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View Full Version : The player I am most worried about....


baja
12-16-2012, 04:55 PM
Is Peyton Manning. Nobody is talking about it but he is missing his long and some mid range passes as of the last few games and It happened again today. He has not been his super sharp self for a while now.

He under threw two long balls that I remember today and missed a couple of others. Playing a 16 game season + playoffs is a lot of stress to put on the regenerating nerve. Sure hope we rest him in parts of the last two games.

If I had to chose I would rather lose HFA and have a 100% (rested) Manning for the playoffs.

With the way we are playing on both sides of the ball we can beat anyone anywhere with Manning at 100%

SonOfLe-loLang
12-16-2012, 05:01 PM
Holy **** people really need to find stuff to complain about

Doggcow
12-16-2012, 05:02 PM
Maybe Baltimore was doing what they always do and blasting receivers and throwing off timing of routes?

baja
12-16-2012, 05:03 PM
Holy **** people really need to find stuff to complain about

You seem like a smart surprised you don't know the difference between "worried" and "complain"

lolcopter
12-16-2012, 05:03 PM
Matt Prater.

errand
12-16-2012, 05:06 PM
Holy **** people really need to find stuff to complain about

Well it is the Mane, ya know....

Deep throws are generally less successful as shorter and intermediate throws...but while some members want to hand wring over Manning missing DThomas deep, I'll point out that he hit Dreesen with a perfect pass where the window was about as big as a mail slot....between 2-3 defenders.

Manning will be fine....this team is playing at a high level now, in basically all phases of the game, running, passing, special teams and run defense, pass defense, etc...

baja
12-16-2012, 05:07 PM
Maybe Baltimore was doing what they always do and blasting receivers and throwing off timing of routes?

This has been happening for a few weeks now. It is not drastic but but he is missing opportunities that he made look easy mid season.

He missed a year and had to completely rebuild nerves in his throwing arm. The idea of fatigue is not far fetched. He may play like superman at times but he is human and he has made huge demands on his system.

bpc
12-16-2012, 05:10 PM
There were about 10 passes that could have went either way. Yes, we need to collect those plays but it comes with time. Couple bad routes, couple great defensive plays and 4-6 balls that were about a yd too much

baja
12-16-2012, 05:11 PM
Ha ha ha. This place is amazing.

To not have some concern for Manning's regenerating nerve with all the rigors of a 16 + game season is simply denial. I hope we can rest him the rest of the way. Play a half next week and a few series against KC.

lolcopter
12-16-2012, 05:13 PM
Wtf are we supposed to do about it brah

DBroncos4life
12-16-2012, 05:15 PM
I don't think baja is off with thinking Manning hasn't looked sharp of late. It's hard to talk about it with how well the team is playing D and running the ball though.

Bacchus
12-16-2012, 05:16 PM
http://lisamorguess.files.wordpress.com/2011/05/istockphoto_11748739-the-sky-is-falling-newspaper-headline1.jpg

fontaine
12-16-2012, 05:18 PM
Manning threw a 35 yard strike right into the hands of Decker in stride in the 3rd quarter.

I'm not worried.

razorwire77
12-16-2012, 05:20 PM
Pretty sure he hit Decker on a 50 yard strike for a touchdown. Pretty sure there was another nice throw where the defender made a helluva play to break another long TD. Pretty sure he threaded the needle to Dreessen with a throw that the only other humans on the planet would make would be Rogers, Brady and Brees. Decker and Thomas also had drops on potential big gainers. There were two bad throws I can remember. The first was a throw behind Thomas on a short drag or a shallow cross (don't remember.) The second was an overthrow to the end-zone. I think we're fine.

CEH
12-16-2012, 05:21 PM
Manning threw a 35 yard strike right into the hands of Decker in stride in the 3rd quarter.

I'm not worried.

Was just about to post the same thing . That pass is as good as it gets in the NFL. Throwing the WR open is heard all the time but the great ones do it

DBroncos4life
12-16-2012, 05:21 PM
I honestly think Thomas could use some rest. He hasn't looked like he is at full speed since getting dinged up against the Pats.

gyldenlove
12-16-2012, 05:21 PM
I am not particularly worried. When the weather gets cold it gets tougher to throw the ball, the ball gets a bit harder and less grippy and your fingers lose a bit of tactile sensory response which means it is trickier to throw the ball. Manning overthrew an early DT touchdown pass down the field, just put about a yard too much on it, he seemed to be a bit ahead of his throws and had a few that were in front of his guy - nothing to suggest any problem.

Currently I am not worried about anyone, Moreno is playing like a beast, Thomas and Decker are taking turns dominating, the offensive line is doing a good enough job considering how few plays they get help blocking, the defense is really coming alive with solid contributions from all 3 levels.

Drek
12-16-2012, 05:22 PM
This has been happening for a few weeks now. It is not drastic but but he is missing opportunities that he made look easy mid season.

He missed a year and had to completely rebuild nerves in his throwing arm. The idea of fatigue is not far fetched. He may play like superman at times but he is human and he has made huge demands on his system.

They're also passes he missed regularly the first few games of the season, so what you're talking about are weeks 4 to 10 when Manning was hitting >70% or better of his passes with a QB rating >100 week after week. As a result you're saying that you worry about games with a >60% completion rate and a >95 QB rating.

What you're basically doing is worrying that Albert Pujols going 8/24 with three doubles means he'll never hit a homerun again. Players have hot and cold streaks.

Any given Sunday this team can win a game any way it needs to. Manning is as good a bet as any to win a shoot out if we find ourselves in one. Our D can carry us to a 13-10 win if that is what we find ourselves needing. Now suddenly it looks like our running game can pick us up with a 100+ yard, >5.0 YPC outing if the other two could use it. This is what balance looks like, when a QB having the game Manning just put up looks worrying.

WolfpackGuy
12-16-2012, 05:24 PM
More an issue with timing than anything physical.

That play to Dreessen was not to be believed.

Just an awesome throw.

Hamrob
12-16-2012, 05:33 PM
I'm not worried about Thomas. If you were watching the Ravens defense, you would have seen that they were keeping the safety to DT's side all game....which is why Manning was going to Decker all game.

Take my #1....you have to beat my #2! Good luck NFL!!!

KipCorrington25
12-16-2012, 05:35 PM
Prater is the one that might cost us a game...

baja
12-16-2012, 05:40 PM
Wtf are we supposed to do about it brah

Us - Nothing

Coaches - see the subtle signs and make resting him a priority even if Manning himself does not agree.

DENVERDUI55
12-16-2012, 05:41 PM
My hell guys will complain or be concerned with anything. My only concern with Manning is the amount the line is allowing him to be hit. If Manning is the weak link we are winning the SB. Prater is who I am worried about when it comes to a 40 yard fg to win the game with Denver down 1 pt.

baja
12-16-2012, 05:42 PM
http://lisamorguess.files.wordpress.com/2011/05/istockphoto_11748739-the-sky-is-falling-newspaper-headline1.jpg

If Mock were alive he would be wearing out the word "Dim Wit" around here.

Do you know the difference between panic and precaution?

Mogulseeker
12-16-2012, 05:44 PM
Bah. Von Miller didn't get a sack today. We should cut him. Bah.

Bacchus
12-16-2012, 05:44 PM
If Mock were alive he would be wearing out the word "Dim Wit" around here.

Do you know the difference between panic and precaution?

Precaution? You R posting on a message board what kind of precautions are we going to take?

I'm not worried, Manning will do what he needs to do to win.

baja
12-16-2012, 05:47 PM
Manning threw a 35 yard strike right into the hands of Decker in stride in the 3rd quarter.

I'm not worried.

I am not saying he doesn't look sharp most of the time. There is something not quite right with some of his passes and I find that a little disconcerting and I have a concern his arm/ nerve way be becoming fatigued. If you want to point to one pass and say all is well that is your prerogative. I contend that is not how it works. I would say nerve fatigue fades in and out in the early stages.

baja
12-16-2012, 05:48 PM
Precaution? You R posting on a message board what kind of precautions are we going to take?

I'm not worried, Manning will do what he needs to do to win.

What are you going to do about anything you observe about the Broncos. Is this really your answer?

The Joker
12-16-2012, 05:50 PM
I don't see what's wrong with raising concerns even after a win, the offense has been taking a while to get going in games this year and that could come back to bite us in the ass.

That said, I'm not worried about Manning at all. Get Kuper back and things will look an awful lot better, he's getting pressure up the middle almost every down with Ramirez in there.

Bacchus
12-16-2012, 05:51 PM
What are you going to do about anything you observe about the Broncos. Is this really your answer?

Baja, I am blindly going to cheer my team through think and thin and always think they will win every game.

I'll let you and the coaches worry about the small stuff.

BroncoFox
12-16-2012, 05:55 PM
Well, he looked like a normal QB today. Even great QBs have a few off days. He still looked great, with one deep pass right in Thomas's hands that was just well defended, a couple miscommunications, and a couple off balls.

I personally don't think it's an issue with nerves or any physical damage. If it were something along those lines, I think we'd see him wincing or at least somehow reacting to the pain he'd be feeling. There was nothing like that. And if it were nerve damage, I think we'd have seen it happen a lot more.

I think he just had some off throws. We'll be fine imo. =)

baja
12-16-2012, 05:55 PM
Baja, I am blindly going to cheer my team through think and thin and always think they will win every game.

I'll let you and the coaches worry about the small stuff.

Good for you.

Why waste your time on a discussion board?

BTW Having Manning turn into a noodle arm in the playoffs because of not seeing the signs and giving him rest the last two games of the season is not exactly 'small stuff'

bronco militia
12-16-2012, 05:59 PM
I'm worried about kuper....thank god handy manny can run block, because he's almost worthless in pass protection

baja
12-16-2012, 06:00 PM
Well, he looked like a normal QB today. Even great QBs have a few off days. He still looked great, with one deep pass right in Thomas's hands that was just well defended, a couple miscommunications, and a couple off balls.

I personally don't think it's an issue with nerves or any physical damage. If it were something along those lines, I think we'd see him wincing or at least somehow reacting to the pain he'd be feeling. There was nothing like that. And if it were nerve damage, I think we'd have seen it happen a lot more.

I think he just had some off throws. We'll be fine imo. =)

Thanks Fox. I was wondering where you were now I see you were off to medical school.

Brewer
12-16-2012, 06:01 PM
Bah. Von Miller didn't get a sack today. We should cut him. Bah.

Bah. Ha. Bah.... Baja- ha ha ha ha!!!!! Can't stop laughing!!!! Hilarious!

baja
12-16-2012, 06:02 PM
I'm worried about kuper....thank god handy manny can run block, because he's almost worthless in pass protection

We got some big gains to his side was great to see. Do you know what's up with Kuper? I would think if he were close he would have been out there today.

The Joker
12-16-2012, 06:03 PM
Thanks Fox. I was wondering where you were now I see you were off to medical school.

Post is a tad ironic don't you think?

BroncoLifer
12-16-2012, 06:05 PM
Bah. Von Miller didn't get a sack today. We should cut him. Bah.

Seriously. Doesn't this guy know that there are a lot of free agents who'd like to have his job?

baja
12-16-2012, 06:05 PM
Bah. Ha. Bah.... Baja- ha ha ha ha!!!!! Can't stop laughing!!!! Hilarious!

Must have put something in the water up there. The intellect of this board has taken a serious dump.

Ya I want to cut Manning.

Punisher
12-16-2012, 06:06 PM
Is Peyton Manning. Nobody is talking about it but he is missing his long and some mid range passes as of the last few games and It happened again today. He has not been his super sharp self for a while now.

He under threw two long balls that I remember today and missed a couple of others. Playing a 16 game season + playoffs is a lot of stress to put on the regenerating nerve. Sure hope we rest him in parts of the last two games.

If I had to chose I would rather lose HFA and have a 100% (rested) Manning for the playoffs.

With the way we are playing on both sides of the ball we can beat anyone anywhere with Manning at 100%

http://s.ecrater.com/stores/13003/4c8372c16041d_13003n.jpg

CEH
12-16-2012, 06:10 PM
"But this is the second consecutive game that Manning spent the fourth quarter with little other priority than to run out the clock. Against Oakland last week, the Broncos had 15 rush attempts and only three passes in the fourth. This week, they had 19 rushes and just one pass attempt in the fourth.

Thatís 34 rushing plays and only four passes in their past two fourth quarters. "

What is there to be worried about?

baja
12-16-2012, 06:10 PM
Post is a tad ironic don't you think?

Noticing some passes flutter on a guy that had 4 neck surgeries that has played 14 full NFL games leading to a concern of fatigue is the same as saying, "He's OK because I didn't see him wince"

I see what you mean. :(

Bacchus
12-16-2012, 06:10 PM
Good for you.

Why waste your time on a discussion board?

BTW Having Manning turn into a noodle arm in the playoffs because of not seeing the signs and giving him rest the last two games of the season is not exactly 'small stuff'

Don't see it. The Broncos will never lose another game.

CEH
12-16-2012, 06:15 PM
Noticing some passes flutter on a guy that had 4 neck surgeries that has played 14 full NFL games leading to a concern of fatigue is the same as saying, "He's OK because I didn't see him wince"

I see what you mean. :(

Did that 51 yard TD flutter. His passes have been fluttering here and there all year

No way does Manning sit unless he's hurt. I'd take HFA anyday over resting Manning . HFA is the quickest way to the big game

lonestar
12-16-2012, 06:16 PM
Ha ha ha. This place is amazing.

To not have some concern for Manning's regenerating nerve with all the rigors of a 16 + game season is simply denial. I hope we can rest him the rest of the way. Play a half next week and a few series against KC.

You have an inside source saying the nerve is an issue? If there was John and John would not have him on the field.

If you are gauging over today's game IMO it was playing a tough defense.

If it was an issue with the nerve he would not be completing much of anything.

Unless you KNOW something quit trying to speculate and stir something up for no reason.

DENVERDUI55
12-16-2012, 06:21 PM
Manning's passes have been fluttering for a few years. Manning is the least of our concerns.

Marshall Dumervil
12-16-2012, 06:22 PM
Must have put something in the water up there. The intellect of this board has taken a serious dump.

Ya I want to cut Manning.

The intellect has taken a dump? You're the one that created this thread. Hilarious!

So tell us what Fox should do? Bench him? Send him to the specialists?

ScottXray
12-16-2012, 06:22 PM
I am not saying he doesn't look sharp most of the time. There is something not quite right with some of his passes and I find that a little disconcerting and I have a concern his arm/ nerve way be becoming fatigued. If you want to point to one pass and say all is well that is your prerogative. I contend that is not how it works. I would say nerve fatigue fades in and out in the early stages.

As usual most of the throws that were of concern came earlier in the game.

It seems to take 2-3 series or so before Mannings arm "warms up".
I also am a little concerned that he was throwing into double coverage at times. But many of the deep throws to DT were to loosen the D up a bit
I think. When he had to , he was hitting his targets.

bowtown
12-16-2012, 06:27 PM
**** it. Let's get OZ on there and see what he can do. This Manning guy isn't getting it done.

baja
12-16-2012, 06:28 PM
"But this is the second consecutive game that Manning spent the fourth quarter with little other priority than to run out the clock. Against Oakland last week, the Broncos had 15 rush attempts and only three passes in the fourth. This week, they had 19 rushes and just one pass attempt in the fourth.

Thatís 34 rushing plays and only four passes in their past two fourth quarters. "

What is there to be worried about?

Maybe this concern has something to do with the run heavy game plan.

43 runs

28 passes

maher_tyler
12-16-2012, 06:30 PM
When i came into this thread i was thinking either Prater or Holliday...

bowtown
12-16-2012, 06:31 PM
Maybe this concern has something to do with the run heavy game plan.

43 runs

28 passes

That's what happens when we have a 28 point lead in the 4th and a running game they can't stop.

baja
12-16-2012, 06:31 PM
The intellect has taken a dump? You're the one that created this thread. Hilarious!

So tell us what Fox should do? Bench him? Send him to the specialists?

Orange Mane Commandments

1. Thou shalt never offer for discussion anything that questions Peyton Manning's Superman status. The words arm or nerve fatigue shall never be whispered.

bowtown
12-16-2012, 06:32 PM
When i came into this thread i was thinking either Prater or Holliday...

I'd say Unrein. Guy hasn't seen the endzone in two weeks.

lolcopter
12-16-2012, 06:35 PM
http://assets.sbnation.com/assets/1883505/failco.gif

@ this thread

baja
12-16-2012, 06:37 PM
That's what happens when we have a 28 point lead in the 4th and a running game they can't stop.

The game was run heavy all game long. Let me quick to say I do not really think it was due to any concern about Manning's stamina.

Look my position is simple really. I would rather rest Manning for parts of the last two games and risk losing the HFA than have him fatigued in the playoffs. I think that is a reasonable precaution. If you guys don't that is fine but lets not insinuate I am complaining or suggesting Manning is somehow failing us because that is clearly stupid of you to do so.

Drunken.Broncoholic
12-16-2012, 06:38 PM
If that nerve was going to take a **** it would've already.

Enjoy the dam win. Something we have never done in that stadium!

baja
12-16-2012, 06:39 PM
http://assets.sbnation.com/assets/1883505/failco.gif

@ this thread

LOL OK where have all the smart guys gone?

SoCalBronco
12-16-2012, 06:46 PM
He's doing fine, Baja. Not every game is going to be 350 yards and 5 TDs. That's just not how reality operates. Especially on the road against a 9 win team that has repeatedly owned us at their place. He's the single biggest reason we've won 9 in a row. He's playing very well and will continue to play very well.

If SF wins tonight, I believe DEN will be in the SB. We can beat HOU in HOU, but if we can get the 2 seed, we will beat anyone else in DEN, including NE.

baja
12-16-2012, 06:52 PM
He's doing fine, Baja. Not every game is going to be 350 yards and 5 TDs. That's just not how reality operates. Especially on the road against a 9 win team that has repeatedly owned us at their place. He's the single biggest reason we've won 9 in a row. He's playing very well and will continue to play very well.

If SF wins tonight, I believe DEN will be in the SB. We can beat HOU in HOU, but if we can get the 2 seed, we will beat anyone else in DEN, including NE.

I know all that So Cal. It has been a long season and some balls have fluttered of late I am only pointing out Peyton has been through a hell of a recovery process and musing would it be wise to take the precaution to rest him these last two games to a degree so that he may be as rested as possible for the playoffs. After all if Manning's arm is fatigued we can kiss the SB run good bye. I think is is a legitimate concern.

Bmore Manning
12-16-2012, 07:21 PM
Baja- this thread absolutely boggles my mind. Peyton made done incredible throws today, I would know, I was AT the game! He missed some throws and wasn't in sync on several occasions with the WRs. He had some fluttered passes, but Peyton has always had some fluttered passes throughout his career.

Next, playing in Baltimore is a very difficult place to play. That place was extremely loud! Not to mention the Ravens were riding an impressive win streak and are a completely different team at home!

Peyton had favorable matchups up front, as the Ravens schemed for the pass and shaded Reed over DT. Everyone says the run game is Denver's Achilles heal, so obviously they want to go into the playoffs on a high note really working the run game.

baja
12-16-2012, 07:39 PM
Baja- this thread absolutely boggles my mind. Peyton made done incredible throws today, I would know, I was AT the game! He missed some throws and wasn't in sync on several occasions with the WRs. He had some fluttered passes, but Peyton has always had some fluttered passes throughout his career.

Next, playing in Baltimore is a very difficult place to play. That place was extremely loud! Not to mention the Ravens were riding an impressive win streak and are a completely different team at home!

Peyton had favorable matchups up front, as the Ravens schemed for the pass and shaded Reed over DT. Everyone says the run game is Denver's Achilles heal, so obviously they want to go into the playoffs on a high note really working the run game.

I appreciate you weighing in with a reasonable take. I hope you are right. I am a guy that would err on the side of caution when it concerns our most important player. Without Manning or even a damaged Manning we are going no where in the playoffs. I know you have watched him all his career so I feel relieved reading your post. Let's hope my concerns are ill founded. The guy has asked an awful lot of his body I still would hope we can rest him.

SonOfLe-loLang
12-16-2012, 07:51 PM
I don't understand where your medical opinion is coming from. I didn't see any weak throws (or any more than normal). In fact, he hit that beautiful seam rout today that 10 weeks ago fluttered on him. I think you're seeing something that's not there

errand
12-16-2012, 08:05 PM
Ha ha ha. This place is amazing.



I agree...

why, we even have a clown or two on here that said they were through with the teaam and even called the franchise classless if they even thought about signing Manning and trading Tebow.....

Bmore Manning
12-16-2012, 08:10 PM
I appreciate you weighing in with a reasonable take. I hope you are right. I am a guy that would err on the side of caution when it concerns our most important player. Without Manning or even a damaged Manning we are going no where in the playoffs. I know you have watched him all his career so I feel relieved reading your post. Let's hope my concerns are ill founded. The guy has asked an awful lot of his body I still would hope we can rest him.

I think it's a very reasonable topic to discuss, Peyton is coming off of 4 neck surgeries and couldn't even throw not so long ago. At times I wonder myself how close is he to Peyton I used to watch? I can honestly say that he's almost the same physically, not quiet 100% Peyton of old, but close! Maybe he can get completely back to that level..maybe not. I know that Cold Weather probably doesn't help his cause.

But what I can say that excites me, is that this is the most complete and best all around team Peyton has ever been a part of. Not to mention Peyton is playing even smarter and in tune than before, if that's even possible. It's almost as if as he has lost some of his physical attributes, whether that's post surgery or a product of old age, his mind is just on a whole other level of real deal. He senses pressure around him, his awareness is as if he put in a full week of practice with the opposing team or has a headset on with their play calling. I know this is all stuff we have all seen and come to know with the guy, but I can't put words on how in sync he is to EVERYTHING! The game is in slow motion and everyone is just playing in his game. He knows the offensive weaknesses and works them each week, and this week the emphasis was on solidifying the run game.

The mans in the zone, Jordan 4th quarter in 92 doesn't have **** on Peyton Manning. Sit back and enjoy the ride!

baja
12-16-2012, 08:11 PM
I don't understand where your medical opinion is coming from. I didn't see any weak throws (or any more than normal). In fact, he hit that beautiful seam rout today that 10 weeks ago fluttered on him. I think you're seeing something that's not there

Not my medical opinion. There was endless coverage about the nature of the recovery of a regenerating nerve. They said his arm would become tired and weak with over use. They said it would get better and better over time. They said the grind of the long season could have an effect toward the end of the season. They said he would need to rest his arm when the nerve demanded it. They in this case are the doctors. Just saying let's not risk over working that arm if it can be avoided. The best way to do that is rest Manning some in the final two weeks. Course if SF goes on to with the game tonight that would give manning a full 14 days rest and that is obviously the best case scenario. But if NE comes back and wins this game I say rest Manning for parts of the last two games cause NE is not losing either of their last two games.

errand
12-16-2012, 08:15 PM
Good for you.

Why waste your time on a discussion board?

BTW Having Manning turn into a noodle arm in the playoffs because of not seeing the signs and giving him rest the last two games of the season is not exactly 'small stuff'

Umm...we ran the ball 44 times and threw it only 28....in fact we had a 10 minute 15 play drive and threw it what? once, maybe twice? I think Manning's arm will be fine....but feel free to keep hand wringing.

BroncoFox
12-16-2012, 08:17 PM
Thanks Fox. I was wondering where you were now I see you were off to medical school.

Well, his nerves are regenerating - not degenerating. Which would be what you are suggesting is happening. It doesn't seem to me his play is getting worse. You are saying what - that to prove his nerves are getting worse, he has to throw for 300 yards, 3 touchdowns every game?

His "wobbly" passes have been a topic of discussion every single week.

I think the case that he is getting older has more to do with passes and arm strength than anything to do with his neck. It's been said by doctors that his neck should be stronger than previously.

I see on this board, and hear on the radio, many nay-sayers. I think that people are just so used to something going wrong, that they are just expecting it. It's hard to accept we are just doing great. Well.. we are. If can score over 30 IN Baltimore with a degenerating Manning.. I guess I can live with that.

errand
12-16-2012, 08:18 PM
Bah. Ha. Bah.... Baja- ha ha ha ha!!!!! Can't stop laughing!!!! Hilarious!

<iframe width="640" height="360" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/rSZCLCJBpbw?feature=player_detailpage" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

errand
12-16-2012, 08:20 PM
Must have put something in the water up there. The intellect of this board has taken a serious dump.

Ya I want to cut Manning.

No, you don't want to cut him...you just called the organization classless for signing him and getting rid of the other QB

errand
12-16-2012, 08:23 PM
Noticing some passes flutter on a guy that had 4 neck surgeries that has played 14 full NFL games leading to a concern of fatigue is the same as saying, "He's OK because I didn't see him wince"

I see what you mean. :(

Manning has never been known for tight spirals...many of his passes flutter ala Kurt Warner. Never matters because his arm strength was good enough and his accuracy is off the charts.

baja
12-16-2012, 08:24 PM
Umm...we ran the ball 44 times and threw it only 28....in fact we had a 10 minute 15 play drive and threw it what? once, maybe twice? I think Manning's arm will be fine....but feel free to keep hand wringing.

You're right let's not give it another thought. Hell let's have him run a few QB draws, they'll never expect that. And so what if his arm gets fatigued we'll just stick in Osweiler and keep on trucking, right errand. He's Peyton F'n Manning he doesn't need any rest for that nerve damaged arm just rub some dirt on it.

maven
12-16-2012, 08:25 PM
Well, his nerves are regenerating - not degenerating. Which would be what you are suggesting is happening. It doesn't seem to me his play is getting worse. You are saying what - that to prove his nerves are getting worse, he has to throw for 300 yards, 3 touchdowns every game?

His "wobbly" passes have been a topic of discussion every single week.

I think the case that he is getting older has more to do with passes and arm strength than anything to do with his neck. It's been said by doctors that his neck should be stronger than previously.

I see on this board, and hear on the radio, many nay-sayers. I think that people are just so used to something going wrong, that they are just expecting it. It's hard to accept we are just doing great. Well.. we are. If can score over 30 IN Baltimore with a degenerating Manning.. I guess I can live with that.

He's done that his entire career.

He's already mentioned that being older there's a lot more fatigue and takes more time to recover. The Thursday night game in Oakland is a perfect example, yet he helped Denver deliver a win.

Best way to solve the fatigue/tired/injuries is to root for the Niners tonight, secure the bye beating Cleveland/KC.

baja
12-16-2012, 08:25 PM
No, you don't want to cut him...you just called the organization classless for signing him and getting rid of the other QB

It must suck to be you.

rmsanger
12-16-2012, 08:26 PM
meh

BroncoFox
12-16-2012, 08:36 PM
I look at it this way. We assumed our fast starts have allowed our defense to function at the level they have this year. Apparently not. Even when our offense is not having their best game, our defense has been dominating. That is just awesome. Which means Peyton does not HAVE to play a perfect game for us to win. We still scored over 30.

We've won 9 in a row. We are scoring over 30 almost every game. I'm really just fine with everything the Broncos are doing right now. The last piece we needed was a running threat. Moreno finally stepping up was the one thing we needed. Peyton does not HAVE to do it all.

errand
12-16-2012, 08:36 PM
It must suck to be you.

Nope..it sucks to be you, because your words have come back to haunt you.

I didn't call the franchise classless...you did. I don't agree with everything they do, but I would never say I was through watching them and call them classless like you did.

And what does it tell you when nobody in this 4-5 page thread agrees with you?

Enjoy the win and the #2 seed if we win out......if you can.

errand
12-16-2012, 08:38 PM
I look at it this way. We assumed our fast starts have allowed our defense to function at the level they have this year. Apparently not. Even when our offense is not having their best game, our defense has been dominating. That is just awesome. Which means Peyton does not HAVE to play a perfect game for us to win. We still scored over 30.

We've won 9 in a row. We are scoring over 30 almost every game. I'm really just fine with everything the Broncos are doing right now. The last piece we needed was a running threat. Moreno finally stepping up was the one thing we needed. Peyton does not HAVE to do it all.


Exactly....there are about 28 other teams out there that wished they had Baja's "concerns"....

baja
12-16-2012, 08:40 PM
Manning is 36 years old.

Manning has had 4 neck surgeries.

Manning's body is in an ongoing process of regenerating a nerve in his neck that allows him arm strength that calls for periodic rest.

Manning has shown some early signs of arm fatigue IMO.

Manning is our most valuable player.

We all want Manning at a 100% for the playoffs.

I think it is logical and wise to rest him for as much of the Cleveland game as possible and for all of the game with KC. unless we need the win for the bye which would give him 14 days rest which is the goal.

I think we can beat (if necessary ) KC without Manning.

Seems simple enough to me and with that there really isn't anymore for me to say.

maven
12-16-2012, 08:59 PM
Manning is 36 years old.

Manning has had 4 neck surgeries.

Manning's body is in an ongoing process of regenerating a nerve in his neck that allows him arm strength that calls for periodic rest.

Manning has shown some early signs of arm fatigue IMO.

Manning is our most valuable player.

We all want Manning at a 100% for the playoffs.

I think it is logical and wise to rest him for as much of the Cleveland game as possible and for all of the game with KC. unless we need the win for the bye which would give him 14 days rest which is the goal.

I think we can beat (if necessary ) KC without Manning.

Seems simple enough to me and with that there really isn't anymore for me to say.

"Is Peyton Manning. Nobody is talking about it but he is missing his long and some mid range passes as of the last few games and It happened again today. He has not been his super sharp self for a while now.

He under threw two long balls that I remember today and missed a couple of others. Playing a 16 game season + playoffs is a lot of stress to put on the regenerating nerve. Sure hope we rest him in parts of the last two games.

If I had to chose I would rather lose HFA and have a 100% (rested) Manning for the playoffs.

With the way we are playing on both sides of the ball we can beat anyone anywhere with Manning at 100%"

Make up your damn mind.

baja
12-16-2012, 09:04 PM
"Is Peyton Manning. Nobody is talking about it but he is missing his long and some mid range passes as of the last few games and It happened again today. He has not been his super sharp self for a while now.

He under threw two long balls that I remember today and missed a couple of others. Playing a 16 game season + playoffs is a lot of stress to put on the regenerating nerve. Sure hope we rest him in parts of the last two games.

If I had to chose I would rather lose HFA and have a 100% (rested) Manning for the playoffs.

With the way we are playing on both sides of the ball we can beat anyone anywhere with Manning at 100%"

Make up your damn mind.

Nothing has changed. Having Manning at a 100% for the playoffs s job one. If you have to choose between the bye or manning at a 100% I'll take Manning at a 100% for the win. You can have both you know. Things look a little different with SF up big. Manning will get the rest he might well need with the bye. I just want Manning 100% for the playoffs is that so hard to understand?

errand
12-16-2012, 09:04 PM
Manning is 36 years old.

Manning has had 4 neck surgeries.

Manning's body is in an ongoing process of regenerating a nerve in his neck that allows him arm strength that calls for periodic rest.

Manning has shown some early signs of arm fatigue IMO.

Manning is our most valuable player.

We all want Manning at a 100% for the playoffs.

I think it is logical and wise to rest him for as much of the Cleveland game as possible and for all of the game with KC. unless we need the win for the bye which would give him 14 days rest which is the goal.

I think we can beat (if necessary ) KC without Manning.

Seems simple enough to me and with that there really isn't anymore for me to say.

If we end up with the #2 seed after defeating KC in final week, he will have two weeks before his next game...he will have Dec. 31st thru at least Jan. 11th to "rest" as needed.

BroncoFox
12-16-2012, 09:44 PM
25-42, 270 yards, 3 TDs
22-37, 285 yards, 2 TDs
27-38, 242 yards, 3 TDs
26-31, 310 yards, 1 TD
17-28, 204 yards, 1 TD

Ok.. last 5 games. This game was his "weakest" game. Seems to me you are focusing just this game against the Ravens, a solid team at home. If I was a fan for any team and my QB had those stats week to week, I'd be very ok with it.

Not worried.. stop being a negative nancy.

Kaylore
12-16-2012, 10:22 PM
Baja, your worry about Manning and suggesting that we need to rest him the next two games is really dumb. Do you think We're going to rest him when we need to win out to get a first round bye? They Bye will be his rest.

And he doesn't need it anyway. There is nothing wrong with Manning. He's overthrowing his receivers. It will take a few seasons to get things right where they need to be.

Arkie
12-16-2012, 10:25 PM
Nothing has changed. Having Manning at a 100% for the playoffs s job one. If you have to choose between the bye or manning at a 100% I'll take Manning at a 100% for the win. You can have both you know. Things look a little different with SF up big. Manning will get the rest he might well need with the bye. I just want Manning 100% for the playoffs is that so hard to understand?

A first round bye means home field advantage in the divisional game and a better chance to host the AFC championship. The Broncos are paying Manning $96 million to win these important games.

baja
12-16-2012, 10:38 PM
Baja, your worry about Manning and suggesting that we need to rest him the next two games is really dumb. Do you think We're going to rest him when we need to win out to get a first round bye? They Bye will be his rest.

And he doesn't need it anyway. There is nothing wrong with Manning. He's overthrowing his receivers. It will take a few seasons to get things right where they need to be.

This was before SF beat NE. which I did not expect to happen. Of course I will be happy with the 14 day rest Manning would get if we win out. It's what I wanted, rest for Manning's still recovering arm after a lot of games.

baja
12-16-2012, 10:40 PM
A first round bye means home field advantage in the divisional game and a better chance to host the AFC championship. The Broncos are paying Manning $96 million to win these important games.

See post 86

Bacchus
12-16-2012, 10:40 PM
This was before SF beat NE. which I did not expect to happen. Of course I will be happy with the 14 day rest Manning would get if we win out. It's what I wanted, rest for Manning's still recovering arm after a lot of games.

Hopefully, Denver will make short work of CLeveland and KC and Denver can yank some banged up starters like Kuper, Manning and others who need it.

baja
12-16-2012, 10:41 PM
Baja, your worry about Manning and suggesting that we need to rest him the next two games is really dumb. Do you think We're going to rest him when we need to win out to get a first round bye? They Bye will be his rest.

And he doesn't need it anyway. There is nothing wrong with Manning. He's overthrowing his receivers. It will take a few seasons to get things right where they need to be.

Well I feel better knowing that. Tell me did he call you or did you call him?

SonOfLe-loLang
12-16-2012, 10:59 PM
If he rests "some of the games," do you honestly think, say, 20 throws is really gonna make the difference?

baja
12-16-2012, 11:17 PM
If he rests "some of the games," do you honestly think, say, 20 throws is really gonna make the difference?

I said all of the KC game unless a win would give us the 2 seed which would give Manning's arm the rest I would like to see going into the playoffs. I was talking about a scenario where we are chasing the Pats hoping they would lose one of their last two ( I was expecting the Pats to beat SF )

To put it simply I did not feel it was worth it to give Manning every snap in the last two games in hopes the Pats would drop a game. Now that they have that changes things, now we do need to win out so Manning can rest his arm for 14 days - play Manning / Win out / get 14 days rest for Peyton mainly and of course every other Bronco too = I'm happy! ;D

XXXII&III
12-16-2012, 11:31 PM
I don't want him off the field - if they could have him hand off 50 times per game so he could rest his arm I'd be for that.... but I want the offense to continue building momentum and cohesion and I don't see that happening when he's off the field.

DENVERDUI55
12-16-2012, 11:51 PM
If he rests "some of the games," do you honestly think, say, 20 throws is really gonna make the difference?

Good point. His arm is fine. He throws how many balls everyday?

baja
12-16-2012, 11:53 PM
I don't want him off the field - if they could have him hand off 50 times per game so he could rest his arm I'd be for that.... but I want the offense to continue building momentum and cohesion and I don't see that happening when he's off the field.

Well that sure is a valid point. I was just prioritizing real rest for Manning #1. And joy oh joy we can have it all, rest for Manning and the team without anyone needing to miss time. Just win out.

spdirty
12-17-2012, 12:28 AM
This has to be the dumbest idea I've ever heard. If Fox rests Manning, and we in turn lose the bye because of it, Fox will deservedly get fired. And Manning will want out of here yesterday.

Some people just have to search far and wide to find something to bitch about, or worry about with this team. It's like an itch that they need to scratch. It's pathetic.

ZONA
12-17-2012, 12:58 AM
I'd be worried if he was missing throws all the time. No QB is going to be perfect in every game. Even Brady has bad throws. All QB miss some throws, it happens. I don't see it happening enough to Manning for it to be a concern.

Whenever you feel concerned about how Manning looks baja, just imagine Tebow out there and you'll feel much better right away.

lonestar
12-17-2012, 02:41 AM
Seems to me he hit Decker right on the nose with his TD pass last night and has hit others exactly right only to have them either drop them or been defensed by an outstanding player.


Much ado about nothing.

lonestar
12-17-2012, 02:46 AM
Let me add. I'll bet there is a battery of doctors and therapists that are monitoring him for the broncos. Considering their investment in him it is the prudent thing to do.

I know I read something not to long ago about him continuing his therapy and his progress was getting better all the time.

Bmore Manning
12-17-2012, 03:36 AM
Baja- the intent and question is something worth talking about.. The problem is the approach and execution came off a little too strong, and it seems everyone is licking at the chops to question you. I'll admit that when I first responded I was baffled, not because there's nothing to talk about related to the topic, but you probably should have conveyed it in the form of a question.

But... I personally do not want to see Manning rested until he himself wants to be taken out. As a long time Manning fan, there were years they were undefeated and dominate in the regular season.. Then they started resting all of their starters way too soon in week 16, typically halftime or not long after into the third quarter. Over two games that adds up to almost a missed game of playing time and then they had the bye week. Needless to say the Colts came out flat and were one and done on many occasions.

I think you missed reading my second posts you should probably take a look at it.. It's my opinion on him physically. I would let him play and the team continue to gel, because they are still not on the same page. Maybe in the 4th quarter he decides it's time and that's reasonable. I think it would be ok to pull some of the starters on defense sooner so back-ups can get playing time,1. To see what they have in the player for the draft, free agency, etc.. 2. So that in the event of an injury in the playoffs, the players not shell shocked.

You don't want your offense sluggish and rusty in the post season, I have seen this happen for years..

*Post #65 is the one that I think you missed for your reference..

fontaine
12-17-2012, 04:12 AM
I am not saying he doesn't look sharp most of the time. There is something not quite right with some of his passes and I find that a little disconcerting and I have a concern his arm/ nerve way be becoming fatigued. If you want to point to one pass and say all is well that is your prerogative. I contend that is not how it works. I would say nerve fatigue fades in and out in the early stages.

I don't know about nerve fatigue, but most QBs over 34 are tired/banged up this time of year.

Is Manning 100% healthy? No, but neither are most QBs.

As long as he can step it up on the field and deliver passes when it counts, then that's all that matters. He's not absolutely perfect but I see no reason to worry.

There were a couple of other passes where he was throwing the ball pretty quick in tight spirals on a rope.

Drek
12-17-2012, 04:57 AM
Well that sure is a valid point. I was just prioritizing real rest for Manning #1. And joy oh joy we can have it all, rest for Manning and the team without anyone needing to miss time. Just win out.

Baja, you're prioritizing rest based on faulty evidence. You're looking at a couple of games where he completed only 60% of his passes and had a QB rating >90 as proof that he's wearing down.

No player completes 70% of their passes with a 100+ QB rating every single Sunday. That is a phenomenal hot streak. Right now you're seeing Manning coming off such a streak. That doesn't mean he's worn out, just that guys have peaks and valleys in their production.

Also, lets take our scouting of Manning to the second level here. You say to rest him because he missed some deep passes. But how was the passing game distributed today? Thomas got shutout because Baltimore sold out hard to do just that. He had a safety cheating over the top all day. Baltimore was smart to do this because Thomas is by far Manning's #1 option. Yesterday Baltimore forced Manning to look at other options and he hit Decker for a big day. That was a great growing experience for this offense.

Manning should continue to take all the QB snaps so that he can round out his comfort level with all the receivers available, otherwise the real problem with our passing game - that it's only elite when Thomas is making big plays - will continue to exist. We've got the talent with Decker, Moreno, Stokley, and the three TEs to make this passing game into something better than that, but it only happens if Manning gets enough live reps with all these other guys to build that all important chemistry.

Bacchus
12-17-2012, 12:16 PM
This has to be the dumbest idea I've ever heard. If Fox rests Manning, and we in turn lose the bye because of it, Fox will deservedly get fired. And Manning will want out of here yesterday.

Some people just have to search far and wide to find something to b**** about, or worry about with this team. It's like an itch that they need to scratch. It's pathetic.

The thread was made before the Broncos had the bye. Baja already stated that Denver should play out the regular season and get then rest the 7 days of the bye week.

Dedhed
12-17-2012, 12:21 PM
Matt Prater.

I'm worried about Prater too. Every FG attempt in the last 4 games or so has had a strange and violent wobble during it's flight that freaks me out. It doesn't look like he has the same control that he's had the last couple of years.

No1BroncoFan
12-17-2012, 07:39 PM
If (big freakin' if) Jax can somehow manage a spoiler game, Hou takes care of business vs. Min, and we don't get complacent vs. Cle. then Baja can have the best of both worlds. Being locked into the 2 seed we could let the second team scrubs beat the piss out of the JV Chiefs in a meaningless game and if they somehow manage to lose, so what. Two weeks off for Manning and a home playoff game.

baja
12-17-2012, 08:02 PM
If (big freakin' if) Jax can somehow manage a spoiler game, Hou takes care of business vs. Min, and we don't get complacent vs. Cle. then Baja can have the best of both worlds. Being locked into the 2 seed we could let the second team scrubs beat the piss out of the JV Chiefs in a meaningless game and if they somehow manage to lose, so what. Two weeks off for Manning and a home playoff game.

Actually I really don't think 2 weeks off is a good idea. If we take care of business and keep the #2 seed the week off is perfect. IMO.

We are in an absolutely perfect spot just win two games at home against teams that have won a total of 7 games.

SF beating NE made it real simple for us.

Arkie
12-17-2012, 08:16 PM
I'm worried about Patrick Hape. We're doomed because he will have a sneak attack! He's crazy like that!

hambone13
12-17-2012, 08:54 PM
I don't think baja is off with thinking Manning hasn't looked sharp of late. It's hard to talk about it with how well the team is playing D and running the ball though.

Agreed. We have to keep in perspective that these players have only played 15 games together. What I find exciting is that there seems to be improvement each week. I like that we're improving on the fly, that's motivating in that we need all the practice we can get to face NE.

baja
12-18-2012, 08:29 PM
2. Peyton Manning, Broncos (2)
There was more flutter and wobble on his passes in Baltimore than at any other time - but then his long dart to Eric Decker was perhaps his best ball of the season.


Read more: Tuesday Morning QB: Play at position mostly underwhelming in Week 15 - The Denver Post http://www.denverpost.com/broncos/ci_22215666/tuesday-morning-qb-play-at-position-mostly-underwhelming#ixzz2FSt2zFKr
Read The Denver Post's Terms of Use of its content: http://www.denverpost.com/termsofuse

ZONA
12-18-2012, 09:03 PM
If (big freakin' if) Jax can somehow manage a spoiler game, Hou takes care of business vs. Min, and we don't get complacent vs. Cle. then Baja can have the best of both worlds. Being locked into the 2 seed we could let the second team scrubs beat the piss out of the JV Chiefs in a meaningless game and if they somehow manage to lose, so what. Two weeks off for Manning and a home playoff game.

I think if we had #2 locked up, which I don't think we will because I don't think NE loses again, I bet we would play starters for a quarter to give them game reps, then some rest.