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Bronco Rob
05-15-2012, 03:49 PM
Elway couldn't pass on Manning's heir apparent


Arnie Stapleton Tuesday May 15, 2012 - 4:20 PM


ENGLEWOOD, Colo. (AP) - John Elway says he just couldn't pass on Peyton Manning's heir apparent, even though he hopes Brock Osweiler will be holding a clipboard for years to come.

Elway said he had to "sacrifice the short-term for the long-term" when he used a second-round pick last month on the Arizona State quarterback rather than drafting a player who could help Manning right away.

The boss of the Denver Broncos was joined by coach John Fox in an hour-long conference call with 6,000 season ticket holders Tuesday, and one caller from suburban Broomfield asked Elway for his reasoning in selecting Osweiler with the 57th overall pick.

The Hall of Fame quarterback, who rejoined the Broncos last year as vice president of football operations, replied: "It's always tough to pick a quarterback that you know is not going to play for you for a while. But I think we have high hopes for him in the future to where once Peyton decides to hang them up that he's the guy in waiting that can keep this (going) and we don't miss a beat ... and we can continue to compete for world championships year in and year out."

Manning signed a five-year, $96 million deal in Denver after his release from Indianapolis. His father, Archie, has said he thinks his son is "year-to-year" after missing all of last season because of a nerve injury that caused weakness in his throwing arm.

Manning, however, has said he intends to fulfill all five years of his contract.

That would mean a long apprenticeship for Osweiler, a 21-year-old righty from Montana who stands 6-foot-8 and is working hard to fix flaws in his throwing motion to better capitalize on his height advantage. http://www.orangemane.com/BB/showthread.php?t=105508

"It's a perfect situation where there's not the pressure for him to come in and start right away," Elway said. "He's not ready for that. But he's also going to learn from Peyton and ... I think it's a great learning experience for him to where we are set for the future.

"And he's our guy for the future," Elway said. "And sometimes we have to sacrifice the short-term for the long-term to grab the guy that you believe can be that next guy for you, and that's Brock Osweiler."


For The Rest... http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/story/19055616/elway-couldnt-pass-on-mannings-heir-apparent

Kaylore
05-15-2012, 03:53 PM
He's really high on this guy. I hope he sees something I don't. I don't think he sucks the way other people do, but Elway talks like this guy is a franchise QB. I don't see the skill set. He's "ok". I know people say he didn't start very much, but that's kind of a my point. I have no idea how he is as a leader of men, but he comes off as rah-rah type. That might work in college but he seems like kind of a goober to me.

Mind you I'm not saying he sucks or is going to suck, just not sure what the big deal is...

BroncoBeavis
05-15-2012, 03:55 PM
But I think we have high hopes for him in the future to where once Peyton decides to hang them up that he's the guy in waiting that can keep this (going) and we don't miss a beat ... and we can continue to compete for world championships year in and year out."]

Good to know John goes in with such reasonable expectations.

Smiling Assassin27
05-15-2012, 03:57 PM
Good to know John goes in with such reasonable expectations.

You expect titles, you just might get 'em. You expect failure, you get the KC Chiefs.


Sincerely,

Tony Robbins

lolcopter
05-15-2012, 03:57 PM
He's really high on this guy. I hope he sees something I don't. I don't think he sucks the way other people do, but Elway talks like this guy is a franchise QB. I don't see the skill set. He's "ok". I know people say he didn't start very much, but that's kind of a my point. I have no idea how he is as a leader of men, but he comes off as rah-rah type. That might work in college but he seems like kind of a goober to me.

Mind you I'm not saying he sucks or is going to suck, just not sure what the big deal is...



He's a tall pocket passer with a quick release and strong arm

What skill set are you not seeing exactly?

Also lol at the rah rah leadership comment given the last guy we had under center

McD more rings than Elway
05-15-2012, 04:02 PM
Looking at the history of the sit-and-wait QBs (Steve McNair, Aaron Rodgers, Philip Rivers), I think there's a good chance Osweiler works out if he gets the opportunity to sit for three years.Todd Graham, the new ASU coach from Pitt, is an a-hole. I don't blame Osweiler for leaving. With 4,000+ yards and 26 TDs, I like the on-field performance from him too when you factor in that he was a redshirt-sophomore. In terms of ability, Osweiler was a better value in the late 2nd than no-upside Brandon Weeden in the 1st or project QB Ryan Tannehill at 8th overall. One round later, a midget (Russell Wilson) and a Kyle Orton clone (Nick Foles) get taken.

Kaylore
05-15-2012, 04:07 PM
He's a tall pocket passer with a quick release and strong arm

What skill set are you not seeing exactly?

Also lol at the rah rah leadership comment given the last guy we had under center

Well I wasn't the biggest proponent for Tebow being a starting a QB. I was against drafting him and still luke-warm on his chances in the NFL, though I did love him, the guy.

And being tall and having a quick release isn't "skill." I'm talking about accuracy, reading defenses, making good decisions and managing a game. Kind of "meh" in those categories I think you'll agree.

lolcopter
05-15-2012, 04:10 PM
Well I wasn't the biggest proponent for Tebow being a starting a QB. I was against drafting him and still luke-warm on his chances in the NFL, though I did love him, the guy.

And being tall and having a quick release isn't "skill." I'm talking about accuracy, reading defenses, making good decisions and managing a game. Kind of "meh" in those categories I think you'll agree.

I would argue that physical attribute certainly do fall under a skill set, and while he does have plenty of work to do in those other areas, it's not as if the guy has a ton of experience to play off of. He has all the physical tools, he just needs to build on the mental aspects of the game which requires time and practice

Chris
05-15-2012, 04:11 PM
do you think elway gets a boner when he watches twilight

BroncoBeavis
05-15-2012, 04:12 PM
He's a tall pocket passer with a quick release and strong arm

What skill set are you not seeing exactly?r

The one where he replaces Peyton frickin' Manning and nobody misses a beat.

Kaylore
05-15-2012, 04:13 PM
Talent and skill are two different things. Having a strong arm, being tall, athleticism - those are things you are born with. You can improve them in some small measure. Skill is proficiency built from knowledge, practice and aptitude. Having a quick mind mind help you process information to read a defense, but reading a defense is a skill.

Chris
05-15-2012, 04:14 PM
Talent and skill are two different things. Having a strong arm, being tall, athleticism - those are things you are born with. You can improve them in some small measure. Skill is proficiency built from knowledge, practice and aptitude. Having a quick mind mind help you process information to read a defense, but reading a defense is a skill.

So in essence, despite their both being pocket passers, Osweiler is the polar opposite of Peyton Manning.

Pony Boy
05-15-2012, 04:16 PM
He's really high on this guy. I hope he sees something I don't. I don't think he sucks the way other people do, but Elway talks like this guy is a franchise QB. I don't see the skill set. He's "ok". I know people say he didn't start very much, but that's kind of a my point. I have no idea how he is as a leader of men, but he comes off as rah-rah type. That might work in college but he seems like kind of a goober to me.

Mind you I'm not saying he sucks or is going to suck, just not sure what the big deal is...

I agree with most of what you say in this post but I hope Elway is right in what he sees in him. I just don't see a team in the SEC or Big 12 that he would have started for in 2011.

Smiling Assassin27
05-15-2012, 04:19 PM
I would argue that physical attribute certainly do fall under a skill set, and while he does have plenty of work to do in those other areas, it's not as if the guy has a ton of experience to play off of. He has all the physical tools, he just needs to build on the mental aspects of the game which requires time and practice


Meh, he'll never get to actually see the field.



Sincerely,

Jim Sorgi

lolcopter
05-15-2012, 04:42 PM
Meh, he'll never get to actually see the field.



Sincerely,

Jim Sorgi

Wasn't sorgi like a 6th round pick?

Chris
05-15-2012, 05:03 PM
Yes and so was Painter (may have been a 7th).

Kaylore
05-15-2012, 05:08 PM
I agree with most of what you say in this post but I hope Elway is right in what he sees in him. I just don't see a team in the SEC or Big 12 that he would have started for in 2011.

That's high praise since SEC QB's typically suck balls. ;D

elsid13
05-15-2012, 05:19 PM
I agree with most of what you say in this post but I hope Elway is right in what he sees in him. I just don't see a team in the SEC or Big 12 that he would have started for in 2011.

I think he isn't that good, but there are number of team in both the Big 12 (Kansas, TT, Iowa State) and Sec (old Miss, Miss State, Auburn South Carolina) that he would have started at.

Bottom line I think Elway felt very comfortable with someone both his son and a friend (Ericson) spoke highly of.

TheReverend
05-15-2012, 05:59 PM
The last time we went from a GOAT QB to a 2nd rounder we missed more than a beat...

SonOfLe-loLang
05-15-2012, 06:04 PM
The last time we went from a GOAT QB to a 2nd rounder we missed more than a beat...

I think Griese was a third, but im picking nits

R-Mac
05-15-2012, 06:14 PM
With one more season as a starter at Arizona State, Osweiler probably would have been a first round pick in 2013. There were eight first round quarterbacks in the last two drafts. Blaine Gabbert was far from impressive at Missouri, he could not produce better stats than undrafted free agent Chase Daniel. Gabbert was a top ten pick because a team saw upside in a combination of prototypical size, arm strength and athletic ability. And Gabbert is not even a tough guy in the pocket, while Osweiler finishes his throws even when he knows he's going to get hit. Christian Ponder was a surprise first round pick. The Browns just drafted a twenty eight year-old quarterback in the first round.

The problem in the current situation is that Osweiler won't have one more season of experience on the field to get better. The upside is still there, but he will spend the season out of the field, holding a clipboard and watching film. At least the Broncos invested in a quarterback of the future, something that could have saved Bill Polian's job. Polian lost his job because he did not care about the backup quarterback. The Colts never needed Jim Sorgi, but they needed the dreadful Curtis Painter when Peyton Manning had several neck surgeries. And look what happened.

You don't know when you'll need your backup quarterback, but you better have someone ready and talented enough to win games.

WolfpackGuy
05-15-2012, 06:25 PM
If he keeps his elbow up like in that mini camp video, I might change my mind on his throwing.

Gotta fix that arm coming through late when he tries to put something on it though.

The ball should be exploding out of the arm of someone who is 6'7" or whatever.

ColoradoDarin
05-15-2012, 06:34 PM
I don't believe a single word out of Elway's mouth, he's got this lying thing down.

TheReverend
05-15-2012, 06:37 PM
I think Griese was a third, but im picking nits

Repped for correcting.

Point remains.

Bigdawg26
05-15-2012, 06:50 PM
Man Elway is really in love with this kid! He's got all the tools to be good. I just hope he learns the nuances of the game and how to prepare from the two of the best QB's to ever play the game.

SoCalBronco
05-15-2012, 07:01 PM
He's really high on this guy. I hope he sees something I don't. I don't think he sucks the way other people do, but Elway talks like this guy is a franchise QB. I don't see the skill set. He's "ok". I know people say he didn't start very much, but that's kind of a my point. I have no idea how he is as a leader of men, but he comes off as rah-rah type. That might work in college but he seems like kind of a goober to me.

Mind you I'm not saying he sucks or is going to suck, just not sure what the big deal is...

I suspect he is one of those GM's that just wants to take a QB every year to have a full system of young talent so there's always a potential answer and/or young talent to work with in the system. I'm not sure it was a great idea to take him at 2 (IMO, other needs far more pressing than developmental QB, even if you like him alot, which I agree with you that he seems to), but I think we'll always see us picking a QB to work with. Hopefully, McCoy will work with him and he'll grow over time. He has some decent physical skills.

Hulamau
05-15-2012, 09:23 PM
He's really high on this guy. I hope he sees something I don't. I don't think he sucks the way other people do, but Elway talks like this guy is a franchise QB. I don't see the skill set. He's "ok". I know people say he didn't start very much, but that's kind of a my point. I have no idea how he is as a leader of men, but he comes off as rah-rah type. That might work in college but he seems like kind of a goober to me.

Mind you I'm not saying he sucks or is going to suck, just not sure what the big deal is...

My take it that Elway sees a football smart kid who is only going to get far better in his ability to read defenses and command the offense with the time he has to learn and yet he also feels Brock has such an intriguing and promising combination of size mixed with decent foot speed and a very fast and quite accurate release married to a huge arm that can make all the throws. And from all reports from his one year as a starter, he's a tough kid and not easy to get down and is a determined competitor as well.

He may seem a little rah rah now, but he is also barely 21 and hardly wet behind the ears. He will mature and settle down soon enough.

The truth is, if he has 80% of the potential and skill set when Peyton hangs it up that Elway apparently is convinced he can and will develop, this move will be seen as pure genius for years to come and would cement Elway as an all-world GM and FO football god on par with his on the field rep. If this is how it pans out, more or less, Elway would have simultaneously turned around the franchise not only in the near term but for well more than a decade after Manning rides off into the sunset with at least one or two SBs under his wing...

Sounds good to me! :flower:

I, for one, am willing to give Elway a large amount of leeway here and benefit of any doubt when it comes to picking a QB project that has the raw goods on all levels to become great it he works at it. And this kid seems fired up to work hard and, apparently, won't be the kind that will resort to sulking and pouting in the corner now that he has to hold the clipboard for at least 3 years.

It truly is the ideal set up for Osweiler. If he really does become a franchise starter, just think of how he will tear up defenses with that height, arm and quick release once he has better mastered the game with Peyton and Elway as his mentors?

The more I watch and learn of him the better I like this scenario! Time will tell, but it very well could turn out to be a monster move drafting Osweiler.

Elway certainly isn't mincing his words or hedging his bets here. He is sold on this guy and that is good news in my book.

One thing is for sure, there is no way we could have found any other QB with his degree of potential and talent that was available in this draft, at any point from our first pick on downward, that would also have been willing to wait as much as 3+ years before taking the reins.

Tombstone RJ
05-15-2012, 09:31 PM
I'm not real thrilled with the Browe pick. Aside from his quick release I'm not sure why Elway is so enamored with him. Unfortunately, I really do think it's Elways family connection to ASU. Hope I'm wrong.

Hulamau
05-15-2012, 09:36 PM
I'm not real thrilled with the Browe pick. Aside from his quick release I'm not sure why Elway is so enamored with him. Unfortunately, I really do think it's Elways family connection to ASU. Hope I'm wrong.

You really and honestly don't think Elway is that big an idiot do you that he would so willingly toss away a second round pick just because the kid is a buddy of his son, do you?!!?

Lestat
05-15-2012, 10:00 PM
Wasn't sorgi like a 6th round pick?

as was Curtis Painter. they were clipboard holders and nothing more.
Osweiler's ceiling is a franchise QB. unfortunately his floor is wash out journeyman QB. high risk, high reward. which is why i keep saying this specifically. if he's willing to buy in and become a pro and not just there for the lifestyle, the paycheck or just satisfied with making it. he can be a special, special QB. he has the size, the arm and the physical attributes to be a great player, his challenge to harness that will be all mental.

if he pushes himself, hones his craft and sells out to be great then we will be set for the next 15 years at QB.
if he gets cocky, complacent or belligerent then he'll bust out and we'll be doing this all over again in 3-5, searching for the next great Broncos QB.

Mogulseeker
05-15-2012, 10:28 PM
as was Curtis Painter. they were clipboard holders and nothing more.
Osweiler's ceiling is a franchise QB. unfortunately his floor is wash out journeyman QB. high risk, high reward. which is why i keep saying this specifically. if he's willing to buy in and become a pro and not just there for the lifestyle, the paycheck or just satisfied with making it. he can be a special, special QB. he has the size, the arm and the physical attributes to be a great player, his challenge to harness that will be all mental.

if he pushes himself, hones his craft and sells out to be great then we will be set for the next 15 years at QB.
if he gets cocky, complacent or belligerent then he'll bust out and we'll be doing this all over again in 3-5, searching for the next great Broncos QB.

This

sgbfan
05-15-2012, 11:12 PM
I think he is coming into the perfect situation, learning behind two hall of fame players. Both of whom were number one picks, were never back-ups in the NFL, and learned on the field.

I don't know what all the hype is about being a backup before being a starter. This is a pretty good article talking about how QB's have done according to how much they played as rookies. It argues that the players were better after sitting, but I think the numbers would be much different if they did it again this year

http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stat-analysis/2005/how-much-should-rookie-quarterbacks-play

Since then the tide has definitely swayed toward the "Big Ben's" and the "Eli's". Rookies have been starting a lot more and having a lot more success.

Newton, Dalton, Ponder, Gabbart, Bradford, Stafford, Sanchez, freeman,Trent Edwards, Flacco, Ryan, Cutler, V. Young, Matt Leinhart, John Skelton, Colt McCoy, Jimmy Clauson all got significant time as rookies.

Grodkowski, Croyle, J. Russell, Tavaris Jackson, Kevin Kolb, Chad Henne, Matt Flynn (will be a starter likely, has 2 starts now), Tyler Thigpen, Tebow, Locker are all guys that got (or expect to get) significant PT after not getting much as a rookie.

Granted, there is still a lot to tell, but in the last 6 years, there hasn't been too much excitement out of that second group. The first group has some duds in there too, but would sitting have helped any of them? The QBOTF is becoming a thing of the past.

That said, I hope they found a gem and he does learn without playing, and is ready to take over for Manning when its his turn.

SportinOne
05-15-2012, 11:29 PM
Personally, I'd rather have Russel Wilson. People keep talking about his height, but he has the perfect mental makeup for an NFL quarterback. They are already talking about him challenging for the starting spot as a rookie against a guy they shelled out free agent money for. Brock Osweiller? Jesus Christ... He doesn't even pass the name test. Then you watch him throw.. Phillis has the weird motion too but he also has the mental makeup to make things happen. You can telly by looking at him, he means business. Osweiller looks like he wants to wet himself.

broncocalijohn
05-15-2012, 11:43 PM
if he pushes himself, hones his craft and sells out to be great then we will be set for the next 15 years at QB.
if he gets cocky, complacent or belligerent then he'll bust out and we'll be doing this all over again in 3-5, searching for the next great Broncos QB.

Sounds like Jay Cutler.

Archer81
05-16-2012, 01:21 AM
Osweiler will show promise. When he does, we will trade him. That's what we do now.


:Broncos:

uplink
05-16-2012, 05:14 AM
If you take a good QB prospect and then teaching him up for a few years, he can be traded for a high draft pick later on the way the packers/eagles do it. Even a 3rd rounder in 3 years would be worth it since you got a quality 2nd string QB for 3 years. It would be good if the broncos got in the business of training young QBs.

I think the broncos are thinking this way, if Peyton says 5 years in Denver he means it baring injury.

uplink
05-16-2012, 05:24 AM
who would you rather have Colin Kaepernick or Brock Osweiler? Although Kaepernick is more athletic, they have similar body types. I think they are similar rated prospects, so the broncos did alright as Kaepernick was the 36 pick last year.

TheElusiveKyleOrton
05-16-2012, 05:52 AM
Osweiler will show promise. When he does, we will trade him. That's what we do now.


:Broncos:

At some point, you're really going to have to let it go.

WolfpackGuy
05-16-2012, 06:28 AM
Personally, I'd rather have Russel Wilson. People keep talking about his height, but he has the perfect mental makeup for an NFL quarterback. They are already talking about him challenging for the starting spot as a rookie against a guy they shelled out free agent money for. Brock Osweiller? Jesus Christ... He doesn't even pass the name test. Then you watch him throw.. Phillis has the weird motion too but he also has the mental makeup to make things happen. You can telly by looking at him, he means business. Osweiller looks like he wants to wet himself.

Wilson can play and make things happen.

The Squawks got themselves a very good player for cheap.

Agamemnon
05-16-2012, 06:56 AM
LOL at the idea this guy is going to replace Manning without missing a beat.

<---This what I think of that.

TonyR
05-16-2012, 07:12 AM
At some point, you're really going to have to let it go.

Seriously. Some people act like a line formed outside Dove Valley to acquire our last QB because of all the awesome promise he showed.

baja
05-16-2012, 07:13 AM
If you take a good QB prospect and then teaching him up for a few years, he can be traded for a high draft pick later on the way the packers/eagles do it. Even a 3rd rounder in 3 years would be worth it since you got a quality 2nd string QB for 3 years. It would be good if the broncos got in the business of training young QBs.

I think the broncos are thinking this way, if Peyton says 5 years in Denver he means it baring injury.

Yes this. I have wanted us to do this sense we got Manning. No one knows how much time Manning has to play could be anywhere from a part of a season to 6 seasons or more. We just don't know. Might as well draft, groom and trade back up QBs until we see him wearing down. Does anyone really think Osweller will sit on the bench for 5 years?

The Moops
05-16-2012, 07:18 AM
To say "We are set for the future" with a gangly, raw prospect with just 15 college starts and who may not make a regular season start till 2015 is a pretty incredulous statement.

But if that's what Elway believes than who is going to tell him the truth about The Easter Bunny?

BroncoBeavis
05-16-2012, 08:14 AM
LOL at the idea this guy is going to replace Manning without missing a beat.

<---This what I think of that.

I'll feel bad for Brock if he's ever brought in with this kind of talk going on.

You can't throw a rook into a QB-centered scheme and expect to be a contender right off the bat. Any kid they put in with that expectation is automatically set up to fail.

If John wants to compete for championships with a zero-experience QB, he'd better start focusing on defense, because that's the only way it can be done.

It's like John's forgotten everything but the last 3 years of his career or something. They don't come out of college as HOF'ers. That's a growth process.

sgbfan
05-16-2012, 08:21 AM
I'll feel bad for Brock if he's ever brought in with this kind of talk going on.

You can't throw a rook into a QB-centered scheme and expect to be a contender right off the bat. Any kid they put in with that expectation is automatically set up to fail.

If John wants to compete for championships with a zero-experience QB, he'd better start focusing on defense, because that's the only way it can be done.

It's like John's forgotten everything but the last 3 years of his career or something. They don't come out of college as HOF'ers. That's a growth process.

The exact reason I hated the pick. This and the thought of training a qb for 3-5 years without him seeing the field.

BroncoBen
05-16-2012, 08:22 AM
I really don't have a problem with the drafting of Brock Osweiler, people argue about winning now .. but you also have to prepare somewhat for the future at certain positions. And QB is one of them.

Reminds me of that saying... 'When is the best time to plant a tree..? Last year'.

Requiem
05-16-2012, 08:23 AM
Derek Methman Wolfe and Brock Slanging Rock Osweiler. second round drug picks.

BroncoBeavis
05-16-2012, 08:32 AM
I really don't have a problem with the drafting of Brock Osweiler, people argue about winning now .. but you also have to prepare somewhat for the future at certain positions. And QB is one of them.

Reminds me of that saying... 'When is the best time to plant a tree..? Last year'.

Yeah, but that's kind of a dumb thing to say after you just finished chopping down the tree that was planted two years earlier. :)

Beej
05-16-2012, 09:16 AM
Yes this. I have wanted us to do this sense we got Manning. No one knows how much time Manning has to play could be anywhere from a part of a season to 6 seasons or more. We just don't know. Might as well draft, groom and trade back up QBs until we see him wearing down. Does anyone really think Osweller will sit on the bench for 5 years?

Do you really think we can groom Brosweiler and trade him for more than
a 2nd?

TheElusiveKyleOrton
05-16-2012, 10:00 AM
Yeah, but that's kind of a dumb thing to say after you just finished chopping down the tree that was planted two years earlier. :)

The tree you refer to was more of a shrub.

peacepipe
05-16-2012, 10:17 AM
The tree you refer to was more of a shrub.

LOL

BroncoBeavis
05-16-2012, 10:30 AM
LOL

A shrub who could beat the Raiders, Kyle. Don't forget. Hilarious!

Lestat
05-16-2012, 10:51 AM
I think he is coming into the perfect situation, learning behind two hall of fame players. Both of whom were number one picks, were never back-ups in the NFL, and learned on the field.

I don't know what all the hype is about being a backup before being a starter. This is a pretty good article talking about how QB's have done according to how much they played as rookies. It argues that the players were better after sitting, but I think the numbers would be much different if they did it again this year

http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stat-analysis/2005/how-much-should-rookie-quarterbacks-play

Since then the tide has definitely swayed toward the "Big Ben's" and the "Eli's". Rookies have been starting a lot more and having a lot more success.

Newton, Dalton, Ponder, Gabbart, Bradford, Stafford, Sanchez, freeman,Trent Edwards, Flacco, Ryan, Cutler, V. Young, Matt Leinhart, John Skelton, Colt McCoy, Jimmy Clauson all got significant time as rookies.

Grodkowski, Croyle, J. Russell, Tavaris Jackson, Kevin Kolb, Chad Henne, Matt Flynn (will be a starter likely, has 2 starts now), Tyler Thigpen, Tebow, Locker are all guys that got (or expect to get) significant PT after not getting much as a rookie.

Granted, there is still a lot to tell, but in the last 6 years, there hasn't been too much excitement out of that second group. The first group has some duds in there too, but would sitting have helped any of them? The QBOTF is becoming a thing of the past.

That said, I hope they found a gem and he does learn without playing, and is ready to take over for Manning when its his turn.

it depends on the team, the set up and the current developmental state of the QB in question.
Brock is a sit and wait QB, Tannehill is as well but will likely be thrown into the fire. Gabbert and Ponder were sit and wait guys last year that got thrown in too early.

Matt Ryan, Big Ben, Eli, Dalton were all considered to be ready to play(though Ryan was not thought of as a true franchise guy).
the old school model has went away a bit as of late because if you take a guy high as your franchise QB he is expected to play early.

the fans wants to see their savior then and there. they don't want to wait as they sucked enough the previous few seasons to need a future franchise QB.

the old school way of developing guys is best if the QB needs it. me personally i don't like the model of throwing a rookie into the fire, you need to surround him with a good or better OL and some weapons. otherwise you risk turning them into David Carr.

baja
05-16-2012, 11:12 AM
Do you really think we can groom Brosweiler and trade him for more than
a 2nd?

Yup.

TheElusiveKyleOrton
05-16-2012, 11:23 AM
A shrub who could beat the Raiders, Kyle. Don't forget. Hilarious!

Okay, so it was a decent looking shrub some of the time.

Still not a tree.

razorwire77
05-16-2012, 11:45 AM
Osweiler's success in my opinion is going to depend in part on how much Peyton has left in the tank. If Manning is able to have two or three successful seasons here and in the interim Osweiler can sit and absorb NFL offenses, go through a couple of camps and preseasons, and really get comfortable reading NFL defenses I think he has the physical skill set to be quite successful. Like the other posts said, it comes down to his desire to be great vs. just being complacent with the money.

I still didn't like the pick, because with the signing of Manning it indicated a shift into a win now mode and I think there were a number of skill position guys on offense and front seven players on defense that could have immediately contributed to that goal.

If the Manning experiment and the win now strategy fails, considering this brutal schedule, the team will be lucky to win 5 games. It then becomes a moot point because you could draft a more NFL ready QB in top 10 in 2013.

Archer81
05-16-2012, 12:12 PM
At some point, you're really going to have to let it go.


I was referring to Cutler as well.

:Broncos:

TheElusiveKyleOrton
05-16-2012, 12:41 PM
I was referring to Cutler as well.

:Broncos:

Yes, and I get that.

The point stands.

Tombstone RJ
05-16-2012, 01:50 PM
You really and honestly don't think Elway is that big an idiot do you that he would so willingly toss away a second round pick just because the kid is a buddy of his son, do you?!!?

Yes I do. Again, I think this is an Elway ego pick. I said this from the beginning, this is a "I'm smarter than everyone else" pick.

Watch Brosweiler, just watch his "highlight" youtube stuff. It's all spread offense crap which by it's nature inflates a QBs stats. Brosweiler didn't have great college stats in a spread offense.

Granted, I haven't spent hours of time watching his game tape, but what little I've seen tells me he's raw, very raw. He's got a quick release which is great and a very nice thing to have. He's got a decent arm, but nothing special. He made some nice throws in college, he also made some terrible throws in college. So what makes this guy so damn special Elway just had to have him? IMHO, nothing.

Again, hope I'm wrong.

jonny1
05-16-2012, 02:00 PM
Matt Ryan, Big Ben, Eli, Dalton were all considered to be ready to play(though Ryan was not thought of as a true franchise guy).the old school model has went away a bit as of late because if you take a guy high as your franchise QB he is expected to play early.

Matt Ryan was drafted by the Falcons as the new face of the franchise, how is that NOT thought of as a franchise guy?

Lestat
05-16-2012, 02:02 PM
Yes I do. Again, I think this is an Elway ego pick. I said this from the beginning, this is a "I'm smarter than everyone else" pick.

Watch Brosweiler, just watch his "highlight" youtube stuff. It's all spread offense crap which by it's nature inflates a QBs stats. Brosweiler didn't have great college stats in a spread offense.

Granted, I haven't spent hours of time watching his game tape, but what little I've seen tells me he's raw, very raw. He's got a quick release which is great and a very nice thing to have. He's got a decent arm, but nothing special. He made some nice throws in college, he also made some terrible throws in college. So what makes this guy so damn special Elway just had to have him? IMHO, nothing.

Again, hope I'm wrong.

that's what every GM does when they take a player people don't agree with. so in that sence Elway did what everyone as a GM does. especially with QB's. hell Seattle did it with Wilson, Miami with Tannehill that high.

it's one thing to say you don't like the pick and think it's a bad one. it's a whole other issue to say you truly believe the GM is so dumb he let's his children cloud his job.

Lestat
05-16-2012, 02:13 PM
Matt Ryan was drafted by the Falcons as the new face of the franchise, how is that NOT thought of as a franchise guy?

you fail to remember what was said about Ryan in that draft.
very few were sold on him as a franchise QB. he was expected to go high because he was the top QB in the draft but he wasn't seen as a elite franchise guy. people were questioning how good he would be and felt he would be a solid QB but not a franchise guy. that's why when Long was taken #1 no one was really stunned.

that was a very very very weak QB class. only Ryan and Flacco went in the first round. the next guys off the board were in the 50's in Brohm and Henne.

outside of Ryan & Flacco the next best QB in that draft is probably Matt Flynn.

Tombstone RJ
05-16-2012, 02:14 PM
that's what every GM does when they take a player people don't agree with. so in that sence Elway did what everyone as a GM does. especially with QB's. hell Seattle did it with Wilson, Miami with Tannehill that high.

it's one thing to say you don't like the pick and think it's a bad one. it's a whole other issue to say you truly believe the GM is so dumb he let's his children cloud his job.

Look at the big picture, that's all I'm saying. If the team is in "win now" mode then drafting Broooooooock that high was tantamount to kicking the team in the nutz. It's a big F.U. pick.

Sure, GMs gamble on picks but out of desparation more than anything else. Last time I checked if Manning goes down, the Broncos are screwed, period. So why bring in a guy who is nothing special, why waste such a high pick on a nothing special QB prospect? Why not at least get some more defensive help so that IF Manning goes down, the defense can try and keep the Broncos in the game? Face it, if Manning goes down it's Hanie time 'cause Broooock ain't coming in.

If the Broncos wanted a developmental QB to sit and learn, pick up a guy in the 4-6 round. A guy who's raw but has upside. You can always draft a first round QB or trade for a QB on down the line (in 3 or so years after Manning hangs it up). I'm just not buying this whole "Brock is a special talent" thing that Elway is selling. There's nothing special about his kid, other than he's tall and played basketball for a while.

Meh, it's an ego pick and yes, I think Jack's connection to Brommy had a lot to do with it.

Lestat
05-16-2012, 02:26 PM
you're missing Elway's point. there is no plan B. he wanted to draft a guy he felt could one day be a franchise QB. if Osweiler goes back to school and improves he's getting taken where Tannehill is next season.

the rest of the QB's in the draft don't have the potential franchise QB ceiling(maybe Russell Wilson)that Osweiler does. so taking Cousins or someone like that later on in the draft to develop as a nice back up who could become a solid starter isn't in Elway's plan.
he wanted a guy who can sit behind Manning and develop into a stud.
that's what he got in Osweiler. he was sold on him much like he was reportedly sold on RGIII earlier on in the year. you get your guy now and let him develop rather than trying to get value later on.

now if we took him in the first round or at #36 then yeah i'd agree that Elway was foolish and smoking something. but he got the QB he was most sold on after the top 2(maybe 3 if they ranked Tannehill that high). now you have to develop that guy and get him to buy in.

ideally you get another DL at #57 but this move if it pans out allows us to focus on every other position in the next 3-4 drafts.
he's not going to play unless it's a blow out, Manning gets hurt or we're resting guys like the Colts did. so now instead of having to address QB after Manning retires(which if we took a QB in the 4th or lower would have done as that's what happened in Indy) we can address the team needs while moving forward with a set QB situation that puts us in the contenders driver seat for years to come.

if he fails, if Elway was wrong and if his ego got in the way of sanity then it become one of the worst picks in Broncos history.
but if he succeeds, if he meets his potential and expectations, if Elway was indeed right.
once again, we're set for 10-15 seasons at QB.
every GM wants their coach, their QB, their team. this is Elway doing that and balancing the present with the potential future.

Tombstone RJ
05-16-2012, 02:41 PM
you're missing Elway's point. there is no plan B. he wanted to draft a guy he felt could one day be a franchise QB. if Osweiler goes back to school and improves he's getting taken where Tannehill is next season.

the rest of the QB's in the draft don't have the potential franchise QB ceiling(maybe Russell Wilson)that Osweiler does. so taking Cousins or someone like that later on in the draft to develop as a nice back up who could become a solid starter isn't in Elway's plan.
he wanted a guy who can sit behind Manning and develop into a stud.
that's what he got in Osweiler. he was sold on him much like he was reportedly sold on RGIII earlier on in the year. you get your guy now and let him develop rather than trying to get value later on.

now if we took him in the first round or at #36 then yeah i'd agree that Elway was foolish and smoking something. but he got the QB he was most sold on after the top 2(maybe 3 if they ranked Tannehill that high). now you have to develop that guy and get him to buy in.

ideally you get another DL at #57 but this move if it pans out allows us to focus on every other position in the next 3-4 drafts.
he's not going to play unless it's a blow out, Manning gets hurt or we're resting guys like the Colts did. so now instead of having to address QB after Manning retires(which if we took a QB in the 4th or lower would have done as that's what happened in Indy) we can address the team needs while moving forward with a set QB situation that puts us in the contenders driver seat for years to come.

if he fails, if Elway was wrong and if his ego got in the way of sanity then it become one of the worst picks in Broncos history.
but if he succeeds, if he meets his potential and expectations, if Elway was indeed right.
once again, we're set for 10-15 seasons at QB.
every GM wants their coach, their QB, their team. this is Elway doing that and balancing the present with the potential future.

No, I understand why Elway did it, I just don't agree with the pick. Brock is not plan B, that's the point I'm making.

Again, if Manning goes down, Brock is not playing. Period. Hanie and Weber are still Plan B. So what's the point again in drafting Brock with the #57 pick again because he's NOT Plan B. Brock is Plan D as of right now.

So, Elway takes a guy who is going to be ready in 3 years with the #2 pick when the defense sucks (or is at the very least in rebuilding mode)? What about the oline? If Manning is the guy, how about spending the #57 on an oline guy who can immediately step in an help the offense?

I guess we will just agree to disagree. I see Brock as a 4th round talent, maybe. I think Elway overdrafted him. Also, as for your point in "now the Broncos don't have to draft a QB in the future" I guess that means if there is a real talented guy, a guy with much more upside the Broncos will now pass him up because they already wasted a 2nd round pick on Brock.

Again, hope I'm wrong and I very much hope Brosweiler turns out to be the best QB the Broncos have ever had. I hope he lights the friggen world on fire and forces Elway to sign him to a bazillion dollar contract.

CEH
05-16-2012, 03:13 PM
No, I understand why Elway did it, I just don't agree with the pick. Brock is not plan B, that's the point I'm making.

Again, if Manning goes down, Brock is not playing. Period. Hanie and Weber are still Plan B. So what's the point again in drafting Brock with the #57 pick again because he's NOT Plan B. Brock is Plan D as of right now.

So, Elway takes a guy who is going to be ready in 3 years with the #2 pick when the defense sucks (or is at the very least in rebuilding mode)? What about the oline? If Manning is the guy, how about spending the #57 on an oline guy who can immediately step in an help the offense?

I guess we will just agree to disagree. I see Brock as a 4th round talent, maybe. I think Elway overdrafted him. Also, as for your point in "now the Broncos don't have to draft a QB in the future" I guess that means if there is a real talented guy, a guy with much more upside the Broncos will now pass him up because they already wasted a 2nd round pick on Brock.

Again, hope I'm wrong and I very much hope Brosweiler turns out to be the best QB the Broncos have ever had. I hope he lights the friggen world on fire and forces Elway to sign him to a bazillion dollar contract.

Same can be said of Brock as an Olineman taken at #57
Beadles was a high 2nd round pick and I'm guessing you would want an Olineman at #57 to replace him

Lestat
05-16-2012, 03:26 PM
No, I understand why Elway did it, I just don't agree with the pick. Brock is not plan B, that's the point I'm making.

Again, if Manning goes down, Brock is not playing. Period. Hanie and Weber are still Plan B. So what's the point again in drafting Brock with the #57 pick again because he's NOT Plan B. Brock is Plan D as of right now.

So, Elway takes a guy who is going to be ready in 3 years with the #2 pick when the defense sucks (or is at the very least in rebuilding mode)? What about the oline? If Manning is the guy, how about spending the #57 on an oline guy who can immediately step in an help the offense?

I guess we will just agree to disagree. I see Brock as a 4th round talent, maybe. I think Elway overdrafted him. Also, as for your point in "now the Broncos don't have to draft a QB in the future" I guess that means if there is a real talented guy, a guy with much more upside the Broncos will now pass him up because they already wasted a 2nd round pick on Brock.

Again, hope I'm wrong and I very much hope Brosweiler turns out to be the best QB the Broncos have ever had. I hope he lights the friggen world on fire and forces Elway to sign him to a bazillion dollar contract.

Hanie might win the back up job and make sure Brock never sees the field, but Weber? naw, Brock is at least #3 for the duration of his time before ascending to the back up spot.

so long as Manning is a Bronco we were only ever going to draft 1 maybe 2 QB's. so whenever we got the QB be it now or 3 years from now we would still pass up taking another.

i don't like taking Brock in the 2nd but i can recognize that he had to be taken there to ensure we got our guy. he has elite potential and my comment on us not having to draft a QB is predicated on Brock reaching his potential. once you take a guy as your QB of the future rarely does a club take another guy high in consecutive drafts. if Manning works out we'll be drafting #30 or lower over the next 5 seasons. we're not likely to get a QB with franchise potential ceiling like we did in Brock unless they have character issues like Mallett, come out a year early like Brock or suffer a bad injury to end their season.

Gort
05-16-2012, 03:34 PM
Osweiler's success in my opinion is going to depend in part on how much Peyton has left in the tank. If Manning is able to have two or three successful seasons here and in the interim Osweiler can sit and absorb NFL offenses, go through a couple of camps and preseasons, and really get comfortable reading NFL defenses I think he has the physical skill set to be quite successful. Like the other posts said, it comes down to his desire to be great vs. just being complacent with the money.

I still didn't like the pick, because with the signing of Manning it indicated a shift into a win now mode and I think there were a number of skill position guys on offense and front seven players on defense that could have immediately contributed to that goal.

If the Manning experiment and the win now strategy fails, considering this brutal schedule, the team will be lucky to win 5 games. It then becomes a moot point because you could draft a more NFL ready QB in top 10 in 2013.

if ELWAY/fox/xanders had drafted a DT and LB with their first 2 picks, i'd have felt alot better about this years draft. taking a QB with the 2nd pick was just Elway putting an exclamation point on the end of the Tebow era. i don't know why Elway disliked the kid so much, but he did. this was his way of saying "shut up about Tebow already".

step 1) back up the Brinks truck for Manning
step 2) trade Tebow for a half filled bucket of KFC
step 3) draft lanky project QB who thinks he's a vampire in the 2nd round
step 4) ?
step 5) profit

nevertheless, i'm not too worried. we are not a SB contender in 2012. this season will be about getting Manning and the new players and coaches acclimated to "Peyton Ball". then we have next offseason and next years draft to start putting the final pieces in place for a SB run. assuming Peyton's head doesn't pop off, 2013 should be the season where nothing less than a SB berth is acceptable.

DBroncos4life
05-16-2012, 03:40 PM
if ELWAY/fox/xanders had drafted a DT and LB with their first 2 picks, i'd have felt alot better about this years draft. taking a QB with the 2nd pick was just Elway putting an exclamation point on the end of the Tebow era. i don't know why Elway disliked the kid so much, but he did. this was his way of saying "shut up about Tebow already".

step 1) back up the Brinks truck for Manning
step 2) trade Tebow for a half filled bucket of KFC
step 3) draft lanky project QB who thinks he's a vampire in the 2nd round
step 4) ?
step 5) profit

nevertheless, i'm not too worried. we are not a SB contender in 2012. this season will be about getting Manning and the new players and coaches acclimated to "Peyton Ball". then we have next offseason and next years draft to start putting the final pieces in place for a SB run. assuming Peyton's head doesn't pop off, 2013 should be the season where nothing less than a SB berth is acceptable.
NO ONE OFFERED US CRAP FOR HIM. The Jags wouldn't part with a third rounder for him because they needed it for a punter.

Lestat
05-16-2012, 03:42 PM
if ELWAY/fox/xanders had drafted a DT and LB with their first 2 picks, i'd have felt alot better about this years draft. taking a QB with the 2nd pick was just Elway putting an exclamation point on the end of the Tebow era. i don't know why Elway disliked the kid so much, but he did. this was his way of saying "shut up about Tebow already".

step 1) back up the Brinks truck for Manning
step 2) trade Tebow for a half filled bucket of KFC
step 3) draft lanky project QB who thinks he's a vampire in the 2nd round
step 4) ?
step 5) profit

nevertheless, i'm not too worried. we are not a SB contender in 2012. this season will be about getting Manning and the new players and coaches acclimated to "Peyton Ball". then we have next offseason and next years draft to start putting the final pieces in place for a SB run. assuming Peyton's head doesn't pop off, 2013 should be the season where nothing less than a SB berth is acceptable.

wasn't the kid he disliked. it was the football player who couldn't be molded into a traditional NFL QB.
you(Elway) as a HOF QB can only watch 45-50 mins of terrible QB play only to find a way to win for so long.
Tebow goes against almost everything a pro style QB stands for.
Elway wants a QB who is consistently good and plays sustainable winning football. too much inconsistency from Tebow as a pocket QB and that's not a sustainable winning formula.

Gort
05-16-2012, 06:42 PM
wasn't the kid he disliked. it was the football player who couldn't be molded into a traditional NFL QB.
you(Elway) as a HOF QB can only watch 45-50 mins of terrible QB play only to find a way to win for so long.
Tebow goes against almost everything a pro style QB stands for.
Elway wants a QB who is consistently good and plays sustainable winning football. too much inconsistency from Tebow as a pocket QB and that's not a sustainable winning formula.

i remember Elway playing like garbage a bunch of times too, and not just when he was a rookie. alot of people forget that many of those 4th quarter comebacks wouldn't have been necessary if Elway hadn't sucked for 3 quarters either. i know it's popular to blame Dan Reeves for everything and to say that Elway was surrounded by tomato cans instead of elite players, but we lost a SB by a score of 55-10. how come we only scored 10? ...because Elway sucked balls that day. 10 of 26 for 108 yards and 2 INT.

Gort
05-16-2012, 06:45 PM
NO ONE OFFERED US CRAP FOR HIM. The Jags wouldn't part with a third rounder for him because they needed it for a punter.

so then you don't trade him! but Elway was so anxious to cut all ties to Tebow, he ACCEPTED a garbage trade just to be rid of him. that's my point.

i know you can't stand Tebow, and that's fine. but Elway didn't HAVE to trade him when he did and he didn't HAVE to accept any offer, no matter how poor. he chose the timing of the trade and he chose to accept a pitiful offer.

in fact, he could have dangled Tebow out there until well after the draft was over and other teams had a better idea of their QB situations.

TheElusiveKyleOrton
05-16-2012, 07:05 PM
so then you don't trade him! but Elway was so anxious to cut all ties to Tebow, he ACCEPTED a garbage trade just to be rid of him. that's my point.

i know you can't stand Tebow, and that's fine. but Elway didn't HAVE to trade him when he did and he didn't HAVE to accept any offer, no matter how poor. he chose the timing of the trade and he chose to accept a pitiful offer.

in fact, he could have dangled Tebow out there until well after the draft was over and other teams had a better idea of their QB situations.

He had to be rid of him because of the Florida morons. Period.

Too much distraction. Too much bull****.

hambone13
05-16-2012, 07:07 PM
He's really high on this guy. I hope he sees something I don't. I don't think he sucks the way other people do, but Elway talks like this guy is a franchise QB. I don't see the skill set. He's "ok". I know people say he didn't start very much, but that's kind of a my point. I have no idea how he is as a leader of men, but he comes off as rah-rah type. That might work in college but he seems like kind of a goober to me.

Mind you I'm not saying he sucks or is going to suck, just not sure what the big deal is...

I couldn't agree more. He seems entirely to "say the right thing" cheezy to me. I don't see much real personality. All of his comments appear scripted from the "How to Talk to Your Coach" handbook. It will be interesting and I hope he develops into a productive guy with a real personality.

Lestat
05-16-2012, 07:08 PM
i remember Elway playing like garbage a bunch of times too, and not just when he was a rookie. alot of people forget that many of those 4th quarter comebacks wouldn't have been necessary if Elway hadn't sucked for 3 quarters either. i know it's popular to blame Dan Reeves for everything and to say that Elway was surrounded by tomato cans instead of elite players, but we lost a SB by a score of 55-10. how come we only scored 10? ...because Elway sucked balls that day. 10 of 26 for 108 yards and 2 INT.

you live and die by your elite players. they have great games and you win, they have bad games and you lose, sometimes they can do everything they can to win or lose a game and the opposite happens anyways.

Elway had his issues no doubt, but he played sustainable winning football.
a QB who can't play in the pocket is like a defense that can't stop the run, doesn't force turnovers and isn't good against the pass.
you can win here and there, but eventually it catches up to you in a bad way.

Lestat
05-16-2012, 07:12 PM
He had to be rid of him because of the Florida morons. Period.

Too much distraction. Too much bull****.

oh it wasn't just Florida. the very people who slobber over Tebow are the reason he couldn't stay.
you can't have people willing to put up billboards, chant for him to come into the game and jump on talk radio saying he was given a raw deal.


without the circus Tebow gets time to develop and learn to be a NFL QB.
i'm not sure he would have been able to be a traditional one either way but he'd have been better served in his development.

Hamrob
05-16-2012, 07:13 PM
Osweiler is the QB I wanted us to take. However, I was thinking we pull the trigger in the 3rd and grab him...and was really hoping that we'd take him in the 4th.

When Gil Brandt came out right before the draft and said that some teams were considering him in the 1st round, I became concerned that we would take him at #36.

All in all, I'm happy with the guys we took...just wish we would have gotten better overall value.

I really like what I see with Osweiler. This is a big kid...who is an athelete. He can move well in the pocket...and isn't a statue like Bledsoe was or Flacko is. He also has good feel for his receivers and a strong arm. Mark me down as someone who thinks he will be a special NFL QB.

Oh, and I'm a Tebow fan too...and think he will be the Jets starter at some point this year. :-)

DBroncos4life
05-16-2012, 07:15 PM
so then you don't trade him! but Elway was so anxious to cut all ties to Tebow, he ACCEPTED a garbage trade just to be rid of him. that's my point.

i know you can't stand Tebow, and that's fine. but Elway didn't HAVE to trade him when he did and he didn't HAVE to accept any offer, no matter how poor. he chose the timing of the trade and he chose to accept a pitiful offer.

in fact, he could have dangled Tebow out there until well after the draft was over and other teams had a better idea of their QB situations.

What is Denver going to do with him? Make him the back up QB? You think that will go over real well with the media and Tebow nuts?

See you don't get that I wanted Tebow to sit and develop here in Denver. I bet I was more for Denver drafting him then you were. The fact of the matter is that ship sailed when Orton **** the bed.

As is by the time Manning wants to retire, Tebow would have left anyways via FA.

TheElusiveKyleOrton
05-16-2012, 07:16 PM
oh it wasn't just Florida. the very people who slobber over Tebow are the reason he couldn't stay.
you can't have people willing to put up billboards, chant for him to come into the game and jump on talk radio saying he was given a raw deal.


without the circus Tebow gets time to develop and learn to be a NFL QB.
i'm not sure he would have been able to be a traditional one either way but he'd have been better served in his development.

That's fair. I should have been clearer, I suppose, but yes, the people who slob on him because of what he accomplished in college are the folks I'm talking about.

Nice guy. And if he'd told the circus to tone it down, it would have gone a long way with the FO and with me personally.

El Jué
05-16-2012, 07:17 PM
...The Hall of Fame quarterback, who rejoined the Broncos last year as vice president of football operations, replied: "It's always tough to pick a quarterback that you know is not going to play for you for a while. But I think we have high hopes for him in the future to where once Peyton decides to hang them up that he's the guy in waiting that can keep this (going) and we don't miss a beat ... and we can continue to compete for world championships year in and year out."

I can't think of any reason to believe a word that drunk says.

DBroncos4life
05-16-2012, 07:23 PM
Osweiler is the QB I wanted us to take. However, I was thinking we pull the trigger in the 3rd and grab him...and was really hoping that we'd take him in the 4th.

When Gil Brandt came out right before the draft and said that some teams were considering him in the 1st round, I became concerned that we would take him at #36.

All in all, I'm happy with the guys we took...just wish we would have gotten better overall value.

I really like what I see with Osweiler. This is a big kid...who is an athelete. He can move well in the pocket...and isn't a statue like Bledsoe was or Flacko is. He also has good feel for his receivers and a strong arm. Mark me down as someone who thinks he will be a special NFL QB.

Oh, and I'm a Tebow fan too...and think he will be the Jets starter at some point this year. :-)
Predicting he takes over the starting job from one of the wosrt starting QBs in the NFL is really going out on a limb. Really the Jets O sucks. There WR's are so young and bad. Only Holmes and Chaz Schilens have more then 100 career catches.

Lestat
05-16-2012, 07:27 PM
Sanchez is a hispanic Kyle Orton. he wins games but he's never a wow guy and it will eventually catch up to him if he doesn't do some serious improving.

eff1ngham
05-21-2012, 12:05 PM
Talent and skill are two different things. Having a strong arm, being tall, athleticism - those are things you are born with. You can improve them in some small measure. Skill is proficiency built from knowledge, practice and aptitude. Having a quick mind mind help you process information to read a defense, but reading a defense is a skill.

Sorry to bring up an older thread, but I went back and watched the Gruden QB camp on Osweiler again over the weekend and he seems like a pretty sharp kid. Well, at least on the field, even if he can't spell. But the interview clips they showed made it seem like he's got a good idea on reading defenses and knowing what to look for. And he seems like he wants to learn and get better. Combined with his size and arm, seems like he could be a really good QB. Now that being said I hope I don't see him on the field any time soon ;)

OrangeSe7en
05-21-2012, 03:44 PM
do you think elway gets a boner when he watches twilight

Finally!...the question that needed to be asked.

Cito Pelon
05-21-2012, 09:08 PM
No, I understand why Elway did it, I just don't agree with the pick. Brock is not plan B, that's the point I'm making.

Again, if Manning goes down, Brock is not playing. Period. Hanie and Weber are still Plan B. So what's the point again in drafting Brock with the #57 pick again because he's NOT Plan B. Brock is Plan D as of right now.

So, Elway takes a guy who is going to be ready in 3 years with the #2 pick when the defense sucks (or is at the very least in rebuilding mode)? What about the oline? If Manning is the guy, how about spending the #57 on an oline guy who can immediately step in an help the offense?

I guess we will just agree to disagree. I see Brock as a 4th round talent, maybe. I think Elway overdrafted him. Also, as for your point in "now the Broncos don't have to draft a QB in the future" I guess that means if there is a real talented guy, a guy with much more upside the Broncos will now pass him up because they already wasted a 2nd round pick on Brock.

Again, hope I'm wrong and I very much hope Brosweiler turns out to be the best QB the Broncos have ever had. I hope he lights the friggen world on fire and forces Elway to sign him to a bazillion dollar contract.

Os will probably be 3 come opening day, maybe even 2, Hanie will be cut.