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View Full Version : Dennis Allen - we're watching (and collectively holding our breath)


cmhargrove
01-13-2012, 07:30 PM
I think I know who Tebow is, I think I know who Fox is, I think I know about Champ, McGahee, Dumervil, et al.

In my eyes, tomorrow is the point where we really find out about Dennis Allen. I think that obviously we still need some defensive talent to be "dominant" in the future, but watching the way Allen prepares for a rematch against the Patriots is one of the most interesting by-lines of tomorrow's game.

I'll be watching closely to see if he has any answer for the dual TE threat that killed us last game. Three man rush? Four man rush? Who does Champ cover? How much and how effectively do we blitz?

Tebow is the headline, but Allen's defensive plan and preparation is what I will be watching most.

Bronco Boy
01-13-2012, 07:36 PM
I'm sure Fox has a lot to do with the defensive gameplan too.

Rohirrim
01-13-2012, 07:44 PM
What I'll be looking for is tackling. They're going to get their catches. That's a given. Just don't give up those YACs. If we can win the field position battle, get the rush on Brady, and do an excellent job of tackling, we can come out on top. And no TOs.

rbackfactory80
01-13-2012, 07:47 PM
You have to disrupt their rhythm either by putting Brady on his ass or not giving their receivers free release off the line.

OrangeSe7en
01-13-2012, 07:48 PM
I agree with this. But we're also relying on guys like Doom, Von, and Ayers to get off blocks.

We also need the secondary to be more stable than it was the first time.

Atwater His Ass
01-13-2012, 07:50 PM
Blitzing Brady a lot is a mistake. He torched us on the blitz last time.

Need to get consistent pressure with the d-line.

OrangeSe7en
01-13-2012, 07:55 PM
Blitzing Brady a lot is a mistake. He torched us on the blitz last time.
Need to get consistent pressure with the d-line.

They had massive breakdowns in the secondary in the last game.

Crushaholic
01-13-2012, 08:02 PM
If they are allowed to score at will, we won't win. Defense will be CRUCIAL.

Hamrob
01-13-2012, 08:12 PM
I think I know who Tebow is, I think I know who Fox is, I think I know about Champ, McGahee, Dumervil, et al.

In my eyes, tomorrow is the point where we really find out about Dennis Allen. I think that obviously we still need some defensive talent to be "dominant" in the future, but watching the way Allen prepares for a rematch against the Patriots is one of the most interesting by-lines of tomorrow's game.

I'll be watching closely to see if he has any answer for the dual TE threat that killed us last game. Three man rush? Four man rush? Who does Champ cover? How much and how effectively do we blitz?

Tebow is the headline, but Allen's defensive plan and preparation is what I will be watching most.I agree 100%.

The biggest goal's for Tebow and the offense:

1. Zero Turnover's
2. Find a way to score close to 30 points

However, this game, will be won or lost by our defense. Specifically, whether we can clog the middle of the field. Can our safeties step up big time, or can we disguise our coverages enough to confuse the best QB in the nfl?

Yes, Allen can make even a bigger name for himself in this game.

barryr
01-13-2012, 08:14 PM
I think the defense has to attack and play physical. If they play it safe and drop more in coverage, the Pats just have too many weapons and will get picked apart. They need to get in Brady's face, especially early in the game, and hit him as many times as they can and try to disrupt their timing in the passing game. If they are to give up many yards and points, I would rather they got after them and tried to get heat on Brady than sit back and get picked apart as Brady has all day to get comfortable and throw. I'd rather they be aggressive than be passive on defense.

theAPAOps5
01-13-2012, 08:16 PM
I hope they bring Von Miller up the middle like they did earlier this year. Heck even bring Doom. But Von was successful doing it earlier this year. Pats are good at containing edge pass rush.

Bring the heat up the gut and make Brady scream like girl just like he does when Gisele pulls his hair!

barryr
01-13-2012, 08:18 PM
I hope they bring Von Miller up the middle like they did earlier this year. Heck even bring Doom. But Von was successful doing it earlier this year. Pats are good at containing edge pass rush.

Bring the heat up the gut and make Brady scream like girl just like he does when Gisele pulls his hair!

Or when she uses his eye liner and nail polish.

Bronco Yoda
01-13-2012, 08:19 PM
I'm thinking the key will be to hold them to fewer points than we score. But I could be wrong.

maher_tyler
01-13-2012, 08:37 PM
I think in obvious passing situations Haggen the strong side, Woodyard the weak side Williams in the middle. Up front, Doom and Von on the ends, Ayers and Thomas at DT. Mays was terrible last week and if he has significant play time, i fully expect big plays at his expense! He is a back up MLB at best..i really hope this is addressed in the off season.

Agamemnon
01-13-2012, 08:41 PM
I think in obvious passing situations Haggen the strong side, Woodyard the weak side Williams in the middle. Up front, Doom and Von on the ends, Ayers and Thomas at DT. Mays was terrible last week and if he has significant play time, i fully expect big plays at his expense! He is a back up MLB at best..i really hope this is addressed in the off season.

Why would we use three linebackers in obvious passing situations?

maher_tyler
01-13-2012, 08:44 PM
Why would we use three linebackers in obvious passing situations?

Haha..true..Williams and Woods in the nickle and Williams in the dime..the front 4 remains the same. Mays doesn't make me feel good..liability in coverage and can't tackle.

sinuous sausage
01-13-2012, 08:52 PM
Blitzing Brady a lot is a mistake. He torched us on the blitz last time.

Need to get consistent pressure with the d-line.

If Tom Brady has time to throw (see: rush less than five), he will surpass 400 aerial yards in this game. Bring pressure and hope for turnovers, then let the offense ground out a victory. I have the gameplan...LISTEN TO ME

Vine
01-13-2012, 08:53 PM
I think I know who Tebow is, I think I know who Fox is, I think I know about Champ, McGahee, Dumervil, et al.

In my eyes, tomorrow is the point where we really find out about Dennis Allen. I think that obviously we still need some defensive talent to be "dominant" in the future, but watching the way Allen prepares for a rematch against the Patriots is one of the most interesting by-lines of tomorrow's game.

I'll be watching closely to see if he has any answer for the dual TE threat that killed us last game. Three man rush? Four man rush? Who does Champ cover? How much and how effectively do we blitz?

Tebow is the headline, but Allen's defensive plan and preparation is what I will be watching most.

Good post. I agree about all the issues you stated here. How the stuff plays out in your message will determine whether the Broncos need to score 40 points or 20 points to win.

sinuous sausage
01-13-2012, 08:53 PM
I'm thinking the key will be to hold them to fewer points than we score. But I could be wrong.

no that's right. just don't tell the Chiefs yet

sinuous sausage
01-13-2012, 08:55 PM
I think the defense has to attack and play physical. If they play it safe and drop more in coverage, the Pats just have too many weapons and will get picked apart. They need to get in Brady's face, especially early in the game, and hit him as many times as they can and try to disrupt their timing in the passing game. If they are to give up many yards and points, I would rather they got after them and tried to get heat on Brady than sit back and get picked apart as Brady has all day to get comfortable and throw. I'd rather they be aggressive than be passive on defense.

absolutely

MplsBronco
01-13-2012, 09:32 PM
I just don't want to see guys running free, uncovered, like last time. How do we just not cover either Gronk or Hernandez on several occasions? Once, they catch the ball, tackle soundly. Make them earn it. I think I heard today that over half of these guys' yardage this year has been YAC.

theAPAOps5
01-13-2012, 09:35 PM
One plus is Raheem Moore will not be touching the field unless it is a dire situation. He was extra special horrid against the Pats

sinuous sausage
01-13-2012, 09:37 PM
feels like it's been awhile since Denver has forced a turnover

theAPAOps5
01-13-2012, 09:39 PM
Yeah since last week!

epicSocialism4tw
01-13-2012, 09:49 PM
Good thread.

I believe that Denver went to a dime formation more after the Pats game. Expect to see that tomorrow.

theAPAOps5
01-13-2012, 09:52 PM
Good thread.

I believe that Denver went to a dime formation more after the Pats game. Expect to see that tomorrow.

I expect to see more of the Mock special 2-3-6 (I believe Mock was always screaming for the 2-7-2 though)

Can blitz from all over and it worked last week.

epicSocialism4tw
01-13-2012, 09:54 PM
I expect to see more of the Mock special 2-3-6 (I believe Mock was always screaming for the 2-7-2 though)

Can blitz from all over and it worked last week.

I'll be looking for it.

theAPAOps5
01-13-2012, 09:58 PM
I'll be looking for it.

I didn't notice it until I watched it again. Thought I was seeing things and then they talked about it on local radio so I wasn't just seeing things.

I wonder if they try this to slow down Gronk and Hernandez. Those two are still the scariest part of the game for me.

OrangeSe7en
01-13-2012, 10:13 PM
Well, one thing that Denver should expect is for NE to throw the ball at least twice when down by the goal line. They won't run it twice because they prefer to put the ball in Brady's hand.

At least thats what they do when I watch.

gunns
01-13-2012, 10:26 PM
I think I know who Tebow is, I think I know who Fox is, I think I know about Champ, McGahee, Dumervil, et al.

In my eyes, tomorrow is the point where we really find out about Dennis Allen. I think that obviously we still need some defensive talent to be "dominant" in the future, but watching the way Allen prepares for a rematch against the Patriots is one of the most interesting by-lines of tomorrow's game.

I'll be watching closely to see if he has any answer for the dual TE threat that killed us last game. Three man rush? Four man rush? Who does Champ cover? How much and how effectively do we blitz?

Tebow is the headline, but Allen's defensive plan and preparation is what I will be watching most.

Me too. And hopefully a rush that puts Brady face planted, several times.

eddie mac
01-13-2012, 10:31 PM
I just think Allen and Co need to keep it close and give Tebow a chance late in the game. They couldn't do that first time around albeit the offensive turnovers didn't help that scenario.

cutthemdown
01-13-2012, 10:51 PM
They will probably use Champ to lock down either Welker or Hernandez. Gronk they will do the same as last game, bracket him with a linebacker and a safety, safety and extra dback etc etc. Goodman will take Branch. Harris will be all over helping in zones and even going 1 on 1 with WR sometimes. Maybe even Ocho Cinco. Most likely though Harris takes Welker in those dime and nickel packages.

Whew its a tough offense to stop.

cutthemdown
01-13-2012, 11:02 PM
Well, one thing that Denver should expect is for NE to throw the ball at least twice when down by the goal line. They won't run it twice because they prefer to put the ball in Brady's hand.

At least thats what they do when I watch.

Also though be ready for those quick Brady qb sneaks on 3rd and short. We need to force him to throw those, or give it to the RB.

cutthemdown
01-13-2012, 11:04 PM
Broncos need Joe Mays to realize he just has to fly into the middle of the oline and plug whatever blocker is in the those A gaps. He's too much trying to run around people and it makes him late.

I would like to see him just go 4 it and fly in at full speed. None of this stutter step BS.

If Brady sneaks it, Mays needs to get a helmet in that gap.

Armchair Bronco
01-14-2012, 12:00 AM
I can't see Fox delegating to Allen the way he hands over all creative decision making authority to McCoy.

Word on the street is that Fox tells McCoy before each game: "Look, as long as you run it 94.6% of the time on first down, I'm happy with anything you want to put together. Go for it! Put your unique mark on the game."

ZONA
01-14-2012, 02:17 AM
I honestly believe that if Miller was healthy and didn't have that cast, he would be much more of a factor. So much so that I think it would be enough of a difference that it would affect how we call plays defensively. If he was healthy, you could put that extra defender into pass coverage because he would put pressure on all day long. Allen is going to have to guess right on play calling often for this defense to stay in this.

NE can't run for ****. I'm not even sure I would use Mays all that much. I'd prefer to see Woodyard on the field 80% of the time.

Vegas_Bronco
01-14-2012, 03:32 AM
Brady does too well stepping up in the pocket...

Decisive and immediate pressure up the middle will kill his game. His lateral speed isn't good and he's too fast to get from behind solo we gotta line up in man defense and blitz the middle disrupt his vision lames and make him throw early. This means all the boys in the box gotta be playing their best on each down. Its there for the taking!

cutthemdown
01-14-2012, 03:43 AM
Brady does too well stepping up in the pocket...

Decisive and immediate pressure up the middle will kill his game. His lateral speed isn't good and he's too fast to get from behind solo we gotta line up in man defense and blitz the middle disrupt his vision lames and make him throw early. This means all the boys in the box gotta be playing their best on each down. Its there for the taking!

I agree up the gut is awesome, but..... our 2 best pass rushers are outside pass rush experts IMO so the pressure has to be coming from the edges as well.

We need DJ, Mays, Ayers to be able to get up inside and make some hits. I do like just stick a guy in the a gap and coming balls out right from the start. Maybe make Pats run to the other gap or use the rback to block. But.....sometimes a little delay also works. Depends on how the guys are covering if we could do some delay blitzing. The thing is Brady can get ball off super quick to those TE. One reason for the low sack numbers. He doesn't have to wait for wr to get downfield like when he was throwing to Moss most of the time.

So thats why I think Broncos should use Bailey on the TE some just to force Brady to look outside to the WR some.

Harris will have to man up on a WR in the dime packages and Goodman needs to have a big game on Branch/Welker/Ocho whoever he has to cover on a given play.

Vegas_Bronco
01-14-2012, 03:59 AM
I agree up the gut is awesome, but..... our 2 best pass rushers are outside pass rush experts IMO so the pressure has to be coming from the edges as well.

We need DJ, Mays, Ayers to be able to get up inside and make some hits. I do like just stick a guy in the a gap and coming balls out right from the start. Maybe make Pats run to the other gap or use the rback to block. But.....sometimes a little delay also works. Depends on how the guys are covering if we could do some delay blitzing. The thing is Brady can get ball off super quick to those TE. One reason for the low sack numbers. He doesn't have to wait for wr to get downfield like when he was throwing to Moss most of the time.

So thats why I think Broncos should use Bailey on the TE some just to force Brady to look outside to the WR some.

Harris will have to man up on a WR in the dime packages and Goodman needs to have a big game on Branch/Welker/Ocho whoever he has to cover on a given play.


I am sure they will all see coverage by champ and adjustments will be made. Love the strategy you posted above. Toms 2 and 3 reads can't consistently happen...he can't find a rhythm there or it will be the deathnail. If you disrupt his timing on a consistent basis...you win and qb is frustrated. We gotta do this from all angles as they are well aware we are good on the edge.

What ia fun to see is that most of the comments by posters are geared toward our defense and their offense. I am real curious to see how their defense deals with our offense...It isn't as glamorous and sexy a topic but can't wait to see how the patsies 'attempt' to stop a freight train on wheels.

Atwater His Ass
01-14-2012, 04:05 AM
If Tom Brady has time to throw (see: rush less than five), he will surpass 400 aerial yards in this game. Bring pressure and hope for turnovers, then let the offense ground out a victory. I have the gameplan...LISTEN TO ME

What did you fail to understand that the DL has to bring the heat? Blitz a guy like Brady and he will torch you. You cannot consitently blitz QB's at Brady's level and expect to be successful.

The defense isn't going to "ground out" a victory blitzing most of the time while relying on our depleted secondary to make plays.

Doom and Miller have to show up for this game. Ayers needs to collapse the pocket when he's shifted to DT. Bunkley and Thomas need to have a game.

We have some great outside rush, but Brady is too experienced to fall for it. Someone needs to be pushing up the middle to take away his step up lane for anything to work.

ScottXray
01-14-2012, 09:11 AM
If Tom Brady has time to throw (see: rush less than five), he will surpass 400 aerial yards in this game. Bring pressure and hope for turnovers, then let the offense ground out a victory. I have the gameplan...LISTEN TO ME

No, Brady killed us on 5 man rushes and blitzes last time., Also on 3 man rush we didn't get there.

Key is to rush 4 but vary the package and go up the middle. Only Stunts and delays worked last time, except the one Doom sack ( which was a missed assignment as he came in free). Outside rush gets there too late with Brady. Clog his lanes and get the arms up if not getting there. Blitz only if you want to give up a big play.

Safeties have to play better this time, and the TEs, WR have to get jammed at the line to buy time. Brady will get his passes in, the key is to TACKLE and not give up too many YAC, which is where the secondary really failed last time. Something like 190 of his 340 yards were YAC, especially the two TE's. Eliminate most of that and we are in it.

Offense must grind it out, and wait for the passes to open up. I think we do the Run run, run thing to start, just to set them up. If we are successful running the secondary will start cheating up, then hit them.

No turnovers by Us means we have a good shot.

briane
01-14-2012, 09:17 AM
I think the key to the game is the play of Andre Goodman. Brady has been afraid of Bailey since the 99 yd pick. He will look goodmans way all night. Heres to hoping Goodman having a great game. (fingers crossed)

Shananahan
01-14-2012, 09:18 AM
Bunkley and Thomas need to have a game.
I think they're each going to have to play four or five games worth tonight in order for us to win.

ND Bronco Fan
01-14-2012, 09:20 AM
If Brady sneaks it, Mays needs to get a helmet in that gap.

Were you referring to Brady's vagina "gap".........

OrangeSe7en
01-14-2012, 09:21 AM
No, Brady killed us on 5 man rushes and blitzes last time., Also on 3 man rush we didn't get there.
Key is to rush 4 but vary the package and go up the middle. Only Stunts and delays worked last time, except the one Doom sack ( which was a missed assignment as he came in free). Outside rush gets there too late with Brady. Clog his lanes and get the arms up if not getting there. Blitz only if you want to give up a big play.

Safeties have to play better this time, and the TEs, WR have to get jammed at the line to buy time. Brady will get his passes in, the key is to TACKLE and not give up too many YAC, which is where the secondary really failed last time. Something like 190 of his 340 yards were YAC, especially the two TE's. Eliminate most of that and we are in it.

Offense must grind it out, and wait for the passes to open up. I think we do the Run run, run thing to start, just to set them up. If we are successful running the secondary will start cheating up, then hit them.

No turnovers by Us means we have a good shot.

A lot of that was breakdowns in the secondary. This was the first game where Denver was without Dawkins and the secondary was on its heels all game. If the secondary doesn't have so many breakdowns, this dynamic changes somewhat. In other words, this is a relevant point if you think Denver will have as many break downs on defense. I'm not saying it won't happen but I don't think it's likely going to be as bad.

sinuous sausage
01-14-2012, 09:50 AM
What did you fail to understand that the DL has to bring the heat? Blitz a guy like Brady and he will torch you. You cannot consitently blitz QB's at Brady's level and expect to be successful.

The defense isn't going to "ground out" a victory blitzing most of the time while relying on our depleted secondary to make plays.

Doom and Miller have to show up for this game. Ayers needs to collapse the pocket when he's shifted to DT. Bunkley and Thomas need to have a game.

We have some great outside rush, but Brady is too experienced to fall for it. Someone needs to be pushing up the middle to take away his step up lane for anything to work.

I'm taking for granted the fact a simple four man rush involving Doom, Bunkley, Thomas, and Ayers won't be enough to rattle a great QB like Tom Brady. It sounds like you've also noticed our depleted secondary, of which I would hate to ask to cover NE's receivers for more than four seconds. Your inclusion of Von in the pass-rush seems to indicate you favor bringing pressure from the LB position (at least five pass-rushers), so it sounds like we're in accord. The blitz has to get there and the secondary has to play just better-than-average: Good things will happen, or at least better things than allowing Tom Brady to adjust his tutu, comb his Bieber locks, and find a wide open Hernandez due to some cornerback not being able to cover him for half a minute.

sinuous sausage
01-14-2012, 09:58 AM
No, Brady killed us on 5 man rushes and blitzes last time., Also on 3 man rush we didn't get there.

Key is to rush 4 but vary the package and go up the middle. Only Stunts and delays worked last time, except the one Doom sack ( which was a missed assignment as he came in free). Outside rush gets there too late with Brady. Clog his lanes and get the arms up if not getting there. Blitz only if you want to give up a big play.

Safeties have to play better this time, and the TEs, WR have to get jammed at the line to buy time. Brady will get his passes in, the key is to TACKLE and not give up too many YAC, which is where the secondary really failed last time. Something like 190 of his 340 yards were YAC, especially the two TE's. Eliminate most of that and we are in it.

Offense must grind it out, and wait for the passes to open up. I think we do the Run run, run thing to start, just to set them up. If we are successful running the secondary will start cheating up, then hit them.

No turnovers by Us means we have a good shot.

See, I think the corners and safeties will give us roughly the same performance (blitz or no blitz) in terms of yardage and completions simply due to the fact they're a) not that good and b) Tom Brady is that good. It would be nice to have excellent corners who forced coverage sacks, but that's not our shtick. We do have excellent pass rushers who can force sacks and incompletions, if not TOs, so methinks it's more auspicious to use the services of Von and DJ in bringing pressure than in hoping for Goodman and Harris to cover arguably the best receiving corps in the league.

ScottXray
01-14-2012, 10:23 AM
See, I think the corners and safeties will give us roughly the same performance (blitz or no blitz) in terms of yardage and completions simply due to the fact they're a) not that good and b) Tom Brady is that good. It would be nice to have excellent corners who forced coverage sacks, but that's not our shtick. We do have excellent pass rushers who can force sacks and incompletions, if not TOs, so methinks it's more auspicious to use the services of Von and DJ in bringing pressure than in hoping for Goodman and Harris to cover arguably the best receiving corps in the league.

I'm thinking we will use the 6 pack dime package mostly on pass downs. Therefore the 4 man rush leaves 1 other LB . 4 Cb, 2 safeties, 3 man line and DJ and Miller , Haggan subbing. We'll have to watch for RB out of backfield or on screens, draws.

Although our young secondary players played poorly the first game , I think they will do better this time out as they have 4 games without Dawk now and are doing better communicating. Actually Goodman has been playing better than his rep lately , and Champ is still very good.

Pass rush WILL be key, as welll as YAC. Hopefully Ayers Doom, Miller , Bunkley can bring it up the middle and disrupt Bradys timing enough to cut his completions down. He is going to get yardage, but YAC must be limited, so the six DBs are smart.

orinjkrush
01-14-2012, 10:50 AM
if mcdaniels has any influence, it will be bubble screen all day. hope he gets nailed on the sidelines.

otherwise brady will 3 step drop, throw on timing to the middle of the field attacking Mays and our safeties.

we must get the a gaps overloaded and pressure upfront forcing brady to scramble. make him have to play like tebow.

our youngsters will have to play lights out.

Br0nc0Buster
01-14-2012, 01:33 PM
Eh our only chance is if our Dline plays out of their mind and our secondary tackles when Brady hits his wideouts

I think 4 and 5 man rushes should be the way to go
no more 3 man rushes, those dont work

blitzing too much also could result in some big plays on our defense

4-5 man rushes and hope Ayers, Doom, Miller, etc... can get there

You can beat Brady with the blitz, Steelers did

But you need a reliable secondary to limit the YAC, which we dont really have outside of Champ

uplink
01-14-2012, 09:25 PM
Allen had 3 chances to scheme a plan to stop an ultra elite QB: Brady twice, Rodgers once. He completely failed all three times. He needs to get better if the broncos are to win in the playoffs in the years to come.

Agamemnon
01-14-2012, 10:01 PM
Allen had 3 chances to scheme a plan to stop an ultra elite QB: Brady twice, Rodgers once. He completely failed all three times. He needs to get better if the broncos are to win in the playoffs in the years to come.

Don't forget Stafford. And really, he didn't need to stop them. He just needed to slow them down. And even at that he failed utterly.

barryr
01-14-2012, 10:03 PM
I just don't understand how you use the same game plan when it doesn't work against the really good passing teams and you do it again in the playoffs. Common sense is not allowed in the NFL?

Agamemnon
01-14-2012, 10:14 PM
I just don't understand how you use the same game plan when it doesn't work against the really good passing teams and you do it again in the playoffs. Common sense is not allowed in the NFL?

In the NFL? Sure.

By the Broncos coaching staff? Apparently not.

The Joker
01-15-2012, 01:34 AM
Allen's done as well as could reasonably have been expected IMO.

We just don't have anywhere near enough talent at DB to stop elite passing offenses at present though.

I'm hoping we can snag one of the top FA CB's to start opposite Bailey next year, then draft another CB with one of our early selections to groom as a long term replacement for Champ.

I don't feel comfortable with the idea of drafting a CB to be a starter, and I really don't want Goodman starting again next year. So we need to find one in free agency, if we're going to spend big bucks anywhere it should be on getting the best CB available.

We need a safety too. Dawkins sounds like he's done, leaving us with Bruton, Moore and Carter. Carter looks the most likely to be a good player from what we've seen thus far, but we don't know if any of them will turn out OK.

We need to sign at least one solid vet this year.

Do that and I think we'll see Allen do much better against the top passing teams.