US embassy in Libya in flames, ambassador dead

[mhgaffney]

Even as this unfolds we are repeating the same crazy policy in Syria -- in our attempt to overthrow another government. Unlike Libya, however, the Syrian conflict threatens to explode into a regional -- posssibly a global -- war, involving Israel, Iran...even Russia and China.
MHG


Video: US consulate in Benghazi on fire, ambassador to Libya reported killed
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TmybuDexikM

US Ambassador and 3 embassy staff killed in Libyan attack

Benghazi - Four Americans including the US Ambassador are reported dead in an attack on the US consulate in Benghazi, Libya. The four were escaping the building that was under attack, when a rocket hit their car.

Reuters reports the building was being evacuated as it was being stormed by militants upset about a US-made film insulting the Prophet Mohammad.

A Libyan official is quoted saying US ambassador Christopher Stevens was helping the staff escape the consulate in Benghazi when their car came under attack. The official tells Reuters, "The American ambassador and three staff members were killed when gunmen fired rockets at them."


Read more: http://www.digitaljournal.com/article/332664#ixzz26GyhAwGj

Time to end the crazy wars -- and bring the troops home, hold our leaders accountable for their crimes, take back our country, and fix our dead economy... MHG

[DenverBrit]

Even as this unfolds we are repeating the same crazy policy in Syria -- in our attempt to overthrow another government. Unlike Libya, however, the Syrian conflict threatens to explode into a regional -- posssibly a global -- war, involving Israel, Iran...even Russia and China.


What's this.....the 35th claim of imminent WWIII this year??

Meds, take your ferking meds!!

[Smiling Assassin27]

Woodathunk that the 'freedom fighters' we armed and supported with NATO airstrikes would turn out to be criminal gangs with no love for America or lawful society? I'm shocked, SHOCKED...

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/T1DEG6BWgp0" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

[spdirty]

Apparently this movie got em all pissed off and in a rage.

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/ntgzoE7rU9A" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/OSlPE04Ubt4" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/SqY0XQCzBpM" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

[houghtam]

Apparently this movie got em all pissed off and in a rage.

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/ntgzoE7rU9A" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/OSlPE04Ubt4" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/SqY0XQCzBpM" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

This.

This was not an attack based on foreign policy one way or the other, per se. It was a response to some dumbass making a movie about their god. OOPS I meant prophet...

[ant1999e]

This.

This was not an attack based on foreign policy one way or the other, per se. It was a response to some dumbass making a movie about their god. OOPS I meant prophet...

Well hell, I don't blame them. Freedom of speech is bullshyt.::)

[W*GS]

gaffe orgasms thinking about WWIII.

[TonyR]

Of course the Romney campaign disgustingly and dishonestly accused Obama of sympathizing with the attackers. How could anyone consider voting for this slime? The whole story here:

http://andrewsullivan.thedailybeast.com/2012/09/unfit-for-government.html

These people are simply unfit for the responsibility of running the United States. The knee-jerk judgments, based on ideology not reality; the inability to back down when you have said something obviously wrong; and the attempt to argue that the president of the US actually sympathized with those who murdered his own ambassador in Benghazi: these are disqualifying instincts for someone hoping to be the president of the US. Disqualifying.

[TonyR]

Here's more:

http://andrewsullivan.thedailybeast.com/2012/09/romney-tries-to-exploit-a-tragedy-fails.html

[TonyR]

Once again, the Romney pattern holds: pander to the right, issue an irresponsible statement, before Romney and his people even know whether this violence is going to spread, and prove that they will try to use even the violent deaths of four diplomats to political advantage. This isn't an aberration. We've seen enough to know that this is his character.
http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&cad=rja&ved=0CCIQFjAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.thedailybeast.com%2Farticles% 2F2012%2F09%2F12%2Fromney-proves-it-again-can-t-let-this-man-near-the-white-house.html&ei=z7NQUMLiHsqO0QGWuYDgBg&usg=AFQjCNH6R2CmPKl51pY-1PfpEtmbdxSNcg&sig2=fc-ysm219VBnV_ySN4tapQ

[TonyR]

"They were just trying to score a cheap news cycle hit based on the embassy statement and now it’s just completely blown up," said a very senior Republican foreign policy hand, who called the statement an "utter disaster" and a "Lehman moment" — a parallel to the moment when John McCain, amid the 2008 financial crisis, failed to come across as a steady leader... "I guess we see now that it is because they’re incompetent at talking effectively about foreign policy," said the Republican. "This is just unbelievable — when they decide to play on it they completely bungle it."
http://www.buzzfeed.com/bensmith/foreign-policy-hands-voice-disbelief-at-romney-cai

[lonestar]

Seems to me the last time and embassy was
Attacked the far left came out in force.

But then the time before that IRAN carter was in office and screwed the pooch a couple of times NOT getting them back.

All it Took was RAGUN taking office To get them released. Not even sure he had warmed
Up the chair in the oval office that they were on the way home.

But that is the diffenrce between wimps and heroes.

[lonestar]

Seems to me the last time and embassy was
Attacked the far left came out in force.

But then the time before that IRAN carter was in office and screwed the pooch a couple of times NOT getting them back.

All it Took was RAGUN taking office To get them released. Not even sure he had warmed
Up the chair in the oval office that they were on the way home.

But that is the diffenrce between wimps and heroes.

[houghtam]

Seems to me the last time and embassy was
Attacked the far left came out in force.

But then the time before that IRAN carter was in office and screwed the pooch a couple of times NOT getting them back.

All it Took was RAGUN taking office To get them released. Not even sure he had warmed
Up the chair in the oval office that they were on the way home.

But that is the diffenrce between wimps and heroes.

Your history is a little off.

If you're referring to Operation Eagle Claw itself, then you're associating President Carter with the planning and execution of a special forces operation, insinuating that it was he who crashed the aircraft into one another and caused the colossal embarrassment of a military operation resulting in no fewer than three new military commands to be named to make sure something like that never happened again.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Eagle_Claw

Then again, if you're making that claim, then you also need to give credit where credit is due in Obama's record vs. Osama bin Laden and his #2. You cannot have it both ways.

If you're referring to it being Carter's fault for the entire situation in Iran to begin with, well...you're also wrong. This is a pretty good clarification of Carter's role in the whole thing. If you really want to go down that road we can blame it all on Ike in '53.

http://www.salon.com/2010/08/17/jimmy_carter_and_iran/

Of course, neither you nor any of your whatevercon friends will read the links. Or what I typed. Or history books.

[TonyR]

Veteran diplomat Nicholas Burns:

I was, frankly, very disappointed and dismayed to see Gov. Romney inject politics into this very difficult situation where our embassies are under attack, where there’s been a big misunderstanding in the Middle East, apparently, about an American film, where we’re trying to preserve the lives of our diplomats. This is no time for politics. I just think that Gov. Romney has, in a very unwise way, injected himself into a situation where he clearly doesn’t have all the facts. http://firstread.nbcnews.com/_news/2012/09/12/13831663-ex-ambassador-very-disappointed-in-unwise-romney-response

[Rigs11]

what an idiot:dummy:

TRENDING: Romney's political pretzel over Libya

Posted by
CNN Political Unit
(CNN) – Has Mitt Romney twisted the narrative of Tuesday's attacks at U.S. missions in Libya and Egypt?

A timeline of the events suggests Romney was wrong in his accusation that the Obama administration's "first response" on Tuesday was one of sympathy for those who started the violence itself–as the violence came after the first statement was published.

And Romney's comments Wednesday characterized that response as standing "in apology" when the embassy's statement was not actually an apology but a condemnation.

The timeline:

Tuesday morning in Egypt, the U.S. Embassy in Cairo released a statement stating it "condemns the continuing efforts by misguided individuals to hurt the religious feelings of Muslims." The statement came after protests erupted in parts of the Arab world in response to an online video found offensive by Muslims.

While the statement doesn't specifically mention the video, it says the embassy "firmly reject(s) the actions by those who abuse the universal right of free speech to hurt the religious beliefs of others." READ THE FULL STATEMENT HERE.

After the statement, protesters began to breach the embassy in Cairo, where ultimately several men scaled the walls of the mission and tore down its American flag.

At 6:30 p.m. ET - The embassy then tweeted about its earlier statement: "This morning's condemnation (issued before protests began) still stands. As does our condemnation of unjustified breach of the Embassy." The tweet was posted by a foreign service officer, CNN confirmed. Several State Department sources said that the U.S. ambassador to Egypt did not sign off on the original statement, as she was in Washington at the time.

Reports then emerged Tuesday evening, Eastern Standard Time, of attacks on the consulate in Benghazi, Libya. The State Department also told CNN that a consulate employee had been killed in the attacks. At the time, however, the employee's nationality was not clear.

At 10:10 p.m. ET, Romney's campaign released an embargoed (until midnight) statement blasting the Obama administration. The statement had a veiled reference to the Egypt embassy's statement that condemned offensive speech against Muslims and referred to it as the administration's "first response":

"I'm outraged by the attacks on American diplomatic missions in Libya and Egypt and by the death of an American consulate worker in Benghazi. It's disgraceful that the Obama Administration's first response was not to condemn attacks on our diplomatic missions, but to sympathize with those who waged the attacks." READ THE FULL STATEMENT HERE.

At 10:25 p.m. ET, the campaign lifted the embargo, and news outlets began reporting the statement.

At 12:11 a.m. ET, Obama's re-election campaign put out a statement, accusing Romney of taking a political swipe during the crisis.

"We are shocked that, at a time when the United States of America is confronting the tragic death of one of our diplomatic officers in Libya, Governor Romney would choose to launch a political attack."

At 6:21 a.m. ET, CNN reported on its wire service that U.S. ambassador to Libya Chris Stevens was killed in a rocket attack. Over the next few hours, it's revealed that three other personnel, including a Foreign Service information management officer, were also killed.

At 10:16 a.m. ET, Romney held a press conference at his campaign office in Jacksonville, Florida. He renewed his criticism of the Obama administration, saying "Obama has demonstrated a lack of clarity as to a foreign policy."

Asked if he regretted the wording in his statement Tuesday night, the Republican then issued his own timeline of the events in answering the question.

"The embassy in Cairo put out a statement after their grounds had been breached. Protestors were inside the grounds," he said. As noted earlier, however, the U.S. Embassy statement was issued before the breach. The embassy then reiterated the statement on Twitter after protestors were over the walls. A Romney campaign official pointed to this tweet, which has since been deleted, as justification for the Republican nominee's comment that the statement came after the grounds were breached.

Romney then said the administration's original statement from the embassy in Cairo was effectively an "apology." His language went further than the Tuesday release from his campaign where he called it "disgraceful" and an expression of "sympathy for those who waged the attacks." READ THE TRANSCRIPT OF THE PRESS CONFERENCE HERE.

"I think it's a terrible course for America to stand in apology for our values. That instead when our grounds are being attacked and being breached, that the first response of the United States must be outrage," he said. "An apology for America's values is never the right course."

His comments also raise the question that if Romney was condemning the embassy statement that condemned offensive speech against Muslims, where does Romney stand on the offensive video?

While he wasn't asked about the video in the press conference, Romney stood by the right to free speech.

"We'll defend also our constitutional rights of speech and assembly and religion," he said. "We encourage our nations to understand and respect the principles of our Constitution because we recognize that these principles are the ultimate source of freedom for individuals around the world."

CNN, however, obtained talking points from the Romney campaign in which they advise Republicans on how to respond to the press over the issue. The document suggests Republicans be prepared to answer this question: "Don't you think it was appropriate for the embassy to condemn the controversial movie in question? Are you standing up for movies like this?"

The answer prompts the responder to say that Romney "rejects the reported message of the movie," but to add that "we will not apologize for our constitutional right to freedom of speech."

http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2012/09/12/romneys-political-pretzel-over-libya/

[Garcia Bronco]

There has to be a response from our Government on this...I am thinking in the order of the aid we provide these countries. Financial ones....

[elsid13]

There has to be a response from our Government on this...I am thinking in the order of the aid we provide these countries. Financial ones....

You're right, but it needs to be measured and calculated. The last thing we need is moving either of the nations into alignment with Iran.

[houghtam]

Wow, Romney really tripped over his dick on this one. And he just doubled down on stupid defending his statement.

Doesn't surprise me.

And yes, there needs to be a calm and calculated response, just as there always does when it comes to foreign policy. Swift and haphazard ends up getting you into stuff you can't get out of.

[Drunken.Broncoholic]

Obama doesnt even attend intelligence meetings anymore. Not surprised this happened. As far as a movie being the reason? Guess freedom of speech isn't worth fighting for anymore. Al Qaeda just hates America plain and simple. They were screaming anti Obama rhetoric at this mob. I don't think Obama made this movie.

[The Lone Bolt]

Wow, Romney really tripped over his dick on this one. And he just doubled down on stupid defending his statement.

Doesn't surprise me.

And yes, there needs to be a calm and calculated response, just as there always does when it comes to foreign policy. Swift and haphazard ends up getting you into stuff you can't get out of.

Agreed. Huge political embarrassment for Romney.

[Kid A]

A lot of weird stuff coming out about this "movie" and its involvement in the embassy attack. Sounds like it's not a real movie? And all the background info on it is fake? And a lot of it is dubbed over? And al Queda had been planning to attack embassy for a while, using protests as a cover to infiltrate and pull it off?

Anyway, a lot of important questions unanswered. Which is why it's pathetic to leap at the first possible moment to turn it into political points.

http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2012/09/mitt-romney-drops-his-3-am-phone-call/262285/#

Mitt Romney could have waited, as they did. When he spoke, he could have said essentially the same thing as they did. We honor the people who serve us. We condemn the violence they endured. We express sorrow and support to their families, and we affirm belief in our values. Americans disagree on many issues, including foreign policy, but those disputes can wait until another day.

But that is not what he said. When he first heard about the violence and protests last night, he rushed to condemn the administration before anyone knew fully what was going on. After he had had a few hours to think, he dug himself in far deeper with a graceless press conference whose dominant theme was partisan criticism of the administration.

[peacepipe]

Obama doesnt even attend intelligence meetings anymore. Not surprised this happened. As far as a movie being the reason? Guess freedom of speech isn't worth fighting for anymore. Al Qaeda just hates America plain and simple. They were screaming anti Obama rhetoric at this mob. I don't think Obama made this movie.where did you get this idiotic notion?

[ant1999e]

I know the left wants to turn this into a anti Romney thread and politicize it even more, let's remember that people did die.

[peacepipe]

I know the left wants to turn this into a anti Romney thread and politicize it even more, let's remember that people did die.

you dumbass,this whole thing got politicized by willard when he opened his mouth without knowing any of the facts. it's why he's currently looking like an idiot.

[peacepipe]

I know the left wants to turn this into a anti Romney thread and politicize it even more, let's remember that people did die.

I wish willard would've thought of that before trying to score political points on this.

[ant1999e]

you dumbass,this whole thing got politicized by willard when he opened his mouth without knowing any of the facts. it's why he's currently looking like an idiot.

Cool story but you are continuing the politicization by focusing on Romney instead of the situation. It's why you are currently looking like an idiot.

[ant1999e]

Do any of you idiots think that two attacks on U.S. Embassies on September 11 was a coincidence?

[peacepipe]

I haven't politicized anything,I merely pointed out what willard was doing when he came out with his statement. I also pointed out that he is looking like an idiot for doing so. It seems to be obvious to everybody but you that willard was trying to score plitical points. It's called an observation.

[ant1999e]

I haven't politicized anything,I merely pointed out what willard was doing when he came out with his statement. I also pointed out that he is looking like an idiot for doing so. It seems to be obvious to everybody but you that willard was trying to score plitical points. It's called an observation.

So you admit to politicizing this thread instead of focusing on the damage that has been done to the lives of innocent people?

[peacepipe]

So you admit to politicizing this thread instead of focusing on the damage that has been done to the lives of innocent people?

what part of "I haven't politicized anything" did you not understand.

[peacepipe]

So you admit to politicizing this thread instead of focusing on the damage that has been done to the lives of innocent people?

you're getting upset with me when you should be getting mad with willard,who politicized this situation in the grandest manner.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

Don't know how the righties can defend this joke of a human being and still act like they have some sort of claim to the high ground...

https://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-snc7/391674_529228753769307_1081308786_n.jpg

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

Cool story but you are continuing the politicization by focusing on Romney instead of the situation. It's why you are currently looking like an idiot.

::)

Does this work the same way as the right-wing "logic" that says condemning racism makes you a racist?

https://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-snc6/262299_529244873767695_635315297_n.jpg

[Drunken.Broncoholic]

La broncos fan = al Qaeda.


Everyone assumed it was about a movie. Ya right it's about 11 years after 9-11

[NorCalBronco7]

I dont believe its about a movie at all, its about 9/11.

[ant1999e]

Who cares what caused it. Did you hear what Willard said? I think Bush new all about it before it happened.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

La broncos fan = al Qaeda.


Drunken.Broncoholic = not just a clever handle.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

Who cares what caused it. Did you hear what Willard said? I think Bush new all about it before it happened.

Yeah, I'm sure no one is surprised that you're giving Willard a pass.

Now the rest of America is another story...

[ant1999e]

During the early days of the Libyans' fight to overthrow Moammar Gadhafi, Christopher Stevens wrangled a ride on a Greek cargo ship and sailed into the rebels' stronghold city of Benghazi. He arrived at a time when the crackle of gunfire could be heard each night.
Stevens and his team didn't even have a place to stay, but found space in a hotel briefly, moving out after a car bomb went off in the parking lot, according to his own account in State Magazine last year.
Stevens, whose diplomatic foothold were a couple of battered tables, was on literally on the rebels' side while the revolution was at its most vulnerable and in danger of being crushed by Gadhafi's troops who were moving on the city. The threat was pushed back at the last minute by the intervention of NATO planes which began bombing Gadhafi's tanks and troops.
Stevens, who was elevated to ambassador four months ago, was killed Tuesday by militants in Gadhafi who stormed the Benghazi consulate. cont...

http://gma.yahoo.com/slain-diplomat-chris-stevens-slipped-libya-cargo-ship-154521257.html

[mhgaffney]

Seems to me the last time and embassy was
Attacked the far left came out in force.

But then the time before that IRAN carter was in office and screwed the pooch a couple of times NOT getting them back.

All it Took was RAGUN taking office To get them released. Not even sure he had warmed
Up the chair in the oval office that they were on the way home.

But that is the diffenrce between wimps and heroes.

In his memoir FROM THE SHADOWS Bpb Gates debunked the prevalent but wrong notion that Carter was a wimp.

In fact, the US military buildup under Reagan started during the Carter admin.

Evidently -- you still have not heard of the October Surprise.

The one who got screwed was Carter. It was a clear-cut case of treason by HW Bush & co.

The objective was to deny Carter another term by working out a secret deal with the Iranians. That is why the US hostages were released within minutes of Ronnie's inauguration.

The secret deal was arms for hostages -- and the arms deliveries started in March 1981. Bob Gates ran the whole show for the CIA --

Another thing happened -- within weeks of the inauguration: the attempted assassination of Reagan by Mr Hinckley -- who (it turns out) was a friend of HW Bush's son.

No wonder there was bad blood between Reagan and Bush. Reagan had to know that his own VP had ordered the hit on his life.

MHG

[elsid13]

This is chaotic evolving situation, that why our leaders must be measured when then speak or take action on world wide events. The ability to have instance information doesn't mean we have instance understanding or knowledge about events.

It appears that loose organized militant group is responsible and that US is taking steps to gather information and work with our allies in the region to get them.

[nyuk nyuk]

Can we just turn the Islamic world into trinitite and call it a day? These assholes have been doing this to people for 1,400 years. It's time to call a spade a spade. Obama can shove his "don't demean a person's religion" crap. Stating fact is not demeaning anyone; it's stating fact.

Islam is ****.

[nyuk nyuk]

Don't know how the righties can defend this joke of a human being and still act like they have some sort of claim to the high ground...

How many times has Obama spiked the football at Ground Zero since Bin Laden was shot?

Speaking of political opportunism.

[nyuk nyuk]

Do any of you idiots think that two attacks on U.S. Embassies on September 11 was a coincidence?

You're stretching the liberal mind a tad too far, brah.

[ant1999e]

http://www.al-monitor.com/pulse/originals/2012/al-monitor/the-filmmaker-who-wasnt.html

The man claiming to be the writer, director and producer of the anti-Islam film that reportedly spurred deadly anti-American protests in Libya and Cairo Tuesday appeared on Wednesday not to exist — at least, not under the name, nationality, origins, religion or profession he claims.
“Sam Bacile” told The Wall Street Journal and The Associated Press in interviews Tuesday that he was an Israeli-born Southern California-based real estate developer, who received $5 million from “100 Jewish donors” to finance his anti-Islam film, Innocence of Muslims, “Islam is a cancer,” he told the Journal and AP.
But several elements of “Bacile’s” story appeared on further examination Wednesday to be phony. There are, for instance, no California real estate license records for anyone with the last name Bacile. And the fact that Bacile said precisely “100 Jewish” donors financed the project also seemed dubious. Israeli officials, contacted by Al-Monitor, declined to say if Bacile was an Israeli citizen, demurring in part because of uncertainty over whether that was a real name. cont...

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

How many times has Obama spiked the football at Ground Zero since Bin Laden was shot?

Speaking of political opportunism.

Translation: "I'm pissed that Obama was able to succeed where my hero Smirky McFlightsuit failed."

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

You're stretching the liberal mind a tad too far, brah.

This from a cheerleader for the president that didn't see anything worrisome about all those warnings about Bin Laden's plans to strike inside the U.S.?

That's some funny sh*t right there. ROFL!

[DAN_BRONCO_FAN]

since its obvious Egypt dont wikes us lets save our selves a lot of money and not give them any more foreign aid.

[Drek]

La broncos fan = al Qaeda.


Everyone assumed it was about a movie. Ya right it's about 11 years after 9-11

No ****.

Which makes Romney's comments even worse. The Egyptian embassy was trying to defuse the tension based on the claim that it was tied to the film, while trying to protect themselves. Instead of waiting to get all the facts Romney was already running his mouth off.

Romney then attacks them and Obama. This is like blaming W. Bush for 9/11 on the morning of 9/11 for a lack of mechanical inspections on air planes. Romney wasn't even willing to wait for all the facts to come in before trying to attack the president.

And talking about it isn't politicizing it, it's recognizing the fact that Romney is incapable of handling foreign policy. He shoots first and aims later, with a very clear mission to start shooting at Iran day one he might get in office.

I'd like a level head in the White House, not a pandering hot head who doesn't suss out the truth before he reacts.

[TonyR]

And talking about it isn't politicizing it, it's recognizing the fact that Romney is incapable of handling foreign policy. He shoots first and aims later, with a very clear mission to start shooting at Iran day one he might get in office.

I'd like a level head in the White House, not a pandering hot head who doesn't suss out the truth before he reacts.

^ Yup. Of the many reasons why Romney isn't electable, this may be the biggest one. He's go the Bush/Cheney foreign policy team at the ready and chomping at the bit to rev up the war machine and further bankrupt our nation.

[TonyR]

As a practical matter, this episode shows how useless Romney’s main foreign policy theme has been. According to Romney, Obama “apologizes for” America, and Romney won’t. He tried to shoehorn the embassy attacks into this frame, and it didn’t work for at least two reasons. First, Obama didn’t respond to the attacks by apologizing for anything or sympathizing with the attackers, as Romney’s original statement charged, so it was blatantly false. Romney’s position that the U.S. should never “apologize for” American values is almost beside the point. Would this have made any difference to the people assaulting the embassy in Cairo or the consulate in Benghazi? Would the attacks not have happened if Romney had been conducting his own brand of thoroughly unapologetic activist foreign policy? It seems unlikely.

Romney might have legitimately questioned the security arrangements for the consulate, for example, or he could have made the fair observation that Libya’s new government is very weak and Libya as a whole has serious security problems, but that wouldn’t have translated into the easy and satisfying point-scoring that Romney seems to prefer. It wouldn’t have fit his ready-made scheme of Obama-as-Carter, but it would have spared him of most of the ridicule he’s receiving now. Now instead of portraying Obama as Carter, he has presented himself as the bumbling McCain figure of 2012.
http://www.theamericanconservative.com/larison/romneys-lehman-moment/?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=romneys-lehman-moment

[TonyR]

Romney’s comments were, to be sure, unusually noxious and indecent. But this is also what happens when campaigns get desperate. Like a gambler who’s already lost too much, they begin taking risks in the hope of making it all back. And then, more often than not, they pay the price.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/ezra-klein/wp/2012/09/12/the-romney-campaign-gets-desperate/

[houghtam]

Here's a pretty good writeup concerning the man who allegedly produced the film. Looks like he's an Egyptian (Coptic) Christian with a history of aliases (including on Nicola Bacily) and bank fraud. He was also on probation and ordered not to use computers or the internet.

Do people still believe this is a free speech issue?

http://news.yahoo.com/california-man-confirms-role-anti-islam-film-223333645.html

Nakoula, who talked guardedly about his role, pleaded no contest in 2010 to federal bank fraud charges in California and was ordered to pay more than $790,000 in restitution. He was also sentenced to 21 months in federal prison and ordered not to use computers or the Internet for five years without approval from his probation officer.

[DBruleU]

If you guys who slam Romney for commenting on these tragedies to score political points voted for Obama in '08...you're a hypocrite.

http://www.buzzfeed.com/andrewkaczynski/barack-obama-used-troop-deaths-to-ding-bush-mccai?fb_action_ids=10152104682320246&fb_action_types=og.likes&fb_source=other_multiline&action_object_map={%2210152104682320246%22%3A17239 2716230680}&action_type_map={%2210152104682320246%22%3A%22og.l ikes%22}&action_ref_map=[]

Barack Obama Used Troop Deaths To Ding Bush, McCain Support For Iraq In 2008

The Obama campaign hit Mitt Romney for using the “tragic death of one of our diplomatic officers in Libya” to “launch a political attack.” On a July 2008 appearance on CNN, then-Senator used the death of U.S. troops in Afghanistan as talking point to ding John McCain and President Bush for their support of the Iraq War.

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/AXNF4_09BOI" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

[DBruleU]

Oh...and let's not forget when "10,000" people died in the tornado in KS. Not a peep then about this slight over estimation.

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/tjO8Qc5s1fY" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

[houghtam]

If you guys who slam Romney for commenting on these tragedies to score political points voted for Obama in '08...you're a hypocrite.

http://www.buzzfeed.com/andrewkaczynski/barack-obama-used-troop-deaths-to-ding-bush-mccai?fb_action_ids=10152104682320246&fb_action_types=og.likes&fb_source=other_multiline&action_object_map={%2210152104682320246%22%3A17239 2716230680}&action_type_map={%2210152104682320246%22%3A%22og.l ikes%22}&action_ref_map=[]

Barack Obama Used Troop Deaths To Ding Bush, McCain Support For Iraq In 2008

The Obama campaign hit Mitt Romney for using the “tragic death of one of our diplomatic officers in Libya” to “launch a political attack.” On a July 2008 appearance on CNN, then-Senator used the death of U.S. troops in Afghanistan as talking point to ding John McCain and President Bush for their support of the Iraq War.

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/AXNF4_09BOI" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

What if we're just slamming him for these comments because he made them in haste and they ended up turning out to be flat out wrong and completely stupid, and that they reflect poorly on how he would handle national crises as the sitting President of the United States?

[TonyR]

If you guys who slam Romney for commenting on these tragedies to score political points voted for Obama in '08...you're a hypocrite.

I can't see the vid at work so I don't know the specifics here, but to me the issue with Romney isn't as much the "political points" as it is the dishonesty. Were Obama's comments dishonest?

[W*GS]

<a href="http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-19572912">Innocence of Muslims: Mystery of film-maker 'Sam Bacile'</a>

His name is more accurately "Im Becile".

[Rascal]

If you guys who slam Romney for commenting on these tragedies to score political points voted for Obama in '08...you're a hypocrite.

http://www.buzzfeed.com/andrewkaczynski/barack-obama-used-troop-deaths-to-ding-bush-mccai?fb_action_ids=10152104682320246&fb_action_types=og.likes&fb_source=other_multiline&action_object_map={%2210152104682320246%22%3A17239 2716230680}&action_type_map={%2210152104682320246%22%3A%22og.l ikes%22}&action_ref_map=[]

Barack Obama Used Troop Deaths To Ding Bush, McCain Support For Iraq In 2008

The Obama campaign hit Mitt Romney for using the “tragic death of one of our diplomatic officers in Libya” to “launch a political attack.” On a July 2008 appearance on CNN, then-Senator used the death of U.S. troops in Afghanistan as talking point to ding John McCain and President Bush for their support of the Iraq War.

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/AXNF4_09BOI" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

I didn't vote for Obama, and won't vote for him or Romney, but what is wrong with what he said?

[DBruleU]

What if we're just slamming him for these comments because he made them in haste and they ended up turning out to be flat out wrong and completely stupid, and that they reflect poorly on how he would handle national crises as the sitting President of the United States?

From everything I have been reading in headlines the past day, people are upset at Romney because he came out and made a statement on foreign policy. The media wants the POTUS to dictate the foreign policy statements seeing as foreign policy is one of Obama's last remaining strong points.

[DBruleU]

I didn't vote for Obama, and won't vote for him or Romney, but what is wrong with what he said?

A lot of the narrative is that Romney is using these tragedies to politicize and score points. Fact is...Obama has done the same thing in the past. Let's not pretend Obama is above all this.

[ghwk]

From everything I have been reading in headlines the past day, people are upset at Romney because he came out and made a statement on foreign policy. The media wants the POTUS to dictate the foreign policy statements seeing as foreign policy is one of Obama's last remaining strong points.

Good Lord we don't need to bash Ronmey, the conservative media is doing it for us! Talk about eating your own. This is proof they really don't like their candidate.

[ghwk]

A lot of the narrative is that Romney is using these tragedies to politicize and score points. Fact is...Obama has done the same thing in the past. Let's not pretend Obama is above all this.

He may have politicized events but not when a terriorst has killed one of our folks, and he didn't criticze the sitting president during the event.

[houghtam]

From everything I have been reading in headlines the past day, people are upset at Romney because he came out and made a statement on foreign policy. The media wants the POTUS to dictate the foreign policy statements seeing as foreign policy is one of Obama's last remaining strong points.

Really? Because everything I read yesterday supports just what I said. In fact, Obama's response was all over television yesterday:

“As president, one of the things I’ve learned is you can’t do that -- that, you know, it’s important for you to make sure that the statements that you make are backed up by the facts, and that you’ve thought through the ramifications before you make them,”

Now, today there are several articles making the fact that Romney has no foreign policy experience common knowledge, but only after he opened his mouth and proved it.

And I wouldn't call this the "media".

http://www.azcentral.com/news/politics/20120912romney-gets-bipartisan-scolding-handling-attacks.html

Romney gets bipartisan scolding for handling of Libya violence

Romney "will find out that first reports from the battlefield are always incorrect," said Richard Armitage, the former deputy Secretary of State under Republican President George W. Bush. "This should be his mantra, so he can speak in a deliberate manner, and not have to repent at his leisure later."

Senate Foreign Relations Committee Chairman John Kerry, a Massachusetts Democrat, called Romney's statements "about as inappropriate as anything I have ever seen at this kind of moment." The comments show "an insensitivity and lack of judgment about what is happening," he told reporters.


Commentator Peggy Noonan, a former Republican official, told Fox News that Romney wasn't "doing himself any favors" with a response bound to be seen as politically craven.

"When you step forward in the midst of a political environment and start giving statements on something dramatic and violent that has happened, you're always leaving yourself open to accusations that you are trying to exploit things politically," she said on Fox News.


You're the one trying to turn this into a partisan issue. The Romney camp stands alone.

[DBruleU]

He may have politicized events but not when a terriorst has killed one of our folks, and he didn't criticze the sitting president during the event.

Did you even listen to the clip? Clearly criticizes Bush and Mcain as well as uses his time to use the death of troops to criticize.

[Rascal]

A lot of the narrative is that Romney is using these tragedies to politicize and score points. Fact is...Obama has done the same thing in the past. Let's not pretend Obama is above all this.

I don't see how they are similar. Obamas comments were about a decision that Bush made, which McCain supported, to go to war with Iraq when we should have been going to Afghanistan. That decision resulted in thousands of deaths. The decision had already been made, so it was appropriate to criticize.

Romney immediately went political on this tragedy while events were still unfolding. I would almost be willing to write it off, but for the fact that it illustrates how he, and/or his foreign policy team, are incompetent/amateurish.

And for Romney to state that Obama was symathetic to the attackers is absolutely asinine (see quotes below). Sure there are those in conservative circles who will believe that. I put them in the same category as those liberals who have the same level of hatred for Bush and blame him for 9-11. But the average american, who isn't blinded by hatred, will realize the stupidity of the comments and how unpresidential they are.

I’m outraged by the attacks on American diplomatic missions in Libya and Egypt and by the death of an American consulate worker [sic] in Benghazi. It’s disgraceful that the Obama administration’s first response was not to condemn attacks on our diplomatic missions, but to sympathize with those who waged the attacks.

And I don't know enough of the content of Obama's Greensville overstatement to see its relevance.

[DBruleU]

Really? Because everything I read yesterday supports just what I said. In fact, Obama's response was all over television yesterday:


Now, today there are several articles making the fact that Romney has no foreign policy experience common knowledge, but only after he opened his mouth and proved it.

And I wouldn't call this the "media".

http://www.azcentral.com/news/politics/20120912romney-gets-bipartisan-scolding-handling-attacks.html

Romney gets bipartisan scolding for handling of Libya violence







You're the one trying to turn this into a partisan issue. The Romney camp stands alone.



Yeah, Obama has never done anything like this.

"The police acted stupidly..."

And I'm always amazed when Romney is hit for not having any foreign policy experience when we elected a guy 4 years ago who had zero experience at doing anything required to be President.

He started out his presidency speaking of closing Gitmo (Fail) and then speaking in Cairo (Turned out to be a fail). Now we have the Muslim Brotherhood in control of Egypt, our closest ally in Israel we have left hanging in the wind, now we have attacks on our sovereign embassy in Cairo and consulate in Libya with pathetic responses such as "We're sorry we offended some Muslim feelings.." paraphrase of course but pretty much what was said.

So Romney issues a response AND takes questions (Most of which were stupid questions asking him why he would make this statement and upstage the POTUS). While in 2004 Kerry attacks Bush over the war but that was all patriotic dissent. POTUS then has his own press conference where he DOESNT take questions at all from the media. Have to make it to Las Vegas for those campaign stops after all.

Obama has been a major fail on FP. We need look no further then this latest F-up and his blatant refusal to meet with Netenyahu because of "time constraints..." but he has time to see Letterman net week.

Weakest President ever.

[DBruleU]

I don't see how they are similar. Obamas comments were about a decision that Bush made, which McCain supported, to go to war with Iraq when we should have been going to Afghanistan. That decision resulted in thousands of deaths. The decision had already been made, so it was appropriate to criticize.

Romney immediately went political on this tragedy while events were still unfolding. I would almost be willing to write it off, but for the fact that it illustrates how he, and/or his foreign policy team, are incompetent/amateurish.

And for Romney to state that Obama was symathetic to the attackers is absolutely asinine (see quotes below). Sure there are those in conservative circles who will believe that. I put them in the same category as those liberals who have the same level of hatred for Bush and blame him for 9-11. But the average american, who isn't blinded by hatred, will realize the stupidity of the comments and how unpresidential they are.



And I don't know enough of the content of Obama's Greensville overstatement to see its relevance.

Did you see the statement from the Embassy in Cairo? The POTUS and State Department own those statements.

When a statement surfaced from the U.S. Embassy in Cairo condemning, "the continuing efforts by misguided individuals to hurt the religious feelings of Muslims" and "firmly [rejecting] the actions by those who abuse the universal right of free speech to hurt the religious beliefs of others,"

That's what he was referring to.

And yes, the two incidents are different, but the way you use those incidents to score points is not.

For effs sake...the tornado reference is "shooting first and aiming later.."

[TonyR]

Did you even listen to the clip? Clearly criticizes Bush and Mcain as well as uses his time to use the death of troops to criticize.

As I said previously, and you have so far apparently ignored, it's more an issue of honesty.

[Rascal]

Did you see the statement from the Embassy in Cairo? The POTUS and State Department own those statements.

When a statement surfaced from the U.S. Embassy in Cairo condemning, "the continuing efforts by misguided individuals to hurt the religious feelings of Muslims" and "firmly [rejecting] the actions by those who abuse the universal right of free speech to hurt the religious beliefs of others,"

That's what he was referring to.

And yes, the two incidents are different, but the way you use those incidents to score points is not.

I know what he was referring to. I think that statement was issued by diplomats in Cairo who were fearful of the situation and made without clearance from Washington. Which is supported by the fact that the White House later disavowed the statement.

I am not aware of Obama saying anything sympathizing/apologetic as he didn't make that statement you are referencing.

[DenverBrit]

Yeah, Obama has never done anything like this.



Romney is the one who put his foot in mouth, both sides of the aisle can see it. Deflecting to a false equivalency reeks of 'desperation.'

Politicians make asses of themselves often, but as Romney is an unknown quantity and running for POTUS, his responses to a crisis are rightly scrutinized.

He made a mistake trying to play election politics with this tragedy.

[Garcia Bronco]

Now it's supposedly happening in Yemen today.

[DBruleU]

So Obama now admits that we have lost Egypt as an ally. He admits on Telemundo interview that we can no longer consider Egypt a friend.

At this rate, we will have no allies left in the world when Obama leaves office. This guy is great at foreign policy.

[houghtam]

Did you see the statement from the Embassy in Cairo? The POTUS and State Department own those statements.

When a statement surfaced from the U.S. Embassy in Cairo condemning, "the continuing efforts by misguided individuals to hurt the religious feelings of Muslims" and "firmly [rejecting] the actions by those who abuse the universal right of free speech to hurt the religious beliefs of others,"

That's what he was referring to.

And yes, the two incidents are different, but the way you use those incidents to score points is not.

For effs sake...the tornado reference is "shooting first and aiming later.."

You are absolutely correct. Please pay attention to this timeline very closely now.

#1 - At 6:30 am local time on Tuesday, the US Embassy says they "condemn the continuing efforts by misguided individuals to hurt the religious feelings of Muslims and firmly reject the actions by those who abuse the universal right of free speech to hurt the religious beliefs of others."

#2 - Protests begin at 11 am local time on Tuesday.

#3 - At 6:30 pm local time on Tuesday, the US Embassy re-tweets "This morning's condemnation (issued before our protests began) still stands. As does our condemnation of unjustified breach of the Embassy."

#4 - At 9:30 pm, Hillary Clinton releases a statement condemning the attack, http://www.nationaljournal.com/nationalsecurity/hillary-clinton-s-statement-on-the-attack-in-libya-20120912

#5 - At 10:15, Romney releases a statement, “I’m outraged by the attacks on American diplomatic missions in Libya and Egypt and by the death of an American consulate worker in Benghazi. It’s disgraceful that the Obama Administration’s first response was not to condemn attacks on our diplomatic missions, but to sympathize with those who waged the attacks.”

Romney's statement is false. IF you are holding to the notion that the embassy represents the Obama administration and what they say is just like if he said it, their first response was to denounce attacks on other people's religion (like many presidents, including Bush just 6 years ago)...BEFORE the protests even started. Their second response was to stand by their statement (denouncing attacks on other people's religion) AND to say that it was wrong for the embassy to be attacked.

Romney doesn't have one leg to stand on in this issue. He's getting blasted by all sides, and rightly so. What he did was stupid, rash, irrational, and a mere shadow of the foreign policy troubles he would cause. Yes, cause.

How you can give the guy who insulted Great Britain and made a farce out of his visit to Israel the benefit of the doubt on such an idiotic and careless statement is beyond me.

[DBruleU]

You are absolutely correct. Please pay attention to this timeline very closely now.

#1 - At 6:30 am local time on Tuesday, the US Embassy says they "condemn the continuing efforts by misguided individuals to hurt the religious feelings of Muslims and firmly reject the actions by those who abuse the universal right of free speech to hurt the religious beliefs of others."

#2 - Protests begin at 11 am local time on Tuesday.

#3 - At 6:30 pm local time on Tuesday, the US Embassy re-tweets "This morning's condemnation (issued before our protests began) still stands. As does our condemnation of unjustified breach of the Embassy."

#4 - At 9:30 pm, Hillary Clinton releases a statement condemning the attack, http://www.nationaljournal.com/nationalsecurity/hillary-clinton-s-statement-on-the-attack-in-libya-20120912

#5 - At 10:15, Romney releases a statement, “I’m outraged by the attacks on American diplomatic missions in Libya and Egypt and by the death of an American consulate worker in Benghazi. It’s disgraceful that the Obama Administration’s first response was not to condemn attacks on our diplomatic missions, but to sympathize with those who waged the attacks.”

Romney's statement is false. IF you are holding to the notion that the embassy represents the Obama administration and what they say is just like if he said it, their first response was to denounce attacks on other people's religion (like many presidents, including Bush just 6 years ago)...BEFORE the protests even started. Their second response was to stand by their statement (denouncing attacks on other people's religion) AND to say that it was wrong for the embassy to be attacked.

Romney doesn't have one leg to stand on in this issue. He's getting blasted by all sides, and rightly so. What he did was stupid, rash, irrational, and a mere shadow of the foreign policy troubles he would cause. Yes, cause.

How you can give the guy who insulted Great Britain and made a farce out of his visit to Israel the benefit of the doubt on such an idiotic and careless statement is beyond me.

Insulted GB? LOL Ok...I understand your train of thought now. I suppose pointing out the obvious is now insulting these days. His Israel trip seemed to be pretty successful...as well as his visit to Poland. But whatever you say. Having lived in Manchester, ENG for a year I can tell you that the Brits truly do take offense to anything you say. They are sensitive people.

So Romney would cause FP troubles based on what he said....but Obama has actually caused FP troubles by what he has done, or lack there of.

If in fact we are going by the very first statement issued on this whole thing in Cairo, then what Romney said is correct. It wasn't a condemnation...it was an apology. Maybe the administration and the State Department need to reign in whatever intern them have at the helm there in Cairo...because their FIRST response which he was referring to was a joke.

When you're POTUS, what's said by your State Department and Embassy is on you.

[houghtam]

Insulted GB? LOL Ok...I understand your train of thought now. I suppose pointing out the obvious is now insulting these days. His Israel trip seemed to be pretty successful...as well as his visit to Poland. But whatever you say. Having lived in Manchester, ENG for a year I can tell you that the Brits truly do take offense to anything you say. They are sensitive people.

So Romney would cause FP troubles based on what he said....but Obama has actually caused FP troubles by what he has done, or lack there of.

If in fact we are going by the very first statement issued on this whole thing in Cairo, then what Romney said is correct. It wasn't a condemnation...it was an apology. Maybe the administration and the State Department need to reign in whatever intern them have at the helm there in Cairo...because their FIRST response which he was referring to was a joke.

When you're POTUS, what's said by your State Department and Embassy is on you.

Gotcha. Good to know that Romney is the only one who is correct on this, and the people on the left and right who are criticizing him are wrong. Hilarious!

[DBruleU]

Gotcha. Good to know that Romney is the only one who is correct on this, and the people on the left and right who are criticizing him are wrong. Hilarious!

Vice versa! Hilarious!

[TonyR]

"This is the time for us as a nation and a people to stand united,' - Ronald Reagan, Republican candidate, after president Carter's botched mission to save US hostages.

"I unequivocally support the president of the United States -- no ifs, ands or buts -- and it certainly is not a time to try to go one-up politically. He made a difficult, courageous decision," - George H.W. Bush, a candidate at the same time.

And people tell me the GOP hasn't changed.
http://andrewsullivan.thedailybeast.com/2012/09/quotes.html

[houghtam]

"People have a constitutional right to burn a Koran if they want to, but doing so is insensitive and an unnecessary provocation."

- Sarah Palin

"[Burning the Koran] could endanger troops and it could endanger the overall effort," Gen. Petraeus said in an interview. "It is precisely the kind of action the Taliban uses and could cause significant problems. Not just here, but everywhere in the world we are engaged with the Islamic community."

- Gen. David Petraeus

Regarding the cartoons portraying Mohammed with a bomb under his turban:

"We find them offensive, and we certainly understand why Muslims would find these images offensive...anti-Muslim images are as unacceptable as anti-Semitic images...as anti-Christian imagesm or any other religious belief."

- Bush Administration Official Statement

"A central tenet of the administration's foreign policy is the promotion of democracy and human rights, including free speech, in countries where they are lacking. But a core mission of its public diplomacy is to emphasize respect for Islam in the wake of the wars in Iraw and Afghanistan."

- New York Times article in support of Bush's statements







"We condemn the continuing efforts by misguided individuals to hurt the religious feelings of Muslims and firmly reject the actions by those who abuse the universal right of free speech to hurt the religious beliefs of others."

- Tweet from the US Embassy in Libya, hours before the protests even started

Yeah, Romney was correct. Uhh

[bombay]

So when Romney accuses the President of actually sympathizing with extremists who murdered US diplomats that's not incendiary?

Romney took a tweet by a staffer from the Cairo embasssy, made without clearance, 6 hours before the attacks began, and then twisted it to say that [1] it was a response to the attacks and [2] it meant the President agreed with foreignors who killed US citizens. To be fair, since Romney rushed down to smirk his way through a news conference before he knew the full extent of what was happening, he did not that Americans had been killed when he initially made the statement. However, once he learned, he stuck to his guns, so to speak, and renewed his -- Obama is not a true American -- criticism. So basically he lied and accused the President of being a traitor to his country.

I completely understand when if you say that Romney, himself, didn't come out and say something incendiary. It's just as untethered from reality as Romney and his neocon foreign advisors, who have been dreadfully wrong on every foreign matter for the last 12 years.

[DAN_BRONCO_FAN]

Can we just turn the Islamic world into trinitite and call it a day? These a-holes have been doing this to people for 1,400 years. It's time to call a spade a spade. Obama can shove his "don't demean a person's religion" crap. Stating fact is not demeaning anyone; it's stating fact.

Islam is ****.

agree 100% there is btw no such thing at least over in that part of the world moderate Islam oh wait there is moderate is where they beat you to a pulp before they kill you for drawing a picture of Mohammad speaking of mo
http://sassywire.files.wordpress.com/2010/02/mohammed20cartoon20danish-thumb.jpg

[DBruleU]

Regarding the cartoons portraying Mohammed with a bomb under his turban:So?











Yeah, Romney was correct. Uhh

So? I agree...it isn't necessary to provoke Muslims. Did Romney say otherwise?

[houghtam]

agree 100% there is btw no such thing at least over in that part of the world moderate Islam oh wait there is moderate is where they beat you to a pulp before they kill you for drawing a picture of Mohammad speaking of mo
http://sassywire.files.wordpress.com/2010/02/mohammed20cartoon20danish-thumb.jpg

Do you feel better now, you insignificant child?

[houghtam]

So? I agree...it isn't necessary to provoke Muslims. Did Romney say otherwise?

Yes. He said that the embassy was apologizing when they were simply saying exactly the same thing that Bush, Petraeus and Palin said.

If you can't see the similarity between what they said and "We condemn the continuing efforts by misguided individuals to hurt the religious feelings of Muslims and firmly reject the actions by those who abuse the universal right of free speech to hurt the religious beliefs of others," then you are a hopeless partisan with a limited view of the real world.

That is all I will say to you on the subject.

[ant1999e]

Here's a pretty good writeup concerning the man who allegedly produced the film. Looks like he's an Egyptian (Coptic) Christian with a history of aliases (including on Nicola Bacily) and bank fraud. He was also on probation and ordered not to use computers or the internet.

Do people still believe this is a free speech issue?

http://news.yahoo.com/california-man-confirms-role-anti-islam-film-223333645.html

It wasn't a free speech issue, it was a 9-11 anniversary attack issue.

[DenverBrit]

So Obama now admits that we have lost Egypt as an ally. He admits on Telemundo interview that we can no longer consider Egypt a friend.

At this rate, we will have no allies left in the world when Obama leaves office. This guy is great at foreign policy.

Why do you find it necessary to lie when quoting others?? Weren't you one who complained about putting the Muslim Brotherhood in office??

"I don't think we would consider them an ally, but we don't consider them an enemy. They are a new government that is trying to find its way," Mr Obama said in a television interview with Spanish-language network Telemundo.


Jonathan Marcus BBC Diplomatic Correspondent

President Obama's comments serve political purposes at home and abroad. A distancing of Washington from the new order in Egypt will not upset the country's new president whose own political background is in the Muslim Brotherhood camp - highly sceptical of US goals in the region.

Amidst riots outside the US embassy in Cairo, Mr Obama is also signalling, as Emile Hokayem, Senior Fellow for Regional Security at the IISS puts it, that "the US cannot be taken for granted. He is looking for leverage over Egypt, putting the responsibility for moving Egypt forward, firmly on Egypt's own shoulders".

At home, amidst the strident debate of the US presidential election campaign, Mr Obama loses no friends by distancing himself from the Egyptian authorities. There is a pervading sense of fatigue in the US with the Middle East and a growing public feeling that "the Arab world" is somehow ungrateful for US support during the upheavals of the Arab Spring.

[DAN_BRONCO_FAN]

oh dear god im gonna die for posting that but remember islam is the religion of pieces when they blow you up

[DBruleU]

Why do you find it necessary to lie when quoting others?? Weren't you one who complained about putting the Muslim Brotherhood in office??

I didn't lie...what I said was accurate. Egypt is no longer an Ally. At the same time...Israel, another strong ally like Egypt used to be is being pushed to the side by Obama. Hence, at this rate, we will have no allies left when this guy leaves office.

[DAN_BRONCO_FAN]

Do you feel better now, you insignificant child?

http://www.bnp.org.uk/sites/default/files/images/behead_those_who_insult_islam.jpg
no because now the religion of pieces will kill me
odd if i did christ piss so called art the us gov will pay me but for the love of god do not say anything bad about islam or mohammad other wise they all will go bat shat insane and burn down embassies .
hey did you hear the news about the Catholics Baptist Methodist any other christian sect rioting looting any foreign embassies or Spain Portugal or any other christian catholic majority . going ape shat burning any foreign embassies down

[DenverBrit]

I didn't lie...what I said was accurate. Egypt is no longer an Ally. At the same time...Israel, another strong ally like Egypt used to be is being pushed to the side by Obama. Hence, at this rate, we will have no allies left when this guy leaves office.

You're doing it again. Here's what you claim Obama said: we can no longer consider Egypt a friend.


Big difference.

But in light of the Egyptian government's Muslim Brotherhood connection, a public statement that makes sense.

Why do you think it such a diplomatic blunder?

[DAN_BRONCO_FAN]

so let me get this straight its ok to insult Christians and Hindus or any other religion but islam is off limits why is that anyone want to explain why islam is soo special.
is it because they act like Americanized bees aka killer bees and attack at the slightest provocation or noise ?

[DenverBrit]

http://www.bnp.org.uk/sites/default/files/images/behead_those_who_insult_islam.jpg
no because now the religion of pieces will kill me
odd if i did christ piss so called art the us gov will pay me but for the love of god do not say anything bad about islam or mohammad other wise they all will go bat shat insane and burn down embassies .
hey did you hear the news about the Catholics Baptist Methodist any other christian sect rioting looting any foreign embassies or Spain Portugal or any other christian catholic majority . going ape shat burning any foreign embassies down

Do you really want to play the stupid game of which religion is more intolerant?
All religions have fundamentalists who do not represent everyone.

http://angryafrican.files.wordpress.com/2008/11/bigots.jpg?w=510

[DBruleU]

You're doing it again. Here's what you claim Obama said:

Big difference.

But in light of the Egyptian government's Muslim Brotherhood connection, a public statement that makes sense.

Why do you think it such a diplomatic blunder?

Ally = Friend. You can look it up in the dictionary if you want to.

The blunder was unfortunately the Egyptians elected a group that does not view us favorably in the least. The Arab Spring hasn't ended the way Obama wanted it to.

[houghtam]

hey did you hear the news about the Catholics Baptist Methodist any other christian sect rioting looting any foreign embassies or Spain Portugal or any other christian catholic majority . going ape shat burning any foreign embassies down

No, but I did hear the news about Christian Fundamentalists saying gay people should be rounded up and allowed to die. And the news about the Catholics doing everything in their power to cover up the child abuse perpetrated by their priests.

And I lived through the 2000-2008 Christian Fundamentalist takeover-of-the-government-turned-chorus-of-Onward-Christian-Soldiers which cost us thousands of lives and millions of dollars.

And so did you.

[DAN_BRONCO_FAN]

Do you really want to play the stupid game of which religion is more intolerant?
All religions have fundamentalists who do not represent everyone.

http://angryafrican.files.wordpress.com/2008/11/bigots.jpg?w=510

so did westbro fly planes into wtc diud westbro burn down any embassies .
so far all i see is westbro protesting distastefully and making people want to deck them one but no terrorist attacks in the name of Jesus or any christian god.
or did i miss the part where christians hijacked a few planes and flew them into twin towers pentagon and one crashed into the ground in pa.
and i missed the part i guess where the pope called for attacks on the infidels non Christians or even pat " i need money for my new ministry " Robertson
or Jim" i banged a prostitute built a christian themed water park " Baker
dont get me going on tv evangelist whome im shure jesus isnt very fond of seeing jesus preached for free never asked for money to build himself a mansion with a swimming pool but im going off topic.
bottom line is there is no wide spread acts of violence in the name of god or Jesus hell not even the Americanized Islamic people here aint that bat shat crazy, most likely if they tried or anyone law enforcement ie FBI state local police would snuff it out or local citizens would add lead to their heads

[DAN_BRONCO_FAN]

again in short westbro disgusting pos but they dont act violent
islam the ones in Pakistan Afghanistan Egypt Syria all other Islamic dominated countries who aint under the control of a strong government go well ape shat you seen them do it right . or are you blind
i say lets take away their foreign aid to all of em

[DenverBrit]

so did westbro fly planes into wtc diud westbro burn down any embassies .
so far all i see is westbro protesting distastefully and making people want to deck them one but no terrorist attacks in the name of Jesus or any christian god.
or did i miss the part where christians hijacked a few planes and flew them into twin towers pentagon and one crashed into the ground in pa.
and i missed the part i guess where the pope called for attacks on the infidels non Christians or even pat " i need money for my new ministry " Robertson
or Jim" i banged a prostitute built a christian themed water park " Baker
dont get me going on tv evangelist whome im shure jesus isnt very fond of seeing jesus preached for free never asked for money to build himself a mansion with a swimming pool but im going off topic.
bottom line is there is no wide spread acts of violence in the name of god or Jesus hell not even the Americanized Islamic people here aint that bat shat crazy, most likely if they tried or anyone law enforcement ie FBI state local police would snuff it out or local citizens would add lead to their heads

Apparently you did.

<iframe width="480" height="360" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/CSe38dzJYkY?rel=0" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

[DAN_BRONCO_FAN]

No, but I did hear the news about Christian Fundamentalists saying gay people should be rounded up and allowed to die. And the news about the Catholics doing everything in their power to cover up the child abuse perpetrated by their priests.

And I lived through the 2000-2008 Christian Fundamentalist takeover-of-the-government-turned-chorus-of-Onward-Christian-Soldiers which cost us thousands of lives and millions of dollars.

And so did you.

did it happen would we Americans let it happen i think not again islam killed how many now vs christians post force the savages to accept christ or die burn the witch superstitious period that swept the world and the which country ie the big 3 England France Spain can take the most land from indigenous people contest or the viking lets rape pillage the village period too

[DAN_BRONCO_FAN]

Apparently you did.

<iframe width="480" height="360" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/CSe38dzJYkY?rel=0" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

omg i love monty python but if it was making fun of oh say islam they would be beheaded
and why cant south park make fun of Mohammad yet everyone else is fair game
in other words why is their fear of Islam IN THE 21ST CENTURY
again if you drew a pic of Jesus and went to the vatican would you be stoned to death?

[DAN_BRONCO_FAN]

umm did i just hijack this thread and not realize it ?
lil ol me hijacking a thread it isnt possible is it

[DenverBrit]

omg i love monty python but if it was making fun of oh say islam they would be beheaded
and why cant south park make fun of Mohammad yet everyone else is fair game
in other words why is their fear of Islam IN THE 21ST CENTURY
again if you drew a pic of Jesus and went to the vatican would you be stoned to death?

All religion needs to keep up with the times.

Unfortunately, religious fundamentalism is determined to keep their followers in the dark ages.
I can't explain why some Muslims are bent on rabid violence; most Mullahs will tell you they are 'corrupting' the Koran.
I've never read the Koran, so I don't know....but it is an expansionist religion.

Why can't they all adopt the concept of 'magic underwear' and simmer down?

[DAN_BRONCO_FAN]

Apparently you did.

<iframe width="480" height="360" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/CSe38dzJYkY?rel=0" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

FETCH THE COMFY CHAIR !!!!!!!!!!!

[DAN_BRONCO_FAN]

All religion needs to keep up with the times.

Unfortunately, religious fundamentalism is determined to keep their followers in the dark ages.
I can't explain why some Muslims are bent on rabid violence; most Mullahs will tell you they are 'corrupting' the Koran.
I've never read the Koran, so I don't know....but it is an expansionist religion.

Why can't they all adopt the concept of 'magic underwear' and simmer down?

or smoke weed which btw should be legalized which if im not mistaken clinton hinted or let voters think that he would but im off topic here and looks like im semi hijacking this thread lol

[elsid13]

TRIPOLI (Reuters) - Libyan authorities have made four arrests in the investigation into the attack on the U.S. consulate in Benghazi in which the U.S. ambassador and three embassy staff were killed, the deputy interior minister said on Thursday.


"Four men are in custody and we are interrogating them because they are suspected of helping instigate the events at the U.S. consulate," Wanis Sharif told Reuters.
He gave no more details.


U.S. ambassador to Libya Christopher Stevens and three other Americans died after the gunmen attacked the U.S. consulate and a safe house refuge in the eastern city of Benghazi on Tuesday night. The attackers were part of a mob blaming America for a film they said insulted the Prophet Mohammad.


http://news.yahoo.com/libya-makes-arrests-over-deadly-benghazi-attack-official-175308342.html

[TonyR]

Commenting on the ridiculous notion that this picking on poor Mitt Romney is a case of media bias:

The media focused on Mitt Romney yesterday because Mitt Romney asked them to. If he had merely issued a formal statement expressing outrage at the mobs in Cairo and Benghazi, the media would have focused on the aspects of this ongoing story that Erickson finds so interesting — effectively, as Daniel Larison observed via Twitter, it would have done Romney’s work for him. http://www.theamericanconservative.com/blaming-the-media-for-romneys-unforced-error/?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=blaming-the-media-for-romneys-unforced-error

[houghtam]

did it happen would we Americans let it happen i think not

I'm not sure which trailer park you were home-schooled in, but they apparently didn't teach you even the very basics of American History, let alone grammar and punctuation.

Not sure if you heard about this little war we fought oh, about 150 years ago? There was a lot of religious justification for slavery. Read Noah’s Curse: The Biblical Justification of American Slavery, it's got footnotes and quotes and everything, just like your English teacher (or mom) would have liked.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

I'm not sure which trailer park you were home-schooled in, but they apparently didn't teach you even the very basics of American History, let alone grammar and punctuation.


In other words, he's the poster boy for the GOP base. Ha!

[Blart]

http://s3-ec.buzzfed.com/static/enhanced/web05/2012/9/12/16/enhanced-buzz-wide-28244-1347483313-2.jpg

http://s3-ec.buzzfed.com/static/enhanced/web05/2012/9/12/16/enhanced-buzz-wide-24263-1347482806-11.jpg

http://s3-ec.buzzfed.com/static/enhanced/web05/2012/9/12/16/enhanced-buzz-wide-27696-1347483363-5.jpg

http://s3-ec.buzzfed.com/static/enhanced/terminal05/2012/9/12/16/enhanced-buzz-wide-5605-1347482812-15.jpg

http://s3-ec.buzzfed.com/static/enhanced/web05/2012/9/12/17/enhanced-buzz-wide-31401-1347485630-6.jpg

http://s3-ec.buzzfed.com/static/enhanced/terminal05/2012/9/12/16/enhanced-buzz-wide-5606-1347482805-10.jpg

[mhgaffney]

again in short westbro disgusting pos but they dont act violent
islam the ones in Pakistan Afghanistan Egypt Syria all other Islamic dominated countries who aint under the control of a strong government go well ape shat you seen them do it right . or are you blind
i say lets take away their foreign aid to all of em

Why not just stop bombing and attacking them...?

[mhgaffney]

The hate film was produced by a US hard core Zionist -- for the purpose of insulting Muslims. If a person sets out to incite hatred -- he will very likely succeed in at least pissing off people on the other side who are very much like him.

Obviously that happened in this case.

Isn't incitement a hate crime? Don't we have laws against incitement? Evidently the producer of the film has gone into hiding. But is he hiding from US law enforcement- - or from angry Muslims? Not sure which.

MHG


Israeli Filmmaker in Hiding After Deadly Protests

By Associated Press

September 12, 2012 "AP" -- An Israeli filmmaker based in California went into hiding Tuesday after his movie attacking Islam's Prophet Muhammad sparked angry assaults by ultra-conservative Muslims on U.S. missions in Egypt and Libya, where a U.S. ambassador and three other Americans were killed.

Speaking by phone from an undisclosed location, writer and director Sam Bacile remained defiant, saying Islam is a cancer and that the 56-year-old intended his film to be a provocative political statement condemning the religion.

Protesters angered over Bacile's film opened fire on and burned down the U.S. Consulate in the eastern Libyan city of Benghazi, killing U.S. Ambassador Christopher Stevens and three others on Tuesday. In Egypt, protesters scaled the walls of the U.S. Embassy in Cairo and replaced an American flag with an Islamic banner.

"This is a political movie," said Bacile. "The U.S. lost a lot of money and a lot of people in wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, but we're fighting with ideas."

Bacile, a California real estate developer who identifies himself as an Israeli Jew, said he believes the movie will help his native land by exposing Islam's flaws to the world.

"Islam is a cancer, period," he said repeatedly, his solemn voice thickly accented.

The two-hour movie, "Innocence of Muslims," cost $5 million to make and was financed with the help of more than 100 Jewish donors, said Bacile, who wrote and directed it.

The film claims Muhammad was a fraud. An English-language 13-minute trailer on YouTube shows an amateur cast performing a wooden dialogue of insults disguised as revelations about Muhammad, whose obedient followers are presented as a cadre of goons.

It depicts Muhammad as a feckless philanderer who approved of child sexual abuse, among other overtly insulting claims that have caused outrage.

Muslims find it offensive to depict Muhammad in any manner, let alone insult the prophet. A Danish newspaper's 2005 publication of 12 caricatures of the prophet triggered riots in many Muslim countries.

Though Bacile was apologetic about Americans who were killed as a result of the outrage over his film, he blamed lax embassy security and the perpetrators of the violence.

"I feel the security system (at the embassies) is no good," said Bacile. "America should do something to change it."

A consultant on the film, Steve Klein, said the filmmaker is concerned for family members who live in Egypt. Bacile declined to confirm.

Klein said he vowed to help Bacile make the movie but warned him that "you're going to be the next Theo van Gogh." Van Gogh was a Dutch filmmaker killed by a Muslim extremist in 2004 after making a film that was perceived as insulting to Islam.

"We went into this knowing this was probably going to happen," Klein said.

Bacile's film was dubbed into Egyptian Arabic by someone he doesn't know, but he speaks enough Arabic to confirm that the translation is accurate. It was made in three months in the summer of 2011, with 59 actors and about 45 people behind the camera.

The full film has been shown once, to a mostly empty theater in Hollywood earlier this year, said Bacile.

[nyuk nyuk]

Good on those protesters, I hope they aren't persecuted for that. What sect are they from?

One thing about those pictures, though. Where are the men in Islamic dress? Imams? They always show up in hordes when it comes time to burn some flags.

[nyuk nyuk]

In other words, he's the poster boy for the GOP base. Ha!

Check those IQ scores again, brother.

[nyuk nyuk]

The hate film was produced by a US hard core Zionist -- for the purpose of insulting Muslims. If a person sets out to incite hatred -- he will very likely succeed in at least pissing off people on the other side who are very much like him.

Obviously that happened in this case.

Isn't incitement a hate crime? Don't we have laws against incitement? Evidently the producer of the film has gone into hiding. But is he hiding from US law enforcement- - or from angry Muslims? Not sure which.

I don't think speaking the obvious about a religion is either incitement or a hate crime - but then again simply offending certain groups is considered both, as if they have a special right to not be offended which overrides the right of free expression.

There are countless vids on YouTube of people insulting Muslims in every way imaginable, just as there are countless vids there of Muslims insulting everyone else in every way imaginable.

We should not allow Muslim chimpouts to dictate our right to free speech. If we do so we cave in to fear of violence (from a self-declared peaceful religion, no less) and allow theocratic hoodlums dictate our basic rights.

If you wouldn't allow Christians to dictate your right to free speech, why would you let Muslims?

[ant1999e]

The only thing left to do is

[Rigs11]

http://cdn.themoderatevoice.com/wordpress-engine/wp-content/uploads/2012/09/118584_600.jpg

[DenverBrit]

Ally = Friend. You can look it up in the dictionary if you want to.

The blunder was unfortunately the Egyptians elected a group that does not view us favorably in the least. The Arab Spring hasn't ended the way Obama wanted it to.

It's about context. In political terms, a country who is an Ally, is not necessarily a friend....or vice versa. Soviet Union comes to mind. A friend, diplomatically, means we are not at war with them. :)

I'm sure Obama....and the West, would prefer a pro western democracy, without a Muslim Brotherhood history. But we have no control over their election, only how we respond to the outcome.

So what should Obama have said?? We are still allies of Egypt?? I'm not sure what it is you find wrong with his statement, it has been praised by both parties.

The same two parties that have condemned Romney's ignorance. So they must be right.

[houghtam]

It's about context. In political terms, a country who is an Ally, is not necessarily a friend....or vice versa. Soviet Union comes to mind. A friend, diplomatically, means we are not at war with them. :)

I'm sure Obama....and the West, would prefer a pro western democracy, without a Muslim Brotherhood history. But we have no control over their election, only how we respond to the outcome.

So what should Obama have said?? We are still allies of Egypt?? I'm not sure what it is you find wrong with his statement, it has been praised by both parties.

The same two parties that have condemned Romney's ignorance. So they must be right.

LOL another dictionary scholar who doesn't know how to use a dictionary. If "ally = friend, you can even look it up in the dictionary", then the dictionary would read:

al·ly
   noun
1. A friend.

Instead, we open the dictionary, flip to the a's, aaaaaaaaaaaaand...

al·ly
   noun
1. a person, group, or nation that is associated with another or others for some common cause or purpose: Canada and the United States were allies in World War II.
2. Biology . a plant, animal, or other organism bearing an evolutionary relationship to another, often as a member of the same family: The squash is an ally of the watermelon.
3. a person who associates or cooperates with another; supporter.

#priceisrightfailuremusic

And yes, Brit, you're absolutely correct. USSR and the US were allies in WWII. They were not friends. Japan, Germany and Italy were allies in WWII. They were not friends.

Ally =/= friend.

[DenverBrit]

It's pretty basic English, so I didn't need to look up that big word, especially in a political context. ;)

[nyuk nyuk]

All religion needs to keep up with the times.

Unfortunately, religious fundamentalism is determined to keep their followers in the dark ages.
I can't explain why some Muslims are bent on rabid violence; most Mullahs will tell you they are 'corrupting' the Koran.
I've never read the Koran, so I don't know....but it is an expansionist religion.

Why can't they all adopt the concept of 'magic underwear' and simmer down?

That would mean loosening values to accommodate lefty social movements. I don't think they should do that. Certainly the political left have never been asked to truncate their belief system to accommodate the religious.

If you can't explain why some Muslims are bent on violence... Perhaps you'd find that answer by reading some Quran? The expansionism and violence begin within it.

[houghtam]

Interesting.

I don't have the links quite yet, but several news sources are now reporting that there was a peaceful protest outside the gates to the embassy. Then a 4 car caravan pulling up with black Islamic flags and heavily armed occupants rolls down the street, busts through the gates, and goes through all four single-story buildings in the compound, shooting the place up.

NPR is reporting "A lot of the witnesses that we've spoken to — neighbors, the son of the landlord, a Libyan guard who was wounded during the first part of the attack on Tuesday night — all say there was no protest at all," Leila reports. "They say that it began as an organized attack on the consulate."

http://www.npr.org/blogs/thetwo-way/2012/09/13/161111082/was-the-american-consulate-attack-in-benghazi-planned

More later.

[nyuk nyuk]

http://cdn.themoderatevoice.com/wordpress-engine/wp-content/uploads/2012/09/118584_600.jpg

Did the cartoonist run out of brown ink?

[nyuk nyuk]

Interesting.

I don't have the links quite yet, but several news sources are now reporting that there was a peaceful protest outside the gates to the embassy. Then a 4 car caravan pulling up with black Islamic flags and heavily armed occupants rolls down the street, busts through the gates, and goes through all four single-story buildings in the compound, shooting the place up.

NPR is reporting "A lot of the witnesses that we've spoken to — neighbors, the son of the landlord, a Libyan guard who was wounded during the first part of the attack on Tuesday night — all say there was no protest at all," Leila reports. "They say that it began as an organized attack on the consulate."

http://www.npr.org/blogs/thetwo-way/2012/09/13/161111082/was-the-american-consulate-attack-in-benghazi-planned

More later.

This is not new, but unfortunately the media asses are choosing to hype the YouTube BS.

9-11 anniversary. It's not hard to piece together.

Further - it was reported that threats were known specifically to that area, and yet these men were left in a consulate with little security.

This is scandalous as all hell.

[DenverBrit]

That would mean loosening values to accommodate lefty social movements. I don't think they should do that. Certainly the political left have never been asked to truncate their belief system to accommodate the religious.

If you can't explain why some Muslims are bent on violence... Perhaps you'd find that answer by reading some Quran? The expansionism and violence begin within it.

Ok, I can't begin to respond to your first paragraph........because it makes no sense. Unless you think fundamentalism is some kind of far right wing movement.

As for your second, are you claiming that all Muslims are terrorists and favor violence?? I have already acknowledge that Islam is expansionist, however, only 'fundamentalists' follow those archaic extremes.
Much like Christian 'fundamentalist' who's beliefs are rooted in the literal adherence to the Old Testament.

Again, Fundamentalism keeps its adherents in the dark ages.........actually, long before.

[nyuk nyuk]

Ok, I can't begin to respond to your first paragraph........because it makes no sense. Unless you think fundamentalism is some kind of far right wing movement.

As for your second, are you claiming that all Muslims are terrorists and favor violence?? I have already acknowledge that Islam is expansionist, however, only 'fundamentalists' follow those archaic extremes.
Much like Christian 'fundamentalist' who's beliefs are rooted in the literal adherence to the Old Testament.

Again, Fundamentalism keeps its adherents in the dark ages.........actually, long before.

It makes perfect sense when you consider that "keeping up with the times" often involves internalizing secular liberal humanistic values and generally leading a lifestyle of hyperindividualist impulse-driven narcissism. I don't think religions should be caving in to garbage like this, yet at least to a degree that's exactly what some are doing, even if that means not being faithful to scriptures. There are plenty of ways in which religion (mainstream, at least) has a solid and appropriate foundation for societal stability, but unfortunately all too often narcissism is so strong in people that they react knee-jerk fashion to anything that asks for self-sacrifice, putting off gratification, or calls for traditional forms of civic duty.

Extremism can come from either direction, and they're both a danger. Though in the Western world, fundamentalist Christian views are obviously nowhere near as dangerous as Islamic ones, and in my opinion, are overall more healthy for society than secular humanism. I think the Islamic world could benefit greatly by being evangelized by Christians and it would help stem the problem of violent Jihad.

Clearly there are shades of violence within Islam, but I believe that Western apologists overstate the numbers of Muslims (especially in the Islamic world) who are more modernized and against terrorist activity. I'd also point out that there are more pacifistic Muslims who are persecuted to the point of violence by other Muslims for heresy - in part due to their unorthodox views on Jihad. The Ahmadiyya sect are among them.

Safe to say that if a religion allows "apostates" within it to be slaughtered, then reasonable expectations of behavior with outsiders are pretty much thrown out the window. On that account alone, to me the problem becomes Islam itself. Part of the problem is that the concept of modernization is tied to Westernization, and that's going to breed hostility.

In the Islamic world, obviously the atmosphere is very repressive. The question for us in modern times is that is the Islamic religion not this extremist, or is it merely that we're not seeing so many outbursts of this extremism due to Islam's weak military position in the world and thus the general unwillingness of the Muslims in more numbers of stick their necks out and participate? In times past, certainly, when Islam had the upper hand, they marched from West Africa to South Asia, and had volunteers all too willingly line up for loot and booty. Islamic terrorist activity and other forms of religious strife with other groups have gone on Asia for a very long time. Imagine what it would be like there if Muslims found themselves in political control there. I think we'd pretty much see a repeat of history."

[ant1999e]

Interesting.

I don't have the links quite yet, but several news sources are now reporting that there was a peaceful protest outside the gates to the embassy. Then a 4 car caravan pulling up with black Islamic flags and heavily armed occupants rolls down the street, busts through the gates, and goes through all four single-story buildings in the compound, shooting the place up.

NPR is reporting "A lot of the witnesses that we've spoken to — neighbors, the son of the landlord, a Libyan guard who was wounded during the first part of the attack on Tuesday night — all say there was no protest at all," Leila reports. "They say that it began as an organized attack on the consulate."

http://www.npr.org/blogs/thetwo-way/2012/09/13/161111082/was-the-american-consulate-attack-in-benghazi-planned

More later.

It wasn't the movie, it was an organized 9-11 anniversary attack. I wouldn't be surprised it the movie was part of the plan.

[ghwk]

TRIPOLI (Reuters) - Libyan authorities have made four arrests in the investigation into the attack on the U.S. consulate in Benghazi in which the U.S. ambassador and three embassy staff were killed, the deputy interior minister said on Thursday.


"Four men are in custody and we are interrogating them because they are suspected of helping instigate the events at the U.S. consulate," Wanis Sharif told Reuters.
He gave no more details.


U.S. ambassador to Libya Christopher Stevens and three other Americans died after the gunmen attacked the U.S. consulate and a safe house refuge in the eastern city of Benghazi on Tuesday night. The attackers were part of a mob blaming America for a film they said insulted the Prophet Mohammad.


http://news.yahoo.com/libya-makes-arrests-over-deadly-benghazi-attack-official-175308342.html

The only thing I know for sure is those four guys are having their skin peeled off a layer at a time.

[barryr]

Apparently that embassy was warned well ahead of time of a possible attack, but not much was done to prepare for it, if anything. If this was Bush, the media in a frenzy. It's Obama, so time to change the subject.

[lonestar]

I don't think speaking the obvious about a religion is either incitement or a hate crime - but then again simply offending certain groups is considered both, as if they have a special right to not be offended which overrides the right of free expression.

There are countless vids on YouTube of people insulting Muslims in every way imaginable, just as there are countless vids there of Muslims insulting everyone else in every way imaginable.

We should not allow Muslim chimpouts to dictate our right to free speech. If we do so we cave in to fear of violence (from a self-declared peaceful religion, no less) and allow theocratic hoodlums dictate our basic rights.

If you wouldn't allow Christians to dictate your right to free speech, why would you let Muslims?

well said, :thumbs:

but way beyond their means to process it.. why bother?

[Smiling Assassin27]

President sworn to uphold Constitution (yes, including the 1st amendment) goes the other way:

Richard Grenell ‏@RichardGrenell
NPR just reported that the "White House asked YouTube to pull down the film"

[houghtam]

President sworn to uphold Constitution (yes, including the 1st amendment) goes the other way:

Asked?

[ant1999e]

This reminds me of my favorite Southpark episode. Appeasement at the cost of freedom isnt the solution.

The President should not ask Youtube to do anything. If they want to take it down, it's on them but pressure from the Pres isn't cool.

The movie is not the real cause of any of this. It's just an excuse. These people love to hate us. And in the case of Libya, that was a calculated attack from a terrorist organization.

[ant1999e]

The only thing I know for sure is those four guys are having their skin peeled off a layer at a time.

And they're probably just scapegoats...

[DBruleU]

This reminds me of my favorite Southpark episode. Appeasement at the cost of freedom isnt the solution.

The President should not ask Youtube to do anything. If they want to take it down, it's on them but pressure from the Pres isn't cool.

The movie is not the real cause of any of this. It's just an excuse. These people love to hate us. And in the case of Libya, that was a calculated attack from a terrorist organization.

Yup.

We keep trying to pinpoint things that we can eliminate in order to appease them and try and make them like us. It won't happen. It's two completely different world views at odds here. That will never change and they will never be happy until the entire world is Islamic.

[DenverBrit]

This reminds me of my favorite Southpark episode. Appeasement at the cost of freedom isnt the solution.

The President should not ask Youtube to do anything. If they want to take it down, it's on them but pressure from the Pres isn't cool.

The movie is not the real cause of any of this. It's just an excuse. These people love to hate us. And in the case of Libya, that was a calculated attack from a terrorist organization.

Which one?

[Smiling Assassin27]

<iframe src='http://widget.newsinc.com/single.html?WID=1&VID=23809494&freewheel=69016&sitesection=breitbartprivate' height='320' width='425' scrolling='no' frameborder='0' marginwidth='0' marginheight='0'></iframe>

[ant1999e]

Which one?

Come on kid.

[DenverBrit]

Come on kid.

Kid? No, I kid you not.

Was the question too difficult?

If it was a terrorist organization, which one?? I'm interested.

[ant1999e]

Kid? No, I kid you not.

Was the question too difficult?

If it was a terrorist organization, which one?? I'm interested.

Islamic Order of Djabutie Stan Ques.

[DenverBrit]

Islamic Order of Djabutie Stan Ques.

So you don't know. Ok.

[ant1999e]

So you don't know. Ok.

I like how you changed what you said...

[DenverBrit]

I like how you changed what you said...

I enjoyed your change too.

[Mecklomaniac]

During the assault on the U.S. embassy in Egypt, demonstrators reportedly chanted “Obama! Obama! We are all Osama!” They yelled this obvious reference to Osama bin Laden as an al Qaeda-style flag was hoisted and the American flag brought down. At least one of the protesters at the anti-American rally knows a thing or two about al Qaeda: Mohammed al Zawahiri, who is the younger brother of al Qaeda’s emir, Ayman al Zawahiri.

http://www.weeklystandard.com/blogs/zawahiris-brother-cairo-embassy-assault_652217.html

[DenverBrit]

3:46 PM – Today
What Was Really Behind The Benghazi Attack?

Writing in the New Yorker, Hisham Matar argues that the attack on the U.S. embassy in Libya was not motivated by the anti-Islam film making waves around the world.

No specific group claimed responsibility for the attack, which was well orchestrated and involved heavy weapons. It is thought to be the work of an extremist faction who, like the Salafis, are willing to use force to exact their will. These groups have perpetrated other similar assaults in Benghazi and elsewhere in Libya. They are utlra-religious, authoritarian groups who justify their actions through selective, corrupt, and ultimately self-serving interpretations of Islam. Under Qaddafi, they kept quiet. In the early days of the revolution some of them claimed that fighting Qaddafi was un-Islamic and conveniently issued a fatwa demanding full obedience to the ruler. This is Libya’s extreme right. And, while much is still uncertain, Tuesday’s attack appears to have been their attempt to escalate a strategy they have employed ever since the Libyan revolution overthrew Colonel Qaddafi’s dictatorship. They see in these days, in which the new Libya and its young institutions are still fragile, an opportunity to grab power. They want to exploit the impatient resentments of young people in particular in order to disrupt progress and the development of democratic institutions.
http://huff.to/R6mQOS

[ant1999e]

3:46 PM – Today
What Was Really Behind The Benghazi Attack?

Writing in the New Yorker, Hisham Matar argues that the attack on the U.S. embassy in Libya was not motivated by the anti-Islam film making waves around the world.


http://huff.to/R6mQOS

You mean it wasn't about the cartoon???

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

Here's hoping these sh*t stains meet the same fate as Bin Laden.

[DenverBrit]

You mean it wasn't about the cartoon???

What cartoon??

Put the mushrooms down and step away! :)

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

What cartoon??

Put the mushrooms down and step away! :)

But "yew posted a cartoon!" is one of the only "rebuttals" he knows.

[ant1999e]

What cartoon??

Put the mushrooms down and step away! :)

I meant movie but I won't change what I posted.

[DenverBrit]

I meant movie but I won't change what I posted.

Hey, all I asked was if you knew which terror group staged the attack.

It seemed like a simple question.

The answer is: "I don't know."

[ant1999e]

Hey, all I asked was if you knew which terror group staged the attack.

It seemed like a simple question.

The answer is: "I don't know."

Of course I don't. But why did you change your response?

[DAN_BRONCO_FAN]

Apparently that embassy was warned well ahead of time of a possible attack, but not much was done to prepare for it, if anything. If this was Bush, the media in a frenzy. It's Obama, so time to change the subject.

its bushes fault yeah that always work or evil republicans fault its not obamas fault http://guyism.com/wp-content/uploads/officerBarbrady1.gif

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

its bushes fault yeah that always work or evil republicans fault its not obamas fault move along now nothing to see here


If we listen to people like you, Bush was never at fault for anything.

[DenverBrit]

Of course I don't. But why did you change your response?

What was my original response?

[DAN_BRONCO_FAN]

If we listen to people like you, Bush was never at fault for anything.

again its time to stop blaming bush for everything its been 4 years he spent alont obama took over and threw the lever into overdrive mode so think its time to stop makin scapegoats and man up man up to fast and furious screw up that got a boarder agent killed man up to lack of security that got men killed in the embassy in Libya

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

again its time to stop blaming bush for everything its been 4 years he spent alont obama took over and threw the lever into overdrive mode so think its time to stop makin scapegoats and man up man up to fast and furious screw up that got a boarder agent killed man up to lack of security that got men killed in the embassy in Libya

Still giving your hero GeeDubya a pass for his total evisceration of the U.S. economy, eh?

Speaking of which, it took Clinton two terms to fix the mess he inherited from Saint Ron and Poppy, and the mess Bill inherited was small potatoes by comparison.

And still peddling that "fast and furious" disinfo? For shame! tsk tsk

In any event, you're clearly just another barely-literate sheep who gets his "facts" from Rush Limbaugh and Glenn Beck, so I'll take anything you might have to say with several large grains of salt.

[ant1999e]

You guys keep talking about bullshyt...

[DAN_BRONCO_FAN]

<iframe src='http://widget.newsinc.com/single.html?WID=1&VID=23809494&freewheel=69016&sitesection=breitbartprivate' height='320' width='425' g='no' frameborder='0' marginwidth='0' marginheight='0'> </iframe>

i lean toward the conservative side but I DO NOT LIKE AUTO PLAY ADS DAMMIT i was goin thru my pc tryin to find that anoying bug that kept doin that crap turns out its you sneaky b-tard not amused

[DAN_BRONCO_FAN]

Still giving your hero GeeDubya a pass for his total evisceration of the U.S. economy, eh?

Speaking of which, it took Clinton two terms to fix the mess he inherited from Saint Ron and Poppy, and the mess Bill inherited was small potatoes by comparison.

And still peddling that "fast and furious" disinfo? For shame! tsk tsk

In any event, you're clearly just another barely-literate sheep who gets his "facts" from Rush Limbaugh and Glenn Beck, so I'll take anything you might have to say with several large grains of salt.

so fast and furious was bushes fault or is it all just a dream just a dream

[ant1999e]

i lean toward the conservative side but I DO NOT LIKE AUTO PLAY ADS DAMMIT i was goin thru my pc tryin to find that anoying bug that kept doin that crap turns out its you sneaky b-tard not amused

This, the shyt is pissing me off.

[mhgaffney]

As usual PCR's latest is on target.

I do not own a TV -- but if he's right that the press is reporting that the ongoing anti US protests were caused by a Hollywood movie -- then truly we have entered Never Never Land.

MHG

Libya: 'Death to America'

By Paul Craig Roberts

September 17, 2012 "Information Clearing House" - September Try to imagine more deluded reporting than this by America’s Presstitute "free press." For 11 years Washington in pursuit of its rightful hegemony has been sending troops, bombers, jet fighters, helicopter gunships, drones, and assassination teams into seven Muslim countries. Two of the Muslim countries, Iraq and Libya, and perhaps more depending on how you see it, have been overthrown by Washington and left in chaos.

Washington’s assaults on seven countries have blown up weddings, funerals, kids’ soccer games, farm houses, hospitals, aid workers, schools, people walking along the streets, village elders, but the Muslims don’t mind! They understand that the well-meaning Americans who love them and are committed to their human rights, are bringing them democracy and women’s rights. The million or more dead, maimed, and displaced Muslims are a low price to be paid for liberation by Washington.

The Muslims understand that liberation has costs and were content with Washington’s liberating violence until some idiot in California produced an anti-Islamic film. This film, and not Washington’s predations, set the Muslim world alive with "hate America."

On the symbolic date of September 11, the US ambassador to Libya and some other Washington representatives were assassinated in Libya. According to the Presstitute media, the assassins did not kill the Americans because Washington destroyed their country and left them in chaos. The assassins killed the Americans because of an anti-Islamic film for which the murdered American representatives were not responsible.

This is the way Washington works and thinks. It is not Washington’s slaughter of Muslims and control over their societies and political life that produces blowback. It is independent film-makers in California!

Deluded politicians in Washington, both Republicans and Democrats and, of course, the bought-and-paid-for "experts," brought these forceful rejections of America upon us all. Washington has not only attacked Muslim countries on the basis of concocted lies – weapons of mass destruction, al Qaeda connections, brutal dictators – but also destroyed the secular governments who held the Islamists in check, and prevented their attacks on US representatives and institutions.

In Egypt, long an American puppet states, the US Embassy was stormed and the US flag was torn apart. If only this was all. Washington could again purchase the Egyptian government, as it has since Anwar Sadat’s assassination. But the ongoing news is that Anti-American protests are not only spreading across the Middle East but erupting throughout the world: Morocco, Sudan, Tunisia, Iraq, Yemen, Iran, Gaza, Bangladesh, Lebanon, London, and even into Israel.

The Obama administration is blaming al Qaeda, an Islamist group that the administration is currently supporting in its efforts to overthrow the secular Assad government in Syria and the group that the Obama administration used to overthrow the Libyan government, thus leaving a power vacuum in its place. Having destroyed the protection from Islamist attacks that secular Arab rulers provided Washington, Obama, in a show of force, has sent drones, aircraft carriers, Marines, and Tomahawk missile ships to Libya, raising the prospect that more schools and children's soccer games will be mistaken for jihadi encampments and blown up.

Attempting to politicize the turmoil, Presidential candidate Mitt Romney declared that the US needed him in the White House and as president he would provide "…the leadership that America respects and will keep us admired throughout the world."

What admiration is Romney talking about? Who are the admirers? In Egypt Muslims marching to the beat of "death to America," have not been deterred by police after three days of protests. CBS reports that "Police continue to fire tear gas in hopes it will deplete the strength of the demonstrators but they [the demonstrators] are proving relentless."

Kings Good, Dictators Bad! Unlike the Washington-supported Saudi royal family that absorbs most of their nation’s oil income, Qaddafi allocated the oil money to Libyans. In Cynthia McKinney’s excellent book, The Illegal War On Libya, Stephen Lendman writes that Qaddafi "wanted Libyans to share in the country’s oil wealth, a notion foreign to America and other Western societies. Under his 1999 Decision No. 111, all Libyans received free healthcare, education, electricity, water, training, rehabilitation, housing assistance, disability, old-age benefits, interest-free state loans, as well as generous subsidies to study abroad, buy a new car, help when they marry, practically free gasoline, and more."

Why did such a relatively wealthy and egalitarian country need to be "liberated" by Washington and its NATO war criminal puppet state?

What was achieved by overthrowing a government that provided for its people in better ways than do Western governments for the people they govern?

The US is the new Rome, and Europe, the UK, Canada, Japan, and Australia are its tributary dominions along with the oil kingdoms.

In his book, Rubicon, Tom Holland describes what it is like to be a dominion of a powerful and ruthless military state:

"Prior to the cataclysms of B.C. 146, there had been some confusion as to the precise definition of ‘freedom.’ When the Romans claimed to be guaranteeing it, what did this mean? ... Roman and Greek interpretations of ‘freedom’ diverged. To the Romans … freedom meant an opportunity for the city states to follow rules laid down by Roman commissioners."

This is the "freedom" that Washington imposes on the world. Washington is the übermensch. The rest of the world is Washington’s playground. Ruling as Rome did, Washington installs puppets and relies on their obeisance.

In the end, empire destroys itself. Washington’s hubris and arrogance is turning the world against America. Thanks to The Clintons, the Bushes, Cheney, Obama and the neoconservatives, America, instead of being loved or even respected, is hated with a rising passion. The widespread attacks on the imperial power’s embassies are only the beginning.

As Gerald Celente had forecast, "The 1st Great War of the 21st Century" has begun.

Paul Craig Roberts was Assistant Secretary of the Treasury for Economic Policy and associate editor of the Wall Street Journal. He was columnist for Business Week, Scripps Howard News Service, and Creators Syndicate. He has had many university appointments. His internet columns have attracted a worldwide following. www.paulcraigroberts.org/

This article was originally posted at Trends Journal

Via LewRockwell.com

[barryr]

And Obama stated the world would see America in a different light and like us more with him as president. Yeah, sure looks like it. More like they see America as weak and this admin. continues to give mixed messages to our once solid allies.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

And Obama stated the world would see America in a different light and like us more with him as president. Yeah, sure looks like it. More like they see America as weak and this admin. continues to give mixed messages to our once solid allies.

::)

Yeah, because, as a Bush cheerleader, you have SO much credibility on presidents and how they influence world opinion re: America.

http://www.bartcop.com/red-states-poor.jpg

[lonestar]

And Obama stated the world would see America in a different light and like us more with him as president. Yeah, sure looks like it. More like they see America as weak and this admin. continues to give mixed messages to our once solid allies.

yep it was HOPE and change alright..

[DenverBrit]

And Obama stated the world would see America in a different light and like us more with him as president. Yeah, sure looks like it. More like they see America as weak and this admin. continues to give mixed messages to our once solid allies.

Which speech??

As for 'weak,' based upon what? Who did we refuse to invade this time??

[DenverBrit]

yep it was HOPE and change alright..

Yeah. Bush was so much better!

[ant1999e]

Kid? No, I kid you not.

Was the question too difficult?

If it was a terrorist organization, which one?? I'm interested.

Al Qaeda...

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/09/19/top-administration-official-says-strike-in-libya-was-terror-attack/

Intelligence sources tell Fox News they are convinced the deadly attack on the U.S. Consulate in Benghazi, Libya, was directly tied to Al Qaeda -- with a former Guantanamo detainee involved.
That revelation comes on the same day a top Obama administration official called last week's deadly assault a "terrorist attack" -- the first time the attack has been described that way by the administration after claims it had been a "spontaneous" act.
"Yes, they were killed in the course of a terrorist attack on our embassy," Matt Olsen, director of the National Counterterrorism Center, said during a Senate hearing Wednesday. cont...

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

https://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/230450_532468513445331_1553437239_n.jpg

[ant1999e]

Not even worth a response LABF. Your pathetic.

[lonestar]

Not even worth a response LABF. Your pathetic.

put the moron in IGGY and you never have to see his pathetic cartoons again..

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

Not even worth a response LABF. Your pathetic.

Thanks for letting me know the message was right on target. :welcome:

Right-wing hypocrites like you look to fault Obama's handling of foreign policy issues while clamoring to replace him with a seasoned, foreign policy genius like Romney...? L0L! Ha!

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

put the moron in IGGY and you never have to see his pathetic cartoons again..but I still go on reading and responding to his posts anyway...I just can't help myself.....you might say I'm obsessed!

Fixed.

[ant1999e]

Al Qaeda...

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/09/19/top-administration-official-says-strike-in-libya-was-terror-attack/

Intelligence sources tell Fox News they are convinced the deadly attack on the U.S. Consulate in Benghazi, Libya, was directly tied to Al Qaeda -- with a former Guantanamo detainee involved.
That revelation comes on the same day a top Obama administration official called last week's deadly assault a "terrorist attack" -- the first time the attack has been described that way by the administration after claims it had been a "spontaneous" act.
"Yes, they were killed in the course of a terrorist attack on our embassy," Matt Olsen, director of the National Counterterrorism Center, said during a Senate hearing Wednesday. cont...

Nothing from the peanut gallery? Al Qaeda attacked our embassy and nobody has anything to say?

[DenverBrit]

Nothing from the peanut gallery? Al Qaeda attacked our embassy and nobody has anything to say?

I imagine everyone who is following the story has read the headlines and their suspicions confirmed.

Now that a group with affiliations to Al Qaeda is suspected, we can expect more details.

What else is there to say that hasn't been said? Think drones?

[DAN_BRONCO_FAN]

https://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/230450_532468513445331_1553437239_n.jpg

but obama is president why jobs keep going there ? why does Hollywood film most of its shows and outside scenes in Canada ?
4 years jobs are going over seas why is that.
can the president control who sends jobs where ?
why cant the president go oh hey if you keep your jobs in the us ill cut you a break in taxes?
if you hire more people ill cut you another break.
see im not the president and yet i just solved the problem
also why wont unions stop donating to politicians ?
why did the us gov allow guns to be sold to Mexican drug lords or whoever ?
i would take hillary at this point matter of fact if the democrats want to really make shure they would win switch obama with hillary at the last minute.!Booya!

[DAN_BRONCO_FAN]

short and simple i want answers and the truth oh and a Lombardi . manning if the refs would learn to ref bring us one gov sucks no matter who anyways refs suck life sucks lol

[ant1999e]

http://www.examiner.com/article/house-administration-denied-repeated-requests-for-extra-security-benghazi

House: Administration denied 'repeated requests' for extra security in Benghazi

In a letter sent to Secretary of State Hillary Clinton on Tuesday, Reps. Darrell Issa (R-CA) and Jason Chaffetz (R-UT) said that repeated requests for additional security in Libya were denied, despite numerous attacks against the consulate.

“Based on information provided to the Committee by individuals with direct knowledge of events in Libya, the attack that claimed the ambassador’s life was the latest in a long line of attacks on Western diplomats and officials in Libya in the months leading up to September 11, 2012,” Rep. Issa wrote.

“In addition, multiple U.S. federal government officials have confirmed to the Committee that, prior to the September 11 attack, the U.S. mission in Libya made repeated requests for increased security in Benghazi,” they added.

“The mission in Libya, however, was denied these resources by officials in Washington.”

The letter spells out 13 separate attacks on or near the compound between April and September. The consulate was attacked and burned on September 11, killing Ambassador Chris Stevens and three other Americans.

"Put together," the letter says, "these events indicated a clear pattern of security threats that could only be reasonably interpreted to justify increased security for U.S. personnel and facilities in Benghazi."

According to the Associated Press, Rep. Chaffetz said there were over 50 incidents.

"Two of them involved explosive devices: a June 6 blast that blew a hole in the security perimeter. The explosion was described to the committee as 'big enough for forty men to go through'; and an April 6 incident where two Libyans who were fired by a security contractor threw a small explosive device over the consulate fence," the AP reported.

State Department spokeswoman Victoria Nuland refused to answer questions on requests for extra security, but said that Clinton received the letter on Tuesday and will reply the same day. The AP said that she "insisted that the department intends to cooperate fully with Congress."

"We share the same goal," she told reporters. "We want to get to the bottom of precisely what happened and learn any lessons that we need to learn from it. We're taking this very, very seriously."

A post at Townhall says that Ambassador Stevens was also concerned about security and made note of it in the journal a CNN crew found in the burned consulate.

"CNN says Stevens wrote about his fears of constant threats -- threats, incidentally, that the Obama administration has downplayed or flat-out denied," Guy Benson wrote.

ABC News reported that White house Press Secretary Jay Carney declined to discuss the issue.

“I’m not going to get into a situation under review by the State Department and the FBI,” he said.

Hot Air's Ed Morrissey minced no words in his criticism of the administration:

The White House and State Department were asleep at the switch before the 9/11 anniversary attack, and they’ve been lying ever since about the circumstances behind it, too.

[lonestar]

http://www.examiner.com/article/house-administration-denied-repeated-requests-for-extra-security-benghazi

House: Administration denied 'repeated requests' for extra security in Benghazi

In a letter sent to Secretary of State Hillary Clinton on Tuesday, Reps. Darrell Issa (R-CA) and Jason Chaffetz (R-UT) said that repeated requests for additional security in Libya were denied, despite numerous attacks against the consulate.

“Based on information provided to the Committee by individuals with direct knowledge of events in Libya, the attack that claimed the ambassador’s life was the latest in a long line of attacks on Western diplomats and officials in Libya in the months leading up to September 11, 2012,” Rep. Issa wrote.

“In addition, multiple U.S. federal government officials have confirmed to the Committee that, prior to the September 11 attack, the U.S. mission in Libya made repeated requests for increased security in Benghazi,” they added.

“The mission in Libya, however, was denied these resources by officials in Washington.”

The letter spells out 13 separate attacks on or near the compound between April and September. The consulate was attacked and burned on September 11, killing Ambassador Chris Stevens and three other Americans.

"Put together," the letter says, "these events indicated a clear pattern of security threats that could only be reasonably interpreted to justify increased security for U.S. personnel and facilities in Benghazi."

According to the Associated Press, Rep. Chaffetz said there were over 50 incidents.

"Two of them involved explosive devices: a June 6 blast that blew a hole in the security perimeter. The explosion was described to the committee as 'big enough for forty men to go through'; and an April 6 incident where two Libyans who were fired by a security contractor threw a small explosive device over the consulate fence," the AP reported.

State Department spokeswoman Victoria Nuland refused to answer questions on requests for extra security, but said that Clinton received the letter on Tuesday and will reply the same day. The AP said that she "insisted that the department intends to cooperate fully with Congress."

"We share the same goal," she told reporters. "We want to get to the bottom of precisely what happened and learn any lessons that we need to learn from it. We're taking this very, very seriously."

A post at Townhall says that Ambassador Stevens was also concerned about security and made note of it in the journal a CNN crew found in the burned consulate.

"CNN says Stevens wrote about his fears of constant threats -- threats, incidentally, that the Obama administration has downplayed or flat-out denied," Guy Benson wrote.

ABC News reported that White house Press Secretary Jay Carney declined to discuss the issue.

“I’m not going to get into a situation under review by the State Department and the FBI,” he said.

Hot Air's Ed Morrissey minced no words in his criticism of the administration:

The White House and State Department were asleep at the switch before the 9/11 anniversary attack, and they’ve been lying ever since about the circumstances behind it, too.

so it seems most not with their heads up their rectums called this correct.. failure by the white house and the State Department (who reports to the white house) to supply them with security..

Go figure..

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

^

Gotta chuckle when I read this kind of sh*t from a cheerleader for an administration that failed to act in advance of 9/11.

Security failures don't get much worse than that, but for some reason you seem to believe you have some sort of moral high ground here.

[ant1999e]

^

Gotta chuckle when I read this kind of sh*t from a cheerleader for an administration that failed to act in advance of 9/11.

Security failures don't get much worse than that, but for some reason you seem to believe you have some sort of moral high ground here.

Is it hard to read while covering your eyes?

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

Is it hard to read while covering your eyes?

You should ask your pal lonestar - he's the clown who continues to respond to my posts when he has me on ignore.

In any event, no eye-covering required to note right-wing hypocrisy when it comes to security matters.

[Mecklomaniac]

<div style="background-color:#000000;width:520px;"><div style="padding:4px;"><iframe src="http://media.mtvnservices.com/embed/mgid:cms:video:thedailyshow.com:419660" width="512" height="288" frameborder="0"></iframe><p style="text-align:left;background-color:#FFFFFF;padding:4px;margin-top:4px;margin-bottom:0px;font-family:Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;font-size:12px;"><b><a href="http://www.thedailyshow.com/watch/mon-october-1-2012/american-terror-story">The Daily Show</a></b><br/>Get More: <a href='http://www.thedailyshow.com/full-episodes/'>Daily Show Full Episodes</a>,<a href='http://www.indecisionforever.com/'>Political Humor & Satire Blog</a>,<a href='http://www.facebook.com/thedailyshow'>The Daily Show on Facebook</a></p></div></div>


When you've lost John Stewart...... “Two things, apparently, have become clear. The attack on our embassy was planned and coordinated. The response to it– eh, not so much.”

[DAN_BRONCO_FAN]

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When you've lost John Stewart...... “Two things, apparently, have become clear. The attack on our embassy was planned and coordinated. The response to it– eh, not so much.”

say wasnt some or most of the posters here blaming the obscure you tube video and not calling this what it is attack on Americans on the 11th anniversary of 9-11 . they just happen to have rocket launchers and rpg sitting around this was totally spontaneous.
then again we had to go meddle in another countries internal affairs wish the us would stop doing that. now every idiot in that country has military grade weapons .

[barryr]

No question the liberals wanted to believe killing bin laden meant terrorism is over, but they are the last ones to understand the terrorists just find a replacement and keep on going. The narrative is ruined if they have to admit it was a planned attack, but only a complete fool believed people just happen to have advanced weaponry laying around or in their pockets to have a "spontaneous" demonstration and attack. News to the liberals: the terrorists don't like America anymore with Obama as president as they did before or I should restate maybe they do since they can spot a weak leader when they see one. A president who is scared and refuses to call terrorism just that, isn't much of a leader.

[lonestar]

No question the liberals wanted to believe killing bin laden meant terrorism is over, but they are the last ones to understand the terrorists just find a replacement and keep on going. The narrative is ruined if they have to admit it was a planned attack, but only a complete fool believed people just happen to have advanced weaponry laying around or in their pockets to have a "spontaneous" demonstration and attack. News to the liberals: the terrorists don't like America anymore with Obama as president as they did before or I should restate maybe they do since they can spot a weak leader when they see one. A president who is scared and refuses to call terrorism just that, isn't much of a leader.
:thumbs:
there you go again.. being logical something most of these morons are unable to understand..

Shame on you..

[DenverBrit]

LOL.

Barry makes no sense, as usual, and you agree with him. 8')

Here, read some expert analysis:

"I would have said four years ago that the al-Qaida movement was emerging as a bigger problem, especially with the emergence of affiliates in places like Yemen and with the spike in homegrown attacks," said Phil Mudd, a senior counterterrorism official at the CIA and FBI during the Bush and Obama administrations. "But I would say today that al-Qaidaism is on the decline. By any balance, the number of places where people want to come after us has declined in the past four years."

Mudd, now a senior research fellow at the nonpartisan New America Foundation, said that while militants in other countries may still be causing problems in their own areas, they are less likely to "be sitting there saying how do we get to Los Angeles, and that's a big change."

"Everyone was afraid that Iraq meant that whenever we thought it was a good idea to bring democracy to a country by force we would do it," said James Lewis, a Washington-based national security expert, now with the Center for Strategic and International Studies. Through diplomatic efforts by the Obama administration, he said that "that level of fear has been tamped down. The global perception of the U.S. is better."

"We have strengthened our alliances around the world to protect against future threats, locked down nuclear materials and improved our homeland defenses," said Tommy Vietor, spokesman for the National Security Council. "The U.S. is absolutely safer now than four years ago."

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

:thumbs:
there you go again.. being logical something most of these morons are unable to understand..

Shame on you..

You and your BFF barry wouldn't know a syllogism from a gopher hole.

Simply forming a coherent English sentence is clearly a challenge for you.

[TonyR]

[W]e know for a fact that Bush had explicit advance warning that 9-11, an attack that killed 2,800 people, was coming. ... The same people who spent years making excuses for why Bush shouldn’t have taken that August 6 PDB seriously are now trying to argue that an attack that was about 1/700th as cataclysmic should be Obama’s undoing? You've got to be kidding me. If you want to talk about why we need to get to the bottom of Benghazi for substantive reasons, I’ll join the conversation. If you are trying to use the deaths of these people as a political cudgel to get Obama because every other piece of crap attack you’ve tried has failed, you are doing something that’s both contemptible and ineffectual. http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2012/10/02/if-benghazi-is-a-scandal-what-was-9-11.html

[ant1999e]

What about Libya???

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

[W]e know for a fact that Bush had explicit advance warning that 9-11, an attack that killed 2,800 people, was coming. ... The same people who spent years making excuses for why Bush shouldn’t have taken that August 6 PDB seriously are now trying to argue that an attack that was about 1/700th as cataclysmic should be Obama’s undoing? You've got to be kidding me. If you want to talk about why we need to get to the bottom of Benghazi for substantive reasons, I’ll join the conversation. If you are trying to use the deaths of these people as a political cudgel to get Obama because every other piece of crap attack you’ve tried has failed, you are doing something that’s both contemptible and ineffectual.

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2012/10/02/if-benghazi-is-a-scandal-what-was-9-11.html

Exactly.

Amazing how these idiots can think they have any credibility in this department.

[DenverBrit]

What about Libya???

What about Libya? ???

U.S. Is Tracking Killers in Attack on Libya Mission

WASHINGTON — The United States is laying the groundwork for operations to kill or capture militants implicated in the deadly attack on a diplomatic mission in Libya, senior military and counterterrorism officials said Tuesday, as the weak Libyan government appears unable to arrest or even question fighters involved in the assault.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/10/03/world/africa/us-said-to-be-preparing-potential-targets-tied-to-libya-attack.html?hp&_r=0

[ant1999e]

http://www.examiner.com/article/house-administration-denied-repeated-requests-for-extra-security-benghazi

House: Administration denied 'repeated requests' for extra security in Benghazi

In a letter sent to Secretary of State Hillary Clinton on Tuesday, Reps. Darrell Issa (R-CA) and Jason Chaffetz (R-UT) said that repeated requests for additional security in Libya were denied, despite numerous attacks against the consulate.

“Based on information provided to the Committee by individuals with direct knowledge of events in Libya, the attack that claimed the ambassador’s life was the latest in a long line of attacks on Western diplomats and officials in Libya in the months leading up to September 11, 2012,” Rep. Issa wrote.

“In addition, multiple U.S. federal government officials have confirmed to the Committee that, prior to the September 11 attack, the U.S. mission in Libya made repeated requests for increased security in Benghazi,” they added.

“The mission in Libya, however, was denied these resources by officials in Washington.”

The letter spells out 13 separate attacks on or near the compound between April and September. The consulate was attacked and burned on September 11, killing Ambassador Chris Stevens and three other Americans.

"Put together," the letter says, "these events indicated a clear pattern of security threats that could only be reasonably interpreted to justify increased security for U.S. personnel and facilities in Benghazi."

According to the Associated Press, Rep. Chaffetz said there were over 50 incidents.

"Two of them involved explosive devices: a June 6 blast that blew a hole in the security perimeter. The explosion was described to the committee as 'big enough for forty men to go through'; and an April 6 incident where two Libyans who were fired by a security contractor threw a small explosive device over the consulate fence," the AP reported.

State Department spokeswoman Victoria Nuland refused to answer questions on requests for extra security, but said that Clinton received the letter on Tuesday and will reply the same day. The AP said that she "insisted that the department intends to cooperate fully with Congress."

"We share the same goal," she told reporters. "We want to get to the bottom of precisely what happened and learn any lessons that we need to learn from it. We're taking this very, very seriously."

A post at Townhall says that Ambassador Stevens was also concerned about security and made note of it in the journal a CNN crew found in the burned consulate.

"CNN says Stevens wrote about his fears of constant threats -- threats, incidentally, that the Obama administration has downplayed or flat-out denied," Guy Benson wrote.

ABC News reported that White house Press Secretary Jay Carney declined to discuss the issue.

“I’m not going to get into a situation under review by the State Department and the FBI,” he said.

Hot Air's Ed Morrissey minced no words in his criticism of the administration:

The White House and State Department were asleep at the switch before the 9/11 anniversary attack, and they’ve been lying ever since about the circumstances behind it, too.

???

[ant1999e]

Records show calls for more protection in Libya, 230 'security incidents' before strike

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/10/09/hundreds-ecurity-incidents-in-libya-before-attack/

The U.S. mission in Libya recorded 230 "security incidents" over a one-year period between 2011 and 2012, according to a State Department document that provides the most expansive view yet of the concerns on the ground in the run-up to the deadly Sept. 11 consulate attack.
The document was obtained by the House Oversight and Government Reform Committee, which is preparing to hold a high-profile hearing on Wednesday featuring security officers who served in Libya.
One of them, Eric Nordstrom, claimed in an Oct. 1 email -- obtained by Fox News -- that he had argued for additional security, citing the "number of incidents that targeted diplomatic missions."
However, Nordstrom suggested the U.S. government was eager to give the impression that Libya was safer than it was and declined.
"These incidents paint a clear picture that the environment in Libya was fragile at best and could degrade quickly," he wrote. "Certainly, not an environment where post should be directed to 'normalize' operations and reduce security resources in accordance with an artificial time table."
The account is similar to that of Lt. Col. Andy Wood, the former head of a Special Forces security team who has also agreed to testify. He has given similar accounts in the media of being rebuffed in calling for more security.
The testimony is sure to fuel the firestorm on Capitol Hill over the administration's handling of the attack -- both in terms of security before the attack and the public explanation afterward of what happened.
Pushed on whether security was pulled back before the Sept. 11 strike, State Department spokeswoman Victoria Nuland declined to get into specifics.
"I'm not going to go into all of these kinds of timeline details as to what we had when and where," she said.
Nuland said that in advance of the Sept. 11 anniversary, the department evaluated the "threat stream" and determined "security at Benghazi was appropriate for what we knew."
The document on the 230 incidents, which spans June 2011 to July 2012, goes well beyond high-profile attacks, like the attempted assassination of the British ambassador in June, to include gunfights, the murder of foreign nationals and an explosives attack on the Benghazi consulate on June 6.
In one June 26 attack, the Tunisian consulate was targeted by a "crude IED," though no one was injured, the report said. A border security officer was assassinated in Benghazi on July 4. The report detailed a string of kidnappings later that month.
A "general assessment" at the end of the document then states: "The risk of U.S. Mission personnel, private U.S. citizens, and businesspersons encountering an isolating event as a result of militia or political violence is HIGH."
A senior Republican with the House oversight committee says there's a pattern -- one where help was requested by teams in Libya and consistently denied.
"It seems to be a coordinated effort between the White House and the State Department," said Rep. Jason Chaffetz, R-Utah, who visited Libya over the weekend.
"They wanted the appearance of ... 'normalization' there in Libya," he said. "And building up of an infrastructure, putting up barbed wire on our ... facility would lead to the wrong impression."
Ahead of Wednesday's hearing, Democrats were accusing Republicans of exploiting the situation for political purposes.
A memo by Democrats on the oversight committee reportedly accused Republican leaders of keeping them largely out of the loop on "unverified allegations," as well as the fact-finding trip.
One Democratic aide also stressed "GOP cuts in spending for embassy security" ahead of the attack.
Four Americans including U.S. Ambassador Chris Stevens were killed in the attack.
An independent investigation launched by the State Department is under way -- it presumably will examine why the administration at first claimed the attack was a "spontaneous" reaction to protests in Egypt over an anti-Islam film despite evidence of terrorism.
A law enforcement investigation is also underway.
New details, confirmed by Fox News, show the attack on the consulate and nearby annex used by the CIA unfolded over five hours. In addition to rocket-propelled grenades, AK-47s and assault rifles, the terrorists used gun trucks and mortars.
After Republican Sen. Bob Corker, a member of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee who traveled to Libya, confirmed to The Washington Post that U.S. agents were analyzing security camera video from the consulate, Attorney General Eric Holder suggested lawmakers pull back on their public discussion of the investigation.
Holder urged "people in Congress" to be "a little mindful of the fact that there is an ongoing investigation and not reveal anything that might compromise our law enforcement investigation."
Fox News' Catherine Herridge contributed to this report.


Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/10/09/hundreds-ecurity-incidents-in-libya-before-attack/#ixzz28s3ZUFB3

[ant1999e]

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/10/09/timeline-new-details-sept-11-consulate-attack-in-libya/

WASHINGTON – Senior State Department officials provided a more detailed picture Tuesday of the consulate attack in Benghazi, Libya, that killed U.S. Ambassador Chris Stevens and three other Americans. A look at how they say the attack took place:

Sept. 10-11, 2012
Stevens arrives in Benghazi and holds meetings on and off the consulate grounds on Sept. 10. He spends the night, and for the 11th anniversary of the 9/11 attacks on the U.S. holds meetings only inside the compound. It is an enclosed area about 300 yards long by 100 yards wide, with a 9-foot outer wall topped by barbed wire and augmented by barriers, steel drop bars and other security upgrades. There are four buildings in the compound. Five diplomatic security officers are present, along with four members of a local militia deployed by Libya's government to provide added security.

Around 8:30 p.m.
Stevens finishes his final meeting of the day and escorts a Turkish diplomat outside the main entrance of the consulate. The situation is calm. There are no protests.

Around 9:40 p.m.
Agents hear loud noises, gunfire and explosions near the front gate. A barracks at the entrance housing the local militiamen is burnt down. Agents viewing cameras see large group of armed men flowing into the compound. Alarm is sounded. Telephone calls are made to the embassy in Tripoli, officials in Washington, the Libyan authorities and a U.S. quick reaction force located at a second compound a little over a mile away.

Grabbing weapons
One agent, armed with a sidearm and an M4 submachine gun, takes Stevens and computer specialist Sean Smith to a safe room inside one of the compound's two main residences. It has a heavy metal grill and several locks, medical supplies and water, and windows that can be opened only from the inside. The other agents equip themselves with long guns, body armor, helmets and ammunition at other buildings. Two try to make it to the building with Stevens. They are met by armed men and are forced to retreat.
Attackers breach the compound
Attackers penetrate Stevens' building and try to break the grill locks for the safe room, but cannot gain access. They dump jerry cans of diesel fuel in the building, light furniture on fire and set aflame part of the exterior of the building. Two of the remaining four agents are in the compound's other residence. Attackers penetrate that building, but the agents barricade themselves in and the attackers can't reach them. Attackers try to enter the tactical operations center, where the last two agents are located. They smash up the door but cannot enter the building.

Americans trapped
Meanwhile, Stevens' building rapidly fills up with thick diesel smoke and burning fumes from the furniture. Inside, visibility is less than 3 feet. Unable to breathe, the Americans go to a bathroom and open a window, but still can't get enough air. They decide to leave the building. The agent goes first, flopping out onto a patio enclosed by sandbags. He takes immediate fire, including probably rocket-propelled grenades. Stevens and Smith don't come out of the building. The agent, suffering severely from smoke inhalation, goes in and out of the building several times to look for them. He then climbs a ladder to the roof of the building and collapses. He radios the other agents to alert them to the situation there.
The other four agents are able to reunite and take an armored vehicle to Stevens' building. They reach the collapsed agent and try to set up a perimeter. They take turns going into the building, searching on hands and knees for the missing Americans. Smith is pulled out, dead. Stevens cannot be found.

Reinforcements
A six-person quick reaction security team arrives from their compound across town. About 60 Libyan militiamen accompany them. They attempt to secure a perimeter around Stevens' building, and take turns going inside. Taking fire, Libyan forces determine they can't hold the perimeter. A decision is made to evacuate the compound and return with everyone to the reaction force's compound.

Evacuation
Agents pile into an armored vehicle, with Smith's body, and leave through the main gate. They face immediate fire. Crowds and groups of men block two different routes to the security compound. Heavy traffic means they are traveling only about 15 mph, and trying not to attract attention. On a narrow street they reach a group of men who signal for them to enter a compound. They sense an attack and speed away, taking heavy fire from AK-47 machine guns at a distance of only 2 feet, and hand grenades thrown against and under the car. Two tires are blown out.
They speed past another crowd of men and onto a main street and across a grassy median into opposing traffic. The agents drive against traffic, eventually reaching their compound. Security gets into firing positions around the compound and on the roof. They take more gunfire and rocket-propelled grenades intermittently for several hours.

More reinforcements
In the night, a team of reinforcements from the U.S. Embassy in Tripoli arrives on a chartered aircraft at the Benghazi airport and reaches the security compound.

Around 4 a.m.
The compound's building is hit by mortar fire. The roof is hit and two security personnel are killed. One agent involved in the attack from the beginning is severely wounded. The men decide to evacuate the city entirely. They spend the next hours securing the annex and moving a large convoy of vehicles to the airport. They evacuate on two flights.


Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/10/09/timeline-new-details-sept-11-consulate-attack-in-libya/#ixzz28s3wf6wr

[elsid13]

What you are getting is more information as folks are able to gather the data and analysis what happened.

[ant1999e]

What you are getting is more information as folks are able to gather the data and analysis what happened.

What we are getting is the truth after being lied to.

[elsid13]

What we are getting is the truth after being lied to.

No one was lied to. In situations like this, leadership is in dark and working off half truth and misinformation. It isn't like TV, most of the time folk in DC don't have immediate access to all the facts and respond before they know what going on.

[Smiling Assassin27]

These hearings are friggin' incredible. Believe me, we were and are being lied to.

p.s. Where TF is Hilary? Coward.

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/uFf0dUH3OtU" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

[DBruleU]

No one was lied to. In situations like this, leadership is in dark and working off half truth and misinformation. It isn't like TV, most of the time folk in DC don't have immediate access to all the facts and respond before they know what going on.

Please. No wonder this Administration gets away with so much crap.

[DBruleU]

These hearings are friggin' incredible. Believe me, we were and are being lied to.

p.s. Where TF is Hilary? Coward.

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/uFf0dUH3OtU" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

..and they accuse Romney of lying?

[Smiling Assassin27]

Rohrbacher: Did budget considerations affect security decisions?

Lamb: "NO SIR."

[Garcia Bronco]

So the State Department was aware that our Embassy was getting threats and did nothing? Is that right?

[barryr]

So the State Department was aware that our Embassy was getting threats and did nothing? Is that right?

Basically. More like typical government action, paperwork sent from desk to desk until it collected dust. But when an admin. believes terrorism does not exist because the killers are awed by POTUS at the time, then this is the result.

[ant1999e]

Susan Rice testified today and said she would not approve the requests made for more security.

[ant1999e]

Bumps in the ****ing road...

[ant1999e]

No one was lied to. In situations like this, leadership is in dark and working off half truth and misinformation. It isn't like TV, most of the time folk in DC don't have immediate access to all the facts and respond before they know what going on.

Come on, you're a respectable poster. Don't take that boat trip down denial river.
-It was 9-11
-13 separate attacks on or near the compound between April and September
-The U.S. mission in Libya recorded 230 "security incidents" over a one-year period between 2011 and 2012
-There was no protest at the consulate
-RPG's...
-The chain of events in that timeline were absolutely pushed up the chain immediately. No way it took a week to gather the facts necessary to rule out a protest gone wild over a stupid video. If not, we have big problem either way.

[ant1999e]

How weak we must look to the rest of the world when our leaders tried to blame a 9-11 terrorist attack on a non-existent protest about an anti-muslim video that was on YouTube. We all should be embarrassed.

[pricejj]

Susan Rice testified today and said she would not approve the requests made for more security.

Susan Rice is the same person who put sanctions on Eritrea. Does she not think Eritreans are poor enough?

[pricejj]

How weak we must look to the rest of the world when our leaders tried to blame a 9-11 terrorist attack on a non-existent protest about an anti-muslim video that was on YouTube. We all should be embarrassed.

It is an obvious lie. Foreigners would laugh that Americans are stupid enough to believe it. At the same time recognizing the entire Obama administration for their treachery and deceipt.

[lonestar]

So the State Department was aware that our Embassy was getting threats and did nothing? Is that right?

That is what seems to have happened..

In fact it now seems that they removed two teams of "security" since August this year from Libya, prior to the attacks....

[Dr. Broncenstein]

Don't worry, fellas. The Obama regime tracked down the YouTube bandit and perpwalked him for a probation violation. Problem solved.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

^

Thanks for giving us the "ditto monkeys who get their 'information' from breitbart.com" POV.

https://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/525969_425111950881223_2126126458_n.jpg

[Jetmeck]

It is an obvious lie. Foreigners would laugh that Americans are stupid enough to believe it. At the same time recognizing the entire Obama administration for their treachery and deceipt.

This is no proof of any of this you ass monkeys keep butt humpin one another though..................

[Jetmeck]

How weak we must look to the rest of the world when our leaders tried to blame a 9-11 terrorist attack on a non-existent protest about an anti-muslim video that was on YouTube. We all should be embarrassed.


If you are embarassed so much of the guy that cleaned up two wars your party created and then killed the guy who murdered thousands of Americans and are so willing to believe this latest BS report then leave.


There is no proof there was no demonstrations. If there weren't demonstrations, then why the hell were they on twitter or facebook or whtever telling the world they denounced the video that at the moment they obviously though or was told was the cause of the problem. ?/

**** off you clueless clowns.

[Dr. Broncenstein]

Blame free speech

Censor free speech

Punish free speech

[BroncoBeavis]

Blame free speech

Censor free speech

Punish free speech

Scariest part of this whole thing. They made up a scapegoat out of whole cloth. Then brought down the weight of government upon that which they invented to cover their asses.

Every one of these guys would be screaming for impeachment if it weren't for that (D) behind Obama's name.

[BroncoBeavis]

There is no proof there was no demonstrations. If there weren't demonstrations, then why the hell were they on twitter or facebook or whtever telling the world they denounced the video that at the moment they obviously though or was told was the cause of the problem. ?/

**** off you clueless clowns.

On Tuesday afternoon, State Department officials acknowledged that despite earlier explanations from the Obama administration, there was no protest outside the Benghazi compound at all.

http://abcnews.go.com/m/blogEntry?id=17440169

[ant1999e]

http://abcnews.go.com/m/blogEntry?id=17440169

It's amazing how ignorant this guy is.

[TonyR]

http://abcnews.go.com/m/blogEntry?id=17440169

^ Wait, does this mean the "liberal media" is to be believed? Or, perhaps that there isn't really a "liberal media conspiracy" at all?!?

You righties are funny. When the news "goes your way" you're full of bluster and bravado. When it doesn't, it's because the liberal media is out to get you.

[BroncoBeavis]

^ Wait, does this mean the "liberal media" is to be believed? Or, perhaps that there isn't really a "liberal media conspiracy" at all?!?

You righties are funny. When the news "goes your way" you're full of bluster and bravado. When it doesn't, it's because the liberal media is out to get you.

How is quoting an MSM article that directly refutes an incorrect point recently made "blustering"

Had I quoted some right-wing source, you'd instantly discredit it. So I used an MSM source, which you then use for some imaginative form of super-deflection.

What you've built yourself is an impenetrable circle of reason.

[lonestar]

This is no proof of any of this you ass monkeys keep butt humpin one another though..................

Wow pot calling someone else kettle black.

Once again. Less name calling but then that is all you seem to have. Civility might get you farther.

Have you thought about anger management classes.

[lonestar]

How is quoting an MSM article that directly refutes an incorrect point recently made "blustering"

Had I quoted some right-wing source, you'd instantly discredit it. So I used an MSM source, which you then use for some imaginative form of super-deflection.

What you've built yourself is an impenetrable circle of reason.

This is all above their pay grade.

All they seem to know is the bullet points they get on a daily basis. If it is not in that well it can't be true.

Even when the liberal press turns on obama they can't believe it.

The jobs report is bunk, he looked like he was ago of ball in the debates after they said he'd mop the floor with Romney. This story is going to hell in a hand basket and they just can't, won't get it their boi is flawed and becoming more unelectable bey the minute.

The more lies and deceit we see by the day only the few moron on the very far left will vote for him.

Live by the sword die by the sword.

[mhgaffney]

Bumps in the ****ing road...

True. Obama's foreign policy is a disaster for the US of A.

Unfortunately, Romney's will be even worse.

We are without a real choice in this election season.

The question: what to do?

[W*GS]

The question: what to do?

What you can do is answer my two questions, bitch.

[mhgaffney]

Once upon a time I attempted to have have a serious conversation with a hard core Zionist. The man is a heart doctor and lives in Michigan.

Initially I had faith that with enough sincerity, good faith, and persistence, we could come to understand one another -- and resolve our differences.

Over a period of time, I gradually realized -- much to my great disappointment -- this was just not possible.

I caught the Zionist lying to me -- with the view to deceiving me. This happened repeatedly.

I tried the same sort of conversation with W*gs - -and with the same result. You simply cannot talk to Zionists. They have an agenda -- and they brook no disagreement and no dissent. They are Stalinists in this regard. If you do not support them totally - you are the enemy -- and should expect to be tarred as anti semites.

This is how the world is. Not very pretty -- but there it is.

MHG

[lonestar]

True. Obama's foreign policy is a disaster for the US of A.

Unfortunately, Romney's will be even worse.

We are without a real choice in this election season.

The question: what to do?


Shirley you jest.. Not sure who's FP was/is worse his or Carter..

I do not see how Romney could fubar FP any worse than nobama has so far..

[W*GS]

I caught the Zionist lying to me -- with the view to deceiving me. This happened repeatedly.

You're one stupid ****.

All I want to know are two things:

1) What is Venus?

2) When was America at its best, and explain your assertion.

You're as bad as that moron Sarah Palin whining about "gotcha" questions.

Show us you're smarter than that idiot. If you can.

[mhgaffney]

Shirley you jest.. Not sure who's FP was/is worse his or Carter..

I do not see how Romney could fubar FP any worse than nobama has so far..

No I do not jest.

You evidently have not been paying attention. Romney has a typical Mormon perspective on the Mideast. He shares the ultra-reactionatry Christian fundamentalist view of it -- in other words he supports Israel's racist Apartheid system --

He wants to make Israeli PM Bibi Netanyahu his trusted advisor on all issues dealing with the Mideast. which will of course lead to another big war -- probably within months of the election.

Romney is clueless about the region, its history, its diverse peoples and religions. He will enthusiastically support whatever Israel does, right or wrong.

He will be the worst US president in memory -- and they've mostly all been bad. We have not had a good one since JFK -- and look what the CIA and banksters did to him.

In short, things will suddenly become MUCH worse.

You need to understand clearly that a major war with Iran will likely go nuclear within days if not hours.

Think about this before casting your ballot. Unfortunately, I can't offer a better alternative. There is none.

Many patriots will sit out this election -- for want of anyone to believe in.
MHG

[lonestar]

No I do not jest.

You evidently have not been paying attention. Romney has a typical Mormon perspective on the Mideast. He shares the ultra-reactionatry Christian fundamentalist view of it -- in other words he supports Israel's racist Apartheid system --

He wants to make Israeli PM Bibi Netanyahu his trusted advisor on all issues dealing with the Mideast. which will of course lead to another big war -- probably within months of the election.

Romney is clueless about the region, its history, its diverse peoples and religions. He will enthusiastically support whatever Israel does, right or wrong.

He will be the worst US president in memory -- and they've mostly all been bad. We have not had a good one since JFK -- and look what the CIA and banksters did to him.

In short, things will suddenly become MUCH worse.

You need to understand clearly that a major war with Iran will likely go nuclear within days if not hours.

Think about this before casting your ballot. Unfortunately, I can't offer a better alternative. There is none.

Many patriots will sit out this election -- for want of anyone to believe in.
MHG
Oh I see instead of having someone on our side who likes us in the area, you want sell the farm out even more to obamas Muslim "friends".

Yep that makes so much more sense to the logical mind.

But go ahead and stick your head in the Syrian/Iran sand and hope they like us.

Myself I know they hate anything not 13th century.

[barryr]

The idiots in the Obama admin. can not even get their stories straight. No wonder people got killed.

[lonestar]

The idiots in the Obama admin. can not even get their stories straight. No wonder people got killed.

I've been to several Embassies over the years and have never seen one with out a Marine Guard contingent..

But I guess they are trying to save money, and this is one of those ways..

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

Mother of Navy Seal killed in Libya speaks out against Romney (http://www1.whdh.com/news/articles/local/boston/12008755850115/mother-of-navy-seal-killed-in-libya-speaks-out/#?utm_medium=email&utm_source=newsletter&utm_campaign=cheatsheet_afternoon&cid=newsletter%3Bemail%3Bcheatsheet_afternoon&utm_term=Cheat%20Sheet)

BOSTON (WHDH) -- Republican presidential candidate Mitt Romney has agreed to stop sharing a story about his encounter with Winchester Navy SEAL Glen Doherty who was killed in the attack on the U.S. consulate in Libya after Doherty’s mother said she was upset Romney was using the story for his political agenda.

Glen Doherty was one of four Americans killed in the September 11 attack on the U.S. consulate.

[elsid13]

I've been to several Embassies over the years and have never seen one with out a Marine Guard contingent..

But I guess they are trying to save money, and this is one of those ways..

Embassies Security is Not the responsibility of the Corp and they are only at major activities. DSS has responsibility and like under Bush they have outsourced physical security to PMC.

[elsid13]

Come on, you're a respectable poster. Don't take that boat trip down denial river.
-It was 9-11
-13 separate attacks on or near the compound between April and September
-The U.S. mission in Libya recorded 230 "security incidents" over a one-year period between 2011 and 2012
-There was no protest at the consulate
-RPG's...
-The chain of events in that timeline were absolutely pushed up the chain immediately. No way it took a week to gather the facts necessary to rule out a protest gone wild over a stupid video. If not, we have big problem either way.

Having been through enough crisis within the government, it's never as straight forward as anyone wants it to be. When it's this high visibility you get people wanting to jump in and offering "opinions" without being fully briefed or understand what really occurred. As I posted early here this thread or on BF (can not remember which) at beginning of the tragic events, that it was still a fluid situation and more information was going to come to light as things progressed.

[Dr. Broncenstein]

Having been through enough crisis within the government, it's never as straight forward as anyone wants it to be. When it's this high visibility you get people wanting to jump in and offering "opinions" without being fully briefed or understand what really occurred. As I posted early here this thread or on BF (can not remember which) at beginning of the tragic events, that it was still a fluid situation and more information was going to come to light as things progressed.

Where did the information blaming a YouTube video for sparking this attack come from? Not a single shred of information to prove this has ever come to light. Yet for two weeks it was all the president, sec of state, ambassador to the UN, and whitehouse spokeskid talked about. When the flag draped coffin of Chris Stevens arrived home, the YouTube video was blamed. At the UN general assembly the President blamed the YouTube video. The administration even put out a public service announcement pleading to the Muslim world to disregard this video.

Where did this ridiculous notion that a YouTube video had anything to do with the ambassador's murder come from?

Does it not trouble you that we have an administration that publicly laments and appologizes for free speech? How about censoring free speech by demanding YouTube take the video down? Or the perpwalk and arrest of an American citizen for posting this video?

[mhgaffney]

Oh I see instead of having someone on our side who likes us in the area, you want sell the farm out even more to obamas Muslim "friends".

Yep that makes so much more sense to the logical mind.

But go ahead and stick your head in the Syrian/Iran sand and hope they like us.

Myself I know they hate anything not 13th century.

From your own words, it appears that the one who hates is you.

You are a typical know it all (as in: know nothing) American who thinks it's our destiny to spread Walmart and McDonalds around the planet -- until everyone looks and talks like us.

I've been studying and writing about the Mideast since 1982 -- and I've watched everything get worse, largely because of the role the US has played.

If they hate us- - it has nothing to do with the 13th century. It's because of US imperialism -- the fact we have bombed and invaded their countries.

MHG

[W*GS]

Heya gaffe...

1) What is Venus?

2) When was America at its best, and explain your assertion.

[elsid13]

Where did the information blaming a YouTube video for sparking this attack come from? Not a single shred of information to prove this has ever come to light. Yet for two weeks it was all the president, sec of state, ambassador to the UN, and whitehouse spokeskid talked about. When the flag draped coffin of Chris Stevens arrived home, the YouTube video was blamed. At the UN general assembly the President blamed the YouTube video. The administration even put out a public service announcement pleading to the Muslim world to disregard this video.

Where did this ridiculous notion that a YouTube video had anything to do with the ambassador's murder come from?

Does it not trouble you that we have an administration that publicly laments and appologizes for free speech? How about censoring free speech by demanding YouTube take the video down? Or the perpwalk and arrest of an American citizen for posting this video?

Don't forgot we had a number of incident occurring at the same time. The Video which did spark protest and attempted storming of US Embassy in Egypt on the same day and similar unrest in Pakistan, Afghanistan, Malaysia and Middle East. We have seen how truly connected and small the modern world is with the things happen. It not hard to see someone drawing the connection when they have not fully been brief (Susan Rice).

[barryr]

Looks like Obama is going to try to pass the blame to Hillary for the Libya fiasco. That should go over well with Bill LOL

[BroncoBeavis]

Don't forgot we had a number of incident occurring at the same time. The Video which did spark protest and attempted storming of US Embassy in Egypt on the same day and similar unrest in Pakistan, Afghanistan, Malaysia and Middle East. We have seen how truly connected and small the modern world is with the things happen. It not hard to see someone drawing the connection when they have not fully been brief (Susan Rice).

If you could isolate it to Susan Rice alone, that would be one thing. But the administration made a coordinated effort between many people to try to pass this off as a protest-gone-wrong over a youtube clip.

They even attempted to use the power of the White House to have the youtube clip censored.

http://www.politico.com/blogs/under-the-radar/2012/09/activists-troubled-by-white-house-call-to-youtube-135618.html

The question remains. Why was the White House so desperate to paint this terrorist attack as something different than it was?

[DAN_BRONCO_FAN]

Heya gaffe...

1) What is Venus?
ill answer that one
Venus is the second planet from the Sun, orbiting it every 224.7 Earth days.[11] The planet is named after the Roman goddess of love and beauty. After the Moon, it is the brightest natural object in the night sky, reaching an apparent magnitude of −4.6, bright enough to cast shadows.[13] Because Venus is an inferior planet from Earth, it never appears to venture far from the Sun: its elongation reaches a maximum of 47.8°. Venus reaches its maximum brightness shortly before sunrise or shortly after sunset, for which reason it has been referred to by ancient cultures as the Morning Star or Evening Star

2) When was America at its best, and explain your assertion.
as for no 2 that varies depending on your opinion quite a few elderly people reminisce about the good ol days and it changes every generation.
some middle age people think the 80s was the best years.

as for me i like them all 70 80 90s and the 2000 im not one to be stuck in one time period i like to change with the times.
i can fit in with any of those eras

[Requiem]

http://i47.tinypic.com/2yjpls6.png

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

Bad news for lonestar, barryr, and the right-wing brain trust...

GOP Rep. Admits House GOP Cut Funding For Embassy Security: \'You Have To Prioritize Things\' (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/10/10/jason-chaffetz-embassy_n_1954912.html)

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

Right-Wing Media's Libya Consulate Security Mythology Falls Apart (http://www.mediamatters.org/blog/2012/10/10/right-wing-medias-libya-consulate-security-myth/190508)

[ant1999e]

http://www.orangemane.com/BB/showthread.php?t=107754

http://dailycaller.com/2012/10/10/dems-accuse-gop-of-cutting-security-funding-in-libya-despite-majority-dem-support-for-vote/

House Democrats opened Wednesday’s House Committee on Oversight and Government Reform hearing by attacking Republicans for cuts to embassy security funding — cuts that only happened thanks to overwhelming support from House Democrats, including House Oversight Committee Ranking Democratic member Rep. Elijah Cummings. In fact, more House Democrats – 149 of them — voted for the cuts than did House Republicans, of which 147 voted for them. cont...

Read more: http://dailycaller.com/2012/10/10/dems-accuse-gop-of-cutting-security-funding-in-libya-despite-majority-dem-support-for-vote/#ixzz28xJDJT9z

http://www.examiner.com/article/u-s-security-officer-asked-for-more-benghazi-security-before-deadly-attack


According to Reuters, U.S. Security Officer Eric Nordstrom, who was assigned to a post in Tripoli until about two months before the attack on the Embassy in Bengazi on September 11, spoke out today regarding a serious concern regarding the State Department in relation to the deadly attack. According to Nordstrom, he had asked his State Department superiors on two separate occasions to issue more security agents to the American mission in Benghazi.

According to documented communication, Charlene Lamb who is a State Department official wanted to maintain an “artificially low” presence of United States security personnel in Benghazi.

Nordstrom reportedly continued to insist on additional U.S. security in Libya by even chronologically listing security incidents that had occurred there from June 2011 to July 2012, forty-eight of the incidents involving incident of militia gunfights to bomb attacks right in Benghazi.

This information was made public in a brief summary of Nordstrom’s statements during an interview with the House Oversight and Government Reform Committee.

According to the Reuters report, Nordstrom’s actions and those of his superiors are to be analyzed in a public hearing on Wednesday in Congress.

The deadly attack in Benghazi left four dead including U.S. Ambassador Christopher Stevens. First reports attempted to blame a viral video which disrespected Islam but then were later changed to admitting that the September 11 attack was terrorist-related.

The primary source of this article is Reuters.

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-202_162-57528567/top-u.s-counterterrorism-adviser-john-brennan-in-libya-amid-questions-over-security-missteps/

Cont...
Lt. Col. Andy Wood, the former head of a U.S. Special Forces "Site Security Team" in Libya, has told CBS News correspondent Sharyl Attkisson that he and many other senior staff at the U.S. Embassy in Tripoli, "felt we needed more, not less" security personnel in the country, but were told "to do with less. For what reasons, I don't know."

Wood and others have portrayed a State Department in Washington that was either unwilling to provide American officials in Libya with the security they required or ignorant of the pressing security concerns in a country where the central government is weak, and Islamic extremist militias have enjoyed virtual free reign in the power vacuum created by the toppling and killing of long-time dictator Muammar Qaddafi.cont...

[lonestar]

Looks like Obama is going to try to pass the blame to Hillary for the Libya fiasco. That should go over well with Bill LOL

Has he fessed up and taken responsibility for ANYTHING that has gone south in the past 4 years?

I think everything bad is someone else's fault..

[DAN_BRONCO_FAN]

Has he fessed up and taken responsibility for ANYTHING that has gone south in the past 4 years?

I think everything bad is someone else's fault..

if obama wants double points he should somehow add bush to the blame list triple points of you can blame Romney quadruple if you can add republicans. 999999999 points if he can use it to blame the rich raise taxes and bankrupt the country

[lonestar]

if obama wants double points he should somehow add bush to the blame list triple points of you can blame Romney quadruple if you can add republicans. 999999999 points if he can use it to blame the rich raise taxes and bankrupt the country

you beat me to it..

:thumbs:

[DAN_BRONCO_FAN]

http://www.orangemane.com/BB/showthread.php?t=107754

no no no its all bushes, republicans ,the rich , the altitude ,him being a nice and polite guy fault.
and this is why we need to gut the military ,tax the rich millionaires* 100% and blame bush
* by millionaires we mean anyone making 200,000 or 500,000 or whatever we decide is rich

[barryr]

Has he fessed up and taken responsibility for ANYTHING that has gone south in the past 4 years?

I think everything bad is someone else's fault..

Heck, he and his team tried to even blame John Kerry for his horrid debate performance.