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View Full Version : Defense still needs work...........


Jetmeck
11-04-2012, 01:50 PM
Discuss...............

colorado jones
11-04-2012, 01:54 PM
.............................

Agreed.

bronco militia
11-04-2012, 02:02 PM
well duh....

as long as the offense can control the game, they are probably good enough

theAPAOps5
11-04-2012, 02:09 PM
yet still handled the Bengals..........

end of discussion :)

Ratboy
11-04-2012, 02:09 PM
You can always get better.

bombay
11-04-2012, 02:10 PM
The defense is fine. Tebow is gone, so the d can give up 20 points.

fontaine
11-04-2012, 02:15 PM
When offenses run a quick no huddle, it's feast of famine for our defense.

fontaine
11-04-2012, 02:17 PM
Bolden shouldn't be on the field. He looked lost on the few plays he was on.

Harvitz81
11-04-2012, 02:18 PM
Bengals scored 10 points on our turnovers. Not too concerned.

SonOfLe-loLang
11-04-2012, 02:18 PM
You can always get better.

exactly, its not gonna be a shut out every game. They had mistakes, they won, get over it

ScottXray
11-04-2012, 02:19 PM
The run game was the suck today. Our O line couldn't open any holes almost all day.

On the other hand NO sacks for Manning, and VonDoom pressured Dalton pretty well, got to him 4-5 times.
We have a Really good pass block line.

NFLBRONCO
11-04-2012, 02:23 PM
Discuss...............

Did we make trades NO
Did offseason start this week NO
Draft NO

The D won't get much better til next year. All we can hope is this group can play pretty good most of the time. The O has to carry us.


We won that's all that matters

theAPAOps5
11-04-2012, 02:28 PM
The run game was the suck today. Our O line couldn't open any holes almost all day.

On the other hand NO sacks for Manning, and VonDoom pressured Dalton pretty well, got to him 4-5 times.
We have a Really good pass block line.

Cincy has very good DL players. They are stout so that didn't surprise me. When they needed the runs late in the game they were there. Willis was getting big chunks to help the clock grind down.

It looks like Cincy tried to take a page from New England. Problem is cincy is not nearly as good as New England. The speed no huddle looks to work well against the Broncos so I expect we will see more.

SonOfLe-loLang
11-04-2012, 02:29 PM
Did we make trades NO
Did offseason start this week NO
Draft NO

The D won't get much better til next year. All we can hope is this group can play pretty good most of the time. The O has to carry us.


We won that's all that matters

You guys are talking like we have West Virginia's D. They weren't that bad today. One awful drive

CEH
11-04-2012, 02:30 PM
If the DB can catch some passes for INTs, this game is a blowout early
Not sure they can do that but they are inches away from making life alot easier for themselves

Kaylore
11-04-2012, 02:31 PM
I'm not worried. Holding an opponent to 20 points on the road after two turnovers is just fine.

bronco militia
11-04-2012, 02:33 PM
You guys are talking like we have West Virginia's D. They weren't that bad today. One awful drive

2.....the one after Holidays return and the 80 yarder after the redzone INT

theAPAOps5
11-04-2012, 02:34 PM
I'm not worried. Holding an opponent to 20 points on the road after two turnovers is just fine.

Well not to be all technical and stuff................. but 23 points.

Garcia Bronco
11-04-2012, 02:36 PM
This game is always a battle. Highest margin of victory against this club that I can remember. Defense did well.

Hamrob
11-04-2012, 02:37 PM
We won today....so, we're not that bad.

We're probably the 3rd or 4th best team in the AFC right now.

Can we improve on that...I'm not sure. That game in Baltimore will tell us a lot. If we can't go and beat the Ravens on their field...then we sure as hell can't got to NE or Houston and beat them.

Defense...needs to improve...but, so does the Offense...and Special Teams. Need to be more consistent overall!

DBroncos4life
11-04-2012, 02:39 PM
How many accounts did fwf say he had...four?

SonOfLe-loLang
11-04-2012, 02:39 PM
2.....the one after Holidays return and the 80 yarder after the redzone INT

fine, two. my point stands

Hamrob
11-04-2012, 02:40 PM
Well not to be all technical and stuff................. but 23 points.Sure...but those turnovers were killers.

One inside the opponents 20...taking at least 3 points off the board....and then other deep in our territory, giving the opponents at least 3 points. Mistakes like those, cost teams football games.

Luckily we overcame them!

NFLBRONCO
11-04-2012, 02:40 PM
You guys are talking like we have West Virginia's D. They weren't that bad today. One awful drive


It was more that OP says D needs more work well it does but, what do they expect without another offseason . Were we awful no but, are weak in spots. So to expect a D with flaws to vastly improve or never have bad drives shouldn't be shocking when it happens.

theAPAOps5
11-04-2012, 02:43 PM
Sure...but those turnovers were killers.

One inside the opponents 20...taking at least 3 points off the board....and then other deep in our territory, giving the opponents at least 3 points. Mistakes like those, cost teams football games.

Luckily we overcame them!

The one that was thrown in the endzone was the worst. That made the game closer than it was.

I blame the whole series that led to the 2nd INT on that worthless POS Lance Ball. He totally crapped himself and jumped on the ball instead of letting his return man, standing right next to him, field the ball.

NFLBRONCO
11-04-2012, 02:46 PM
We need better play on the road still. Its easier to swallow with a win. ST's gave up pretty big returns. O had drops turnovers running game was poor props to them for containing us most of the day.

BroncosSR
11-04-2012, 02:46 PM
The defense is fine. Tebow is gone, so the d can give up 20 points.

LOL. True story.

KevinJames
11-04-2012, 02:51 PM
I'm not worried. Holding an opponent to 20 points on the road after two turnovers is just fine.

pretty much

Rock Chalk
11-04-2012, 02:51 PM
You guys are talking like we have West Virginia's D. They weren't that bad today. One awful drive

Burn @ West Virginia.

Stupid hilljacks.

DENVERDUI55
11-04-2012, 02:53 PM
I'm not worried. Holding an opponent to 20 points on the road after two turnovers is just fine.

Yup we should win every single game that we only give up 20.

OrangeSe7en
11-04-2012, 02:56 PM
The defense did OK. The bigger problem was the running game.

shovelpass#30
11-04-2012, 03:02 PM
D is a lot better than I expected at the start of the season. Interior line playing solid (and creating more pass rush than I can remember). But the biggest revelation is at cornerback - Harris and Carter have been terrific.

Rock Chalk
11-04-2012, 03:02 PM
We won, so as far as Im concerned, everything went peachy.

LongDongJohnson
11-04-2012, 03:05 PM
Defense wasnt perfect. They were stout against the run for the most part. They had 5 sacks. Miller dominated. But we did give up some big pass plays. That play where trevathan left greshem to attack dalton was horrible. Gave up 50+ yards on a play that should have been stopped.

Action
11-04-2012, 03:10 PM
Biggest play of the day of 54 yards went to Dumervil's mistake of leaving his coverage chasing Dalton down behind the LOS.

The biggest "issue" I see with this defense/scheme is that we play so much man coverage as opposed to pure Zone coverage you see the top defenses in the league play (SF/Pitt/Chi). But this is something that takes time to put in, more than 1 off season.... exchanges of coverages need to be precise and we just aren't too great at that.

Action
11-04-2012, 03:22 PM
Defense wasnt perfect. They were stout against the run for the most part. They had 5 sacks. Miller dominated. But we did give up some big pass plays. That play where trevathan left greshem to attack dalton was horrible. Gave up 50+ yards on a play that should have been stopped.

That was Dumervil...

how the hell do you guys get players wrong every single week on some of the biggest plays of the game?

OrangeSe7en
11-04-2012, 03:32 PM
That was Dumervil...

how the hell do you guys get players wrong every single week on some of the biggest plays of the game?

You need to lower your expectations. I now know this.

RedskinBronco
11-04-2012, 03:48 PM
My one gripe was not getting off on a couple of 3rd down plays that they should have, including a couple 3rd and long.

HOWEVER, this is still an impressive win. Keep in mind that Cincy had a BYE week and was waiting at home for the Broncos. It's not easy to win under those circumstances no matter who you are or who you are playing.

I'll take this one. On to Carolina, not a good team, so let's destroy them...

OrangeSe7en
11-04-2012, 03:53 PM
My one gripe was not getting off on a couple of 3rd down plays that they should have, including a couple 3rd and long.

HOWEVER, this is still an impressive win. Keep in mind that Cincy had a BYE week and was waiting at home for the Broncos. It's not easy to win under those circumstances no matter who you are or who you are playing.

I'll take this one. On to Carolina, not a good team, so let's destroy them...

Carolina has been playing better lately. They outplayed the Bears at Soldier Field and just defeated Washington on the road. I know it's easy to look at their record and dismiss them as an easy win but that might not be the case.

RedskinBronco
11-04-2012, 03:56 PM
Carolina has been playing better lately. They outplayed the Bears at Soldier Field and just defeated Washington on the road. I know it's easy to look at their record and dismiss them as an easy win but that might not be the case.

I had both games on. Their defense is pretty respectable but Manning can rip them apart.

They are 2-6 because they self implode and make many mistakes. Fortunately for them, the redskins are an embarrassment on defense and someone mentioned, this was a typical Shanarat home game coming off a 2 game road trip.

Don't let a win over the redskins fool you. Also, I am positive Chicago overlooked the panthers and evidently they weren't happy about it and expect more and so they took it out on the Titans today...

fontaine
11-04-2012, 04:01 PM
I've been impressed with JDR, but why play Dumervil on every first down?

It's obvious to see it's wearing him down and when we have a stout run defender in Ayers then we should keep Dumervil on for 2nd/3rd downs.

bronco militia
11-04-2012, 04:04 PM
I've been impressed with JDR, but why play Dumervil on every first down?

It's obvious to see it's wearing him down and when we have a stout run defender in Ayers then we should keep Dumervil on for 2nd/3rd downs.

I thought Doom wore out their LT...he was a beast in the 4th quarter as the refs refused to call all the holding

Hamrob
11-04-2012, 04:06 PM
The one that was thrown in the endzone was the worst. That made the game closer than it was.

I blame the whole series that led to the 2nd INT on that worthless POS Lance Ball. He totally crapped himself and jumped on the ball instead of letting his return man, standing right next to him, field the ball.I think the real issue with that KO return...was that Holiday didn't run up and catch the ball. That's why Ball was like....WTF man...and fell on it.

fontaine
11-04-2012, 04:21 PM
I thought Doom wore out their LT...he was a beast in the 4th quarter as the refs refused to call all the holding

Sure, but we want Dumveril for the long haul and I just don't see the benefit of having him on 1st downs.

Ayers has been playing pretty well of late in his limited snaps.

baja
11-04-2012, 04:23 PM
Who would have thunk at the beginning of the year LB would be the weakest part of the D

Action
11-04-2012, 04:24 PM
Sure, but we want Dumveril for the long haul and I just don't see the benefit of having him on 1st downs.

Ayers has been playing pretty well of late in his limited snaps.

Because a Wolfe-Vickerson-Bannan-Ayers dline would create questionable pressure if the QB were to drop back and pass.

24champ
11-04-2012, 04:28 PM
Biggest play of the day of 54 yards went to Dumervil's mistake of leaving his coverage chasing Dalton down behind the LOS.

The biggest "issue" I see with this defense/scheme is that we play so much man coverage as opposed to pure Zone coverage you see the top defenses in the league play (SF/Pitt/Chi). But this is something that takes time to put in, more than 1 off season.... exchanges of coverages need to be precise and we just aren't too great at that.

There was a lot of coverage problems today, particularly with the linebackers. That and Champ had his worst game of the season (even with an interception that was a gift). JDR will have lots to work on with his players this week in practice and the film room.

BroncosSR
11-04-2012, 04:29 PM
The defense did OK. The bigger problem was the running game.

That and that McCoy tried continually to force it with McGahee. McGahee likes to dance through the tackles. And when we face a decent line like we did today, I'd like to see Hillman try and go to the outside. Maybe some design pitches. Maybe I'm wrong but McGahee was very ineffective inside the tackles today.

baja
11-04-2012, 04:35 PM
That and that McCoy tried continually to force it with McGahee. McGahee likes to dance through the tackles. And when we face a decent line like we did today, I'd like to see Hillman try and go to the outside. Maybe some design pitches. Maybe I'm wrong but McGahee was very ineffective inside the tackles today.

Until late it the game when it really mattered

OrangeSe7en
11-04-2012, 04:38 PM
That and that McCoy tried continually to force it with McGahee. McGahee likes to dance through the tackles. And when we face a decent line like we did today, I'd like to see Hillman try and go to the outside. Maybe some design pitches. Maybe I'm wrong but McGahee was very ineffective inside the tackles today.

Whats sad is that they struggled running the ball several times when Manning audibled to a run. But I tend to agree with you that they should have mixed it up more on 1st down.

fontaine
11-04-2012, 04:54 PM
Because a Wolfe-Vickerson-Bannan-Ayers dline would create questionable pressure if the QB were to drop back and pass.

I'll disagree, Ayers has really improved his pass rush this year.

OrangeSe7en
11-04-2012, 04:56 PM
I'll disagree, Ayers has really improved his pass rush this year.

It really doesnt present that feel by watching games.

Agamemnon
11-04-2012, 05:30 PM
This **** is getting old. The offense was worse than the defense today.

Agamemnon
11-04-2012, 05:32 PM
Sure, but we want Dumveril for the long haul and I just don't see the benefit of having him on 1st downs.

Ayers has been playing pretty well of late in his limited snaps.

In today's NFL teams often pas on 1st down.

theAPAOps5
11-04-2012, 05:35 PM
This **** is getting old. The offense was worse than the defense today.

Sick of what? Winning? Or of these threads?

peacepipe
11-04-2012, 05:39 PM
I'll disagree, Ayers has really improved his pass rush this year.

ayers improved,but not even close to taking over for doom. Ayers is 1st rd pick that at best is a rotational player/back up.

fwf
11-04-2012, 05:47 PM
Im a lot more concerned with our running game. Dalton is a pretty good Qb with a big arm. Add Green in the mix and their getting theirs. Mcgahee's lack of speed and Hillman's lack of experience/skills is what worries me. And does anyone really think Willis will hold up through January getting 25 touches a game? Lets see what Ball's got. He showed glimpses last year.

LongDongJohnson
11-04-2012, 05:49 PM
That was Dumervil...

how the hell do you guys get players wrong every single week on some of the biggest plays of the game?

1 I didnt rewind the play 5 times like you probably did.
2 when I see a guy in coverage I dont assume that its doom.

Big deal if I got one play wrong. Tv announcers do it like 10 times a game.

KevinJames
11-04-2012, 05:50 PM
Im a lot more concerned with our running game. Dalton is a pretty good Qb with a big arm. Add Green in the mix and their getting theirs. Mcgahee's lack of speed and Hillman's lack of experience/skills is what worries me. And does anyone really think Willis will hold up through January getting 25 touches a game? Lets see what Ball's got. He showed glimpses last year.

:spit:

fwf
11-04-2012, 05:54 PM
:spit:

It's Ball or 27! The deadline has passed so were stuck with the 4 backs we have. Thats on Elway. Do you have a better idea?

baja
11-04-2012, 06:16 PM
It's Ball or 27! The deadline has passed so were stuck with the 4 backs we have. Thats on Elway. Do you have a better idea?

Ya go jump in the cold lake you promised us you would and post the vid.

TonyR
11-04-2012, 06:21 PM
It really doesnt present that feel by watching games.

Ayers' pressure caused Champ's interception.

TonyR
11-04-2012, 06:23 PM
Ya go jump in the cold lake you promised us you would and post the vid.

You have to admit that his concern about McGahee being over worked has some merit. Those aren't young legs and he really needs to be spelled more often. If they don't like their other options they should've brought one in this past offseason.

KevinJames
11-04-2012, 06:23 PM
It's Ball or 27! The deadline has passed so were stuck with the 4 backs we have. Thats on Elway. Do you have a better idea?

The running game is fine....our backs are fine

Bengals front 7 just gave us a hard time, it had nothing to do with lack of ability from our RBs.

Giving Ball and Moreno carries over Hillman wouldn't help us they would only hurt us.

Hillman is a playmaker hes also the youngest player in the NFL, give him time he will see more carries. He obviously didn't get many carries due to how the game was going, Bengals kept swinging back and keeping us in passing situations.

and McGahee is great hes not wearing down keep feeding him and he will get tough yards when we need them.

I think later in the season once we clinch the AFC West and it starts getting real cold, you will see how dominate our running game can be. Around that time I would guess it be almost split carries w/ Willis and Ronnie.

Fox and McCoy said they are going to use the hot hand approach when they wanna establish the run game. So Hillman will have his days im sure.

baja
11-04-2012, 06:26 PM
You have to admit that his concern about McGahee being over worked has some merit. Those aren't young legs and he really needs to be spelled more often. If they don't like their other options they should've brought one in this past offseason.

What you say is true but he ran a game on us all, make a promise if it was false and now it time to pay up.

BTW I though the thread was funny but I expect him to post that vid ;D

OrangeSe7en
11-04-2012, 06:29 PM
Ayers' pressure caused Champ's interception.

And...? It's not like he didn't occasionally get pressure in the past. If you can't say something with substance, don't say anything at all.

Action
11-04-2012, 06:37 PM
1 I didnt rewind the play 5 times like you probably did.
2 when I see a guy in coverage I dont assume that its doom.

Big deal if I got one play wrong. Tv announcers do it like 10 times a game.

1. No I didn't need to rewind it considering they replayed that play in slow motion from behind the endzone so you can clearly see who it is.

2. You shouldn't assume it's anyone, all you have to do is look at the number.

TV announcers have different teams to study every week.

How long have you followed the Broncos? How long has Dumervil been on the Broncos? Do Dumervil or Trevathon wear a similar number? DO they look anything alike? In technique? In how they run?

There's really no excuse TBH, I see it all the time on OMane... a plce where people put so much weight into their opinion, don't even know what players are actually on the field. :spit:

Action
11-04-2012, 06:42 PM
I'll disagree, Ayers has really improved his pass rush this year.

It's still the same power bull rush... he has 0 sacks on the year and 4 tackles and no QB hits (I don't know why he didn't get credited with 1 today)

I do agree that it might be wise to sub Dumervil out on some downs to keep him fresh but that would be purely to keep him fresh, not because there is some good pass rushing talent behind him.

TonyR
11-04-2012, 06:45 PM
And...? It's not like he didn't occasionally get pressure in the past. If you can't say something with substance, don't say anything at all.

LOL "And...?" That's the best you can do?!?

You said, with respect to Ayers:
It really doesnt present that feel by watching games.

I pointed out a big play Ayers made that you might have seen had you watched the game and/or understood what you saw. And then I'm the one not saying something "with substance"?

You need to learn when to hold 'em, and when to fold 'em.

OrangeSe7en
11-04-2012, 06:52 PM
LOL "And...?" That's the best you can do?!?

You said, with respect to Ayers:


I pointed out a big play Ayers made that you might have seen had you watched the game and/or understood what you saw. And then I'm the one not saying something "with substance"?

You need to learn when to hold 'em, and when to fold 'em.

He said he's really improved his pass rush this year. Once again, you're failing to make a point.

ZONA
11-04-2012, 06:59 PM
B-


* We had 3 sure INT's and we only got 1 of them. Would have been nice to have gotten 1 more.

* Not Champs best game for the most part but nice recovery with the INT

* Pressure was good. We got some sacks.

* Decent game against the run. A little too much YAC though.

* 3rd down defense was pretty damn good. Always a huge key for this defense.

* A few too many big plays were given up. Tackling was good but not great.

I would have given us a B+ on defense performance because this was a road game but considering the offense we went against wasn't special. Decent but nothing great.

errand
11-04-2012, 07:02 PM
yet still handled the Bengals..........

end of discussion :)

This^

Bengals scored 10 points off turnovers by Manning.....and also cost us 7.....and gave up what 3 big plays? 37 yarder to AJ, and Gresham's 52 yarderand Sanu's 34 yarder....and had 5 sacks (3 by Miller)...oh and Woodyard had 14 tackles today too to pace the team.

swaiy
11-04-2012, 07:06 PM
1. No I didn't need to rewind it considering they replayed that play in slow motion from behind the endzone so you can clearly see who it is.

2. You shouldn't assume it's anyone, all you have to do is look at the number.

TV announcers have different teams to study every week.

How long have you followed the Broncos? How long has Dumervil been on the Broncos? Do Dumervil or Trevathon wear a similar number? DO they look anything alike? In technique? In how they run?

There's really no excuse TBH, I see it all the time on OMane... a plce where people put so much weight into their opinion, don't even know what players are actually on the field. :spit:

I heard Jeopardy music while reading this post.

Inquiring minds would like to know the answers to these questions.

errand
11-04-2012, 07:08 PM
Well not to be all technical and stuff................. but 23 points.

Defense was denied a double digit lead when Manning was picked in end zone...and was put in bad situation when he threw another from our end zone....

I wasn't worried at all because Manning is great enough to overcome most multiple INT games...and the D was pretty good except for 3 big plays totaling 123 of Dalton's 299 passing yards.

errand
11-04-2012, 07:12 PM
That was Dumervil...

how the hell do you guys get players wrong every single week on some of the biggest plays of the game?

LOL...I know right? I'll go with "what is alcohol? Alex"

Broncos_OTM
11-04-2012, 07:13 PM
You have to admit that his concern about McGahee being over worked has some merit. Those aren't young legs and he really needs to be spelled more often. If they don't like their other options they should've brought one in this past offseason.

It has merrit the poster althkugb has no credibility

Action
11-04-2012, 07:44 PM
B-


* We had 3 sure INT's and we only got 1 of them. Would have been nice to have gotten 1 more.

* Not Champs best game for the most part but nice recovery with the INT

* Pressure was good. We got some sacks.

* Decent game against the run. A little too much YAC though.

* 3rd down defense was pretty damn good. Always a huge key for this defense.

* A few too many big plays were given up. Tackling was good but not great.

I would have given us a B+ on defense performance because this was a road game but considering the offense we went against wasn't special. Decent but nothing great.

I agree with your grade and assessment outside of those "sure INTs"

The Tony Carter one was tough and that Chris Harris one would have been a spectacular catch for even a WR as it was thrown well behind Harris.

Bronco Rob
11-18-2012, 09:59 PM
???