PDA

View Full Version : Wallace for our first round pick for sure now?


canadianbroncosfan
03-19-2012, 02:42 PM
Now that we've landed Manning, how strongly should we consider trading away our first round draft pick to bring in Mike Wallace? To be honest, I'm still on the fence. I think we definitely need the dynamic weapon at offense, but our D still has holes to fill. I would lead more to bringing him in simply because I don't think we get a Mike Wallace caliber player at #25.

Mogulseeker
03-19-2012, 02:43 PM
Still on the fence, here. Best option at the moment, but I think we could make a move for Brockers or Kirkpatrick.

Agamemnon
03-19-2012, 02:44 PM
Won't surprise me one bit.

extralife
03-19-2012, 02:45 PM
it's apparently not happening, but I think it's a no-brainer. I keep saying it, and I'll keep saying it until the Steelers lock him up.

Beantown Bronco
03-19-2012, 02:46 PM
http://www.orangemane.com/BB/showthread.php?t=104253

edog24
03-19-2012, 02:47 PM
I hope we use the first on BPA. I just don't get a good feeling out of blowing the bankroll now in the hopes that we win the SB in the next couple years. It's not working out well for the Eagles.

I liked the direction we were going of young cheap players and getting the max value out of them, we need to keep that up.

DomCasual
03-19-2012, 02:48 PM
Manning made mediocre WRs look solid to great. We have some talent at WR. I think we'll be fine. I wouldn't mind seeing a guy like Stokley back, considering his comfort-level with Manning. But assuming Decker will be back at 100%, I would rather use our draft to go after bigger needs.

extralife
03-19-2012, 02:48 PM
I hope we use the first on BPA. I just don't get a good feeling out of blowing the bankroll now in the hopes that we win the SB in the next couple years. It's not working out well for the Eagles.

I liked the direction we were going of young cheap players and getting the max value out of them, we need to keep that up.

Wallace is 25. He is the best player available.

Agamemnon
03-19-2012, 02:49 PM
Manning made mediocre WRs look solid to great. We have some talent at WR. I think we'll be fine. I wouldn't mind seeing a guy like Stokley back, considering his comfort-level with Manning. But assuming Decker will be back at 100%, I would rather use our draft to go after bigger needs.

Reggie Wayne and Marvin Harrison were not mediocre. Jesus Christ...

UberBroncoMan
03-19-2012, 02:52 PM
Either him OR we sign Stokely to play our slot with Decker and Thomas on the outside.

I'm thinking the later is more likely.

Wallace would be ****ing insane though...but I'd rather have us saved the 1st and kept Royal.

edog24
03-19-2012, 02:53 PM
Wallace is 25. He is the best player available.

I think he will cost too much. Pus we have way bigger needs now that we have a pretty fragile situation at qb that we need to protect at all costs.

Agamemnon
03-19-2012, 02:53 PM
Wallace is 25. He is the best player available.

It's a move that makes a lot of sense honestly. I mean they just signed Manning so they are banking first and foremost on offense to win them games. Mike Wallace is almost certainly the best offensive weapon they can get for the 25th overall pick, and he's already fully developed as a receiver. I'm still utterly horrified at this "win now" crap, but if you're going to do it, Wallace is your best bet. And hell, he isn't old and nearly used up so it isn't actually bad for our long-term future.

Pony Boy
03-19-2012, 02:53 PM
I get a chubby thinking about Manning to Joe Adams in the slot .......

bombay
03-19-2012, 02:54 PM
Schefter shot this down earlier.

TerrElway
03-19-2012, 02:55 PM
Reggie Wayne and Marvin Harrison were not mediocre. Jesus Christ...

I don't think they were either.

But...

...Austin Collie and the Hernandez dude sure looked like studs with PM throwing to them.

I think a great QB makes the whole team better.

From the line - gets rid of the ball quicker takes some pressure off of them- to the wide outs. Even the defense. The SB defenses for Denver in the 90's benefitted from playing with a lot of leads because of a juggernaut offense.

All Bronco fans are hoping the Manning has it in the tank to do just that with this team.

Garcia Bronco
03-19-2012, 02:58 PM
**** no. He's a decent receiver, but for a 2-3 round pick.

Garcia Bronco
03-19-2012, 03:00 PM
Manning made mediocre WRs look solid to great. We have some talent at WR. I think we'll be fine. I wouldn't mind seeing a guy like Stokley back, considering his comfort-level with Manning. But assuming Decker will be back at 100%, I would rather use our draft to go after bigger needs.

This.

We need DT's. We need trench work. Everything else can wait.

Garcia Bronco
03-19-2012, 03:01 PM
Wallace is 25. He is the best player available.

No he isn't. He's a middle tier receiver at best.

edog24
03-19-2012, 03:08 PM
This.

We need DT's. We need trench work. Everything else can wait.

Well, therein lies the problem. We are in a situation now where we have a qb who has maybe up to 5 good years left, so we don't really have the time now to develop too many key players.

I would lie if I said I wasn't concerned about us getting PM. It seems like a pardigm shift from last year when we were all about having young raw talent while benefitting our cap space. Now, it seems like we have shifted into win now mode which I find concerning for the future.

extralife
03-19-2012, 03:10 PM
No he isn't. He's a middle tier receiver at best.

you're dumb as a rock.

Jekyll15Hyde
03-19-2012, 03:14 PM
No he isn't. He's a middle tier receiver at best.

Not even a little bit

DomCasual
03-19-2012, 03:16 PM
Reggie Wayne and Marvin Harrison were not mediocre. Jesus Christ...

So, are you saying Jesus Christ was or wasn't mediocre? I'm confused.

Sometimes, I think you try to be an asshole for being an asshole's sake.

Are these guys great WRs, dumbass?

Sean Dawkins
Torrance Small
Jerome Pathon
Terrance Wilkins
Ken Dilger (TE)
Brandon Stokley
Anthony Gonzalez
Austin Collie
Pierre Garcon
Jacob Tamme (TE)

Those are all guys that had decent to solid seasons (minimum 500 yards and a handful of TDs), catching passes from Peyton Manning. I'm not going to go back and take the time to research guys that had great individual games filling in for Harrison and Wayne when they were injured (Blaire White most recently comes to mind), but that would be further evidence.

Marvin Harrison hasn't really played since 2006 (he was injured and/or ineffective in 2007 and 2008). Reggie Wayne didn't show up until Manning's fourth or fifth year. Somehow, Manning survived in those other years. And he's gotten crazy numbers from his 3rd/Slot WRs.

canadianbroncosfan
03-19-2012, 03:18 PM
No he isn't. He's a middle tier receiver at best.

What?

That One Guy
03-19-2012, 03:19 PM
Wallace is known as a deep threat so I wonder if Manning can throw a deep ball yet? He might be able to hit precision balls but if he tries to wing it and it goes lame, that may not be an aspect of the offense.

And we're all assuming Peyton means win now but maybe they just wanted out of Tebowmania enough that they're willing to pay the extra money.

Drunk Monkey
03-19-2012, 03:31 PM
Hell no. We have other needs.

boppool
03-19-2012, 03:35 PM
Reggie Wayne and Marvin Harrison were not mediocre. Jesus Christ...

Yes, but without Manning, Wayne looked mediocre... Just saying.

Lestat
03-19-2012, 03:40 PM
No he isn't. He's a middle tier receiver at best.

in what universe is he a middle tier WR? he tears the cover off the defense, catches stuff over the middle,bubble screens & etc.
middle tier my ass.

CEH
03-19-2012, 03:41 PM
I want to see JT SUperStar 80 now. Young TE who should only get better

RunSilentRunDeep
03-19-2012, 03:42 PM
Too many other needs. If they really want another receiver, draft Stephen Hill and save the money for elsewhere.

elsid13
03-19-2012, 03:42 PM
It doesn't make sense. Look for them to get WR in the draft and look BPA (offense of defensive line) in the 1st.

Old Dude
03-19-2012, 06:25 PM
I'm wondering about the possibility of a short term deal with Lee Evans. The guy was extremely explosive in Buffalo before an ankle injury in 2010. Disasterous time with the Ravens last year - just 4 catches in the 9 games he was healthy - and then dropped a game-winning pass in the end zone in the AFC championship game.

No off-the-field problems that I've ever heard of. He might be the kind of player looking for some vindication that the Broncos found in Brandon LLoyd a couple years ago - - if the terms are favorable.

DBroncos4life
03-19-2012, 06:32 PM
No he isn't. He's a middle tier receiver at best.

LOL wut? Top ten in yards for a WR in back to back years. 18 TDs in the last two years. Middle tier my ass.

BroncoBeavis
03-19-2012, 06:34 PM
LOL wut? Top ten in yards for a WR in back to back years. 18 TDs in the last two years. Middle tier my ass.

Dude, we got Stoke back. Manning will make him look like Eddie Mac in his prime, no problem.

DBroncos4life
03-19-2012, 06:37 PM
Dude, we got Stoke back. Manning will make him look like Eddie Mac in his prime, no problem.

Cry some more dude!

yerner
03-19-2012, 06:43 PM
Just listening to the Bill Simmons podcast where Bill Barnwell was discussing the lack of interest in Wallace and RFA in general. He implied that there may be some type of agreement between owners to rarely make offers to these players. Certainly some type of collusion. He didn't directly say that it was actually happening but that it was just odd no team had made an offer to a guy like Wallace.

barryr
03-19-2012, 06:48 PM
Just listening to the Bill Simmons podcast where Bill Barnwell was discussing the lack of interest in Wallace and RFA in general. He implied that there may be some type of agreement between owners to rarely make offers to these players. Certainly some type of collusion. He didn't directly say that it was actually happening but that it was just odd no team had made an offer to a guy like Wallace.

Or maybe teams are wondering if they want to give up a 1st round pick for Wallace and/or if they can offer a deal that the Steelers can't match.

ScottXray
03-19-2012, 06:57 PM
This.

We need DT's. We need trench work. Everything else can wait.

Elway also knows that great running game is a big part of the reason we won those two super bowls. If you go all in to stop the run the pass game explodes. if you try to stop the pass the run game kills you. Of course there are no sure TDs in this draft that can be had with our pick at 25, but at least one of the top 3 rds is going to be atRB unless we sign Bush or something similar.

And yes we need DT and MLB and CB too. We are in a running ( other than SD) divison and you have to be able to get the D Off the field to give the O a chance.

yerner
03-19-2012, 07:00 PM
Or maybe teams are wondering if they want to give up a 1st round pick for Wallace and/or if they can offer a deal that the Steelers can't match.

How can some team in the 20's not think this is a good idea though? Cincy has plenty of money, needs a wr and could hurt a division opponent. It's bizarre that it makes so much sense and not one team in the league is interested.

Garcia Bronco
03-19-2012, 07:56 PM
Just listening to the Bill Simmons podcast where Bill Barnwell was discussing the lack of interest in Wallace and RFA in general. He implied that there may be some type of agreement between owners to rarely make offers to these players. Certainly some type of collusion. He didn't directly say that it was actually happening but that it was just odd no team had made an offer to a guy like Wallace.

Because he's not worth more than middle tier money. He's average WR. DT can be just as good. The outside of the defense and offense are the least of our worries. From the middle out.

BroncoBeavis
03-19-2012, 08:11 PM
Cry some more dude!

Change your Avy. PM's never beat the Steelers in the playoffs.

DENVERDUI55
03-19-2012, 08:13 PM
Change your Avy. PM's never beat the Steelers in the playoffs.

How many times has he played them?

DBroncos4life
03-19-2012, 08:14 PM
Change your Avy. PM's never beat the Steelers in the playoffs.

Yeah I'll get right the **** on that as soon as you join the Jags board :welcome:

BroncoBeavis
03-19-2012, 08:15 PM
Yeah I'll get right the **** on that as soon as you join the Jags board :welcome:

Jags board? Sounds like this one.

DBroncos4life
03-19-2012, 08:16 PM
How many times has he played them?

Once, they lost 21 to 18.

BroncoBeavis
03-19-2012, 08:16 PM
How many times has he played them?

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/R1piy8Zxddw" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Punisher
03-19-2012, 08:18 PM
Hell no. We have other needs.

This
Plus i don't want to give the Steelers more ammo for the draft

DENVERDUI55
03-19-2012, 08:19 PM
Once, they lost 21 to 18.

Exactly.

Broncojef
03-19-2012, 08:20 PM
We absolutely need Clark; and Wallace would put us over the top. Manning came here to light it up. Give him the tools to do so. Asking a new WR out of college to make the jump is seldom done in the first couple years and is rare. I wouldn't mind seeing a young guy with experience to show the way to DT and Decker. Waqllace is a special talent and would be an awesome weapon for Peyton. You won't find that kind of talent with the #25 pick to help our team out as much as he would, that and stealing him from the Squeelers would be awesome.

UberBroncoMan
03-19-2012, 08:24 PM
Wonder of Mario Fannin will turn into our new TD.

Garcia Bronco
03-19-2012, 08:27 PM
We absolutely need Clark; and Wallace would put us over the top. Manning came here to light it up. Give him the tools to do so. Asking a new WR out of college to make the jump is seldom done in the first couple years and is rare. I wouldn't mind seeing a young guy with experience to show the way to DT and Decker. Waqllace is a special talent and would be an awesome weapon for Peyton. You won't find that kind of talent with the #25 pick to help our team out as much as he would, that and stealing him from the Squeelers would be awesome.

He is not a special talent. Randy Moss is a special talent. Tim Brown was a special talent. Certainly not worht big money and certainly not worth a first round pick.

yerner
03-19-2012, 08:30 PM
He is not a special talent. Randy Moss is a special talent. Tim Brown was a special talent. Certainly not worht big money and certainly not worth a first round pick.

What is the basis of that opinion? Have you looked at his games when Ben hasn't played? There as good as when Big Ben does not play. He is one of the best deep threats in the league.

Garcia Bronco
03-19-2012, 08:36 PM
What is the basis of that opinion? Have you looked at his games when Ben hasn't played? There as good as when Big Ben does not play. He is one of the best deep threats in the league.

Watch him play. He's nothing special. He's not the best route runner. He struggles blocking. I would not sink big money or any draft pick into to him and league agrees. Calvin Johnson is a guy I would sink money into. Is Mike Wallace Calvin Johnson good? How about LF in Az?

At the very least you people over value him.

DENVERDUI55
03-19-2012, 08:37 PM
Wonder of Mario Fannin will turn into our new TD.

Jeremiah Johnson is my dark horse gut feeling. I think he could be good in a Manning led zone scheme and catching those checkdowns out of the backfield.

OBF1
03-19-2012, 08:38 PM
Because he's not worth more than middle tier money. He's average WR. DT can be just as good. The outside of the defense and offense are the least of our worries. From the middle out.

You are flat our wrong. Wallace is faster than Thomas will ever be. Wallace has had better seasons than Thomas has... More yards, TD's. Sorry Garcia, But WR's like Wallace do not fall off of tree's. At #25, the guy is a steal.

barryr
03-19-2012, 08:41 PM
Only in these forums can a Wallace be considered overvalued, but duds like Andre Goodman be considered too important to let go.

Doggcow
03-19-2012, 08:41 PM
Watch him play. He's nothing special. He's not the best route runner. He struggles blocking. I would not sink big money or any draft pick into to him and league agrees. Calvin Johnson is a guy I would sink money into. Is Mike Wallace Calvin Johnson good? How about LF in Az?

At the very least you people over value him.

Who said he was Megatron good? Or even close to demanding that kind of money? Your argument is invalid.

Broncojef
03-19-2012, 08:43 PM
He is not a special talent. Randy Moss is a special talent. Tim Brown was a special talent. Certainly not worht big money and certainly not worth a first round pick.

OK get that you don't like Wallace but have no idea why, the kid leads the league the last couple years in 20+ and 40+ yard receptions and has blazing speed. Runs great routes and is better IMO than a DeSean Jackson. I see him as a young Greg Jennings type player. He's average 1200 yards and 9 TDs the last two seasons even when Roethelisburger has been banged up. He'll never be a Calvin Johnson or Andre Johnson but when paired with the rest of our young talent would be an awesome weapon. Give him a big signing bonus and a modest salary over the next 5 years. Look at Tim Brown's stats the only thing he has over Wallace is longevity. Moss is in a differnt league probably more comparable to Calvin.

Broncojef
03-19-2012, 08:46 PM
Watch him play. He's nothing special. He's not the best route runner. He struggles blocking. I would not sink big money or any draft pick into to him and league agrees. Calvin Johnson is a guy I would sink money into. Is Mike Wallace Calvin Johnson good? How about LF in Az?

At the very least you people over value him.

No one is comparing him to that quality talent (Calvin/LF), no one wants to spend that kind of money. For a first round pick this year and a decent salary long term I'd grab him asap.

Garcia Bronco
03-19-2012, 08:46 PM
You are flat our wrong. Wallace is faster than Thomas will ever be. Wallace has had better seasons than Thomas has... More yards, TD's. Sorry Garcia, But WR's like Wallace do not fall off of tree's. At #25, the guy is a steal.

**** no. And the Steelers would laugh all the way to the bank. If you just want a guy to strech the field...get out to ouija board and see who Al Davis would draft.

Garcia Bronco
03-19-2012, 08:49 PM
OK get that you don't like Wallace but have no idea why, the kid leads the league the last couple years in 20+ and 40+ yard receptions and has blazing speed. Runs great routes and is better IMO than a DeSean Jackson. I see him as a young Greg Jennings type player. He's average 1200 yards and 9 TDs the last two seasons even when Roethelisburger has been banged up. He'll never be a Calvin Johnson or Andre Johnson but when paired with the rest of our young talent would be an awesome weapon. Give him a big signing bonus and a modest salary over the next 5 years. Look at Tim Brown's stats the only thing he has over Wallace is longevity. Moss is in a differnt league probably more comparable to Calvin.

He's a middle tier receiver. Worth middle tier money and not a first round pick. Maybe a late second, but that's as high as I would go. Plus I gotta pay him. And he wants big money, which is why no one has offered himan official contract. You just busted out four dudes I would take over him. You're making my point.

Broncojef
03-19-2012, 09:10 PM
He's a middle tier receiver. Worth middle tier money and not a first round pick. Maybe a late second, but that's as high as I would go. Plus I gotta pay him. And he wants big money, which is why no one has offered himan official contract. You just busted out four dudes I would take over him. You're making my point.

Guess I don't know what kind of money he is demanding but we need one proven WR on the roster and I think your being too harsh on him he's alot better than you are giving him credit for and he'd be around for the next decade. I'd love to see him with a Manning talent over Roethelisburger. I'd give the #25 in a heart beat.

extralife
03-19-2012, 11:12 PM
Watch him play. He's nothing special. He's not the best route runner. He struggles blocking. I would not sink big money or any draft pick into to him and league agrees. Calvin Johnson is a guy I would sink money into. Is Mike Wallace Calvin Johnson good? How about LF in Az?

At the very least you people over value him.

so now because Mike Wallace is not RANDY MOSS or CALVIN JOHNSON he's "mid tier" and not worth a late first round pick? and he's no good because he "struggles blocking"? get your head checked, son.

NFLBRONCO
03-19-2012, 11:24 PM
D D D @ 25

canadianbroncosfan
03-19-2012, 11:27 PM
Jeremiah Johnson is my dark horse gut feeling. I think he could be good in a Manning led zone scheme and catching those checkdowns out of the backfield.

This.

JJ37 had some big plays for us last year, and then got rewarded with like 1-2 more touches in a game.

cutthemdown
03-19-2012, 11:27 PM
I haven't heard Wallace won't block. I have heard many respected analysts and other fans say they think he is the best deep ball receiver in the NFL. DT is really physical, and Decker sort of a route runner type with good size. Really Wallace would round that WR group out really nice. We would have a true deep threat, and all around stud in the making in DT, and a hard working route runner in decker.

cutthemdown
03-19-2012, 11:28 PM
Jeremiah Johnson is my dark horse gut feeling. I think he could be good in a Manning led zone scheme and catching those checkdowns out of the backfield.

We have all been pretty down on him, but Moreno really could blossom in a manning offense. If he can get healthy etc. Maybe Broncos won't be ditching him like we all thought would happen.

pricejj
03-20-2012, 12:49 AM
After some recalculation, I've come to the conclusion that we actually do have enough $$ for Mike Wallace (if we can get a slight discount on Dallas Clark.

I would do it. Mike Wallace is a better weapon than Wright or Hill...and would immediately give us the #1 receiver that we need RIGHT NOW.

Do it EFX. Shoot first, and ask questions later. Give him $12M up front, followed by $6M per year for the next 4 years. That ought to do it.

We will still have enough to sign Bunkley ($5M) , Saturday ($4.5M), Clark ($2M), Stokely ($1M), and Dawkins ($1M).

...it CAN be done.

uplink
03-20-2012, 01:34 AM
WR have been a hot commodity in FA so far, but can the broncos afford Wallace now with the Manning contract since they'd have to give a really good contract to get him?

I think the broncos will be looking for a top vet receiver to pair with Manning, maybe a trade since the FA market is now bare. Who knows. Do the Jags or Eagle has someone they'd flip for Tebow? Maybe a trade for steve smith (but I don't think he is a Manning type of WR)

ZONA
03-20-2012, 01:34 AM
Call me a homer but I think DT's got more upside then Wallace. DT is a beast with good hands and speed. He was just a bit dinged up early last year. You saw what he could do later in the year. This dude with Manning throwing darts to him..............forgetttaaboutit. Decker also looked very solid as a #2. He's not a track guy but he's got that surprising on the field speed and got behind many of defenses last year. Again, that was with Tebow throwing to him. Manning will only make him look better.

I think we could go after a WR in the draft as well. Some nice options will be there in the 2nd round.

So NO to Wallace. Use that 1st round pick on defense or OL.

FireFly
03-20-2012, 01:58 AM
He's a better player than we're likely to get at 25.

Nothing is sure is the draft, especially that far down in it. He is a sure thing and can be had.

We won't do it, but we should.

cutthemdown
03-20-2012, 02:01 AM
Oh and seriously a player like Calvin Johnson would probably cost you 2 first round picks. But I can see how parting with a first round pick for a deep threat WR might be too much to give. If that was the case though they should have picked up a decent vet WR for depth in case Willis and Decker can't step up, or DT fails to develop into a number 1.

cutthemdown
03-20-2012, 02:02 AM
I bet anything that Wayne knew Manning was going to Denver. He only wanted to leave Indy for Miami. When he figured Manning wasn't going there he resigned.

ZONA
03-20-2012, 02:39 AM
I don't think anybody was saying Rod Smith or Ed McCaffrey was a Calvin Johnson or Larry Fitzgerald type of WR. But they were very very good all around WR's. They blocked as well as they ran routes and were committed to that. I just don't think this offense is going to be the same type of air attack people saw in Indy for so many years. I think it's going to feature alot more running then that offense and thus, I think we're going to be looking for the same type of production from WR's. The guys we have, I think they're used to being more all around since they had to block so much last year. I don't think we need some mega WR especially at the cost of a 1st round pick. There will be some really good players there at #25 we can use somewhere, especially on defense or the OL.

Drek
03-20-2012, 03:26 AM
Call me a homer but I think DT's got more upside then Wallace. DT is a beast with good hands and speed. He was just a bit dinged up early last year. You saw what he could do later in the year. This dude with Manning throwing darts to him..............forgetttaaboutit. Decker also looked very solid as a #2. He's not a track guy but he's got that surprising on the field speed and got behind many of defenses last year. Again, that was with Tebow throwing to him. Manning will only make him look better.

I think we could go after a WR in the draft as well. Some nice options will be there in the 2nd round.

So NO to Wallace. Use that 1st round pick on defense or OL.
You do know that we are going to run out of a 3 WR base probably 95% of the time with Manning, right?

DT, Decker, and Willis is "damn, I hope DT stays healthy and Manning can make something happen with those other two".

DT, Decker, and Wallace is "if DT stays healthy we're the best receiving corps in the NFL and Manning is going to make them look even better."

Adding Wallace is the perfect compliment to DT developing into the full package WR he has the natural talent to become. It also allows Decker to do what he does best, work in the slot where his size to quickness ratio is an ungodly mismatch. Throw in Dallas Clark and Julius Thomas, which I think could produce a nice seamless transition within the offense from old to young over the next couple seasons and we would be stacked with targets from day one.

Watch him play. He's nothing special. He's not the best route runner. He struggles blocking. I would not sink big money or any draft pick into to him and league agrees. Calvin Johnson is a guy I would sink money into. Is Mike Wallace Calvin Johnson good? How about LF in Az?

At the very least you people over value him.
You do know that what you described here "not the best route runner" and "struggles blocking" are the absolutely nicest ways in which people have commented on those aspects of Randy Moss' game right? Mike Wallace is the closest thing to a Randy Moss level deep threat in the NFL today and he isn't going to cost you Calvin Johnson or Larry Fitzgerald money. He'll cost you Desean Jackson/Pierre Garcon money and a late 1st round pick. How is that not a good value proposition for a team clearly in "win now" mode?

BowlenBall
03-20-2012, 05:00 AM
You do know that we are going to run out of a 3 WR base probably 95% of the time with Manning, right?

DT, Decker, and Willis is "damn, I hope DT stays healthy and Manning can make something happen with those other two".

DT, Decker, and Wallace is "if DT stays healthy we're the best receiving corps in the NFL and Manning is going to make them look even better."

Adding Wallace is the perfect compliment to DT developing into the full package WR he has the natural talent to become. It also allows Decker to do what he does best, work in the slot where his size to quickness ratio is an ungodly mismatch. Throw in Dallas Clark and Julius Thomas, which I think could produce a nice seamless transition within the offense from old to young over the next couple seasons and we would be stacked with targets from day one.


You do know that what you described here "not the best route runner" and "struggles blocking" are the absolutely nicest ways in which people have commented on those aspects of Randy Moss' game right? Mike Wallace is the closest thing to a Randy Moss level deep threat in the NFL today and he isn't going to cost you Calvin Johnson or Larry Fitzgerald money. He'll cost you Desean Jackson/Pierre Garcon money and a late 1st round pick. How is that not a good value proposition for a team clearly in "win now" mode?

Very rarely do you read a post on a message board that completely changes your opinion on a topic -- very well reasoned, Drek, and consider me on board the Mike Wallace train. Rep.

At the very worst, we force Pittsburgh to match an offer and can screw with a conference rival's finances, right?

Drek
03-20-2012, 05:42 AM
Very rarely do you read a post on a message board that completely changes your opinion on a topic -- very well reasoned, Drek, and consider me on board the Mike Wallace train. Rep.

At the very worst, we force Pittsburgh to match an offer and can screw with a conference rival's finances, right?

Pretty much. Worst case scenario we force them to backload some last minute money that will handcuff them in cap terms down the road.

Best case we get Wallace.

Middle ground we force them into releasing a guy they would prefer to keep.

The worst case is still slightly beneficial.

cutthemdown
03-20-2012, 05:44 AM
I think Drek is right on the WR issue. Broncos need to probably draft a WR or 2, and still look for a vet FA to bring into camp. Manning makes them better but what we have isn't good enough. Not when you look at what Brady has in NE to throw to.

Fact is we may not be able to get up with the big boys this yr. Broncos still have too many holes. Getting manning is huge though. Our goal is to get better and win more then 8 games, win the afc west and make playoffs. If we can get to 10 wins, get comfy with manning, he doesn;t get hurt etc Broncos could set up for a run.

Thing about teams like NE is their defenses might have as many problems as we do. Its just that NE scores so much their defense gets a lead all the time.

Beantown Bronco
03-20-2012, 06:40 AM
Because he's not worth more than middle tier money. He's average WR.

There are approximately 180-200 WRs on nfl rosters each year. If he's average, then he must be ranked somewhere around 90. Please name the 90 or so WRs that are better than him.

BowlenBall
03-20-2012, 06:54 AM
I think Drek is right on the WR issue. Broncos need to probably draft a WR or 2, and still look for a vet FA to bring into camp. Manning makes them better but what we have isn't good enough. Not when you look at what Brady has in NE to throw to.

Fact is we may not be able to get up with the big boys this yr. Broncos still have too many holes. Getting manning is huge though. Our goal is to get better and win more then 8 games, win the afc west and make playoffs. If we can get to 10 wins, get comfy with manning, he doesn;t get hurt etc Broncos could set up for a run.

Thing about teams like NE is their defenses might have as many problems as we do. Its just that NE scores so much their defense gets a lead all the time.

The Manning signing is a clear signal that that the Denver Broncos intend to make a run at the Super Bowl now, NOT build for the future (that's a major reason why Manning chose us). Even though his contract is for 5 years, they're most likely only looking at 2012-2014 as their window of opportunity.

Mike Wallace is plug-and-play, whereas any receiver we draft will most likely take two years to get to Wallace's level (if at all). And as Drek said before, we really don't have a 3rd or 4th receiver of any consequence for all those 3-receiver packages....

kappys
03-20-2012, 07:41 AM
Drek makes a nice argument but for a deep threat to be useful you have to pass protect. Beadles in particular is atrocious at pass pro and we have to improve up front first - I would rather have spent Mike Wallace type money on an elite guard but too late for that.

pricejj
03-20-2012, 08:16 AM
Drek makes a nice argument but for a deep threat to be useful you have to pass protect. Beadles in particular is atrocious at pass pro and we have to improve up front first - I would rather have spent Mike Wallace type money on an elite guard but too late for that.

Ryan Harris may be ready to go at OT. He was slated to start for the Eagles last year, then hurt his back again. If so, Beadles becomes a back-up.

LT - Ryan Clady
LG - Orlando Franklin
C - Jeff Saturday
RG - Chris Kuper
RT - Ryan Harris

This is a line Manning could work with.

pricejj
03-20-2012, 08:19 AM
You do know that we are going to run out of a 3 WR base probably 95% of the time with Manning, right?

DT, Decker, and Willis is "damn, I hope DT stays healthy and Manning can make something happen with those other two".

DT, Decker, and Wallace is "if DT stays healthy we're the best receiving corps in the NFL and Manning is going to make them look even better."

Adding Wallace is the perfect compliment to DT developing into the full package WR he has the natural talent to become. It also allows Decker to do what he does best, work in the slot where his size to quickness ratio is an ungodly mismatch. Throw in Dallas Clark and Julius Thomas, which I think could produce a nice seamless transition within the offense from old to young over the next couple seasons and we would be stacked with targets from day one.


You do know that what you described here "not the best route runner" and "struggles blocking" are the absolutely nicest ways in which people have commented on those aspects of Randy Moss' game right? Mike Wallace is the closest thing to a Randy Moss level deep threat in the NFL today and he isn't going to cost you Calvin Johnson or Larry Fitzgerald money. He'll cost you Desean Jackson/Pierre Garcon money and a late 1st round pick. How is that not a good value proposition for a team clearly in "win now" mode?

Right on, Drek. We need to build this team to win THIS YEAR. Last year the Broncos won a playoff game...the Broncos WILL be able to afford Wallace, to a slightly frontloaded contract without going over the cap in future years. The time to make a move is NOW.

robbieopperude
03-20-2012, 08:33 AM
Pretty much. Worst case scenario we force them to backload some last minute money that will handcuff them in cap terms down the road.

Best case we get Wallace.

Middle ground we force them into releasing a guy they would prefer to keep.

The worst case is still slightly beneficial.

This. We should at least Mike Wallace a fair offer that he signs so that he puts the pressure on Pitt to match or let him go to us. If Pitt does match you know they are going to have to release guys or restructure guys that they don't want to.

Having Wallace as a deep threat is great but I really think he would be great on the slants and posts that Marvin Harrison in his prime ran with Manning. Wallace and Harrison are very similar players right now in their career. Lean Burners. Harrison probably had better hands.

DENVERDUI55
03-20-2012, 09:04 AM
Ryan Harris may be ready to go at OT. He was slated to start for the Eagles last year, then hurt his back again. If so, Beadles becomes a back-up.

LT - Ryan Clady
LG - Orlando Franklin
C - Jeff Saturday
RG - Chris Kuper
RT - Ryan Harris

This is a line Manning could work with.

Harris can't be counted on to play 8 games let alone 16.

pricejj
03-20-2012, 09:09 AM
Harris can't be counted on to play 8 games let alone 16.

I'm not sure of the status of his back injury situation...but if this guy could get healthy, he would be BY FAR the best pass-blocking RT on the team. I can dream can't I?

Broncos next coup:

Heist Mike Wallace from the Steelers

Ronnie Tsunami
03-20-2012, 09:12 AM
Technically, Wallace will cost us his salary less the cost of signing a first round draft pick

So... 47 million over 5 years (9.4 mil a year, the deal desean got), minus 4 years 9 million (4.5 mil a year) Jon Baldwin #26 pick in last year's draft (salary)

we could have wallace for 6.2 million a year.

Jekyll15Hyde
03-20-2012, 09:29 AM
Call me a homer but I think DT's got more upside then Wallace. DT is a beast with good hands and speed. He was just a bit dinged up early last year. You saw what he could do later in the year. This dude with Manning throwing darts to him..............forgetttaaboutit. Decker also looked very solid as a #2. He's not a track guy but he's got that surprising on the field speed and got behind many of defenses last year. Again, that was with Tebow throwing to him. Manning will only make him look better.

I think we could go after a WR in the draft as well. Some nice options will be there in the 2nd round.

So NO to Wallace. Use that 1st round pick on defense or OL.

How about just an idiot

v2micca
03-20-2012, 09:39 AM
In a year in which we did not need big upgrades at DT, MLB, CB, and O-line, I would be all for giving up our 25th over-all pick for this guy. I think he would be well worth it. But, with the possibility of Brockers, Cox, Poe, or Still falling to us at number 25, I just can't get on board with giving up our first round this year.

pricejj
03-20-2012, 09:57 AM
In a year in which we did not need big upgrades at DT, MLB, CB, and O-line, I would be all for giving up our 25th over-all pick for this guy. I think he would be well worth it. But, with the possibility of Brockers, Cox, Poe, or Still falling to us at number 25, I just can't get on board with giving up our first round this year.

Would you rather draft a DT who may get 4 sacks...or a receiver (Wallace) who may get 1,200 yards and 10 touchdowns, while giving Manning a receiving target he needs to succeed?

Derek Wolfe may be a better UT than any of those DT's, and could be had in the 2nd or 3rd round.

Rohirrim
03-20-2012, 10:01 AM
Manning made mediocre WRs look solid to great. We have some talent at WR. I think we'll be fine. I wouldn't mind seeing a guy like Stokley back, considering his comfort-level with Manning. But assuming Decker will be back at 100%, I would rather use our draft to go after bigger needs.

Given the schedule we've got coming up, I agree. We need to fill and improve as many slots as we can, not spend what we have left on one guy. Manning will make everybody on offense better, especially the receivers.

Ronnie Tsunami
03-20-2012, 10:08 AM
Let's consider what we get when you couple the prospect of nabbing Wallace with Shipping Tebow out for a 2nd or a 3rd round pick.

1. Wallace's salary is in no way an issue, especially since we won't have to pay a round 1 salary anymore.
2. If we gain a 2nd or a 3rd for Tebow, we can delay the pickup of a DT until round 2 and grab a solid RB in round 3

Who'd you rather have

Tebow, Devon Still (1), Doug Martin (2)

or

Mike Wallace (1), Alameda Ta'amu (2), Vinny Curry (2) and Robert Turbin/Bernard Pierce (3)

v2micca
03-20-2012, 10:09 AM
Would you rather draft a DT who may get 4 sacks...or a receiver (Wallace) who may get 1,200 yards and 10 touchdowns, while giving Manning a receiving target he needs to succeed?

Derek Wolfe may be a better UT than any of those DT's, and could be had in the 2nd or 3rd round.



Would rather have the DT. Also, not sold on Derek Wolfe.

pricejj
03-20-2012, 10:36 AM
Let's consider what we get when you couple the prospect of nabbing Wallace with Shipping Tebow out for a 2nd or a 3rd round pick.

1. Wallace's salary is in no way an issue, especially since we won't have to pay a round 1 salary anymore.


1. To get Wallace, the Broncos are going to have to pay A LOT...Steelers have $20M in cap space...the Steelers may not let him get away.
2. The Broncos may have to offer $15M up front to pry Wallace away...which would not allow us to sign Bunkley, Saturday, Clark, Stokely, and Dawkins...without cutting Ty Warren.
3. Tebow does not factor into the Wallace decision. If we can get a 2nd round draft pick, ship him. If not, keep him.

Old Dude
03-20-2012, 10:39 AM
1. No way is Denver going to get a 2d round pick for Tebow. I think the best we can possibly hope for is a late 3rd to mid-4th round pick. More likely it will be a 5th.

2. Mike Wallace could certainly be an impact player here. But, in addition to the draft pick, he'd command a huge contract. For the same money we could probably get Jeff Saturday plus resign Bunkley plus fill at least one more position of need (TE, DB, RB, OL, DL, WR, LB, backup QB) while keeping the 25th overall pick. He's a luxury I don't think Denver can afford at this point.

pricejj
03-20-2012, 10:40 AM
Would rather have the DT. Also, not sold on Derek Wolfe.

1. I wonder who Peyton Manning would rather have (considering he had 4 first round receivers to throw to in Indy, and will have major say in the draft)?
2. I wonder who Bowlen and EFX would rather have (considering they just dropped $96M on a QB)?
3. Out of Cox, Brockers, Poe, Still...only Cox is worth a 1st round pick at the UT position.

BroncoBeavis
03-20-2012, 10:40 AM
1. No way is Denver going to get a 2d round pick for Tebow. I think the best we can possibly hope for is a late 3rd to mid-4th round pick. More likely it will be a 5th.

2. Mike Wallace could certainly be an impact player here. But, in addition to the draft pick, he'd command a huge contract. For the same money we could probably get Jeff Saturday plus resign Bunkley plus fill at least one more position of need (TE, DB, RB, OL, DL, WR, LB, backup QB) while keeping the 25th overall pick. He's a luxury I don't think Denver can afford at this point.

So we need to find one of those great WR's that don't want to get paid.

Simple enough

Old Dude
03-20-2012, 10:43 AM
We have bigger needs than finding a "great" wide receiver. Simple as that.

Beantown Bronco
03-20-2012, 10:45 AM
1. To get Wallace, the Broncos are going to have to pay A LOT...Steelers have $20M in cap space...the Steelers may not let him get away.

20 Mil? Try 4 mil.

http://www.steelersdepot.com/2012/03/steelers-to-receive-extra-1-6-million-in-2012-salary-cap-space-thanks-to-cowboys-redskins/

pricejj
03-20-2012, 10:48 AM
1. No way is Denver going to get a 2d round pick for Tebow. I think the best we can possibly hope for is a late 3rd to mid-4th round pick. More likely it will be a 5th.

Then there is no reason to ship him...somebody will give up a 2nd rounder for him over the course of the next 1.5 years. Better to keep him as insurance, than give him up for a 3rd.

2. Mike Wallace could certainly be an impact player here. But, in addition to the draft pick, he'd command a huge contract. For the same money we could probably get Jeff Saturday plus resign Bunkley plus fill at least one more position of need (TE, DB, RB, OL, DL, WR, LB, backup QB) while keeping the 25th overall pick. He's a luxury I don't think Denver can afford at this point.[/QUOTE].

1. You might be right...if the Steelers truly have $20M in cap space, Wallace would be too expensive. Better to draft a 1st round WR, in that case.
2. However, if Wallace only requires $10M in the initial year, we can afford Bunkley, Saturday, Clark, Stokely, and Dawkins...without cutting Ty Warren.

pricejj
03-20-2012, 10:49 AM
20 Mil? Try 4 mil.

http://www.steelersdepot.com/2012/03/steelers-to-receive-extra-1-6-million-in-2012-salary-cap-space-thanks-to-cowboys-redskins/

Looks like $20M to me:

http://www.spotrac.com/nfl/pittsburgh-steelers/cap-hit/

...I think the $4M was an old number before the Steelers made cuts...but I can't be sure.

Beantown Bronco
03-20-2012, 10:51 AM
Looks like $20M to me:

http://www.spotrac.com/nfl/pittsburgh-steelers/cap-hit/

...I think the $4M was an old number before the Steelers made cuts...but I can't be sure.

Your numbers haven't been updated to reflect the RFA tenders. Mine have. Mine is from last week. They haven't made any significant cuts in the last week.

Garcia Bronco
03-20-2012, 10:51 AM
We need DT's and linebackers more than we need a wide receiver or a corner. We are weak up the middle. If you are weak up the middle you'll eventually lose.

Lestat
03-20-2012, 10:52 AM
people keep talking about all the first round WR's manning had to throw to in Indy. but they also fail to account for the porous defense that was behind him due to all the high draft picks spent on offense the Colts drafted 7 offensive players in the first round in the Manning era, they drafted 4 defensive players.
their defense was always undersized, cat quick but couldn't hold up most times in the playoffs and Manning had to play keep away to get wins or string together some serious come from behind gems.

the Broncos need to solidify and shore up the defense and the running game so that Manning doesn't have to win every game by being almost perfect. we need a offense that can cram it down the opposing D's throat and we need a defense that if Manning has a bad game we can pick him up and win in the playoffs.

Beantown Bronco
03-20-2012, 10:52 AM
2. However, if Wallace only requires $10M in the initial year, we can afford Bunkley, Saturday, Clark, Stokely, and Dawkins...without cutting Ty Warren.

They need to cut Warren regardless of cap implications. Any cap savings would just be gravy.

Lestat
03-20-2012, 10:57 AM
no way you cut Warren, he's had some injury issues the past few seasons but as much as people don't want to hear it he's our most talented DT. if he stays healthy that makes our defense so much better.
that makes Thomas,Vickerson or Bunkley a back up and that in itself improves our depth at the position. if you draft a DT(say a Still,Poe,Brockers in the first or a Thompson in the 2nd)then you potentially have a tandem of draftee + Warren as your starters and Warren is a disruptive force when healthy.

TonyR
03-20-2012, 11:00 AM
Although the Steelers wouldn't have much incentive to do so, is a sign and trade a possibility? So maybe we can give up something less than a first?

Beantown Bronco
03-20-2012, 11:00 AM
no way you cut Warren, he's had some injury issues the past few seasons but as much as people don't want to hear it he's our most talented DT.

Only because we only have one other NFL DT signed right now.

if he stays healthy that makes our defense so much better.


Huge if.

that makes Thomas,Vickerson or Bunkley a back up and that in itself improves our depth at the position.

Thomas and Bunkley are not even Broncos.

pricejj
03-20-2012, 11:26 AM
Your numbers haven't been updated to reflect the RFA tenders. Mine have. Mine is from last week. They haven't made any significant cuts in the last week.

Really....then I like our chances :wiggle:

They need to cut Warren regardless of cap implications. Any cap savings would just be gravy.

Can't do it man...Vickerson is subpar, and was benched before he was injured...McBean is now suspended. Only way we cut Warren is if we draft a DT in round 1, and the Wallace decision is going to have to go down by April 20th...draft is April 26th.

http://www.bucsnation.com/2012/2/20/2811779/2012-nfl-offseason-calendar-free-agency-franchise-tags-and-other-dates

gunns
03-20-2012, 11:50 AM
Pros: While I would NEVER take a WR in the first round, Wallace is a proven commodity and one of the few WR's I see as a difference maker. I think Decker and Thomas are good WR's and with Manning will show that knowing where the ball is going will elevate their games. With all 3 and Clark it would make it almost impossible to defend.

Cons: I think he would cost too much and we have other needs that outweigh another WR. Even if Peyton is 100%, without a defense that can defend the good offenses, W-L will only change slightly. Right now defense is our priority in FA and the draft. Stock up that defense and the Broncos are one scary team.

MVP-06
03-20-2012, 11:58 AM
Man with Wallace and possibly Clark, all we would have to do is hold teams below 30 points.

Garcia Bronco
03-20-2012, 12:03 PM
LOL

Jekyll15Hyde
03-20-2012, 12:45 PM
LOL

you really have no clue

Garcia Bronco
03-20-2012, 12:54 PM
you really have no clue

Whatever. We don't need outside help on either side of the ball more than we need help up the ****ing middle. Unless you have the words defensive tackle on your lips...you are a ****ing moron dip**** dumb mother ****er that has no business discussing this. :P

Wallace is a ****ing mid-tier at best fake number 1 wide reciever that I would at best compare to James Jett. Neither worth a first rounder or a big contract when you need defensive tackles, guards, and linebackers.

Drek
03-20-2012, 01:16 PM
Drek makes a nice argument but for a deep threat to be useful you have to pass protect. Beadles in particular is atrocious at pass pro and we have to improve up front first - I would rather have spent Mike Wallace type money on an elite guard but too late for that.

Zane Beadles is better than most Colts OGs in Manning's time there. He still went deep.

Beadles will have his first full off-season with Magazu this year.

Beadles will have Jeff Saturday next to him calling out assignments.

Beadles will have Walton trying to take his job and return to the starting lineup.

Wallace alone shaves tenths of seconds off the time it takes the average WR to get deep.

Sounds like we've got no reason not to. No rookie WR can be expected to contribute big plays day one. Same with a rookie DT. Sign FA solutions at CB, MLB, and DT then get Wallace so Manning can light up the scoreboard toe to toe with Brady and Rodgers.

Bronco Yoda
03-20-2012, 01:18 PM
Did Manning sign off on this thread yet?

Ronnie Tsunami
03-20-2012, 01:23 PM
My goal is to make Peyton Manning the greatest quarterback to ever play the game. - John Elway

Denver will sign Mike Wallace?

Beantown Bronco
03-20-2012, 02:04 PM
Wallace is a ****ing mid-tier at best fake number 1 wide reciever that I would at best compare to James Jett. Neither worth a first rounder or a big contract when you need defensive tackles, guards, and linebackers.

Wallace is averaging 1200 yds and 9 TDs. The average NFL WR averages way under 500 yds and fewer than 5 TDs.

Garcia Bronco
03-20-2012, 03:32 PM
Wallace is averaging 1200 yds and 9 TDs. The average NFL WR averages way under 500 yds and fewer than 5 TDs.

And yet Mike Wallace is average at best. He's James Jett. He's the Steelers number 1 by default. There is a reason no one is offering him money and he won't be offered any by us because Elway knows it's a waste of money when we can get the same production out of Decker.

yerner
03-20-2012, 03:42 PM
And yet Mike Wallace is average at best. He's James Jett. He's the Steelers number 1 by default. There is a reason no one is offering him money and he won't be offered any by us because Elway knows it's a waste of money when we can get the same production out of Decker.

I don't think the Broncos will or should spend that money on a WR. But your assessment of Wallace is way off and unsupported by statistics and the opinions of others around the NFL. He isn't Randy Moss, but he is certainly not James Jett either.

Garcia Bronco
03-20-2012, 03:44 PM
I don't think the Broncos will or should spend that money on a WR. But your assessment of Wallace is way off and unsupported by statistics and the opinions of others around the NFL. He isn't Randy Moss, but he is certainly not James Jett either.

He's average at best. Steeler fans will even tell you so...and I am surrounded by them...in Denver :/

SonOfLe-loLang
03-20-2012, 03:58 PM
He's average at best. Steeler fans will even tell you so...and I am surrounded by them...in Denver :/

He's had two fantastic years and is only 25. I dont understand how he is "average at best," and saying "Steelers fans say so" isnt an argument

pricejj
03-20-2012, 04:29 PM
He's average at best. Steeler fans will even tell you so...and I am surrounded by them...in Denver :/

Mike Wallace is a better deep threat than anybody the Patriots have:

Patriots:
1. Wes Welker
2. Brandon Lloyd
3. Rob Gronkowski
4. Chad Johnson
5. Aaron Hernandez
6. Dont'e Stallworth
7. Anthony Gonzalez
8. Julian Edelman

Broncos:
1. Demaryius Thomas
2. Eric Decker
3. Matt Willis
4. Jason Hill
5. D'Andre Goodwin
6. Mark Dell
7. Virgil Green
8. Julius Thomas


...ummm yeah...gonna need Wallace, Tamme, Clark, Stokely...and whoever else we can muster.

How else are the Broncos going to beat the Patriots? Gotta score points...that's all there is to it.

Beantown Bronco
03-20-2012, 04:31 PM
He's average at best. Steeler fans will even tell you so...and I am surrounded by them...in Denver :/

I'm still waiting for the list of 90 odd receivers that are better than him. By definition, that's the criteria required for him to be "average". C'mon. Let's see it.

Astrass
03-20-2012, 04:33 PM
Hmm... I'd like him IF he's smart enough to pick up the system. I don't know what his contract would look like but if reasonable, why not?

We need a WR anyways since Royal left.

SonOfLe-loLang
03-20-2012, 04:33 PM
I'm still waiting for the list of 90 odd receivers that are better than him. By definition, that's the criteria required for him to be "average". C'mon. Let's see it.

ahem...AT BEST average

Garcia Bronco
03-20-2012, 04:39 PM
Mike Wallace is a better deep threat than anybody the Patriots have:

Patriots:
1. Wes Welker
2. Brandon Lloyd
3. Rob Gronkowski
4. Chad Johnson
5. Aaron Hernandez
6. Dont'e Stallworth
7. Anthony Gonzalez
8. Julian Edelman

Broncos:
1. Demaryius Thomas
2. Eric Decker
3. Matt Willis
4. Jason Hill
5. D'Andre Goodwin
6. Mark Dell
7. Virgil Green
8. Julius Thomas


...ummm yeah...gonna need Wallace, Tamme, Clark, Stokely...and whoever else we can muster.

How else are the Broncos going to beat the Patriots? Gotta score points...that's all there is to it.

BFS. Wallace is relatively no better than Decker or DT. So you want to give up a first round pick on a team that sorely needs to build through the draft for a mid-tier WR and pay him big money...especially when we just got one of the most badass QB's in the league. If we didn't have other needs...sure

We need DT's, TE's and RB's and Safties...and we could improve at MLB. WR and Corner are the least of our worries.

Garcia Bronco
03-20-2012, 04:41 PM
I'm still waiting for the list of 90 odd receivers that are better than him. By definition, that's the criteria required for him to be "average". C'mon. Let's see it.

No...amongst "number 1" WRs...which is what we're talking about...he's average. You people over value him...good thing the Broncos don't.

He's had zero official contract offers. If he was what you say he is....he wouldn't be on the market at the moment.

SonOfLe-loLang
03-20-2012, 04:42 PM
BFS. Wallace is relatively no better than Decker or DT. So you want to give up a first round pick on a team that sorely needs to build through the draft for a mid-tier WR and pay him big money...especially when we just got one of the most badass QB's in the league. If we didn't have other needs...sure

We need DT's, TE's and RB's and Safties...and we could improve at MLB. WR and Corner are the least of our worries.

Youre changing the argument.

You said he's, at best, average.

BroncoBuff
03-20-2012, 04:49 PM
Wallace is 25. He is the best player available.

Isn't this roster already an "all eggs in one basket" proposition?

I'd prefer signing Dallas Clark and drafting well.

pricejj
03-20-2012, 04:52 PM
BFS. Wallace is relatively no better than Decker or DT. So you want to give up a first round pick on a team that sorely needs to build through the draft for a mid-tier WR and pay him big money...especially when we just got one of the most badass QB's in the league. If we didn't have other needs...sure

We need DT's, TE's and RB's and Safties...and we could improve at MLB. WR and Corner are the least of our worries.

In case you missed the memo, we're goin' with plan A.

Plan A:
1. Re-signing an NT (Bunkley: pending)
2. Signing a good center-field FS (Adams: check)
3. Signing an MLB (Mays: check /shudder)
4. Upgrading 6'5" QB with a laser, rocket arm (Manning: check)
5. Upgrading Center (Saturday: pending)
6. Upgrading TE (Tamme/Clark: pending)
7. Upgrading CB (Porter: pending)
8. Replacing starting WR (hopefully Wallace: pending)
9. Making the team better through the draft
10. If Stokely and Dawkins want to hop on board, they are welcome

Any questions?

Jekyll15Hyde
03-20-2012, 04:53 PM
No...amongst "number 1" WRs...which is what we're talking about...he's average. You people over value him...good thing the Broncos don't.

He's had zero official contract offers. If he was what you say he is....he wouldn't be on the market at the moment.

You going to actually bring substance to this?

Drek
03-20-2012, 04:57 PM
Isn't this roster already an "all eggs in one basket" proposition?

I'd prefer signing Dallas Clark and drafting well.

Wallace is all of 25. He can be an "all eggs in one basket" play who's still a key contributor post Manning.

Houshyamama
03-20-2012, 04:58 PM
Say no to Wallace!!@!!!!!11!

Broncojef
03-20-2012, 05:02 PM
In case you missed the memo, we're goin' with plan A.

Plan A:
1. Re-signing an NT (Bunkley: pending)
2. Signing a good center-field FS (Adams: check)
3. Signing an MLB (Mays: check /shudder)
4. Upgrading 6'5" QB with a laser, rocket arm (Manning: check)
5. Upgrading Center (Saturday: pending)
6. Upgrading TE (Tamme/Clark: pending)
7. Upgrading CB (Porter: pending)
8. Replacing starting WR (hopefully Wallace: pending)
9. Making the team better through the draft
10. If Stokely and Dawkins want to hop on board, they are welcome

Any questions?

Looks perfect wish the MLB was an upgrade but oh well.

DBroncos4life
03-20-2012, 05:09 PM
No...amongst "number 1" WRs...which is what we're talking about...he's average. You people over value him...good thing the Broncos don't.

He's had zero official contract offers. If he was what you say he is....he wouldn't be on the market at the moment.

Ok there only 8 WRs had more yards then him. 8 WRs had more TDs then him. 14 averaged more YPC then him. 11 had more 20+ catches then him. 10 had more YPG then him. 10 had more YAC then him. 9 had more 1DNs then him.

At what point does a WR that is in the top 10 in almost every major receiving categories make him just an average WR.?

MVP-06
03-20-2012, 05:47 PM
Whatever. We don't need outside help on either side of the ball more than we need help up the ****ing middle. Unless you have the words defensive tackle on your lips...you are a ****ing moron dip**** dumb mother ****er that has no business discussing this. :P

Wallace is a ****ing mid-tier at best fake number 1 wide reciever that I would at best compare to James Jett. Neither worth a first rounder or a big contract when you need defensive tackles, guards, and linebackers.

You sir, are an ***hole. we just get done signing the free agent of the decade and you come in with James Jett comparisons? You put Wallace on this team with Clark an I guarantee you we push 30 every game. No doubt we need help in the middle, but I'm going to give EFX the benefit of he doubt that they already know that. Don't need your ramblings to confirm. :cuss:

lolcopter
03-20-2012, 05:56 PM
Wallace is relatively no better than Decker or DT.

except for having better hands and more speed, okay

BroncosMT
03-20-2012, 06:00 PM
In case you missed the memo, we're goin' with plan A.

Plan A:
1. Re-signing an NT (Bunkley: pending)
2. Signing a good center-field FS (Adams: check)
3. Signing an MLB (Mays: check /shudder)
4. Upgrading 6'5" QB with a laser, rocket arm (Manning: check)
5. Upgrading Center (Saturday: pending)
6. Upgrading TE (Tamme/Clark: pending)
7. Upgrading CB (Porter: pending)
8. Replacing starting WR (hopefully Wallace: pending)
9. Making the team better through the draft
10. If Stokely and Dawkins want to hop on board, they are welcome

Any questions?

I would like to see McClain from Baltimore added to that list....but that looks pretty good!

txtebow
03-20-2012, 06:02 PM
If we can get Wallace for 8million a season or less and still have money left over(12 million or so) for Saturday, Clark, Tamme, Tracey Porter and maybe Barrett Ruud that'll be a GREAT off Season.....

Broncojef
03-20-2012, 06:15 PM
If we can get Wallace for 8million a season or less and still have money left over(12 million or so) for Saturday, Clark, Tamme, Tracey Porter and maybe Barrett Ruud that'll be a GREAT off Season.....

Can't even imagine...the Manning signing just opens everything up.

Garcia Bronco
03-21-2012, 03:59 PM
My steeler buddies are reading this laughing their asses off at you.

ZONA
03-21-2012, 04:11 PM
There is NO WAY we can use 1st on Wallace now that Bunkley is gone. NO WAY

Cito Pelon
03-21-2012, 04:20 PM
Manning can't even throw the long ball at this point, so why go for a deep threat?

EDIT: OK, I can see going for Wallace for the next QB they bring in that can throw the long ball.

pricejj
03-21-2012, 04:27 PM
There is NO WAY we can use 1st on Wallace now that Bunkley is gone. NO WAY

If you think Fox and JDR are going to start a rookie at NT...your DEAD WRONG. Ty Warren was penciled in at NT last year, before he got hurt, and will probably be the starting NT going into camp this year.

There are plenty of guys that we could sign for to replace Bunkley:

1. Sammie Lee Hill (would have to give up a 4th, RFA)
2. Derek Landri
3. Shaun Rogers
4. John Henderson
5. Marcus Stroud

Landri, Henderson, and Stroud have all played for Fox/JDR...so they know them well. It's enough to pick an adequate replacement from. Usually Fox/JDR prefer monstrous NT's, everyone on that list except Landri, fit the bill. Bunkley is a bit undersized for a typical Fox/JDR NT.

But my guess is this FO won't give up ANY draftpicks for Mike Wallace, let alone sign anyone to large contracts.

Gutless Drunk
03-22-2012, 08:16 AM
"The 49ers did indeed make an inquiry about the Steelers restricted free agent during the opening week of free agency. But they and the other teams that asked about Wallace were told the receiver was looking for a lot of money.

How much? A league source said that Wallace, 25, wants a contract that surpasses the eight-year, $120 million deal that Larry Fitzgerald signed last year with the Cardinals. Combine that with the first-round pick any team that signs Wallace to an offer sheet would lose if the Steelers didn't match the offer, and you start to understand why we've heard so little about Wallace in the last week and a half."

Read more here: http://blogs.sacbee.com/49ers/archives/2012/03/the-49ers-inquired-about-mike-wallace-but.html#storylink=cpy

Beantown Bronco
03-22-2012, 08:18 AM
Well, that certainly does explain it. Waaaay too much money.

lolcopter
03-22-2012, 08:33 AM
Yeah **** that noise

maven
03-22-2012, 08:36 AM
"The 49ers did indeed make an inquiry about the Steelers restricted free agent during the opening week of free agency. But they and the other teams that asked about Wallace were told the receiver was looking for a lot of money.

How much? A league source said that Wallace, 25, wants a contract that surpasses the eight-year, $120 million deal that Larry Fitzgerald signed last year with the Cardinals. Combine that with the first-round pick any team that signs Wallace to an offer sheet would lose if the Steelers didn't match the offer, and you start to understand why we've heard so little about Wallace in the last week and a half."

Read more here: http://blogs.sacbee.com/49ers/archives/2012/03/the-49ers-inquired-about-mike-wallace-but.html#storylink=cpy

Well... This thread is done.

TonyR
03-22-2012, 08:41 AM
Manning can't even throw the long ball at this point...

Do we know this for certain? He said on Monday that if there was a game this weekend he'd be ready to play.

strafen
03-22-2012, 08:48 AM
Now that we've landed Manning, how strongly should we consider trading away our first round draft pick to bring in Mike Wallace? To be honest, I'm still on the fence. I think we definitely need the dynamic weapon at offense, but our D still has holes to fill. I would lead more to bringing him in simply because I don't think we get a Mike Wallace caliber player at #25.This is the kind of stupid moves this franchise is notorious for pulling.
We need defense, and you're suggesting we give up our 1st round for yet another WR...
Brilliant!

I hope that with Elway, stupid moves are a thing of the past.
With two former head coaches on our stuff with extensive defensive background, the last thing in the world for them to do would be giving up our best chance to get better on defense for a freakin' WR...

McDman
03-22-2012, 08:54 AM
Wallace is asking for more than Fitzgerald, not gonna happen.

Lestat
03-22-2012, 09:16 AM
he wants more than Fitz? he's dreaming a very lucid dream.
there are 3 WR's in the game who can basically get a blank check, Megatron,Fitz and Andre Johnson.

g6matty
03-22-2012, 09:19 AM
i think pierre garcon's contract really screwed up the wide receiver market going forward

lolcopter
03-22-2012, 09:22 AM
i think pierre garcon's contract really screwed up the wide receiver market going forward

Snyder strikes again

teknic
03-22-2012, 09:41 AM
i think pierre garcon's contract really screwed up the wide receiver market going forward

Remember, next year there is a cap floor. A lot of teams are nowhere near that cap floor currently because they are/were trying to save money (Broncos...).

Huge 15mil/year+ contracts are going to become the norm sooner than later. So many teams must spend big next year to reach the cap floor, which is going to push the prices up drastically.

g6matty
03-22-2012, 09:44 AM
Remember, next year there is a cap floor. A lot of teams are nowhere near that cap floor currently because they are/were trying to save money (Broncos...).

Huge 15mil/year+ contracts are going to become the norm sooner than later. So many teams must spend big next year to reach the cap floor, which is going to push the prices up drastically.

i hope we save some space to re-sign ryan clady long term next year.

at first i was pretty pissed how we started off free agency basically doing nothing. but after landing manning if we dont sign anyone else id still be happy because i think we have the offensive pieces in place and he will bring them all together.

Jekyll15Hyde
03-22-2012, 10:12 AM
was interested.... not anymore.

Garcia Bronco
03-22-2012, 10:25 AM
Gee...if he was so good you would think people would meet his asking price. Strange.

Beantown Bronco
03-22-2012, 10:33 AM
Gee...if he was so good you would think people would meet his asking price. Strange.

C'mon now Garcia. If he was asking for above average #1 WR money, he'd have gotten an offer right now. He's asking to be paid like he's the 2nd best WR in the entire league. Completely different.

You're still wrong about his talent.

Garcia Bronco
03-22-2012, 10:38 AM
C'mon now Garcia. If he was asking for above average #1 WR money, he'd have gotten an offer right now. He's asking to be paid like he's the 2nd best WR in the entire league. Completely different.

You're still wrong about his talent.

I am not saying he lacks talent; what I am saying is we can get the same talent elsewhere for less with our badass QB.

Beantown Bronco
03-22-2012, 10:41 AM
I am not saying he lacks talent

You called him "average" on numerous occasions. Same thing IMO.

what I am saying is we can get the same talent elsewhere for less with our badass QB.

If he really does expect the money being reported, then yes, we'll save money elsewhere. Although I don't know if we'll get the same talent elsewhere. Wallace definitely looks like the cream of the crop to me.

I'd love to hear some names though.

Garcia Bronco
03-22-2012, 11:06 AM
You called him "average" on numerous occasions. Same thing IMO.



If he really does expect the money being reported, then yes, we'll save money elsewhere. Although I don't know if we'll get the same talent elsewhere. Wallace definitely looks like the cream of the crop to me.

I'd love to hear some names though.

DT and Eric Decker. **** those dudes are already on the roster and if Manning can make a name for Pierre-Garcon...he can do it for Willis.

lolcopter
03-22-2012, 11:09 AM
DT and Eric Decker. **** those dudes are already on the roster and if Manning can make a name for Pierre-Garcon...he can do it for Willis.

DT and decker can't hold Wallace's jock right now. They show a lot of promise, but Wallace is the premier deep threat in the game today


That being said, we don't need him at that price

Beantown Bronco
03-22-2012, 11:14 AM
DT and Eric Decker. **** those dudes are already on the roster and if Manning can make a name for Pierre-Garcon...he can do it for Willis.

That's all well and good if all those guys can play every snap and stay healthy for an entire season. So far, they haven't stayed healthy and everyone needs a breather throughout a game. We need more talent at the position.

I wanted it to be Wallace, but it looks like he and his agent are making that impossible. Nobody is going to give him the contact he's seeking, so it looks to me like he's either going to have to sign his tender with Pittsburgh or he's going to be a holdout.

long beach bronco
03-22-2012, 11:16 AM
I wouldn't mind bringing in Ted Ginn Jr. That would shore up our punt return and kickoff return duties not to mention a dangerous deep threat that is not as talented as Wallace but just as fast and Ginn never had a QB like Manning throwing to him.

SonOfLe-loLang
03-22-2012, 11:17 AM
I am not saying he lacks talent; what I am saying is we can get the same talent elsewhere for less with our badass QB.

you said he was "at best" an average WR

Lestat
03-22-2012, 11:42 AM
he drops passes like it's his job.
I wouldn't mind bringing in Ted Ginn Jr. That would shore up our punt return and kickoff return duties not to mention a dangerous deep threat that is not as talented as Wallace but just as fast and Ginn never had a QB like Manning throwing to him.

hookemhess
03-22-2012, 11:49 AM
"The 49ers did indeed make an inquiry about the Steelers restricted free agent during the opening week of free agency. But they and the other teams that asked about Wallace were told the receiver was looking for a lot of money.

How much? A league source said that Wallace, 25, wants a contract that surpasses the eight-year, $120 million deal that Larry Fitzgerald signed last year with the Cardinals. Combine that with the first-round pick any team that signs Wallace to an offer sheet would lose if the Steelers didn't match the offer, and you start to understand why we've heard so little about Wallace in the last week and a half."

Read more here: http://blogs.sacbee.com/49ers/archives/2012/03/the-49ers-inquired-about-mike-wallace-but.html#storylink=cpy

http://i.imgur.com/2oux5.png

Beantown Bronco
03-22-2012, 11:55 AM
he drops passes like it's his job.

So you're saying he'd fit right in.

baja
03-22-2012, 11:56 AM
We need a return man find a WR that can do that too.

Taco John
03-22-2012, 12:01 PM
Schefter says this was never in the cards.

hookemhess
03-22-2012, 12:02 PM
Schefter says this was never in the cards.

And good. I'm not real big on the Caldwell signing. But if its true that Wallace's asking price is anywhere close to Fitz, then he's out of his mind and probably going to turn into a prima donna.

Rohirrim
03-22-2012, 12:51 PM
And good. I'm not real big on the Caldwell signing. But if its true that Wallace's asking price is anywhere close to Fitz, then he's out of his mind and probably going to turn into a prima donna.

It's true:
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/03/22/report-mike-wallace-told-49ers-he-wants-more-than-larry-fitzgerald/

Kaylore
03-22-2012, 01:11 PM
Wallace is asking for more than Fitzgerald, not gonna happen.

Yeah that pretty much ensures no one will pick him up. Some players are so stupid.

g6matty
03-23-2012, 09:34 AM
Snyder strikes again

http://l.yimg.com/bt/api/res/1.2/46pk_39rkaGnxjAl18ERhg--/YXBwaWQ9eW5ld3M7cT04NTt3PTYzMA--/http://media.zenfs.com/en/blogs/sptusnflexperts/shanahan-snyder-hooters.jpg

Beantown Bronco
03-23-2012, 09:38 AM
What the hell is Snyder doing in that pick? What a weird pose. Apparently, being at Hooters makes him feel as though he needs to stick out his man boobs....

g6matty
03-23-2012, 09:47 AM
http://l.yimg.com/bt/api/res/1.2/46pk_39rkaGnxjAl18ERhg--/YXBwaWQ9eW5ld3M7cT04NTt3PTYzMA--/http://media.zenfs.com/en/blogs/sptusnflexperts/shanahan-snyder-hooters.jpg

not sure if hes sucking in his stomach or puffing out his chest LOL

ZONA
03-24-2012, 03:34 PM
Wallace is asking for more than Fitzgerald, not gonna happen.

What's funny is some members here are still saying in their reply's on posts that they would like for us to get Wallace. Let's go people, pay attention. Wallace wants a larger contract then Larry Fitzgerald. What don't you get. It's not gonna happen. Denver is NOT going to get Wallace so please stop saying you expect or would like to see the Broncos obtain him.

razorwire77
03-24-2012, 04:17 PM
http://l.yimg.com/bt/api/res/1.2/46pk_39rkaGnxjAl18ERhg--/YXBwaWQ9eW5ld3M7cT04NTt3PTYzMA--/http://media.zenfs.com/en/blogs/sptusnflexperts/shanahan-snyder-hooters.jpg

So much win in this photo.

Shanny with a wtf am I doing here look.

Snyder with the moobs and dogging the camera.

Random black guy looking in the other direction with a Hooter's t-shirt on.

DarkHorse30
03-24-2012, 05:07 PM
Wallace is OVERRATED - and he would push DT to 2 in Denver? That would be a dopey move Draft a wr/kr in late in the draft