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View Full Version : Yay It's Chiefs week.


baja
12-23-2012, 04:20 PM
this is NOT a trap game. ;D

Bob's your Information Minister
12-23-2012, 04:21 PM
All ya'll need to do is beat us and we're gonna get us a franchise QB.

Thanks!

Chiefs will rule the AFC West for 15 years.

Punisher
12-23-2012, 04:23 PM
All ya'll need to do is beat us and we're gonna get us a franchise QB.

Thanks!

Chiefs will rule the AFC West for 15 years.

http://gifrific.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/08/Louis-CK-Scratches-His-Head.gif

baja
12-23-2012, 04:24 PM
You proud?

Bob's your Information Minister
12-23-2012, 04:25 PM
So proud. This team sucked hard this year for the right to take Chocolate Pain.

Bacchus
12-23-2012, 04:26 PM
chiefs suck, but not as bad as their fans. They deserve better.

Headless Hessian Rider
12-23-2012, 04:28 PM
[QUOTE=Bob's your Information Minister;3761531]All ya'll need to do is beat us and we're gonna get us a franchise QB.

I thought you already got 3 on the roster :rofl: ....

baja
12-23-2012, 04:29 PM
[QUOTE=Bob's your Information Minister;3761531]All ya'll need to do is beat us and we're gonna get us a franchise QB.

I thought you already got 3 on the roster :rofl: ....

I forgot that LOL

Bronco Bob
12-23-2012, 04:29 PM
So proud. This team sucked hard this year for the right to take Chocolate Pain.

You'd have been better off sucking hard last year and gotten Andrew Luck.
Not really that great a class of QBs this year. Leave it to the Chiefs to screw
up a screw up.

brncs_fan
12-23-2012, 04:31 PM
I'm setting the early line at 12.5.

Bob's your Information Minister
12-23-2012, 04:36 PM
Geno is as good a prospect as you're going to find in most draft classes. The Luck/RGIII thing last year was a complete aberration.

This guy's stock is going to soar and everyone will have him going #1 after combine, workouts and interviews. Geno will nail all of that.

Old Dude
12-23-2012, 09:20 PM
Gotta take the Chiefs seriously. Look what Jax almost did to NE today. But I think the Broncos can put up a few more points in this regular season finale than they did last year.

Kaylore
12-23-2012, 09:23 PM
We won't sleep on the Chiefs. They're a division rival and they beat us at home last year. Fox will reiterate that point this week. With the Texans playing the Colts, there's an outside shot we could get the 1 seed. If we were going to have a "trap game" it was today and being at home against a team we usually beat showed that wasn't a problem.

Next week there will be no surprises. The Chiefs aren't playing for anything and the Broncos have a few reasons to win and even more reasons not to lose.

baja
12-23-2012, 09:48 PM
If we lose it will be a bigger shock than the 96 Jacksonville lose (not as painful but a bigger shock)

The Chiefs are playing for the #1 pick or do they already have that sewn up? ;D

Looks like they and the jags each have 2 wins.

Hulamau
12-23-2012, 09:54 PM
All ya'll need to do is beat us and we're gonna get us a franchise QB.

Thanks!

Chiefs will rule the AFC West for 15 years.

Funny that is pretty much what you've harped on about here every year you guys have had a top 1 , 2 or 3 pick which seems like about 10 years in a row now... :-) Howz that worked out fer ya???

If he were in last years QB class, Geno Smith would be a third round pick .. late second at best ... and probably behind Brock O had he stayed in college this year and continued to develop as a college QB.

KC is where first round talent goes to wither and fade away.

FearLanier
12-23-2012, 10:22 PM
Funny that is pretty much what you've harped on about here every year you guys have had a top 1 , 2 or 3 pick which seems like about 10 years in a row now... :-) Howz that worked out fer ya???

If he were in last years QB class, Geno Smith would be a third round pick .. late second at best ... and probably behind Brock O had he stayed in college this year and continued to develop as a college QB.

KC is where first round talent goes to wither and fade away.

If Geno Smith were in last years draft, he would have been taken by Miami at 8.

Jetmeck
12-23-2012, 10:37 PM
So proud. This team sucked hard this year for the right to take Chocolate Pain.

lAST FIRST ROUND qb cHIEFS PICKED WAS bLACKLEDGE in 83.

Good luck fat boy

Jetmeck
12-23-2012, 10:39 PM
So proud. This team sucked hard this year for the right to take Chocolate Pain.


This guy would be smart to do an ELway and ELI deal and tell the Chiefs to go **** themselves.

He would be better off anywhere else.............period !

Bob's your Information Minister
12-23-2012, 10:46 PM
This guy would be smart to do an ELway and ELI deal and tell the Chiefs to go **** themselves.

He would be better off anywhere else.............period !

Actually this isn't true at all.

The Chiefs have a very good young offensive line, with just about the best bookend tackles in football with Albert and Winston, who have both been terrific this season. Combined they have allowed something like 5 sacks. Albert has earned a big contract extension.

If Bowe is resigned, the Chiefs will have a very good pair of starting WR with him and Steve Breaston. Jon Baldwin is probably a bust but the Chiefs can find a third WR somewhere.

Tony Moeaki also looks like he has recovered from his knee injury and though he doesn't have great numbers, since Week 7 he has been productive for the Chiefs.

With Charles proving he is an elite back and fully recovered from his knee injury Geno would have an elite running attack lean on as a rookie. That could potentially be a huge factor in his development.

Finally, we know the Chiefs have a defense that will keep them in most games. It's amazing that this team could have easily beaten Oakland, Indy, Denver, Pittsburgh and Baltimore if the offense and quarterbacks hadn't completely **** the bed in all those games. The D was great in all of those losses and kept the team in the game.

You're probably looking at a .500 team next year in KC if Geno has a good rookie year.

We're certainly a much more attractive team than the Jags or Raiders, who both have terrible offensive lines and really, really bad defenses.

Kaylore
12-23-2012, 10:50 PM
Poor chief fans. They are left with the dregs of a QB draft class and have re-imagined spread-offense QB's who can't read defenses into "start right now" prospects.

Raidersbane
12-23-2012, 11:15 PM
You'd have been better off sucking hard last year and gotten Andrew Luck.
Not really that great a class of QBs this year. Leave it to the Chiefs to screw
up a screw up.

This, and we will draft for defensive needs at our pleasure.........because it pleases us.:afro:

Rolandftw
12-23-2012, 11:52 PM
There's a lot of if's with KC. If you're counting on Steve Breaston, who's been terrible on the rare occasion he's actually been active to be your #2, you're in deep trouble.

I'd be fairly surprised if KC was .500 next season, but their schedule will certainly be softer. KC fans don't like it, but when good teams play bad teams, they often play down to their competition. Indy, Pittsburgh, Baltimore, Denver all basically sleep walked through their games with KC.

Look at Jacksonville. 4 of their last 6 games, they were within a TD of winning (or won). I don't think anyone actually thinks the Jaguars are a player or two away from being right up there with New England and Houston.

Worst thing Chiefs management could do would be to think they could put a band aid on their roster and fix all of their problems.

Jetmeck
12-23-2012, 11:57 PM
Actually this isn't true at all.

The Chiefs have a very good young offensive line, with just about the best bookend tackles in football with Albert and Winston, who have both been terrific this season. Combined they have allowed something like 5 sacks. Albert has earned a big contract extension.

If Bowe is resigned, the Chiefs will have a very good pair of starting WR with him and Steve Breaston. Jon Baldwin is probably a bust but the Chiefs can find a third WR somewhere.

Tony Moeaki also looks like he has recovered from his knee injury and though he doesn't have great numbers, since Week 7 he has been productive for the Chiefs.

With Charles proving he is an elite back and fully recovered from his knee injury Geno would have an elite running attack lean on as a rookie. That could potentially be a huge factor in his development.

Finally, we know the Chiefs have a defense that will keep them in most games. It's amazing that this team could have easily beaten Oakland, Indy, Denver, Pittsburgh and Baltimore if the offense and quarterbacks hadn't completely **** the bed in all those games. The D was great in all of those losses and kept the team in the game.

You're probably looking at a .500 team next year in KC if Geno has a good rookie year.

We're certainly a much more attractive team than the Jags or Raiders, who both have terrible offensive lines and really, really bad defenses.



BS on hit and miss Charles and Moaki hasn't done a thing this year and well BOWE is Bowe...............

Rest of your receivers did less than BOWE.................

Quinn sure has to run around a lot if that line is so solid............

Only thing your right about is a defense.............


Thing is you have had a defense before and couldn't get out of your own way to find a decent offense..............

Thing is you had a good offense with Holmes and then GREAT LINE and decent QB with Green and yet couldn't find your way to a defense...................


Your franchise is clueless and I feel sorry for whomever they draft///////////////Manning shunned you fools for a reason.

If you were just lacking a QB and had such a great organization..................Manning would have returned your calls.

Nuff said.....................

UberBroncoMan
12-24-2012, 12:01 AM
All ya'll need to do is beat us and we're gonna get us a franchise QB.

Thanks!

Chiefs will rule the AFC West for 15 years.

Missed the right draft class for that by about a year.

UberBroncoMan
12-24-2012, 12:05 AM
They only think KC has going for it is Google Fiber.

FearLanier
12-24-2012, 02:28 AM
Poor chief fans. They are left with the dregs of a QB draft class and have re-imagined spread-offense QB's who can't read defenses into "start right now" prospects.

Look no further than Washington, Carolina, Seattle and San Franciso for prime examples of teams using variations of the spread offense. More and more NFL teams are using it. Those QB's are in the shotgun a lot.

Watch the Patriots. They have Brady lined up in shot gun using variations of it quite a bit. They even went to Chip Kelly to use some of his knowledge.

Even Peyton Manning has used variations of the spread offense dating back to when he was a Colt.

As for Geno, he can read defenses better than people think. Just because he struggled against Texas Tech and Kansas State doesn't mean he can't make reads or go through progressions. He's proven that he can go through his reads from what I've watched.

Bob's your Information Minister
12-24-2012, 06:55 AM
BS on hit and miss Charles

This sentence is all anyone needs to know you're a dumbass.

1500 ****ing yards this year, dude.

#1 rushing average in NFL HISTORY.

2nd best back in the league, easy.

spiralism
12-24-2012, 07:29 AM
Nick Foles would go as the top QB in this draft. Cousins would definitely be a first rounder. Make no mistake, this is the weakest QB class in years, so i have to applaud KCs timing to be the ****test team in the NFL with serious problems at QB a season after what is already looking like one of the best QB classes there's ever been...that 7-9 record last year and Dontari Poe pick as a result definitely paid dividends! LOL!

Bob's your Information Minister
12-24-2012, 07:45 AM
This isn't that weak of a QB class. People are only saying that because there's no Luck or RGIII, and Russell Wilson came out of NOWHERE.

Hindsight sure is 20/20, huh?

Fact is, Geno is about as good a prospect as Matt Ryan ever was, and certainly better than Joe Flacco. I can only imagine what you idiots would be saying if Geno had thrown 19 picks as a senior.

The 08 QB draft class was nothing special and there are two borderline franchise QBs out of that first round.

Tyler Wilson, Geno Smith and Matt Barkley will all go in the first round this April. This is a pretty decent class compared to a lot of years.

It's certainly no JaMarcus Russell/Brady Quinn.

Kaylore
12-24-2012, 07:59 AM
Chief fans are just happy to be trying to draft a QB to develop. They haven't done that in more than a decade. The problem is they are going to face the reality of how hard it is to find the right one - even when that prospect appears to be near perfect. They are staring at a class of projects and system QB's. Brock Osweiller would be a first round pick this year.

Instead they are clinging to annecdotes that never happen - like how Aaron Rogers fell in the draft, or how Tom Brady was a late round pick.

My advise to Chief fans is hope you get a GM that knows enough to get an offensive coach on your staff somewhere that can develop QB's and then don't expect too much too soon out of whoever your QB is. The odds of finding a franchise QB at all are miniscule. The odds of finding one in this draft class are smaller than normal.

Bob's your Information Minister
12-24-2012, 08:07 AM
I agree that it is a crapshoot, but there's a lot to like about Geno Smith.

It's not like he has a questionable arm, or is inaccurate or has character risks.

He'll be playing behind a solid line with a great RB to lean on.

If he can adapt to the pro game he's going to be fine.

And you're right, we are happy just going out rolling the dice on a QB. That's how you win in this league. It's way past due.

If Geno busts, we'll try again in three years.

And so will you guys. Brock Osweiler isn't **** and you all know it.

Durango
12-24-2012, 08:16 AM
This isn't that weak of a QB class. People are only saying that because there's no Luck or RGIII, and Russell Wilson came out of NOWHERE.

Hindsight sure is 20/20, huh?

Fact is, Geno is about as good a prospect as Matt Ryan ever was, and certainly better than Joe Flacco. I can only imagine what you idiots would be saying if Geno had thrown 19 picks as a senior.

The 08 QB draft class was nothing special and there are two borderline franchise QBs out of that first round.

Tyler Wilson, Geno Smith and Matt Barkley will all go in the first round this April. This is a pretty decent class compared to a lot of years.

It's certainly no JaMarcus Russell/Brady Quinn.

It's the worst QB class is a while, easily years. Geno Smith doesn't check down from the pocket and fixates on his receiver. Analysts also always seem to question his ability to read defenses, and that's at the college level.

He's athletic and has a rocket arm, but boy, he would be a big, big risk as the #1 over-all draft pick. Wow.

Bob's your Information Minister
12-24-2012, 08:44 AM
He's exactly zero risk for a franchise like the Chiefs.

This is not a bad QB class at all. People are getting silly after Luck/RGIII happened.

Do you honestly think a guy like Joe Flacco even begins to compare to dudes like Geno, Barkley or Wilson as pro prospects? Flacco was a ****ing nobody, a late riser. Basically Mike Glennon is this year's Joe Flacco.

I mean ****, Ryan Tannehill is not better as a pro prospect than Geno or Wilson or Barkley. Not even close. He had barely one full year of starting experience and he went in the first round.

This is a fine QB class. Take off the hindsight glasses. What happened last year happens once every 10 years.

As QB classes go, this one looks OK. Now next year's QB class...that class is gonna be ****.

Kaylore
12-24-2012, 08:50 AM
This isn't that weak of a QB class. People are only saying that because there's no Luck or RGIII, and Russell Wilson came out of NOWHERE.

Hindsight sure is 20/20, huh?

Fact is, Geno is about as good a prospect as Matt Ryan ever was, and certainly better than Joe Flacco. I can only imagine what you idiots would be saying if Geno had thrown 19 picks as a senior.

The 08 QB draft class was nothing special and there are two borderline franchise QBs out of that first round.

Tyler Wilson, Geno Smith and Matt Barkley will all go in the first round this April. This is a pretty decent class compared to a lot of years.

It's certainly no JaMarcus Russell/Brady Quinn.

First, virtually everyone disagrees. It's not just comparitive. There are no standouts. a Freshman wont he Heisman trophy for crying out loud and a linebacker was in the running. What does that tell you?

No one REALLY knows, but history isn't on your side. Going back ten years, QB classes that produced starters went two years in a row, but one class had a few or maybe one good one and then the class before or after had a really strong class. Then there is a class where the cupboard is empty and it takes one more class to find some starters. Going by this pattern, you guys are due a really crappy class, and early prognosticators are looking at it like that is the going to be the case.

I'll only list the guys who started as a legit push from their teams to be starters.

1997
Drunkenmiller, Plummer, Wuerffel - D-

1998
Manning, Hasselbeck, Griese, Batch - B*

1999
McNabb, Culpepper, Brooks C+

2000
Pennington, Brady, Bulger B+

2001
Vick, Brees, Tuiasosoppo. B

2002
Carr, Harrington, Ramsey, McCown D

2003
Palmer, Leftwich, Boller, Grossman, Simms C+

2004
Manning, Rivers, Roethlisberger, Simms A-

2005
Smith, Rogers, Campbell, Frye, Walter, Orton, Anderson, Cassel, Fitzpatrick A

2006
Young, Leinart, Cutler, Whitehurst, Croyle, Gradkowski C-

2007
Russel, Quinn, Kolb, Edwards, Thigpen F+

2008
Ryan, Flacco, Henne C+

2009
Stafford, Sanchez, Freeman, Painter B

2010
Bradford, Tebow, McCoy D+

2011
Newton, Locker, Gabbert, Ponder, Dalton, Kaepernick (McElroy too) A-

2012
Luck, Griffin, Tannehill, Wheedon, Wilson, Foles, Cousins A

It's obviously too early to say who will work out even from a year ago, but it would appear that the NFL is due a poor QB draft class.

You guys need to face the reality that just because you have the first pick and need a QB, that doesn't mean there's one ready for you worthy of a first overall pick.

The good news (or bad news depending) is many of those franchise QB's were found in later picks than first overall. The other good news is while it's near impossible to find a franchise guy, it is possible to find someone who can be at least decent.

And maybe we're all wrong. 2006 was supposed to be a great class and it sucked.

Unfortunately what ends up happening more often is the QB's that everyone thinks will be good actually aren't. It's rare that there is someone from a weak class that turns out to be a gem.

Bob's your Information Minister
12-24-2012, 08:54 AM
Dude, people thought Cam Newton was a late 2nd round pick before he began shooting up boards.

Geno is absolutely at least as good as a prospect right now. And he's a guy coming out who can actually, you know, throw the ball at a high level and doesn't look to run.

Don't even get me started on Sam Bradford. Scouts were sucking that guy off. The next Troy Aikman my ass.

Everyone was blowing that 06 class, too. It turned out to be ****.

You cannot sit here and say this is a bad QB class. IMO it's certainly on part with the 08 class in terms of potential. You need to rate these guys as prospects, not what they became as pros. You're looking at all of this in hindsight, and that's completely unfair.

If Tannehill was declaring this year he'd EASILY go after Geno, Wilson and Barkley. Put things in perspective.

DENVERDUI55
12-24-2012, 08:59 AM
If Tannehill was declaring this year he'd EASILY go after Geno, Wilson and Barkley. Put things in perspective.

Tannehill would be the first QB off the board easily.

Bob's your Information Minister
12-24-2012, 09:00 AM
It's cool that you want to be edgy and anti-Chief and say Geno isn't worthy of a #1. That's fine.

But if you sit here and tell me this kid is a worse prospect than Ryan Tannehill, you're ****ing lying to everyone. Geno has three + years of incredible, winning production in two different systems. Physically, he has it all. That alone makes him an awesome, awesome prospect.

As a pure pro prospect he's somewhere between Robert Griffin and Josh Freeman. He's absolutely a first round QB, and given the Chiefs' needs and how inexpensive even the #1 pick is these days, it's a no brainer.

Kaylore
12-24-2012, 09:03 AM
I think Geno Smith is a first round QB. That said he is not worth the first overall, and I wouldn't want him. The bust potential is high with him and there are red flags. He plays with amazing receivers and throws into double and tripple coverage. He doesn't go through progressions and leans on his arm and his skill positions more than his football IQ. It's going to be a rough go for Geno his first two years.

MillerMayhem58
12-24-2012, 09:15 AM
chief fans are just like raider fans were/are. They don't have a clue.....They keep buying tickets, keep buying gear, and keep drinking the kool-aid. What none of these fans realize is if OWNERSHIP wanted to win, they would be winning. Kc is a food stamp franchise (nothing against food stamps or people who need them). They do not care about W/L's they only care about the $$$

MillerMayhem58
12-24-2012, 09:16 AM
And BTW everytime Bobby says KC has a solid Oline, I laugh so hard I have to stop reading for a minute. LOL

CEH
12-24-2012, 09:27 AM
Dude, people thought Cam Newton was a late 2nd round pick before he began shooting up boards.

Geno is absolutely at least as good as a prospect right now. And he's a guy coming out who can actually, you know, throw the ball at a high level and doesn't look to run.

Don't even get me started on Sam Bradford. Scouts were sucking that guy off. The next Troy Aikman my ass.

Everyone was blowing that 06 class, too. It turned out to be ****.

You cannot sit here and say this is a bad QB class. IMO it's certainly on part with the 08 class in terms of potential. You need to rate these guys as prospects, not what they became as pros. You're looking at all of this in hindsight, and that's completely unfair.

If Tannehill was declaring this year he'd EASILY go after Geno, Wilson and Barkley. Put things in perspective.

Tannehill is light years better than any QB coming out this year. So you are saying these QBs are top 7 talent last year? No way. KC is stuck taking a QB and hoping he turns it around in KC. Good luck with that with a new GM and coach and KCs terrible history of drafting QBs that win games for them

I love it. KC picked the wrong year to suck for Luck.

Kaylore
12-24-2012, 09:44 AM
On what the OP is really about, this will be a similar game to the one we just played except the running back will better and the defense and offensive play calling will be worse. We should win provided we can contain Charles. Quinn isn't going to be able to catch up once we go up one touchdown. They are a field goal offense.

Raidersbane
12-24-2012, 10:00 AM
It's kinda sad when all a K.C. fan can cling to for hope in the future is someone who has yet to be drafted much less signed. Has never put on an NFL uniform much less taken a snap in a game. And quarterback is only one (and not the greatest) of the myriad of problems for that organization.

Rocket 7
12-24-2012, 11:49 AM
I'm setting the early line at 12.5.

They have it at 16.5

http://www.footballlocks.com/nfl_odds.shtml

FearLanier
12-24-2012, 11:51 AM
I would easily take both Wilson or Geno over Tannehill. At this time during last year, Tannehill was a questionable 1st round pick. He had 1 good season. That's it. Geno and Wilson have had multiple good years.

The reason why this QB class gets no love, besides the amazing QB class last year, is because all the first round QB's this year are on teams that have horrible coaching and surrounding talent.

IMO I'm more of a Tyler Wilson fan because I'd like my QB to have 3 things: toughness, leadership and smarts. Wilson has all 3.
In fact, Wilson was in by far the hardest situation I've seen a college QB be in in quite some time. All 3 of his best WR's leave for NFL, his coach is out and replaced by a guy who has no clue what he's doing, his OL sucks and his running game is average at best.

As for not lighting it up when they enter the league, how do you know Kaylore? Chiefs have a top 5 running game, a decent OL, if they keep Bowe they have a good WR and they could draft another good WR in round 2.

It really depends on who the coach is and who we draft.

Kaylore
12-24-2012, 12:06 PM
I don't know. But odds are in favor of every QB sucking and especially system ones. You have to nit-pick the few times guys suceeded. I can point to "all the rest" and show them sucking.

SoCalBronco
12-24-2012, 12:19 PM
Wilson is the only first round caliber QB in this class, Bob. He's not worth the No. 1 overall pick, but if you got him, I would say that is a good player to develop with good skills. Barkley is 2nd-3rd round talent. Geno will make a fine slot WR.

FearLanier
12-24-2012, 12:20 PM
I don't know. But odds are in favor of every QB sucking and especially system ones. You have to nit-pick the few times guys suceeded. I can point to "all the rest" and show them sucking.

The NFL is changing. Spread QB's are making it in the NFL, the triple option is working and the Patriots are using plays for a college coach who has no experience in the NFL.

IMO it depends on what situation each guy goes into. We'll see who the coach is and the surrounding talent.

Kaylore
12-24-2012, 01:29 PM
The NFL is changing. Spread QB's are making it in the NFL, the triple option is working and the Patriots are using plays for a college coach who has no experience in the NFL.

IMO it depends on what situation each guy goes into. We'll see who the coach is and the surrounding talent.

Hope springs eternal in the heart of every Chief fan. If I hadn't been to SB since the moon landing, and I hadn't abandoned the team yet, I would hope for that too, I suppose.

Just remember that playing in the shotgun and a college style spread offense aren't the same thing. Tim Tebow was one of, if not THE greatest spread offense QB in the history of college football. He was accurate and dynamic and look at him now. RG3 is a totally different story. And Cam isn't looking so hot. The League isn't changing as much as you think.

And just because you need a QB and you have the number 1 pick doesn't mean you are getting a franchise QB with the number 1 pick. Sorry, but the draft is what it is. It isn't a store where you work your way down your shopping list and fill everything you need. It's more like a dirty mine where there is big value to be had, things to be used, and while not all are what you need right now, there are some really valuable things, but it's in a lot of dirt and grime and you have to get lucky more than anything else.

That's why I am a firm supporter of BPA.

FearLanier
12-24-2012, 02:01 PM
Hope springs eternal in the heart of every Chief fan. If I hadn't been to SB since the moon landing, and I hadn't abandoned the team yet, I would hope for that too, I suppose.

Just remember that playing in the shotgun and a college style spread offense aren't the same thing. Tim Tebow was one of, if not THE greatest spread offense QB in the history of college football. He was accurate and dynamic and look at him now. RG3 is a totally different story. And Cam isn't looking so hot. The League isn't changing as much as you think.

And just because you need a QB and you have the number 1 pick doesn't mean you are getting a franchise QB with the number 1 pick. Sorry, but the draft is what it is. It isn't a store where you work your way down your shopping list and fill everything you need. It's more like a dirty mine where there is big value to be had, things to be used, and while not all are what you need right now, there are some really valuable things, but it's in a lot of dirt and grime and you have to get lucky more than anything else.

That's why I am a firm supporter of BPA.

I agree, but Geno Smith and Tyler Wilson have qualities that franchise QB's have. It's not saying that they are going to be those QB's, but it's a crap shoot. No QB is a certainty and no QB is a complete failure either. There are QB's who weren't said to be great QB prospects (Joe Flacco, Matt Ryan, Russell Wilson) but they turned out pretty good for their teams.

The Chiefs haven't had success in the playoffs because they don't have the leader at QB and have only really tried to get the best talent once in 1983. Getting a QB of their own to develop and try is what I would like to see happen.

baja
12-24-2012, 02:43 PM
Best thing the Chiefs could do is trade for Alex Smith than trade the #1 pick for as many picks as they can get.

FearLanier
12-24-2012, 03:14 PM
Best thing the Chiefs could do is trade for Alex Smith than trade the #1 pick for as many picks as they can get.

Yeah trading for other teams backup QB's has worked so well for the last 20 years..

Drunken.Broncoholic
12-24-2012, 03:30 PM
One can only hope they get Alex smith. Would assure more of the same for them.

Not a good year to have great position for a QB. The talent just isn't there this year in the draft.

baja
12-24-2012, 03:31 PM
Yeah trading for other teams backup QB's has worked so well for the last 20 years..

Ya I'm with ya draft Geno with the number 1 overall. I like it. Who's he going to throw the ball to?

FearLanier
12-24-2012, 03:45 PM
Ya I'm with ya draft Geno with the number 1 overall. I like it. Who's he going to throw the ball to?

Tyler Wilson. He'll throw to Dwayne Bowe and draft picks including Cordarelle Patterson and Joseph Fauria :thumbs:

Rolandftw
12-24-2012, 05:38 PM
I think Geno Smith and Tyler Wilson might measure out to be similar to Ryan Tannehill. Yeah, Tannehill only had one very good college season, but so did Cam Newton. Only having one great year doesn't eliminate someone from being a franchise QB at the next level.

Geno will probably struggle as a rookie. Maybe even the first two seasons. He really struggled against good defenses this year for the most part. But nothing to really lose for KC. They have to go after a franchise QB and the draft is still a better shot at that, then Alex Smith and other retreads.

It's only really a matter of whether Tyler Wilson or Geno Smith is the better option.

FearLanier
12-24-2012, 06:00 PM
I think Geno Smith and Tyler Wilson might measure out to be similar to Ryan Tannehill. Yeah, Tannehill only had one very good college season, but so did Cam Newton. Only having one great year doesn't eliminate someone from being a franchise QB at the next level.

Geno will probably struggle as a rookie. Maybe even the first two seasons. He really struggled against good defenses this year for the most part. But nothing to really lose for KC. They have to go after a franchise QB and the draft is still a better shot at that, then Alex Smith and other retreads.

It's only really a matter of whether Tyler Wilson or Geno Smith is the better option.

I think they are easily better than Tannehill. Maybe because I wasn't a fan of his. After watching Tannehill blow multiple 2nd half leads in college I just didn't think he had it.

Funny thing about Geno is he had 12 TD's, 5 INT's, a 60% completion percentage and about 300 yards average against the 5 top 50 defenses he played this seaosn(OU, KSU, TTU, TCU, Maryland).

We'll find out more about what they can do next month at the Senior Bowl and in February at the combine.

Tombstone RJ
12-24-2012, 06:15 PM
Here's what if kc should do: bring in Vick as the starting qb and hire young Shanny as the HC. This way Vick will get the RG3 offense. But kc won't do this because they are idiots.

That's what I'd do if I was the GM. Good thing I'm not the kc GM, I'd have them winning in one year.

Bacchus
12-24-2012, 06:37 PM
Best thing the Chiefs could do is trade for Alex Smith than trade the #1 pick for as many picks as they can get.

wow, that is a pretty good idea. Chief fan would blow a gasket though if they do not draft Geno.

FearLanier
12-24-2012, 08:16 PM
Here's what if kc should do: bring in Vick as the starting qb and hire young Shanny as the HC. This way Vick will get the RG3 offense. But kc won't do this because they are idiots.

That's what I'd do if I was the GM. Good thing I'm not the kc GM, I'd have them winning in one year.

Signing a 33 year old retread who has never been that good throwing the ball over a Geno Smith or Tyler Wilson is the worst move we could possibly make.

I would rather have Alex Smith than Vick if we had to sign a FA QB.

DBroncos4life
12-24-2012, 08:24 PM
Here's what if kc should do: bring in Vick as the starting qb and hire young Shanny as the HC. This way Vick will get the RG3 offense. But kc won't do this because they are idiots.

That's what I'd do if I was the GM. Good thing I'm not the kc GM, I'd have them winning in one year.

Why would they do that when the can trade for Cousins instead? Kyle with Cousins would be way better then Kyle and Vick.

lonestar
12-24-2012, 08:34 PM
Not sure of how many draft choices KC has. But if they have them all. Thet pic1 or 2, then 33-34, then 63-64 then under. 100 again depending on how many comp picks awarded for losing FA.

If they get a good GM like we wound up with. They could be looking at 4-6 starters. On an already loaded with talent team.

We all know that it was coaching and lousy QB play last year. Fix that along with a legit GM and they could be a hell of a team for very long time.

FearLanier
12-24-2012, 09:29 PM
I think it's hilarious when people say the Chiefs should draft the best player available? If it isn't a QB, then who is it?

Luke Joekel? Chiefs have a LT who has only given up 1 sack all year and has been one of the best the last 2 years.

Manti Te'o-An ILB at #1? Yeah no. He's not even as good of a prospect as Luke Keuchly the year before.

Star Lotelieresjsl-Idk his name but he can't get sacks and god help One Arrowhead Drive if this guy is the pick.

Jarvis Jones/Damontre Moore-Why? Tamba and Houston combined for 19 sacks so far this year and that was with them playing from behind 90% of the year.

Bjoern Werner-See above, plus he's only 255 lbs. Nowhere near big enough to play DE int he 3-4.

Bottomline: there are no players worth drafting at 1 besides QB.

Kaylore
12-24-2012, 09:32 PM
Geno isn't worth the first overall.

SoCalBronco
12-24-2012, 09:35 PM
Geno will be an improvement on Breaston in the slot.

theAPAOps5
12-24-2012, 09:37 PM
Best thing the Chiefs could do is trade for Alex Smith than trade the #1 pick for as many picks as they can get.

Yeah, you mean best thing for the Broncos right?

FearLanier
12-24-2012, 09:48 PM
Geno isn't worth the first overall.

No player in this draft at any position is worth #1 overall.

lonestar
12-24-2012, 09:56 PM
No player in this draft at any position is worth #1 overall.

there may indeed someone that would love to have that "special guy" and will trade up for him..

may be able to garner a few more picks..

there is not doubt that someone will be special at the combine.. Hell someone that clocks a legit 4.1 and OAK will want him regardless of the position they play.. ahahahahahaha

if it is OAK they may even trade their entire draft for him..

Bob's your Information Minister
12-24-2012, 10:42 PM
Wilson is the only first round caliber QB in this class, Bob. He's not worth the No. 1 overall pick, but if you got him, I would say that is a good player to develop with good skills. Barkley is 2nd-3rd round talent. Geno will make a fine slot WR.

This is a ****ty troll since we all know Geno is a pocket passer first and foremost.

Bacchus
12-25-2012, 12:04 AM
Well Bob, I hope the Chiefs draft Geno with the #1 pick. He had 12 TDs and 5 Ints against the 5 half way decent college teams he played this year.

He is Andre Ware.

FearLanier
12-25-2012, 12:29 AM
Well Bob, I hope the Chiefs draft Geno with the #1 pick. He had 12 TDs and 5 Ints against the 5 half way decent college teams he played this year.

He is Andre Ware.

Well I guess it could be worse. We could have a QB prospect like Osweiler :wiggle:

Durango
12-25-2012, 01:39 AM
Well I guess it could be worse. We could have a QB prospect like Osweiler :wiggle:

Ha! You would celebrate having this kid. Every thing I read says the entire organization is wildly impressed with the talents of this guy, and here's the best part; he's learning behind Manning.

You lose assh*le.

Rolandftw
12-25-2012, 03:04 AM
I think they are easily better than Tannehill. Maybe because I wasn't a fan of his. After watching Tannehill blow multiple 2nd half leads in college I just didn't think he had it.

Funny thing about Geno is he had 12 TD's, 5 INT's, a 60% completion percentage and about 300 yards average against the 5 top 50 defenses he played this seaosn(OU, KSU, TTU, TCU, Maryland).

We'll find out more about what they can do next month at the Senior Bowl and in February at the combine.

Tannehill's numbers were very good. Better then Tyler Wilson this year. Both teams didn't have that much talent around them, at least defensively. So guess it comes down to whether or not, team performance is a huge judge of whether someone will be good at the next level.

Geno had good games against Maryland and OU. But was awful against KSU, TTU, TCU. But West Virginia had their own problems this year, too. His ability to go through his progressions are a major concern to me, but it wouldn't deter me from drafting him either. As you said, there isn't really a #1 type pick at any position, so they might as well take a shot on what spot they need the most. If it doesn't pan out, they can do another go at it 3 seasons from now.

I wasn't really a fan of the Brock pick, but you can certainly make the argument had he slightly improved as a senior that he could be a first round pick in this year's draft class. There's also not any pressure for him to produce over the next couple seasons most likely.

Kaylore
12-25-2012, 06:11 AM
Well I guess it could be worse. We could have a QB prospect like Osweiler :wiggle:

At least Osweiller is in a good QB class.

Raidersbane
12-25-2012, 06:27 AM
I say the chiefs trade down the number one pick and then draft a kicker......then make a bid for Sanchez...

peacepipe
12-25-2012, 07:22 AM
We're 15 1/2 point favorites,if anyone is betting on the game.

TheReverend
12-25-2012, 07:27 AM
All ya'll need to do is beat us and we're gonna get us a franchise QB.

Thanks!

Chiefs will rule the AFC West for 15 years.

... In THIS draft?

Who's the 'franchise QB'? This reminds me of the Jamarcus/Quinn draft

oubronco
12-25-2012, 08:02 AM
http://raddezigns.com/decal_pics/10289_Black.jpg

oubronco
12-25-2012, 08:07 AM
http://cdn.bleacherreport.net/images_root/slides/photos/002/746/331/Chiefs32_original_original_original_display_image. png?1352695128

FearLanier
12-25-2012, 11:53 AM
Tannehill's numbers were very good. Better then Tyler Wilson this year. Both teams didn't have that much talent around them, at least defensively. So guess it comes down to whether or not, team performance is a huge judge of whether someone will be good at the next level.

Geno had good games against Maryland and OU. But was awful against KSU, TTU, TCU. But West Virginia had their own problems this year, too. His ability to go through his progressions are a major concern to me, but it wouldn't deter me from drafting him either. As you said, there isn't really a #1 type pick at any position, so they might as well take a shot on what spot they need the most. If it doesn't pan out, they can do another go at it 3 seasons from now.

I wasn't really a fan of the Brock pick, but you can certainly make the argument had he slightly improved as a senior that he could be a first round pick in this year's draft class. There's also not any pressure for him to produce over the next couple seasons most likely.

Well of course Tannehill's numbers were better than Wilson's. He had talent everywhere at A&M while Wilson had nothing but Cobi Hamilton at Arkansas.

That's why I love Wilson as a prospect. He was in the worst position a college QB could be in and he still looked very good and was never rattled. If he can handle the worst adversity in college then he should be more than prepared for the NFL.

Agamemnon
12-25-2012, 12:16 PM
... In THIS draft?

Who's the 'franchise QB'? This reminds me of the Jamarcus/Quinn draft

Seriously. Is anyone scared of Geno Smith?

DAN_BRONCO_FAN
12-25-2012, 12:55 PM
the suck is strong with the chiefs

FearLanier
12-25-2012, 01:20 PM
If one learns about Geno Smith or Tyler Wilson, than you will easily see that they are hands down better prospects than Quinn/Russell.

Especially from the intangibles standpoint.

Raidersbane
12-25-2012, 01:25 PM
If one learns about Geno Smith or Tyler Wilson, than you will easily see that they are hands down better prospects than Quinn/Russell.

Especially from the intangibles standpoint.
Wishful thinking is a hell of a drug!

DAN_BRONCO_FAN
12-25-2012, 01:30 PM
well if the chiefs think the Qbs in this draft are the next coming of Luck RgIII Elway Montana Young Manning ect let them think it .
we could use a bye week and a couple of preseason like games

Tombstone RJ
12-25-2012, 01:57 PM
Kc will manage to screw this draft up no matter what, just like 1983.

Tombstone RJ
12-25-2012, 02:01 PM
Signing a 33 year old retread who has never been that good throwing the ball over a Geno Smith or Tyler Wilson is the worst move we could possibly make.

I would rather have Alex Smith than Vick if we had to sign a FA QB.

:rofl: whatever

KipCorrington25
12-25-2012, 02:19 PM
Wishful thinking is a hell of a drug!

It's KC fans you are talking about so that drug you mention is meth. !Booya!

FearLanier
12-25-2012, 02:53 PM
Chiefs fans don't think Geno or Wilson is the next RG3/Luck (well maybe Bob).

They are however not JaMarcus Russell or Brady Quinn. I would easily take Geno Smith over a lot of the QB's in the normal classes over the last few years.
Easily.

Pass is...IN-COM-PLETE!
12-25-2012, 03:05 PM
Chiefs fans don't think Geno or Wilson is the next RG3/Luck (well maybe Bob).

They are however not JaMarcus Russell or Brady Quinn. I would easily take Geno Smith over a lot of the QB's in the normal classes over the last few years.
Easily.

You knock JaMarcus Russell like he was some questionable prospect but he was perhaps the most physically unique QB at time he was drafted. 6-foot-6, 260 pounds and could chuck the football 80 yards. He had an outstanding pro day too. Russell also had the performance vs. high level of competition in his favor.

In hindsight it's easy to bury him now.

Quinn dropped to No. 22 so he's not even worthy of comparison to a potential QB taken with the No.1 overall selection.

FearLanier
12-25-2012, 04:32 PM
You knock JaMarcus Russell like he was some questionable prospect but he was perhaps the most physically unique QB at time he was drafted. 6-foot-6, 260 pounds and could chuck the football 80 yards. He had an outstanding pro day too. Russell also had the performance vs. high level of competition in his favor.

In hindsight it's easy to bury him now.

Quinn dropped to No. 22 so he's not even worthy of comparison to a potential QB taken with the No.1 overall selection.

I stopped caring about how physically gifted QB's were after the Kyle Boller threw 80 yards on his knees.

I think NFL fans have learned that intangibles is what you look for in a QB more than physical strengths.

Pass is...IN-COM-PLETE!
12-25-2012, 05:05 PM
I stopped caring about how physically gifted QB's were after the Kyle Boller threw 80 yards on his knees.

I think NFL fans have learned that intangibles is what you look for in a QB more than physical strengths.

Outside of a rare Drew Brees, the great ones have the combination of physical traits and intangibles.

DBroncos4life
12-25-2012, 05:11 PM
I stopped caring about how physically gifted QB's were after the Kyle Boller threw 80 yards on his knees.

I think NFL fans have learned that intangibles is what you look for in a QB more than physical strengths.

Question would you rather get Kyle and trade for Cousins or just draft Geno?

Rolandftw
12-25-2012, 05:13 PM
If one learns about Geno Smith or Tyler Wilson, than you will easily see that they are hands down better prospects than Quinn/Russell.

Especially from the intangibles standpoint.

Better then Quinn? yeah, easily. But Russell's idiocy was the main thing that held him back.

FearLanier
12-25-2012, 05:27 PM
Outside of a rare Drew Brees, the great ones have the combination of physical traits and intangibles.

Tom Brady, Peyton Manning and Russell Wilson are prime examples of the intangibles. Leadership, hard work, football IQ. That's what really makes them successful more than their arm strength or body build.

That's why I like Geno and Wilson. They are both extremely hard workers and have a very good football IQ.

I like Wilson's leadership more than Geno's though. That's the difference between them IMO.

FearLanier
12-25-2012, 05:37 PM
Question would you rather get Kyle and trade for Cousins or just draft Geno?

I would rather get Kyle Shannahan and Geno Smith/Tyler Wilson tbh. Both ruys seem to fit his sytem well.

Pass is...IN-COM-PLETE!
12-25-2012, 06:10 PM
I like Wilson's leadership more than Geno's though. That's the difference between them IMO.

I like Wilson's leadership, too. I hope the Queefs get him.

http://espn.go.com/ncf/conferences/standings?confId=8&year=2012

Kaylore
12-25-2012, 06:21 PM
How does anyone know it isn't a Russell/Quinn draft?

At the time both were considered solid QB picks. Russell was a physically gifted passer, and Quinn was like a more polished Aaron Rogers (before he was Aaron Rogers). In fact both Quinn and Rogers fell in the draft the same way, but Rogers had "it" and Quinn didn't.

It's a total crap shoot.

Here's a list of first overall QB's taken in the last 20 years.

Bolded are the ones who played in a spread offense.

Drew Bledsoe
Peyton Manning
Tim Couch
Michael Vick
David Carr
Carson Palmer
Eli Manning
Alex Smith
Jamarcus Russell
Matthew Stafford
Sam Bradford
Cam Newton
Andrew Luck

FearLanier
12-25-2012, 06:26 PM
I like Wilson's leadership, too. I hope the Queefs get him.

http://espn.go.com/ncf/conferences/standings?confId=8&year=2012

Because of his teams record?

Ken Dorsey, Tim Tebow, Vince Young, Jason White, Matt Leinart, Danny Wuerffel, Eric Crouch.

All those QB's won a ton of college games. How did their NFL careers turn out?

FearLanier
12-25-2012, 06:33 PM
How does anyone know it isn't a Russell/Quinn draft?

At the time both were considered solid QB picks. Russell was a physically gifted passer, and Quinn was like a more polished Aaron Rogers (before he was Aaron Rogers). In fact both Quinn and Rogers fell in the draft the same way, but Rogers had "it" and Quinn didn't.

It's a total crap shoot.

Here's a list of first overall QB's taken in the last 20 years.

Bolded are the ones who played in a spread offense.

Drew Bledsoe
Peyton Manning
Tim Couch
Michael Vick
David Carr
Carson Palmer
Eli Manning
Alex Smith
Jamarcus Russell
Matthew Stafford
Sam Bradford
Cam Newton
Andrew Luck

I agree completely that nobody knows, that's why I think it's a hilarious when people think this QB class sucks simply because Kiper/McShay says they suck. Those guys are still doing damage control on their predictions (Russell Wilson wouldn't be a starter/Ricky Stanzi was best QB prospect of 2011 class).

Geno played in more of a pro style offense for 1 year and looked great, and that was his first year starting in college. That alone should give him some credibility because he has proven he isn't simply a spread QB.

Bob's your Information Minister
12-25-2012, 06:34 PM
Here's a list of first overall QB's taken in the last 20 years.

Bolded are the ones who played in a spread offense.

Drew Bledsoe
Peyton Manning
Tim Couch
Michael Vick
David Carr
Carson Palmer
Eli Manning
Alex Smith
Jamarcus Russell
Matthew Stafford
Sam Bradford
Cam Newton
Andrew Luck

Nice way to twist the facts to make Geno look bad.

Ben Roethlisberger played in the spread, too.

It's no longer the red flag it once was.

Especially since Geno has played in two different system and makes plenty of NFL caliber throws.

FearLanier
12-25-2012, 06:39 PM
RG3 should definitely be included in the spread convo. He went 2nd, but he's still a prime example.

Broncos4Life
12-25-2012, 09:05 PM
I don't know if this was posted in the thread, and I'm not going to sift through 5 pages to find out.

Chiefs: 1st team in NFL history to lose a game with 350 yd rushing.
According to Pro Football Reference.

Goobzilla
12-25-2012, 09:24 PM
Denver by 30, nothing to see here...except for Lerch throwing his first NFL passes as PFM will be rocking the sock hat by the 4th.

SoCalBronco
12-25-2012, 10:37 PM
Nice way to twist the facts to make Geno look bad.

Ben Roethlisberger played in the spread, too.

It's no longer the red flag it once was.

Especially since Geno has played in two different system and makes plenty of NFL caliber throws.

The system Smith plays in now was derived from the EXACT system Tim Couch played in at Kentucky in 1997 and 1998. Coach Mumme and Coach Leach attended alot of clinic lectures from LaVell Edwards and Norm Chow at BYU in the 1980s and early 1990s and often went up to BYU to soak in their ideas about the passing game. It was often siad that Mumme and Leach brought the BYU Offense "on steroids" to Kentucky, by taking what they felt were BYU's most successful plays, adding alot of new and interesting screen passes (the bubble screen became a staple in part due to its use in the late 90s at UK and also at Purdue, as did the WR middle screen and quick screen), and running it out of the shotgun, repping individual plays over and over ith a few tags here and there. They began with classic Mesh route from BYU. This was primarily a man to man beater, but they changed one route in the combo that made it deadly vs. zone by creating a triangle on the strongside that included both a horizontal stretch on the flat defender and a vertical stretch on said defender. They also blended together what was the original BYU "66" pass (their All Curl) with the BYU 67 pass (their three vertical pattern) so you would have a terrific pass that would work against all zones (Cov 2, Cov 3 and Quarters). They also took both of BYU's flood patterns, the strongside flood (65) and the weakside flood (69). They renumbered them in their offense and had the HB run an option route on their weakside flood. The weakside flood, known at UK, then T.T. and now W.V.U as "Y-Cross" was a big play waiting to happen and was very difficult for ILB's to defend because it started out looking alot like All-Curl and if they dropped too deep to choke the deep crossing route off, the TE could just sit down in the void. If he "got on top" of the MLB and made the deep cross, then the WLB would always be in a bind with the deep cross at 17-22 yards on top and the HB option route on the bottom. Whatever he does, he is wrong. The FS would also be neutralized by the outside WR's vertical. It is a beautiful three level stretch that has been a big gainer for over 20 years at various schools. Mumme and Leach expanded the BYU quick game which was the basic slant combos and hitch combos and they added the popular Y-Stick route which is prevalent in nearly all offenses. In 1997 and 1998 they ran Y-Stick so many times successfully with James Whalen (played for the Cowboys for awhile) and once teams adapted to try and overplay the stick, they added the Y-Corner route to take advantage of the overreaction. In 1998, Mumme added the "Shallow Crossing Series", which he learned from our very own Shanny. This was a great route that is still used by Air Raid teams today, including Dana Holgerson at West Virginia. Very, very versatile and great vs. all coverages, with simple rules to learn, but hard to defend.

At West Virginia, they are still runnign many of the same classic Air Raid concepts with Geno that Tim Couch ran 15 years ago. They still run the two old BYU flood routes (Y-Cross and Y-Sail) and the Shallow Crossing Series and Holgerson has also emphasized the four verticals route, which everyone runs, but they have tried to perfect it. They do not run as much of the horizontal stuff as was the case at UK (they don't rush Mesh much, except in the Red Zone), but alot of hte classic Air Raid stuff is still there (Stick is still there, Corner is still there). Holgerson has added things which the other two QBs Khan mentioned (Newton and Smith) ran alot in their offenses. We have to make a distinction between pass-first spread offenses (such as the UK/Texas Tech Air Raid) and run-first spread offenses (Urban Meyer Gun option). Smith ran literally the latter at Utah in 2003-2004, featuring the basic read option, the triple option, speed option, shovel option etc., whereas Newton ran a similar offense under Gus Malzahn at Auburn (actually Auburn's offense is not so much a style as it is a tempo, if you read Malzahn's book, his empahsis is not so much on plays, but rather how fast to play, no-huddle, etc.)

What Smith is doing now in the passing game is similar to Couch, and there is some component similar to the run stuff for Smith. Actually, what Holgerson has really done there is try to do both at once and by at once I mean in the same play. They have their "duel read" packages, where you take it a step further from simply passing from the spread when the box numbers arent favorable and running when the box numbers are favorable. Instead, what he is doing is having both a run play and a pass play in the same actual call. There is no need to audible or anything like that. The most famous example is the Y-Stick/Draw combo. They will block the draw up front, which naturally starts out looking like a pass block anyway and depending on the movement of the ILB after the snap, they hand off the draw or throw the Stick route. There is alot of duel read stuff they do. They have a pattern where the OL will all run block, three WRs will be on one side, two of which will block on the defenders one will be ready to catch a quick screen and on the single reciever side they will run an option route, so you have it all there, there's no audibling or anything so that there is no chance of being decieved by the defense. Either the defense will have two guys covering the three recievers which leaves the screen open, or they will only assign one corner to the option route with no deep safety, or they wont have people in the box, so you dont check to anything, its 3 rolled into 1, no communication needed. Just snap it and decide.

Sorry for rambling, but the point is Bob this is not an NFL style of offense, none of these are. The classic Air Raid is not NFL style, the run game aspect of what they do with Geno is not NFL style, and certainly the duel read stuff is not NFL style. Personally, I think it would be fun to try and incorporate some of these things into the NFL (you see Shanny doing some of Baylor's stuff with RGIII, at least trying as best he can to blend together his traditional attack with the RG3 college stuff), but certainly most NFL offenses will be much different for Geno and that means he won't be at a strategic advantage with these special systems like he was in college (and like Tim Couch benefitted from back in the day when no one else ran this and virtually no one, not even in the big bad SEC knew how to defend it. Look at the old Kentucky scores from the last 90s, they had weak talent and still put up alot of points on major powers...same kinda thing for Geno, although he does have some good WRs).

IMO, you would be better served drafting Tyler Wilson. Now he's NOT worthy of the No. 1 overall pick, but I think he is a first round QB talent. I think Geno isn't a first round QB talent. He's a good athlete, but I'm not seeing it as a pro QB. I'm not trying to rag on the Chiefs Bob, this is my honest opinion.

FearLanier
12-26-2012, 12:14 AM
The system Smith plays in now was derived from the EXACT system Tim Couch played in at Kentucky in 1997 and 1998. Coach Mumme and Coach Leach attended alot of clinic lectures from LaVell Edwards and Norm Chow at BYU in the 1980s and early 1990s and often went up to BYU to soak in their ideas about the passing game. It was often siad that Mumme and Leach brought the BYU Offense "on steroids" to Kentucky, by taking what they felt were BYU's most successful plays, adding alot of new and interesting screen passes (the bubble screen became a staple in part due to its use in the late 90s at UK and also at Purdue, as did the WR middle screen and quick screen), and running it out of the shotgun, repping individual plays over and over ith a few tags here and there. They began with classic Mesh route from BYU. This was primarily a man to man beater, but they changed one route in the combo that made it deadly vs. zone by creating a triangle on the strongside that included both a horizontal stretch on the flat defender and a vertical stretch on said defender. They also blended together what was the original BYU "66" pass (their All Curl) with the BYU 67 pass (their three vertical pattern) so you would have a terrific pass that would work against all zones (Cov 2, Cov 3 and Quarters). They also took both of BYU's flood patterns, the strongside flood (65) and the weakside flood (69). They renumbered them in their offense and had the HB run an option route on their weakside flood. The weakside flood, known at UK, then T.T. and now W.V.U as "Y-Cross" was a big play waiting to happen and was very difficult for ILB's to defend because it started out looking alot like All-Curl and if they dropped too deep to choke the deep crossing route off, the TE could just sit down in the void. If he "got on top" of the MLB and made the deep cross, then the WLB would always be in a bind with the deep cross at 17-22 yards on top and the HB option route on the bottom. Whatever he does, he is wrong. The FS would also be neutralized by the outside WR's vertical. It is a beautiful three level stretch that has been a big gainer for over 20 years at various schools. Mumme and Leach expanded the BYU quick game which was the basic slant combos and hitch combos and they added the popular Y-Stick route which is prevalent in nearly all offenses. In 1997 and 1998 they ran Y-Stick so many times successfully with James Whalen (played for the Cowboys for awhile) and once teams adapted to try and overplay the stick, they added the Y-Corner route to take advantage of the overreaction. In 1998, Mumme added the "Shallow Crossing Series", which he learned from our very own Shanny. This was a great route that is still used by Air Raid teams today, including Dana Holgerson at West Virginia. Very, very versatile and great vs. all coverages, with simple rules to learn, but hard to defend.

At West Virginia, they are still runnign many of the same classic Air Raid concepts with Geno that Tim Couch ran 15 years ago. They still run the two old BYU flood routes (Y-Cross and Y-Sail) and the Shallow Crossing Series and Holgerson has also emphasized the four verticals route, which everyone runs, but they have tried to perfect it. They do not run as much of the horizontal stuff as was the case at UK (they don't rush Mesh much, except in the Red Zone), but alot of hte classic Air Raid stuff is still there (Stick is still there, Corner is still there). Holgerson has added things which the other two QBs Khan mentioned (Newton and Smith) ran alot in their offenses. We have to make a distinction between pass-first spread offenses (such as the UK/Texas Tech Air Raid) and run-first spread offenses (Urban Meyer Gun option). Smith ran literally the latter at Utah in 2003-2004, featuring the basic read option, the triple option, speed option, shovel option etc., whereas Newton ran a similar offense under Gus Malzahn at Auburn (actually Auburn's offense is not so much a style as it is a tempo, if you read Malzahn's book, his empahsis is not so much on plays, but rather how fast to play, no-huddle, etc.)

What Smith is doing now in the passing game is similar to Couch, and there is some component similar to the run stuff for Smith. Actually, what Holgerson has really done there is try to do both at once and by at once I mean in the same play. They have their "duel read" packages, where you take it a step further from simply passing from the spread when the box numbers arent favorable and running when the box numbers are favorable. Instead, what he is doing is having both a run play and a pass play in the same actual call. There is no need to audible or anything like that. The most famous example is the Y-Stick/Draw combo. They will block the draw up front, which naturally starts out looking like a pass block anyway and depending on the movement of the ILB after the snap, they hand off the draw or throw the Stick route. There is alot of duel read stuff they do. They have a pattern where the OL will all run block, three WRs will be on one side, two of which will block on the defenders one will be ready to catch a quick screen and on the single reciever side they will run an option route, so you have it all there, there's no audibling or anything so that there is no chance of being decieved by the defense. Either the defense will have two guys covering the three recievers which leaves the screen open, or they will only assign one corner to the option route with no deep safety, or they wont have people in the box, so you dont check to anything, its 3 rolled into 1, no communication needed. Just snap it and decide.

Sorry for rambling, but the point is Bob this is not an NFL style of offense, none of these are. The classic Air Raid is not NFL style, the run game aspect of what they do with Geno is not NFL style, and certainly the duel read stuff is not NFL style. Personally, I think it would be fun to try and incorporate some of these things into the NFL (you see Shanny doing some of Baylor's stuff with RGIII, at least trying as best he can to blend together his traditional attack with the RG3 college stuff), but certainly most NFL offenses will be much different for Geno and that means he won't be at a strategic advantage with these special systems like he was in college (and like Tim Couch benefitted from back in the day when no one else ran this and virtually no one, not even in the big bad SEC knew how to defend it. Look at the old Kentucky scores from the last 90s, they had weak talent and still put up alot of points on major powers...same kinda thing for Geno, although he does have some good WRs).

IMO, you would be better served drafting Tyler Wilson. Now he's NOT worthy of the No. 1 overall pick, but I think he is a first round QB talent. I think Geno isn't a first round QB talent. He's a good athlete, but I'm not seeing it as a pro QB. I'm not trying to rag on the Chiefs Bob, this is my honest opinion.

I agree with Tyler Wilson, but saying Geno Smith won't make it because he plays in the spread is simply not true. He's played in multiple systems and had great success in both.

The NFL is using the air raid a lot too. Look at what Shannahan is doing with RG3. Tom Brady air raided the Dolphins for 4 TD's and 500 yards a couple years ago and still uses it.
Peyton Manning even uses the air raid quite a bit. Even as a Colt.

It's used more in the NFL then people think.

SoCalBronco
12-26-2012, 12:26 AM
I agree with Tyler Wilson, but saying Geno Smith won't make it because he plays in the spread is simply not true. He's played in multiple systems and had great success in both.

The NFL is using the air raid a lot too. Look at what Shannahan is doing with RG3. Tom Brady air raided the Dolphins for 4 TD's and 500 yards a couple years ago and still uses it.
Peyton Manning even uses the air raid quite a bit. Even as a Colt.

It's used more in the NFL then people think.

No, no one uses the "Air Raid" in the NFL. By "Air Raid" I dont merely mean passing alot, even though they pass alot. I mean a very specific system of plays and a very specific practice style and nothing more. The Air Raid is a system where they have a few core pass plays and they are very specific and they will run just those plays, out of about 4-6 formations, with some tags for each play to make it appear multiple and to give it some flexibility for anticipated defensive adjustments. You start out with a dozen or so things, give each 2-3 tags, and you have (what appears to the opponent) as 35 plays when its really only 12-15.

That's it, that's all they do, except for a quick game and a fairly expansive screen game. They will run their few things over and over, it doesnt matter what the coverage is. Because there is so little of it, Leach will rep each one HUNDREDS of times each week so that they know what to do against any concievable defense. It's like the old Green Bay Packers sweep from the 60s (or the Shanny inside zone and outside zone with the complementary playaction and rollout). That's their thing. They wont come in with a million things, they rep it until they are perfect at it and the muscle memory is there for each person. If you go back and look at the old Kentucky playbooks, you'll see they number about 50 pages for everything together. The NFL is the EXACT opposite of the Air Raid (its also the exact opposite of Norm Chow's BYU/NC State/USC offense...at least until Pete Carroll told him to totally change the run game and also to emphasize more of the stuff the NFL was doing in the Quick game in particular, there are articles on this on Chris Brown's blog among other places). The NFL, by and large, believes in having a million different run and pass plays (200-400 pages). Coach Leach will install his ENTIRE OFFENSE in 3 days. There is not a SINGLE NFL OFFENSE that can be installed in just 3 days. Not one. Manning's Colts offense, it is true, is more of an execution offense, where they have a much smaller core than usual and they work with far fewer formatoins than usual, but he has the freedom to check in and out of just about anything to just about anything within that core and much of the offense is from the LOS so as to eliminate tendencies. Still, it is not similar to the Air Raid because they aren't using the Air Raid's classic bread and butter plays and it still likely has quite a bit more volume. The Air Raid is also distinct because of its practice style. If you read any of the Tony Franklin System materials or anything of the like, there is a very distinct way of practicing, what to empahsize, what not to, how they do repetitions, how they do passing drills, what they do to "replace" the need for stretching etc. So no, its not the same at all.

Bob's your Information Minister
12-26-2012, 01:17 AM
too bad geno can't make throws from under center. he'll never succeed in a pro set.

http://i.imgur.com/CoV87.gif

Doggcow
12-26-2012, 01:30 AM
too bad geno can't make throws from under center. he'll never succeed in a pro set.

http://i.imgur.com/Z7gS9.gif

What? Damnit Bob.

TheChamp24
12-26-2012, 06:11 AM
Honestly, all the 1st round caliber QB's this year don't necessarily scream "Franchise QB" to me. Kinda like the 2011 draft when you had Newton, Gabbert, Locker, Ponder all go in the 1st. Newton has shown flashes, but the other three, two of them flat out stink and the other one, Locker, is meh so far.

As for the "spread", it is more about having multiple WR's/TE's to throw to, spreading the defense, creating a mismatch somewhere to get a guy open for a 7 yard gain or so.

bronco militia
12-26-2012, 06:29 AM
CHIEFS WEEK!!

http://media1.break.com/dnet/media/2012/12/21/70cbc9c7-7e51-48cd-ae0f-c45bdcb1577a.gif

ZZZ...

Kaylore
12-26-2012, 08:57 AM
too bad geno can't make throws from under center. he'll never succeed in a pro set.

http://i.imgur.com/CoV87.gif

He's staring his receiver down the whole time. That's an interception in the NFL.

I love how all your gifs are him doing things wrong: Throwing into tripple coverage when there is another guy wide open, staring down his receivers.

You can tell this dude has one read every play.

Bob's your Information Minister
12-26-2012, 12:19 PM
He's staring his receiver down the whole time. That's an interception in the NFL.
.

Wrong. The ball comes out of his hands in two seconds.

That's a great throw and shows that he's not just a spread QB, too.

Keep digging the hole. There are dozens and dozens of snaps of this kid going through more than one read but you're sticking your head in the sand. Probably because you're scared ****less of the Chiefs getting a franchise QB for once.

SoCalBronco
12-26-2012, 12:24 PM
Sigh. Ok Bob lets wait to see where he is projected to go. I'll bet it's not in Round 1

Heyneck
12-26-2012, 12:31 PM
Geno sucks! I smell chiefs bust all over again!!! What a lousy QB year! And it had to be the chiefs picking #1!!! Hahahahaha that has to be some cosmic karma going for you guys!!!

Heyneck
12-26-2012, 12:36 PM
Plus dude,... Bob... you are the kiss of death for any of your player you start to rep! Anybody remember the Baldwin thread? What a complete fail. I can't remember a most incompetent franchise picking in the top 5. Let alone the first round. Keep it up Bob! Keep it up!!!

FearLanier
12-26-2012, 12:38 PM
No, no one uses the "Air Raid" in the NFL. By "Air Raid" I dont merely mean passing alot, even though they pass alot. I mean a very specific system of plays and a very specific practice style and nothing more. The Air Raid is a system where they have a few core pass plays and they are very specific and they will run just those plays, out of about 4-6 formations, with some tags for each play to make it appear multiple and to give it some flexibility for anticipated defensive adjustments. You start out with a dozen or so things, give each 2-3 tags, and you have (what appears to the opponent) as 35 plays when its really only 12-15.

That's it, that's all they do, except for a quick game and a fairly expansive screen game. They will run their few things over and over, it doesnt matter what the coverage is. Because there is so little of it, Leach will rep each one HUNDREDS of times each week so that they know what to do against any concievable defense. It's like the old Green Bay Packers sweep from the 60s (or the Shanny inside zone and outside zone with the complementary playaction and rollout). That's their thing. They wont come in with a million things, they rep it until they are perfect at it and the muscle memory is there for each person. If you go back and look at the old Kentucky playbooks, you'll see they number about 50 pages for everything together. The NFL is the EXACT opposite of the Air Raid (its also the exact opposite of Norm Chow's BYU/NC State/USC offense...at least until Pete Carroll told him to totally change the run game and also to emphasize more of the stuff the NFL was doing in the Quick game in particular, there are articles on this on Chris Brown's blog among other places). The NFL, by and large, believes in having a million different run and pass plays (200-400 pages). Coach Leach will install his ENTIRE OFFENSE in 3 days. There is not a SINGLE NFL OFFENSE that can be installed in just 3 days. Not one. Manning's Colts offense, it is true, is more of an execution offense, where they have a much smaller core than usual and they work with far fewer formatoins than usual, but he has the freedom to check in and out of just about anything to just about anything within that core and much of the offense is from the LOS so as to eliminate tendencies. Still, it is not similar to the Air Raid because they aren't using the Air Raid's classic bread and butter plays and it still likely has quite a bit more volume. The Air Raid is also distinct because of its practice style. If you read any of the Tony Franklin System materials or anything of the like, there is a very distinct way of practicing, what to empahsize, what not to, how they do repetitions, how they do passing drills, what they do to "replace" the need for stretching etc. So no, its not the same at all.

The NFL runs the Air Raid or variances of it. Especially the basic Air Raid concept as shown below..

http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2009/09/10/sports/patsplay3.jpg

They don't run it consistently as the main scheme, but it is a big part of different teams play books, like Peyton Manning's for example.

http://smartfootball.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/3-Levels.png
http://smartfootball.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/5-Smash.png
http://smartfootball.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/9-4Verts.png
http://smartfootball.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/3-Levels.png

And Tom Brady. Pats use the Air Raid more than anyone.

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/j5v9EOlCgpY" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

TheChamp24
12-26-2012, 12:38 PM
Sigh. Ok Bob lets wait to see where he is projected to go. I'll bet it's not in Round 1

Geno's projected to be the #1 pick currently. He will be a 1st round pick.

SoCalBronco
12-26-2012, 12:45 PM
The NFL runs the Air Raid or variances of it. Especially the basic Air Raid concept as shown below..

http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2009/09/10/sports/patsplay3.jpg

They don't run it consistently as the main scheme, but it is a big part of different teams play books, like Peyton Manning's for example.

http://smartfootball.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/3-Levels.png
http://smartfootball.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/5-Smash.png
http://smartfootball.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/9-4Verts.png
http://smartfootball.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/3-Levels.png

And Tom Brady. Pats use the Air Raid more than anyone.

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/j5v9EOlCgpY" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Again no. The stuff you have cited are the Levels concept which was the classic play at Indy and you still see it in Denver and many places. The other stuff is also NFL stuff. Air Raiders don't use Levels. Everyone has a version of four verticals and smash but AR has a very specific version of four verts.

FearLanier
12-26-2012, 12:47 PM
He's staring his receiver down the whole time. That's an interception in the NFL.

I love how all your gifs are him doing things wrong: Throwing into tripple coverage when there is another guy wide open, staring down his receivers.

You can tell this dude has one read every play.

Goes to his 2nd read and under pressure and makes a great throw.

http://assets.sbnation.com/assets/1904895/geno1.gif

He throws to his first read a lot (especially when he's down in the game) but there's no mistaken that he goes through his progressions quite a bit too.

FearLanier
12-26-2012, 12:52 PM
Again no. The stuff you have cited are the Levels concept which was the classic play at Indy and you still see it in Denver and many places. The other stuff is also NFL stuff. Air Raiders don't use Levels. Everyone has a version of four verticals and smash but AR has a very specific version of four verts.

It's very similar to what Geno runs now and I have no doubt he could easily understand and run that offense efficiently.

The fact that he ran a pro style system for an entire year in college tells me he can learn multiple systems and run them well (had 24 TD's to 8 INT's with about 3,000 yards).

It's like people don't think Geno is smart enough to run a pro system or something, which is silly.

Heyneck
12-26-2012, 01:05 PM
It's very similar to what Geno runs now and I have no doubt he could easily understand and run that offense efficiently.

The fact that he ran a pro style system for an entire year in college tells me he can learn multiple systems and run them well (had 24 TD's to 8 INT's with about 3,000 yards).

It's like people don't think Geno is smart enough to run a pro system or something, which is silly.

Geno can run an offense... but is he worth the #1 pick? Hell to the no!

Bob's your Information Minister
12-26-2012, 01:11 PM
Geno can run an offense... but is he worth the #1 pick? Hell to the no!

He's worth the #1 pick as much as Cam was.

Tell me what Cam did better than Geno coming out. I'll wait.

Bob's your Information Minister
12-26-2012, 01:11 PM
Sigh. Ok Bob lets wait to see where he is projected to go. I'll bet it's not in Round 1

If the Chiefs don't take him the Jags or Raiders will. He's a top 5 pick, easy.

Multiple mocks have him going #1.

FearLanier
12-26-2012, 01:22 PM
Geno can run an offense... but is he worth the #1 pick? Hell to the no!

Neither was Cam Newton or RG3 at this point when they were prospects.

TheReverend
12-26-2012, 01:29 PM
He's worth the #1 pick as much as Cam was.

Tell me what Cam did better than Geno coming out. I'll wait.

https://encrypted-tbn2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRqtr8LTss9XQUmSasCHMmscEvInu5HC 8sLTn_yQjz87db5B29y9g







my bad, I meant








https://encrypted-tbn2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQlv0X4c09mGf9dpf0icrygLFetrVj-aKdJrfIa60Rbx_C6VdC7PA



And I think Cam's mega overrated too, so what does that tell you? I pray that the Chiefs draft Geno.

Very little could make me NFL-happier in April.

FearLanier
12-26-2012, 01:31 PM
https://encrypted-tbn2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRqtr8LTss9XQUmSasCHMmscEvInu5HC 8sLTn_yQjz87db5B29y9g







my bad, I meant








https://encrypted-tbn2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQlv0X4c09mGf9dpf0icrygLFetrVj-aKdJrfIa60Rbx_C6VdC7PA



And I think Cam's mega overrated too, so what does that tell you? I pray that the Chiefs draft Geno.

Very little could make me NFL-happier in April.

Geno doesn't have the me-first attitude that Cam does, he's smarter than Cam and he's invested in the game completely unlike Cam.

So a Cam comparison is kind of a stretch.

Kaylore
12-26-2012, 01:32 PM
How do you know Geno is smarter than Cam Newton?

oubronco
12-26-2012, 01:33 PM
He's worth the #1 pick as much as Cam was.

Tell me what Cam did better than Geno coming out. I'll wait.

They both suck just not as bad as Tebow

TheReverend
12-26-2012, 01:35 PM
Geno doesn't have the me-first attitude that Cam does, he's smarter than Cam and he's invested in the game completely unlike Cam.

So a Cam comparison is kind of a stretch.

You're right. One was clutch carrying his team to their first ever BCS Championship in an undefeated season.

The other completely pissed his team out of any form of contention.

I'm really looking forward to the latter coming to AFCW.

Maybe "Red Drank" this time?

FearLanier
12-26-2012, 01:36 PM
How do you know Geno is smarter than Cam Newton?

"A visionary, he was called. After taking an intelligence test, he was labeled gifted. If his mother wished, Smith could have skipped a grade. She decided against it, preferring he mature with his peers — a notion that did not go as planned, considering Smith often grew bored after finishing his schoolwork faster than most of his classmates.

“His visions of things have always been beyond his years,” Tracey Sellers said of her son, who is now West Virginia’s quarterback and a serious Heisman Trophy contender for the ninth-ranked Mountaineers (3-0), who host No. 25 Baylor (3-0) on Saturday."

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/09/29/sports/ncaafootball/geno-smith-and-the-art-of-football-at-west-virginia.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0

TheReverend
12-26-2012, 01:38 PM
"A visionary, he was called. After taking an intelligence test, he was labeled gifted. If his mother wished, Smith could have skipped a grade. She decided against it, preferring he mature with his peers — a notion that did not go as planned, considering Smith often grew bored after finishing his schoolwork faster than most of his classmates.

“His visions of things have always been beyond his years,” Tracey Sellers said of her son, who is now West Virginia’s quarterback and a serious Heisman Trophy contender for the ninth-ranked Mountaineers (3-0), who host No. 25 Baylor (3-0) on Saturday."

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/09/29/sports/ncaafootball/geno-smith-and-the-art-of-football-at-west-virginia.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0

^ Ha!

Color me convinced! His visions! Geno Smith is the second coming sent to save the Chiefs! :rofl:

TheChamp24
12-26-2012, 01:39 PM
Again, this class is extremely weak on the offensive side and at QB in terms of those franchise type players.
Matt Barkley was the #1 overall pick back in September, and now he's a fringe first rounder I think.
There are some decent prospects, but none of them that absolutely wow you and say "You have to take this guy!".
Smith seems the best to me, I never understood why Landry Jones gets downvoted so much when he's had similar paths and strengths/weaknesses to all the other QB's like Wilson and Barkley.

TheReverend
12-26-2012, 01:40 PM
Again, this class is extremely weak on the offensive side and at QB in terms of those franchise type players.
Matt Barkley was the #1 overall pick back in September, and now he's a fringe first rounder I think.
There are some decent prospects, but none of them that absolutely wow you and say "You have to take this guy!".
Smith seems the best to me, I never understood why Landry Jones gets downvoted so much when he's had similar paths and strengths/weaknesses to all the other QB's like Wilson and Barkley.

They're ALL fringe first rounders. Not even a Sam Bradford or Stafford among them. GREAT year for the Chiefs to draft #1.

FearLanier
12-26-2012, 01:46 PM
You're right. One was clutch carrying his team to their first ever BCS Championship in an undefeated season.

The other completely pissed his team out of any form of contention.

I'm really looking forward to the latter coming to AFCW.

Maybe "Red Drank" this time?

Well Rev,I see you have never watched a WVU game before. If you did, maybe you'd see that their defense is the worst in college football, his running game is non-existent, his OL is average at best, his ST's has given up 3 TD's as well as his kicker not being able to make chip shots and his HC has no idea how to fix any of it.

Geno put his team in a position to win twice against TCU and multiple times vs OU.

But hey, I guess that's Geno's fault too.

FearLanier
12-26-2012, 01:47 PM
They're ALL fringe first rounders. Not even a Sam Bradford or Stafford among them. GREAT year for the Chiefs to draft #1.

Geno Smith>Sam Bradford

TheReverend
12-26-2012, 01:48 PM
Well Rev,I see you have never watched a WVU game before. If you did, maybe you'd see that their defense is the worst in college football, his running game is non-existent, his OL is average at best, his ST's has given up 3 TD's as well as his kicker not being able to make chip shots and his HC has no idea how to fix any of it.

Geno put his team in a position to win twice against TCU and multiple times vs OU.

But hey, I guess that's Geno's fault too.

Geno Smith>Sam Bradford

Lol, you're right, you should totally draft him :notworthy

FearLanier
12-26-2012, 01:53 PM
Lol, you're right, you should totally draft him :notworthy

Why would you take Bradford over Geno?

delany
12-26-2012, 02:13 PM
Geno Smith>Sam Bradford

Amazing how in love with Geno you are now...seeing as you were on Barkley's jock as late as Oct\Nov. Then when you saw his stock drop, you switched to Geno. You fall in and out of love quicker than a teenage girl.

Like all other Chief fans, you can convince yourself of anything. No need to think for yourself at all. Just read a mock draft that shows the Chiefs picking a QB and proudly proclaim...Thats my guy!!! No wait.....Thats my guy!!! No wait....Thats my guy!!!

Bob's your Information Minister
12-26-2012, 02:35 PM
https://encrypted-tbn2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRqtr8LTss9XQUmSasCHMmscEvInu5HC 8sLTn_yQjz87db5B29y9g







my bad, I meant








https://encrypted-tbn2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQlv0X4c09mGf9dpf0icrygLFetrVj-aKdJrfIa60Rbx_C6VdC7PA



And I think Cam's mega overrated too, so what does that tell you? I pray that the Chiefs draft Geno.

Very little could make me NFL-happier in April.

And neither are relevant in terms of NFL success.

FearLanier
12-26-2012, 02:40 PM
Amazing how in love with Geno you are now...seeing as you were on Barkley's jock as late as Oct\Nov. Then when you saw his stock drop, you switched to Geno. You fall in and out of love quicker than a teenage girl.

Like all other Chief fans, you can convince yourself of anything. No need to think for yourself at all. Just read a mock draft that shows the Chiefs picking a QB and proudly proclaim...Thats my guy!!! No wait.....Thats my guy!!! No wait....Thats my guy!!!

Barkley was a great pick, but I jumped off his bandwagon when I found out that he was cheating.

He had great arm strength because USC ball boys deflated the ball some.

I still think he can be an Andy Dalton like QB in a good situation. He's really smart and has leadership.

FearLanier
12-26-2012, 02:43 PM
I think it's pretty silly that everybody here thinks these QB's are the next Brady Quinn/JaMarcus Russell.

TheReverend
12-26-2012, 02:45 PM
I think it's pretty silly that everybody here thinks these QB's are the next Brady Quinn/JaMarcus Russell.

Say that again in 2015 when you're drafting your next one.

Kaylore
12-26-2012, 02:58 PM
"A visionary, he was called. After taking an intelligence test, he was labeled gifted. If his mother wished, Smith could have skipped a grade. She decided against it, preferring he mature with his peers — a notion that did not go as planned, considering Smith often grew bored after finishing his schoolwork faster than most of his classmates.

“His visions of things have always been beyond his years,” Tracey Sellers said of her son, who is now West Virginia’s quarterback and a serious Heisman Trophy contender for the ninth-ranked Mountaineers (3-0), who host No. 25 Baylor (3-0) on Saturday."

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/09/29/sports/ncaafootball/geno-smith-and-the-art-of-football-at-west-virginia.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0

So what? Because his Mom "wished he could skip a grade." And his visions beyond his years? What does that even mean? How does that make him better than Cam Newton?

Ryan Fitzpatrick is a genius and scored the highest ever on the wonderlic. That doesn't make him a football genius.

FearLanier
12-26-2012, 03:24 PM
Say that again in 2015 when you're drafting your next one.

You still haven't explained what you don't like about Geno or Wilson.

FearLanier
12-26-2012, 03:25 PM
So what? Because his Mom "wished he could skip a grade." And his visions beyond his years? What does that even mean? How does that make him better than Cam Newton?

Ryan Fitzpatrick is a genius and scored the highest ever on the wonderlic. That doesn't make him a football genius.

He's an extremely smart guy who has always proven to understand things better than everyone in school. He's proven his football IQ at college. He's played in the spread and a completely different system with a ton of pro style plays/looks and looked great in both.

Ryan Fitzpatrick was a horrible QB in college and he played in the Ivy League. He doesn't have the talent Geno does.

Tombstone RJ
12-26-2012, 03:30 PM
"A visionary, he was called. After taking an intelligence test, he was labeled gifted. If his mother wished, Smith could have skipped a grade. She decided against it, preferring he mature with his peers — a notion that did not go as planned, considering Smith often grew bored after finishing his schoolwork faster than most of his classmates.

“His visions of things have always been beyond his years,” Tracey Sellers said of her son, who is now West Virginia’s quarterback and a serious Heisman Trophy contender for the ninth-ranked Mountaineers (3-0), who host No. 25 Baylor (3-0) on Saturday."

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/09/29/sports/ncaafootball/geno-smith-and-the-art-of-football-at-west-virginia.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0

He's a regular Joey Harrington

TheReverend
12-26-2012, 03:32 PM
You still haven't explained what you don't like about Geno or Wilson.

Because it's an incredibly long laundry list of "lol you're not a #1 pick", but for a sample:

How about inconsistent mechanics and the subsequent accuracy issues that he's exhibited especially downfield, entirely shotgun experience, backfoot penchant without a "Cutler" tier arm to compensate. His gaudy numbers are a reflection of the passing scheme and Big-12 more than anything else. His "athleticism" will get exposed at the combine.

Also, for every ONE Clemson game, there's two Texas Tech and K-State.

Rolandftw
12-26-2012, 03:34 PM
I think it's pretty silly that everybody here thinks these QB's are the next Brady Quinn/JaMarcus Russell.

They could be. It's all a crapshoot really. Guess I don't see Geno as someone that has a better skill set then Sam Bradford or Cam Newton even. I think if either talent was available in this class, they would go #1

R8R H8R
12-26-2012, 03:37 PM
Wrong. The ball comes out of his hands in two seconds.

That's a great throw and shows that he's not just a spread QB, too.

Keep digging the hole. There are dozens and dozens of snaps of this kid going through more than one read but you're sticking your head in the sand. Probably because you're scared ****less of the Chiefs getting a franchise QB for once.

Just curious what you will do if your new GM disagrees with you on this guy, and passes on him? Maybe he will trade for Flynn instead? You never know.

FearLanier
12-26-2012, 03:44 PM
Because it's an incredibly long laundry list of "lol you're not a #1 pick", but for a sample:

How about inconsistent mechanics and the subsequent accuracy issues that he's exhibited especially downfield, entirely shotgun experience, backfoot penchant without a "Cutler" tier arm to compensate. His gaudy numbers are a reflection of the passing scheme and Big-12 more than anything else. His "athleticism" will get exposed at the combine.

Also, for every ONE Clemson game, there's two Texas Tech and K-State.

Mechanics can't be fixed by coaching? I don't think they are that big of a problem. His accuracy is one of his best assets.

And in a completely different system, Geno had 24 TD's/8 INT's and 65% completion percentage. So much for him only being able to succeed in the spread eh?

I don't think he's a generational QB, but I think he is definitely better than a lot of the normal QB's of the last few years.

Rolandftw
12-26-2012, 03:45 PM
Wrong. The ball comes out of his hands in two seconds.

That's a great throw and shows that he's not just a spread QB, too.

Keep digging the hole. There are dozens and dozens of snaps of this kid going through more than one read but you're sticking your head in the sand. Probably because you're scared ****less of the Chiefs getting a franchise QB for once.

I don't think too many Broncos fans are worried about KC, franchise QB or not. It's Chief fans that feel convinced, they're only really missing talent at the QB position (and GM and HC), and getting a franchise QB would mean 12-15 years of dominance effective from Geno's rookie season.

FearLanier
12-26-2012, 04:08 PM
Pretty high praise when Oliver Luck is telling people you are a good student of the game.


Geno Smith Is Just A System Quarterback?

By Richard Cirminiello
CollegeFootballNews.com
Posted Oct 1, 2012

Share on twitter Share on facebook | More Sharing ServicesMore

Richard Cirminiello's Monday Thought: Geno Smith has become football's newest superstar.



- Cirminiello: Geno Smith Is The Real Deal
- Zemek: The Teams That Aren't For Real
- Harrison: Penn State As The Big Ten Spoiler
- Johnson: The ACC's Woes Continue
- Doan: So What If Ohio State Goes 12-0?

By Richard Cirminiello

Geno Smith plays in a great system for quarterbacks. He is not, however, a system quarterback.

The proverbial system quarterback. He’s the guy who piles up video game-like stats on the college level despite having questionable physical ability, at least the way NFL scouts and GMs evaluate physical ability. He flourishes in an attack designed to spread out defenses, speed up the tempo and fill the air with a hailstorm of passes. He is Timmy Chang, Case Keenum, B.J. Symons and countless others who’ve been disciples of the likes of June Jones, Mike Leach and Hal Mumme. He is not Geno Smith.

Smith has put up staggering numbers through the first four games of 2012. How monstrous? He’s on pace to finish the regular season with 60 touchdown passes and 5,184 yards … and no picks. He’s also completing more than 83% of his passes, many of which have been tough throws, out routes and crossing patterns.

There aren’t a lot of dump-offs in this West Virginia attack. Because Smith is off to a record-breaking start, though, it becomes convenient for casual fans and observers to assume that the senior from Miramar, Fla. in Broward County is nothing more than a watered-down product of his system. Nothing could be further from the truth.

Those who viewed more than just the Mountaineers’ box score on Saturday got a glimpse of what Smith is all about. The numbers are sterling. But the film is even better. He’s a legitimate next-level passer who might go on to challenge everyone at his position, including USC’s Matt Barkley, for top billing at April’s NFL Draft. Smith is well-sized, has a great feel for the pocket and throws the best ball of anyone at this level. And the competition may not even be close.

His receivers, especially Tavon Austin and Stedman Bailey, are loaded with talent, but Smith makes the job of those around him so much easier by delicately dropping the ball into their hands. His precision, accuracy and timing are impeccable. His release is quick, and his decision-making is improving.

I spent time with West Virginia AD Oliver Luck in the spring. When the subject of his program’s quarterback came up, he raved about the maturation of Smith in Morgantown, not just as a passer, but also as a student of the game. Luck described No. 12 as one of the smartest and most mature young quarterbacks he’d been around.

They were words of high praise from a man whose own son was the top overall pick of the 2011 NFL Draft. He went on to say that Smith is a highly cerebral athlete who’ll get better as he spends more time learning from inventive head coach Dana Holgorsen. The dividends from that relationship have really begun to bear fruit for both sides this season.

Don’t downplay or dismiss Geno Smith because he strafed the Baylor D for a record-setting eight touchdowns and 656 yards on 45-of-51 passing this past weekend. He’s just Don’t downplay or dismiss Geno Smith because he strafed the Baylor D for a record-setting eight touchdowns and 656 yards on 45-of-51 passing this past weekend. He’s just maximizing his talent, taking what defenses give him and blossoming into the kind of all-eight touchdowns and 656 yards on 45-of-51 passing this past weekend. He’s just maximizing his talent, taking what defenses give him and blossoming into the kind of all-around quarterback who’s capable of following a similar trajectory to Sundays that RG3

http://cfn.scout.com/2/1226731.html

Heyneck
12-27-2012, 09:08 AM
"A visionary, he was called. After taking an intelligence test, he was labeled gifted. If his mother wished, Smith could have skipped a grade. She decided against it, preferring he mature with his peers — a notion that did not go as planned, considering Smith often grew bored after finishing his schoolwork faster than most of his classmates.

“His visions of things have always been beyond his years,” Tracey Sellers said of her son, who is now West Virginia’s quarterback and a serious Heisman Trophy contender for the ninth-ranked Mountaineers (3-0), who host No. 25 Baylor (3-0) on Saturday."

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/09/29/sports/ncaafootball/geno-smith-and-the-art-of-football-at-west-virginia.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0

Seriously? Mom comments to back up his intelligence? Hahahaha people skip grades all the time. That doesn't make them savants. HAhahahaha please take Geno!!! Russel Wilson is 3 times the complete QB and leader Geno will ever be... and he was a 3rd rounder (Got to admit Russel is really rad)!!!

Heyneck
12-27-2012, 09:10 AM
If the Chiefs don't take him the Jags or Raiders will. He's a top 5 pick, easy.

Multiple mocks have him going #1.

Actually when people refer to him they talk about top 15... but yeah... please go and use the 1st overall on him.

Kaylore
12-27-2012, 09:15 AM
The fact that the Jags and Raiders have targeted him is a red flag he sucks already. :rofl:

Heyneck
12-27-2012, 09:17 AM
Pretty high praise when Oliver Luck is telling people you are a good student of the game.


Geno Smith Is Just A System Quarterback?

By Richard Cirminiello
CollegeFootballNews.com
Posted Oct 1, 2012

Share on twitter Share on facebook | More Sharing ServicesMore

Richard Cirminiello's Monday Thought: Geno Smith has become football's newest superstar.



- Cirminiello: Geno Smith Is The Real Deal
- Zemek: The Teams That Aren't For Real
- Harrison: Penn State As The Big Ten Spoiler
- Johnson: The ACC's Woes Continue
- Doan: So What If Ohio State Goes 12-0?

By Richard Cirminiello

Geno Smith plays in a great system for quarterbacks. He is not, however, a system quarterback.

The proverbial system quarterback. He’s the guy who piles up video game-like stats on the college level despite having questionable physical ability, at least the way NFL scouts and GMs evaluate physical ability. He flourishes in an attack designed to spread out defenses, speed up the tempo and fill the air with a hailstorm of passes. He is Timmy Chang, Case Keenum, B.J. Symons and countless others who’ve been disciples of the likes of June Jones, Mike Leach and Hal Mumme. He is not Geno Smith.

Smith has put up staggering numbers through the first four games of 2012. How monstrous? He’s on pace to finish the regular season with 60 touchdown passes and 5,184 yards … and no picks. He’s also completing more than 83% of his passes, many of which have been tough throws, out routes and crossing patterns.

There aren’t a lot of dump-offs in this West Virginia attack. Because Smith is off to a record-breaking start, though, it becomes convenient for casual fans and observers to assume that the senior from Miramar, Fla. in Broward County is nothing more than a watered-down product of his system. Nothing could be further from the truth.

Those who viewed more than just the Mountaineers’ box score on Saturday got a glimpse of what Smith is all about. The numbers are sterling. But the film is even better. He’s a legitimate next-level passer who might go on to challenge everyone at his position, including USC’s Matt Barkley, for top billing at April’s NFL Draft. Smith is well-sized, has a great feel for the pocket and throws the best ball of anyone at this level. And the competition may not even be close.

His receivers, especially Tavon Austin and Stedman Bailey, are loaded with talent, but Smith makes the job of those around him so much easier by delicately dropping the ball into their hands. His precision, accuracy and timing are impeccable. His release is quick, and his decision-making is improving.

I spent time with West Virginia AD Oliver Luck in the spring. When the subject of his program’s quarterback came up, he raved about the maturation of Smith in Morgantown, not just as a passer, but also as a student of the game. Luck described No. 12 as one of the smartest and most mature young quarterbacks he’d been around.

They were words of high praise from a man whose own son was the top overall pick of the 2011 NFL Draft. He went on to say that Smith is a highly cerebral athlete who’ll get better as he spends more time learning from inventive head coach Dana Holgorsen. The dividends from that relationship have really begun to bear fruit for both sides this season.

Don’t downplay or dismiss Geno Smith because he strafed the Baylor D for a record-setting eight touchdowns and 656 yards on 45-of-51 passing this past weekend. He’s just Don’t downplay or dismiss Geno Smith because he strafed the Baylor D for a record-setting eight touchdowns and 656 yards on 45-of-51 passing this past weekend. He’s just maximizing his talent, taking what defenses give him and blossoming into the kind of all-eight touchdowns and 656 yards on 45-of-51 passing this past weekend. He’s just maximizing his talent, taking what defenses give him and blossoming into the kind of all-around quarterback who’s capable of following a similar trajectory to Sundays that RG3

http://cfn.scout.com/2/1226731.html

So you just posted an article off his first 4 games this year? ok... he played against who??? Hahahahaha plus who wrote this? Is the writer in 8th or 10th grade? Because I know kids that write better than this. Just look at that last paragraph.

DBroncos4life
12-27-2012, 09:41 AM
If I was KC I would do whatever it could to move back and then draft Sean Renfree from Duke later.

Bob's your Information Minister
12-27-2012, 10:07 AM
The fact that the Jags and Raiders have targeted him is a red flag he sucks already. :rofl:

The only reason he's in a discussion with those teams is because they pick #2 and #3.

If the Eagles, Browns, Cardinals or Jets were picking #2 or #3 they'd probably be after Geno, too.

Geno is being mocked by a lot of people at #1 now. NFLdraftcountdown.com has him going 1st overall. Noted draft guru Matt Miller has him going #1 to the Chiefs, too.

@nfldraftscout
If I'm the #Chiefs, Geno Smith is my guy unless a trade out is possible. He's athletic, exciting, productive enough to spark offense.

The only people who don't seem to be on the Geno bandwagon at this point are dumb Chiefs fans who want Tim Tebow or Alex Smith, or Broncos fans who are so scared of the Chiefs getting a stud QB they're going way too far on disparaging the man who is clearly the top QB coming out.

Kaylore
12-27-2012, 10:14 AM
Kiper doesn't even have him as the first QB off the board.

Bob's your Information Minister
12-27-2012, 10:19 AM
Kiper's a mouth breathing retard, though. There's ample evidence of this.

24champ
12-27-2012, 10:31 AM
Rick Mirer II, The sequel.

FearLanier
12-27-2012, 11:13 AM
Kiper doesn't even have him as the first QB off the board.

That's because Kiper is a dumbass who is always wrong every year.

FearLanier
12-27-2012, 11:19 AM
Here's exactly what I was talking about for Kaylore and SoCal. The NFL is changing drastically. The spread is becoming gospel for several teams.

http://www.sbnation.com/longform/2012/12/27/3792740/pistol-offense-nfl-redskins-rg3

DENVERDUI55
12-27-2012, 11:28 AM
Smith the next AFCW bust QB. I'm hope chiefs take him.

Kaylore
12-27-2012, 11:35 AM
If you think I'm ripping Smith because the Chiefs want him, you're wrong. If this was last year and it was Luck and RGIII coming out, I would be the most miserable person in the world on draft day. It's just how the Chiefs are. They find ways to fail in epic ways. I mean they even got to draft a QB in 1983 and took the worst one. Eason and O'Brien would have even been better. But the Chiefs found a way to screw it up. Now they have their worst record in a long time, look at the first pick in the draft, and are facing one of the worst classes in the last five years.

I bet you guys get Geno Smith, he bombs, and the other QB's taken ALL become amazing, further adding to your fail. In fact there will probably be some sixth round pick that goes Brady and becomes a HOF legend, while Geno Smith is backing up the Cardinals in 2019.

FearLanier
12-27-2012, 11:44 AM
If you think I'm ripping Smith because the Chiefs want him, you're wrong. If this was last year and it was Luck and RGIII coming out, I would be the most miserable person in the world on draft day. It's just how the Chiefs are. They find ways to fail in epic ways. I mean they even got to draft a QB in 1983 and took the worst one. Eason and O'Brien would have even been better. But the Chiefs found a way to screw it up. Now they have their worst record in a long time, look at the first pick in the draft, and are facing one of the worst classes in the last five years.

I bet you guys get Geno Smith, he bombs, and the other QB's taken ALL become amazing, further adding to your fail. In fact there will probably be some sixth round pick that goes Brady and becomes a HOF legend, while Geno Smith is backing up the Cardinals in 2019.

Hmm well I like Tyler Wilson as my #1 guy, though I wouldn't mind him or Geno Smith.

And fun fact Kaylore...at this time last year Kiper had RG3 ranked 24th on his big board.

Different people will be running the Chiefs than now or 1983, so we don't know what will happen.

Oh and if there is one class that is going to suck, it's next years QB class. The Louisville QB is the only real good one and he's not even that great.

FearLanier
12-27-2012, 11:55 AM
Actually Kaylore I'm curious on your thoughts of Tyler Wilson.

Bob's your Information Minister
12-27-2012, 12:00 PM
Now they have their worst record in a long time, look at the first pick in the draft, and are facing one of the worst classes in the last five years.


That's not true, though.

This is at least as good as the 2008 QB draft class.

Ryan and Wilson are very comparable prospects, although Wilson has a stronger arm.

So are Glennon and Flacco.

I'm not sure where Geno fits but he's damn sure a better prospect than Tyler Wilson, and didn't throw 19 picks like Ryan.

FearLanier
12-27-2012, 12:09 PM
That's not true, though.

This is at least as good as the 2008 QB draft class.

Ryan and Wilson are very comparable prospects, although Wilson has a stronger arm.

So are Glennon and Flacco.

I'm not sure where Geno fits but he's damn sure a better prospect than Tyler Wilson, and didn't throw 19 picks like Ryan.

Based on what? Just curious.

Kaylore
12-27-2012, 12:12 PM
Actually Kaylore I'm curious on your thoughts of Tyler Wilson.

I like him better than Geno. One of my problems with Geno is he has amazing receivers and plays in a spread against crappy defenses. Petrino liked to mix things up which let Wilson take snaps under center. I like that he has faced adversity with the coaching fallout and played elite competion. He reminds me of Christian Ponder.

FearLanier
12-27-2012, 12:29 PM
I like him better than Geno. One of my problems with Geno is he has amazing receivers and plays in a spread against crappy defenses. Petrino liked to mix things up which let Wilson take snaps under center. I like that he has faced adversity with the coaching fallout and played elite competion. He reminds me of Christian Ponder.

His technique reminds me of Christian Ponder, especially his feet, but I think his overall playing style reminds me of Tony Romo, though I think that he has the toughness and leadership that Tony Romo lacks.

Heyneck
12-27-2012, 12:31 PM
I like him better than Geno. One of my problems with Geno is he has amazing receivers and plays in a spread against crappy defenses. Petrino liked to mix things up which let Wilson take snaps under center. I like that he has faced adversity with the coaching fallout and played elite competion. He reminds me of Christian Ponder.

Yup me too. I think Tyler is better pro-prospect than Geno. He reminds me a lot about Ryan. We all now how that turned out for the Dolphins... Anyway, people can talk about Spread QBs coming into the league and it being called the new frontier. But in reality, it's just a small sample of QBs, and most importantly they have coordinators or coaches that can adapt that scheme to the pro game.

Bob's your Information Minister
12-27-2012, 12:35 PM
One of my problems with Geno is he has amazing receivers and plays in a spread against crappy defenses.

Check out what he did against the OU #8 pass defense then.

You sound like you haven't watched him much, if at all.

Geno had a 17-4 TD-INT ratio against top 25 teams this year.

Fedaykin
12-27-2012, 01:00 PM
jags, faid and bob like Smith?

Dude will wash out in 3 years.

zms325i
12-27-2012, 01:02 PM
Its kinda funny that the chiefs week thread became the same as every one of bobs offseason threads. yada yada yada the chiefs are going to do x y or z and become better than everyone else soon. Brandon Albert is better than Clady, Houston is better than Miller, hali is better than Dumervil, Croyle is better than Cutler, Bowe is better than Marshall/Thomas, Moeaki is better than Gonzo was. It literally the same thing every season/week/thread, but it never comes true. I am sure that Smith will be a sure fire HOFer, because Bob loves him. Meanwhile, the Broncs are 12-3 and looking great. Good luck with the pick I guess.

FearLanier
12-27-2012, 01:03 PM
Check out what he did against the OU #8 pass defense then.

You sound like you haven't watched him much, if at all.

Geno had a 17-4 TD-INT ratio against top 25 teams this year.

I'd still take Wilson. Wilson had nobody but Cobi Hamilton this year (and Hamilton dropped a ton of balls) but yet he looked just as good as he did last year despite his coach and top 3 WR's leaving Arkansas.

This is why I like Tyler Wilson.

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/g1icbPg7Efw" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

There are two kinds of people in this world: followers and leaders. Tyler Wilson is no question a leader.
Hell they almost beat LSU for crying out loud. Do you know how impressive it is have a team like LSU on the ropes when you have virtually no talent or coaching? Wilson WAS Arkansas coach this year.

cutthemdown
12-27-2012, 01:18 PM
Geno Smith just not that good. I am loving the fact Chiefs think he is the number 1 pick. This is going to be so funny to watch.

Kaylore
12-27-2012, 01:40 PM
Geno Smith just not that good. I am loving the fact Chiefs think he is the number 1 pick. This is going to be so funny to watch.

Really Chief fans think that. We're not even sure who their GM is going to be, but it's really who HE thinks is worth it. Hopefully it's someone stupid.

Kaylore
12-27-2012, 01:44 PM
His technique reminds me of Christian Ponder, especially his feet, but I think his overall playing style reminds me of Tony Romo, though I think that he has the toughness and leadership that Tony Romo lacks.

That's the thing is he plays like Romo because his line sucks, which again I think is a good thing. Cutler was in similar circumstances. It develops some bad habbits, but also some necessary ones to pay in the pros. Remember that Ponder was really mobile in college too, so I mean Ponder as he was a prospect. And I didn't mean to compare him to Ponder as a way to slam him. It's too early to say he's a bust or not and I think Ponder could still develop.

FearLanier
12-27-2012, 02:40 PM
Really Chief fans think that. We're not even sure who their GM is going to be, but it's really who HE thinks is worth it. Hopefully it's someone stupid.

Latest news on Chiefs GM search. Glad Polian is not linked.

Kansas City -- The general consensus among the league sources I interviewed was that the high level of fan unrest in Kansas City would probably lead Chiefs owner Clark Hunt to make the personally difficult decision to replace general manager Scott Pioli, and not just head coach Romeo Crennel. Hunt and Pioli remain close, so there's a chance Pioli returns, especially if there's a head coach hire that Pioli can sell to Hunt as the potential difference maker. Iowa head coach Kirk Ferentz is a name long linked to Pioli dating from their days together in Cleveland, and he always surfaces as a possible Pioli hire.
If Pioli isn't retained, he won't be out of work for long, because his personnel judgments are still widely respected throughout the league -- at least outside of Kansas City. It was thought the Chiefs might pursue Bill Polian as a GM candidate, but sources say there has not been contact between the two, even though Polian was thought to be willing to listen.
Other potential GM hires by the Chiefs are plentiful, but they include San Francisco's Gamble, Green Bay director of football operations John Dorsey and Indianapolis vice president of football operations Tom Telesco.
Dorsey is known for having a good eye for talent, and his college scouting background gives him a strong draft pedigree. He has worked under both Ted Thompson and Ron Wolf in Green Bay, two of the most respected personnel evaluators in recent NFL history, and sources say he's ready and willing to pursue all GM opportunities after turning down offers to interview last year.
On the coaching side, Arians, who might win the NFL Coach of the Year award for the job he did as the Colts' interim, is a name that has surfaced in Kansas City. His track record for quarterback coaching is respected, and his résumé includes successful stints with the likes of Peyton Manning in Indy, Ben Roethlisberger in Pittsburgh and this year's impressive rookie season by the Colts' Andrew Luck.
On the defensive side of the ball, Cincinnati defensive coordinator Mike Zimmer has again done a superb job with the talent he has on hand, and his work has as much to do with the Bengals returning to the playoffs as any other factor. He has been long considered a quality head coaching candidate, and his son, Adam Zimmer, is currently a defensive assistant on Crennel's staff.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/nfl/news/20121227/black-monday-nfl-coaches-2012/#ixzz2GIFg6Ne3

Kaylore
12-27-2012, 02:42 PM
Do you trust Clark Hunt to hire someone competent? It seems like he cares more about Soccer than football...

TheChamp24
12-27-2012, 02:48 PM
I like him better than Geno. One of my problems with Geno is he has amazing receivers and plays in a spread against crappy defenses. Petrino liked to mix things up which let Wilson take snaps under center. I like that he has faced adversity with the coaching fallout and played elite competion. He reminds me of Christian Ponder.

Ponder? Christian freakin Ponder? That is a terrible comparison because Ponder flat out sucks and had no business being a 1st rounder to be honest.

Wilson, I don't get it, why is he so much better than say Landry Jones?

Kaylore
12-27-2012, 02:50 PM
Ponder? Christian freakin Ponder? That is a terrible comparison because Ponder flat out sucks and had no business being a 1st rounder to be honest.

Wilson, I don't get it, why is he so much better than say Landry Jones?

Ponder as a prospect coming out. Ponder was a very good college QB. However as first rounders go, I agree. But as I have said, this is a poor class.

FearLanier
12-27-2012, 03:00 PM
Do you trust Clark Hunt to hire someone competent? It seems like he cares more about Soccer than football...

Yes. He hired the best GM prospect 4 years ago and the fans, as well as NFL analysts, agreed he was a very good hire.

Just because it didn't work out doesn't mean Clark doesn't care. I think cares greatly about the franchise. It is his family's shining achievement and his fathers legacy. It will be interesting to see who Clark hires.

If Clark didn't care, Pioli would be back next season.

TheChamp24
12-27-2012, 07:53 PM
Ponder as a prospect coming out. Ponder was a very good college QB. However as first rounders go, I agree. But as I have said, this is a poor class.

Ponder wasn't very good coming out from FSU, heck a lot of QB's recently have exploded in the draft who are crappy prospects. Ponder and Gabbert are two of them.

I guess its the luxury of not having to pay a crap load now for rookies.

Bob's your Information Minister
12-27-2012, 09:11 PM
I guess I should post the game, eh...

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/LZCPd5u6f3c?rel=0" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Geno's game against the Sooners is why he's absolutely got to be the Chiefs' pick. The 8th rated pass defense. And he puts his team in a position to win it.

Un-freaking-believable.

Watch the pass at the 2:50 mark. The 3:30 mark. The 6:05 mark. The 7:20 mark. The 7:30 mark. Sick. Ridiculous throws. Guys don't make that **** but once in their college careers and Geno is doing this **** every single game, multiple times every game. The guy can absolutely throw the ball.

And then, the pocket presence at the 5:10 mark. The 6:40 mark. The 8:10 mark.

Total ****ing package.

Tombstone RJ
12-27-2012, 09:17 PM
DOOOOOOOOOOOOOONNNNT CAAAAAAAAAAARRRRRRRRRRRREEE!

zms325i
12-27-2012, 11:20 PM
Derek Carr. Put it down.

Rolandftw
12-27-2012, 11:25 PM
Both Stedman Bailey and Tavon Austin pick up a lot of yards after the catch

Austin picked up 909 of his 1266 receiving yards after the catch (71.8% of his total receiving yards)

Bailey picked up 553 of his 1501 receiving yards after the catch (36.8% of his total receiving yards)

These two players account for 69.1% of Geno Smith's passing yards.

Geno is not likely to have a similar situation in the NFL where his top two receivers collectively pick up more then 50% of their yardage after the catch

Durango
12-27-2012, 11:29 PM
I guess I should post the game, eh...

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/LZCPd5u6f3c?rel=0" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Geno's game against the Sooners is why he's absolutely got to be the Chiefs' pick. The 8th rated pass defense. And he puts his team in a position to win it.

Un-freaking-believable.

Watch the pass at the 2:50 mark. The 3:30 mark. The 6:05 mark. The 7:20 mark. The 7:30 mark. Sick. Ridiculous throws. Guys don't make that **** but once in their college careers and Geno is doing this **** every single game, multiple times every game. The guy can absolutely throw the ball.

And then, the pocket presence at the 5:10 mark. The 6:40 mark. The 8:10 mark.

Total ****ing package.

Sounds like you're trying to sell yourself on the idea in the hope that someone here will agree and validate. Sorry.

SoCalBronco
12-27-2012, 11:33 PM
Bob is trying to psychologically replace LJ.

FearLanier
12-28-2012, 12:52 AM
This is a good thing. Keep pumping Geno up Bob! It will be all the better when we take Wilson or Glennon and you don't have your kiss of death attached to their nuts.

SoCalBronco
12-29-2012, 12:47 AM
This is a good thing. Keep pumping Geno up Bob! It will be all the better when we take Wilson or Glennon and you don't have your kiss of death attached to their nuts.

It must be a truly awful QB year when Glennon is even discussed as a first rounder. I'm an ACC guy, he's an alright player, but is probably no better than the 5th best QB in the ACC and the conference is weak. Being 5th best in the conference means you aren't a first rounder in any real draft. Glennon is like a 3rd round talent and will take some real time to become a pro QB.

This whole draft is riddled with mid round talents. Wilson is the only one with good tools and deserving of a first round grade adn thats just in the middle of the round. No one else deserves half a look in the first round. Barkley and Jones are both mid-to-late 2nds. Geno will be a fine replacement for Steve Breaston in the slot. Glennon is a 3rd round pick. A guy that would be a nice prospect to develop would be Renfree but he got hurt in his bowl game and just had surgery to his pec. EJ Manuel will be working at McDonalds making tasty Bacon, Egg and Cheese McGriddles. Aaron Murray has put up some nice stats but I dont think he has elite tools and is still a junior and hasnt played great against good defenses. Bray doesnt have elite tools, either. This class is hot garbage.

KipCorrington25
12-29-2012, 11:23 AM
KC with the first pick is like N. Korea with a nuclear bomb they will cock it up with disastrous results. Hilarious!

Agamemnon
12-29-2012, 11:38 AM
Geno Smith could end up being great in the NFL, but I really don't expect it.

DAN_BRONCO_FAN
12-29-2012, 12:15 PM
why are some of you trying to convince chief fans those QBs aint worth a high draft pick. i say let em draft whoever they want. they are desperate for a QB .hey chiefs save your draft picks i hear the jets are going to trade let some QBs go at a bargain basement price ,but just in case some other team tries to steal that awesome QB the jets have, you should offer them your first round pick

24champ
12-29-2012, 01:05 PM
It must be a truly awful QB year when Glennon is even discussed as a first rounder. I'm an ACC guy, he's an alright player, but is probably no better than the 5th best QB in the ACC and the conference is weak. Being 5th best in the conference means you aren't a first rounder in any real draft. Glennon is like a 3rd round talent and will take some real time to become a pro QB.

This whole draft is riddled with mid round talents. Wilson is the only one with good tools and deserving of a first round grade adn thats just in the middle of the round. No one else deserves half a look in the first round. Barkley and Jones are both mid-to-late 2nds. Geno will be a fine replacement for Steve Breaston in the slot. Glennon is a 3rd round pick. A guy that would be a nice prospect to develop would be Renfree but he got hurt in his bowl game and just had surgery to his pec. EJ Manuel will be working at McDonalds making tasty Bacon, Egg and Cheese McGriddles. Aaron Murray has put up some nice stats but I dont think he has elite tools and is still a junior and hasnt played great against good defenses. Bray doesnt have elite tools, either. This class is hot garbage.


Agree. This class of QBs are hot garbage. Chiefs should look into a stop gap QB.

Heyneck
12-29-2012, 01:29 PM
so yeah... Geno stinking up the joint right now. I so hope the Queefs takem him!!!

SoCalBronco
12-29-2012, 02:04 PM
Bob....Geno is smoking pole so far against a Big East defense. 9 for 16 for 62 yards or whatever. Trash.

oubronco
12-29-2012, 02:11 PM
They will piss on their fans and take a Defensive player who will be a Bust

Kaylore
12-29-2012, 02:21 PM
Bob....Geno is smoking pole so far against a Big East defense. 9 for 16 for 62 yards or whatever. Trash.

He's been terrible, particularly on third down. Dude stares down his receivers every play. And remember supposedly he studied Syracuse "all summer" to try and figure them out. Tavon Austin is a beast, though.

SoCalBronco
12-29-2012, 02:23 PM
He's been terrible, particularly on third down. Dude stares down his receivers every play. And remember supposedly he studied Syracuse "all summer" to try and figure them out. Tavon Austin is a beast, though.

But...but...it's snowing.

/Bob

SoCalBronco
12-29-2012, 03:09 PM
Bob maybe you should change his nickname to Chocolate Fraud.

Like I said stick with Wilson.....not slot receivers.

24champ
12-29-2012, 03:09 PM
Geno freaking sucks under pressure. Two safeties?

Orange Habit
12-29-2012, 03:29 PM
With all this talk on the Chiefs' looming first overall pick it might be nice to add some history that I researched on being the worst team during an NFL season.

There have been five teams that haven't been the worst since the merger, but have been the worst before the merger. Those five teams are the Packers, Bears, Redskins, Giants, and (!!!) the Cardinals.

There are three other teams that have never been the worst but haven't existed for the whole time since the merger: the Seahawks, Jaguars, and Ravens.

Setting those teams aside, there are only two teams since the merger that have never "earned" the first overall pick by being the worst team in the NFL.

Those two teams are the Broncos and Chiefs.

If business is taken care of on Sunday, only one team will have that honor.

Bob's your Information Minister
12-29-2012, 04:04 PM
I can't recall the taste of food... nor the sound of water... nor the touch of grass. I'm... naked in the dark, with nothing, no veil... between me... and the wheel of fire! I can see him... with my waking eyes!

Drunken.Broncoholic
12-29-2012, 04:16 PM
This season has shut up that clown KCStud. That bozo was wrong on every level. Must be too embarrassing for him to come around now.

Bob's your Information Minister
12-29-2012, 04:21 PM
Anyway, one bad game in terrible conditions changing nothing. He's still the same great prospect he's always been.

SoCalBronco
12-29-2012, 04:26 PM
LOL.....you're just trolling at this point. He'll make a good replacement for Breaston.

Bob's your Information Minister
12-29-2012, 04:29 PM
You really accuse ME of trolling when you're labeling a competent pocket passer as a friggin slot receiver? The dude isn't even a scrambler. He has fewer rushing yards than Andrew Luck.

Heyneck
12-29-2012, 04:39 PM
Anyway, one bad game in terrible conditions changing nothing. He's still the same great prospect he's always been.

Please pick him FIRST OVERALL!!!

DENVERDUI55
12-29-2012, 05:13 PM
This is a good thing. Keep pumping Geno up Bob! It will be all the better when we take Wilson or Glennon and you don't have your kiss of death attached to their nuts.

Geno played himself out of first overall pick which sucks for Bronco fans.

Bob's your Information Minister
12-29-2012, 05:28 PM
Geno played himself out of first overall pick which sucks for Bronco fans.

No one has ever played themselves out of a 1st overall pick via one game.

Especially not a game of that type.

Geno needs to be #1 overall based on sheer arm talent alone.

Drunken.Broncoholic
12-29-2012, 05:38 PM
No one has ever played themselves out of a 1st overall pick via one game.

Especially not a game of that type.

Geno needs to be #1 overall based on sheer arm talent alone.

Face it. It's a horrible year for QBs. Geno is not top pick talent.

Bob's your Information Minister
12-29-2012, 05:40 PM
He's as good of a prospect as Cam Newton ever was, and since he's a better passer, probably better.

Bacchus
12-29-2012, 05:43 PM
No one has ever played themselves out of a 1st overall pick via one game.

Especially not a game of that type.

Geno needs to be #1 overall based on sheer arm talent alone.

Like Ryan Leaf and Jeff George that kinda arm strength and talent?

Damn I need to stay out of this thread, just worthless.

Bob's your Information Minister
12-29-2012, 05:47 PM
Like Ryan Leaf and Jeff George that kinda arm strength and talent?

Damn I need to stay out of this thread, just worthless.

Geno has 0 character concerns and is known as a hard worker and level headed. Very mature, intelligent individual.

When you combine that with his pure arm talent and great athleticism he is just a fine specimen.

Compare Geno as a prospect to someone like Joe Flacco and it's not even close. Geno is easily a top 10 QB and the best in this class.

FearLanier
12-29-2012, 05:48 PM
Tyler Wilson is the only QB worth a top 5 pick right now. He does everything Geno does, but is tougher, is a better leader and plays better against good defenses.

I think Wilson will really rise when he plays on a level playing field next month. His football IQ is said to be amazing so we'll see.

Still like Geno and thnk he'll be good, but Wilson has always been my top QB prospect.

Drunken.Broncoholic
12-29-2012, 05:50 PM
I would even put Glennon in front of Geno.

Bob's your Information Minister
12-29-2012, 05:52 PM
He doesn't do everything Geno does. He's not as accurate. He's not as mobile. He doesn't have his production, nor does he have his wins.

Tyler Wilson would be the #1 QB if Geno wasn't. Tyler Wilson is the kind of QB you see go in the 1st every stinkin' year. You gonna tell me Wilson is any worse of a prospect than Matt Ryan was coming out? No ****ing way.

Tyler Wilson WISHES he had Geno's downfield accuracy. That's what is setting him apart right now. That and the 95 TDs and 27 wins, of course.

Bob's your Information Minister
12-29-2012, 05:53 PM
I would even put Glennon in front of Geno.

Based on ****ing what? LOL

No one has given me one good reason why any of these QBs are better than Geno.

He's the total ****ing package. If he played in a pro style offense everyone would be worshiping his golden right arm.

Fact is, he already did as a sophomore.

FearLanier
12-29-2012, 05:57 PM
He doesn't do everything Geno does. He's not as accurate. He's not as mobile. He doesn't have his production, nor does he have his wins.

Tyler Wilson would be the #1 QB if Geno wasn't. Tyler Wilson is the kind of QB you see go in the 1st every stinkin' year. You gonna tell me Wilson is any worse of a prospect than Matt Ryan was coming out? No ****ing way.

Tyler Wilson WISHES he had Geno's downfield accuracy. That's what is setting him apart right now. That and the 95 TDs and 27 wins, of course.

Wilson has leadership unlike Geno and that showed today.

By the way, Wilson lost his 3 best WR's to the NFL but still had over 60% completion percentage.

Bacchus
12-29-2012, 05:58 PM
I like Wilson over Geno. Where is Wilson slotted to go?

Bob's your Information Minister
12-29-2012, 06:00 PM
Both will go in the top 5.

Bob's your Information Minister
12-29-2012, 06:01 PM
Wilson has leadership unlike Geno and that showed today.

By the way, Wilson lost his 3 best WR's to the NFL but still had over 60% completion percentage.

OK, whatever. Counts for jack on that dog**** team. Intangible quality.

Geno still ****s on him in every category.

Drunken.Broncoholic
12-29-2012, 06:06 PM
You need to worry about piolis future before your pick. Cause if he stays he'll take Glennon. Bank on it.

Bacchus
12-29-2012, 06:10 PM
Both will go in the top 5.

oh, I did not think Wilson was that highly rated.

Durango
12-29-2012, 06:15 PM
He's as good of a prospect as Cam Newton ever was, and since he's a better passer, probably better.

I'd laugh, but you're actually serious. Newton has incomparable athletic skills, but he couldn't read a defense if it were demonstrated with finger puppets along the sideline.

Smith isn't in Newton's class athletically, but he may be better at reading defenses. If you waste the #1 pick on this guy, you had better hope and pray that's the case.

FearLanier
12-29-2012, 06:19 PM
OK, whatever. Counts for jack on that dog**** team. Intangible quality.

Geno still ****s on him in every category.

The only things Geno does better than Wilson are release the ball quicker and put a better touch on the ball.

Wilson can read defenses better, make progressions and still have good accuracy.

Tombstone RJ
12-29-2012, 06:22 PM
I really hope kc drafts Geno over Wilson.

Old Dude
12-29-2012, 06:27 PM
One nice thing about being 12-3 is not having to stress over firings and hirings on Black Monday or a draft that's still 4 months away.

colorado jones
12-29-2012, 06:39 PM
Boob is going to finally lose his virginity...to Geno Smith.

Prepare thy anus.

Bacchus
12-29-2012, 06:48 PM
Geno Smith isn't the best player in the draft and might not even be among the top 10. But the Chiefs aren't going anywhere without a quarterback, so there will be immense pressure to address that need with their first-round selection.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1450949-2013-nfl-mock-draft-first-round-with-team-needs/page/2

Bob's your Information Minister
12-29-2012, 07:15 PM
The only things Geno does better than Wilson are release the ball quicker and put a better touch on the ball.

Wilson can read defenses better, make progressions and still have good accuracy.

So one of these areas is coachable, one is not.

Hmmm.

Also, 40-6 TD-INT? Reads defenses just fine.

Bob's your Information Minister
12-29-2012, 07:16 PM
You need to worry about piolis future before your pick. Cause if he stays he'll take Glennon. Bank on it.

He's out Monday. I've known for 2 months.

SoCalBronco
12-29-2012, 07:30 PM
What about Albert Breers report Bob?

Bacchus
12-29-2012, 07:35 PM
Without Dwayne Bowe, the Chiefs were unable to gain a single first down against a poor Raiders defense. Is there anyone left that thinks Brady Quinn is a NFL caliber quarterback? It looks like the Chiefs will have a new GM and coach for this draft and the Chiefs need to take a quarterback. Is Geno Smith worthy of the first pick in the draft? No, he isn't. However, the Chiefs can not afford to be cute and try to grab a quarterback later. He is not Andrew Luck, but he is better than Ryan Tannehill or Christian Ponder. It's a bit of a reach, but the Chiefs have to pull the trigger on Smith.

http://www.drafttek.com/2013-nfl-mock-draft-round1.asp

Br0nc0Buster
12-29-2012, 07:47 PM
So one of these areas is coachable, one is not.

Hmmm.

Also, 40-6 TD-INT? Reads defenses just fine.

I have no idea why Geno Smith has been elevated to this god status among Chief fans

This game in particular showed how faulty judging him by his stats are
He threw for like 200 yards and 2 TDs and no picks
on the stat sheet it looked like he played well

But he didnt
The stats do no reflect how he was unable to move the ball when needed

Colt Brennan once threw for 58 TDs in a season

The idea that Geno is a system qb was not put to rest today
He looked every bit like a system qb when the system breaks down

FearLanier
12-29-2012, 08:03 PM
I would like to point out that most of the media in KC wants Tyler Wilson, not Geno Smith.

Bacchus
12-29-2012, 08:25 PM
I would like to point out that most of the media in KC wants Tyler Wilson, not Geno Smith.

It doesn't seem to me Wilson is a top ten pick. I'm not saying he isn't better that Geno but drafting him at #1 would seem to be a huge gamble as Chief's fan would revolt.

Tombstone RJ
12-29-2012, 08:30 PM
It doesn't seem to me Wilson is a top ten pick. I'm not saying he isn't better that Geno but drafting him at #1 would seem to be a huge gamble as Chief's fan would revolt.

the combine will be the final say for the draft. If Wilson has a sick combine then it could catapolt him to the #1 QB status. I'm thinking that it's gonna be Geno that has a great combine and this will secure his #1 QB status.

DENVERDUI55
12-29-2012, 08:35 PM
So one of these areas is coachable, one is not.

Hmmm.

Also, 40-6 TD-INT? Reads defenses just fine.
Big difference in college vs pros. Tim Tebow read defenses fine for college because you don't really have to read them. What was his TD in INT ratio?

DAN_BRONCO_FAN
12-29-2012, 09:21 PM
i got 2 nagging questions
1. why are chief fans on a Bronco forum all the time 365 or 366 days a year?
2. why are the 2 chief fans trying to talk up the QB selections on a bronco forum ?

MillerMayhem58
12-29-2012, 09:41 PM
Tyler Wilson looks like a matt cassel clone. He drops back and has a panic attack if his #1 option is covered and because he has a little mobility he's able to scramble enough to dump it off to a RB.
I hope kc drafts Wilson because in every highlight he likes to roll right when his #1 option is covered. Thats right into the VON MILLER zone.

tesnyde
12-29-2012, 10:20 PM
One nice thing about being 12-3 is not having to stress over firings and hirings on Black Monday or a draft that's still 4 months away.

Unless your Marty Schottenheimer and 2007 Chargers with 14-2 record.

FearLanier
12-30-2012, 12:18 AM
the combine will be the final say for the draft. If Wilson has a sick combine then it could catapolt him to the #1 QB status. I'm thinking that it's gonna be Geno that has a great combine and this will secure his #1 QB status.

Next month will be huge. Wilson and Glennon have already accepted Senior Bowl invitations and Geno is expected to be there too.

Wilson has already been said to have an "amazing" football IQ. I like Wilson and right now I think he's got a considerable lead over Geno as the best QB talent.

FearLanier
12-30-2012, 12:25 AM
So one of these areas is coachable, one is not.

Hmmm.

Also, 40-6 TD-INT? Reads defenses just fine.

Colt Brennan threw 58 TD's in a season and like 125 in his 3 years. How did he turn out?

A simple TD-INT stat doesn't tell all. That is one of Geno's biggest concerns.

Rother8
12-30-2012, 02:12 AM
Colt Brennan threw 58 TD's in a season and like 125 in his 3 years. How did he turn out?

A simple TD-INT stat doesn't tell all. That is one of Geno's biggest concerns.

Colt Brennan faps to tape of big 12 defenses.

Goobzilla
12-30-2012, 07:02 PM
Denver by 30, nothing to see here...except for Lerch throwing his first NFL passes as PFM will be rocking the sock hat by the 4th.

Nailed it! :strong: