PDA

View Full Version : DeMeco Ryans


TonyR
09-19-2012, 08:04 AM
I live in the Philadelphia market so I listen to Philly sports radio and of course hear about the Eagles all the time. They are very happy with the improvement DeMeco Ryans has provided them at the MLB position thus far this season. The Eagles got him from Houston for a 4th round pick this past offseason. Considering the Broncos need at the position, and the connection with Kubiak, do you think it's something the Broncos could/should have done? Along with not finding a better backup RB, giving Joe Mays that contract instead of upgrading the position is one of my biggest complaints with the offseason moves.

TheReverend
09-19-2012, 08:11 AM
Obviously, yes. Wouldve been a HUGE boon

fontaine
09-19-2012, 08:19 AM
This is cool, I was just thinking we need more hindsight threads.

TonyR
09-19-2012, 08:23 AM
I'm perplexed what Fox/Del Rio/Elway were thinking here. I suppose the Texans preferred to move Ryans out of the conference, but even so there were other players available.

TonyR
09-19-2012, 08:24 AM
This is cool, I was just thinking we need more hindsight threads.

^ Seriously? Is this not a football discussion forum? There are plenty of other great threads for you to read and post in.

Ray Finkle
09-19-2012, 08:25 AM
the guy was/is coming off two major injuries.....

Philly has had crap MLB's the last few years so of course he is an upgrade. However, it is not like the Eagles defenses has played amazing.

ColoradoDarin
09-19-2012, 08:33 AM
^ Seriously? Is this not a football discussion forum? There are plenty of other great threads for you to read and post in.

pretty sure there was a thread about it when the trade went down

TonyR
09-19-2012, 08:35 AM
the guy was/is coming off two major injuries.....

Philly has had crap MLB's the last few years so of course he is an upgrade. However, it is not like the Eagles defenses has played amazing.

Agree on the injury part. But worth a shot for a 4th round pick?

Eagles defense looks really good. They're currently ranked 4th in yards and 7th in points allowed.

TonyR
09-19-2012, 08:35 AM
pretty sure there was a thread about it when the trade went down

Thanks. Feel free to bump it.

55CrushEm
09-19-2012, 08:36 AM
Agree on the injury part. But worth a shot for a 4th round pick?

Eagles defense looks really good. They're currently ranked 4th in yards and 7th in points allowed.

One of their 2 games was also against the lowly Cleveland Browns.

Just too early to tell.

ColoradoDarin
09-19-2012, 08:37 AM
Thanks. Feel free to bump it.

Herp.

BroncoInferno
09-19-2012, 08:43 AM
The primary issue with our LBs is that none of them can cover. Ryans would have been of little help in that regard.

TheReverend
09-19-2012, 08:48 AM
I'm perplexed what Fox/Del Rio/Elway were thinking here. I suppose the Texans preferred to move Ryans out of the conference, but even so there were other players available.

You're looking at player and compensation without looking at the third factor: $

Just sucks that they cheaped out and still pay Joe Mays that kinda money :/

cmhargrove
09-19-2012, 08:57 AM
The primary issue with our LBs is that none of them can cover. Ryans would have been of little help in that regard.

It was the same knock on Curtis Lofton as well. Statistically, Mays performed well against the run last year, so it was worth a shot. We look even better against the run this year (although that will be tested this week). We still need an MLB with coverage skills. That is the weakness of Ryans, Lofton, and the other "good choices" available this year.

I still don't know that our worst issue on defense is the LB's. Once again, the run defense is pretty good right now. I think Safety, and the inability to cover passing lanes in the middle of the field may be our undoing. It seems that the most dangerous mismatches these days are against pass catching TE's (across the league). Part of that falls on the LB's, but the real "winning plays" seem to come at the expense of poor Safety play.

We need to fix both in the long term, but if we had "smart" safeties that could actually diagnose plays and react properly, I think our passing D would be pretty stellar right now.

TheReverend
09-19-2012, 09:07 AM
^ those are more often LB coverage areas than safety

Drunken.Broncoholic
09-19-2012, 09:09 AM
the guy was/is coming off two major injuries.....

Philly has had crap MLB's the last few years so of course he is an upgrade. However, it is not like the Eagles defenses has played amazing.

Wasn't Mays an eagle during those crap years?

TonyR
09-19-2012, 09:13 AM
You're looking at player and compensation without looking at the third factor: $

Just sucks that they cheaped out and still pay Joe Mays that kinda money :/

Yeah, I kind of ignored $ since they overpaid Mays anyway. But clearly Ryans is more of a financial commitment although the Eagles didn't have to pay the signing bonus. Here are the contract details:

Ryans:
3/30/2010: Signed a six-year, $48 million contract. The deal contains $21.75 million guaranteed, including a $7.5 million signing bonus. Another $600,000 is available through incentives based on Pro Bowl appearances in the first three years. 2012: $4.45 million (+ $1.45 million signing bonus + $100,000 workout bonus), 2013: $6.6 million (+ $100,000 workout bonus), 2014-2015: $6.8 million (+ $100,000 workout bonus), 2016: Free Agent
http://www.rotoworld.com/player/nfl/3657/demeco-ryans

Mays:
3/18/2012: Signed a three-year, $12 million contract. The deal contains $4.5 million guaranteed, including a $500,000 signing bonus, all of Mays' first-year salary, and $500,000 of his second-year salary. 2012: $3.5 million, 2013: $4 million, 2014: $3.5 million (+ $500,000 roster bonus), 2015: Free Agent
http://www.rotoworld.com/player/nfl/4943/joe-mays

Chris
09-19-2012, 09:25 AM
Much as I hate to say it I don't think the Browns are as "lowly" as we'd expect this season.

eddie mac
09-19-2012, 09:27 AM
When the **** are people going to realise that whether you agree with it or not the Broncos really rate Joe Mays. So much so they offered him enough money to get off a plane and fly home to sign on the dotted line.

Tombstone RJ
09-19-2012, 09:46 AM
Joe Mays is what he is. The Broncos know his strengths and weaknesses as to the Texans. Pretty sure Kubiak is going to do a lot of crossing patterns over the middle to exploit this weekness. The question is, how will the Broncos adjust? If I was JDR I'd move away from the 5-2 to a more traditional 4-3. If the Texans want to run up the middle then that is right up May's alley. If the Texans play action and throw outs to the WRs, it's on Porter and Bailey to cover. If Kubiak tries to exploit the quick slant, crossing routs over the middle, the safeties should be able to help, along with Doom. If they run outside, the LBers should flow.

broncocalijohn
09-19-2012, 09:49 AM
Thanks. Feel free to bump it.

SHould we bump every offseason free agent thread that involves middle linebackers?

DENVERDUI55
09-19-2012, 09:51 AM
One of their 2 games was also against the lowly Cleveland Browns.

Just too early to tell.

When your O has given it away 9 times in 2 games and you win your D is doing something right.

Rock Chalk
09-19-2012, 10:03 AM
the guy was/is coming off two major injuries.....

Philly has had crap MLB's the last few years so of course he is an upgrade. However, it is not like the Eagles defenses has played amazing.

??

The Eagles defense has kept them in two games where he Eagles offense has given up on average 4.5 turnovers per game and one of those games was against Baltimore, not exactly a pushover.

Their defense has been downright spectacular this season.

55CrushEm
09-19-2012, 10:05 AM
When your O has given it away 9 times in 2 games and you win your D is doing something right.

Touche.

Punisher
09-19-2012, 10:11 AM
Lol the irony is the eagles cutt joe mays

Kaylore
09-19-2012, 10:15 AM
This is cool, I was just thinking we need more hindsight threads.

I love talking about things we can't change.

Drek
09-19-2012, 10:35 AM
I love talking about things we can't change.

Not recognizing the mistakes of the past is the first step towards repeating them in the future.

The FO went all in for Peyton and apparently can't multitask, so things like trading for Ryans on the cheap, signing Mike Tolbert to give us another legitimate power back option (who could have doubled as our FB), shoring up a relatively thin WR corps, and adding more legitimate safety depth all fell by the wayside.

TonyR
09-19-2012, 11:30 AM
^ My thinking exactly, Drek. And it's not like they had to break the bank to make these obvious improvements.

Lestat
09-19-2012, 11:49 AM
Lol the irony is the eagles cutt joe mays

they traded him to us for JJ Arrington.

we should have signed Jameel McClain

but what we really need at MLB
http://sitracking.files.wordpress.com/2012/09/manti-teo-getty-t.jpg

maher_tyler
09-19-2012, 11:58 AM
the guy was/is coming off two major injuries.....

Philly has had crap MLB's the last few years so of course he is an upgrade. However, it is not like the Eagles defenses has played amazing.

Considering their offense has turn the ball over 9 times...i think they're doing alright. I'm kinda wondering if it is an indication of how good that team is. Turn the ball over that much and still be 2-0.

TonyR
09-19-2012, 12:02 PM
I'm kinda wondering if it is an indication of how good that team is. Turn the ball over that much and still be 2-0.

I think they're a really dangerous team. And they're doing it without one of the best LTs in the game (Jason Peters). In the end it will come down to Michael Vick. He's one of the best talents in the game but doesn't always play smart football.

Lestat
09-19-2012, 12:29 PM
Considering their offense has turn the ball over 9 times...i think they're doing alright. I'm kinda wondering if it is an indication of how good that team is. Turn the ball over that much and still be 2-0.

the Eagles are dangerous. every time the ball is snapped that offense can score a touch down.

people hate on Vick and he does make some boneheaded throws. but i can live with a boneheaded play when you're trying to make the big play.
that's what Vick does, he's got so much talent that he can make any play work and to a fault he tries to. if he learned to check down and take little chunks instead of having to have the big one that offense would be unstoppable.

well... assuming his OL actually blocks someone. dude gets whacked a ton when he's in the pocket. his OL is just average without Peters.

BroncoInferno
09-19-2012, 12:35 PM
The FO went all in for Peyton and apparently can't multitask, so things like trading for Ryans on the cheap

Depends on what you mean by "cheap." The draft compensation may have been a bargain, but the contract we would have inherited was not. Additionally, as has already been stated, the issue with our LBs is they can't cover. This is also a weak area in Ryans' game.

signing Mike Tolbert to give us another legitimate power back option (who could have doubled as our FB)

Tolbert turned down a more lucrative offer to resign with San Diego in order to sign with Carolina. He's originally from Georgia and went to school at Coastal Carolina University (just outside Myrtle Beach, SC) and wanted to play closer to home.

shoring up a relatively thin WR corps

Stokley has looked like a solid addition so far. They also signed Bubba Caldwell. Granted, that has not worked out thus far, but he caught 37 balls last season, so it was certainly an attempt to address depth. Did you expect to sign Vincent Jackson for $11 million per season?

and adding more legitimate safety depth all fell by the wayside.

They attempted to do this with the Adams signing. Also, they invested 2nd and 4th rounders in safeties in the 2011 draft. Successful teams give their youngsters a chance to develop rather than trying to throw money at a veteran to fill every perceived need.

Look, Elway was clear on day one that he didn't think throwing around money in FA was the best way to build a team. So, it baffles me how folks continue to express shock everytime we pass on free agents. He said he was going to build primarily through the draft, and that's the model he's clearly trying to follow.

TonyR
09-19-2012, 01:37 PM
Elway was clear on day one that he didn't think throwing around money in FA was the best way to build a team. So, it baffles me how folks continue to express shock everytime we pass on free agents. He said he was going to build primarily through the draft, and that's the model he's clearly trying to follow.

My thought on this is that when you bring in a guy like Peyton Manning you have to go "all in". I brought up the specific case of Ryans because I hear about the Eagles all the time and they had a glaring weakness similar to that of the Broncos at MLB. They made a move to shore it up, we gave a generous contract to a guy they gave up on despite their weakness at the position. They drafted Casey Matthews and he didn't get it done so they went FA. We drafted Nate Irving, and so far it hasn't worked out, and instead re-signed Joe Mays. I think they went the "better" route despite it being riskier and more expensive.

TonyR
09-19-2012, 01:42 PM
I love talking about things we can't change.

LOL I know, right?!? We never talk about things like players we should have/shouldn't have drafted/traded, and coaches we should have/shouldn't have hired/fired, on this forum! (Mike Shanahan, Josh McDaniels, Ed Reed, Jake Plummer, Jay Cutler, Kyle Orton, Peyton Hillis, Tim Tebow, and Knowshon Moreno, among many others, all say hello!)

ColoradoDarin
09-19-2012, 02:03 PM
LOL I know, right?!? We never talk about things like players we should have/shouldn't have drafted/traded, and coaches we should have/shouldn't have hired/fired, on this forum! (Mike Shanahan, Josh McDaniels, Ed Reed, Jake Plummer, Jay Cutler, Kyle Orton, Peyton Hillis, Tim Tebow, and Knowshon Moreno, among many others, all say hello!)

I'm glad you said it specifically. Kaylore would have never figured it out.

<object width="420" height="315"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube-nocookie.com/v/L_mrNQBLSMU?version=3&amp;hl=en_US&amp;rel=0"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube-nocookie.com/v/L_mrNQBLSMU?version=3&amp;hl=en_US&amp;rel=0" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" width="420" height="315" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true"></embed></object>

BroncoInferno
09-19-2012, 02:20 PM
My thought on this is that when you bring in a guy like Peyton Manning you have to go "all in". I brought up the specific case of Ryans because I hear about the Eagles all the time and they had a glaring weakness similar to that of the Broncos at MLB. They made a move to shore it up, we gave a generous contract to a guy they gave up on despite their weakness at the position. They drafted Casey Matthews and he didn't get it done so they went FA. We drafted Nate Irving, and so far it hasn't worked out, and instead re-signed Joe Mays. I think they went the "better" route despite it being riskier and more expensive.

I think the Eagles are a perfect example of why investing heavily in the FA market is not a sound strategy. The "Dream Team" went 8-8 last season.

TonyR
09-19-2012, 02:28 PM
I think the Eagles are a perfect example of why investing heavily in the FA market is not a sound strategy. The "Dream Team" went 8-8 last season.

I hear ya, but I think their issues last year were more about Vick, coaching, and injuries than FA failures. But fair point nonetheless.

Tombstone RJ
09-19-2012, 02:29 PM
I think the Eagles are a perfect example of why investing heavily in the FA market is not a sound strategy. The "Dream Team" went 8-8 last season.

This is how I think the Broncos are approaching FA too, that is, you don't bring all the FAs in all at once, you phase them in according to need and based on how the draft picks are doing. I guarantee you the Broncos will be active in the FA market next off season and the next offseason and the next...

What the Eagles did last year got them a lot of press and put a lot of stress on the coaching staff and the team to perform. It didn't work. Honestly, I can't remember a team heavily investing in a lot of FAs in a short amount of time that worked (won a championship) since Shanny did it back in 1995, 1996, 1997.