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View Full Version : More Craziness to Come?


Rohirrim
03-13-2012, 07:00 AM
It occurred to me this morning, reading all the notes about Manning, the Redskins trade, free agency, the draft, and one of the wildest off seasons ever, especially for the Broncos, that we might only be seeing the beginning. Peter King wrote this in his SI notes this morning:

The Colts cut half their roster. Sort of. Much of the backbone of a team that averaged 12.5 wins a year from 2005 to 2010 has disappeared in the last five days: The wrecking ball taken to the passing game is like nothing in recent history. Manning, Anthony Gonzalez and Dallas Clark were told they wouldn't be retained. Three more receivers -- wideouts Reggie Wayne and Pierre Garcon, and tight end Jacob Tamme -- will leave in free agency, almost certainly. Think of the Colts' opening-camp receiving corps in July 2010: The top two quarterbacks (including Curtis Painter) are now gone. The top two tight ends, gone. Three of the top four wideouts (excepting Austin Collie), gone. And the defense? Captain and leader Gary Brackett, cut. As Adam Schefter reported Friday, Dwight Freeney is on the trading block. Andrew Luck has to be thinking, "What am I walking into? The '76 Bucs?''
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2012/writers/peter_king/03/12/freeagency/index.html#ixzz1p0Hv8CDP

And suddenly the pieces came together and I realized: Luck is going to refuse to go to Indy! He's going to pull a Manning! (Eli, that is). You heard it here first. If you think Archie Manning is involved in Peyton's decision making process, wait until you see Andrew Luck's dad, Oliver. There's no way he lets his son start his NFL career at some franchise that has been dismantled. Face it, Luck is walking into a wasteland if he goes to Indy. He'll get his ass kicked for years. He'll be in worse shape than David Carr when the Texans drafted him. I really don't think Oliver Luck is going to let that happen.

And if that happens, like I think it will, where does that leave Shanahan? That's why you don't trade early for picks. The Redskins assumed that Indy takes Luck and they take RGIII. Badabing, badaboom. Assumptions have a way of biting you on the ass. If Andrew Luck refuses to play for Indy, the Redskins are now in a position where they can't bid for the number one spot. They've taken themselves out of the game. Who swoops in and takes that top spot then? Cleveland? The Rams (using all the picks the Redskins gave them)? Miami? Maybe even Denver (if they don't get Peyton)?

IMHO, there are more fireworks to come. ;D

spdirty
03-13-2012, 07:04 AM
I hope Luck and Griffin both refuse to go to Indy. **** that bull**** team. Deserve to be where they were pre-Manning until Irsay dies or sells.

But if your scenario happens that leaves Shanahan with Luck. I don't think he'd be too upset about that.

BroncoInferno
03-13-2012, 07:05 AM
The Redskins made the move to trade up because of how they felt about RGIII. I doubt they will feel much regret if your scenario comes into play.

WolfpackGuy
03-13-2012, 07:05 AM
This isn't far fetched now that all the dominoes have fallen.

Bronco Rob
03-13-2012, 07:06 AM
Karmic Retribution.



:thumbsup:

Kaylore
03-13-2012, 07:06 AM
I think Luck shows up and plays, but all my dreams would be fulfilled if Luck refused to go to Indy.

Beantown Bronco
03-13-2012, 07:07 AM
If Andrew Luck refuses to play for Indy, the Redskins are now in a position where they can't bid for the number one spot. They've taken themselves out of the game. Who swoops in and takes that top spot then? Cleveland? The Rams (using all the picks the Redskins gave them)? Miami? Maybe even Denver (if they don't get Peyton)?

IMHO, there are more fireworks to come. ;D

I must be missing something. Why would the Skins even care. They want RGIII, not Luck. And they'd still draft and have RGIII regardless of what Luck decides after he's drafted.

CEH
03-13-2012, 07:10 AM
It occurred to me this morning, reading all the notes about Manning, the Redskins trade, free agency, the draft, and one of the wildest off seasons ever, especially for the Broncos, that we might only be seeing the beginning. Peter King wrote this in his SI notes this morning:

The Colts cut half their roster. Sort of. Much of the backbone of a team that averaged 12.5 wins a year from 2005 to 2010 has disappeared in the last five days: The wrecking ball taken to the passing game is like nothing in recent history. Manning, Anthony Gonzalez and Dallas Clark were told they wouldn't be retained. Three more receivers -- wideouts Reggie Wayne and Pierre Garcon, and tight end Jacob Tamme -- will leave in free agency, almost certainly. Think of the Colts' opening-camp receiving corps in July 2010: The top two quarterbacks (including Curtis Painter) are now gone. The top two tight ends, gone. Three of the top four wideouts (excepting Austin Collie), gone. And the defense? Captain and leader Gary Brackett, cut. As Adam Schefter reported Friday, Dwight Freeney is on the trading block. Andrew Luck has to be thinking, "What am I walking into? The '76 Bucs?''
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2012/writers/peter_king/03/12/freeagency/index.html#ixzz1p0Hv8CDP

And suddenly the pieces came together and I realized: Luck is going to refuse to go to Indy! He's going to pull a Manning! (Eli, that is). You heard it here first. If you think Archie Manning is involved in Peyton's decision making process, wait until you see Andrew Luck's dad, Oliver. There's no way he lets his son start his NFL career at some franchise that has been dismantled. Face it, Luck is walking into a wasteland if he goes to Indy. He'll get his ass kicked for years. He'll be in worse shape than David Carr when the Texans drafted him. I really don't think Oliver Luck is going to let that happen.

And if that happens, like I think it will, where does that leave Shanahan? That's why you don't trade early for picks. The Redskins assumed that Indy takes Luck and they take RGIII. Badabing, badaboom. Assumptions have a way of biting you on the ass. If Andrew Luck refuses to play for Indy, the Redskins are now in a position where they can't bid for the number one spot. They've taken themselves out of the game. Who swoops in and takes that top spot then? Cleveland? The Rams (using all the picks the Redskins gave them)? Miami? Maybe even Denver (if they don't get Peyton)?

IMHO, there are more fireworks to come. ;D

Bruce Allen said publicly they are happy where they are at becuase they like both players. They will get one or the other.

Rohirrim
03-13-2012, 07:10 AM
I must be missing something. Why would the Skins even care. They want RGIII, not Luck. And they'd still draft and have RGIII regardless of what Luck decides after he's drafted.

Perhaps they went RGIII because Luck became unreachable and they felt they had to make a move and secure the second spot? I wonder if both QBs were available to Shanahan, which one he'd pick? My money would be on Luck.

Rohirrim
03-13-2012, 07:15 AM
Bruce Allen said publicly they are happy where they are at becuase they like both players. They will get one or the other.

If you sat Shanahan down and told him both QBs were available, which one would he pick? IMHO, it would be Luck. Hands down. Luck plays the kind of mental, game management style that Shanahan loves. They went for RGIII because if they didn't, they knew it was Tannehill or Grossman. I believe about half of what coaches and GMs tell the press.

Anyway, I guess the real point of this thread is, what happens if Luck pulls an Eli on Indy? The effect on the Redskins was a secondary thought.

houghtam
03-13-2012, 07:16 AM
I thought I saw somewhere that the Colts were already in contract talks with Luck?

enjolras
03-13-2012, 07:17 AM
Perhaps they went RGIII because Luck became unreachable and they felt they had to make a move and secure the second spot? I wonder if both QBs were available to Shanahan, which one he'd pick? My money would be on Luck.

I'd put my money, my house, my car and pretty much anything else of value on it. Nobody in their right mind would take RGIII over Luck. Not based on their body of work in college.

RGIII is a really nice consolation prize, but he's not the main event.

srphoenix
03-13-2012, 07:23 AM
Definitely an interesting and plausible take, but I think Irsay has been in contact with Luck for months now and has let him know what's taking place and what they have planned for the future. This is definitely going down as one of the most interesting offseasons in memory and we haven't even begun free agency!

TonyR
03-13-2012, 07:24 AM
If you sat Shanahan down and told him both QBs were available, which one would he pick? IMHO, it would be Luck. Hands down.

^ Yup, absolutely.

Rohirrim
03-13-2012, 07:25 AM
I'd put my money, my house, my car and pretty much anything else of value on it. Nobody in their right mind would take RGIII over Luck. Not based on their body of work in college.

RGIII is a really nice consolation prize, but he's not the main event.

Imagine if Luck tells the Colts to go **** themselves and then Indy takes RGIII?

Rohirrim
03-13-2012, 07:28 AM
I thought I saw somewhere that the Colts were already in contract talks with Luck?

The only thing I can find on that is this:
"When you have the chance to learn from a guy like Peyton Manning, if that chance arises, youd better take advantage of it, Luck said. Hes arguably the best quarterback ever, and he was my hero growing up. So, yeah.

Hulamau
03-13-2012, 07:35 AM
I think Luck shows up and plays, but all my dreams would be fulfilled if Luck refused to go to Indy.

Hey Khan,

Now that you're the owner of an NFL franchise .. you interested in trading for Timmy and if so, what will you give??!?

Kaylore
03-13-2012, 07:37 AM
Hey Khan,

Now that you're the owner of an NFL franchise .. you interested in trading for Timmy and if so, what will you give??!?

One Pizza Pie!

http://static.foxsports.com/content/fscom/img/2011/12/14/121411-Shahid-Khan-SW-PI_20111214222454873_660_320.JPG

TheReverend
03-13-2012, 07:41 AM
Odds of this happening:

0.000000000000000001%

Rohirrim
03-13-2012, 07:42 AM
One Pizza Pie!

http://static.foxsports.com/content/fscom/img/2011/12/14/121411-Shahid-Khan-SW-PI_20111214222454873_660_320.JPG

He has this kind of Gomez Addams thing about him. ;D

Chris
03-13-2012, 07:42 AM
http://www.the-nri.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/08/indian-moustache.jpg

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_2Ws1iYWdp-Y/SzuWEL5164I/AAAAAAAAAwI/3IJZJsd9SnU/s320/amoir1.jpg

barryr
03-13-2012, 07:42 AM
I don't see this happening. The Colts are mostly cutting either high priced vets or guys that didn't produce for them, or guys on the other side of 30 who do not fill the need of rebuilding, which is the path they are taking. Rookie QB's hardly expect to be going to great teams.

Rohirrim
03-13-2012, 07:42 AM
Odds of this happening:

0.000000000000000001%

Nice argument. :oyvey:

CEH
03-13-2012, 07:46 AM
If you sat Shanahan down and told him both QBs were available, which one would he pick? IMHO, it would be Luck. Hands down. Luck plays the kind of mental, game management style that Shanahan loves. They went for RGIII because if they didn't, they knew it was Tannehill or Grossman. I believe about half of what coaches and GMs tell the press.

Anyway, I guess the real point of this thread is, what happens if Luck pulls an Eli on Indy? The effect on the Redskins was a secondary thought.

Indy cut their players before Shanny traded his picks. WASH knew what was going on in Indy. Peyton rebuffed Shanny here in Denver and the next thing you know WASH went to plan B. RGIII is Jake Plummer only more athetic and smarter and can hit the deep ball. Perfect player for Shanny 3 level route tree and boots off play action. RGIII is no dummy in his own right. This is not Micheal Vick

TheReverend
03-13-2012, 07:48 AM
Nice argument. :oyvey:

Your OP's even better...

1. They're already in contract talks with Luck

2. He doesn't have the baseball leverage

3. He doesn't have ANY leverage lol

4. The Colts learned that lesson in 1983.

5. He's been nothing but super complimentary of the Colts in interviews.

6. They released Peyton... even if Luck refused to play for them, they'd probably just take RGIII instead and stay put.

7. Once again, your thread ****ing sucks.

Better?

Rohirrim
03-13-2012, 07:58 AM
Your OP's even better...

1. They're already in contract talks with Luck

2. He doesn't have the baseball leverage

3. He doesn't have ANY leverage lol

4. The Colts learned that lesson in 1983.

5. He's been nothing but super complimentary of the Colts in interviews.

6. They released Peyton... even if Luck refused to play for them, they'd probably just take RGIII instead and stay put.

7. Once again, your thread ****ing sucks.

Better?

And you wonder why you're so well loved?

1. Contract talks don't mean **** until there is a signature on paper.

2. Eli Manning had no leverage.

3. Last week, Indy had not cut all these players. You assume they informed Luck of this in advance. Assumption.

4. What player coming out of college is not complimentary to any and all teams that might draft him?

5. Your post. Don't mean ****. Take a Midol. ;D

Sassy
03-13-2012, 08:00 AM
LOL I was actually thinking about this yesterday...not about RG3 not going to the skins...but Luck refusing the Colts...that would be hilarious!

TheReverend
03-13-2012, 08:01 AM
And you wonder why you're so well loved?

1. Contract talks don't mean **** until there is a signature on paper.

2. Eli Manning had no leverage.

3. Last week, Indy had not cut all these players. You assume they informed Luck of this in advance. Assumption.

4. What player coming out of college is not complimentary to any and all teams that might draft him?

5. Your post. Don't mean ****. Take a Midol. ;D

Sweet rebuttal lol

I say again before you got your panties all twisted and stomped your feet:

Odds of this happening:

0.000000000000000001%

I've seen better threads and predictions from Bob.

Rohirrim
03-13-2012, 08:02 AM
Sweet rebuttal lol

I say again before you got your panties all twisted and stomped your feet:



I've seen better threads and predictions from Bob.

And your reasoning is about as good as MacGruder's.

TheReverend
03-13-2012, 08:03 AM
And your reasoning is about as good as MacGruder's.

Yes, the mountain of logic and actual supporting information versus your tin foil hat....

Gcver2ver3
03-13-2012, 08:04 AM
dwight freeney?....

yes please...

Rohirrim
03-13-2012, 08:21 AM
Seems to me the similarities between Eli & Archie and Andrew & Oliver are pretty blatant.

vancejohnson82
03-13-2012, 08:25 AM
Point #1 on Rev's list is really all there is to know

if the Colts recieved ANY kind of hesitation from Luck I'm positive they would have been more careful about scorching the Earth

DomCasual
03-13-2012, 08:26 AM
If that happens, then here's what we do.

We sign Manning. Everyone here rejoices. We then trade Tebow to the Arab for the seventh pick. We then call Indianapolis, and trade them Manning plus the seventh pick for the first pick.

TheReverend
03-13-2012, 08:30 AM
Point #1 on Rev's list is really all there is to know

if the Colts recieved ANY kind of hesitation from Luck I'm positive they would have been more careful about scorching the Earth

Honestly didn't even have to make it to point #1.

Anyone who's seen ANY interview with Luck this year has seen him praise the city of Indianapolis, the organization, the stadium etc.

He even said that while any competitor wants to play every snap, sitting behind Peyton would be an amazing learning experience.

But let's not let actual information get in the way of speculative deranged lunacy.

maven
03-13-2012, 08:31 AM
The Colts are doing the smart move in gutting the team and rebuilding with Luck.

Rohirrim
03-13-2012, 08:32 AM
Point #1 on Rev's list is really all there is to know

if the Colts recieved ANY kind of hesitation from Luck I'm positive they would have been more careful about scorching the Earth

That's why I'm not a libertarian. I don't believe in the assumption that people always act rationally. Watching the world day to day fortifies that belief. ;D

MacGruder
03-13-2012, 08:38 AM
I hope Luck and Griffin both refuse to go to Indy. **** that bull**** team. Deserve to be where they were pre-Manning until Irsay dies or sells.

But if your scenario happens that leaves Shanahan with Luck. I don't think he'd be too upset about that.

Just like the Broncos don't deserve Manning or Tebow the way they have played Tebow who was a model citizen for his team after they screwed him multiple times...

Tombstone RJ
03-13-2012, 08:45 AM
I think the gutting of the Colts is another way of the new front office saying that the old ways are out and the colts fully intend to build a new team around Luck. What the Lucks have to honestly ask themselves is can they do this? Polian is gone, he was at least a proven GM. Can the new front office draft and bring in FAs that can win? I'm guessing the offense they will build around Luck is the same offense he ran in college? They also have to rebuild the defense.

It's a pretty tall order.

Rohirrim
03-13-2012, 08:46 AM
Funny. I typed into Google, "Andrew Luck, contract, Indianapolis Colts" and can't find a single mention of there being contract talks going on. The internets must be broke.

TonyR
03-13-2012, 08:47 AM
Anyone who's seen ANY interview with Luck this year has seen him praise the city of Indianapolis, the organization, the stadium etc.

To be fair, and not necessarily disagreeing with your overall point, has he said anything publicly since they started gutting the roster?

maven
03-13-2012, 08:48 AM
I think the gutting of the Colts is another way of the new front office saying that the old ways are out and the colts fully intend to build a new team around Luck. What the Lucks have to honestly ask themselves is can they do this? Polian is gone, he was at least a proven GM. Can the new front office draft and bring in FAs that can win? I'm guessing the offense they will build around Luck is the same offense he ran in college? They also have to rebuild the defense.

It's a pretty tall order.

The Colts are going to suck for multiple years, cleared cap space, and will have a ton of high draft picks to maneuver. Can they do this? Who knows, but I bet it would be fun FO gig in Indy right now to start with Luck and improve the rest.

Tombstone RJ
03-13-2012, 08:51 AM
The Colts are going to suck for multiple years, cleared cap space, and will have a ton of high draft picks to maneuver. Can they do this? Who knows, but I bet it would be fun FO gig in Indy right now to start with Luck and improve the rest.

Yep, if Luck is everything they hope and expect him to be, then he is the cornerstone upon which the rest of the team can be built, much like Polian did with Manning. I guess what I don't understand is why dump Polian? If I was Isray I would have kept Polian and simply told him to build a new team around Luck.

Chris
03-13-2012, 09:00 AM
Polian was old and was developing that old guy smell. That's why Irsay got rid of him.

houghtam
03-13-2012, 09:21 AM
Luck is not going to leave the Colts high and dry. Just not going to happen. For one, look at how that city (and state) venerated Manning. They still do. God knows, I live here. Luck has his chance to be a god for 15 years. Yeah that will happen wherever he goes, but there has been absolutely no mention of Luck holding out or pulling a power play. It's pure speculation, and based on nothing more than a hunch posed by a what if.

baja
03-13-2012, 09:31 AM
And your reasoning is about as good as MacGruder's.
Don't insult MacGruder like that. I'm not so bad.

Rohirrim
03-13-2012, 09:37 AM
Luck is not going to leave the Colts high and dry. Just not going to happen. For one, look at how that city (and state) venerated Manning. They still do. God knows, I live here. Luck has his chance to be a god for 15 years. Yeah that will happen wherever he goes, but there has been absolutely no mention of Luck holding out or pulling a power play. It's pure speculation, and based on nothing more than a hunch posed by a what if.

Yes, it's speculation. And the idea that Luck is a lock to sign with Indy is also speculation. I can find no evidence of contract talks going on between Indy and Luck and I haven't heard a word from the Luck camp (which includes Oliver) since Manning was cut and the Indy roster (especially the receiving corps) was gutted. One speculation or set of assumptions has about as much value as any others.

Heyneck
03-13-2012, 09:56 AM
http://www.the-nri.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/08/indian-moustache.jpg

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_2Ws1iYWdp-Y/SzuWEL5164I/AAAAAAAAAwI/3IJZJsd9SnU/s320/amoir1.jpg

The Legend of Khan!

http://ilol.co/upload_pic/7606.gif

broncosteven
03-13-2012, 11:22 AM
I think it is funny how the Colts cleaned house and went full on rebuild. Everyone was afraid the Colts would cut Manning Draft Luck and keep going winning 10-13 games a year.

Now with the dismantling I think the Colts are in for a long hard road just to get back to .500

BroncoBen
03-13-2012, 11:26 AM
The Redskins made the move to trade up because of how they felt about RGIII. I doubt they will feel much regret if your scenario comes into play.

Yeah.. supposable the Redskins love both RGIII and Luck, so regardless they get a QB they like. Going to cost them.. but you can't win big unless you gamble big.

srphoenix
03-13-2012, 11:52 AM
If that happens, then here's what we do.

We sign Manning. Everyone here rejoices. We then trade Tebow to the Arab for the seventh pick. We then call Indianapolis, and trade them Manning plus the seventh pick for the first pick.

everyone and I mean EVERYONES minds would be completely blown, would be the biggest trade coup in the history of the nfl.

Tombstone RJ
03-13-2012, 11:58 AM
If that happens, then here's what we do.

We sign Manning. Everyone here rejoices. We then trade Tebow to the Arab for the seventh pick. We then call Indianapolis, and trade them Manning plus the seventh pick for the first pick.

Hilarious!

Wow, that would be epic. Peyton would be back in Indy with no team and less money...

Shananahan
03-13-2012, 12:44 PM
If that happens, then here's what we do.

We sign Manning. Everyone here rejoices. We then trade Tebow to the Arab for the seventh pick. We then call Indianapolis, and trade them Manning plus the seventh pick for the first pick.
This would be the funniest goddamn thing.

Archedamian
03-13-2012, 11:01 PM
http://www.the-nri.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/08/indian-moustache.jpg

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_2Ws1iYWdp-Y/SzuWEL5164I/AAAAAAAAAwI/3IJZJsd9SnU/s320/amoir1.jpg

Mangal Pandey. Awesome.