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View Full Version : wow! are the STL Rams taking steps to move to London?


Gort
01-20-2012, 01:12 PM
are the St. Louis Rams taking the first steps toward moving to London? ...or will they just be designated to play a certain number of games there each year? (sort of like Detroit always playing on Thanskgiving).

they'll play games in London in each of the next 3 years.

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news?slug=ap-nflinlondon

Tombstone RJ
01-20-2012, 01:19 PM
I don't see a permanent move, for one thing, no players would want to be on a team that has to fly across the atlantic (and to the US West Coast) for games and I seriously doubt that the teams in their division would like to have to make the trip to London every year.

SonOfLe-loLang
01-20-2012, 01:22 PM
That was my initial reaction, but it seems like such a nightmare logistically.

Gort
01-20-2012, 01:24 PM
I don't see a permanent move, for one thing, no players would want to be on a team that has to fly across the atlantic (and to the US West Coast) for games and I seriously doubt that the teams in their division would like to have to make the trip to London every year.

the NFL has said it wants to put a team there. STL wants to move. the owner owns a soccer team in the EPL. whether London gets an existing team or an expansion franchise, i don't know, but it wouldn't surprise me if it happens sometime in the next several years.

KO5K
01-20-2012, 01:28 PM
Will never happen.

The NFL drastically overestimates the support it has in the UK/Europe.

bendog
01-20-2012, 01:29 PM
Stan the Man is the cable King. His local media rights could be astounding.

Archer81
01-20-2012, 01:33 PM
I'd think there would be a team in Mexico City before there is one in London.


:Broncos:

Gort
01-20-2012, 01:34 PM
I'd think there would be a team in Mexico City before there is one in London.


:Broncos:

too many jokes, too little time...

Requiem
01-20-2012, 01:41 PM
The Rams are about all the folks over there deserve.

Rams vs. Browns
Rams vs. Bills
Rams vs. Vikings

Do something like that.

Real ****ty football.

BroncoBeavis
01-20-2012, 01:42 PM
Will never happen.

The NFL drastically overestimates the support it has in the UK/Europe.

Yeah, but that doesn't mean it wouldn't like to build support over there. It's hard to build a fan base with no locals to root for. Flying in a couple of teams with no ties to the area once a year basically amounts to an exhibition. Whether it counts to us as a regular season game doesn't matter over there. It's hard to make games matter to the locals unless it's 'their' team.

Then again this might just be a trial where they get the same team for a few years in a row to see if that helps spark any more interest. There may be enough interest in the UK to support an NFL franchise. But flying in different teams year after year isn't going to harness or build anything.

BroncoBeavis
01-20-2012, 01:43 PM
And if a team was ever placed in Europe, they'd almost have to realign to put that team in one of the East divisions. Could you imagine the whole NFC West having to travel to London every year to play the Rams?

Houshyamama
01-20-2012, 01:45 PM
too many jokes, too little time...

Mexico City Drug Runners

BroncoBeavis
01-20-2012, 01:47 PM
Mexico City Drug Runners

I'd go with the Coyotes myself. :)

Archer81
01-20-2012, 01:48 PM
Mexico City El Guapos.


:Broncos:

DarkHorse
01-20-2012, 01:49 PM
Canada will get a team before anyone across the pond does. Looks like they're trying to gauge interest over there without putting together another NFLE league.

Archer81
01-20-2012, 01:53 PM
Mexico City Plethoras.

Mexico City Chupacabras.

:Broncos:

Mountain Bronco
01-20-2012, 01:55 PM
Sure, move the team there and you are guaranteed at least 8 wins a year, but also guaranteed 8 losses a year. To much travel, but it seems to fit with Mr. 8-8 as their coach.

Requiem
01-20-2012, 01:56 PM
Mexico City Traffickers

Agamemnon
01-20-2012, 01:59 PM
Goodell and his London fixation. God that guy is such a retarded douchebag.

Houshyamama
01-20-2012, 02:04 PM
Mexico City Plethoras.

Mexico City Chupacabras.

:Broncos:

They have a plethora of fans.

eddie mac
01-20-2012, 02:04 PM
Will never happen.

The NFL drastically overestimates the support it has in the UK/Europe.

TV viewing figures have doubled inside 3 seasons and every single game has averaged over the 80k mark, only dropping below 80k for the first time this year. I also have no doubt that a British (London based) franchise would be far more successful financially that quite a few current NFL teams which are struggling like Jacksonville, Buffalo and Tampa.

We actually get more live coverage of the NFL now here than the majority of US based citizens and have Redzone:yayaya:.

I've also yet to hear one complaint from an NFL player about having to come over here. The majority love the break and the chance to get out of the US. Now obviously if Britain ever got a franchise, there would be issues with players relocating here especially the big names and they would need to be financially rewarded to make such a commitment.

Archer81
01-20-2012, 02:05 PM
They have a plethora of fans.


Jefe, what is a plethora?


:Broncos:

El Guapo
01-20-2012, 02:07 PM
Mexico City El Guapos.


:Broncos:

I approve; however, coyotes or vaqueros works well too.

Houshyamama
01-20-2012, 02:09 PM
TV viewing figures have doubled inside 3 seasons and every single game has averaged over the 80k mark, only dropping below 80k for the first time this year. I also have no doubt that a British (London based) franchise would be far more successful financially that quite a few current NFL teams which are struggling like Jacksonville, Buffalo and Tampa.

We actually get more live coverage of the NFL now here than the majority of US based citizens and have Redzone:yayaya:.

Do you get Redzone for free?

eddie mac
01-20-2012, 02:10 PM
Do you get Redzone for free?

Part of skysports package which the NFL live game are on. Full digital TV here costs about $90 a month.

Houshyamama
01-20-2012, 02:14 PM
Part of skysports package which the NFL live game are on. Full digital TV here costs about $90 a month.

That's pricey. At least you get Redzone, that channel rocks. As for football in the UK, I have no doubt it would be successful as there are enough fans over there to support a team, but I just don't think it would ever work because of the travel.

bendog
01-20-2012, 02:32 PM
I dunno. I was paying around that when I pulled the plug. Stan the Man likes to control the site from which local broadcast comes from. The issue is that nfl owners share equally in network fees. But CBS and Fox are not in europe. Stan not only knows how much interest he's earned on the first dime he made, he knows were the dime is.

broncosteven
01-20-2012, 02:39 PM
I approve; however, coyotes or vaqueros works well too.

Amigos?

BroncoBeavis
01-20-2012, 02:49 PM
TV viewing figures have doubled inside 3 seasons and every single game has averaged over the 80k mark, only dropping below 80k for the first time this year. I also have no doubt that a British (London based) franchise would be far more successful financially that quite a few current NFL teams which are struggling like Jacksonville, Buffalo and Tampa.

We actually get more live coverage of the NFL now here than the majority of US based citizens and have Redzone:yayaya:.

I've also yet to hear one complaint from an NFL player about having to come over here. The majority love the break and the chance to get out of the US. Now obviously if Britain ever got a franchise, there would be issues with players relocating here especially the big names and they would need to be financially rewarded to make such a commitment.

I think it's a great idea on paper. And I'm sure teams would love traveling there once in awhile. Would be much harder on the divisional teams who'd have to do it every year. And even harder than that on the London team, who'd have to do 8 cross-Atlantics a year. Don't know if that's even possible.

bendog
01-20-2012, 02:54 PM
Amigos?

MARICONS

extralife
01-20-2012, 03:51 PM
I like how the NFL tries to sell the game in England by going out of their way to make sure the London game is balls awful every single year.

BroncoBeavis
01-20-2012, 03:59 PM
I like how the NFL tries to sell the game in England by going out of their way to make sure the London game is balls awful every single year.

Yeah, there is that. But it's a tough balance. It's not like the yearly contenders are going to want to give up an actual home game every year. It's gonna be the suck teams that don't care enough to protect their home schedule.

DAN_BRONCO_FAN
01-20-2012, 04:01 PM
i think the Rams should move to barrow Alaska or Death Valley they can also be renamed the burnt rams or frozen rams

bendog
01-20-2012, 04:03 PM
I dunno about that. IMO the Rams are in great shape to be the next emerging NFC power. I think the Saints shot their cap this year. The SF loss was pretty devastating. The Giants with Eli will be potentially in the hunt every year, but Eli's inconsistent. The Pack will be around for years. I'm not sure about SF. Great D, great running attack. I think they're what Den aspires to be.

Car has a great future with Cam. I'm not sure about Tampa Bay. I like Freeman, but he can rub teammates the wrong way. In StL Bradford was hurt, and they never got going. They should end up with five picks in the top 100 though.

I'll still be surprised if they don't end up in LA though.

KO5K
01-20-2012, 04:05 PM
TV viewing figures have doubled inside 3 seasons and every single game has averaged over the 80k mark, only dropping below 80k for the first time this year. I also have no doubt that a British (London based) franchise would be far more successful financially that quite a few current NFL teams which are struggling like Jacksonville, Buffalo and Tampa.

It will be interesting to see the attendance figures for this year. Some claim that it didn't sell out last year simply because it was announced so late, there were what, 10000 empty seats?

I personally think it's more that people aren't interested in forking out 200 to watch a game that they don't really care about. They've been once or twice for the experience and now they'd rather watch the game at home or watch their own team play on the TV/internet at home.

I also don't see anyway that a London franchise would work. I'd say most people that go the IS game are big NFL fans who love making the trip once a year to see a live game, a yearly event that they really look forward to. No way would they make that trip 8 times a year especially for a team that they don't really support. People already have their teams, that won't change because a franchise comes over here.

We'll see in October, but my guess is that the game isn't a sellout and in 2015 the IS moves elsewhere.

bendog
01-20-2012, 04:22 PM
It will be interesting to see the attendance figures for this year. Some claim that it didn't sell out last year simply because it was announced so late, there were what, 10000 empty seats?

I personally think it's more that people aren't interested in forking out 200 to watch a game that they don't really care about. They've been once or twice for the experience and now they'd rather watch the game at home or watch their own team play on the TV/internet at home.

I also don't see anyway that a London franchise would work. I'd say most people that go the IS game are big NFL fans who love making the trip once a year to see a live game, a yearly event that they really look forward to. No way would they make that trip 8 times a year especially for a team that they don't really support. People already have their teams, that won't change because a franchise comes over here.

We'll see in October, but my guess is that the game isn't a sellout and in 2015 the IS moves elsewhere.

yeah, but suppose a team that was pretty good sort of adopted London as their second home. Stan the Man is a finacially stable guy and he has sports broadcast experiennce Play one game there. Then package the rest of the games. I still think that eventually the NFL will have to broaden their out of network base, and instead of just selling a league package, sell individ team packages. The networks would have more of the prime time type games, and the league would be selling advertising time directly to Bud and Geico.

TheReverend
01-20-2012, 04:28 PM
No. But they're clearly trying to capture and monopolize a new market.

Good move of them, imo.

BroncoBeavis
01-20-2012, 04:33 PM
It will be interesting to see the attendance figures for this year. Some claim that it didn't sell out last year simply because it was announced so late, there were what, 10000 empty seats?.

Wembley holds something like 90k though. Even with 10k empty, that would be higher attendance than most NFL home games.

KO5K
01-20-2012, 04:35 PM
yeah, but suppose a team that was pretty good sort of adopted London as their second home. Stan the Man is a finacially stable guy and he has sports broadcast experiennce Play one game there. Then package the rest of the games. I still think that eventually the NFL will have to broaden their out of network base, and instead of just selling a league package, sell individ team packages. The networks would have more of the prime time type games, and the league would be selling advertising time directly to Bud and Geico.

With Gamepass you can buy individual team packages, though it isn't great value compared to the entire package.

The first bit I agree with to an extent, but only because you point out that it would a pretty good team, which is never going to happen.

KO5K
01-20-2012, 04:40 PM
Wembley holds something like 90k though. Even with 10k empty, that would be higher attendance than most NFL home games.

There was 77,000 there, down 8,000 from the year before. If that figure was to hold then I would totally expect their to be a game in the UK for a long time but we'll have to see if that figure holds.

broncosteven
01-20-2012, 07:02 PM
I dunno about that. IMO the Rams are in great shape to be the next emerging NFC power. I think the Saints shot their cap this year. The SF loss was pretty devastating. The Giants with Eli will be potentially in the hunt every year, but Eli's inconsistent. The Pack will be around for years. I'm not sure about SF. Great D, great running attack. I think they're what Den aspires to be.

Car has a great future with Cam. I'm not sure about Tampa Bay. I like Freeman, but he can rub teammates the wrong way. In StL Bradford was hurt, and they never got going. They should end up with five picks in the top 100 though.

I'll still be surprised if they don't end up in LA though.

I think there are a ton of St Louis fans, I see a lot of Rams jerseys here in the Chicago area but it could be all the Cardinal fans sticking it in the craw of cub (loser) fans.

I still think the Falcons have one of the worst fanbases in the NFL.

BroncoMan4ever
01-21-2012, 12:01 AM
come on, teams on the coasts bitch when they have to take trips to the other side of the country. can you just imagine the outcry if 8 teams a year had to make a London trip. that would also be a massively unfair homefield advantage.

lonestar
01-21-2012, 01:27 AM
I think it's a great idea on paper. And I'm sure teams would love traveling there once in awhile. Would be much harder on the divisional teams who'd have to do it every year. And even harder than that on the London team, who'd have to do 8 cross-Atlantics a year. Don't know if that's even possible.

Actually they could have several games in a row stateside so the travel across the pond would not be as hard on the Rams as it would be for the other teams..

I'd guess that each team could get a bye week before or after their game in Europe with all the other games in the US would be the first few games in the year and the last few games of the season..

As for moving them to the NFCE not going to happen way to much rivalry with the existing teams there.. If they were ever going to do that DAL would have been moved when they realigned the teams years back..

As for not having sell outs in the past couple of years well they still had more in attendance than all but DAL can have with almost 90K seats available..

IMHO not as far fetched as some might think..

NOw the only other question is are their enough fans to buy season tickets for those 60K seats that it would take to sustain the teams..
and would those other seats sell out when the reigning Super Bowls champs come to town each year along with those other high profile teams such as the Cowgirls, NY jets/Giants, bears, saints, Pats, Redskins and Packers.

I'd guess that good teams coming to town for say 3-4 of their non conference games would seal the deal..

lonestar
01-21-2012, 01:31 AM
come on, teams on the coasts b**** when they have to take trips to the other side of the country. can you just imagine the outcry if 8 teams a year had to make a London trip. that would also be a massively unfair homefield advantage.

no more than say going to Green bay in NOV-DEC.. or some of the Dome teams have on artificial grass. or for that matter a dome team playing on real grass ..

and then there is the black hole.

No one wants to go to SEA anymore with their fans.. and old Mile High well that was special..

eddie mac
01-21-2012, 04:14 AM
I think it's a great idea on paper. And I'm sure teams would love traveling there once in awhile. Would be much harder on the divisional teams who'd have to do it every year. And even harder than that on the London team, who'd have to do 8 cross-Atlantics a year. Don't know if that's even possible.

To be fair BB I think the notion is a long way off. They'd need to host more than one game a year for starters. When/If they bump it up to 2-3 reg season games per year in Europe and it's successful then they can look towards the franchise thing but needless to say some players are gonna be real pissed when they get drafted there especially vets with kids. As you say I dont really know how it would all fall into place to make it work. 1 week a year is one thing, but 17 weeks plus playoffs, very hard to achieve.

eddie mac
01-21-2012, 04:23 AM
It will be interesting to see the attendance figures for this year. Some claim that it didn't sell out last year simply because it was announced so late, there were what, 10000 empty seats?

I personally think it's more that people aren't interested in forking out 200 to watch a game that they don't really care about. They've been once or twice for the experience and now they'd rather watch the game at home or watch their own team play on the TV/internet at home.

I also don't see anyway that a London franchise would work. I'd say most people that go the IS game are big NFL fans who love making the trip once a year to see a live game, a yearly event that they really look forward to. No way would they make that trip 8 times a year especially for a team that they don't really support. People already have their teams, that won't change because a franchise comes over here.

We'll see in October, but my guess is that the game isn't a sellout and in 2015 the IS moves elsewhere.

Word is that one of the new Olympic Stadium's uses after the Olympics (still up in the air I know) could well be for NFL games. If West Ham get the ground the anticipated new capacity after the games will go down to the 55-60k mark. Just another iron in the fire I think but as for your other point about lack of support for a new team over a 16 game season, I'd have to disagree. If this was a long-term thing I think many NFL fans would switch teams if said franchise was competing against the best the NFL could offer and at some point down the line (grassroots UK players making it in the game via the NCAA) that would also help in that dept. Remember that this would be totally different from NFL Europe in that it wont be practice squad football. If say for example London were able to draft 10 of the 200 best current NFL players in an expansion draft a lot of fans would switch or at least go to see the team they're playing every other week.

Now I'm not saying that would include me cos 27 years of orange would be very hard to shift, but there are a lot of new fans in the UK that couldn't tell you who Drew Brees plays for if you catch my drift, i.e not really team affiliated yet.

eddie mac
01-21-2012, 04:24 AM
i think the Rams should move to barrow Alaska or Death Valley they can also be renamed the burnt rams or frozen rams

It's a good job they aren't moving to Wales. The Welsh sheep shaggers rings a bell.:giggle:

Gort
01-21-2012, 04:25 AM
To be fair BB I think the notion is a long way off. They'd need to host more than one game a year for starters. When/If they bump it up to 2-3 reg season games per year in Europe and it's successful then they can look towards the franchise thing but needless to say some players are gonna be real pissed when they get drafted there especially vets with kids. As you say I dont really know how it would all fall into place to make it work. 1 week a year is one thing, but 17 weeks plus playoffs, very hard to achieve.

it's not that tough. pick a team such as the Rams.

the Rams play 4 games in STL, 4 games in London, and 8 games on the road in other stadiums. they are based in STL. they all live in STL. they train in STL. they have temporary training facilities in London (a practice field, etc.). they play back-to-back games in London twice a year, so the team is essentially taking a trip there, not living there. they are there for 9-10 days each time... they fly in 2 days before a game (friday), finish workouts for the game, play the game, stay and practice all week, play the 2nd game, fly back to STL. if the league sets it up so that the bye weeks for them and their opponents are "helpful", it's not really too tough to come up with a way to make this work, if the NFL is behind it. the games in London would be evening games so that the broadcasts stateside are during the normal NFL broadcasts.

Mile High 81
01-21-2012, 04:27 AM
Well i do not think this will work. Okay NFL Football ist poular in the UK and Europe. But i do not think a franchise would fit.

So when you go to the Game in London the stadium is full of NFL Fans from every team.

When you try to build a franchise you need 2/3 Fans from one team to fill the stadium. 8 Times a year.

That will not work.

eddie mac
01-21-2012, 04:27 AM
come on, teams on the coasts b**** when they have to take trips to the other side of the country. can you just imagine the outcry if 8 teams a year had to make a London trip. that would also be a massively unfair homefield advantage.

I dont think it would be a problem for the members of the visiting team once a season because the majority always look forward to getting a wee trip away across the pond and applaud the UK for their hospitality. I do however see a problem with the players who'd be playing for the London team and would have to relocate for half the year, with young families that could be a major problem.

eddie mac
01-21-2012, 04:30 AM
Well i do not think this will work. Okay NFL Football ist poular in the UK and Europe. But i do not think a franchise would fit.

So when you go to the Game in London the stadium is full of NFL Fans from every team.

When you try to build a franchise you need 2/3 Fans from one team to fill the stadium. 8 Times a year.

That will not work.

It depends how they sell it MH81. Ticket pricing will also come into it. No way fans could afford 200 8 games a year. You also have to remember that instead of 2 NFL teams coming over once a season, your UK fan gets the opportunity to see 9 different teams. I'm pretty sure the NFL wouldn't worry too much about the London teams support if the Pats, Niners, Dolphins, Jets or whoever were drawing 40-50k fans.

Bronx33
01-21-2012, 08:58 AM
I dont see a problem with the UK having a team but its a logistical nightmare but why couldn't the team be based here and renamed something UK-ish?

Mile High 81
01-22-2012, 04:13 AM
It depends how they sell it MH81. Ticket pricing will also come into it. No way fans could afford 200 8 games a year. You also have to remember that instead of 2 NFL teams coming over once a season, your UK fan gets the opportunity to see 9 different teams. I'm pretty sure the NFL wouldn't worry too much about the London teams support if the Pats, Niners, Dolphins, Jets or whoever were drawing 40-50k fans.
Thats right ticket price will be huge. I also see that teams like jets, niners dolphins will get you fans. but from a home team view that basiclly means you will have no homefield adv. . thats a probleme in my view.

barters
01-22-2012, 05:20 AM
I'm glad Eddie Mac is talking some sense!

A lot of the issues that people have raised are really not a problem! For example travelling would absolutely not be a problem (flying first or business class) even going from the West Coast to the UK. For the London team I would imagine that they would make 2/3 trips to the US per season and play 2/3 games each time.

Gauging interest in a full time franchise from the International Series games is tough. I'm a huge NFL fan and live about 90 minutes from London and have only been once (when we played the 49ers). Team allegiance has a lot to do with it. If there was a team based here and 'representing' the UK then I think most casual NFL followers would ditch their team and follow the London team.

Worth bearing in mind the size of London - the same size as Chicago (in terms of population) and the only US cities that are larger are NYC and LA. I personally think that if this got the go-ahead that they could comfortably sell out every game as it would open the NFL to so many more new people (who currently may not be that interested due to not having a team to follow).

broncoblue
01-22-2012, 07:17 AM
My view is a team in London would be a disaster in the long run. Sure it may work for a season or so due to novelty value but when the international game is played id say 50% is made up of "NFL FANS" . Also theres only new fans who dont have teams already and i dont think you would get 90k cockneys buying into the london rams.
The cost of attending wembley is frighting if you live out of london and the price inside and the price of tickets isnt something , i for one, people can afford.
Would I go ,nope, only if if we were playing there .
London couldnt sustain a team in nfl europe and i think hand on heart it would be the same for a nfl franchise.