you nitpick the ebb and flow of every single game as if the world is out to get Manning. Yeah, Peyton Manning is the only QB in history to have NFL games swing back and forth on!

Fact: Manning has a 32:21 TD:INT ratio in the postseason. More than 25% of those TDs came courtesy of blowing Denver the hell out. The postseason he won the Superbowl, he threw 3TDs and 7INTs, eventually beating out Sexy Rexy Grossman in the big game. When he played in his second Superbowl, he nuked an evenly matched game by throwing a pick to Tracy Porter. What a boss.

Outside of picking apart crap defenses like Denver's and Kansas City, Peyton Manning looks like a totally different QB in the postseason. How could one argue differently? If he hits a tough defense he has a tendency to choke. If he plays in the cold he chokes. He is a sharp QB, but the dude has some very costly turnovers at the worst of times. (Spotting Baltimore 17-points, if I remember right, being the most recent of flubs, including the game-losing OT interception.)


By comparison, Tom Brady's TD-INT ratio is 42-22 in the postseason. Flacco 19-8. Aaron Rodgers 18-5. Eli Manning 17-8. Mark Sanchez 9-3 (lol).

When you think about the kind of super-high powered offenses Manning had for most of his career, his numbers look even uglier. Of course the worst is just the simple fact he has lost consistently and thoroughly, a sort of repetition of losing which cannot be ignored by playing patty-cake with the NFL gods or making up excuses as to why Vanderjagt missed a field goal (after Jerome Bettis miraculously fumbled it in the first place...). He doesn't even pass the eye test. I've watched the majority of Manning's playoff games and he never plays with the sort of intricate, killer-style he carries in the regular season. This is especially true if he's outside in the weather. A few games of screwing up is a fluke, an entire career of it is a pattern.


It's so damn obvious but the stat boys don't seem to get it.

BTW the Pittsburgh game might have been the most embarrassing game he played in the post season not counting the Jets debacle. Pitt was another team he took it to that year in the regular season that was just mentally tougher when the postseason rolled around.

Arkie
03-07-2013, 06:42 PM
Manning was drafted by the last place Colts and couldn't win a playoff game soon enough. He began with three one-and-dones beginning the year after he was drafted. Then he couldn't win the Super Bowl. Tom Brady, on the other hand, had a better team early on, and he didn't have any pressure of high expectations to carry the team. He started off his career by never losing a playoff game during spygate. These first impressions have stuck with both of them. That's why most people don't realize that Manning has a better playoff record and SB record than Brady over the last 7 to 8 years.