Sign the Petition. Save Democracy in America.

[Rohirrim]

An already horrendous situation was made much worse two years ago this month when the Supreme Court ruled in Citizens United v. the Federal Elections Commission that multinational corporations have a constitutional right to spend whatever they want to influence election outcomes. A bare 5-4 majority lowered the floodgates on unchecked, unlimited, unaccountable corporate cash in political campaigns. Corporations were equated with people. A century of laws regulating business spending on elections were upended. In one fell swoop, five justices fantasized for corporations a right never conceived by the founders whose preamble to our Constitution begins with the words, "We the people..."

The ruling not only poisoned our political process. It contaminated the legislative process. It cast a permanent chill over all policymaking. Will the merits or the money tip the balance when an issue comes before Congress? What do you think? If the question is on breaking up huge banks, for example, every member of the Senate and the House, in the back of their minds, will ask themselves what the personal price would be for taking on Wall Street. Am I going to be punished? Will a huge amount of money be unleashed in my state? They're going to think twice about how to cast that vote. Not to put too fine a point on it, you will see politicians being adopted by corporations and becoming wholly owned subsidiaries of corporate entities.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/rep-bernie-sanders/we-the-people_b_1219573.html

[Rohirrim]

If you think we can take on Wall Street and the banks and the energy companies without taking care of Citizens United first, all I can say is, you're drinking the Koolaid.

[peacepipe]

signed it,but i'm extremely pessimistic that it will ever happen.

[Blart]

Really? The year of the protest has given me hope.

[Bob]

I would much rather save the Republic -- Democracy is the wrong term, if they can get that simple fact right, what else do they not understand?

[Rohirrim]

I would much rather save the Republic -- Democracy is the wrong term, if they can get that simple fact right, what else do they not understand?

Please just go away.

[Bob]

Please just go away.

What? you disagree -- or is this another example where you need another history lesson?

[lonestar]

I would much rather save the Republic -- Democracy is the wrong term, if they can get that simple fact right, what else do they not understand?

you have to remember that the huffiington post is so far to the left that anything they print or for that matter anyone that reads it and believes it is a mental midget..

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

you have to remember that the huffiington post is so far to the left that anything they print or for that matter anyone that reads it and believes it is a mental midget..

There you go attacking the messenger because you can't refute the message again.

SOP for the right.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

Please just go away.

But then Rush wouldn't have an audience. ;)

[Rohirrim]

What? you disagree -- or is this another example where you need another history lesson?

Okay, dum***. I'll play. How do the representatives of government in this republic, including the executive, attain office? Are they appointed, or elected by the people?

I've always wondered why you rightards take such issue with the concept of "representative democracy." This has been argued before on here. For some reason, you troglodytes really hate the idea that the government of this country is a democracy. You just hate the word, don't you? Says a lot about you.

I think, in your minds, if you keep saying over and over to yourselves that this republic is not a democracy, you can convince yourselves that anybody who doesn't agree with your fascist dogma can rightfully be eliminated from representation. After all, that's what your right wing representatives in Congress are doing day after day, by stopping all the processes of government that don't pass their dogmatic agenda.

This also explains why the Right Wing in America has no respect for the outcome of elections. If you can't fix the election (as with Bush in Florida and Ohio) and your candidate loses, then you expend all your energies to ensure that the government of your opponent fails. After all, it's pretty clear what your agenda is: The implementation of an ideologically rigid, dogmatic, right wing state. A one religion, socially restrictive police state governed by corporations and the military. One need only watch your primaries to get a whiff of where you want to take this country. After all, Citizens United was a major victory for your side, wasn't it?

The natural enemy of such a state is democracy. I can see why you despise even the mention of the word.

Go ahead and give me a history lesson.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

Bill Moyers: How ordinary people can fight ‘Citizens United’



<iframe src="http://player.vimeo.com/video/35388815?title=0&amp;byline=0&amp;portrait=0" width="400" height="225" frameborder="0" webkitAllowFullScreen mozallowfullscreen allowFullScreen></iframe><p><a href="http://vimeo.com/35388815">Ask Bill: How can ordinary people help to overturn or nullify the Citizen United Decision?</a> from <a href="http://vimeo.com/user9013478">BillMoyers.com</a> on <a href="http://vimeo.com">Vimeo</a>.</p>

[Bob]

you have to remember that the huffiington post is so far to the left that anything they print or for that matter anyone that reads it and believes it is a mental midget..

I am aware of that, but its still a pet peeve, and another example of changing our history and traditions, that progressives are so fond of attempting.

[Bob]

Okay, dum***. I'll play. How do the representatives of government in this republic, including the executive, attain office? Are they appointed, or elected by the people?

I've always wondered why you rightards take such issue with the concept of "representative democracy." This has been argued before on here. For some reason, you troglodytes really hate the idea that the government of this country is a democracy. You just hate the word, don't you? Says a lot about you.

I think, in your minds, if you keep saying over and over to yourselves that this republic is not a democracy, you can convince yourselves that anybody who doesn't agree with your fascist dogma can rightfully be eliminated from representation. After all, that's what your right wing representatives in Congress are doing day after day, by stopping all the processes of government that don't pass their dogmatic agenda.

This also explains why the Right Wing in America has no respect for the outcome of elections. If you can't fix the election (as with Bush in Florida and Ohio) and your candidate loses, then you expend all your energies to ensure that the government of your opponent fails. After all, it's pretty clear what your agenda is: The implementation of an ideologically rigid, dogmatic, right wing state. A one religion, socially restrictive police state governed by corporations and the military. One need only watch your primaries to get a whiff of where you want to take this country. After all, Citizens United was a major victory for your side, wasn't it?

The natural enemy of such a state is democracy. I can see why you despise even the mention of the word.

Go ahead and give me a history lesson.

I will in one of the main threads, as this is an important distinction.

[Rohirrim]

you have to remember that the huffiington post is so far to the left that anything they print or for that matter anyone that reads it and believes it is a mental midget..

I guarantee you, you've never gone there, never read it, never even seen it, but still mouth off (if you had, you'd know it's only a collection of articles and essays from all over the place). Why? Because you're a right wing parrot. A puppet. You have no interest in anything that is not already rattling around in your little peanut head. The only places you go for information are places that agree with what you already believe and reinforce the unexamined ideas, even if they are completely wrong, that you already hold. You are a golem. A creature of animated mud. A troglodyte. Incurious. Oafish. Dull witted. Living a thoroughly unexamined life.

[Rohirrim]

I will in one of the main threads, as this is an important distinction.

An important distinction? How? We are a republic. We are a democracy. We are both things. You can call a dog a canine. It's still a dog.

[Odysseus]

If you are concerned about the collapse of the middle class, you should be concerned about how American campaigns are financed. If you wonder why the United States is the only country in the industrialized world not to have a national health care program, if you're asking why we pay the highest price in the world for prescription drugs, or why we spend more money on the military than the rest of the world combined, you are talking about campaign finance. You are talking about the unbelievable power that big-money interests have over every legislative decision.

An already horrendous situation was made much worse two years ago this month when the Supreme Court ruled in Citizens United v. the Federal Elections Commission that multinational corporations have a constitutional right to spend whatever they want to influence election outcomes. A bare 5-4 majority lowered the floodgates on unchecked, unlimited, unaccountable corporate cash in political campaigns. Corporations were equated with people. A century of laws regulating business spending on elections were upended. In one fell swoop, five justices fantasized for corporations a right never conceived by the founders whose preamble to our Constitution begins with the words, "We the people..."

[Bob]

An important distinction? How? We are a republic. We are a democracy. We are both things. You can call a dog a canine. It's still a dog.

In this case, it may be more accurate to cite Lincoln, Just because fools call a dog's tail, his fifth leg doesnt make it correct.

[lonestar]

I guarantee you, you've never gone there, never read it, never even seen it, but still mouth off (if you had, you'd know it's only a collection of articles and essays from all over the place). Why? Because you're a right wing parrot. A puppet. You have no interest in anything that is not already rattling around in your little peanut head. The only places you go for information are places that agree with what you already believe and reinforce the unexamined ideas, even if they are completely wrong, that you already hold. You are a golem. A creature of animated mud. A troglodyte. Incurious. Oafish. Dull witted. Living a thoroughly unexamined life.

Wow you must be proud of your self. All of theose names in such a short paragraph. Must have spent a long time in the dictionary to find them all.

But your wrong I have been there and read the crap they publish. .

I find it ironic that one of the richest women in the USA would be so wrong about almost everything.

Guess it must have been all that money she got rom her ex that went to her head.

I suspect had she actually earned it she would have a much better perspective.

I'm so glad there are morons out there that think that she is Gods answer to their prayers.

Go with God.

[Rohirrim]

In this case, it may be more accurate to cite Lincoln, Just because fools call a dog's tail, his fifth leg doesnt make it correct.

Thanks for hijacking the thread. Obviously, you support corporations taking over our elections. So. **** you.

[Rohirrim]

Wow you must be proud of your self. All of theose names in such a short paragraph. Must have spent a long time in the dictionary to find them all.

But your wrong I have been there and read the crap they publish. .

I find it ironic that one of the richest women in the USA would be so wrong about almost everything.

Guess it must have been all that money she got rom her ex that went to her head.

I suspect had she actually earned it she would have a much better perspective.

I'm so glad there are morons out there that think that she is Gods answer to their prayers.

Go with God.

Another supporter of the corporate takeover of America. Hopefully, the true patriots outnumber people like you.

[Fedaykin]

I would much rather save the Republic -- Democracy is the wrong term, if they can get that simple fact right, what else do they not understand?

A republic IS a democracy. The terms are not mutually exclusive. One is a specific type of another, not a completely different beast. All republics (that is, governments that are actually structured as a republic not various governments that call themselves republics) are democracies , though not all democracies are republics.

[Rohirrim]

A republic IS a democracy. The terms are not mutually exclusive. One is a specific type of another, not a completely different beast. All republics (that is, governments that are actually structured as a republic not various governments that call themselves republics) are democracies , though not all democracies are republics.

He's just trying to hijack the thread. Hard to believe that there are actually Americans out there who support Citizens United, but there are.

[Fedaykin]

He's just trying to hijack the thread. Hard to believe that there are actually Americans out there who support Citizens United, but there are.

What, we should be upset that Sony, a Japanese corporation (along with tons of other foreign corps) now has more say in our government than its citizens?

What could possibly go wrong?

[Bob]

Thanks for hijacking the thread. Obviously, you support corporations taking over our elections. So. **** you.

What did the Supreme Court say on this matter? Or do you not believe in Maybury V. Madison?

For someone who gets bent out of shape when I suggest Obama might be Marxist leaning, you sure like to call others names...ones's that are more personal in nature. Is it you are attempting (feebly) to shut others up? That would not be very Democratic of you. One might begin to think that you also lean toward controling what others say and think. If so, it would also explain why Obama's choice to head the FCC (Mark Lloyd) would never create a concern for you.

[Rohirrim]

What did the Supreme Court say on this matter? Or do you not believe in Maybury V. Madison?

For someone who gets bent out of shape when I suggest Obama might be Marxist leaning, you sure like to call others names...ones's that are more personal in nature. Is it you are attempting (feebly) to shut others up? That would not be very Democratic of you. One might begin to think that you also lean toward controling what others say and think. If so, it would also explain why Obama's choice to head the FCC (Mark Lloyd) would never create a concern for you.

It's Marbury v Madison. And that does not claim the court is infallible, only that the court is the final arbiter of constitutional questions. Citizens United is one of the worst examples of high court activism in our history. They made law where it did not exist before.

The Court’s ruling threatens to undermine the integrity of elected institutions across the Nation. The path it has taken to reach its outcome will, I fear, do damage to this institution.

If you'd like to read more of Justice Stevens blistering dissent, where he was joined by three other justices, go here:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x7536905

[lonestar]

It's Marbury v Madison. And that does not claim the court is infallible, only that the court is the final arbiter of constitutional questions. Citizens United is one of the worst examples of high court activism in our history. They made law where it did not exist before.

The Court’s ruling threatens to undermine the integrity of elected institutions across the Nation. The path it has taken to reach its outcome will, I fear, do damage to this institution.

If you'd like to read more of Justice Stevens blistering dissent, where he was joined by three other justices, go here:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x7536905
So in your opine Stevens is correct and the other 5 are wrong.

Why does that not surprise me..

[alkemical]

https://encrypted-tbn0.google.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQcu2sx9IdTjYoc3q0A6FtDEiGiGGYiD n2cPjyZ8Ikd5xItI6byew

[alkemical]

https://encrypted-tbn1.google.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRfdMTXjv0gBJHYGwBSP4ITmFFToQjaI 7mOsbVcpbsIuD2cxLOe

[alkemical]

https://encrypted-tbn2.google.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTO1uWK7JKxIHahM4lnc-XU5675o5-5ac2hE4HF0-8bC6LWwOw4

[Rohirrim]

So in your opine Stevens is correct and the other 5 are wrong.

Why does that not surprise me..

Did you read the dissent? Of course you didn't.

Do you believe that corporations are people and have the right to pump unlimited amounts of corporate money into our elections?

[Odysseus]

Did you read the dissent? Of course you didn't.

Do you believe that corporations are people and have the right to pump unlimited amounts of corporate money into our elections?

This is why even if we throw the bums out nothing will change.

The biggest problem with a store bought congress is not domestic corporations purchase of our prosperity but the foreign and global interests who have money who can affect elections.

Most political changes are done with the right idea in mind but the end result, outside of free market, gets so easily poisoned.

[Spider]

Companies outside of the states can affect out election outcomes ...... Come on Bob get your head out of your ass son and wake up ..Citizens united is as evil as Al Davis in a speedo

[Play2win]

A vote for the GOP is a vote against the best interests of America.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

Bill Moyers on Citizens United: "It is not a partisan issue; it is more than a political issue; it is a great moral issue."

https://s-external.ak.fbcdn.net/safe_image.php?d=AQDAQltCplajiOv_&w=90&h=90&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.truth-out.org%2Fsites%2Fdefault%2Ffiles%2FCU1.jpg (http://www.truth-out.org/bill-moyers-fighting-back/1327630978)Bill Moyers | Fighting Back Against Corporate Personhood (http://www.truth-out.org/bill-moyers-fighting-back/1327630978)

Rarely have so few imposed such damage on so many. When five conservative members of the Supreme Court handed for-profit corporations the right to secretly flood political campaigns with tidal waves of cash on the eve of an election, they moved America closer to outright plutocracy, where political ...(cont.)