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Bacchus
02-15-2013, 07:52 AM
Tim Tebow to speak at virulently anti-gay, anti-Semitic Dallas megachurch


Rick Chandler

Feb 14, 2013, 5:49 PM EST

It seems that lately Tim Tebow has been making more speaking appearances in church than he has quarterback appearances in NFL games. Tebow made headlines with his Easter address in Georgetown, Texas in April, and his talk at a Scottsdale, AZ church earlier this month. And now he’s got another gig at a megachurch in Dallas, only this one comes with a large helping of controversy.

Tebow has a speaking engagement on April 28 at First Baptist Dallas, according to the church’s website. That’s the church led by pastor Robert Jeffress, a virulently anti-gay and anti-Semitic evangelical Christian who has made quite a name for himself in religious circles.


In October 2011, Jeffress endorsed Texas Governor Rick Perry for president, then went on to claim that Islam, Mormonism and Judaism are heretical religions “from the pit of hell.”

On the eve of the presidential election in November 2012, Jeffress warned his Dallas congregation that President Barack Obama’s re-election would “lead to the rise of the Antichrist,” according to The Christian Post.

Jeffress also gained notoriety for his statements about the gay community. According to ThinkProgress, during the same speech where he endorsed Rick Perry in 2011, Jeffress told a crowd at the high-profile Values Voters Summit that gays should not be allowed in the military because “Seventy percent of the gay population” has AIDS.




Rest of article: http://offthebench.nbcsports.com/2013/02/14/tim-tebow-to-speak-at-virulently-anti-gay-anti-semitic-dallas-megachurch/related/

schaaf
02-15-2013, 08:07 AM
Tim Tebow to speak at virulently anti-gay, anti-Semitic Dallas megachurch


Rick Chandler

Feb 14, 2013, 5:49 PM EST

It seems that lately Tim Tebow has been making more speaking appearances in church than he has quarterback appearances in NFL games. Tebow made headlines with his Easter address in Georgetown, Texas in April, and his talk at a Scottsdale, AZ church earlier this month. And now he’s got another gig at a megachurch in Dallas, only this one comes with a large helping of controversy.

Tebow has a speaking engagement on April 28 at First Baptist Dallas, according to the church’s website. That’s the church led by pastor Robert Jeffress, a virulently anti-gay and anti-Semitic evangelical Christian who has made quite a name for himself in religious circles.


In October 2011, Jeffress endorsed Texas Governor Rick Perry for president, then went on to claim that Islam, Mormonism and Judaism are heretical religions “from the pit of hell.”

On the eve of the presidential election in November 2012, Jeffress warned his Dallas congregation that President Barack Obama’s re-election would “lead to the rise of the Antichrist,” according to The Christian Post.

Jeffress also gained notoriety for his statements about the gay community. According to ThinkProgress, during the same speech where he endorsed Rick Perry in 2011, Jeffress told a crowd at the high-profile Values Voters Summit that gays should not be allowed in the military because “Seventy percent of the gay population” has AIDS.




Rest of article: http://offthebench.nbcsports.com/2013/02/14/tim-tebow-to-speak-at-virulently-anti-gay-anti-semitic-dallas-megachurch/related/


Thi surprises anyone how?

bronco militia
02-15-2013, 08:15 AM
who knew

ZZZ...

Rohirrim
02-15-2013, 08:21 AM
Uhh

Drunken.Broncoholic
02-15-2013, 08:56 AM
A belief that goes against every fragment of his faith? Sure is.

rugbythug
02-15-2013, 09:01 AM
Love the sinner and hate the sin.

Heyneck
02-15-2013, 09:11 AM
Anybody who is Catholic or at least understands the bible should not be surprised by this. There is a reason God created Eve for and from Adam.

Agamemnon
02-15-2013, 09:17 AM
He's a Southern Baptist. Southern Baptists universally believe that homosexuality is a sin. This is not news. They also believe all non-Christian belief systems come from the devil. This is also not news.

s0phr0syne
02-15-2013, 09:29 AM
Anybody who is Catholic or at least understands the bible should not be surprised by this. There is a reason God created Eve for and from Adam.



Because....Adam was straight?

orangeatheist
02-15-2013, 09:29 AM
I'd be shocked if Tebow thinks the earth is only 6,000 years old.

\sarcasm

Kaylore
02-15-2013, 09:31 AM
He probably is anti-gay.

He probably also isn't giving a speech about homosexuality. All we know is he is going to a church that has strong views on homosexuality and he is giving speech there.

spdirty
02-15-2013, 10:18 AM
I don't know how you can call yourself a christian with a basic understanding of the bible and not be anti-gay. 1 Corintians 6:9-11 and 1 Timothy 1:8-11.

Chris
02-15-2013, 10:36 AM
I don't know how you can call yourself a christian with a basic understanding of the bible and not be anti-gay. 1 Corintians 6:9-11 and 1 Timothy 1:8-11.

I think it's about the Christians that take the bible literally and the Christians that understand it as a 2000 year old story written down and edited by a bunch of old dudes 300 years later at the Council of Nicea.

I dunno. I know a lot of people are fascinated by religion but the whole thing tires me out more than the WRP forum.

spdirty
02-15-2013, 10:47 AM
the Christians that understand it as a 2000 year old story written down and edited by a bunch of old dudes 300 years later at the Council of Nicea.

Why would they call themselves Christians if they don't know what to believe?

SonOfLe-loLang
02-15-2013, 11:02 AM
Why would they call themselves Christians if they don't know what to believe?

I would assume the vast majority of people who call themselves christian don't know what to believe.

SleepingTiger
02-15-2013, 11:12 AM
I would assume the vast majority of people who call themselves christian don't know what to believe.

its about the individual and not about the religion itself. you can say the same regarding many religions.

Rohirrim
02-15-2013, 11:14 AM
Anybody who is Catholic or at least understands the bible should not be surprised by this. There is a reason God created Eve for and from Adam.

Yep. Well, except for the priests, but other than that...

Heyneck
02-15-2013, 11:24 AM
Yep. Well, except for the priests, but other than that...

For sure.... I am a huge believer. But I do have my issues with the institution that is church. That being one of them, and how the Vatican used to protect or come with a lame excuse to protect the Priest, when in truth, they should be protecting the kids. At least they finally condemned them, but still it took a long time for that.

DenverBrit
02-15-2013, 11:28 AM
Nice choice of church.

But Tebow’s peace-and-love message could be tested by the megachurch’s evangelical Christian pastor, the Rev. Robert Jeffress.

He once accused gay activists of trying to hide “the link between homosexuality and pedophilia.”

In November, the preacher warned his flock that President Obama’s reelection “would lead to a rise of the antiChrist.”

While endorsing Texas Gov. Rick Perry’s presidential bid in October 2011, Jeffress bashed Islam, Judaism and Mormonism as heretical religions “from the pit of hell.”

gunns
02-15-2013, 12:09 PM
Tim Tebow to speak at virulently anti-gay, anti-Semitic Dallas megachurch


Rick Chandler

Feb 14, 2013, 5:49 PM EST

It seems that lately Tim Tebow has been making more speaking appearances in church than he has quarterback appearances in NFL games. Tebow made headlines with his Easter address in Georgetown, Texas in April, and his talk at a Scottsdale, AZ church earlier this month. And now he’s got another gig at a megachurch in Dallas, only this one comes with a large helping of controversy.

Tebow has a speaking engagement on April 28 at First Baptist Dallas, according to the church’s website. That’s the church led by pastor Robert Jeffress, a virulently anti-gay and anti-Semitic evangelical Christian who has made quite a name for himself in religious circles.


In October 2011, Jeffress endorsed Texas Governor Rick Perry for president, then went on to claim that Islam, Mormonism and Judaism are heretical religions “from the pit of hell.”

On the eve of the presidential election in November 2012, Jeffress warned his Dallas congregation that President Barack Obama’s re-election would “lead to the rise of the Antichrist,” according to The Christian Post.

Jeffress also gained notoriety for his statements about the gay community. According to ThinkProgress, during the same speech where he endorsed Rick Perry in 2011, Jeffress told a crowd at the high-profile Values Voters Summit that gays should not be allowed in the military because “Seventy percent of the gay population” has AIDS.




Rest of article: http://offthebench.nbcsports.com/2013/02/14/tim-tebow-to-speak-at-virulently-anti-gay-anti-semitic-dallas-megachurch/related/

Ok, let's get our torches and go after Kaylore and Dom!

How is the Mormon church not Christian? Hello. Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints.

I don't know how you can call yourself a christian with a basic understanding of the bible and not be anti-gay. 1 Corintians 6:9-11 and 1 Timothy 1:8-11.

Have to wonder if those people that judge and are anti gay see themselves at all in those scriptures. Probably not.

SleepingTiger
02-15-2013, 12:14 PM
For sure.... I am a huge believer. But I do have my issues with the institution that is church. That being one of them, and how the Vatican used to protect or come with a lame excuse to protect the Priest, when in truth, they should be protecting the kids. At least they finally condoned them, but still it took a long time for that.

condoned or condemned?

Heyneck
02-15-2013, 12:17 PM
condoned or condemned?

sry condemned.

spdirty
02-15-2013, 12:18 PM
Have to wonder if those people that judge and are anti gay see themselves at all in those scriptures. Probably not.

I did back when I drank a lot. Also when I was divorced and screwed around i wasn't any better. The standard of behavior for Christians according to the Bible is extremely high.

Lestat
02-15-2013, 12:20 PM
Anybody who is Catholic or at least understands the bible should not be surprised by this. There is a reason God created Eve for and from Adam.

or... you could look at it this way. Women outnumber men 2 to 1 in the world, the projection is 3 to 1 within the next few years.
so for every dude that goes gay and loves up on another dude.

that means it skews the available female numbers to a straight man's favor.
**** Gangnam, in a few years it will be Harem style. :yayaya:

Smiling Assassin27
02-15-2013, 01:01 PM
I did back when I drank a lot. Also when I was divorced and screwed around i wasn't any better. The standard of behavior for Christians according to the Bible is extremely high.

'Behavior' is the key term there. At least from a Catholic perspective, same sex attraction is not a sin, though it is viewed as a disorder (not in some medical sense, though), just like alcoholism, drug addiction, etc. When the attraction turns into action--living a gay lifestyle--then it becomes a sin, just as when a hetero attraction turns into sleeping around, cheating on your spouse, getting hooked on porn, etc. the sin is in the action, not the hetero attraction. All are called to chastity, hetero or homo, which if done right, keeps us detached from sinful action. [/end lecture on Catholic Catechism]

DenverBrit
02-15-2013, 01:13 PM
I don't know how you can call yourself a christian with a basic understanding of the bible and not be anti-gay. 1 Corintians 6:9-11 and 1 Timothy 1:8-11.

Same goes for slavery.

As for your male and female slaves whom you may have: you may buy male and female slaves from among the nations that are around you. You may also buy from among the strangers who sojourn with you and their clans that are with you, who have been born in your land, and they may be your property. You may bequeath them to your sons after you to inherit as a possession forever. You may make slaves of them, but over your brothers the people of Israel you shall not rule, one over another ruthlessly
Leviticus 25:44-46 Or adultery.

If a man commits adultery with another man's wife, both the man and the woman must be put to death. (Leviticus 20:10 NLT) How about some genocide?

Do not spare them, but kill both man and woman, child and infant, ox and sheep, camel and donkey.’” (1 Samuel 15:3)Being a Christian should never be a justification for bigotry.

SonOfLe-loLang
02-15-2013, 01:13 PM
its about the individual and not about the religion itself. you can say the same regarding many religions.

And i would.

BroncoBeavis
02-15-2013, 01:30 PM
Same goes for slavery.

"Slavery" in the age of monarchy was a different animal than our modern perspective allows us to comprehend. If you owned nothing, in many cases there were no better alternatives to you than being the servant of a man who did.

I'm intrigued by this new idea though that speaking at a place makes you responsible for it's positions. Seems like a few years back we were told even regularly attending a church didn't necessarily mean you agreed with what it said.

DenverBrit
02-15-2013, 02:18 PM
"Slavery" in the age of monarchy was a different animal than our modern perspective allows us to comprehend. If you owned nothing, in many cases there were no better alternatives to you than being the servant of a man who did.

I'm intrigued by this new idea though that speaking at a place makes you responsible for it's positions. Seems like a few years back we were told even regularly attending a church didn't necessarily mean you agreed with what it said.

So are many attitudes....we no longer burn heretics or witches.

Yet here we are, still picking and choosing which Bible passages to use for our respective agendas.

If we have decided slavery is now wrong, why isn't homophobia?

BTW, servant and slave are not the same.

BroncoBeavis
02-15-2013, 03:00 PM
If we have decided slavery is now wrong, why isn't homophobia?

Well, it's obviously a different animal entirely to leave behind a practice that was once allowed (though not necessarily encouraged) than it is to start allowing a practice forbidden. And that's not even getting into the whole Christian Handbook 1.0/2.0 OT/NT paradigm. Many things were left behind when Christians believe the law became fulfilled. Were it not for Acts 15:29 (edit, sorry), you could even maybe use that line of argument.

BTW, servant and slave are not the same.

It's really not as simple as you make it sound.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Judaism_and_slavery

The laws governing Jewish slaves were more lenient than laws governing non-Jewish slaves, but a single Hebrew word, ebed (meaning slave or servant) is used for both situations. In English translations of the Bible, the distinction is sometimes emphasized by translating the word as "slave" in the context of non-Jewish slaves, and "servant" or "bondman" for Jewish slaves.

And in the passage of Leviticus you cited, some English translations use the word "bondman" in place of "slave." In any case there was little practical difference between the two.

Agamemnon
02-15-2013, 03:01 PM
By the way, I'm as far from being a Christian conservative as possible (not even a Christian and definitely not a conservative), but really, believing a sexual behavior is sinful is not necessarily the same thing as being "anti-gay" or hating homosexuals. A lot of christians honestly see it as loving homosexuals and wanting to save them from their sexual immorality and the damnation that comes along with it. It may be misguided, but it isn't hateful. Admittedly there are some Christian conservatives who are definitely hateful towards gay people, but it certainly isn't all of them.

Blart
02-15-2013, 03:24 PM
Not news.

He supported Focus on the Family before he came to Denver.


Leviticus 11:9-12
9 These shall ye eat of all that are in the waters: whatsoever hath fins and scales in the waters, in the seas, and in the rivers, them shall ye eat.
10 And all that have not fins and scales in the seas, and in the rivers, of all that move in the waters, and of any living thing which is in the waters, they shall be an abomination unto you:
11 They shall be even an abomination unto you; ye shall not eat of their flesh, but ye shall have their carcases in abomination.
12 Whatsoever hath no fins nor scales in the waters, that shall be an abomination unto you.


“We don’t hate people who eat shellfish—God does.”
~ Rev. Michael Fordworth, 1984

“As a mother, I know that people who eat shellfish are all inherently evil for some reason.”
~ Anita Bryant, 1982


“Christianity stands for freedom; we don’t want to impose our religion on everyone else. We just don’t want shellfish or shellfish-eater values to be forced upon us….”
~ David Limbaugh, 1994

“It’s about time we faced up to the truth. If we accept the radical notion that shellfish can be consumed—be it in the kitchen or in a restaurant or in anywhere else—we are utterly destroying the concept of dinner.”~ Alan Keyes, 2002

DenverBrit
02-15-2013, 04:06 PM
Well, it's obviously a different animal entirely to leave behind a practice that was once allowed (though not necessarily encouraged) than it is to start allowing a practice forbidden. And that's not even getting into the whole Christian Handbook 1.0/2.0 OT/NT paradigm. Many things were left behind when Christians believe the law became fulfilled. Were it not for Acts 15:29 (edit, sorry), you could even maybe use that line of argument.



It's really not as simple as you make it sound.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Judaism_and_slavery



And in the passage of Leviticus you cited, some English translations use the word "bondman" in place of "slave." In any case there was little practical difference between the two.

Now that's cherry picking the bible to suit one's agenda.

Incest was commanded, killing adulterers was commanded, genocide was commanded, killing homosexuals was commanded. There is an endless list of barbaric practices within the Bible, so who gets to choose what to obey and what to ignore? Much of the homophobia comes from Fundamentalists who interpret the Bible literally.

We all see the Bible differently, and for many it is God's word. I live in a different millennium. :)

BroncoBeavis
02-15-2013, 04:28 PM
Now that's cherry picking the bible to suit one's agenda.

Incest was commanded, killing adulterers was commanded, genocide was commanded, killing homosexuals was commanded. There is an endless list of barbaric practices within the Bible, so who gets to choose what to obey and what to ignore? Much of the homophobia comes from Fundamentalists who interpret the Bible literally.)

There's much popular confusion between what was commanded in the Bible vs simply documented (or even predicted) So I won't get too far into any of your points unless you want to get more specific. The Old Testament was admittedly brutal to the modern conscience. Probably less so to people who lived in those times. I'm glad that a Christian is allowed to believe that that page in history has been turned.

I agree that many of the people that like to hammer others with the OT are hypocritical to their faith. If you're not keeping the old law, how can you hold others to it?

Better to keep the two greatest commandments yourself than worry about whether others keep all 10.

Bacchus
02-15-2013, 05:50 PM
"Slavery" in the age of monarchy was a different animal than our modern perspective allows us to comprehend. If you owned nothing, in many cases there were no better alternatives to you than being the servant of a man who did.

I'm intrigued by this new idea though that speaking at a place makes you responsible for it's positions. Seems like a few years back we were told even regularly attending a church didn't necessarily mean you agreed with what it said.

Being a serf although bad was not being a slave where you worked for no pay until you died. Serf's although they got paid little were still basically free men.

Bacchus
02-15-2013, 05:53 PM
Not news.

He supported Focus on the Family before he came to Denver.


Leviticus 11:9-12


“We don’t hate people who eat shellfish—God does.”
~ Rev. Michael Fordworth, 1984

“As a mother, I know that people who eat shellfish are all inherently evil for some reason.”
~ Anita Bryant, 1982

“Christianity stands for freedom; we don’t want to impose our religion on everyone else. We just don’t want shellfish or shellfish-eater values to be forced upon us….”
~ David Limbaugh, 1994

“It’s about time we faced up to the truth. If we accept the radical notion that shellfish can be consumed—be it in the kitchen or in a restaurant or in anywhere else—we are utterly destroying the concept of dinner.”~ Alan Keyes, 2002







WTF?? I have never heard that about shellfish. Utterly makes no sense whatsoever. What is the logic behind this?

Heyneck
02-15-2013, 06:02 PM
yeah... but... do you like fish sticks?

errand
02-15-2013, 06:14 PM
Leviticus was Hebrew Law.....you know the ones who didn't believe Jesus was the Messiah

Christians believe in the teachings of Jesus Christ.

Anyone using Leviticus to blast Christians is ignorant, and pushing an agenda

Agamemnon
02-15-2013, 06:23 PM
Being a serf although bad was not being a slave where you worked for no pay until you died. Serf's although they got paid little were still basically free men.

In most cases it was definitely a form of slavery and to call serfs "basically free men" would be incorrect (aside from a small minority who were actually free men). That said it definitely was not as onerous as most forms of slavery.

Dr. Broncenstein
02-15-2013, 06:37 PM
Most gays are anti-Tebow.

Inkana7
02-15-2013, 06:40 PM
Being a serf although bad was not being a slave where you worked for no pay until you died. Serf's although they got paid little were still basically free men.

Ahahahaha no

DenverBrit
02-15-2013, 06:44 PM
Leviticus was Hebrew Law.....you know the ones who didn't believe Jesus was the Messiah

Christians believe in the teachings of Jesus Christ.

Anyone using Leviticus to blast Christians is ignorant, and pushing an agenda

And he loved all mankind equally.

So where does the homophobia come from? Paul's letters in Romans?

No, it's origins and veracity come from the Old Testament....specifically Leviticus. The 'agenda' is being factual.

rugbythug
02-15-2013, 06:50 PM
Christians and indeed Christ himself separated the sinner from the sin. The bible is very clear homosexuality is a sin. Just like any other sin one can be forgiven of it.

Currently homosexuals want there life style to be unalterable and a genetic program they can not help. Soon this will change, If homosexuality is really a genetic disorder. Then we will see a crescendo of homosexuality, followed by a very small ongoing population. This would render the gay agenda a small splinter group in 2 generations. At that point gays will want homosexuality to become a free expression and something anyone can aspire to. Otherwise they will be breed out of existence.

Disorder-Used in a classical sense any gene that prevents the carrier from reproducing is not good for the population at large.

Rohirrim
02-15-2013, 06:56 PM
I sent in my application for the Pope opening.

Haven't heard anything, yet.

ChrisToker
02-15-2013, 07:29 PM
Gonna laugh my ass off when Teblow gets busted w/ a little boy in the Philippines

ChrisToker
02-15-2013, 07:36 PM
Anybody who is Catholic or at least understands the bible should not be surprised by this. There is a reason God created Eve for and from Adam.

Hellz yeah so we could watch that fat bottomed girl bounce her ass cheeks on a boat like you profile pic.

Connecticut Bronco Fan
02-15-2013, 07:42 PM
http://atheistatlarge.org/articles/uploads/2011/06/MarriageAccordingToTheBible.jpg

Bacchus
02-15-2013, 07:53 PM
Gonna laugh my ass off when Teblow gets busted w/ a little boy in the Philippines

I think he is a gay virgin

broncosteven
02-15-2013, 08:00 PM
Anybody who is Catholic or at least understands the bible should not be surprised by this. There is a reason God created Eve for and from Adam.

Didn't one of Noah's son have sex with him after they all got liquored up after the flood when Noah and his lineage were biblicly all that was left of man kind?

Apparently God created gayness for a reason because it happened after both Adam and Noah...

Archer81
02-15-2013, 08:37 PM
I think he is a gay virgin


Indeed.


:Broncos:

DENVERDUI55
02-15-2013, 08:39 PM
It wouldn't surprise me if Tebow despised homosexuality.

Tombstone RJ
02-15-2013, 09:12 PM
Same goes for slavery.

Or adultery.

How about some genocide?

Being a Christian should never be a justification for bigotry.

You are taking the Bible way out of context and you know it. People love to do this. Not only people like you who don't know what they are talking about, but people who want to start cults based on 1 or 2 verses out of the Bible that they completely missread and missapply.

errand
02-15-2013, 10:05 PM
And he loved all mankind equally.

So where does the homophobia come from? Paul's letters in Romans?

No, it's origins and veracity come from the Old Testament....specifically Leviticus. The 'agenda' is being factual.

So calling homosexuality a sin is hatred? Is Tebow and his Christian gang of homophobes shooting gays or beating them?

BTW, they're not afraid of homos....they're afraid of what will happen to them when God passes judgement on the world.

broncosteven
02-15-2013, 10:21 PM
So calling homosexuality a sin is hatred? Is Tebow and his Christian gang of homophobes shooting gays or beating them?

BTW, they're not afraid of homos....they're afraid of what will happen to them when God passes judgement on the world.

When is that due? Everytime I hide in the shipping container bunker buried in the back yard for a week or 2 to see if the 2nd comming is over it turns out nothing happened.

Dr. Broncenstein
02-15-2013, 10:23 PM
"Ewwww... I poop from there."

Tim Tebow

broncosteven
02-15-2013, 10:27 PM
"Ewwww... I poop from there."

Tim Tebow

Just think how Noah felt after he woke and found out his son boned him

Archer81
02-15-2013, 11:06 PM
Whenever I see articles like this, I think to myself..."aww, bless their hearts".

I live my life the way I see fit. Any wrong I have done, and any bad decision I have made will be hashed out one of these days. It wont be because some halfwit preacher screams and gesticulates from a mega church pulpit. Always amuses me, the you should have a personal relationship with God...and it should be the same as my personal relationship with God. If God exists, then He clearly made me this particular way, so sending me to hell for so called design flaws seems unnaturally cruel, and I am not sure in that case that god would be one I would want to worship or know in the slightest.

As for Tebow...the sooner he comes out the better off he will be.

:Broncos:

huh??
02-15-2013, 11:06 PM
Hmmmm. "Seventy percent", huh?
That's like, almost half or something. Isn't it?

Wes Mantooth
02-15-2013, 11:15 PM
Next thing you are going to tell me is he doesn't like the Koran either.

SonOfLe-loLang
02-15-2013, 11:50 PM
So calling homosexuality a sin is hatred? Is Tebow and his Christian gang of homophobes shooting gays or beating them?

BTW, they're not afraid of homos....they're afraid of what will happen to them when God passes judgement on the world.

The day god passes judgement on the world! You'll be waiting an eternity for that to happen

And if you call it a sin, it's at least intolerance

cutthemdown
02-16-2013, 12:00 AM
Ok, let's get our torches and go after Kaylore and Dom!

How is the Mormon church not Christian? Hello. Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints.



Have to wonder if those people that judge and are anti gay see themselves at all in those scriptures. Probably not.

Romney had to win for Mormonism to be cool. Now it's just a silly cult again. :)

Bacchus
02-16-2013, 03:01 AM
Whenever I see articles like this, I think to myself..."aww, bless their hearts".

I live my life the way I see fit. Any wrong I have done, and any bad decision I have made will be hashed out one of these days. It wont be because some halfwit preacher screams and gesticulates from a mega church pulpit. Always amuses me, the you should have a personal relationship with God...and it should be the same as my personal relationship with God. If God exists, then He clearly made me this particular way, so sending me to hell for so called design flaws seems unnaturally cruel, and I am not sure in that case that god would be one I would want to worship or know in the slightest.

As for Tebow...the sooner he comes out the better off he will be.

:Broncos:

No Chris, haven't you heard? Homosexuality is a choice and a sin. My preacher said so and he speaks to god everyday and god told him..

fontaine
02-16-2013, 07:45 AM
I don't know how you can call yourself a christian with a basic understanding of the bible and not be anti-gay. 1 Corintians 6:9-11 and 1 Timothy 1:8-11.

Yeah, all those clowns who followed Jesus and called themselves Christians in the first century obviously were too stupid to understand they had to wait till Timothy/Corinthians to fully understand.

Tombstone RJ
02-16-2013, 08:26 AM
Whenever I see articles like this, I think to myself..."aww, bless their hearts".

I live my life the way I see fit. Any wrong I have done, and any bad decision I have made will be hashed out one of these days. It wont be because some halfwit preacher screams and gesticulates from a mega church pulpit. Always amuses me, the you should have a personal relationship with God...and it should be the same as my personal relationship with God. If God exists, then He clearly made me this particular way, so sending me to hell for so called design flaws seems unnaturally cruel, and I am not sure in that case that god would be one I would want to worship or know in the slightest.

As for Tebow...the sooner he comes out the better off he will be.

:Broncos:

All sex outside of marriage is a sin. Does not matter if its between a hetero couple or a gay couple. Homosexuals cannot marry in the Bible. The basic principle is you choose to have sex, plain and simple. It's a choice. If you are gay, you must choose to abstain from sex with a man just like a hetero guy must choost to abstain from sex with a woman unless he's married to her. Masturbation is also a sin.

It's a choice. Don't kid yourself. All sex is a choice.

elsid13
02-16-2013, 08:57 AM
"Slavery" in the age of monarchy was a different animal than our modern perspective allows us to comprehend. If you owned nothing, in many cases there were no better alternatives to you than being the servant of a man who did.

I'm intrigued by this new idea though that speaking at a place makes you responsible for it's positions. Seems like a few years back we were told even regularly attending a church didn't necessarily mean you agreed with what it said.

It is not different from today view to ancient era perspective. Slavery is evil practice no matter when or where it is done.

Archer81
02-16-2013, 09:00 AM
It is not different from today view to ancient era perspective. Slavery is evil practice no matter when or where it is done.


"Ancient" slavery lacked the racial component that developed in the 17th and 18th centuries.


:Broncos:

Archer81
02-16-2013, 09:02 AM
All sex outside of marriage is a sin. Does not matter if its between a hetero couple or a gay couple. Homosexuals cannot marry in the Bible. The basic principle is you choose to have sex, plain and simple. It's a choice. If you are gay, you must choose to abstain from sex with a man just like a hetero guy must choost to abstain from sex with a woman unless he's married to her. Masturbation is also a sin.

It's a choice. Don't kid yourself. All sex is a choice.


http://tinyurl.com/424k5pt


:Broncos:

elsid13
02-16-2013, 09:11 AM
"Ancient" slavery lacked the racial component that developed in the 17th and 18th centuries.


:Broncos:

Harlots in ancient Sparta might disagree. Slavery is slavery no matter what. Just because there is racial component in the American experience doesn't make it any better or worse. To make the argument that slavery was better in ancient world is falsity. Proof can be seen with the number of slave rebellion that have occurred. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slave_rebellion

Archer81
02-16-2013, 09:17 AM
Harlots in ancient Sparta might disagree. Slavery is slavery no matter what. Just because there is racial component in the American experience doesn't make it any better or worse. To make the argument that slavery was better in ancient world is falsity. Proof can be seen with the number of slave rebellion that have occurred. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slave_rebellion


I'm not saying ancient slavery was better. Slavery is slavery. I was pointing out that ancient slavery was less inclined to be based on skin tone and more likely to be based on you losing a war or being in the wrong place at the wrong time.

:Broncos:

SonOfLe-loLang
02-16-2013, 09:23 AM
All sex outside of marriage is a sin. Does not matter if its between a hetero couple or a gay couple. Homosexuals cannot marry in the Bible. The basic principle is you choose to have sex, plain and simple. It's a choice. If you are gay, you must choose to abstain from sex with a man just like a hetero guy must choost to abstain from sex with a woman unless he's married to her. Masturbation is also a sin.

It's a choice. Don't kid yourself. All sex is a choice.

To me, it's very sad that people take some ancient text into account when making any decision about their life, sexual or otherwise.

BowlenBall
02-16-2013, 09:24 AM
or... you could look at it this way. Women outnumber men 2 to 1 in the world, the projection is 3 to 1 within the next few years.
so for every dude that goes gay and loves up on another dude.

that means it skews the available female numbers to a straight man's favor.
**** Gangnam, in a few years it will be Harem style. :yayaya:

Huh?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sex_ratio

"The CIA estimates that the current world wide sex ratio at birth is 107 boys to 100 girls. In 2010, the global sex ratio was 986 females per 1,000 males and trended to reduce to 984 in 2011."

Br0nc0Buster
02-16-2013, 09:25 AM
Tebow is probably gay anyways

Maybe him and Teo will hit it off

That is assuming Tebow is still in the league, which is not a given anymore

DenverBrit
02-16-2013, 09:45 AM
So calling homosexuality a sin is hatred? Is Tebow and his Christian gang of homophobes shooting gays or beating them?

The 'preacher' in this thread certainly believes so: "He once accused gay activists of trying to hide “the link between homosexuality and pedophilia.”

BTW, they're not afraid of homos....they're afraid of what will happen to them when God passes judgement on the world.

In the meantime, they'll/you'll do the judging and condemning, just in case God isn't paying attention. Right, got it.

DenverBrit
02-16-2013, 10:03 AM
You are taking the Bible way out of context and you know it. People love to do this. Not only people like you who don't know what they are talking about, but people who want to start cults based on 1 or 2 verses out of the Bible that they completely missread and missapply.

And people love to pick and choose which bible verses to quote and obey based upon their personal moral compass.

Rohirrim
02-16-2013, 10:19 AM
I know that when I am in a quandary regarding a modern issue of ethics, morality and values, I turn to the primitive desert peoples of 2,000 years ago for guidance. I mean, what other option do we have?

rugbythug
02-16-2013, 10:38 AM
I know that when I am in a quandary regarding a modern issue of ethics, morality and values, I turn to the primitive desert peoples of 2,000 years ago for guidance. I mean, what other option do we have?

Personally I prefer the flavor of the moment that bends to my whimsy no harm in that.

Rohirrim
02-16-2013, 10:57 AM
Personally I prefer the flavor of the moment that bends to my whimsy no harm in that.

I prefer using my own ability to reason based on education, logic and knowledge of science, but hey, whatever floats your boat.

Pontius Pirate
02-16-2013, 11:26 AM
"Christians" who oppose homosexuality because of "what the Bible says" are ridiculous. There are plenty of things the bible says you should and shouldn't do that no one else pays any attention to.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/03/07/13-things-the-bible-forbids_n_1327701.html

Also, as far as I know, Jesus himself never says ANYTHING about homosexuality in the bible so if you're a follower of Christ, I wouldn't be so strong in your opinion when it comes to homosexuality.

errand
02-16-2013, 11:32 AM
When is that due? Everytime I hide in the shipping container bunker buried in the back yard for a week or 2 to see if the 2nd comming is over it turns out nothing happened.

Nobody knows but God Himself.....

I'm thinking someone who said he can't wait for prepubesecent girls to come over for a sleepover should be more worried than you are....but then again He did give us free will.

errand
02-16-2013, 11:36 AM
Also, as far as I know, Jesus himself never says ANYTHING about homosexuality in the bible so if you're a follower of Christ, I wouldn't be so strong in your opinion when it comes to homosexuality.

Jesus is the Son of God......it's the Holy Trinity....you know the Father, Son, and the Holy Ghost....they're one and the same dude.

If you like engaging in homosexual activities, feel free....He gave us all free will.

errand
02-16-2013, 11:42 AM
In the meantime, they'll/you'll do the judging and condemning, just in case God isn't paying attention. Right, got it.

It's not my judgement you clowns need to be worried about.....I don't believe in abortion, but I've never once thought of bombing a clinic that performs them.....just because I think homosexuality is a crap lifestyle doesn't mean I'm out shooting them for fun, or telling them "we don't serve your kind in here"

God is always paying attention, and He will judge mankind.....I just try to do my best to make sure I'm not one of those He condemns to an eternity of pain and suffering. Again, He gave us all free will....we can choose to believe or not.

errand
02-16-2013, 11:52 AM
All sex outside of marriage is a sin. Does not matter if its between a hetero couple or a gay couple.

Exactly....pastors and preachers all speak out against adultery and fornication as well.....but somehow those sermons never seem to make it to the mainstream media outlets.

God will pass judgement on everyone, not just gay people.....He will judge people who judge others (myself included) people who lie, people who steal, murder, covet their neighbor's possessions and wife, people who worship false idols, etc.....nobody knows when that day will come, but when it does, and you haven't repented and asked for His forgiveness, there will be Hell to pay.

I choose to believe this...others choose not to...guess we'll see if it happens in our lifetime.

broncosteven
02-16-2013, 12:30 PM
Jesus is the Son of God......it's the Holy Trinity....you know the Father, Son, and the Holy Ghost....they're one and the same dude.

If you like engaging in homosexual activities, feel free....He gave us all free will.

Something we can agree with, still doesn't mean I want gay guys hitting on me but to each their own if you want to bone a dude or own a gun. Just don't infringe on my liberties.

Tombstone RJ
02-16-2013, 12:54 PM
And people love to pick and choose which bible verses to quote and obey based upon their personal moral compass.

I agree! You can't pick and choose which part of the Bible you are going to follow and which part you are going to ignore. Both religious zealots and those who hate the Bible do the same thing. What you did is an exact sample of taking the Bible out of context to fit an agenda.

Pontius Pirate
02-16-2013, 01:40 PM
Jesus is the Son of God......it's the Holy Trinity....you know the Father, Son, and the Holy Ghost....they're one and the same dude.

If you like engaging in homosexual activities, feel free....He gave us all free will.

OH. That explains it. See, I knew I was missing something. A GHOST. ****, my bad. I always forget the GHOSTS.

Homosexuality is bad because GHOSTS.

rugbythug
02-16-2013, 01:59 PM
I prefer using my own ability to reason based on education, logic and knowledge of science, but hey, whatever floats your boat.

We are saying the same thing. Its nice to set your own rules you always win. Congrats on life.

rugbythug
02-16-2013, 02:00 PM
"Christians" who oppose homosexuality because of "what the Bible says" are ridiculous. There are plenty of things the bible says you should and shouldn't do that no one else pays any attention to.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/03/07/13-things-the-bible-forbids_n_1327701.html

Also, as far as I know, Jesus himself never says ANYTHING about homosexuality in the bible so if you're a follower of Christ, I wouldn't be so strong in your opinion when it comes to homosexuality.

Jesus whoever lusts has already sinned. Bar raised.

BroncsRule
02-16-2013, 02:06 PM
I prefer using my own ability to reason based on education, logic and knowledge of science, but hey, whatever floats your boat.

I usually just pour some bodily fluids on a hot griddle and scry for meaning in the bubbles.

jerseyboiler120
02-16-2013, 03:04 PM
I always find it purely hypocritical when liberals bash anyone who does not support their beliefs. This used to be a free country where one could express oneself; now you can only express ideas and beliefs that fall within certain categories supported by the mainstream media. It's become a sad place to live now.

Gutless Drunk
02-16-2013, 03:43 PM
32084

and so does Tebow, in a self-loathing way (if you know what I mean. and what I mean is there is a chance Tebow likes the cock, but may not know it yet)

Dr. Broncenstein
02-16-2013, 04:06 PM
I always find it purely hypocritical when liberals bash anyone who does not support their beliefs. This used to be a free country where one could express oneself; now you can only express ideas and beliefs that fall within certain categories supported by the mainstream media. It's become a sad place to live now.

You need a progressive exorcism. The power of the Piss Christ compels you.

Requiem
02-16-2013, 04:10 PM
I always find it purely hypocritical when liberals bash anyone who does not support their beliefs. This used to be a free country where one could express oneself; now you can only express ideas and beliefs that fall within certain categories supported by the mainstream media. It's become a sad place to live now.

People who hate on gays, etc. should be bashed.

DenverBrit
02-16-2013, 04:24 PM
I agree! You can't pick and choose which part of the Bible you are going to follow and which part you are going to ignore. Both religious zealots and those who hate the Bible do the same thing. What you did is an exact sample of taking the Bible out of context to fit an agenda.

I quoted verse. ANYONE quoting verse would, by its nature, be taking it out of context. If I do it, I have an agenda, if you do it.....it's preaching gospel?

My point was simple. Why are some 'practices' like slavery ignored, but from exactly the same source, homosexuality a sin?

SonOfLe-loLang
02-16-2013, 04:43 PM
I always find it purely hypocritical when liberals bash anyone who does not support their beliefs. This used to be a free country where one could express oneself; now you can only express ideas and beliefs that fall within certain categories supported by the mainstream media. It's become a sad place to live now.

We don't give a **** what you believe until you start demanding other humans deserve less rights than you.

Tombstone RJ
02-16-2013, 04:50 PM
I quoted verse. ANYONE quoting verse would, by its nature, be taking it out of context. If I do it, I have an agenda, if you do it.....it's preaching gospel?

My point was simple. Why are some 'practices' like slavery ignored, but from exactly the same source, homosexuality a sin?

You are taking a few verses out of the Bible and saying "see, the Bible says slavery is good, see!!" and the Bible does no such thing. It's like me taking one line out of a book, for example, Webster's Dictionary, flip to a page with a word like "Torture", read one line of the definition like "to cause extreme physical or mental pain." and to say "see, this book advocates torture!" Because, look right here on page 1502, it says "to cause extreme physical or mental pain"! So, Webster's Dictionary is ok with this, see!

Nope, it's taking one line completely out of context. It's also missunderstanding the purpose of the book itself.

The Bible is a history book too. This doesn't mean it advocates things like slavery. It's simply telling you about history and then saying "there's a better way."

The very fact I have to explain this to you tells me you have an agenda. Your agenda is to bad mouth the Bible. Your agenda is to make people who believe in the Bible look ignorant and stupid.

But whatever.

bombay
02-16-2013, 05:00 PM
Something we can agree with, still doesn't mean I want gay guys hitting on me but to each their own if you want to bone a dude or own a gun. Just don't infringe on my liberties.


You get hit on by gay guys? That's a peculiar assertion.

rugbythug
02-16-2013, 05:09 PM
32084

and so does Tebow, in a self-loathing way (if you know what I mean. and what I mean is there is a chance Tebow likes the cock, but may not know it yet)

God loves everyone

God hates sin

All sin is equal.

DenverBrit
02-16-2013, 05:18 PM
You are taking a few verses out of the Bible and saying "see, the Bible says slavery is good, see!!" and the Bible does no such thing. It's like me taking one line out of a book, for example, Webster's Dictionary, flip to a page with a word like "Torture", read one line of the definition like "to cause extreme physical or mental pain." and to say "see, this book advocates torture!" Because, look right here on page 1502, it says "to cause extreme physical or mental pain"! So, Webster's Dictionary is ok with this, see!

Nope, it's taking one line completely out of context. It's also missunderstanding the purpose of the book itself.

The Bible is a history book too. This doesn't mean it advocates things like slavery. It's simply telling you about history and then saying "there's a better way."

The very fact I have to explain this to you tells me you have an agenda. Your agenda is to bad mouth the Bible. Your agenda is to make people who believe in the Bible look ignorant and stupid.

But whatever.

Talk about misquoting to serve an agenda. Here is what I actually said. http://www.orangemane.com/BB/showpost.php?p=3797606&postcount=26

And note that SPDirty referenced Bible quotes to justify being 'anti-gay', but that's permissible, because again, it suits your agenda.

I took NOTHING out of context, I quoted Bible verse verbatim......and I could have found much nastier verse.

It's no surprise you're defensive.

Tombstone RJ
02-16-2013, 05:35 PM
Talk about misquoting to serve an agenda. Here is what I actually said. http://www.orangemane.com/BB/showpost.php?p=3797606&postcount=26

And note that SPDirty referenced Bible quotes to justify being 'anti-gay', but that's permissible, because again, it suits your agenda.

I took NOTHING out of context, I quoted Bible verse verbatim......and I could have found much nastier verse.

It's no surprise you're defensive.

Ok, so tell me all about the surrounding passages of these Bible verses please. I want to know breakdown of the all the chapters before these verses, and all the chapters after these verses, and a breakdown of the books from which these verses come from. I also want you to tell me how the verses fit into the larger picture of the entire Bible, from Genesis to Revelation. Please be in depth. And you can't copy and paste someone elses work. You do the work.

I know people is seminary do this. This is why they are in seminary.

I don't for one second think you know what you are talking about. You have an agenda. Your agenda is to purposely missunderstand and then misuse the Bible. Like I said, there's very little difference between you and the person who wants to start a cult based on one or two verses of the Bible that are completely misinterpreted.

DenverBrit
02-16-2013, 06:17 PM
Ok, so tell me all about the surrounding passages of these Bible verses please. I want to know breakdown of the all the chapters before these verses, and all the chapters after these verses, and a breakdown of the books from which these verses come from. I also want you to tell me how the verses fit into the larger picture of the entire Bible, from Genesis to Revelation. Please be in depth. And you can't copy and paste someone elses work. You do the work.

I know people is seminary do this. This is why they are in seminary.

I don't for one second think you know what you are talking about. You have an agenda. Your agenda is to purposely missunderstand and then misuse the Bible. Like I said, there's very little difference between you and the person who wants to start a cult based on one or two verses of the Bible that are completely misinterpreted.

Hilarious!
Yeah, those 15 years at conservative Catholic schools and attending weekly Latin mass at Westminster Cathedral taught me nothing.

The message I was taught was of forgiveness, helping others, loving your fellow man and not being a judgmental a-hole.

ChrisToker
02-16-2013, 06:20 PM
Ok, so tell me all about the surrounding passages of these Bible verses please. I want to know breakdown of the all the chapters before these verses, and all the chapters after these verses, and a breakdown of the books from which these verses come from. I also want you to tell me how the verses fit into the larger picture of the entire Bible, from Genesis to Revelation. Please be in depth. And you can't copy and paste someone elses work. You do the work.

I know people is seminary do this. This is why they are in seminary.

I don't for one second think you know what you are talking about. You have an agenda. Your agenda is to purposely missunderstand and then misuse the Bible. Like I said, there's very little difference between you and the person who wants to start a cult based on one or two verses of the Bible that are completely misinterpreted.

http://clergyproject.org/

Tombstone RJ
02-16-2013, 06:24 PM
Hilarious!
Yeah, those 15 years at conservative Catholic schools and attending weekly Latin mass at Westminster Cathedral taught me nothing.

The message I was taught was of forgiveness, helping others, loving your fellow man and not being a judgmental a-hole.

Being that you are Catholic, you never studied the Bible. You may have gone to mass and sunday school, but you were told what to believe by priets, etc. Again, until you go to seminary or spend some time actually studying the Bible with others who went to seminary you are speaking from ignorance.

I've have grown up around Catholics and for the most part, they are the most ignorant people in the world when it comes to Catholicisim and the Bible.

Tombstone RJ
02-16-2013, 06:32 PM
http://clergyproject.org/

So what? Do you know how many different interpretations of the theory of evolution there are? Just because there are some who have lost faith does not make the Bible any less valid or true.

ChrisToker
02-16-2013, 06:32 PM
Everyone has a right to ones own belief. Technically the only unforgivable sin is blasphemy of the Holly spirit! Which is insane because it's the easiest to do! Most ppl do it a few times just from critical thinking.

errand
02-16-2013, 06:44 PM
People who hate on gays, etc. should be bashed.

Who is hating on them? You got a problem with His word on the matter, take it up with Him when you're dead and He passes judgement on you.

Br0nc0Buster
02-16-2013, 06:45 PM
Everyone has a right to ones own belief. Technically the only unforgivable sin is blasphemy of the Holly spirit! Which is insane because it's the easiest to do! Most ppl do it a few times just from critical thinking.

Is that the same ghost that hates homosexuals?

Saw sinister the other day, starting to get my ghosts mixed up

DenverBrit
02-16-2013, 07:13 PM
Being that you are Catholic, you never studied the Bible. You may have gone to mass and sunday school, but you were told what to believe by priets, etc. Again, until you go to seminary or spend some time actually studying the Bible with others who went to seminary you are speaking from ignorance.

I've have grown up around Catholics and for the most part, they are the most ignorant people in the world when it comes to Catholicisim and the Bible.

So unless one goes to seminary, they have no right to discuss the Bible?

You appear to live in a self righteous, holier-than-though world, and you're welcome to it.

Have a nice evening.

Inkana7
02-16-2013, 07:25 PM
Being that you are Catholic, you never studied the Bible. You may have gone to mass and sunday school, but you were told what to believe by priets, etc. Again, until you go to seminary or spend some time actually studying the Bible with others who went to seminary you are speaking from ignorance.

I've have grown up around Catholics and for the most part, they are the most ignorant people in the world when it comes to Catholicisim and the Bible.

lol

Tombstone RJ
02-17-2013, 12:21 PM
So unless one goes to seminary, they have no right to discuss the Bible?

You appear to live in a self righteous, holier-than-though world, and you're welcome to it.

Have a nice evening.

Nope, never said that. I said you have an agenda and you are misinterpreting and misrepresenting the Bible, that is my point.

Have a great day!

W*GS
02-17-2013, 12:37 PM
Who is hating on them? You got a problem with His word on the matter, take it up with Him when you're dead and He passes judgement on you.

What did Jesus say about homosexuals?

DenverBrit
02-17-2013, 01:31 PM
Nope, never said that. I said you have an agenda and you are misinterpreting and misrepresenting the Bible, that is my point.

Have a great day!

You keep saying this, over and over. So what is my agenda??

Other than asking a simple question that you deliberately ignore. So I'll ask again.

Why is slavery and genocide condoned, but from exactly the same source, homosexuality a sin punishable by death?

BroncoBeavis
02-17-2013, 03:17 PM
You keep saying this, over and over. So what is my agenda??

Other than asking a simple question that you deliberately ignore. So I'll ask again.

All I can tell you is read Acts 15.

W*GS
02-17-2013, 03:22 PM
All I can tell you is read Acts 15.

What did Jesus say about homosexuality?

DenverBrit
02-17-2013, 04:41 PM
All I can tell you is read Acts 15.

Thanks, but could you narrow it down? 1-41?

Pontius Pirate
02-17-2013, 05:43 PM
Who is hating on them? You got a problem with His word on the matter, take it up with Him when you're dead and He passes judgement on you.

Here are some more nuggets from the bible. "The word of the lord" LULZ:

Give beer to those who are perishing - Proverbs
Unicorns will make the land bloody and fat - Isaiah
If your eye isn't working, pluck it out and toss it away - Matthew
Put bad children with snakes - Isaiah
If two men are fighting and one of their wives gets in the way and hits a dude in his genitals, you should cut her hand off - Deuteronomy
If you hit your slave, and he survives, that's okay - Exodus
Random stuff about boiling and eating children - Kings
Bears tearing apart children for making fun of someone - Kings
Fig trees should suffer if they do not bear fruit for the godly - Matthew
Do not get a round haircut or you go to hell - Leviticus
Don't touch or eat pigs (football players - sinners) - Leviticus
Don't talk to psychics - Leviticus
If you pull out, that's still cheating, and you'll die - Genesis
No tattoos bro - Leviticus
You can't wear polyester - Leviticus
You can't get divorced - Mark (this is one all anti-gay zealots adhere to right?)
Eunuchs can not be part of the church - Deuteronomy
You can't braid your hair, wear gold, pearls, or hip clothes - Timothy
You can't eat shellfish - Leviticus
Children who curse their parents should be executed - Exodus
You can't gossip - Leviticus
If you get remarried, you're basically committing adultery - Mark
If you work on Sunday, you should be executed - Exodus
Women: shut up in church dammit - Corinthians
If a woman is not a virgin at marriage, she should be stoned - Deuteronomy


OH YEAH AND NO GAYS BRO

Pontius Pirate
02-17-2013, 05:45 PM
What did Jesus say about homosexuals?

Spoiler alert: Jesus himself never said anything about homosexuality. Some of his homies did, though, and people been yappin' bout it ever since.

BroncoBeavis
02-17-2013, 06:03 PM
Thanks, but could you narrow it down? 1-41?

http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Acts+15&version=NIV

It's really not that long. It's probably best to read it all for the context. But 24-29 gets to why many Christians believe some things apply while others do not.

W*GS
02-17-2013, 06:14 PM
http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Acts+15&version=NIV

It's really not that long. It's probably best to read it all for the context. But 24-29 gets to why many Christians believe some things apply while others do not.

So what makes "sexual immorality" apply but not the meat from strangled animals?

What did Jesus say about homosexuality?

BroncoBeavis
02-17-2013, 10:51 PM
So what makes "sexual immorality" apply but not the meat from strangled animals?

What did Jesus say about homosexuality?

I'm not aware of any widespread practice of eating strangled animals. :p

And it's not coherent to say that anything Jesus never specifically mentioned automatically became fair game.

But casting my interpretation one way or another on this tough issue isn't really my role. I'm just trying to answer (because it was asked) why many Christians consider certain OT prohibitions still in effect while so many others are forgotten.

Bacchus
02-18-2013, 07:53 AM
In the past, Jeffress has claimed that Islam promoted pedophilia (http://tpmmuckraker.talkingpointsmemo.com/2010/09/dallas_pastor_islam_promotes_pedophilia_video.php) , said Judaism "leads people to an eternity of separation from God in hell (http://www.jewishjournal.com/jews_and_mormons/item/evangelicals_bigotry_mormons_--_and_jews_39111009)," and reportedly reduced Catholics, Hindus, Buddhists and others to members of cults (http://www.sltrib.com/ci_10566940). (Jeffress criticized Republican presidential nominee Mitt Romney for his Mormon faith but eventually supported him over Barack Obama, whose reelection he said would "pav(e) the way for the future reign of the Antichrist.") Jeffress denounced the repeal of "Don't Ask, Don't Tell" by observing that (http://thinkprogress.org/politics/2011/10/07/339299/video-prominent-perry-endorser-robert-jeffress-says-voting-for-romney-would-give-credibility-to-a-cult/?mobile=nc) "It's a fact that [AIDS is] a gay disease so there's a reasonable reason to exclude gays from the military.”

Pontius Pirate
02-18-2013, 11:01 AM
I'm not aware of any widespread practice of eating strangled animals. :p

And it's not coherent to say that anything Jesus never specifically mentioned automatically became fair game.

But casting my interpretation one way or another on this tough issue isn't really my role. I'm just trying to answer (because it was asked) why many Christians consider certain OT prohibitions still in effect while so many others are forgotten.

I just read the passage you cited and it doesn't say anything about homosexuality. It just talks about sexual immorality. And that in itself can be all sorts of things that were controversial at the time: adultery, polygamy, sodomy, etc. What we do know, however, is that society has been the one to develop the norm on what is acceptable sexually. And societies differ. Eg. I'm sure in certain parts of Utah, polygamy is still fine AND is accepted in staunchly religious circles. Polygamy itself wasn't even taboo during the time of the bible.

So, your passage doesn't really do anything to back-up why the religious right feels justified in opposing the rights of homosexuals.

DenverBrit
02-18-2013, 01:06 PM
http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Acts+15&version=NIV

It's really not that long. It's probably best to read it all for the context. But 24-29 gets to why many Christians believe some things apply while others do not.

Thanks for narrowing it.

It might explain why some choose to ignore some text, but it is very thin. It's more of a 'suggestion' and says nothing about homophobia.

29 You are to abstain from food sacrificed to idols, from blood, from the meat of strangled animals and from sexual immorality. You will do well to avoid these things.
Farewell.

It leaves out many of the practices that, should have been mentioned as sinful and therefore shunned.
Jesus said nothing about homosexuality and that reinforces the suspicion that homophobia is not a 'Christian' trait, but an Old Testament Evangelical attitude. But even if it isn't that simple, if Church doctrine has decided it is a sin, then fine; keep that attitude within the Church and its followers can abstain their brains out. :)

This Bishop summarizes nicely, of course, he's probably regarded as a heretic by some of the sanctimonious Evangelicals here.

What did Jesus say about homosexuality?

This is the fourth in a series of articles, by The Rt. Rev. V. Gene Robinson, Episcopal Bishop of New Hampshire, and visiting Senior Fellow at the Center for American Progress, Washington, DC, examining the Biblical texts traditionally used to address the issue of homosexuality from a religious (Jewish and Christian) perspective.

What Jesus Says about Homosexuality:

That's right. Jesus is not recorded as having said anything related to intimate sexual relationships between people of the same gender. One has to wonder, if homosexuality is such a heinous sin against God, why does Jesus himself never refer to it? One cannot extrapolate affirmation of such relationships from that silence, but still, why no mention of an issue now causing entire churches to split?

St. Paul's Letter to the Romans

Passages in Paul's epistles to the Romans and Corinthians, as well as a passage from I Timothy are cited by the tradition as condemning homosexuality. A closer look suggests some questions about that traditional understanding.

(A lot of textual context in the link, I have posted only the opening and closing paragraphs)

In short, we are not certain what sexual practices Paul has in mind in this passage. He simply does not tell us. What is clear is that these practices are related to the worship of idols - and clearly not what we are talking about today. Our questions involve a modern understanding of human sexuality in which a small minority of people - by their nature - are affectionally oriented toward people of the same gender, a concept unknown to the ancient mind. And we are not talking about temple prostitutes, but rather two people of the same gender who are drawn into a faithful, monogamous, life-long-intentioned relationship. Not much help here on answering the questions we are asking.

http://onfaith.washingtonpost.com/onfaith/guestvoices/2010/12/what_did_jesus_say_about_homosexuality.html

DenverBrit
02-18-2013, 01:23 PM
I looked at another of the articles in the series, this time dealing with Leviticus.

Enlightening article for those interested as it gets to the root of homophobia among the Evangelical/Fundamentalists .

Homosexuality in Leviticus

By The Rt. Rev. V. Gene Robinson
In practice, we modern day Christians have regarded most of the injunctions in the Holiness Codes of Leviticus and Deuteronomy as culturally bound to the ancient times of the Hebrews--but not binding on us. These same purity codes forbid eating shellfish, planting a field with two different kinds of seed or wearing simultaneously two kinds of cloth. They would prohibit us from ordaining to the priesthood any handicapped person - not to mention women. We cannot, then, isolate these passages about homosexual acts and impute to them the kind of enduring authority which we ascribe to nothing before or after these passages. One has to wonder why the biblical literalists who cite this passage against homosexuality don't seem to go all the way and advocate for death as the punishment for homosexual behavior! We cannot have it both ways.

http://onfaith.washingtonpost.com/onfaith/guestvoices/2010/12/homosexuality_in_leviticus.html

Tombstone RJ
02-18-2013, 03:50 PM
You keep saying this, over and over. So what is my agenda??

Other than asking a simple question that you deliberately ignore. So I'll ask again.

Again, what is the context? Please refer to post #95.

Tombstone RJ
02-18-2013, 03:55 PM
lol. Jesus didn't specifically address many, many, many things. That does not mean He is ok with it. Jesus didn't say anything about beastiality either.

Pontius Pirate
02-19-2013, 09:59 AM
lol. Jesus didn't specifically address many, many, many things. That does not mean He is ok with it. Jesus didn't say anything about beastiality either.

And yet the church feels a need to trumpet the bible as their "proof" that God is not okay with homosexuality and use that proof as their defense in witholding societal rights that all other protected classes have.

Meanwhile: adultery, divorce, alcoholism, and the growing gap between the rich & poor (very CLEAR things that the bible says are not okay) fly under the radar of the religious right.....sorry, I mean the religious right PRACTICES all those things.

BroncoBeavis
02-19-2013, 10:49 AM
Thanks for narrowing it.

It might explain why some choose to ignore some text, but it is very thin. It's more of a 'suggestion' and says nothing about homophobia.

Not sure if you really mean homophobia, or if you meant homosexuality here. If you mean homophobia, I think you're right. But being afraid of anything/anyone wasn't really Jesus' style, and I think he'd obviously preach against irrational fear and/or shunning anyone just because they practice something you don't agree with.

As for the rest, you have to think through Jesus' teaching as a whole, in addition to the understanding of his day. Homosexuality was pretty universally condemned back in those days, and Jesus didn't spend a ton of time being Captain Obvious and restating things which everyone pretty much already believed.

He was on record drawing a very hard line on adultery, which almost nobody meets (myself included) And in Matthew 19 he reiterates Genesis in regards to God joining one man and one woman.

In this context, and the context of the prevailing wisdom of the time he lived, it's ridiculous to think that Jesus would've bothered saying anything about homosexuality, unless he thought something was wrong with that prevailing wisdom. Or thought about another way, when Acts talks about sexual immorality, that should be taken as immorality as they would've defined it. Not how society decides to define it on any given day.

If the fact that Jesus was silent on this is evidence of anything, it's evidence of the opposite of what you're saying. But in my thinking, Jesus tended to preach on what he encountered. It's hard to imagine him running into that situation, considering the sexually-reserved (repressed? :)) nature of the culture he lived in.

BroncoBeavis
02-19-2013, 11:09 AM
And since you bolded You will do well to avoid these things.

I think you are correct in a sense. Unlike some people, I don't believe homosexuality, or eating "strangled" meat (now that I thinka bout it maybe that was just code for a BJ :) ) is going to necessarily see anyone turned away at the gate. It shouldn't, any more than some of my sexually immoral (adulterous) thoughts should keep me away. We all fall short.

Which is maybe why I tend to be a Sola fide guy.

TonyR
02-20-2013, 07:41 AM
http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/story/21726884/agreeing-to-speak-at-intolerant-church-is-tebows-greatest-sin

http://www.grantland.com/story/_/id/7369021/fair-game

DenverBrit
02-20-2013, 08:00 AM
Not sure if you really mean homophobia, or if you meant homosexuality here. If you mean homophobia, I think you're right. But being afraid of anything/anyone wasn't really Jesus' style, and I think he'd obviously preach against irrational fear and/or shunning anyone just because they practice something you don't agree with.

As for the rest, you have to think through Jesus' teaching as a whole, in addition to the understanding of his day. Homosexuality was pretty universally condemned back in those days, and Jesus didn't spend a ton of time being Captain Obvious and restating things which everyone pretty much already believed.

He was on record drawing a very hard line on adultery, which almost nobody meets (myself included) And in Matthew 19 he reiterates Genesis in regards to God joining one man and one woman.

In this context, and the context of the prevailing wisdom of the time he lived, it's ridiculous to think that Jesus would've bothered saying anything about homosexuality, unless he thought something was wrong with that prevailing wisdom. Or thought about another way, when Acts talks about sexual immorality, that should be taken as immorality as they would've defined it. Not how society decides to define it on any given day.

If the fact that Jesus was silent on this is evidence of anything, it's evidence of the opposite of what you're saying. But in my thinking, Jesus tended to preach on what he encountered. It's hard to imagine him running into that situation, considering the sexually-reserved (repressed? :)) nature of the culture he lived in.

I did mean homophobia as I was looking for a source that would explain the uncompromising and, IMO, un-Christian intolerance and bigotry. And as the Bishop's article I posted suggests, it's mainly Leviticus, a source that is selectively quoted to suit personal moral agendas, and in some cases hate.
. One has to wonder why the biblical literalists who cite this passage against homosexuality don't seem to go all the way and advocate for death as the punishment for homosexual behavior! We cannot have it both ways.

Anyway, back to Tebow and the Church he has chosen.
There can be no doubt that Tebow is fully aware of the homophobic views of this pastor, every public move he makes is carefully orchestrated.

We should all be disappointed that he supports this bigotry.

DenverBrit
02-20-2013, 08:05 AM
And since you bolded

I think you are correct in a sense. Unlike some people, I don't believe homosexuality, or eating "strangled" meat (now that I thinka bout it maybe that was just code for a BJ :) ) is going to necessarily see anyone turned away at the gate. It shouldn't, any more than some of my sexually immoral (adulterous) thoughts should keep me away. We all fall short.

Which is maybe why I tend to be a Sola fide guy.

:P

https://encrypted-tbn2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRykOIIkKNFvUVJjkhK0H2snQoJiHiMO lta2HHLOrs51EBbGAqcbA

DenverBrit
02-20-2013, 08:08 AM
http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/story/21726884/agreeing-to-speak-at-intolerant-church-is-tebows-greatest-sin

http://www.grantland.com/story/_/id/7369021/fair-game

The CBS report really nails it.

Tebow and his 'handlers' have made a huge mistake.

BroncoBeavis
02-20-2013, 08:32 AM
I did mean homophobia as I was looking for a source that would explain the uncompromising and, IMO, un-Christian intolerance and bigotry. And as the Bishop's article I posted suggests, it's mainly Leviticus, a source that is selectively quoted to suit personal moral agendas, and in some cases hate.
.

Anyway, back to Tebow and the Church he has chosen.
There can be no doubt that Tebow is fully aware of the homophobic views of this pastor, every public move he makes is carefully orchestrated.

We should all be disappointed that he supports this bigotry.

I'm not sure you really get the conflict between your first and second statements. I agree with the first part. And for many of the same reasons, I disagree with the second.

DenverBrit
02-20-2013, 08:40 AM
I'm not sure you really get the conflict between your first and second statements. I agree with the first part. And for many of the same reasons, I disagree with the second.

Fair enough, but could you bold the two statements, I counted four.

BroncoBeavis
02-20-2013, 08:50 AM
Fair enough, but could you bold the two statements, I counted four.

I'll paraphrase in that first you say intolerance is unchristian, but then that anyone you don't agree with should be blacklisted and shunned.

First, a Christian should be willing to share his faith with anyone. Regardless of who they are, or what they've done. Funny thing is Tebow could go to death row and talk to the inmates, and nobody would have any issue with it. That's how ridiculous this rift has become.

Second, simply speaking to a Church does not indicate support for any or all of their doctrine. You can't even assume someone that attends the church necessarily supports everything it preaches. I thought we learned that in 2008. :)

DenverBrit
02-20-2013, 09:04 AM
I'll paraphrase in that first you say intolerance is unchristian, but then that anyone you don't agree with should be blacklisted and shunned.

First, a Christian should be willing to share his faith with anyone. Regardless of who they are, or what they've done. Funny thing is Tebow could go to death row and talk to the inmates, and nobody would have any issue with it. That's how ridiculous this rift has become.

Second, simply speaking to a Church does not indicate support for any or all of their doctrine. You can't even assume someone that attends the church necessarily supports everything it preaches. I thought we learned that in 2008. :)

You'll have to post my comments that make this statement.

BroncoBeavis
02-20-2013, 09:47 AM
You'll have to post my comments that make this statement.

Seems self-explanatory. On what basis should Tim Tebow, as a Christian, refuse an invitation to speak at this church (as opposed to any other church)?

peacepipe
02-20-2013, 09:50 AM
Seems self-explanatory. On what basis should Tim Tebow, as a Christian, refuse an invitation to speak at this church (as opposed to any other church)?

Outside of the extreme hate speech that comes out of this church,nothing.

BroncoBeavis
02-20-2013, 10:06 AM
Outside of the extreme hate speech that comes out of this church,nothing.

Do you think Christ refused to preach to anyone, regardless of what they believed? This concept of "I'm not going to talk to you because I'm better than that" is anything but Christian.

peacepipe
02-20-2013, 10:13 AM
Do you think Christ refused to preach to anyone, regardless of what they believed? This concept of "I'm not going to talk to you because I'm better than that" is anything but Christian.

Christ preached inclusion of all people,not something this church represents.

DenverBrit
02-20-2013, 10:40 AM
Seems self-explanatory. On what basis should Tim Tebow, as a Christian, refuse an invitation to speak at this church (as opposed to any other church)?

Oh, maybe because the pastor is a homophobe and a bigot and Tebow validates the man by speaking there. I thought Tebow better than that. And make no mistake, Tebow knows exactly what Jeffress stands for.

If Tebow were to speak at a KKK or White Supremacist meeting, I'd feel much the same way. Don't!

But that is a long way from your accusation:

but then that anyone you don't agree with should be blacklisted and shunned.

If your asking do I think bigots, homophobes, racists, xenophobes should be 'shunned'?

Yes, don't you??

cutthemdown
02-20-2013, 10:48 AM
Oh, maybe because the pastor is a homophobe and a bigot and Tebow validates the man by speaking there. I thought Tebow better than that. And make no mistake, Tebow knows exactly what Jeffress stands for.

If Tebow were to speak at a KKK or White Supremacist meeting, I'd feel much the same way. Don't!

But that is a long way from your accusation:



If your asking do I think bigots, homophobes, racists, xenophobes should be 'shunned'?

Yes, don't you??

So if someone speaks somewhere then they get all the beliefs of that organization pinned to them?

BroncoBeavis
02-20-2013, 11:10 AM
But that is a long way from your accusation:



If your asking do I think bigots, homophobes, racists, xenophobes should be 'shunned'?

Yes, don't you??

Cool. In three sentences, you renounce my "accusation" and then accept it. :)

Jesus dealt with all of the above. And prostitutes. Criminals. Cheats. Tax collectors. etc etc. He shunned no one. Only the world worries about what other people think about it.

BroncoBeavis
02-20-2013, 11:13 AM
So if someone speaks somewhere then they get all the beliefs of that organization pinned to them?

"The Government Lied about Pearl Harbor"

-President Obama, via his church. LOL

BroncoBeavis
02-20-2013, 11:20 AM
"The Holocaust is a Hoax"

-President Obama via his Cairo speech to Muslim Brotherhood members. LOL

DenverBrit
02-20-2013, 11:37 AM
So if someone speaks somewhere then they get all the beliefs of that organization pinned to them?


You're generalizing, be specific.

DenverBrit
02-20-2013, 11:40 AM
Cool. In three sentences, you renounce my "accusation" and then accept it. :)

Jesus dealt with all of the above. And prostitutes. Criminals. Cheats. Tax collectors. etc etc. He shunned no one. Only the world worries about what other people think about it.

I asked you a question as you have 'personalized' the conversation.

Do you shun, bigots, homophobes, racists, xenophobes?

In case 'shun' isn't understood:

shun [ʃʌn]
vb shuns, shunning, shunned
(tr) to avoid deliberately; keep away from

BroncoBeavis
02-20-2013, 11:50 AM
I asked you a question as you have 'personalized' the conversation.

Do you shun, bigots, homophobes, racists, xenophobes?

In case 'shun' isn't understood:

I'm sure I do to some extent. Everyone 'shuns' others they're not comfortable with on some level. But that's not the Christian side of BroncoBeavis talking. :) And in the context of faith, if I was given an invitation to speak from the heart about my faith to anyone, no matter how twisted or depraved (the people, not the faith :) ) I'd feel guilty if I refused to do so. No matter who it was. The Klan. NAMBLA. Lesbian Nazi Hookers' Alliance. Planned Parenthood. :)

Anyone.

Bacchus
02-20-2013, 12:56 PM
I'm sure I do to some extent. Everyone 'shuns' others they're not comfortable with on some level. But that's not the Christian side of BroncoBeavis talking. :) And in the context of faith, if I was given an invitation to speak from the heart about my faith to anyone, no matter how twisted or depraved (the people, not the faith :) ) I'd feel guilty if I refused to do so. No matter who it was. The Klan. NAMBLA. Lesbian Nazi Hookers' Alliance. Planned Parenthood. :)

Anyone.

So if a there was a clan rally and they wanted you to come and be the first speaker to talk about your race you would do it? You would feel honored?

BroncoBeavis
02-20-2013, 01:08 PM
So if a there was a clan rally and they wanted you to come and be the first speaker to talk about your race you would do it? You would feel honored?

Race? I think you're missing something here.

DenverBrit
02-21-2013, 09:10 AM
I'm sure I do to some extent. Everyone 'shuns' others they're not comfortable with on some level. But that's not the Christian side of BroncoBeavis talking. :) And in the context of faith, if I was given an invitation to speak from the heart about my faith to anyone, no matter how twisted or depraved (the people, not the faith :) ) I'd feel guilty if I refused to do so. No matter who it was. The Klan. NAMBLA. Lesbian Nazi Hookers' Alliance. Planned Parenthood. :)

Anyone.

Well Timmy was smart enough to 'shun' the Church, and that probably IS the 'Christian side of Timmy talking. :)

Tim Tebow cancels speech at church

Tebow posted a series of tweets Thursday: "While I was looking forward to sharing a message of hope and Christ's unconditional love with the faithful members of the historic First Baptist Church of Dallas in April, due to new information that has been brought to my attention, I have decided to cancel my upcoming appearance. I will continue to use the platform God has blessed me with to bring Faith, Hope and Love to all those needing a brighter day. Thank you for all of your love and support. God Bless!"

Bacchus
02-21-2013, 01:06 PM
Well Timmy was smart enough to 'shun' the Church, and that probably IS the 'Christian side of Timmy talking. :)

Tim Tebow cancels speech at church

DALLAS (AP) -- New York Jets quarterback Tim Tebow has backed out of an appearance at a Baptist mega church in Dallas run by a pastor who has created controversy with his remarks about gays and other faiths.

Tebow tweeted Thursday that he canceled a scheduled April 28 appearance at First Baptist Church due to ''new information that has been brought to my attention.''

''I will continue to use the platform God has blessed me with to bring Faith, Hope and Love to all those needing a brighter day,'' Tebow wrote.

The Rev. Robert Jeffress, First Baptist's pastor, confirmed in a phone interview that Tebow called him Wednesday night to cancel.

Jeffress said Tebow told him he would like to speak at First Baptist at some point, but ''he needed to avoid controversy right now for personal and professional reasons.''

Jeffress has preached that gay sex is sinful, Mormonism is a cult and Islam promotes violence and pedophilia. He said Thursday that First Baptist was being mischaracterized as a ''hate church,'' and that the church's teachings were consistent with historic Christian beliefs.

Tebow wasn't going to speak about anything controversial, Jeffress said.

DenverBrit
02-21-2013, 03:56 PM
DALLAS (AP) -- New York Jets quarterback Tim Tebow has backed out of an appearance at a Baptist mega church in Dallas run by a pastor who has created controversy with his remarks about gays and other faiths.

Tebow tweeted Thursday that he canceled a scheduled April 28 appearance at First Baptist Church due to ''new information that has been brought to my attention.''

''I will continue to use the platform God has blessed me with to bring Faith, Hope and Love to all those needing a brighter day,'' Tebow wrote.

The Rev. Robert Jeffress, First Baptist's pastor, confirmed in a phone interview that Tebow called him Wednesday night to cancel.

Jeffress said Tebow told him he would like to speak at First Baptist at some point, but ''he needed to avoid controversy right now for personal and professional reasons.''

Jeffress has preached that gay sex is sinful, Mormonism is a cult and Islam promotes violence and pedophilia. He said Thursday that First Baptist was being mischaracterized as a ''hate church,'' and that the church's teachings were consistent with historic Christian beliefs.

Tebow wasn't going to speak about anything controversial, Jeffress said.

More of a business/PR decision than repudiating the bigotry?

nyuk nyuk
02-21-2013, 04:31 PM
Rest of article: http://offthebench.nbcsports.com/2013/02/14/tim-tebow-to-speak-at-virulently-anti-gay-anti-semitic-dallas-megachurch/related/

Glad to see NBC using such neutral language in their reporting, thus living up to the standards of ethics we've come to trust from journalists.

nyuk nyuk
02-21-2013, 04:32 PM
More of a business/PR decision than repudiating the bigotry?

Why is it only "bigotry" when THEY say it?

Haven't I asked you and yours about speaking beyond simplistic labels before?

Why don't you ever call Jews and Muslims "bigots" for having the same views about homosexuality?

DenverBrit
02-21-2013, 04:46 PM
Why is it only "bigotry" when THEY say it?

Haven't I asked you and yours about speaking beyond simplistic labels before?

Why don't you ever call Jews and Muslims "bigots" for having the same views about homosexuality?


Start a thread about it and I will.

This thread is about Tebow and his decisions, try and keep up.

nyuk nyuk
02-21-2013, 04:50 PM
Start a thread about it and I will.

This thread is about Tebow and his decisions, try and keep up.

This thread is about selective attacks on Christians, actually. And your selective moral turd-spatter only proves the point.

I'm still waiting for libs to mass together and attack Jews and Muslims for this. It's as if you sit quietly, lying in wait for a WHITE CHRISTIAN to do it and then you spring out like a Jack in the Box.

You understand that kind of behavior speaks volumes about your own, right?

DenverBrit
02-21-2013, 04:58 PM
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_rIZfaHBJWHE/R1Bt0xrVIxI/AAAAAAAADMM/h7AklYRBvoU/s1600-R/Seagulls+yapping.gif

nyuk nyuk
02-21-2013, 05:00 PM
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_rIZfaHBJWHE/R1Bt0xrVIxI/AAAAAAAADMM/h7AklYRBvoU/s1600-R/Seagulls+yapping.gif

Yes, I can't hear a thing. My point exactly.

BroncoBeavis
02-22-2013, 09:22 AM
More of a business/PR decision than repudiating the bigotry?

As I've said, repudiation (ie locking people in a closet to be forgotten) has no value to Christ.

I think Tim's trying to balance the effect the irrational spittle-sprinklers might have at this moment on his career (and by extension, his ministry) That CBS article posted earlier was honestly shameless. But I'd still be perfectly fine with him speaking to that (or any) group. The only thing that matters is what he says to them. I think he could do a lot of good there. But it's totally his call as to whether now is the right time or not.

Bacchus
02-22-2013, 10:56 AM
This thread is about selective attacks on Christians, actually. And your selective moral turd-spatter only proves the point.

I'm still waiting for libs to mass together and attack Jews and Muslims for this. It's as if you sit quietly, lying in wait for a WHITE CHRISTIAN to do it and then you spring out like a Jack in the Box.

You understand that kind of behavior speaks volumes about your own, right?

Jews, Muslims, Christians, Mormons they are all the same.

DenverBrit
02-22-2013, 10:57 AM
As I've said, repudiation (ie locking people in a closet to be forgotten) has no value to Christ.

I think Tim's trying to balance the effect the irrational spittle-sprinklers might have at this moment on his career (and by extension, his ministry) That CBS article posted earlier was honestly shameless. But I'd still be perfectly fine with him speaking to that (or any) group. The only thing that matters is what he says to them. I think he could do a lot of good there. But it's totally his call as to whether now is the right time or not.

I agree.

Had he intended to speak, in some way, about toning down the vitriol coming from that ministry, he would be doing that congregation and his ministry a service. As he will likely speak at a later date, we'll know for sure.

DenverBrit
02-22-2013, 11:05 AM
Jews, Muslims, Christians, Mormons they are all the same.

Our resident harpie has so little faith, she has to attack anyone who would suggest bigotry is present amongst some Christians.

Personally, I find bigotry comes from all factions, regardless their religious beliefs.

Some keep it personal and others preach it from their respective, literal and metaphorical, 'pulpits.'

Bacchus
02-22-2013, 11:10 AM
Our resident harpie has so little faith, she has to attack anyone who would suggest bigotry is present amongst some Christians.

Personally, I find bigotry comes from all factions, regardless their religious beliefs.

Some keep it personal and others preach it from their respective, literal and metaphorical, 'pulpits.'

Every religion thinks there's is the best and will kill, lie, cheat, plunder and steal to prove it.

Buddhists are cool though.

cutthemdown
02-22-2013, 11:44 AM
You're generalizing, be specific.

No i am not I am asking a straight question. If a person goes to give a speech at an organization does that mean he should have to have all their beliefs assigned to him. Or does it mean he is accepting of their positions?

cutthemdown
02-22-2013, 11:47 AM
People realize the word bigot can mean anyone who lets stereotypes make them intolerant of another group? Hell if you believe things like Republicans only care about themselves, then go out and call repubs evil greedy white loving bitches, you are now a bigot strictly speaking.

houghtam
02-22-2013, 11:49 AM
No i am not I am asking a straight question. If a person goes to give a speech at an organization does that mean he should have to have all their beliefs assigned to him. Or does it mean he is accepting of their positions?

You're talking about an organization. We're talking about a church. A church which teaches there is no grey area in sin, and that if you're not with us you're against us. That seems like all or nothing to me.

BroncoBeavis
02-22-2013, 11:55 AM
and that if you're not with us you're against us.

Yeah, there's no way that kind of thinking could ever be used in a political sense. :)

houghtam
02-22-2013, 12:06 PM
Yeah, there's no way that kind of thinking could ever be used in a political sense. :)

You're not really doing your own argument any favors by saying this.

And yes, I suppose it "could be used" politically. The Bible preaches it.

cutthemdown
02-22-2013, 12:13 PM
You're talking about an organization. We're talking about a church. A church which teaches there is no grey area in sin, and that if you're not with us you're against us. That seems like all or nothing to me.

A church is an organization.

houghtam
02-22-2013, 12:22 PM
A church is an organization.

Eyeroll.

If you really need me to explain to you what that meant, you're ignorant, willfully or otherwise.

But sure, I'll do it for you: most secular organizations don't take policy from a book that says if you're not with us you're against us, so yes, there is a different standard, and rightfully so.

Anyone claiming they are 100% right deserves to be held to that standard.

DenverBrit
02-22-2013, 12:48 PM
No i am not I am asking a straight question. If a person goes to give a speech at an organization does that mean he should have to have all their beliefs assigned to him. Or does it mean he is accepting of their positions?

If a person goes to a KKK rally and talks about the joys of cross burning, yes!!

If a person goes to westboro baptist church and tells them how ****ing wrong they are, no!!

It's not going that endorses, it's what they say that matters.

houghtam
02-22-2013, 01:04 PM
If a person goes to a KKK rally and talks about the joys of cross burning, yes!!

If a person goes to westboro baptist church and tells them how ****ing wrong they are, no!!

It's not going that endorses, it's what they say that matters.

Somewhat.

But IMO if he goes to this church and does anything less than call them out on their treatment of certain groups, he's not being Christ-like.

I believe if Christ were invited to a church (excuse me, organization) like this, he would have called them all Christian Pharisees and repudiated everything they stood for. He wouldn't stand up there and give a speech about loving your neighbor and not make mention of the manner in which they're "loving" theirs. That's not the Jesus that exists in any Bible I've ever read.

And I'm not going back over my qualifications on the subject. They're quite well documented.

BroncoBeavis
02-22-2013, 01:09 PM
You're not really doing your own argument any favors by saying this.

And yes, I suppose it "could be used" politically. The Bible preaches it.

The Bible teaches many things in different contexts. Some people confuse its teachings about what mankind deserves with those that teach us about all that we've been given.

But like I said earlier, it's hard to argue specifics over generalities.

BroncoBeavis
02-22-2013, 01:12 PM
Somewhat.

But IMO if he goes to this church and does anything less than call them out on their treatment of certain groups, he's not being Christ-like.

I believe if Christ were invited to a church (excuse me, organization) like this, he would have called them all Christian Pharisees and repudiated everything they stood for. He wouldn't stand up there and give a speech about loving your neighbor and not make mention of the manner in which they're "loving" theirs. That's not the Jesus that exists in any Bible I've ever read.

And I'm not going back over my qualifications on the subject. They're quite well documented.

The Pharisees were also very good at casting judgement upon Christ before he was even able to speak for himself. Often based on the people he allowed himself to be seen with.

DenverBrit
02-22-2013, 01:52 PM
Somewhat.

But IMO if he goes to this church and does anything less than call them out on their treatment of certain groups, he's not being Christ-like.

I believe if Christ were invited to a church (excuse me, organization) like this, he would have called them all Christian Pharisees and repudiated everything they stood for. He wouldn't stand up there and give a speech about loving your neighbor and not make mention of the manner in which they're "loving" theirs. That's not the Jesus that exists in any Bible I've ever read.

And I'm not going back over my qualifications on the subject. They're quite well documented.

Somehow, I don't see that happening, though I'd like to be wrong.

I had read that he was to receive a large fee for speaking there, it's doubtful he will bite the hand that feeds him. Backing off now, probably had more to do with finding a new NFL team.

Wasn't going to happen had he not 'postponed'........and regardless, the damage is done and may prove to be the end of his NFL 'adventure.'

BroncoBeavis
02-22-2013, 02:03 PM
Wasn't going to happen had he not 'postponed'........and regardless, the damage is done and may prove to be the end of his NFL 'adventure.'

That's a touch convenient. Before you would've said he was done because he couldn't play the game of football. Now it's because he's not lock-step with your sense of decorum?

If he makes it or not, this nifty bit of media manufacture has nothing to do with it.

DenverBrit
02-22-2013, 02:55 PM
That's a touch convenient. Before you would've said he was done because he couldn't play the game of football. Now it's because he's not lock-step with your sense of decorum?

If he makes it or not, this nifty bit of media manufacture has nothing to do with it.

It's interesting that you think you know what I 'would have said.' You're wrong. I think he can be a football player, just not a QB and when did I say he was done?

However, take all of his liabilities.....can't play QB at the NFL level, the circus that loudly follows him and now the controversy of his speaking engagement at a church regarded as bigoted.

IMO, It's now unlikely an NFL team will sign him......and his chances before were already slim to nil. It's a 'tipping point' and I think he may have reached it.

If you think otherwise, say so. Because, unlike you, I don't pretend to know what someone is thinking.

TonyR
02-22-2013, 03:07 PM
If a person goes to give a speech at an organization does that mean he should have to have all their beliefs assigned to him. Or does it mean he is accepting of their positions?

If he went there and just gave a nice talk then he'd pretty much be legitimizing, if not outright endorsing, them and their beliefs. Which is clearly why he backed out, because that's what he was planning to do and he didn't realize how much backlash there was going to be.

BroncoBeavis
02-22-2013, 04:32 PM
It's interesting that you think you know what I 'would have said.' You're wrong. I think he can be a football player, just not a QB and when did I say he was done?

However, take all of his liabilities.....can't play QB at the NFL level, the circus that loudly follows him and now the controversy of his speaking engagement at a church regarded as bigoted.

IMO, It's now unlikely an NFL team will sign him......and his chances before were already slim to nil. It's a 'tipping point' and I think he may have reached it.

If you think otherwise, say so. Because, unlike you, I don't pretend to know what someone is thinking.

Ok, so let's get more specific then. Which team do you think might've looked at Tim, but is now having a backroom conversation to the effect of "Well, I would've liked to have seen what he could do, but then I heard he almost talked to this one hardcore fundie Church in Dallas, so no dice. I'm out." :)

BroncoBeavis
02-22-2013, 04:35 PM
If he went there and just gave a nice talk then he'd pretty much be legitimizing, if not outright endorsing, them and their beliefs. Which is clearly why he backed out, because that's what he was planning to do and he didn't realize how much backlash there was going to be.

This is cool. So because President Obama didn't specifically renounce Holocaust Denial when he spoke to the Muslim Brotherhood in Egypt, he actually legitimized it. Good to know.

DenverBrit
02-22-2013, 05:39 PM
Ok, so let's get more specific then. Which team do you think might've looked at Tim, but is now having a backroom conversation to the effect of "Well, I would've liked to have seen what he could do, but then I heard he almost talked to this one hardcore fundie Church in Dallas, so no dice. I'm out." :)

You have too much time on your hands.

cutthemdown
02-22-2013, 06:04 PM
If a person goes to a KKK rally and talks about the joys of cross burning, yes!!

If a person goes to westboro baptist church and tells them how ****ing wrong they are, no!!

It's not going that endorses, it's what they say that matters.

LOL your not answering. What if all tebow did was say the same things he always does and doesn't talk at all about gay issues? Things aren't as easy as you try and make them. By using the Westboro church you picked the most outlandish ridiculous one you have ever heard of. How is that being reasonable? KKK and Westboro Church are your two examples. Wow don't go trying to be too reasonable now.

I like you answer though its your intent that always matter and what should be judged. People got pissed at tebow before he even went. He never got a chance to speak to them. All this sort of thing does is drive people further apart but I realize you don't see it that way.

TonyR
02-22-2013, 06:09 PM
This is cool. So because President Obama didn't specifically renounce Holocaust Denial when he spoke to the Muslim Brotherhood in Egypt, he actually legitimized it. Good to know.

Totally different scenario and circumstances. Stupid, terrible comparison.

DenverBrit
02-22-2013, 10:29 PM
LOL your not answering. What if all tebow did was say the same things he always does and doesn't talk at all about gay issues? Things aren't as easy as you try and make them. By using the Westboro church you picked the most outlandish ridiculous one you have ever heard of. How is that being reasonable? KKK and Westboro Church are your two examples. Wow don't go trying to be too reasonable now.

I like you answer though its your intent that always matter and what should be judged. People got pissed at tebow before he even went. He never got a chance to speak to them. All this sort of thing does is drive people further apart but I realize you don't see it that way.

Of course I did. And too the point. You didn't like the Organizations I picked?? Tough luck.

I asked you to be specific. Here's your question.

If a person goes to give a speech at an organization does that mean he should have to have all their beliefs assigned to him. Or does it mean he is accepting of their positions?

ADD much?? Ha!

BroncoBeavis
02-22-2013, 11:14 PM
Totally different scenario and circumstances. Stupid, terrible comparison.

True. On the one hand you have to worry about the soul of each person in attendance. The other was just a meaningless political photo op. Not much to compare. :)

TonyR
02-23-2013, 09:11 AM
True...

Once again you're not as stupid as you're letting on. What you are is disingenuous. You're comparing a speech directly to an church/organization vs. a speech where a small group of an organizations members attended a speech. If you can't see or understand the distinction then there's really no point arguing with you about it any more.

nyuk nyuk
02-23-2013, 11:54 AM
This is about the PC hordes thought policing and persecuting anyone they don't like. Nothing more, nothing less.

W*GS
02-23-2013, 11:56 AM
This is about the PC hordes thought policing and persecuting anyone they don't like. Nothing more, nothing less.

Yep - straight folks are so persecuted these days - especially the ones who fear, hate, and loathe homosexuals.

nyuk nyuk
02-23-2013, 11:57 AM
Love the sinner and hate the sin.

I'll be damned why secular liberals keep quoting Gandhi when the topic is Christianity.

Apparently they're ignorant enough to think it's from the Bible or something.

nyuk nyuk
02-23-2013, 11:59 AM
Yep - straight folks are so persecuted these days - especially the ones who fear, hate, and loathe homosexuals.

Anyone who doesn't agree with the left coalition is persecuted, and this thread is an example of that. The "tolerance" crowd are quick to attack anyone that says things they don't like, thus rendering the concept of their "tolerance" a total sham.

Anyone who thinks gays are "persecuted" has their head up their ass. Disagreement with does not equal persecution. That's something you and yours need to get pounded into your little empty skulls.

DenverBrit
02-23-2013, 12:06 PM
I'll be damned why secular liberals keep quoting Gandhi when the topic is Christianity.

Apparently they're ignorant enough to think it's from the Bible or something.



“I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ.”

― Mahatma Gandhi

DenverBrit
02-23-2013, 12:14 PM
“To be a Christian means to forgive the inexcusable because God has forgiven the inexcusable in you.”
― C.S. Lewis

DenverBrit
02-23-2013, 12:15 PM
“The Christian ideal has not been tried and found wanting. It has been found difficult; and left untried.”
― G.K. Chesterton,

“The Bible has noble poetry in it... and some good morals and a wealth of obscenity, and upwards of a thousand lies.”
― Mark Twain

“The word 'God' is for me nothing more than the expression and product of human weaknesses, and religious scripture a collection of honourable, but still primitive legends which are nevertheless pretty childish. No interpretation, no matter how subtle, can (for me) change this.”
― Albert Einstein

“If Christ were here there is one thing he would not be—a Christian.”
― Mark Twain,

W*GS
02-23-2013, 12:19 PM
Anyone who doesn't agree with the left coalition is persecuted

How? By being told that you're an idiot and full of ****? You poor poor baby. Did your wittle feewings get hurted?

Compared to how the right coalition does indeed persecute people, you're getting off easy.

Anyone who thinks gays are "persecuted" has their head up their ass. Disagreement with does not equal persecution. That's something you and yours need to get pounded into your little empty skulls.

You'd say that gays weren't being persecuted as long as they weren't being rounded up and executed.

STFU.

TonyR
02-23-2013, 12:20 PM
Anyone who doesn't agree with the left coalition is persecuted, and this thread is an example of that. The "tolerance" crowd are quick to attack anyone that says things they don't like, thus rendering the concept of their "tolerance" a total sham.

Anyone who thinks gays are "persecuted" has their head up their ass. Disagreement with does not equal persecution. That's something you and yours need to get pounded into your little empty skulls.

So then can we put you officially on the record as being in support of Robert Jeffress and his teachings?

nyuk nyuk
02-23-2013, 12:24 PM
How? By being told that you're an idiot and full of ****? You poor poor baby. Did your wittle feewings get hurted?

LOL what? Calling names isn't an argument, so why would that hurt my feelings? All that does is display to everyone that you're incapable of anything else.

Compared to how the right coalition does indeed persecute people, you're getting off easy.

I think I already said disagreement doesn't equal persecution. Are these two words too large for you at this stage in your life?


You'd say that gays weren't being persecuted as long as they weren't being rounded up and executed.

STFU.

Last time I heard of that happening was in enlightened, Socialist, leftist Cuba. What does that have to do with Tim Tebow or American Christians?

Right - nothing. You're reaching, to put it mildly.

:~ohyah!::rofl:

nyuk nyuk
02-23-2013, 12:25 PM
So then can we put you officially on the record as being in support of Robert Jeffress and his teachings?

False dichotomy in action.

If I have the audacity to say that disagreement doesn't equal persecution, then in your eyes I am "one of those."

Try again.

TonyR
02-23-2013, 12:28 PM
Try again.

Answer the question. Do you agree or disagree with the teachings of Jeffress? Simple question that even a simple person like you should be able to answer. Time to man up.

nyuk nyuk
02-23-2013, 12:28 PM
“The Christian ideal has not been tried and found wanting. It has been found difficult; and left untried.”
― G.K. Chesterton,

“The Bible has noble poetry in it... and some good morals and a wealth of obscenity, and upwards of a thousand lies.”
― Mark Twain

“The word 'God' is for me nothing more than the expression and product of human weaknesses, and religious scripture a collection of honourable, but still primitive legends which are nevertheless pretty childish. No interpretation, no matter how subtle, can (for me) change this.”
― Albert Einstein

“If Christ were here there is one thing he would not be—a Christian.”
― Mark Twain,

Appeals to authority - good one.

Suffice it to say, had this thread been about Christians who said things you liked, you wouldn't be dropping your britches and taking a dump here.

nyuk nyuk
02-23-2013, 12:32 PM
Answer the question. Do you agree or disagree with the teachings of Jeffress? Simple question that even a simple person like you should be able to answer. Time to man up.

What question? You're attempting a false dichotomy argument as I just explained. Why should I defend myself from a guilty before proven innocent accusation on account that I said that disagreement doesn't equal persecution. Your attitude smacks of both prejudicial hostility and hostile attributional bias.

You have also utterly failed to explain why you think my pointing out that disagreement doesn't equal persecution is wrong and that it means I am "one of them."

If you think I'm religious and a follower of these people, then do your homework and prove me guilty - go over ALL of my posts and show me where I ever made such a statement. Go ahead. The onus is not on me to prove myself innocent of your nonsense. Do your homework. Get off your lard ass.

So please - man up yourself, assuming your manhood hasn't already fallen off.

DenverBrit
02-23-2013, 12:32 PM
Appeals to authority - good one.

Suffice it to say, had this thread been about Christians who said things you liked, you wouldn't be dropping your britches and taking a dump here.

You describe any mention of Christianity you don't like as 'taking a dump'? :rofl:

Get over yourself, you don't resemble any Christian I've ever met.

W*GS
02-23-2013, 12:34 PM
LOL what? Calling names isn't an argument, so why would that hurt my feelings? All that does is display to everyone that you're incapable of anything else.

You've made it abundantly clear you're an idiot. And a liar.

Pointing out facts isn't name-calling.

I think I already said disagreement doesn't equal persecution. Are these two words too large for you at this stage in your life?

How does one have a "disagreement" about an intrinsic aspect of a person?

Do you have a disagreement with females? With folks with dark skin? With tall people? With short people? With those born (say) without legs?

What do you mean by "disagreement"?

Last time I heard of that happening was in enlightened, Socialist, leftist Cuba. What does that have to do with Tim Tebow or American Christians?

You homophobes envy and support those places in which gays are indeed rounded up, or assaulted, or murdered, just for being homosexual.

nyuk nyuk
02-23-2013, 12:38 PM
“I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ.”

― Mahatma Gandhi

Odd how "antiracists" don't mind quoting flaming racists - when they aren't white.

Do you people pay remote attention to the types of trash you idolize or not?

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/H1OX3SI0_hY" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

When was the last time you had a good bowel movement, by the way?

nyuk nyuk
02-23-2013, 12:42 PM
You've made it abundantly clear you're an idiot. And a liar.

Pointing out facts isn't name-calling.

Labels and calling names aren't facts, unless you're about 10 years old and on a school playground.

How does one have a "disagreement" about an intrinsic aspect of a person?

Do you have a disagreement with females? With folks with dark skin? With tall people? With short people? With those born (say) without legs?

This is 100% deflective.


What do you mean by "disagreement"?

2nd time in 2 days: Dictionary, sir.


You homophobes envy and support those places in which gays are indeed rounded up, or assaulted, or murdered, just for being homosexual.

Not only is this mindless labeling, it's also pretending to have knowledge of human psychology, which we know you absolutely to not have.

Sad times in American education that people think applying slur-labels equals arguing in defense of something.

Since I don't admire either Nazi Germany nor Marxist Cuba, you're pulling things out of your ass again.

Again: How does this tie-in with American Christians? You're all over the map, as always, and at this point I have to wonder if you have ADHD since you have such a clear inability to stick to the topic.

nyuk nyuk
02-23-2013, 12:43 PM
You describe any mention of Christianity you don't like as 'taking a dump'? :rofl:

Get over yourself, you don't resemble any Christian I've ever met.

I don't resemble one because I'm not one. 2+2, Red Coat.

I've never called any mention of Christianity as "taking a dump," so this is a strawman.

DenverBrit
02-23-2013, 12:44 PM
LOL.

Well if you're going to use Penn and Teller.

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/kdAZjD_01fI" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

DenverBrit
02-23-2013, 12:46 PM
I don't resemble one because I'm not one.
.

That's obvious.

nyuk nyuk
02-23-2013, 12:47 PM
That's obvious.

Tell it to Tony R, he thinks I am one.

W*GS
02-23-2013, 12:48 PM
Labels and calling names aren't facts, unless you're about 10 years old and on a school playground.

You're an idiot and a liar. Those are simple facts.

This is 100% deflective.

You claim not to be persecuting homosexuals - you just have "disagreement" with them. In this context, what do you mean by that word?

How does one "disagree" with an intrinsic aspect of a person? Elaborate, please.

Since I don't admire either Nazi Germany nor Marxist Cuba, you're pulling things out of your ass again.

Do you admire the Taliban, Islamists generally, a big swathe of Africa for their views on homosexuality? Why or why not?

Again: How does this tie-in with American Christians?

"God Loves Uganda".

nyuk nyuk
02-23-2013, 12:49 PM
LOL.

Well if you're going to use Penn and Teller.

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/kdAZjD_01fI" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Wow, cool, I never saw that episode. Totally new to me and ****.

Bad attempt at deflecting for using a ****ty source (pun intended). Going to keep citing people with Gandhi's racial views? If so, I can direct you to David Duke.

nyuk nyuk
02-23-2013, 12:58 PM
You're an idiot and a liar. Those are simple facts.



You claim not to be persecuting homosexuals - you just have "disagreement" with them. In this context, what do you mean by that word?

How does one "disagree" with an intrinsic aspect of a person? Elaborate, please.



Do you admire the Taliban, Islamists generally, a big swathe of Africa for their views on homosexuality? Why or why not?



"God Loves Uganda".

Namecalling and deflection, as always. After 2 requests, still no explanation of why American Christians are lumped in with people who "exterminate" gays. Unsurprisingly. Why? Hollow accusations. Unsubstantiated. Unsupportable. Invented whole-cloth. Lacking any real ammunition, you had to reach overseas and in some distant time in history without even bothering to make a tie-in. In other words, a weak-assed and utterly failed attempt at the guilt-by-association fallacy.

I didn't say I had a disagreement with them. This is another of your bull**** strawmen - 2nd time in 2 days, in specific. Typically - like Tony R on this thread - you have chosen to arbitrarily try to snap me into a caricatured straw man of "one of those" and browbeat incessantly until your hands bleed from banging your keybaord. I'll tell you the same thing I did Tony - if you're going to throw accusations, don't expect people to prove themselves innocent of your guilty before proven innocent in your ad hoc inquisitorial court. Do your homework, get off your lazy ass and prove your accusations. Or shut your mouth like an adult.

Of course you're too angry at people you disagree with to remotely exert any semblance of self-control, thus we see the frequent chimpouts and torrents of curse words we see from you. You have displayed zero ability to disagree with people in an adult fashion.

Know what that makes you and your PC thought police coalition?

big·ot (bgt)
n.
One who is strongly partial to one's own group, religion, race, or politics and is intolerant of those who differ.

W*GS
02-23-2013, 01:00 PM
Do you disagree with homosexuality, nyuk?

nyuk nyuk
02-23-2013, 01:03 PM
Do you disagree with homosexuality, nyuk?

Must suck being you. Thankfully I'm not handicapped by a lack of a basic college education to where I have no ability besides deflections, caricatures, and slurs to formulate and support my arguments. I've actually been taught how to formulate an argument and support it in such a manner that I got straight As in doing so. I actually know what it takes and what it looks like to argue a position and support it like an adult with a college education, and you're doing NONE of it.

^5

DenverBrit
02-23-2013, 01:05 PM
Wow, cool, I never saw that episode. Totally new to me and ****.

Bad attempt at deflecting for using a ****ty source (pun intended). Going to keep citing people with Gandhi's racial views? If so, I can direct you to David Duke.

If that were the criteria, few of the Founders could ever be quoted and neither could vast numbers of past and present 'Christians.'

Truths come from many quarters, even from racists born of racism. Gandhi was no saint, but he was still a great man. As was Jefferson, who rejected the mysticism of the Bible and owned slaves. The list is endless.

If you're looking for perfection, look in the mirror. If you find it there, expect it elsewhere.
Malcolm Forbes

W*GS
02-23-2013, 01:06 PM
Must suck being you. Thankfully I'm not handicapped by a lack of a basic college education to where I have no ability besides deflections, caricatures, and slurs to formulate and support my arguments. I've actually been taught how to formulate an argument and support it in such a manner that I got straight As in doing so. I actually know what it takes and what it looks like to argue a position and support it like an adult with a college education, and you're doing NONE of it.

Do you disagree with homosexuality, nyuk?

nyuk nyuk
02-23-2013, 01:12 PM
If that were the criteria, few of the Founders could ever be quoted and neither could vast numbers of past and present 'Christians.'

Truths come from many quarters, even from racists born of racism. Gandhi was no saint, but he was still a great man. As was Jefferson, who rejected the mysticism of the Bible and owned slaves. The list is endless.

If you're looking for perfection, look in the mirror. If you find it there, expect it elsewhere.
Malcolm Forbes



Racists are great men. Check.

nyuk nyuk
02-23-2013, 01:12 PM
Do you disagree with homosexuality, nyuk?

Uh oh, Wog is in hurt ego rescue mode, folks.

houghtam
02-23-2013, 01:15 PM
Must suck being you. Thankfully I'm not handicapped by a lack of a basic college education to where I have no ability besides deflections, caricatures, and slurs to formulate and support my arguments. I've actually been taught how to formulate an argument and support it in such a manner that I got straight As in doing so. I actually know what it takes and what it looks like to argue a position and support it like an adult with a college education, and you're doing NONE of it.

^5

I can vouch for that. I taught it to you personally in this thread here:

http://www.orangemane.com/BB/showthread.php?t=110224


...


:yayaya:

DenverBrit
02-23-2013, 01:21 PM
Racists are great men. Check.

You're a simpleton. Check!

nyuk nyuk
02-23-2013, 01:28 PM
You're a simpleton. Check!

LMAO. Oh I get it - the standard only goes one way. If one is a liberal, he can quote anyone. If one isn't, well, you know. "One of those."

nyuk nyuk
02-23-2013, 01:29 PM
I can vouch for that. I taught it to you personally in this thread here:

http://www.orangemane.com/BB/showthread.php?t=110224


God bless the inventors of Google. Silver bullet if I ever saw one.

houghtam
02-23-2013, 01:30 PM
LMAO. Oh I get it - the standard only goes one way. If one is a liberal, he can quote anyone. If one isn't, well, you know. "One of those."

PIKEW! DEFLECTION!

:yayaya:

houghtam
02-23-2013, 01:34 PM
God bless the inventors of Google. Silver bullet if I ever saw one.

I can find the OMane by typing it into Google.

I guess that doesn't exist either.

Let me guess, you work for Google too?





:yayaya:

nyuk nyuk
02-23-2013, 01:35 PM
PIKEW! DEFLECTION!

:yayaya:

A deflection from what? That liberals are allowed to get away with quoting such people without being tarred and feathered? What in that would cause me to feel the need to deflect?

nyuk nyuk
02-23-2013, 01:36 PM
I can find the OMane by typing it into Google.

I guess that doesn't exist either.

Let me guess, you work for Google too?





:yayaya:

There are things in the world much more complicated than houghtam can Google away. This basic fact of life will never change.

houghtam
02-23-2013, 01:40 PM
There are things in the world much more complicated than houghtam can Google away. This basic fact of life will never change.

Yep, that's why we have laws that you can look up on Google to show the uneducated their exact wording and their application in previous court decisions. Whew, it's a good thing Google doesn't write the laws themselves.

:yayaya:

DenverBrit
02-23-2013, 01:41 PM
LMAO. Oh I get it - the standard only goes one way. If one is a liberal, he can quote anyone. If one isn't, well, you know. "One of those."

Quoting Gandhi or Jefferson means I approve of racism?

You're a simpleton or being deliberately obtuse, or both.

Anyway, you're a Marxist wtf would you know about anything. :~ohyah!:

TonyR
02-23-2013, 01:57 PM
What question? You're attempting a false dichotomy argument as I just explained. Why should I defend myself from a guilty before proven innocent accusation on account that I said that disagreement doesn't equal persecution. Your attitude smacks of both prejudicial hostility and hostile attributional bias.

You have also utterly failed to explain why you think my pointing out that disagreement doesn't equal persecution is wrong and that it means I am "one of them."

If you think I'm religious and a follower of these people, then do your homework and prove me guilty - go over ALL of my posts and show me where I ever made such a statement. Go ahead. The onus is not on me to prove myself innocent of your nonsense. Do your homework. Get off your lard ass.

So please - man up yourself, assuming your manhood hasn't already fallen off.

LOL Wow, so much hostility! All this flailing about in an effort to avoid answering a simple question. I'm not calling anyone "guilty" or "innocent", and I'm not accusing anyone of anything. I'm asking you a very simple question. But you sure act like someone who's afraid to admit the truth! Something you're ashamed of, nyuk?

TonyR
02-23-2013, 02:00 PM
I don't resemble one because I'm not one.

Funny, because back when you posted as epicsocialism4tw and dramallama you often proudly proclaimed your Christian superiority.

houghtam
02-23-2013, 02:17 PM
I wonder if black people were just being "disagreed with" when their marriages, whether to other blacks while slaves, or to whites prior to 1967, weren't recognized?

houghtam
02-23-2013, 02:19 PM
Funny, because back when you posted as epicsocialism4tw and dramallama you often proudly proclaimed your Christian superiority.

"I've said a hundred times I'm not that person! Even though looking back at their posts, if I weren't him, I'd like to have his babies. But no, you got me. I'm him."

- epicdramanyukftw

:yayaya:

W*GS
02-23-2013, 04:38 PM
Do you disagree with homosexuality, nyuk?

Pony Boy
02-23-2013, 04:51 PM
Do you disagree with homosexuality, nyuk?

Very simple to answer, your butt hole is an exit not an entrance.

W*GS
02-23-2013, 05:25 PM
Very simple to answer, your butt hole is an exit not an entrance.

So anal sex is the determinant of homosexuality. That would be news to the homosexual couples that don't practice it, and to the heterosexual ones that do.

BroncoBeavis
02-23-2013, 06:02 PM
Once again you're not as stupid as you're letting on. What you are is disingenuous. You're comparing a speech directly to an church/organization vs. a speech where a small group of an organizations members <s>attended a speech</s> were specifically requested to attend by the speaker.

FIFY

TonyR
02-24-2013, 12:15 PM
FIFY

Your "fix" doesn't in any way, shape or form change the argument. In other words, you're still wrong. But keep trying. I'll give you an E- for effort.

BroncoBeavis
02-24-2013, 01:29 PM
Your "fix" doesn't in any way, shape or form change the argument. In other words, you're still wrong. But keep trying. I'll give you an E- for effort.

Yeah, totally. Organizing a speech and throwing out a "Hey, where are all the Nazi sympathizers at?" ...... no big deal.

Speaking at a non-PC church and to whoever just happens to attend it is much much worse. LOL

TonyR
02-27-2013, 01:16 PM
No comments from the righties about this?!?

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-02-26/apple-joins-morgan-stanley-to-back-gay-marriage-at-supreme-court.html

W*GS
02-27-2013, 01:30 PM
The paleoconservatives - troglodytes, really - still don't get it.

cutthemdown
02-27-2013, 05:34 PM
Most republicans want the right to give up on social issues like abortion, gay marraige, so we can point out what a disaster liberals are for our country overal.