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View Full Version : Do We Have Defensive Issues, OR Is Big Ben Just A Good QB?


RhymesayersDU
09-09-2012, 11:05 PM
Defense was not good tonight. The third and long conversions by Pittsburgh sucked. Something to be concerned with long term, or just Big Ben being Big Ben?

YOU decide, OMane.

bronco militia
09-09-2012, 11:09 PM
maybe a little of both...big ben did the same thing to the broncos in 2nd half of last years playoff game

Bacchus
09-09-2012, 11:10 PM
Ben is so hard to bring down it is very frustrating. A more conventional and a more difficult test will be next week

RhymesayersDU
09-09-2012, 11:11 PM
Ben is so hard to bring down it is very frustrating. A more conventioanl and a more difficult test will be next week

I'm hoping this is the case. I agree, Ben has a history of extending plays, being tough to bring down, etc. I REALLY hope this is the case here.

Because if we can't get off the field on 3rd and 10+, we're screwed.

Garcia Bronco
09-09-2012, 11:12 PM
Defense was excellent tonight. Always room for improvement, but Ben is that good. He's got 2 SB rings doing exactly what he did tonight.

Paladin
09-09-2012, 11:12 PM
A little of both. Broncos DBs making some errors, and someone has to cover Miller, dammit.

OTOH, Pitt has to be equaly concerned. On balance, it ws not a badly played game.....

BroncoFanDoug
09-09-2012, 11:13 PM
I think the D was awesome. Bend not break. Get used to it because this is Del Rio D.

The D stopped the run. The D allowed zero big plays. This approach compliments Peyton so well.

This D is sooooo much better than last year.

RhymesayersDU
09-09-2012, 11:14 PM
Defense was excellent tonight. Always room for improvement, but Ben is that good. He's got 2 SB rings doing exactly what he did tonight.

The defense was not excellent by any stretch.

They get kudos for holding PITT to some FGs and making the big play at the end, but we have got to get off the field on 3rd and long. We have to.

Agamemnon
09-09-2012, 11:14 PM
Both. We have coverage issues at linebacker and safety and Del Rio refused to bring the heat on 3rd and long all game long for some reason, but the Rapist was pretty much on fire on third down tonight. I don't think it will be this bad all season, but I do have a feeling it will be a reoccurring theme, especially against great QB's.

Tombstone RJ
09-09-2012, 11:15 PM
Mays is a total liability in coverage. Ben made some good plays and Mays made some horrible--HORRIBLE--plays in coverage.

NFLBRONCO
09-09-2012, 11:19 PM
Denver's D faced a team with zero running threat and still struggled that's a concern. Miller and Doom were next to invisable most of the night facing backups that's a concern and needs to get better. If teams can take out Doom and Miller easily our D will really struggle. Denver had ball 36 secs in 3rd qtr. Denver's D has to get off field alot quicker.

BroncoMan4ever
09-09-2012, 11:23 PM
I think the D was awesome. Bend not break. Get used to it because this is Del Rio D.

The D stopped the run. The D allowed zero big plays. This approach compliments Peyton so well.

This D is sooooo much better than last year.

I consider converting 3rd and 10+ a big play; and that happened several times tonight.

Garcia Bronco
09-09-2012, 11:25 PM
The defense was not excellent by any stretch.

They get kudos for holding PITT to some FGs and making the big play at the end, but we have got to get off the field on 3rd and long. We have to.

Perhaps you just need to watch it again.

broncocalijohn
09-09-2012, 11:28 PM
They couldnt run on us and yet we still let Ben throw at us. It is a concern when you let at least 3 3rd and over 12 yards to make first downs. Simply put, it will get us by the Chiefs but not going to take us to the Super Bowl. TG for Manning when he actually got a chance to eat up some time of possession. That is the part that frustrated me. I want to see Manning out there driving down the field, not sitting on the bench waiting and waiting.

Heyneck
09-09-2012, 11:30 PM
Too early to tell. We where good in 1st and 2nd down.. but on 3rd we where just awful. It's only the first game... but it sure seems like if both the offensive and defensive scheme gel, this team could go places.

Agamemnon
09-09-2012, 11:30 PM
A little perspective:

If this defense maintains this level of performance all season, going off last season's rankings, they will rank 5th in points allowed and 2nd in yards allowed. So yeah, they were pretty good tonight. Far from perfect, but pretty damn good all the same.

Ziggy
09-09-2012, 11:32 PM
The Steelers offense went 11 for 19 on third down conversions. A lot of those were 3rd and long. Add in the fact that thier offense was down 2 starting lineman, thier starting RB did not play, and thier best WR just got in last week to a new system with no offseason. Our linebacker and safety play was horrible. It did get shored up some when Jim Leonhard came in late, but Mays hasn't improved one bit from last season. Rahim Moore still makes mental errors at big times, and Woodyard struggled so badly that they had to put in Keith Brooking at one point.

NFLBRONCO
09-09-2012, 11:34 PM
A little perspective:

If this defense maintains this level of performance all season, going off last season's rankings, they will rank 5th in points allowed and 2nd in yards allowed. So yeah, they were pretty good tonight. Far from perfect, but pretty damn good all the same.

If we can get off the field faster and more often I'll be satisfied with progress on D this year. We still have miles to go on D but, at least we are way more fun to watch.

Bronco Yoda
09-09-2012, 11:49 PM
Good grief. Big Ben played very well tonight. He kept JUST getting away from our pass rush. We were just a half a step away from stopping him all night long. Frustrating for sure, but Rapeberger gets paid to make plays too. And to his credit he really did pull some rabbits out of his ass tonight at times. Not too many other Ben like players out there.

ZONA
09-09-2012, 11:53 PM
Here's my take on the defensive performance tonight.


Pretty solid against the run, especially since Warren was gone for a good chunk of it. I said before the game even started when everybody was saying we're going to sack him 5 or 6 times and knock him down all game long. He's one of the most crafty guys in the pocket and if you do get to him, he's hard as hell to get down. With those last few sacks in garbage time when the game was pretty much wrapped up, it looks better then it was at getting to Ben. That's got to improve. Did love the Miller shoulder dip on that one sack, that was a thing of beauty. Mays got faked out of his jock at the endzone, can't have that Mr. Mays, you need to improve alot or I promise when DJ comes back your field time will get limited. We got owned on 3rd and long tonight. It was ugly and that's all you can say about it. You expect to give those up sometimes but not all night long. That is a huge concern right now. I did like how our DB's though did not give up. We got that pick six at the end and we had our hands on a few more passes we should have came up with INT's on those.

Overall - even though the Steelers were without some good players (and for the record, we had some nice players out as well - DJ, Hunter, Kuper and Warren for much of it) they are still a very well coached team with alot of talent and they are physical. It was a good test for us.

Last comment - somebody needs to tell Moreno to either put some tape on those shoes or go with the high tops Hilarious!

hambone13
09-09-2012, 11:53 PM
I'm hoping this is the case. I agree, Ben has a history of extending plays, being tough to bring down, etc. I REALLY hope this is the case here.

Because if we can't get off the field on 3rd and 10+, we're screwed.

I think it's pretty tough to establish this as a concern until there is even a semblance of a pattern. I mean even Moneyball had some statistical justification before it was forced down the throats of the over-focused.

Agamemnon
09-09-2012, 11:53 PM
Good grief. Big Ben played very well tonight. He kept JUST getting away from our pass rush. We were just a half a step away from stopping him all night long. Frustrating for sure, but Rapeberger gets paid to make plays too. And to his credit he really did pull some rabbits out of his ass tonight at times. Not too many other Ben like players out there.

And we still held them to under 300 yards and 20 points. Yes we struggled against the pass on third down, but it's really silly to only focus on that when there were a lot of positives as well.

BroncoMan4ever
09-09-2012, 11:56 PM
A little perspective:

If this defense maintains this level of performance all season, going off last season's rankings, they will rank 5th in points allowed and 2nd in yards allowed. So yeah, they were pretty good tonight. Far from perfect, but pretty damn good all the same.
True the yardage stats look good, but are misleading. Similar to the Shanahan defense of we have the number 2 offense in the league because of yardage even though we don't score that much.

The D wss technically good but it was cringe worthy watching it

hambone13
09-09-2012, 11:57 PM
They couldnt run on us and yet we still let Ben throw at us. It is a concern when you let at least 3 3rd and over 12 yards to make first downs. Simply put, it will get us by the Chiefs but not going to take us to the Super Bowl. TG for Manning when he actually got a chance to eat up some time of possession. That is the part that frustrated me. I want to see Manning out there driving down the field, not sitting on the bench waiting and waiting.

I can't say that I didn't have similar feelings but reading into it like it's the personality of this team is just premature. I had a blast because of the highs and lows....I expected them cause well.....we have a new QB, even if it is PM.

myMind
09-09-2012, 11:58 PM
We just beat a top 10 team by 12 points, 6 of which came from the D. First game of the season. You decide, drama mama.

Agamemnon
09-10-2012, 12:00 AM
True the yardage stats look good, but are misleading. Similar to the Shanahan defense of we have the number 2 offense in the league because of yardage even though we don't score that much.

The D wss technically good but it was cringe worthy watching it

What's misleading about the yardage stats? We held a team to under 20 points and under 300 yards. We gave up some really bad plays on third and long, but in the end our defense did a lot of good things. If we play better on 3rd and long, this game is a bloodbath.

hambone13
09-10-2012, 12:02 AM
Last comment - somebody needs to tell Moreno to either put some tape on those shoes or go with the high tops Hilarious!

I'm so glad you said something about that. I was watching the game with mom, who was in from out of town and knows little to nothing about football, and eve she was like, "How does the guy who's suppose to run the ball come out of his shoes? Doesn't he know how to tie them?". It was even funnier when I explained that it was certainly not the first time. You're right, WTF with the shoes man?

ZONA
09-10-2012, 12:14 AM
What's misleading about the yardage stats? We held a team to under 20 points and under 300 yards. We gave up some really bad plays on third and long, but in the end our defense did a lot of good things. If we play better on 3rd and long, this game is a bloodbath.

Hell, if we even stop half of those 3rd and longs it's a blood bath. Their T.O.P. compared to ours midway through the 4th was insane. Next week going against Ryan, White, Jones and Gonzales will be a huge test. I guess some good news is that their running game today, against the Chiefs, sucked balls. We should be able to hold that running game at bay. I'm sure our defense will be practicing 3rd and long many times this week in practice. ^5

broncowill
09-10-2012, 12:17 AM
A lot of the pass rushing issues were from Ben getting rid of the ball quickly, or side stepping the rush when we were able to get presure. I didn't like the play calling on third downs at all. It was either blitz a corner or safety and have mays in woodyard in coverage, or a basic 3 man rush.

Archer81
09-10-2012, 12:26 AM
MLB with coverage skills should be an early pick in April. All I'm sayin...


:Broncos:

Broncolt
09-10-2012, 12:42 AM
also, opponents gameplans when peyton was in indy was obviously run the clock and wear out the defense. the denvers d was on the field for awhile tonights game, so that peyton doesnt have the ball long (see what he did after that 9 minute 3rd quarter drive in like 2 plays/mins??) but i think the denvers d is really good promising... 3rd down D could def improve.

Broncolt
09-10-2012, 12:44 AM
also, opponents gameplans when peyton was in indy was obviously run the clock and wear out the defense. the denvers d was on the field for awhile tonights game, so that peyton doesnt have the ball long (see what he did after that 9 minute 3rd quarter drive in like 2 plays/mins??) but i think the denvers d is really good and promising. the cornerbacks are great, the pressure is there.. 3rd down D could def improve, but steelers played real well on 3rd downs

Bacchus
09-10-2012, 12:49 AM
also, opponents gameplans when peyton was in indy was obviously run the clock and wear out the defense. the denvers d was on the field for awhile tonights game, so that peyton doesnt have the ball long (see what he did after that 9 minute 3rd quarter drive in like 2 plays/mins??) but i think the denvers d is really good and promising. the cornerbacks are great, the pressure is there.. 3rd down D could def improve, but steelers played real well on 3rd downs

I heard Rapistberger on the radio saying that their game plan was to have long drives to keep Manning off the field.

BroncoMan4ever
09-10-2012, 01:19 AM
What's misleading about the yardage stats? We held a team to under 20 points and under 300 yards. We gave up some really bad plays on third and long, but in the end our defense did a lot of good things. If we play better on 3rd and long, this game is a bloodbath.

Misleading is that we shut down the run but got beat a lot through the air. Also the Steelers were working with backup OL and were without Mendenhall. We play a lot of elite teams this year and a bunch of top flight QBs that can and most likely will pick apart our secondary and LBs. A Pittsburgh team that played an average game had our defense on the ropes slmost the entire game.

Premature worry, but this D scares me

maher_tyler
09-10-2012, 01:26 AM
We knew Mays was a liability at MLB. Not surprising at all watching him get burnt most of the game. Once again we're going to have problems on D against good offenses. Especially the Pats. Its a nightmare match up for us with how terrible our LBers are. Just gotta get an early lead and maintain it so our pass rush can get after it like on that last drive tonight.

Drek
09-10-2012, 03:36 AM
11 of 18 on 3rd downs.

The final score doesn't change the fact that any team giving up that stat has something wrong on their D.

Ours happens to be named Wesley Woodyard and Joe Mays. They just can't cover. Both are solid against the run, but that is assumed with any LB who gets to start. The inability to cover at all by those two was our biggest failing on 3rd downs.

Rock Chalk
09-10-2012, 06:01 AM
Defense gives up less than 300 total yards to a perennial playoff team with a 2 time superbowl winning QB, terrific WRs, one of the best TEs in the game and you effing people complain.

RhymesayersDU
09-10-2012, 06:21 AM
Perhaps you just need to watch it again.

No, I saw every play. But feel free to be more vague next time.

TonyR
09-10-2012, 07:06 AM
I'm a bit concerned with the lack of pressure for much of the game against a patchwork O-line. And then when we did get pressure Ben often made us pay by finding the vacated zone. I'm also concerned how the receiving TE has become a weapon for many teams in the league so we're going to be seeing a lot of them, and we really struggle covering them. Finally, I'm a bit worried how we allowed their slow RB's to bounce outside so often. What will we do when we have burners do that to us and there's nobody there to help? But all in all hard to argue with the end result last night.

lolcopter
09-10-2012, 07:10 AM
Up until the last couple drives our pass defense was compete garbage, there was a wide open player NEARLY EVERY DAMN PLAY

Run defense was good though

delany
09-10-2012, 07:14 AM
Defense gives up less than 300 total yards to a perennial playoff team with a 2 time superbowl winning QB, terrific WRs, one of the best TEs in the game and you effing people complain.

But I can hold the Steelers to -100 total yards when I play against them on Madden 12!

The expectations by some are insane. I honestly think a shut-out game wouldn't stop the
hand-wringing here.

We didn't have DJ. We have a rook and a guy that was out of football last year on the DL. A new DC. A new CB. Game 1 of the season. Plus we weren't playing Madden!

Lots of things to work on....but IMO the defense was as fun to watch as the O last night. Exciting times to be a fan of the Broncos

lolcopter
09-10-2012, 07:19 AM
If porter doesn't get that pick 6 we likely loose that game

Pass defense was crap all night. Granted Ben is terrific at avoiding pressure and getting rid of the ball, but if we're going to leave wide open receivers every single play while not being able to finish with the pass rush, the falcons are gonna rip us a new one next Monday


Time to step it up guys

Dedhed
09-10-2012, 07:21 AM
Mays is a total liability in coverage. Ben made some good plays and Mays made some horrible--HORRIBLE--plays in coverage.

Yeah, this. We have to find a way to get him off the field on 3rd and long, it's like playing with ten men, but worse.

Requiem
09-10-2012, 07:23 AM
The Steelers were working the underneath game really well. Antonio Brown, Mike Wallace and Emanuel Sanders are all extremely fast and additionally quick off the line. Even Champ couldn't cover those guys all day with the kind of time Big Ben had on some of those 3rd and Forevers. It was really discouraging to see Roethlisberger keep extending those plays. I mean seriously, how many false start penalties did those turdball OL for the Steelers have? At least two a drive. It was beyond pathetic.

Overall, in re: pass coverage issues the biggest problem would be our linebackers, in particular Joe Mays (even though he's our NDSU Bison stud) who is extremely poor in pass coverage. It has been an issue of his going back to his FCS days with the Bison. This is where having DJ Williams suspended for 6 games hurts. There is no reason that Joe Mays should EVER be in on 3rd and Long situations.

As far as our safeties go: Rahim Moore made some mental mistakes as well, but had some solid plays in the game. Overall, outside a few plays, I was very impressed with Mike Adams. That play in the endzone was perfect coverage!

The Broncos need to look to the draft or FA to get some better LBers. If we are looking for the complete pacakge, it's Teo from Notre Dame. He is going to be absolutely phenomenal. Probably not as good as Kuechly (BC, now Panthers) coming out, but definitely a Top 20 selection. If we can't get him, Kevin Reddick of the Heels would be nice a round or two later. C.J. Mosley and Jonathan Brown are two underclassmen who should declare that would be valuable OLB options who have ability to cover well, especialy Mosley. That guy is gonna be awesome in the NFL.

WolfpackGuy
09-10-2012, 07:25 AM
They seemed to be better against the pass when they got up in the receivers' faces which didn't happen until the second half.

Roethlisberger is going to make his plays and has proven repeatedly he can keep plays alive, so he should get some credit.

The defense looks strong at the point of attack, but the yardage after the backs bounced outside was concerning.

Dedhed
09-10-2012, 07:28 AM
The expectations by some are insane. I honestly think a shut-out game wouldn't stop the
hand-wringing here.

We didn't have DJ. We have a rook and a guy that was out of football last year on the DL. A new DC. A new CB. Game 1 of the season. Plus we weren't playing Madden!

Lots of things to work on....but IMO the defense was as fun to watch as the O last night. Exciting times to be a fan of the Broncos
Third down was terrible any way you look at it, and if it doesn't get your attention you're simply distracted by the shine of a week one win and the fact that Manning looked good.

If you're thinking DJ is the answer, you're barking mad.

eddie mac
09-10-2012, 07:31 AM
Up until the last couple drives our pass defense was compete garbage, there was a wide open player NEARLY EVERY DAMN PLAY

Run defense was good though

You let a QB run around for 5 seconds and see if you can cover his receiving options. BIG Ben ran out of about 5-6 sacks alone then hit a receiver.

Drek
09-10-2012, 07:36 AM
Defense gives up less than 300 total yards to a perennial playoff team with a 2 time superbowl winning QB, terrific WRs, one of the best TEs in the game and you effing people complain.

Why do you directly associate voicing concern with complaining? If you saw a guy lifting a grand piano to a second story window with bailing twine would you give him a heads up, or would you just bite your tongue to avoid looking like a complainer.

At CB we look three deep and strong at that.

The pass rush will get better, Wolfe looks like a great pick, Ayers looks like he'll be a good rotational player even if he fails to use his demotion as motivation to take the next step.

The run D is way better.

But the LBs and safeties still can't keep the ball out of the hands of every tom, dick, and harry the opposition lines up at TE or RB.

So if they can't handle guys like Heath Miller how exactly are they going to slow down Gronkowski and Hernandez? Its nice to know that Manning could throw up 48 in a shootout, but I'd much rather see the D figure this one glaring weakness out and step up to match Manning's game.

lolcopter
09-10-2012, 07:37 AM
You let a QB run around for 5 seconds and see if you can cover his receiving options. BIG Ben ran out of about 5-6 sacks alone then hit a receiver.

Explain Heath millers wide open TD pass then

Pass D was garbage all night up until that last drive where porter (finally) snagged a pick

Drek
09-10-2012, 07:40 AM
Explain Heath millers wide open TD pass then

Pass D was garbage all night up until that last drive where porter (finally) snagged a pick

Pass D wasn't bad, just any work done by our LBs and safeties. Moore was constantly a step out of position, Woodyard and Mays are lost in space, and Adams is solid in coverage but not great at reading the run or putting runners on the ground.

Irish Stout
09-10-2012, 07:45 AM
1. There was only one holding call against the Steelers, but they held all night giving Ben ample time to make a throw.

2. Coverage was often zone and they exploited it on 3rd downs between the safety and the LB.

3. We have coverage issues with our safeties and LBs... I finally agree that Mays is not going to cut it in pass coverage.

4. Ben Rapesaburger has only improved with time. The first three quarters of that game the man had incredible decision making and accuracy. It was one of the top performances I have seen from him ever. I cannot believe other QBs will look that good. We have a worry though when we face Ryan, Brady and Brees later this year.

RhymesayersDU
09-10-2012, 07:47 AM
Third down was terrible any way you look at it, and if it doesn't get your attention you're simply distracted by the shine of a week one win and the fact that Manning looked good.

This. I'm not saying there weren't positives, because there were. Holding them to two TDs and two FGs was good overall. But 3rd down was a nightmare.

Irish Stout
09-10-2012, 07:48 AM
As far as our safeties go: Rahim Moore made some mental mistakes as well, but had some solid plays in the game. Overall, outside a few plays, I was very impressed with Mike Adams. That play in the endzone was perfect coverage!



I thought Rahim Moore made more plays that saved mistackles from LBers than he made mental mistakes. I can see the kid is slowly coming around. Hopefully a few more games and he'll have his head on completely straight.

Speaking of tackles... I thought Del Rio was working with these guys on wrapping up and pulling down. Tackling over the last 5 years + has looked so bad for this team and last night wasn't much of an exception.

55CrushEm
09-10-2012, 07:49 AM
Sorry if I missed it....but.....where the hell was Ty Warren ? I don't think I saw him at all in the second half.

On IR tomorrow??

EDIT: Sorry....just saw the thread.

houghtam
09-10-2012, 08:13 AM
1st Quarter

3rd and 14 - Roethlisberger to Wallace for 13 yards, PUNT
3rd and 9 - Roethlisberger to Sanders for 13 yards, 1ST DOWN
3rd and 12 - Roethlisberger sacked by Wolfe, PUNT

2nd Quarter

3rd and 2 - Roethlisberger to Brown for 4 yards, 1ST DOWN
3rd and short - Roethlisberger inclomplete, FIELD GOAL
3rd and 3 - Redman rushes 6 yards, 1ST DOWN
3rd and 11 - Roethlisberger to Brown for 23 yards, 1ST DOWN
3rd and 13 - Roethlisberger to Sanders for 17 yards, 1ST DOWN
3rd and short - Roethlisberger to Miller for 4 yards, TOUCHDOWN

3rd Quarter

3rd and 12 - Roethlisberger to Sanders for 15 yards, 1ST DOWN
3rd and 3 - Roethlisberger rushes 2 yards, 4TH DOWN
3rd and 4 - Roethlisberger to Wallace for 7 yards, 1ST DOWN
3rd and 3 - Roethlisberger incomplete, FIELD GOAL
3rd and 10 - Roethlisberger incomplete, Pass Interference, 1ST DOWN
3rd and 18 - Roethlisberger to Miller for 23 yards, 1ST DOWN
3rd and 7 - Roethlisberger to Miller for 8 yards, 1ST DOWN

4th Quarter

3rd and 2 - Roethlisberger to Wallace for 3 yards, TOUCHDOWN
3rd and 3 - Roethlisberger incomplete
3rd and 5 - Roethlisberger sacked for loss of 10 yards, DOWNS

Roethlisberger's 3rd down stats:

11 of 15, 130 yards, 2 TDs - 2 sacks for -19 yards

Yeah, I'd say "excellent" is not a word that accurately describes our defense's performance last night, particularly on 3rd down. And this wasn't a matter of the defense being on the field too long, either. They allowed 6 straight 3rd down conversions in the 2nd quarter.

TonyR
09-10-2012, 08:20 AM
Yeah, I'd say "excellent" is not a word that accurately describes our defense's performance last night, particularly on 3rd down.

Ouch. Even uglier when you see it summarized like that. Gotta adjust and improve.

~Crash~
09-10-2012, 08:48 AM
Denver's D faced a team with zero running threat and still struggled that's a concern. Miller and Doom were next to invisable most of the night facing backups that's a concern and needs to get better. If teams can take out Doom and Miller easily our D will really struggle. Denver had ball 36 secs in 3rd qtr. Denver's D has to get off field alot quicker.

NFL the leauge is turning a blind eye to all holding you can tell .I think it is how they are helping the reffs.. by the way it is for all the teams .we were holding all game long. Hilarious! soo ... point is kind of glad they are letting this go on less players getting killed. less players getting in the back field with a full head of steam. look when we get our old reffs back they can keep the injories down the way they do it but this is working for now.

Mountain Bronco
09-10-2012, 09:08 AM
Ben extends plays better than anyone in the game, but the third down defense needs to get better no doubt. Run D looked solid and while Pitt doesn't have a great RB, they did run the ball often and we stuffed it, so that is good. Corners were actually pretty good tonight, but damn the tight end killing us, freaking drives me nuts. There is all this praise for Mays, but dude made some awful plays on the Miller TD and a huge missed tackle.

~Crash~
09-10-2012, 09:12 AM
Mays is what he is goodgame ....bad games ... slow!

Drunken.Broncoholic
09-10-2012, 09:13 AM
We have 3rd down issues.

The defense was doing its job all night long getting their offense into 3rd and longs. Then fall apart on the 3rd down. They convert a 1st, then play well until that following 3rd down. Happened on more than a few drives.

FrankieTwoThumbs
09-10-2012, 09:14 AM
The fact that they converted a lot of 3rd and longs was discouraging. The fact that they were in 3rd and long a lot was a wonderful improvement on last season though, and I am guessing teams not named Steelers or Patriots won't have the same success.

Edit: Crap, a little too late.

lolcopter
09-10-2012, 09:17 AM
The fact that they converted a lot of 3rd and longs was discouraging. The fact that they were in 3rd and long a lot was a wonderful improvement on last season though, and I am guessing teams not named Steelers or Patriots won't have the same success.

Edit: Crap, a little too late.

the falcons, texans, and saints might

DENVERDUI55
09-10-2012, 09:21 AM
I thought D played well except 3rd and longs. We filled gaps good in the run game, contained pass until 3rd and long. As I said after the first preseason game when everyone was saying how awesome the pass rush is I thought it is still a concern. Other than VonDOOM and Wolfe here and there the push won't affect the really good QBs in the league. D was worked over during he whole strectch when Manning ran 2 plays for basically 2 quarters but to give them credit we led that time 7-6.

FrankieTwoThumbs
09-10-2012, 09:26 AM
the falcons, texans, and saints might

Maybe. I think Ben actually had a lot to do with it, as I think our pass rush will show better against less elusive qb's. The TE's of the Pats will probably still kill us, but I am hoping our pass rush vs their new line counters it a bit. I may be delusional, but I think we will hold our own against the falcons and texans.

Beantown Bronco
09-10-2012, 09:40 AM
Speaking of tackles... I thought Del Rio was working with these guys on wrapping up and pulling down. Tackling over the last 5 years + has looked so bad for this team and last night wasn't much of an exception.

The new CBA has REALLY cut down on the number of offseason practices and amount of contact allowed during the practices. There's only so much the coaches can do given the new constraints.

2KBack
09-10-2012, 09:45 AM
Looked to me like the gameplan was not to give up the big play. So coverage was soft. After the lost 3rd quarter it appeared that Del Rio allowed the the coverage to tighten up a bit.

It's like our defense played right into the ball control that Pitt planned on using.

Dedhed
09-10-2012, 09:47 AM
I thought Rahim Moore made more plays that saved mistackles from LBers than he made mental mistakes. I can see the kid is slowly coming around. Hopefully a few more games and he'll have his head on completely straight.I agree. I thought Moore's play last night was encouraging. He was in better position overall, and came close to a couple of really big plays. He's certainly ahead of where he was at any point last year, and if he can continue to improve he could develop into a playmaker given his athleticism.

The Rahim "the dream" Moore in his intro was annoying, but his play on the field was much improved over last season.

Drunken.Broncoholic
09-10-2012, 09:53 AM
I agree. I thought Moore's play last night was encouraging. He was in better position overall, and came close to a couple of really big plays. He's certainly ahead of where he was at any point last year, and if he can continue to improve he could develop into a playmaker given his athleticism.

The Rahim "the dream" Moore in his intro was annoying, but his play on the field was much improved over last season.

He showed great speed and almost had that int. I too saw some improvement in him.

TheElusiveKyleOrton
09-10-2012, 09:58 AM
Ben was doing what Ben does. Extending play, turning nothing into something. Specifically on third down, the guy just doesn't say die.

I know it's taboo to give credit to opposing players here, but he's the best there is at extending, finding a receiver, and getting the ball there. The best.

Pick Six
09-10-2012, 10:00 AM
Ben is a smart quarterback, and the Steelers are a very good team. I have no problem with the way we played. This isn't the Raiders. Once again, I think the Steelers will be battling us for AFC supremacy...

TonyR
09-10-2012, 10:04 AM
...turning nothing into something.

"Junk into jewels" is how I think Al Michaels (or was it Collinsworth?) described it at one point last night.

Dedhed
09-10-2012, 10:04 AM
Ben was doing what Ben does. Extending play, turning nothing into something. Specifically on third down, the guy just doesn't say die.

I know it's taboo to give credit to opposing players here, but he's the best there is at extending, finding a receiver, and getting the ball there. The best.I can live with BB making a play with his legs and waiting for a WR to uncover, which he did 3-4 on 3rd down.

It's the other nine third and longs that were converted that are the issue.

DivineLegion
09-10-2012, 10:04 AM
Looking around the league, we were one of the few defenses to allow less than 300 yards of total offense. We gave up 209 through the air, and 47 on the ground. The defensive line is excellent, I see a drastic improvement here. The linebackers good at pluging gaps in the run game, but lackluster in the passing game. The linebackers poor play in the passing game leads me to my biggest concern which is 3rd down defense. We gave up 11 first downs on 15 attempts. A good portion of this can be attributed to Ben's escapability, which is one thing he does better than any other QB in the league. The other was poor pass coverage from our LB's. It wasn't until Del Rio took Woodyard off of Heath Miller, and replaced him with Adams; that the broncos had any chance of eleminating the TE. This is definitly going to be an area of concern for the season, and is going to require someone like Tarvathian to step up, or one hell of a coaching job by JDR.

Jetmeck
09-10-2012, 11:40 AM
The defense was not excellent by any stretch.

They get kudos for holding PITT to some FGs and making the big play at the end, but we have got to get off the field on 3rd and long. We have to.


exactly right, be very careful of full on homers....some can't handle the truth.

Bacchus
09-10-2012, 11:44 AM
I'm a bit concerned with the lack of pressure for much of the game against a patchwork O-line. And then when we did get pressure Ben often made us pay by finding the vacated zone. I'm also concerned how the receiving TE has become a weapon for many teams in the league so we're going to be seeing a lot of them, and we really struggle covering them. Finally, I'm a bit worried how we allowed their slow RB's to bounce outside so often. What will we do when we have burners do that to us and there's nobody there to help? But all in all hard to argue with the end result last night.

I thought the defense got a lot of pressure on Ben he is just very hard to bring down and he moves very well. There were many times Ben had to leave the pocket because of pressure.

SonOfLe-loLang
09-10-2012, 11:48 AM
The defense isnt perfect, but its not nearly as bad as some are making it out to be. We didnt give up a ton of yards or points. Yes, third down D was bad, and some of that is schematic, but thats also Ben's forte. He gets paid too.

I loved our last defensive possession. Yes, the game seemed over, but we've watched teams drive down on us for quick scores in those situations only to hold our collective breath during an onsides kick. Von shut the door. It was awesome.

lonestar
09-10-2012, 12:03 PM
Defense was not good tonight. The third and long conversions by Pittsburgh sucked. Something to be concerned with long term, or just Big Ben being Big Ben?

YOU decide, OMane.

both..

Bacchus
09-10-2012, 12:04 PM
He showed great speed and almost had that int. I too saw some improvement in him.

Exactly, He seemed like the fastest guy out on the defense.

eff1ngham
09-10-2012, 12:05 PM
I thought the defense got a lot of pressure on Ben he is just very hard to bring down and he moves very well. There were many times Ben had to leave the pocket because of pressure.

This is what I thought as well. We did a good job of getting the Steelers into 3rd and long, but Ben avoided the rush well a few times, and then others where the coverage was good initially, he bought time and found an open guy (something he does better than almost every QB in the league).

I think against less mobile QBs (Ryan, Schaub, for example) we might had more success on 3rd down. Guess we'll find out soon

MagicHef
09-10-2012, 12:26 PM
They allowed 6 straight 3rd down conversions in the 2nd quarter.

I don't think an incomplete pass and forcing the Steelers to settle for 3 counts as a 3rd down conversion.

NFLBRONCO
09-10-2012, 12:28 PM
Should we freak out NO
Should we wonder a bit Yes (Even though we know we need lots more help on D.

Can you imagine last night if Starting RB played at all?

A healthy balanced O will give us fits. Luckily not all QB's are as tough as Big Ben in the pocket.

Broncomutt
09-10-2012, 12:32 PM
The third down thing has always been frustrating, but when the game was within the Steelers reach (25-19 with 3 min to go), their last 5 offensive plays of the game:

Pick Six
Sack
10 yard pass
Sack
Sack

There was some suckage, but there was some clutch play also by the defense.

NFLBRONCO
09-10-2012, 12:34 PM
The third down thing has always been frustrating, but when the game was within the Steelers reach (25-19 with 3 min to go), their last 5 offensive plays of the game:

Pick Six
Sack
10 yard pass
Sack
Sack

There was some suckage, but there was some clutch play also by the defense.

True plus we'll get better as season goes on

menonite
09-10-2012, 12:35 PM
"mediocre and possibly lousy"

Just get off the dang field. Loved the last drive. More of that please.

Hulamau
09-10-2012, 12:36 PM
The defense was not excellent by any stretch.

They get kudos for holding PITT to some FGs and making the big play at the end, but we have got to get off the field on 3rd and long. We have to.

MUch of this was first game screw ups in the secondary and LB corp and the fact that once Big Ben does what he does so well on nearly every defense, and pulled 3rd down rabbits out of his hat early quickly led to our D getting really gassed in the second and third quarters.

I mean they were on the field foreverm which becomes a self-fulfilling nightmare for the defense as with each 3rd and long the steelers converted the easier it was to do it again with our guys sucking that much more wind.

The D didnt break though as it would have with the lesser defensive backfield and front 7s of years past and that is a huge thing! Even when they didnt have their legs under them any longer as Champ said after the game, they still hung in there and kept a real lid on top of this game until

PEYTON MotherF***KING MANNING could get back on the field and ram another 80 yard drive down their throats!

Its very common for the DBs on most teams to struggle some against top tier QBs .. especially in weeks 1 or 2. They will tighten things up for sure in hte next couple weeks ahead, and the vast majority of QBs we face will not be as consistently successful at extending plays as Big Ben usually is and was last night.

Brady and Brees will be tough and likely Ryan later this week as well. But our QB pressure is going to look more like it did in the fourth quarter as well going forward and the DBs will feed off this game and tighten things up for sure.

Hulamau
09-10-2012, 12:48 PM
This was first game with Del Rio calling the D, First game with Manning led offense, first game with new defensive backfield and new D line ....

I'm not worried at all, things will gel week by week, I do hope Ty Warren can play and stay on the field as soon as possible. He's a force in the middle when healthy. Vickerson held he own pretty much in substitution, in spite of a couple discipline related penalties.

Pick Six
09-10-2012, 12:54 PM
This was first game with Del Rio calling the D, First game with Manning led offense, first game with new defensive backfield and new D line ....

I'm not worried at all, things will gel week by week, I do hope Ty Warren can play and stay on the field as soon as possible. He's a force in the middle when healthy. Vickerson held he own pretty much in substitution, in spite of a couple discipline related penalties.

Vickerson actually played better than he has, in a long time. Of course, that isn't saying much...

baja
09-10-2012, 01:26 PM
1. There was only one holding call against the Steelers, but they held all night giving Ben ample time to make a throw.

2. Coverage was often zone and they exploited it on 3rd downs between the safety and the LB.

3. We have coverage issues with our safeties and LBs... I finally agree that Mays is not going to cut it in pass coverage.

4. Ben Rapesaburger has only improved with time. The first three quarters of that game the man had incredible decision making and accuracy. It was one of the top performances I have seen from him ever. I cannot believe other QBs will look that good. We have a worry though when we face Ryan, Brady and Brees later this year.

This is the best take I have seen so far on the D's performance.

I think many people are undervaluing Big Ben's play last night. Playing the way he did they would have blown out the Broncos team of last year.

Amazing amount of improvement over last season and we are just starting to find out identity. This will be a playoff team to be reckoned if we can stay reasonably healthy.


Speaking of health what is the story with Warren?

houghtam
09-10-2012, 01:55 PM
I don't think an incomplete pass and forcing the Steelers to settle for 3 counts as a 3rd down conversion.

You know what, you're right. How about I change

"they allowed 6 straight 3rd down conversions in the 2nd quarter"

to

"they allowed one 3rd down conversion on a 10 play, 60 yard FG drive and four 3rd down conversions on a 14 play, 89 yard TD drive, on back to back drives in the 2nd quarter"

Does that really make you feel any better?

Rock Chalk
09-10-2012, 06:04 PM
Not for nothign Drek, because you are one of the few people here that doesnt talk out of his ass 99% of the time, but when most of these morons open their mouth, they are complaining.

Which makes them no different than any other retarded fanbase. Ive just got a personal connetion to the Bronco fan base which makes it intolerable.

CB we are 3 deep, Champ, Porter and Harris are all starter quality corners. Safeties are adequate. Not bad, not spectacular. LBs are downright horrible in pass coverage, no one is denying that.

But to act like we face QBs like Big Ben who is going to escape the sacks and pressure the Broncos put on him last night every week is ****ing asinine. We pressure Brady or Schaub like we pressured Rapistburger, we are going to win those games.

And some of those 3rd down conversions were just us ****ting the bed. We had them stopped and failed, but it wasnt because of lack of quality players, just blown defenses. We actually had at least 8 blown coverages that the Rapist missed because of pressure.


Why do you directly associate voicing concern with complaining? If you saw a guy lifting a grand piano to a second story window with bailing twine would you give him a heads up, or would you just bite your tongue to avoid looking like a complainer.

At CB we look three deep and strong at that.

The pass rush will get better, Wolfe looks like a great pick, Ayers looks like he'll be a good rotational player even if he fails to use his demotion as motivation to take the next step.

The run D is way better.

But the LBs and safeties still can't keep the ball out of the hands of every tom, dick, and harry the opposition lines up at TE or RB.

So if they can't handle guys like Heath Miller how exactly are they going to slow down Gronkowski and Hernandez? Its nice to know that Manning could throw up 48 in a shootout, but I'd much rather see the D figure this one glaring weakness out and step up to match Manning's game.

CEH
09-10-2012, 06:12 PM
Not for nothign Drek, because you are one of the few people here that doesnt talk out of his ass 99% of the time, but when most of these morons open their mouth, they are complaining.

Which makes them no different than any other retarded fanbase. Ive just got a personal connetion to the Bronco fan base which makes it intolerable.

CB we are 3 deep, Champ, Porter and Harris are all starter quality corners. Safeties are adequate. Not bad, not spectacular. LBs are downright horrible in pass coverage, no one is denying that.

But to act like we face QBs like Big Ben who is going to escape the sacks and pressure the Broncos put on him last night every week is ****ing asinine. We pressure Brady or Schaub like we pressured Rapistburger, we are going to win those games.

And some of those 3rd down conversions were just us ****ting the bed. We had them stopped and failed, but it wasnt because of lack of quality players, just blown defenses. We actually had at least 8 blown coverages that the Rapist missed because of pressure.

I agree.

There is no one in the NFL except Big Ben who can move and fight for a 2nd chance and still make the completion.

It's the first game under a new DC against a top 5 team.

Win or lose last night I like our team going forward

Agamemnon
09-10-2012, 06:56 PM
Should we freak out NO
Should we wonder a bit Yes (Even though we know we need lots more help on D.

Can you imagine last night if Starting RB played at all?

A healthy balanced O will give us fits. Luckily not all QB's are as tough as Big Ben in the pocket.

I really don't think we would've had that much trouble with Mendenhall.

LRtagger
09-10-2012, 07:24 PM
Mays doesn't need to be covering TEs. Teams with good TEs will beat us to death on mismatches. If you have to have Mays on the field on 3rd down he needs to be blitzing 99% of the time. Preferred solution would be Danny T on the field for 3rd downs. I think as the season rolls on Fox will roll some of the youth onto the field.

lonestar
09-11-2012, 09:07 AM
Mays doesn't need to be covering TEs. Teams with good TEs will beat us to death on mismatches. If you have to have Mays on the field on 3rd down he needs to be blitzing 99% of the time. Preferred solution would be Danny T on the field for 3rd downs. I think as the season rolls on Fox will roll some of the youth onto the field.

JDR as an ex all pro LB just maybe be able to coach mays up on the weaknesses in his game..

TonyR
09-11-2012, 09:13 AM
JDR as an ex all pro LB just maybe be able to coach mays up on the weaknesses in his game..

You can't "coach up" a lack of lateral quickness. There's a reason the Eagles dumped him despite a weakness at the position.

lonestar
09-11-2012, 10:22 AM
You can't "coach up" a lack of lateral quickness. There's a reason the Eagles dumped him despite a weakness at the position.

Hey JDR got him a nice contract. I'm guessing he saw something there you have not.

My money for now is on Mays.

houghtam
09-11-2012, 10:23 AM
Hey JDR got him a nice contract. I'm guessing he saw something there you have not.

My money for now is on Mays.

Care to wager with me? Mays is terrible.

lonestar
09-11-2012, 10:31 AM
Care to wager with me? Mays is terrible.

While I was. Not
Impressed myself. I will still wait for JDR who knows DL and LBs to make that call.

As for a bet. I only bet on sure things.