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View Full Version : What positions do you think the Broncos need to address in free agency and the draft?


BowlenBall
01-15-2012, 02:41 AM
What positions do you think the Broncos need to address in free agency and the draft? (pick as many as you think apply, then discuss)

ol#7
01-15-2012, 02:45 AM
MLB. Until we actally have one, the D will continue to get owned.

BowlenBall
01-15-2012, 02:47 AM
MLB. Until we actally have one, the D will continue to get owned.

Agreed -- the day Al Wilson injured his neck was the day we became a bottom-10 defense.

I also think cornerback is a critical concern.

uk bronco
01-15-2012, 03:04 AM
Realistically we have to look to pick up help on D through FA and get a playmaker on O through the draft. We are probably one of the least attractive teams for FA WRs and i think it will be hard to get more talent there unless we draft it. I would like to see us draft a RB TE & WR and address the needs at DL LB and CB in FA

The Joker
01-15-2012, 03:12 AM
It depends on who hits the market.

If a quality corner like Grimes from Atlanta or Carr from KC hits the market we need to make a big push for them.

OL Nicks from New Orleans or RB Bush from Oakland are the potentially more expensive guys I wouldn't be surprised to see targeted either.

I expect us to add an affordable vet safety or two for sure, with Dawkins done we absolutely need some vet presence there.

The Moops
01-15-2012, 04:37 AM
Um someone actually voted for kicker?

BowlenBall
01-15-2012, 05:05 AM
And punter?

Trolls.

Spider
01-15-2012, 06:30 AM
MLB , Corner , DE , DT..........

orinjkrush
01-15-2012, 06:40 AM
the center of the defense: DT, MLB, S

the center of the Oline: C, G

money in the bank IF we can find/draft/sign them

go_broncos
01-15-2012, 06:41 AM
Defense -- MLB, DT,CB
Offense - WR that doesn't drop balls, C,G

Bigdawg26
01-15-2012, 06:45 AM
I think we are going to be deep at DT when we get Ty Warren and Big Vick back next season. I would still like to see the BPA at 25 hopefully a great corner, safety, or MLB will fall.

barryr
01-15-2012, 06:48 AM
The Broncos need to do these things IMO;

Get another quality RB, one with speed would be nice.

Get another WR, one with speed would be nice.

Get a TE that can be effective down the field in the passing game.

Move Franklin to LG and Harris at RT or someone else.

Better backup QB.

Get a real MLB.

Get 2 more DL, one at DT and DE.

Get at least another CB if not more.

Get another safety.

Establish on both sides of the ball, a little more creativity inb the play calling and less predictability.

Some of these things can be done with the current players, like if Julius Thomas can be that TE in the passing game or not.

But there are many problem areas that need addressing before this team can take the next step. Looking at the holes, it is amazing they made it to the playoffs and even won a playoff game.

peacepipe
01-15-2012, 07:02 AM
The Broncos need to do these things IMO;

Get another quality RB, one with speed would be nice.

Get another WR, one with speed would be nice.

Get a TE that can be effective down the field in the passing game.

Move Franklin to LG and Harris at RT or someone else.

Better backup QB.Get a real MLB.

Get 2 more DL, one at DT and DE.

Get at least another CB if not more.

Get another safety.

Establish on both sides of the ball, a little more creativity inb the play calling and less predictability.

Some of these things can be done with the current players, like if Julius Thomas can be that TE in the passing game or not.

But there are many problem areas that need addressing before this team can take the next step. Looking at the holes, it is amazing they made it to the playoffs and even won a playoff game.they need to bring in a QB that can compete for the starter.

Jekyll15Hyde
01-15-2012, 07:04 AM
Agreed -- the day Al Wilson injured his neck was the day we became a bottom-10 defense.



This

Jekyll15Hyde
01-15-2012, 07:06 AM
The Broncos need to do these things IMO;

Get another quality RB, one with speed would be nice.

Get another WR, one with speed would be nice.

Get a TE that can be effective down the field in the passing game.

Move Franklin to LG and Harris at RT or someone else.

Better backup QB.

Get a real MLB.

Get 2 more DL, one at DT and DE.

Get at least another CB if not more.

Get another safety.

Establish on both sides of the ball, a little more creativity inb the play calling and less predictability.

Some of these things can be done with the current players, like if Julius Thomas can be that TE in the passing game or not.

But there are many problem areas that need addressing before this team can take the next step. Looking at the holes, it is amazing they made it to the playoffs and even won a playoff game.

I agree with most of this but I think it is unrealistic to solidify that many positions in one off-season. That is a 2 year minimum type list. The cupboard is pretty pare in far too many positions.

cutthemdown
01-15-2012, 07:08 AM
We only have about 5 positions we couldn't use a better play at. Still very easy to build the team. MLB, DE, DT, CB, TE, OG, WR, OC, RB take your pick.

WolfpackGuy
01-15-2012, 07:09 AM
Probably would've been easier to ask what positions do they NOT need to address in the offseason...

Damn that idiot ex-coach.

Pretty much a miracle the current roster made it to the second round of the playoffs.

Tebow-Fan15
01-15-2012, 07:09 AM
How about Defensive Coordinator!! How do you expect to beat tom brady when you only rush 3 or 4 people every down?!

barryr
01-15-2012, 07:10 AM
I agree with most of this but I think it is unrealistic to solidify that many positions in one off-season. That is a 2 year minimum type list. The cupboard is pretty pare in far too many positions.

I agree, so that shows how much talent this roster lacks and yes I have harped on this, but this is what happens when previous regimes do such a poor job at drafting and developing players. You are left with so many holes that some should have been resolved by now. This is why I have stated they need at least 2 really good drafts and a great job in free agency, signing quality players and not the garbage that Shanahan used to sign especially on defense, to become serious contenders

barryr
01-15-2012, 07:11 AM
they need to bring in a QB that can compete for the starter.

Good luck finding one.

Jekyll15Hyde
01-15-2012, 07:12 AM
How about Defensive Coordinator!! How do you expect to beat tom brady when you only rush 3 or 4 people every down?!

Only if Allen gets a HC position somewhere. He isnt going anywhere

BroncoBuff
01-15-2012, 07:14 AM
Get another quality RB, one with speed would be nice.

Get another WR, one with speed would be nice.

Get a TE that can be effective down the field in the passing game.

Move Franklin to LG and Harris at RT or someone else.

Better backup QB.

Get a real MLB.

Get 2 more DL, one at DT and DE.

Get at least another CB if not more.

Get another Safety.

Good analysis ... every position except OLB and Center.

In order:

MLB
CB
WR
RB

Any luck we'll land a playmaking MLB at 25 ... remember Al Wilson was #31.

Backup QBs always suck ... since Kubiak anyway.

barryr
01-15-2012, 07:17 AM
Good analysis ... every position except OLB and Center.

In order:

MLB
CB
WR
RB

Any luck we'll land a playmaking MLB at 25 ... remember Al Wilson was #31.

Maybe Alabama's Hightower, but he likely will go 15-24. Hightower would be nice to get though since he can line up in other spots too and even used as a pass rusher at times, so some versatility. Whether the Broncos would be that creative with him is another story.

Jekyll15Hyde
01-15-2012, 07:18 AM
I agree, so that shows how much talent this roster lacks and yes I have harped on this, but this is what happens when previous regimes do such a poor job at drafting and developing players. You are left with so many holes that some should have been resolved by now. This is why I have stated they need at least 2 really good drafts and a great job in free agency, signing quality players and not the garbage that Shanahan used to sign especially on defense, to become serious contenders

No doubt. I think EFX's first year was above average but still we missed too much in the draft. It was good in the early rounds with Von, Franklin and even Carter in the 4th. But they didnt get enough depth in those late rounds. Granted, the jury is still out on some (Irving, Thomas).

BowlenBall
01-15-2012, 07:27 AM
Good analysis ... every position except OLB and Center.

In order:

MLB
CB
WR
RB

Any luck we'll land a playmaking MLB at 25 ... remember Al Wilson was #31.

Backup QBs always suck ... since Kubiak anyway.

The MLB / ILB position is usually devalued in the draft a bit -- here's the highest drafted one in each of the last few years:

2011: Akeem Ayers, pick # 39
2010: Rolando McClain, pick #08
2009: James Laurninitis, pick #35
2008: Curtis Lofton, pick #34
2007: Patrick Willis, pick #11
2006: DeMeco Ryans, pick #33
2005: Lofa Tatupu, pick #45
2004: Jonathon Vilma, pick #12

Jekyll15Hyde
01-15-2012, 07:33 AM
The MLB / ILB position is usually devalued in the draft a bit -- here's the highest drafted one in each of the last few years:

2011: Akeem Ayers, pick # 39
2010: Rolando McClain, pick #08
2009: James Laurninitis, pick #35
2008: Curtis Lofton, pick #34
2007: Patrick Willis, pick #11
2006: DeMeco Ryans, pick #33
2005: Lofa Tatupu, pick #45
2004: Jonathon Vilma, pick #12

I am worried as i see some mocks having us take Burfict at 25. He could be called a playmaker but he also seems reckless and prone to over-pursuit. Thats not what we need. He has a good highlight reel though...

BroncoBuff
01-15-2012, 07:35 AM
Maybe Alabama's Hightower, but he likely will go 15-24. Hightower would be nice to get though since he can line up in other spots too and even used as a pass rusher at times, so some versatility. Whether the Broncos would be that creative with him is another story.

Wow, I heartily endorse your nomination for #1.

He was Captain sophomore and junior years ... of THAT defense. Called the plays and the checks. That leadership would be great. He sounds kinda Patrick Willis-ish.



http://img857.imageshack.us/img857/3791/donta.jpg

Rascal
01-15-2012, 07:41 AM
No to burfict.

Jekyll15Hyde
01-15-2012, 07:46 AM
Wow, I heartily endorse your nomination for #1.

He was Captain sophomore and junior years ... of THAT defense. Called the plays and the checks. That leadership would be great. He sounds kinda Patrick Willis-ish.



http://img857.imageshack.us/img857/3791/donta.jpg

THIS!
May have to move up 2-3 spots to make it happen but could be exactly what this D needs. Assuming he goes somewhere around 21, we might have to use our 4th (and maybe another late rd) to move up.

Edit: now I see we have no 4th but have the 2nd pick in the 5th. So it might be both 5ths.

theAPAOps5
01-15-2012, 07:48 AM
That is one weird name DontA

Spider
01-15-2012, 07:48 AM
THIS!
May have to move up 2-3 spots to make it happen but could be exactly what this D needs. Assuming he goes somewhere around 21, we might have to use our 4th (and maybe another late rd) to move up.

we can hope ;)

Spider
01-15-2012, 07:49 AM
That is one weird name DontA

Dont a pass on his side of the field ...... His mom already new he was bad ass ;D

Cito Pelon
01-15-2012, 07:49 AM
MLB is the big deal to me, followed by CB, S, WR, and RB.

Jekyll15Hyde
01-15-2012, 07:55 AM
we can hope ;)

Yes... I was surprised to see that he isnt being mocked higher. Let hope this is a reality.

Spider
01-15-2012, 07:59 AM
Yes... I was surprised to see that he is being mocked higher. Let hope this is a reality.

Kid had great size , I didnt see his speed , but with all those accolades I am sure he is fast enough ;) I dont watch college , so the draft is a real blind shoot for me ....

DarkHorse
01-15-2012, 08:00 AM
Middle of the defense - DT, MLB, and 2 starting quality safeties via Free Agency please. That will allow Irving, Moore and Carter to continue to get better.

elsid13
01-15-2012, 08:09 AM
Yes... I was surprised to see that he isnt being mocked higher. Let hope this is a reality.

Because he doesn't have the speed to for good pass coverage. He is second day kinda guy. There is one 1st rounder MLB in this draft - Luke Kuechly (BC) and everyone else has challenges to their game. When Teo went back to Norte Dame the ILB spot took a hit.

ColoradoDarin
01-15-2012, 08:10 AM
Seriously love it if we drafted Dont'a!

Killericon
01-15-2012, 08:30 AM
Depends on if we re-sign The Bunk.

Dedhed
01-15-2012, 08:31 AM
MLB. Until we actally have one, the D will continue to get owned.

I believe this as well. We've been completely suspect on defense since the day Al Wilson left.

Watching DJ and Mays continually blow assignments or just flat out get abused yesterday was a brutal reminder that nothing has changed.

joe9999
01-15-2012, 08:33 AM
It depends on who hits the market.

If a quality corner like Grimes from Atlanta or Carr from KC hits the market we need to make a big push for them.

OL Nicks from New Orleans or RB Bush from Oakland are the potentially more expensive guys I wouldn't be surprised to see targeted either.

I expect us to add an affordable vet safety or two for sure, with Dawkins done we absolutely need some vet presence there.

This makes a lot of sense. Running back is high on the list of needs and will likely be addressed through free agency and with a later round pick.

Obviously after the Patriots game, help is needed in the defensive backfield.

BPA for the first round pick.

We need a passing game that targets the TE more. Not sure if this is a coaching problem or lack of talent at the position.

Jekyll15Hyde
01-15-2012, 08:33 AM
Because he doesn't have the speed to for good pass coverage. He is second day kinda guy. There is one 1st rounder MLB in this draft - Luke Kuechly (BC) and everyone else has challenges to their game. When Teo went back to Norte Dame the ILB spot took a hit.

He is a 1st rd pick in nearly every mock I have seen

theAPAOps5
01-15-2012, 08:35 AM
Dont a pass on his side of the field ...... His mom already new he was bad ass ;D

Kind of like Champ. I believe i once heard a story when champ was still playing in college that his mom named him champ because she knew he was going to be special. Have to see if there is a link.

Spider
01-15-2012, 08:37 AM
Kind of like Champ. I believe i once heard a story when champ was still playing in college that his mom named him champ because she knew he was going to be special. Have to see if there is a link.

:D I remember hearing something about that

theAPAOps5
01-15-2012, 08:43 AM
It was a nickname, but it was a cool story. Can't find it though. Much better than his real first name. Roland Bailey..... Just have that same je nais se qua

elsid13
01-15-2012, 08:51 AM
He is a 1st rd pick in nearly every mock I have seen

Mocks are just that Mocks, They are for entertainment purposes only and should never be used to determine talent or draft position in NFL.

Ratboy
01-15-2012, 09:33 AM
QB - Draft

I do not think Tebow is the long term solution at QB. He will most likely be starting in 2012 for the Broncos and will be evaluated based off the season. I would like to see Denver draft a QB in round 2-3.

RB - Free Agency
If we're a running team, we need a running back that can show it. Rice, Forte, and Foster are all Free Agents. The second tier include Tolbert, Hillis, Bush.

Tight End - Free Agency

We really need a few more weapons for our QB. Greg Olson will be available and could be a solid pick up.

DT - Draft and Free Agency

I think this is obvious, we're still pretty weak in the middle. Bunkley and Thomas both played well, but we still need that dominate player. I would look into the draft and free agency to improve this position.

MLB - Free Agency

Mays is bad. I wish we would have seen more of Irving, but I think it's clear that the coaches do not think much of him. I would love to see a FA pick up.

CB - Draft and Free Agency

Champ is still playing at a high level and Nick Harris has been pretty solid for being undrafted. This should be a major concern for us! I would like to user our first round pick on a CB, but we need remember to take the BPA.

TheReverend
01-15-2012, 10:38 AM
Started clicking corner and guard and then MLB and then before I knew it I had clicked damn near every position...

Bronx33
01-15-2012, 10:44 AM
HA! looking tat the results it appears we need help at almost every position but i would really focus on the DBs we need some type of pass defense its almost non existant right now.

Denver724
01-15-2012, 10:50 AM
MLB is the big deal to me, followed by CB, S, WR, and RB.

What about Nate Irving? I thought Bill Parcells had him rated as the #1 MLB in the 2011 draft. Shouldn't he be in-line to replace Mays, who I am sure wont be re-signed as a starter?

gyldenlove
01-15-2012, 11:01 AM
The MLB / ILB position is usually devalued in the draft a bit -- here's the highest drafted one in each of the last few years:

2011: Akeem Ayers, pick # 39
2010: Rolando McClain, pick #08
2009: James Laurninitis, pick #35
2008: Curtis Lofton, pick #34
2007: Patrick Willis, pick #11
2006: DeMeco Ryans, pick #33
2005: Lofa Tatupu, pick #45
2004: Jonathon Vilma, pick #12

MLBs tend to be less athletic or smaller than OLBs since they will often provide less pass rush and therefore not as valuable - the notable exceptions are Vilma, Willis and Mcclain all of whom came out at around 245 lbs and run faster than 4.50 which is the same kind of size-speed as Von Miller.

gyldenlove
01-15-2012, 11:03 AM
I want a starting safety in free agency - I am not sure Dawkins is coming back and even if he is we have no depth behind him and Carter right now - Bruton, Moore and Bush were all atrocious.

I would really like an RCB in free agency as well, maybe Porter or Carr who can take over directly from Goodman which will give us time to develop a rookie CB behind Champ.

I want MLB and RB in the draft, I would prefer MLB, CB and DT in the first 3 rounds of the draft and a RB in 4 or 5.

NFLBRONCO
01-15-2012, 11:08 AM
CB DT RB/WR I know we could use soo much more.

FA: MLB S WR/RB OL

QB FA or Draft not sure what Elway will do

Drek
01-15-2012, 11:21 AM
What I HOPE we do this off-season.

Free Agency
Linebackers:
Dan Connor - MLB from Carolina. Young (26) consistent run defender, athletic enough to be a three down player. The Carolina connection with Fox could help us here, he wants to start and we can offer that. I like him better than the alternatives because is shorter track record likely means he will be cheaper. Alternatives if we can't land him (in order of preference): Curtis Lofton, David Hawthorne, D'Qwell Jackson. No excuse for not adding one of these guys this off-season and taking MLB off the "problems" list.

Defensive Line:
Jason Jones - DT/DE for Tennessee. Jones is unhappy with Tennessee's new staff and their use of him as a DE. While weighing in at 6'5", 276 he has great natural pass rush from the interior. That is a much needed skill here on this club. Tennessee uses him about 2:1 DE/DT, I think if we flip that and maybe go a touch heavier at DT we would have a valuable DL weapon who won't cost us a fortune. On all but obvious running downs he should be inside, on obvious running downs we get Doom off the field and bump Jones out to DE opposite Ayers.

Pat Sims - DT for the Bengals. Big (330 pounds), young (26) run stuffer who would take blockers off our linebackers and free up our pass rushers to win one on one battles. Adding him gives us the gap crushing interior player we need to let Doom, Miller, Ayers, and the recently acquired Jones do their jobs. I'd prefer Red Bryant but his recent comments suggest he has no intention of leaving Seattle. We should be kicking the tires though just in case they low ball him.

Corner:
Brent Grimes/Brandon Carr/Tracy Porter - I don't care which one of these three we add, just get one of them. Any would lock up the #2 spot opposite Champ for the next 3-4 years, letting Harris develop a comfort level as our nickel guy and adding some nice extra competition when Thompson and Vaughn return from injuries.

Safety:
Open by making hard runs at Laron Landry and Dashon Goldson. I doubt either one moves on but it would be a major coup if we could.

When/if that fails we go after Tom Zbikowski - SS, Baltimore. Zbikowksi is a very athletic safety with good ball skills while still being a powerful tackler and strong on run support. He would add a young veteran to our safety corps but would not command big money and would still allow for Rahim Moore to break out and earn himself a starting job should he bounce back well from his rookie year trials.

We have good flexibility at safety even though I believe Dawk has played his last game. Carter is a balanced player who looks like a quality starter at either FS or SS, so we can pair whatever we can get along side him.

Quarterback:
David Garrard - QB, formerly of Jacksonville. Garrard is a big, mobile QB despite turning 33 last season and missing the entire year after his release due to a back injury and the complications from surgery. Almost zero chance he sees an offer to start anywhere. In Denver we can offer a backup role in an offense that matches his skill set well. Alternatively we could pursue Josh Johnson, a very young and untested athletic QB who likely lacks the frame (at 6'3", 205) to be anything more than a stop gap replacement for Tebow but would still allow us to run the same offense, but I'd definitely prefer the veteran Garrard, assuming he understands his role.

Draft
General philosophy for this team needs to remain BPA, trading back as needed to make sure that matches positions of need. Do not trade up. We do not have the draft pick fire power and can't give up anything from 2012 for short term gains. To that end:

Round 1 - My targets would be Trent Richardson and Devon Stills. If Dre Kirkpatrick somehow went tumbling down to us there then that would be fantastic, but its a pipe dream. The only real threat to taken Richardson before us, in my opinion, would be Cincy. But they have two picks in the first so unless they resolve RB in FA we likely will just miss out on Richardson. I have a good bit of faith that Stills makes it to us if Richardson doesn't and provides the youth we need to start building good DT play long term. If for whatever reason we can't get either then Chase Minnifield or Stephon Gilmore both would make sense.

Round 2 - If we fail to land Richardson in round 1 we go for David Wilson or Lamar Miller in round 2. If we did get Richardson in the first then here we look for the best CB/DL/OL available. I think its possible we could get Jared Crick or Josh Chapman here for the DL. Corner availability will be a crap shoot depending on 40 times so as of now thats a play it by ear thing. On the OL I think its very possible we pull a good OG out of this pick or our third.

Round 3 - Best slider we see at DB/DL/OL period.

Back half of the draft: grab a slot WR type who can work on KR/PR as well, Kendall Wright, Jarius Wright, or Joe Adams are early names to look for. Get another weapon at TE, Michael Egnew would be an ideal candidate though he might be more of a 3rd rounder. Grab Kellen Moore late as low cost insurance against Tim Tebow failing to mature further, but he might just end up a UDFA so I wouldn't jump too hard.

I'd like to see the team come out of the draft with additions at RB, DT, CB, WR, TE, and OG or QB.

Then for UDFAs target additional RB, CB, and WR depth as our top priorities.

From a team philosophy standpoint I'd like to see the offense move to a two WR, two TE single back set for the base. Thomas and Decker on the wings, Julius Thomas and Virgil Green at TE. We could then move Green into an H-back role or have Thomas in the slot to give different looks. This would give us a good base to run out of while giving Tebow a lot of tall, athletic targets. If he can find chemistry with that group throwing the ball this offense would be very dangerous.

Defensively we're headed in the right direction schematically in my opinion, we just lack the talent to make it work consistently. We can't wait on in house options and need to resolve our needs through the draft, but we also need to add young depth at CB and DT to make sure we aren't back in the same situation in a couple years.

ColoradoDarin
01-15-2012, 11:37 AM
^ what Drek said. Someone email Elway and Xanders with that post.

Turd_Ferguson
01-15-2012, 11:52 AM
QB: option stuff needs to go. If Tebow can't run a more traditional offense need to bring in someone that can. Tebow will start the season, unless they make a move for Flynn. Otherwise take one in the draft and let Tebow sink or swim.

RB: Willis had a good year but he is old and often injured this year. Johnson and Ball aren't NFL starters IMO. Need a number 1 for willis to back up.

WR: Need a solid number 2 behind DT if he continues to improve and becomes the number 1 i think he can be. would allow Decker to slide to the slot. resign Royal if possible. Keep Matt Willis for depth/special teams.

TE: Not the biggest need but, would be a nice luxury.. See Gronk and Hernandez for the pats.

MLB: HUGE NEED. Hope they use first pick for this. DTs are better than people think. Poor play from MLB makes them look bad.

Safety: Dawks is old. Younger players showed some potential still need to find a John Lynch/Brian Dawkins/Ed Reid type safety. I know they don't grow on trees but a great safety makes the whole D better. More important than CB I think.

KO5K
01-15-2012, 11:53 AM
RB, FB, WR, C, DT, MLB, CB, S.

So basically every position.

ZONA
01-15-2012, 12:19 PM
Wow - it's right there in the results. Almost everybody agrees, our 2 best players are the kicker and punter. We've got work to do people.

yerner
01-15-2012, 12:21 PM
Trent Richardson will not even be close to available at our pick. That's just ridiculous.

oubronco
01-15-2012, 12:32 PM
What I HOPE we do this off-season.

Free Agency
Linebackers:
Dan Connor - MLB from Carolina. Young (26) consistent run defender, athletic enough to be a three down player. The Carolina connection with Fox could help us here, he wants to start and we can offer that. I like him better than the alternatives because is shorter track record likely means he will be cheaper. Alternatives if we can't land him (in order of preference): Curtis Lofton, David Hawthorne, D'Qwell Jackson. No excuse for not adding one of these guys this off-season and taking MLB off the "problems" list.

Defensive Line:
Jason Jones - DT/DE for Tennessee. Jones is unhappy with Tennessee's new staff and their use of him as a DE. While weighing in at 6'5", 276 he has great natural pass rush from the interior. That is a much needed skill here on this club. Tennessee uses him about 2:1 DE/DT, I think if we flip that and maybe go a touch heavier at DT we would have a valuable DL weapon who won't cost us a fortune. On all but obvious running downs he should be inside, on obvious running downs we get Doom off the field and bump Jones out to DE opposite Ayers.

Pat Sims - DT for the Bengals. Big (330 pounds), young (26) run stuffer who would take blockers off our linebackers and free up our pass rushers to win one on one battles. Adding him gives us the gap crushing interior player we need to let Doom, Miller, Ayers, and the recently acquired Jones do their jobs. I'd prefer Red Bryant but his recent comments suggest he has no intention of leaving Seattle. We should be kicking the tires though just in case they low ball him.

Corner:
Brent Grimes/Brandon Carr/Tracy Porter - I don't care which one of these three we add, just get one of them. Any would lock up the #2 spot opposite Champ for the next 3-4 years, letting Harris develop a comfort level as our nickel guy and adding some nice extra competition when Thompson and Vaughn return from injuries.

Safety:
Open by making hard runs at Laron Landry and Dashon Goldson. I doubt either one moves on but it would be a major coup if we could.

When/if that fails we go after Tom Zbikowski - SS, Baltimore. Zbikowksi is a very athletic safety with good ball skills while still being a powerful tackler and strong on run support. He would add a young veteran to our safety corps but would not command big money and would still allow for Rahim Moore to break out and earn himself a starting job should he bounce back well from his rookie year trials.

We have good flexibility at safety even though I believe Dawk has played his last game. Carter is a balanced player who looks like a quality starter at either FS or SS, so we can pair whatever we can get along side him.

Quarterback:
David Garrard - QB, formerly of Jacksonville. Garrard is a big, mobile QB despite turning 33 last season and missing the entire year after his release due to a back injury and the complications from surgery. Almost zero chance he sees an offer to start anywhere. In Denver we can offer a backup role in an offense that matches his skill set well. Alternatively we could pursue Josh Johnson, a very young and untested athletic QB who likely lacks the frame (at 6'3", 205) to be anything more than a stop gap replacement for Tebow but would still allow us to run the same offense, but I'd definitely prefer the veteran Garrard, assuming he understands his role.

Draft
General philosophy for this team needs to remain BPA, trading back as needed to make sure that matches positions of need. Do not trade up. We do not have the draft pick fire power and can't give up anything from 2012 for short term gains. To that end:

Round 1 - My targets would be Trent Richardson and Devon Stills. If Dre Kirkpatrick somehow went tumbling down to us there then that would be fantastic, but its a pipe dream. The only real threat to taken Richardson before us, in my opinion, would be Cincy. But they have two picks in the first so unless they resolve RB in FA we likely will just miss out on Richardson. I have a good bit of faith that Stills makes it to us if Richardson doesn't and provides the youth we need to start building good DT play long term. If for whatever reason we can't get either then Chase Minnifield or Stephon Gilmore both would make sense.

Round 2 - If we fail to land Richardson in round 1 we go for David Wilson or Lamar Miller in round 2. If we did get Richardson in the first then here we look for the best CB/DL/OL available. I think its possible we could get Jared Crick or Josh Chapman here for the DL. Corner availability will be a crap shoot depending on 40 times so as of now thats a play it by ear thing. On the OL I think its very possible we pull a good OG out of this pick or our third.

Round 3 - Best slider we see at DB/DL/OL period.

Back half of the draft: grab a slot WR type who can work on KR/PR as well, Kendall Wright, Jarius Wright, or Joe Adams are early names to look for. Get another weapon at TE, Michael Egnew would be an ideal candidate though he might be more of a 3rd rounder. Grab Kellen Moore late as low cost insurance against Tim Tebow failing to mature further, but he might just end up a UDFA so I wouldn't jump too hard.

I'd like to see the team come out of the draft with additions at RB, DT, CB, WR, TE, and OG or QB.

Then for UDFAs target additional RB, CB, and WR depth as our top priorities.

From a team philosophy standpoint I'd like to see the offense move to a two WR, two TE single back set for the base. Thomas and Decker on the wings, Julius Thomas and Virgil Green at TE. We could then move Green into an H-back role or have Thomas in the slot to give different looks. This would give us a good base to run out of while giving Tebow a lot of tall, athletic targets. If he can find chemistry with that group throwing the ball this offense would be very dangerous.

Defensively we're headed in the right direction schematically in my opinion, we just lack the talent to make it work consistently. We can't wait on in house options and need to resolve our needs through the draft, but we also need to add young depth at CB and DT to make sure we aren't back in the same situation in a couple years.

Can you run the offseason please

oubronco
01-15-2012, 12:34 PM
Trent Richardson will not even be close to available at our pick. That's just ridiculous.

But it would be so awesome if he was

barryr
01-15-2012, 12:41 PM
What I HOPE we do this off-season.

Free Agency
Linebackers:
Dan Connor - MLB from Carolina. Young (26) consistent run defender, athletic enough to be a three down player. The Carolina connection with Fox could help us here, he wants to start and we can offer that. I like him better than the alternatives because is shorter track record likely means he will be cheaper. Alternatives if we can't land him (in order of preference): Curtis Lofton, David Hawthorne, D'Qwell Jackson. No excuse for not adding one of these guys this off-season and taking MLB off the "problems" list.

Defensive Line:
Jason Jones - DT/DE for Tennessee. Jones is unhappy with Tennessee's new staff and their use of him as a DE. While weighing in at 6'5", 276 he has great natural pass rush from the interior. That is a much needed skill here on this club. Tennessee uses him about 2:1 DE/DT, I think if we flip that and maybe go a touch heavier at DT we would have a valuable DL weapon who won't cost us a fortune. On all but obvious running downs he should be inside, on obvious running downs we get Doom off the field and bump Jones out to DE opposite Ayers.

Pat Sims - DT for the Bengals. Big (330 pounds), young (26) run stuffer who would take blockers off our linebackers and free up our pass rushers to win one on one battles. Adding him gives us the gap crushing interior player we need to let Doom, Miller, Ayers, and the recently acquired Jones do their jobs. I'd prefer Red Bryant but his recent comments suggest he has no intention of leaving Seattle. We should be kicking the tires though just in case they low ball him.

Corner:
Brent Grimes/Brandon Carr/Tracy Porter - I don't care which one of these three we add, just get one of them. Any would lock up the #2 spot opposite Champ for the next 3-4 years, letting Harris develop a comfort level as our nickel guy and adding some nice extra competition when Thompson and Vaughn return from injuries.

Safety:
Open by making hard runs at Laron Landry and Dashon Goldson. I doubt either one moves on but it would be a major coup if we could.

When/if that fails we go after Tom Zbikowski - SS, Baltimore. Zbikowksi is a very athletic safety with good ball skills while still being a powerful tackler and strong on run support. He would add a young veteran to our safety corps but would not command big money and would still allow for Rahim Moore to break out and earn himself a starting job should he bounce back well from his rookie year trials.

We have good flexibility at safety even though I believe Dawk has played his last game. Carter is a balanced player who looks like a quality starter at either FS or SS, so we can pair whatever we can get along side him.

Quarterback:
David Garrard - QB, formerly of Jacksonville. Garrard is a big, mobile QB despite turning 33 last season and missing the entire year after his release due to a back injury and the complications from surgery. Almost zero chance he sees an offer to start anywhere. In Denver we can offer a backup role in an offense that matches his skill set well. Alternatively we could pursue Josh Johnson, a very young and untested athletic QB who likely lacks the frame (at 6'3", 205) to be anything more than a stop gap replacement for Tebow but would still allow us to run the same offense, but I'd definitely prefer the veteran Garrard, assuming he understands his role.

Draft
General philosophy for this team needs to remain BPA, trading back as needed to make sure that matches positions of need. Do not trade up. We do not have the draft pick fire power and can't give up anything from 2012 for short term gains. To that end:

Round 1 - My targets would be Trent Richardson and Devon Stills. If Dre Kirkpatrick somehow went tumbling down to us there then that would be fantastic, but its a pipe dream. The only real threat to taken Richardson before us, in my opinion, would be Cincy. But they have two picks in the first so unless they resolve RB in FA we likely will just miss out on Richardson. I have a good bit of faith that Stills makes it to us if Richardson doesn't and provides the youth we need to start building good DT play long term. If for whatever reason we can't get either then Chase Minnifield or Stephon Gilmore both would make sense.

Round 2 - If we fail to land Richardson in round 1 we go for David Wilson or Lamar Miller in round 2. If we did get Richardson in the first then here we look for the best CB/DL/OL available. I think its possible we could get Jared Crick or Josh Chapman here for the DL. Corner availability will be a crap shoot depending on 40 times so as of now thats a play it by ear thing. On the OL I think its very possible we pull a good OG out of this pick or our third.

Round 3 - Best slider we see at DB/DL/OL period.

Back half of the draft: grab a slot WR type who can work on KR/PR as well, Kendall Wright, Jarius Wright, or Joe Adams are early names to look for. Get another weapon at TE, Michael Egnew would be an ideal candidate though he might be more of a 3rd rounder. Grab Kellen Moore late as low cost insurance against Tim Tebow failing to mature further, but he might just end up a UDFA so I wouldn't jump too hard.

I'd like to see the team come out of the draft with additions at RB, DT, CB, WR, TE, and OG or QB.

Then for UDFAs target additional RB, CB, and WR depth as our top priorities.

From a team philosophy standpoint I'd like to see the offense move to a two WR, two TE single back set for the base. Thomas and Decker on the wings, Julius Thomas and Virgil Green at TE. We could then move Green into an H-back role or have Thomas in the slot to give different looks. This would give us a good base to run out of while giving Tebow a lot of tall, athletic targets. If he can find chemistry with that group throwing the ball this offense would be very dangerous.

Defensively we're headed in the right direction schematically in my opinion, we just lack the talent to make it work consistently. We can't wait on in house options and need to resolve our needs through the draft, but we also need to add young depth at CB and DT to make sure we aren't back in the same situation in a couple years.

Yep, I think MLB will need to be addressed in free agency since this draft is not deep there and some are seen as mid to lower picks, so how good they can be is a question. I do hope Irving gets a chance though since he was a 3rd rounder, so maybe he is the guy already on the team.

Connor would add depth at least or Irving pushing Williams at the other LB spot.

Polk might be available with the Bronco 2nd round pick, but I would be shocked if Miller and Wilson lasted that long.

After seeing how the best defenses do it, I'm for spending the most money on the DL and high picks there too.

CB is a troubled spot, but free agency could help fix that, but harder to find good pass rushers in free agency, let alone outspend teams for them. Usually takes the draft to find them, so I would be happy to see a DT, DE, and RB drafted high in the draft for the Broncos and use free agency to help solve other problem areas. Even signing better backups on the DL is needed since only Bunkley and Vickerson are worth keeping at DT and more help is needed at DE too.

It is clear if the Broncos ever want to be a serious contender, they need guys on defense who can make plays, not players who take up space but rarely do much other than that.

Drek
01-15-2012, 01:54 PM
Trent Richardson will not even be close to available at our pick. That's just ridiculous.

I think its very possible he will be. Look at the first round.

Indianapolis (2-14) - Luck, no question.
St. Louis (2-14) - Have Jackson.
Minnesota (3-13) - Have AP.
Cleveland (4-12) - Have Hardesty, showed interest in keeping Hillis early in the season, 4 seems pretty early for a running back.
Tampa Bay (4-12) - Have Blount
Washington (5-11) - Shanahan won't take an RB this early.
Jacksonville (5-11) - MJD.
Miami (6-10) - Bush + Thomas (2nd round pick last year, good when healthy this year).
Carolina (6-10) - Deangelo on a big deal + Stewart has one more year left.
Buffalo (6-10) - Fred Jackson + CJ Spiller.
Kansas City (7-9) - Charles + McCluster + Battle.
Seattle (7-9) - Marshaun Lynch, though he is a FA.
Arizona (8-8) - Beanie Wells, finally had his breakout year.
Dallas (8-8) - Felix Jones and Murray.
Philadelphia (8-8) - Shady McCoy.
New York Jets (8-8) - Shonne Greene, will probably resign Tomlinson.
Cincinnati - from Oakland (8-8) - Cedric Benson, but he's an FA.
San Diego (8-8) - Ryan Matthews.
Chicago (8-8) - Forte, though he's a FA.
Tennessee (9-7) - CJ2K.
Cincinnati* (9-7) - See above.
Cleveland - from Atlanta* (10-6) - Again, do they resign Hillis or not?
Detroit* (10-6) - Took LeShore last year. Jahvid Best.
Pittsburgh* (12-4) - Mendenhall and co., not their biggest need.
Denver* (8-8)

Its entirely possible he gets within our reach. Though yes, beating Pittsburgh gives Cincy and Cleveland each a second bite at the apple before us.

Generally though, if some team grabs him it signals a pretty solid RB being allowed to walk. Big question is what Richardson does at the combine. If its Mark Ingram + 10 pounds he could very possibly fall into our laps at #25, just like it took the Saints trading back up to stop Ingram's fall at #28 last year.

RB and MLB are the two positions that most easily go into free fall when other positions are well stocked. If enough underclassmen jump this year (a lot already are) we could see that happen. CB looks particularly well off for first round talent and there are two real franchise type QB prospects at the top of the draft. A lot of big, physically gifted WRs coming out this year too.

Denver724
01-15-2012, 02:16 PM
I think its very possible he will be. Look at the first round.

Indianapolis (2-14) - Luck, no question.
St. Louis (2-14) - Have Jackson.
Minnesota (3-13) - Have AP.
Cleveland (4-12) - Have Hardesty, showed interest in keeping Hillis early in the season, 4 seems pretty early for a running back.
Tampa Bay (4-12) - Have Blount
Washington (5-11) - Shanahan won't take an RB this early.
Jacksonville (5-11) - MJD.
Miami (6-10) - Bush + Thomas (2nd round pick last year, good when healthy this year).
Carolina (6-10) - Deangelo on a big deal + Stewart has one more year left.
Buffalo (6-10) - Fred Jackson + CJ Spiller.
Kansas City (7-9) - Charles + McCluster + Battle.
Seattle (7-9) - Marshaun Lynch, though he is a FA.
Arizona (8-8) - Beanie Wells, finally had his breakout year.
Dallas (8-8) - Felix Jones and Murray.
Philadelphia (8-8) - Shady McCoy.
New York Jets (8-8) - Shonne Greene, will probably resign Tomlinson.
Cincinnati - from Oakland (8-8) - Cedric Benson, but he's an FA.
San Diego (8-8) - Ryan Matthews.
Chicago (8-8) - Forte, though he's a FA.
Tennessee (9-7) - CJ2K.
Cincinnati* (9-7) - See above.
Cleveland - from Atlanta* (10-6) - Again, do they resign Hillis or not?
Detroit* (10-6) - Took LeShore last year. Jahvid Best.
Pittsburgh* (12-4) - Mendenhall and co., not their biggest need.
Denver* (8-8)

Its entirely possible he gets within our reach. Though yes, beating Pittsburgh gives Cincy and Cleveland each a second bite at the apple before us.

Generally though, if some team grabs him it signals a pretty solid RB being allowed to walk. Big question is what Richardson does at the combine. If its Mark Ingram + 10 pounds he could very possibly fall into our laps at #25, just like it took the Saints trading back up to stop Ingram's fall at #28 last year.

RB and MLB are the two positions that most easily go into free fall when other positions are well stocked. If enough underclassmen jump this year (a lot already are) we could see that happen. CB looks particularly well off for first round talent and there are two real franchise type QB prospects at the top of the draft. A lot of big, physically gifted WRs coming out this year too.

I can see these teams taking him. There is no way he falls to us. No way. Especially with Cleveland and Cincinnati having two picks before us.

Cleveland
Washington
Seattle
New York Jets
Cincinnati
Chicago
Cincinnati
Cleveland

Drek
01-15-2012, 02:35 PM
I can see these teams taking him. There is no way he falls to us. No way. Especially with Cleveland and Cincinnati having two picks before us.

Cleveland
Washington
Seattle
New York Jets
Cincinnati
Chicago
Cincinnati
Cleveland

Cleveland won't take him with their first pick, way too high for an RB in today's era. If that was their value on the RB position they would never have had the contract issues they had with Hillis.

Shanahan has never taken an RB that high and was getting good production on the ground all year with his cast of late rounders and retreads. I doubt he spends a top 10 pick on an RB all of a sudden when they've got far bigger needs.

The Jets have Shonne Greene, a very similar back to Richardson. Why would they go for him when they could get someone like Wilson or Miller in the 2nd who would be a better compliment?

Chicago won't take him unless they lose Forte, which likely takes another realistic destination for him off this list. Even then, Richardson isn't known for his hands, he's not going to fill Forte's shoes in that offense. I'd imagine they're a more likely landing spot for Hillis.

I'm not saying Richardson WILL be available at #25, just that if you'd asked people this time last year if you could get Mark Ingram in the 20's they'd have given you the same answer you're all giving right now. If things go the right way Richardson could be there. He could also go to Indy, throw up 35 bench reps of 225, run a 4.4 flat 40 and find himself going in the top 10. But I think the odds are more likely that he runs a 4.55 to 4.60 range 40 and is dismissed by some teams as another power back type, and should there be any RB movement in FA (plenty of good ones hitting the market) you could see a lot of teams feeling like they've got the position answered well enough to use the 1st on something else.

Denver724
01-15-2012, 02:52 PM
Cleveland won't take him with their first pick, way too high for an RB in today's era. If that was their value on the RB position they would never have had the contract issues they had with Hillis.

Shanahan has never taken an RB that high and was getting good production on the ground all year with his cast of late rounders and retreads. I doubt he spends a top 10 pick on an RB all of a sudden when they've got far bigger needs.

The Jets have Shonne Greene, a very similar back to Richardson. Why would they go for him when they could get someone like Wilson or Miller in the 2nd who would be a better compliment?

Chicago won't take him unless they lose Forte, which likely takes another realistic destination for him off this list. Even then, Richardson isn't known for his hands, he's not going to fill Forte's shoes in that offense. I'd imagine they're a more likely landing spot for Hillis.

I'm not saying Richardson WILL be available at #25, just that if you'd asked people this time last year if you could get Mark Ingram in the 20's they'd have given you the same answer you're all giving right now. If things go the right way Richardson could be there. He could also go to Indy, throw up 35 bench reps of 225, run a 4.4 flat 40 and find himself going in the top 10. But I think the odds are more likely that he runs a 4.55 to 4.60 range 40 and is dismissed by some teams as another power back type, and should there be any RB movement in FA (plenty of good ones hitting the market) you could see a lot of teams feeling like they've got the position answered well enough to use the 1st on something else.

Anything can happen. I just think that there is a good chance he goes well before our pick. All the "Draft Experts" say he is a much better RB than Ingram.

snowspot66
01-15-2012, 02:53 PM
they need to bring in a QB that can compete for the starter.

Seeing as how there isn't one out there it would be a waste of resources. It's Tebow or nothing next year and we move on after he proves he can do it or proves he can't.

yerner
01-15-2012, 02:57 PM
I think its very possible he will be. Look at the first round.

Indianapolis (2-14) - Luck, no question.
St. Louis (2-14) - Have Jackson.
Minnesota (3-13) - Have AP.
Cleveland (4-12) - Have Hardesty, showed interest in keeping Hillis early in the season, 4 seems pretty early for a running back.
Tampa Bay (4-12) - Have Blount
Washington (5-11) - Shanahan won't take an RB this early.
Jacksonville (5-11) - MJD.
Miami (6-10) - Bush + Thomas (2nd round pick last year, good when healthy this year).
Carolina (6-10) - Deangelo on a big deal + Stewart has one more year left.
Buffalo (6-10) - Fred Jackson + CJ Spiller.
Kansas City (7-9) - Charles + McCluster + Battle.
Seattle (7-9) - Marshaun Lynch, though he is a FA.
Arizona (8-8) - Beanie Wells, finally had his breakout year.
Dallas (8-8) - Felix Jones and Murray.
Philadelphia (8-8) - Shady McCoy.
New York Jets (8-8) - Shonne Greene, will probably resign Tomlinson.
Cincinnati - from Oakland (8-8) - Cedric Benson, but he's an FA.
San Diego (8-8) - Ryan Matthews.
Chicago (8-8) - Forte, though he's a FA.
Tennessee (9-7) - CJ2K.
Cincinnati* (9-7) - See above.
Cleveland - from Atlanta* (10-6) - Again, do they resign Hillis or not?
Detroit* (10-6) - Took LeShore last year. Jahvid Best.
Pittsburgh* (12-4) - Mendenhall and co., not their biggest need.
Denver* (8-8)

Its entirely possible he gets within our reach. Though yes, beating Pittsburgh gives Cincy and Cleveland each a second bite at the apple before us.

Generally though, if some team grabs him it signals a pretty solid RB being allowed to walk. Big question is what Richardson does at the combine. If its Mark Ingram + 10 pounds he could very possibly fall into our laps at #25, just like it took the Saints trading back up to stop Ingram's fall at #28 last year.

RB and MLB are the two positions that most easily go into free fall when other positions are well stocked. If enough underclassmen jump this year (a lot already are) we could see that happen. CB looks particularly well off for first round talent and there are two real franchise type QB prospects at the top of the draft. A lot of big, physically gifted WRs coming out this year too.

Bro, he is like a top 5 talent on any "guru's" draft list. I think Kiper has him # 3 overall. This isn't Mark Ingram. He is big and fast and will be on somebody's bpa list. He won't make it outside the top 10 unless he has a terrible 40. And even then he goes top 20.

strafen
01-15-2012, 02:57 PM
Who voted for kicker and punter?
Seriously?! ROFL! LOL

HooptyHoops
01-15-2012, 03:09 PM
Agreed -- the day Al Wilson injured his neck was the day we became a bottom-10 defense.

I also think cornerback is a critical concern.

Wilson was a late 1st rounder too....let's do it again!!

Drek
01-15-2012, 03:17 PM
Bro, he is like a top 5 talent on any "guru's" draft list. I think Kiper has him # 3 overall. This isn't Mark Ingram. He is big and fast and will be on somebody's bpa list. He won't make it outside the top 10 unless he has a terrible 40. And even then he goes top 20.

1. Kiper is an idiot who knows dick.

2. All the talk before the combine was that Ingram could run a 4.4 and was gone in the top 15. He goes to Indy, runs a 4.62, then runs a 4.53 at his pro day. Falls to the #28 pick. Same talk about Richardson right now, rumors of Alabama coaches timing him at 4.4. We'll see come the combine. If he drops the 4.4 he claims then sure, he's a top 10 pick. If he runs a 4.55 or so he's in the 20's. At that point you have teams labeling him as lacking break away speed while David Wilson and Lamar Miller are likely to run 4.3-4.4 40's and likely to be second rounders.

Stephen Jackson was considered a similar dominant RB in college. Everyone had him pegged as a top 15 pick. Everyone thought when he slid to #15 we just lucked into a steal, at which point we took DJ and let his slide continue. He ended up going #24. He's bigger than Richardson and ran a 4.52 on a bum knee.

That is all it takes. A bunch of good underclassmen at other positions coming out and Richardson running a 4.5 or worse. At that point he could definitely fall to us at #25.

Hamrob
01-15-2012, 04:36 PM
I think we also need to keep in mind, that our draft class received little to no offseason coaching. Most of them had to play because of injuries and or lack of depth. That's not a bad thing in my mind, because they got valuable experience. Give them all a full offseason and there definitely could be some help to be found in this group. That's not to mention our practice squad and IR guys. Miller, Franklin, and Carter were tremendous considering they were rookies and received no mini-camps etc.

Von Miller - LB
Rahim Moore - Safety
Orlando Franklin - Tackle
Nate Irving - MLB
Quinton Carter - Safety
Julius Thomas - TE
Mike Mohamad - LB
Virgil Green - TE
Jeremy Beal - DE
Mario Fannin - RB (undrafted)

Garcia Bronco
01-15-2012, 04:56 PM
We need to sign our one year guys at DT in free agency.

cutthemdown
01-15-2012, 05:09 PM
the center of the defense: DT, MLB, S

the center of the Oline: C, G

money in the bank IF we can find/draft/sign them

Broncos IMO wont be going much after oline even though I would love Nicks

CEH
01-15-2012, 05:10 PM
Unless Fox changes his philosphy I don't see him drafting a 260 LB MLBer. I would not be suprise to see us select the center from WIS with our first pick. I bet we trade back into the 2nd .

gyldenlove
01-15-2012, 05:12 PM
I think its very possible he will be. Look at the first round.

Indianapolis (2-14) - Luck, no question.
St. Louis (2-14) - Have Jackson.
Minnesota (3-13) - Have AP.
Cleveland (4-12) - Have Hardesty, showed interest in keeping Hillis early in the season, 4 seems pretty early for a running back.
Tampa Bay (4-12) - Have Blount
Washington (5-11) - Shanahan won't take an RB this early.
Jacksonville (5-11) - MJD.
Miami (6-10) - Bush + Thomas (2nd round pick last year, good when healthy this year).
Carolina (6-10) - Deangelo on a big deal + Stewart has one more year left.
Buffalo (6-10) - Fred Jackson + CJ Spiller.
Kansas City (7-9) - Charles + McCluster + Battle.
Seattle (7-9) - Marshaun Lynch, though he is a FA.
Arizona (8-8) - Beanie Wells, finally had his breakout year.
Dallas (8-8) - Felix Jones and Murray.
Philadelphia (8-8) - Shady McCoy.
New York Jets (8-8) - Shonne Greene, will probably resign Tomlinson.
Cincinnati - from Oakland (8-8) - Cedric Benson, but he's an FA.
San Diego (8-8) - Ryan Matthews.
Chicago (8-8) - Forte, though he's a FA.
Tennessee (9-7) - CJ2K.
Cincinnati* (9-7) - See above.
Cleveland - from Atlanta* (10-6) - Again, do they resign Hillis or not?
Detroit* (10-6) - Took LeShore last year. Jahvid Best.
Pittsburgh* (12-4) - Mendenhall and co., not their biggest need.
Denver* (8-8)

Its entirely possible he gets within our reach. Though yes, beating Pittsburgh gives Cincy and Cleveland each a second bite at the apple before us.

Generally though, if some team grabs him it signals a pretty solid RB being allowed to walk. Big question is what Richardson does at the combine. If its Mark Ingram + 10 pounds he could very possibly fall into our laps at #25, just like it took the Saints trading back up to stop Ingram's fall at #28 last year.

RB and MLB are the two positions that most easily go into free fall when other positions are well stocked. If enough underclassmen jump this year (a lot already are) we could see that happen. CB looks particularly well off for first round talent and there are two real franchise type QB prospects at the top of the draft. A lot of big, physically gifted WRs coming out this year too.

There is no way he gets by Cincinati twice, all signs point to Benson being gone and they need offensive talent to protect Dalton.

maher_tyler
01-15-2012, 05:14 PM
Agreed -- the day Al Wilson injured his neck was the day we became a bottom-10 defense.

I also think cornerback is a critical concern.

I would say so but not critical. We have some young talent there. Harris looked good. Will be interesting to see how Thompson comes back. I'd like to bring in someone in from FA. I think our biggest need is at MLB though. Mays was beaten repeatedly all year long whether it be in coverage against TEs or against the run missing tackles or just being to slow. Next would be at DT. Zero pressure up the gut from our D has been our problem for as long as i can remember. We can hardly get pressure blitzing. We need a lot of help on the front 7 of the D.

Denver724
01-15-2012, 05:42 PM
I think we also need to keep in mind, that our draft class received little to no offseason coaching. Most of them had to play because of injuries and or lack of depth. That's not a bad thing in my mind, because they got valuable experience. Give them all a full offseason and there definitely could be some help to be found in this group. That's not to mention our practice squad and IR guys. Miller, Franklin, and Carter were tremendous considering they were rookies and received no mini-camps etc.

Von Miller - LB
Rahim Moore - Safety
Orlando Franklin - Tackle
Nate Irving - MLB
Quinton Carter - Safety
Julius Thomas - TE
Mike Mohamad - LB
Virgil Green - TE
Jeremy Beal - DE
Mario Fannin - RB (undrafted)

Don't forget about Mark Dell (WR). I think he may be a good one.

Atwater His Ass
01-15-2012, 05:50 PM
Defensive Tackle is #1 for me (still). Bunkley and Thomas are good rotational depth guys, but we need to find some NFL quality starters here. Vickersen is meh, and Warren hasn't played football in two years and is the wrong side of 30; don't see how anyone would be willing to count on him contributing other than rotation.

MLB. We have a prospect that hopefull can develop. It's a concern for sure though and needs to be addressed.

S. Almost same as MLB for me. We have some young talent here in Carter and Moore. Moore should have a chance next year and hopefully can improve. Bush and Bruton are trash.

CB is a mess outside of Champ and needs to be sorely addressed.

OL. I like the idea of moving Franklin to guard and finding a new RT. Potentiall upgrades 2 positions with investment in only 1 player. Beadles and Walton just got tore up yesterday. Would definately appear they aren't starting material. Would be great if Harris could get and stay healthy.

RB. McGahee was great this year, but I'm not comfortable relying on him to shoulder the load next season. Moreno can't be counted on as anything other than a 3rd down type of back/receiver. Not a fan of Ball. But wouldn't use a high pick here or deal out a big FA contract. Too much injury risk with this position.

WR. Would like to see Royal come back, but he's really only a 3rd option / KR/PR in my eyes. Decker and Thomas I like, but worried if they can stay on the field consistently.

QB. Need a backup if Quinn leaves and would like to see a developmental pick in the later rounds.

Order of need imo:
1) DT
2) CB
3) OG/OT, depending on what we do with Franklin
4) MLB, maybe nr 3 if EFX thinks Irvin won't develop
5) S
6) WR
7) RB
8) QB

MagicHef
01-15-2012, 07:18 PM
Perhaps I am being too optimistic towards some of our 1st and 2nd year guys, but I think G and MLB are the positions we NEED to address. After that, I think the areas we devote resources depends on what type of team we want to be. I could see us getting some weapons for the offense, or getting some talent for the defensive backfield or DL. I hope it's the latter.

GoBroncos84
01-15-2012, 07:26 PM
as far as starters, MLB and CB are the biggest needs. Depth at running back and DT are probably next on the list.

Rascal
01-15-2012, 07:28 PM
Broncos need to get 4 starters at least and more depth, IMO.

HAT
01-15-2012, 07:28 PM
Good luck finding one.

Josh Johnson

chanesaw
01-15-2012, 07:42 PM
Um someone actually voted for kicker?

Prater is a FA, hence we need to address his position.

cutthemdown
01-15-2012, 07:44 PM
Why were Colquitts punts so lame? Didn't the seem sort of floppy short POS punts.

MagicHef
01-15-2012, 07:48 PM
Why were Colquitts punts so lame? Didn't the seem sort of floppy short POS punts.

Probably the horse tranquilizer Belichick slipped him.

Lycan
01-15-2012, 08:11 PM
Identify the best MLB available, whether it be through the draft or FA, and do whatever it takes to get them on this team.

Then focus on CB, WR, S, RB and DT.

I don't expect to fix them all in one off-season, but fix what you can and patch the rest up for next season.

Bigdawg26
01-15-2012, 09:11 PM
It would be so sweet to pick up Dan Connor and Tom Zbikowski from FA!

fontaine
01-16-2012, 03:04 AM
Ask yourself this question:

What was the biggest difference to our defense this year?

It's clear that the return of Dumerville and a healthy defense with Allen got it done but the single biggest impact was that of Von Miller.

The game has changed so much in the last few years that all the focus is on the passing game and defenders that can stop the passing offense. THAT'S why Von Miller is such a big deal.

We need to upgrade the DE/DT/MLB and DB positions to address that. I hope we target guys like Jason Jones, Jeremy Mincey, Cliff Avril at the DL position to continue to build the pass rush and sign guys like Brandon Carr and another coverage safety.

On offense we're set at WR with Decker/Thomas but desperately need a big, speedy TE that can exploit the middle. Maybe Jeremy Shockey for a couple of seasons while Julius Thomas develops.

fontaine
01-16-2012, 03:22 AM
And another thing:

Beadles and Walton are two of the worst interior lineman in the AFC. Hopefully we bring in some competition against these guys because they're a liability.

cutthemdown
01-16-2012, 03:25 AM
Probably the horse tranquilizer Belichick slipped him.

So I wasn't just drunk right? They were noticeable lame compared to his normal boomers. They just were not coming off his foot normal.

Doggcow
01-16-2012, 03:26 AM
I'm not sure if Colquitt has the job locked up.

cutthemdown
01-16-2012, 03:33 AM
And another thing:

Beadles and Walton are two of the worst interior lineman in the AFC. Hopefully we bring in some competition against these guys because they're a liability.

Well wait just a minute. I wouldn't say worst. but......neither are good vs really big DT. Throw in Clady being more a finesse player and we have Franklin and Kuper that can deliver punishment. But I am impressed with all of their pass blocking. I think what we could use a big mauling guard to play the left side, keep Walton, Beadles takes over for Hochstien as first reserve.

Then I also feel a real FB would help the interior run blocking. I know people think being a great lead blocker shouldn't be hard, but its an art form sometimes as tough as being a great tackler. It takes anticipation, quickness, and the ability to think, then when you do all that and get into the right hole you have to deliver a blow vs a backer or dback who has had far less traffic to go through to get to get to the gap.

Howard Griffith really was one of the best at it I have even seen in Denver. He would often see know gap defender to get a block on, make an adjustment and help stop a penetrating dlineman. I remember lots of plays him getting just enough on a guy in the backfield TD was able to make a play out of it.

fontaine
01-16-2012, 04:05 AM
Well wait just a minute. I wouldn't say worst. but......neither are good vs really big DT. Throw in Clady being more a finesse player and we have Franklin and Kuper that can deliver punishment. But I am impressed with all of their pass blocking. I think what we could use a big mauling guard to play the left side, keep Walton, Beadles takes over for Hochstien as first reserve.

It's not just me saying it. Even though it's pretty clear to me that Beadles is awful and Walton is poor from most of the games I've rewatched.

http://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2012/01/15/re-focused-broncos-patriots-divisional-round/

Walton finished the season as easily the worst grades center in the NFL and Beadles was among the worst guards in the league as well.

The only reason why this isn't more obvious to other is the severely limited amount of times we're passed the ball, but all the signs are there. Take away Tebow's rushing yards and these two still struggle in the run game and routinely make mistakes in pass blocking also.

fontaine
01-16-2012, 04:18 AM
The reason why I've consistently brought up Beadles and Walton is pretty simple.

An inefficient way to improve a team is to upgrade a decent position/unit into an elite one. We can upgrade the FB, WR, MLB position but the guys we already have there are not the worst or near bottom in their respective positions, so if you get better players there it's not going to vastly improve your team.

The BEST way is to take the worst units/players in your team and rank them according to the number of snaps they play.

C/LG pretty much play every single offensive snap and to have two of the near worst players in those positions impacts us on every single drive be it run blocking or pass protection. EVEN if you upgrade those two positions to mediocre/average (which could be done cheaply) then you bring in a massive improvement on every single drive due to the number of snaps these guys play.

We don't have to sign pro bowlers at these positions. Just veteran guys who'll come reasonabley cheap which is must more feasible than trying to sign a pro-bowl type CB.

Drek
01-16-2012, 04:48 AM
The reason why I've consistently brought up Beadles and Walton is pretty simple.

An inefficient way to improve a team is to upgrade a decent position/unit into an elite one. We can upgrade the FB, WR, MLB position but the guys we already have there are not the worst or near bottom in their respective positions, so if you get better players there it's not going to vastly improve your team.

The BEST way is to take the worst units/players in your team and rank them according to the number of snaps they play.

C/LG pretty much play every single offensive snap and to have two of the near worst players in those positions impacts us on every single drive be it run blocking or pass protection. EVEN if you upgrade those two positions to mediocre/average (which could be done cheaply) then you bring in a massive improvement on every single drive due to the number of snaps these guys play.

We don't have to sign pro bowlers at these positions. Just veteran guys who'll come reasonabley cheap which is must more feasible than trying to sign a pro-bowl type CB.

I personally put little faith in profootballfocus, their stats are almost all poorly constructed algorithms based on poorly reviewed film. Nothing close to what people actually in the NFL do.

That said, we can resolve a lot of our OL issues with simply replacing Beadles at LG. Then he can work at C to give Walton some competition while also being our 1st reserve at the rest of the OL. Retain Ryan Harris as our backup swing tackle as well and we would have a seven deep OL that would be young and have real potential of being something special.

Carl Nicks would be an ideal answer to this problem. He would be expensive but he's also only 26 and history has shown that if you're going to commit big FA money to a single position the OL, OG in particular, moves from team to team better than pretty much anything else.

kappys
01-16-2012, 05:38 AM
This is a tough poll because truthfully any answer besides punter/kicker is right.

I focused on where we could get the biggest impact among starters and also assuming the current FA on this team return - I think we need a solid TE to open up the middle of the field, LG(Unless Beadles makes serious strides), MLB, SS to replace Dawkins, CB to replace Goodman(might be Chris Harris).

That said this is a team with very poor depth in many spots. Mcgahee will be a year older and we need a 2nd back not Lance Ball if we run it this much(Knowshown was starting to come on a bit until injured again). There is really no spot at which we have quality depth .

fontaine
01-16-2012, 06:19 AM
I personally put little faith in profootballfocus, their stats are almost all poorly constructed algorithms based on poorly reviewed film. Nothing close to what people actually in the NFL do.

That said, we can resolve a lot of our OL issues with simply replacing Beadles at LG. Then he can work at C to give Walton some competition while also being our 1st reserve at the rest of the OL. Retain Ryan Harris as our backup swing tackle as well and we would have a seven deep OL that would be young and have real potential of being something special.

Carl Nicks would be an ideal answer to this problem. He would be expensive but he's also only 26 and history has shown that if you're going to commit big FA money to a single position the OL, OG in particular, moves from team to team better than pretty much anything else.

I agree that you can't put full stock in pff but they do highlight individual mistakes which is simpler to track for OL since we've transitioned to a more power blocking scheme.

Beadles and Walton account for the most individual mistakes and negative plays among the OL 2nd year running.

Guards are relatively cheap and easy to upgrade like you said. Nicks may be too expensive but Ben Grubbs might be cheaper and Beadles/Harris would be decent depth.

That along with another pass rusher at DT or DE would be ideal. McBean needs to go and I hope can be replaced by Warren next year. I would still like to develop Irving and target a CB/S combo in FA.

That's four new FAs and would leave the draft for bpa.

Old Dude
01-16-2012, 06:45 AM
I'm pretty much with Drek and Fontaine on this one. I still think that the majority of NFL games (and especially playoff games) are won or lost at the line of scrimmage.

Looking at Denver's 5 starters on the O-Line as well as the front four on D, I think the single weakest link is Beadles. He's consistently blown up and overpowered by DTs in pass protection; he frequently fails to adjust against any kind of stunt, he can't drive block. I will give him credit for being fast enough to pull, but he often winds up downfield blocking no one.

Honestly, I think he's so bad that he worsens the players around him. (Clady and Walton). LG should be the number one priority in the off-season.

I'm less negative about Walton. He was abominable for most of his rookie year but I think he did make some progress in his second season, and I think he'd make more if he didn't have such a liability on his left side.

Cito Pelon
01-16-2012, 07:20 AM
What about Nate Irving? I thought Bill Parcells had him rated as the #1 MLB in the 2011 draft. Shouldn't he be in-line to replace Mays, who I am sure wont be re-signed as a starter?

My thinking about Irving is if he was ready to start, why didn't they put him in for Mays? Mays had a horrible 67 solo tackles, and only 83 total. That's horrible for a 4-3 MLB starting all 16 games.

TonyR
01-16-2012, 07:33 AM
I'm shocked how little the QB position is being discussed. Are we 100% sure that EFX are sold on Tebow as next year's de facto starter and/or QBOTF? I'm curious how many people think there's a real possibility that real competition is brought in one way or another. I'm getting feeling almost everybody thinks it's Tebow next year but would you really be all that surprised to see Elway try to make a course correction?

KO5K
01-16-2012, 07:36 AM
I'm shocked how little the QB position is being discussed. Are we 100% sure that EFX are sold on Tebow as next year's de facto starter and/or QBOTF?

That wasn't the question dumbass.

TonyR
01-16-2012, 07:47 AM
That wasn't the question dumbass.

I'm asking the question, genius. Take a deep breath, re-read the thread title, then take another deep breath. Are you calmed down now a little bit? Okay, let me walk you throught this. QB is the most important position on the field. Considering this, I think the position warrants inclusion in any discussion of FA and the draft. I'm sorry this is so difficult for you.

CEH
01-16-2012, 07:50 AM
I'm asking the question, genius. Take a deep breath, re-read the thread title, then take another deep breath. Are you calmed down now a little bit? Okay, let me walk you throught this. QB is the most important position on the field. Considering this, I think the position warrants inclusion in any discussion of FA and the draft. I'm sorry this is so difficult for you.


Plus it's the first choice in the poll. Can ppl be this ignorant.

Powderaddict
01-16-2012, 07:55 AM
DT, MLB, CB, OG/C (depth, and competition for Walton/Beadles), RB, TE.

In no particualr order.

I'd love to see Bush in a Bronco uni, I really hope they make a run at him!

fontaine
01-16-2012, 08:11 AM
I'm shocked how little the QB position is being discussed. Are we 100% sure that EFX are sold on Tebow as next year's de facto starter and/or QBOTF? I'm curious how many people think there's a real possibility that real competition is brought in one way or another. I'm getting feeling almost everybody thinks it's Tebow next year but would you really be all that surprised to see Elway try to make a course correction?

I think we can win with Tebow and the point of competition at QB is different than that from other positions.

The only question with Tebow is how much he improves this offseason and during training camp. And he's done enough to deserve the starting role and full focus on helping him improve.

If he shows no improvement next season in his accuracy, timing and more importantly his ability to target WRs against tight coverage then you can start looking for real alternatives.

I don't think any reasonable person can expect Tebow to be the finished product or even close to it next season, but it is very realistic to expect improvement in his key weakenesses I've stated which are part of the skillset that makes a good QB.

Cito Pelon
01-16-2012, 08:17 AM
I'm shocked how little the QB position is being discussed. Are we 100% sure that EFX are sold on Tebow as next year's de facto starter and/or QBOTF? I'm curious how many people think there's a real possibility that real competition is brought in one way or another. I'm getting feeling almost everybody thinks it's Tebow next year but would you really be all that surprised to see Elway try to make a course correction?

Well, only they know what they're gonna do. They have until late-April to decide if Tebow is making progress enough. I think they'll stick with Tebow.

KO5K
01-16-2012, 08:19 AM
Plus it's the first choice in the poll. Can ppl be this ignorant.

Can people be this stupid?

TheReverend
01-16-2012, 08:22 AM
In order:

CB, CB, G, MLB, DT, DE, S, RB, OT

The Joker
01-16-2012, 09:10 AM
In order:

CB, CB, G, MLB, DT, DE, S, RB, OT

Safety needs to be higher.

Dawkins is probably done, after that it's...

Carter - Can probably start and do well.
Bruton - Pure special teams/backup guy IMO.
Moore - Struggled immensely as a rookie, no guarantee he won't suck.

Agree on CB, hope we get a top FA and then draft another CB in the first three rounds.

BroncoInferno
01-16-2012, 09:19 AM
I'm shocked how little the QB position is being discussed. Are we 100% sure that EFX are sold on Tebow as next year's de facto starter and/or QBOTF? I'm curious how many people think there's a real possibility that real competition is brought in one way or another. I'm getting feeling almost everybody thinks it's Tebow next year but would you really be all that surprised to see Elway try to make a course correction?

Even if they aren't 100% sold (I'm not either), who are they going to bring in? Look at the veteran QBs available. The best of the bunch is Matt Flynn. Someone is going to give him big money to be their undisputed starter, plus probably have to give GB a high draft pick if they franchise him. So, he's out. Who else is there? I'd give Shaun Hill a look. He a quality veteran backup who did a solid job for Detroit when Stafford was hurt last year. Who else? Other than Flynn and Hill, Orton is probably the best guy out there. Jason Campbell? I'd just as soon commit to Tebow in 2012, with Hill as the backup if Tebow is just so bad there's no justification to stick with him. If he stinks, so be it, we'll have a high draft pick to find his replacement in 2013.

Crushaholic
01-16-2012, 10:12 AM
Even though I think Tebow has promise, we still need to look at QB. I don't feel good about Tebow's backups. Secondary is also a huge need...

barryr
01-16-2012, 10:13 AM
If there is serious QB's out there that can give Tebow competition, then I'm all for it, but who? I just see more Orton types out there.

As for the defense, as well as people say Allen did with this unit, don't forget this unit ranked in the 20's. I know as Bronco fans we are used to backups and special teams guys masquerading as starters on defense, but it would be nice if this team had a legit 11 starters on defense for once. So guys like Goodman, Mays, and Thomas especially, I know some like them for if anything sentimental reasons since been around a little while, but come on. Guys like that don't see the field on really good defenses, much less start.

Mile High Mojoe
01-16-2012, 10:14 AM
CB,RB, MLB,WR and DL.

Mile High Mojoe
01-16-2012, 10:17 AM
I'm shocked how little the QB position is being discussed. Are we 100% sure that EFX are sold on Tebow as next year's de facto starter and/or QBOTF? I'm curious how many people think there's a real possibility that real competition is brought in one way or another. I'm getting feeling almost everybody thinks it's Tebow next year but would you really be all that surprised to see Elway try to make a course correction?

You're a broken record that no one is listening to, the only "shocking" thing here is you don't look in the mirror and see it for yourself.

TheReverend
01-16-2012, 10:18 AM
Safety needs to be higher.

Dawkins is probably done, after that it's...

Carter - Can probably start and do well.
Bruton - Pure special teams/backup guy IMO.
Moore - Struggled immensely as a rookie, no guarantee he won't suck.

Agree on CB, hope we get a top FA and then draft another CB in the first three rounds.

When we get legitimate NFL corners and solid coverage underneath, our safeties immediately look better by not having to do nearly as much.

Otherwise -

Carter: Already has done well as a starter
Moore: High responsibility cerebral position in a truncated off-season. Will be dramatically better next year.
Bruton: Did way better than I had ever imagined he could.

Grab a mediocre vet and call it a day.

As for CB, very rarely do top, young CBs hit FA. We whiffed big time not even sniffing around Joseph last year.

barryr
01-16-2012, 10:21 AM
Funny, not long ago seemed quite a few of Tebow's detractors went from he can't throw, to he can't win, to he can't get the team to the playoffs, to then, what they must have felt was safe to say, they would believe in him(at least for a year) if they beat the Steelers, but obviously for some, it was just BS. Tebow didn't win the Super Bowl and set all passing records along the way, so he must be replaced. Great stuff.

oubronco
01-16-2012, 10:27 AM
DT, DT, CB, MLB, RB, QB

Rohirrim
01-16-2012, 10:29 AM
This poll brings up the same disconnect that has been evident on here for a while. This team made it to the second round of the playoffs. Judging by this poll, they need help at almost every position. And the reason we lost to the Pats is because the coaching staff sucks?

TonyR
01-16-2012, 10:31 AM
You're a broken record that no one is listening to, the only "shocking" thing here is you don't look in the mirror and see it for yourself.

LOL Doesn't really matter what you and I think, dippydoo. It does, however, matter what EFX think. And I particularly wonder where Elway's head is at regarding the QB position. Because, you know, this might factor in to the team's offseason plans a little. Nomsayin'?

Mile High Mojoe
01-16-2012, 10:33 AM
This poll brings up the same disconnect that has been evident on here for a while. This team made it to the second round of the playoffs. Judging by this poll, they need help at almost every position. And the reason we lost to the Pats is because the coaching staff sucks?

No... that's just how your mind chooses to frame the debate. You think Tebow sucks, he's the main source for our suckyness right?

barryr
01-16-2012, 10:35 AM
LOL Doesn't really matter what you and I think, dippydoo. It does, however, matter what EFX think. And I particularly wonder where Elway's head is at regarding the QB position. Because, you know, this might factor in to the team's offseason plans a little. Nomsayin'?

Elway has already stated that Tebow is the starter and plans to work with him in the offseason. Kind of strange that Elway would look to waste his time working with a QB he plans to replace. But that is using logic.

Mile High Mojoe
01-16-2012, 10:43 AM
LOL Doesn't really matter what you and I think, dippydoo. It does, however, matter what EFX think. And I particularly wonder where Elway's head is at regarding the QB position. Because, you know, this might factor in to the team's offseason plans a little. Nomsayin'?

A while ago you were bragging that you got on a Philly radio station singing the praises of Tebow and defending his honor what happened?

We do need a backup, a better one than Quinn but we need players on D, CB, MLB, OLB and DL. We need another RB bad, more depth at WR and probably a Guard to cover for Kuper. Tebow will be the starter next season so quit broing us with the talk that someone will come in and compete for the QB job next year it's BS. Wake up and move on.

Did you see how Goodman played in NE? DJ had a nice season but is getting long in the tooth, Mays and Woodyard improved but I thought in the last 3 games they both slide... tons of mistackles. Royal and Decker didn't produce squat in the second half. Let's not worry about turning the team upside down again with a QB change until 2013 draft at the earliest. Bring in a veteran backup and call it good period.

yerner
01-16-2012, 10:43 AM
They need players at pretty much every position other than special teams. I think BPA is the best way to think about this draft.

I personally would like a QB in the 2nd. Foles, Tannehill, or Osweiler. All those dudes can really throw it and I'm thinking Tebow won't play a full season with those hits he takes.

TonyR
01-16-2012, 10:45 AM
A while ago you...

Again, this isn't about me. I'm not the one calling the shots.

ThirtyDegrees
01-16-2012, 10:46 AM
I'm shocked how little the QB position is being discussed. Are we 100% sure that EFX are sold on Tebow as next year's de facto starter and/or QBOTF? I'm curious how many people think there's a real possibility that real competition is brought in one way or another. I'm getting feeling almost everybody thinks it's Tebow next year but would you really be all that surprised to see Elway try to make a course correction?

What competition is available?

I don't think anybody is seriously considering signing Charlie Whitehurst or Matt Flynn to compete with Tebow.

Rohirrim
01-16-2012, 10:46 AM
No... that's just how your mind chooses to frame the debate. You think Tebow sucks, he's the main source for our suckyness right?

I can't waste time talking to you. You see everything in black and white. It's either all this or all that. I shudder to think you were a cop at some point.

Mile High Mojoe
01-16-2012, 10:52 AM
I can't waste time talking to you. You see everything in black and white. It's either all this or all that. I shudder to think you were a cop at some point.

Okay..in short tell me where we go next year? Where do we start? I didn't say anything about the Coaching, others may have but the Coaching was brilliant at times and to conservative at times.

So I'm all ears, I know you're a smart person and have an opinion. I'm willing to hear you out. But if Tebow is the first thing out of your mouth then you've lost me.

Mile High Mojoe
01-16-2012, 10:57 AM
I'm waiting Roh, instead of trash talk just shock me by summarizing your opinion.

razorwire77
01-16-2012, 10:57 AM
I'm shocked how little the QB position is being discussed. Are we 100% sure that EFX are sold on Tebow as next year's de facto starter and/or QBOTF? I'm curious how many people think there's a real possibility that real competition is brought in one way or another. I'm getting feeling almost everybody thinks it's Tebow next year but would you really be all that surprised to see Elway try to make a course correction?

I'd be shocked if Elway and company outright draft a QB in the first or second rounds to take over for Tebow this year. The **** hitting the fan uproar and media circus would be unbearable. My guess is if there is a value pick at the QB position like Ryan Lindley in the 3rd or 4th round, they might pull the trigger. They will also most definitely bring in a veteran to back up Tebow, but my guess is Tim gets otas, preseason, and 4 or 5 games into 2012 to continue to show improvement, but if he doesn't show enough improvement in reading defenses and throwing from the pocket over the middle of the field they'll cut their losses with him and draft someone like Barkley in 2012. I don't necessarily agree with taking that position with Tebow, but if he struggles in 2012-13, that's what I think happens.

Tombstone RJ
01-16-2012, 10:58 AM
Most, if not all the guys in the draft that people on this thread want--will.be.gone. Sorry folks, that's just the way it is... you can dream but you are only fooling yourself, here's a much more realistic pick for the Broncos at #25:

http://nfltraderumors.co/nfltr-features/2012-nfl-mock-draft/

Rohirrim
01-16-2012, 11:01 AM
Okay..in short tell me where we go next year? Where do we start? I didn't say anything about the Coaching, others may have but the Coaching was brilliant at times and to conservative at times.

So I'm all ears, I know you're a smart person and have an opinion. I'm willing to hear you out. But if Tebow is the first thing out of your mouth then you've lost me.

Where did I even mention Tebow in that post? Why did you even respond if you have nothing against the coaching? My point was crystal clear: How can anybody on the one hand see this team go to the second round of the playoffs, then on the other hand agree that we need help at nearly every position, and then argue that the coaching sucks? It's an absurd syllogism.

TonyR
01-16-2012, 11:07 AM
I'd be shocked if Elway and company outright draft a QB in the first or second rounds to take over for Tebow this year. The **** hitting the fan uproar and media circus would be unbearable. My guess is if there is a value pick at the QB position like Ryan Lindley in the 3rd or 4th round, they might pull the trigger. They will also most definitely bring in a veteran to back up Tebow, but my guess is Tim gets otas, preseason, and 4 or 5 games into 2012 to continue to show improvement, but if he doesn't show enough improvement in reading defenses and throwing from the pocket over the middle of the field they'll cut their losses with him and draft someone like Barkley in 2012. I don't necessarily agree with taking that position with Tebow, but if he struggles in 2012-13, that's what I think happens.

Thanks, good post. I tend to agree on all points.

Mile High Mojoe
01-16-2012, 11:08 AM
Where did I even mention Tebow in that post? Why did you even respond if you have nothing against the coaching? My point was crystal clear: How can anybody on the one hand see this team go to the second round of the playoffs, then on the other hand agree that we need help at nearly every position, and then argue that the coaching sucks? It's an absurd syllogism.

Well... I agree with that but this thread was about draft picks. I stayed away form the debate on Sunday about the Coaching in the NE game. Vince Lombardi could have been the HC for the Broncos and we probably still would of lost the game. I thought it was stupid to run the ball after we got down by 21 points but since we ran for over 250 yards against them in the 1st meeting even down by 21 points I guess the thinking was making some positive yardage no matter how small.

So... back to the draft. You've probably posted somewhere your opinion on it but I'm not going to look in a 1,000 threads to find it. What do we do?

Mile High Mojoe
01-16-2012, 11:19 AM
They need players at pretty much every position other than special teams. I think BPA is the best way to think about this draft.

I personally would like a QB in the 2nd. Foles, Tannehill, or Osweiler. All those dudes can really throw it and I'm thinking Tebow won't play a full season with those hits he takes.

Why waste a Top pick for a QB when we have so many holes to fill and it's clear that Tebow will be the starter next season? BPA except for QB and if Tebow craps out next season then in 2013 we shop for a QB. Bring in a veteran free agent for now and focus on other positions.

yerner
01-16-2012, 11:19 AM
I'd be shocked if Elway and company outright draft a QB in the first or second rounds to take over for Tebow this year. The **** hitting the fan uproar and media circus would be unbearable. My guess is if there is a value pick at the QB position like Ryan Lindley in the 3rd or 4th round, they might pull the trigger. They will also most definitely bring in a veteran to back up Tebow, but my guess is Tim gets otas, preseason, and 4 or 5 games into 2012 to continue to show improvement, but if he doesn't show enough improvement in reading defenses and throwing from the pocket over the middle of the field they'll cut their losses with him and draft someone like Barkley in 2012. I don't necessarily agree with taking that position with Tebow, but if he struggles in 2012-13, that's what I think happens.

We all know Elway was hoping around the country this year looking at QB's. Tebow's performance in New England couldn't have left them feeling great. If they end up with a guy like Tannehill available in the 2nd and really like him, I don't think they'll be able to help themselves. People are just going to have to deal.

Also, the cap numbers on the 2nd rounders isnt what it used to be. Paying a decent developmental backup could be sold to the public. Nick Foles sitting on the sidelines for a couple years seeing how the Tebow thing plays out could be very alluring. In reality the Broncos need to be getting talent all thru the roster.

Mile High Mojoe
01-16-2012, 11:27 AM
We all know Elway was hoping around the country this year looking at QB's. Tebow's performance in New England couldn't have left them feeling great. If they end up with a guy like Tannehill available in the 2nd and really like him, I don't think they'll be able to help themselves. People are just going to have to deal.

Also, the cap numbers on the 2nd rounders isnt what it used to be. Paying a decent developmental backup could be sold to the public. Nick Foles sitting on the sidelines for a couple years seeing how the Tebow thing plays out could be very alluring. In reality the Broncos need to be getting talent all thru the roster.

This just isn't happening. They're not going to waste a #2 pick on a QB this year, you're projecting. They aren't that stupid.

Tombstone RJ
01-16-2012, 11:27 AM
We all know Elway was hoping around the country this year looking at QB's. Tebow's performance in New England couldn't have left them feeling great. If they end up with a guy like Tannehill available in the 2nd and really like him, I don't think they'll be able to help themselves. People are just going to have to deal.

Also, the cap numbers on the 2nd rounders isnt what it used to be. Paying a decent developmental backup could be sold to the public. Nick Foles sitting on the sidelines for a couple years seeing how the Tebow thing plays out could be very alluring. In reality the Broncos need to be getting talent all thru the roster.

I kind of agree with this unfortunately. I think that the Broncos will take a QB in the first or second round IF, and yes this is a big IF, the right QB for some unknown reason drops in their lap. If they love Tannehill and see him as the perfect type of QB they would love to have and for some unknown twisted and strange reason Tannehill falls to the Broncos in the second round (I definitely think he'll go in the first) then yah, EFX pulls the trigger.

HAT
01-16-2012, 11:27 AM
What competition is available?

I don't think anybody is seriously considering signing Charlie Whitehurst or Matt Flynn to compete with Tebow.

Josh Johnson.

http://www.tampabay.com/multimedia/archive/00088/c4s_jsoh101009_88926c.jpg

Tombstone RJ
01-16-2012, 11:28 AM
This just isn't happening. They're not going to waste a #2 pick on a QB this year, you're projecting. They aren't that stupid.

wrong sir, YOU are projecting. We are being realistic.

yerner
01-16-2012, 11:33 AM
This just isn't happening. They're not going to waste a #2 pick on a QB this year, you're projecting. They aren't that stupid.

Why is having depth at the most important position on the football team stupid? Tebow's style of play is conducive to injury. I'm not saying they are going into the draft looking for QB in the 2nd but if they see great value there, it may be too tempting to pass up.

Mile High Mojoe
01-16-2012, 11:37 AM
wrong sir, YOU are projecting. We are being realistic.

We need DB's and LB's bad, we need a RB worse, more depth at WR and help on the DL, another G. So we take a QB #2? Is a Rookie QB who sets on the bench all year going to help the Broncos win next year?

We need D. The house of cards finally fell in the Pats game. Wasting a pick on a QB is just dumb, sorry I don't agree.

Mile High Mojoe
01-16-2012, 11:39 AM
Why is having depth at the most important position on the football team stupid? Tebow's style of play is conducive to injury. I'm not saying they are going into the draft looking for QB in the 2nd but if they see great value there, it may be too tempting to pass up.

Sign a free agent QB, that's the smart move here.

TheReverend
01-16-2012, 11:43 AM
Most, if not all the guys in the draft that people on this thread want--will.be.gone. Sorry folks, that's just the way it is... you can dream but you are only fooling yourself, here's a much more realistic pick for the Broncos at #25:

http://nfltraderumors.co/nfltr-features/2012-nfl-mock-draft/

If we miss Devon by 1 selection I'm going to throw a temper tantrum.

elsid13
01-16-2012, 11:44 AM
Sign a free agent QB, that's the smart move here.

It going to cost the team more to get a decent FA QB, vs taking one in the draft. If the right guy is sitting there they will take him. Worse case they develop him and trade him away like Green Bay, best case he comes in challenge Tebow for starting job and give the team insurance if Tebow get hurts.

Tombstone RJ
01-16-2012, 11:44 AM
We need DB's and LB's bad, we need a RB worse, more depth at WR and help on the DL, another G. So we take a QB #2? Is a Rookie QB who sets on the bench all year going to help the Broncos win next year?

We need D. The house of cards finally fell in the Pats game. Wasting a pick on a QB is just dumb, sorry I don't agree.

The Broncos need a lot of things--lots of help on defense I agree. The situation I'm talking about is IF a QB falls the Broncos, a QB they covet, then I don't think they pass him up.

That being said, I don't think they trade up for a QB in the first or second round. The Broncos have Tebow, they will give Tebow another year and they WANT Tebow to succeed. I know Bowlen sure wants Tebow to succeed if for no other reason than jersey sales.

I don't think the Broncos will draft a QB this year, maybe in the later rounds but the Broncos already have Adam Weber and they may be happy with him and then bring in a vet to be a backup. With EFX now running the show it's hard to predict what rout the will take because we simply don't have a large enough sample size to predict with any accuracy where the draft and FA will go this coming year.

elsid13
01-16-2012, 11:45 AM
If we miss Devon by 1 selection I'm going to throw a temper tantrum.

And that will do what? Beside entertaining us on the mane

55CrushEm
01-16-2012, 11:46 AM
I'd be shocked if Elway and company outright draft a QB in the first or second rounds to take over for Tebow this year. The **** hitting the fan uproar and media circus would be unbearable. My guess is if there is a value pick at the QB position like Ryan Lindley in the 3rd or 4th round, they might pull the trigger. They will also most definitely bring in a veteran to back up Tebow, but my guess is Tim gets otas, preseason, and 4 or 5 games into 2012 to continue to show improvement, but if he doesn't show enough improvement in reading defenses and throwing from the pocket over the middle of the field they'll cut their losses with him and draft someone like Barkley in 2012. I don't necessarily agree with taking that position with Tebow, but if he struggles in 2012-13, that's what I think happens.

I agree with this. #1...Tebow has earned the offseason and another year (at least part of it) as the starter.

But the biggest reason we should avoid drafting a QB in the EARLY rounds is that we have way too many other holes to fill on this team.

It would be a different story if we were stacked at every position except QB.

SonOfLe-loLang
01-16-2012, 11:46 AM
I'd be shocked if Elway and company outright draft a QB in the first or second rounds to take over for Tebow this year. The **** hitting the fan uproar and media circus would be unbearable. My guess is if there is a value pick at the QB position like Ryan Lindley in the 3rd or 4th round, they might pull the trigger. They will also most definitely bring in a veteran to back up Tebow, but my guess is Tim gets otas, preseason, and 4 or 5 games into 2012 to continue to show improvement, but if he doesn't show enough improvement in reading defenses and throwing from the pocket over the middle of the field they'll cut their losses with him and draft someone like Barkley in 2012. I don't necessarily agree with taking that position with Tebow, but if he struggles in 2012-13, that's what I think happens.

I think this would be fair.

HAT
01-16-2012, 11:48 AM
If we miss Devon by 1 selection I'm going to throw a temper tantrum.

That seems like a pretty weak mock to me Rev....Still will be long gone IMO.

If they do go DT...Cox is the next best choice there.

TheReverend
01-16-2012, 11:49 AM
And that will do what? Beside entertaining us on the mane

You answered your own question?

Mile High Mojoe
01-16-2012, 11:50 AM
It going to cost the team more to get a decent FA QB, vs taking one in the draft. If the right guy is sitting there they will take him. Worse case they develop him and trade him away like Green Bay, best case he comes in challenge Tebow for starting job and give the team insurance if Tebow get hurts.

Why spent big dollars on a free agent QB? Taking a QB in the second probably from a dollars stand point would be more. More than that we just need more help elsewhere. Letting the fear of losing Tebow to injury dictate our draft choices is too small to sacrifice another starter that we so badly need on this team don't you think?

Why not wait until 2013 and then draft one?

Rohirrim
01-16-2012, 11:51 AM
Well... I agree with that but this thread was about draft picks. I stayed away form the debate on Sunday about the Coaching in the NE game. Vince Lombardi could have been the HC for the Broncos and we probably still would of lost the game. I thought it was stupid to run the ball after we got down by 21 points but since we ran for over 250 yards against them in the 1st meeting even down by 21 points I guess the thinking was making some positive yardage no matter how small.

So... back to the draft. You've probably posted somewhere your opinion on it but I'm not going to look in a 1,000 threads to find it. What do we do?

I always believe in the same philosophy when it comes to football: Build up the lines. I like Jared Crick, DT/DE, Nebraska in the first round right now. The pass rush must be improved. That's the key to success in the new NFL. On the offense, I agree with Drek, we should go after Nicks in FA for LG and move Beadles to C. Walton as backup. Everything starts with the lines.

Tebow needs more weapons, but he also has to expand his ability to read defenses and use more of the route tree, including timing routes, which means the same old fundamentals re footwork. I imagine that will be his focus in the offseason. We need more running weapons. I would like a very fast small guy on the order of Sproles as a change up back to force defenses to worry about the outside. If we're going with more of a spread option attack centered on Tebow, we should get a back-up QB who also excels in that scheme. This is the one flaw in using a QB so much on the ground. He could get injured and then if you have a standard scheme QB backing up, you're screwed. Obviously, we'll also need at least one WR in the draft or FA, more likely two. We could even take Vincent Jackson from the Chargers. There seem to be some issues there between him and that FO. Of course, with Tebow at QB, we might have a tough time attracting top WRs (especially those who are more concerned about their own catches than anything else).

Once the lines are fixed, we need ILB and veteran secondary help. Depending how it all unfolds and where the money is at, maybe we could even make a run at Landry? It would be a gamble, but it could turn out very well for the team that rolls the dice. IMO, we should get one of those top, veteran TEs and let him become Tebow's personal security blanket and go-to guy, especially on dump offs.

I think we're at a place where it will take at least a couple of years to really get AFCCG strong, and that's if we don't **** up on any picks or FAs. You've also got to have some luck on your side.

Mile High Mojoe
01-16-2012, 12:25 PM
It does start with the lines on O and D Roh. Weíve failed miserably in drafting and signing free agents on the DL over the last 10 years. Mainly I guess because Shanahan and McD where offense guys. Hopefully Fox can find us a Julius Peppers kind of guy even if itís in the later rounds or through free agency

After watching how the 9ers young DL was pressuring and knocking Brees around itíd sure be nice to have some studs that could penetrate without sending the house. For all the talk about how great their DBís were though they didnít play that well against the Saints. I guess my point is we can have a better DL but if we donít have the DBís to cover or LBís with some speed who can cover TEís then a good DL becomes moot. Look at the Lions, didnít seem to help them too much.

I think we get the best CBís and Sís we can get so we can have more freedom to be aggressive with a pass rush if we donít improve at LB or DL. And at LB the only guy who should consider his job safe is Miller and maybe DJ to a lesser extent. DJ picked up his game this season but heís long in the tooth and doesnít cover well anymore. Mays played well during the winning streak but in the last 5 games of the season he didnít. He and Woodyard missed many a tackle, I know the rest of the team didnít tackle all that well but we have to have some LBís that have some speed and can tackle.

So I guess my deal would be focus on the defensive side of the ball this year and get the BPA in any of the 3 areas. We do need another RB, WR and a G. But if the 9ers showed us anything yesterday a great D first and foremost is going to carry you, especially in the playoffs.

orinjkrush
01-16-2012, 03:34 PM
with our schedule next year, i expect a worse record overall. assuming that, draft infrastructure this year when our draft position is lower, and marquee skill players next year when our draft position is higher. so draft MLB, DL, OL and S this year and next year QB, CB and RB and WR. just as a heuristic, but jumping on a player that somehow slides to us unexpectedly. remember its a 3 year plan.

HAT
01-16-2012, 03:47 PM
with our schedule next year, i expect a worse record overall.

I would be shocked if they hit 8-8 next year....Shocked.

Old Dude
01-16-2012, 04:46 PM
I disagree that we are okay at the safety spots.

Bruton was victimized from start to finish in the Pats game. Raheem Moore is an absolute bust. Granted, he's a rookie, but he regressed from training camp. I don't think there's any reason to think that he'll improve next year any more than any random guy on the practice squad. Carter looks like a good backup, but not a starter.

This isn't as high a priority as the offensive or defensive lines, but it's an area where Denver could improve dramatically with even slightly-above-average players.

Drek
01-16-2012, 04:47 PM
My thinking about Irving is if he was ready to start, why didn't they put him in for Mays? Mays had a horrible 67 solo tackles, and only 83 total. That's horrible for a 4-3 MLB starting all 16 games.

I think Irving was significantly handicapped by the change of schemes and the shortened off-season. Also, despite Miller's strong rookie campaign and Carter coming on late it is very hard to commit three key defensive spots to rookies and expect any kind of reliable performances.

We should look to upgrade over Mays but not at big money. That probably takes Lofton off the market for us but Connor and Hawthorne should both still be viable upgrades. Then Iriving gets a legitimate chance to earn the job or work to replace DJ at WOLB.

Atwater His Ass
01-16-2012, 07:11 PM
How much we spend (or not) on MLB will come down to what Fox feels about Irving and if he'll develop.

Denver724
01-26-2012, 09:45 AM
1. Kiper is an idiot who knows dick.

2. All the talk before the combine was that Ingram could run a 4.4 and was gone in the top 15. He goes to Indy, runs a 4.62, then runs a 4.53 at his pro day. Falls to the #28 pick. Same talk about Richardson right now, rumors of Alabama coaches timing him at 4.4. We'll see come the combine. If he drops the 4.4 he claims then sure, he's a top 10 pick. If he runs a 4.55 or so he's in the 20's. At that point you have teams labeling him as lacking break away speed while David Wilson and Lamar Miller are likely to run 4.3-4.4 40's and likely to be second rounders.

Stephen Jackson was considered a similar dominant RB in college. Everyone had him pegged as a top 15 pick. Everyone thought when he slid to #15 we just lucked into a steal, at which point we took DJ and let his slide continue. He ended up going #24. He's bigger than Richardson and ran a 4.52 on a bum knee.

That is all it takes. A bunch of good underclassmen at other positions coming out and Richardson running a 4.5 or worse. At that point he could definitely fall to us at #25.

This person thinks Richardson will go #5 to Tampa (with Schiano being hired).

http://nflmocks.com/2012/01/26/tampa-bays-hiring-of-greg-schiano-could-mean-trent-richardson-for-bucs/

BowlenBall
04-27-2012, 06:48 AM
Bump from four months ago -- the top three areas of need we voted on were ILB, CB, and RB.

And yet, everyone's hoping for a DT now with our next pick....