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Peoples Champ
11-28-2011, 09:56 AM
Defense is the reason that all of the Tebow haters on espn (hodge/dilfer and others) are using as the reason of our 5-1 record with the Timmy Badger.

I love how our D is playing and they have been lights out. Von Miller will be my next jersey because the dude is a BEAST.

However, Tebow is playing with the same Defense that Kyle Orton had when we were 1-4. When we got gashed for around 150 yards by Mcfadden. The same D that gave up 20 plus points to Cincy and San diego in game 1.


Tebow's intangibles and leadership has given the Broncos Defense a reason to believe. Part of being QB is motivating, and getting the team to believe in you and play for you. Thats why when Elway won the superbowl, they said "this ones for John". Because everyone wanted to win for John, and I think Tebow has a little of that in him. Tebow has stuck his neck out for the team, now they are laying it on the line for him and the rest of the team. WE HAVE A REAL TEAM NOW.

bronco militia
11-28-2011, 09:57 AM
Its not like all of the sudden our Defense is getting injured players back and healthy.

what

Peoples Champ
11-28-2011, 09:59 AM
Defense is the reason that all of the Tebow haters on espn (hodge/dilfer and others) are using as the reason of our 5-1 record with the Timmy Badger.

I love how our D is playing and they have been lights out. Von Miller will be my next jersey because the dude is a BEAST.

However, Tebow is playing with the same Defense that Kyle Orton had when we were 1-4. When we got gashed for around 150 yards by Mcfadden. The same D that gave up 20 plus points to Cincy and San diego in game 1.

Its not like all of the sudden our Defense is getting injured players back and healthy. Why are all the sudden they are playing lights out? What am I missing?

Tebow's intangibles and leadership has given the Broncos Defense a reason to believe. Part of being QB is motivating, and getting the team to believe in you and play for you. Thats why when Elway won the superbowl, they said "this ones for John". Because everyone wanted to win for John, and I think Tebow has a little of that in him.

the team knows that Tebow would stick his neck on the line for anyone on the team, and they are doing the same for him.

Peoples Champ
11-28-2011, 10:00 AM
Its not like all of the sudden our Defense is getting injured players back and healthy.

what


Meaning when we were 1-4 we were missing dumervill or miller or dawkins, and now they are back and we are 5-1. We have had those guys this whole time. Minus champ in one game, was it miami?

Dedhed
11-28-2011, 10:01 AM
It's simply the latest in a long line of refusing to give Tebow credit for what he is.

The same people who were blaming the defense for losses while Kyle Orton was the QB are now crediting them for winning games in spite of the QB. It's the most absurd logic I have seen to date.

What an amazing coincidence that the defense just happened to gel right when Tebow got the starting job.

Agamemnon
11-28-2011, 10:01 AM
A lot can be said for the fact that Tebow isn't turning the ball over and Orton was constantly. That's huge. Oh and he actually makes plays in clutch situations while Orton is allergic to clutch situations.

bfoflcommish
11-28-2011, 10:02 AM
not too mention finally comfortable under yet another d coordinator

bowtown
11-28-2011, 10:03 AM
Meaning when we were 1-4 we were missing dumervill or miller or dawkins, and now they are back and we are 5-1. We have had those guys this whole time. Minus champ in one game, was it miami?

I think you might want to recheck your facts.

Inkana7
11-28-2011, 10:03 AM
Meaning when we were 1-4 we were missing dumervill or miller or dawkins, and now they are back and we are 5-1. We have had those guys this whole time. Minus champ in one game, was it miami?

Champ missed 3 games and Dumervil was hurt for the first half of the season. I think DJ missed some time too.

bronco militia
11-28-2011, 10:05 AM
anyone that fails recognize the defense's improvement is probably too far up Tebows ass to notice.

that being said, this team has played better ever since Orton was benched

lolcopter
11-28-2011, 10:08 AM
Dilfer actually gave tebow a bunch of credit post game and says he loves what he's seeing because he's a huge fan of team football (iknowright)

WolfpackGuy
11-28-2011, 10:09 AM
Tebow isn't turning it over like the ball is on fire, and it's keeping the defense out of bad situations for the most part.

Biggest difference I've seen in the last 6 games.

Agamemnon
11-28-2011, 10:11 AM
anyone that fails recognize the defense's improvement is probably too far up Tebows ass to notice.

that being said, this team has played better ever since Orton was benched

I just don't understand why so many insist on it being one or the other. The defense has clearly improved since Tebow became our starter, and Tebow has made some incredibly clutch plays, avoided turnovers, and super-charged what was a mediocre run game. This either/or crap is idiotic.

lolcopter
11-28-2011, 10:15 AM
Orton loses winnable games, Tebow wins winnable games

Defense now has hope

/thread

Chris
11-28-2011, 10:18 AM
It's simply the latest in a long line of refusing to give Tebow credit for what he is.

The same people who were blaming the defense for losses while Kyle Orton was the QB are now crediting them for winning games in spite of the QB. It's the most absurd logic I have seen to date.

What an amazing coincidence that the defense just happened to gel right when Tebow got the starting job.

This is what channels can do when they're on 24 hours a day. There's been so much crap thrown at viewers between then and now that they can pretend they never said these things.

There is no accountability in TV sports journalism.

bronco militia
11-28-2011, 10:20 AM
I just don't understand why so many insist on it being one or the other. .

yeah, I don't get it either. The rotating door for coaches and QB's the last 13 years probably doesn't help.

Peoples Champ
11-28-2011, 10:23 AM
I think you might want to recheck your facts.


I may be wrong. Who on D has come back for this 5-1 stretch that was out when we were 1-4?

Peoples Champ
11-28-2011, 10:25 AM
Tebow isn't turning it over like the ball is on fire, and it's keeping the defense out of bad situations for the most part.

Biggest difference I've seen in the last 6 games.

Biggest difference i have seen is the passion and the enthusiasm the Defense is finally playing with. They look hungry. Big difference from when Orton was in there.

TheReverend
11-28-2011, 10:25 AM
Defense is the reason that all of the Tebow haters on espn (hodge/dilfer and others) are using as the reason of our 5-1 record with the Timmy Badger.

I love how our D is playing and they have been lights out. Von Miller will be my next jersey because the dude is a BEAST.

However, Tebow is playing with the same Defense that Kyle Orton had when we were 1-4. When we got gashed for around 150 yards by Mcfadden. The same D that gave up 20 plus points to Cincy and San diego in game 1.

Its not like all of the sudden our Defense is getting injured players back and healthy. We have had almost full health the whole season. Why are all the sudden they are playing lights out? What am I missing?

Tebow's intangibles and leadership has given the Broncos Defense a reason to believe. Part of being QB is motivating, and getting the team to believe in you and play for you. Thats why when Elway won the superbowl, they said "this ones for John". Because everyone wanted to win for John, and I think Tebow has a little of that in him.

Elvis missed a few games early on.

So did Marcus Thomas.

So did DJ Williams.

Miller keeps getting better every week.

Carter has taken over at S and is also getting better every week.

We found Harris at nickle CB.

Offensively, we've cut WAY down on turnovers from the QB position and our TOP is dramatically improved.

And yes, on top that they do seem to play harder for Tim (Champ has specifically mentioned this)

lolcopter
11-28-2011, 10:25 AM
I may be wrong. Who on D has come back for this 5-1 stretch that was out when we were 1-4?

Doom wasn't fully recovered yet, plus the emergence of Chris Harris has helped. DJ also missed awhile with the elbow injury

bronco militia
11-28-2011, 10:25 AM
off the top of my head, DJ Willams, Marcus Thomas, Champ Bailey all missed some time

bronco militia
11-28-2011, 10:26 AM
http://www.denverbroncos.com/team/injury-report.html

click on each week

Chris
11-28-2011, 10:26 AM
I may be wrong. Who on D has come back for this 5-1 stretch that was out when we were 1-4?

Marcus Thomas has come back. Dumervil has gotten healthy.

Peoples Champ
11-28-2011, 10:28 AM
Marcus Thomas has come back. Dumervil has gotten healthy.



Ok,

I was wrong,

So nobody thinks our Defense is visibly playing with more intensity since Tebow has started?

lolcopter
11-28-2011, 10:29 AM
Ok,

I was wrong,

So nobody thinks our Defense is visibly playing with more intensity since Tebow has started?

They always have, going back to last year

Bunkley and the guys love Teebs

Peoples Champ
11-28-2011, 10:30 AM
They always have, going back to last year

Bunkley and the guys love Teebs


I thought last year our Defense was 32 in the league?

lolcopter
11-28-2011, 10:32 AM
I thought last year our Defense was 32 in the league?

I was talking more about how fired up they were the last few games, more specifically after the game winning TD against the texans

Agamemnon
11-28-2011, 10:32 AM
So nobody thinks our Defense is visibly playing with more intensity since Tebow has started?

Anybody who argues otherwise is an imbecile. Period.

TonyR
11-28-2011, 10:33 AM
Elvis missed a few games early on.

So did Marcus Thomas.

So did DJ Williams.

Miller keeps getting better every week.

Carter has taken over at S and is also getting better every week.

We found Harris at nickle CB.

Offensively, we've cut WAY down on turnovers from the QB position and our TOP is dramatically improved.

And yes, on top that they do seem to play harder for Tim (Champ has specifically mentioned this)

/ thread

BroncoMan4ever
11-28-2011, 10:38 AM
our defense has gotten healthier. the fact that Doom is again injury free has directly coincided with Miller hitting his stride and taking his game to a new level the last few weeks. i am sorry, but if Doom were not back to 100% this defense doesn't look as good as it has, and Miller doesn't look as incredible as he has over the last few weeks.

also, consider that this defense has been learning on the fly. entirely new regime and scheme for the defense and the fact that there was very little practice time with it can lead to disappointing results, but get better over time.

right now, i say this team should focus on getting more talent on the defensive side of the ball, and a few more RBs in the offseason and forget the QB talk for 2012. is Tebow the QBOTF for this franchise...i don't know yet, but he has at least earned the right to try and build upon this season in 2012. considering we have no shot at Luck and all the other QBs are basically the standard every year QB crop coming out of college, we should wait a year to draft one if it is necessary.

also, this team needs to give a new contract to Bunkley. dude has been playing some damn good football and is showing why he was a 1st round pick years ago.

Broncbow
11-28-2011, 10:40 AM
Miller had more sacks in the first 5 games than he did in the following 5.

When your QB has time to read a tolstoy novel behind his offensive line, and the coach has the audacity to run only 3 passing plays in 3 drives of OT, it speaks volumes as to why someone would assume its the defense and not Tebow.

Fox absolutely refusing to allow Tebow to take the glory off the field with the passing game is the reason why Tebow so many have written him off as being the pivitol point, depite the wins hinging on him.

Fox only allows Tebow to strut his stuff as a last resort ploy. 18 passing attempts per game average when we are behind compared to
1 passing attempt when we are ahead?

Do you really have to be a rocket scientist to see the conspiracy to shut down Tebow that is in play here?

enjolras
11-28-2011, 10:42 AM
Ok,

I was wrong,

So nobody thinks our Defense is visibly playing with more intensity since Tebow has started?

I don't place much stock on Tebow's "intangibles" suddenly willing the defense to be better, if that is what your asking...

It's already been mentioned. The offense isn't turning the ball over. They're taking time off the clock and their overall time spent on the field is a lot longer.

For instance: a 3-and-out for a running team is actually a very different than a 3-and-out for a passing team. The passing team runs three plays and takes 25 seconds off the clock. They punt and play continues really quickly. In the NFL the running Team runs three plays and takes 2 minutes (or more) off the clock which typically gets you to the next TV timeout. That buys another 3-5 minutes of "real" time that the defense gets to rest.

The offense rarely goes backwards, which means that the field position battle is much better for the Broncos (less so this week I'd imagine, however). Colquitt (who might be this teams MVP) consistently pins our opponents deep which gives the defense plenty of opportunities to stop them.

Previously the offense had far to many negative possessions and turnovers which consistently left the defense in short fields.

The rest of the defense has come in and developed well. Bunkley, Carter, Thomas, and McBean (in particular) are playing at a MUCH higher level than when the year started.

That said, I do think Tebow brings a belief to the team as a whole. They fight and claw until the final whistle. Nobody on the team has the luxury of pulling against the team (they all saw what happened to Lloyd) and what they are trying to accomplish. That is huge, and full credit goes to Tebow for energizing this team when he was inserted into the lineup.

I think at this point, it's bigger than him. The whole organization has learned how to win, and that's a really big thing.

Peoples Champ
11-28-2011, 10:42 AM
I was talking more about how fired up they were the last few games, more specifically after the game winning TD against the texans


oh ya for sure, when Tebow went in last year I saw intensity from our Defense I hadnt seen in years.

Peoples Champ
11-28-2011, 10:43 AM
Anybody who argues otherwise is an imbecile. Period.

my point, thanks bud!

Peoples Champ
11-28-2011, 10:46 AM
Elvis missed a few games early on.

So did Marcus Thomas.

So did DJ Williams.

Miller keeps getting better every week.

Carter has taken over at S and is also getting better every week.

We found Harris at nickle CB.

Offensively, we've cut WAY down on turnovers from the QB position and our TOP is dramatically improved.

And yes, on top that they do seem to play harder for Tim (Champ has specifically mentioned this)


You cleaned up my point i was trying to make. Sorry that I was sloppy and didnt check the injuries, i was more going by the eye test and it looks like we are playing with more intensity vs when orton was in there.

Broncbow
11-28-2011, 10:48 AM
Elvis missed a few games early on.

So did Marcus Thomas.

So did DJ Williams.

Tebow lost Brandon Lloyd and Knowshon Moreno

Shotgun Willie
11-28-2011, 10:48 AM
Tebow lost Brandon Lloyd and Knowshon Moreno

wrong thread

bronco militia
11-28-2011, 10:49 AM
I'm sure the lockout didn't help with implementing a new system. There are far less breakdowns in coverage and players seem to be ready for just about anything.

bronco militia
11-28-2011, 10:50 AM
is it a really a loss when Moreno goes on IR?

;D

lolcopter
11-28-2011, 10:50 AM
Tebow lost Brandon Lloyd and Knowshon Moreno

Lloyd hurts, gaffney too... But knowshon is practically addition by subtraction (unless it's his pass catching ability out of the backfield)

Broncbow
11-28-2011, 10:50 AM
wrong thread

Not if we are talking about who should be getting credit.

Agamemnon
11-28-2011, 10:51 AM
Lloyd hurts, gaffney too... But knowshon is practically addition by subtraction (unless it's his pass catching ability out of the backfield)

It'd actually be nice to have Moreno out there for Tebow to throw to honestly.

iforgotmypassword
11-28-2011, 10:53 AM
how about the very obvious fact that Tebow moves the chains... we run the piss out of the ball and the clock runs. How many less possessions is our defense playing a game?

Peoples Champ
11-28-2011, 10:54 AM
my only concern is: can the Defense continue to play with this intensity forever? I frickin hope so. How long will it last? Can we build the Defense even better in the draft next year and win with Defense and a run game and no passing attack? Can we do it Baltimore Ravens style?

Only time will tell

Peoples Champ
11-28-2011, 10:55 AM
how about the very obvious fact that Tebow moves the chains... we run the piss out of the ball and the clock runs. How many less possessions is our defense playing a game?


exactly, more ammo against the tebow haters on ESPN.

Merryl hodges comment at beginning of year :

“Orton or Tebow? It’s embarrassing to think the Broncos could win with Tebow!!”

bronco militia
11-28-2011, 10:56 AM
how about the very obvious fact that Tebow moves the chains... we run the piss out of the ball and the clock runs. How many less possessions is our defense playing a game?

consider the Broncos offense is only converting around 30% on their third downs, probably not as much as you think.

Agamemnon
11-28-2011, 10:58 AM
my only concern is: can the Defense continue to play with this intensity forever? I frickin hope so. How long will it last? Can we build the Defense even better in the draft next year and win with Defense and a run game and no passing attack? Can we do it Baltimore Ravens style?

Only time will tell

The intensity they are playing with now is what is needed to be an elite defense, no matter how talented you are. So hopefully they can sustain it indefinitely.

As far as the no passing attack thing goes, that's just silly. Tebow's improving weekly and usually looks okay to good when they let him off the leash. There's no reason to think that the style of offense we are running now is what we will always run with Tebow. Then again we are talking about Fox and McCoy so...

TonyR
11-28-2011, 10:59 AM
consider the Broncos offense is only converting around 30% on their third downs, probably not as much as you think.

Yup, the last two games the offense hasn't exactly been keeping the defense off the field. But the myth perpetuates unabated...

Broncbow
11-28-2011, 11:00 AM
is it a really a loss when Moreno goes on IR?

;D

Moreno only managed 26 of his 179 rushing yards with Orton. Moreno was playing 7 times better with Tebow.:notworthy

lolcopter
11-28-2011, 11:00 AM
consider the Broncos offense is only converting around 30% on their third downs, probably not as much as you think.

They're also getting many first downs on 1st and 2nd down with the emergence of mcgahee and the zone read. Sure, third down % needs to get better, but when running game moves the chains in two plays that is worlds better than three passing incompletions then punt. Hell even run run run punt is better

For instance, in our opening drive against the jets didn't we only have one third down despite driving down the entire field and failing to convert on 4th

Either way, 3rd down % isn't a THE BEST indicator of Offensive efficiency

Pick Six
11-28-2011, 11:01 AM
my only concern is: can the Defense continue to play with this intensity forever? I frickin hope so. How long will it last? Can we build the Defense even better in the draft next year and win with Defense and a run game and no passing attack? Can we do it Baltimore Ravens style?

Only time will tell

I actually sense that the Von Doom combination hasn't YET seen its best days. They are getting quite the chemistry going...:thumbsup:

Paladin
11-28-2011, 11:04 AM
.

However, Tebow is playing with the same Defense that Kyle Orton had when we were 1-4.

I do not believe this is true. The D had to learn the new schemes, and several players were injured. Also, the Olinemen were learning new plays. I believe the TEAM is growing together, and the D especially is pulling together. TEBOW does not play D. T is a lousy passing QB still, and the D is having to work extra hard to stay in the games.

That is not to say that I am a TEBOW hater because I am not; I am a Broncos' fan. But I do have some reservations as to TT's passing skills to get more than the 13 ppg needed to beat some of teh better teams in the league. Time will tell.....

Peoples Champ
11-28-2011, 11:06 AM
The intensity they are playing with now is what is needed to be an elite defense, no matter how talented you are. So hopefully they can sustain it indefinitely.

As far as the no passing attack thing goes, that's just silly. Tebow's improving weekly and usually looks okay to good when they let him off the leash. There's no reason to think that the style of offense we are running now is what we will always run with Tebow. Then again we are talking about Fox and McCoy so...


I agree, tebow is improving passing. His accuracy was crazy good yesterday. The incompletions were mostly dropped balls in the hands of the receivers.

There were a few times yesterday on 3rd down they put the leash on tebow and ran the option or a QB draw when I knew tebow coulda throw for a 1st down. I hope they let him throw a little more in the future.

Peoples Champ
11-28-2011, 11:08 AM
I do not believe this is true. The D had to learn the new schemes, and several players were injured. Also, the Olinemen were learning new plays. I believe the TEAM is growing together, and the D especially is pulling together. TEBOW does not play D. T is a lousy passing QB still, and the D is having to work extra hard to stay in the games.

That is not to say that I am a TEBOW hater because I am not; I am a Broncos' fan. But I do have some reservations as to TT's passing skills to get more than the 13 ppg needed to beat some of teh better teams in the league. Time will tell.....

ya you have a good point, however champ did say they are playing harder with Tebow in there.

Peoples Champ
11-28-2011, 11:08 AM
I actually sense that the Von Doom combination hasn't YET seen its best days. They are getting quite the chemistry going...:thumbsup:

helz ya

Dedhed
11-28-2011, 11:12 AM
Ok,

I was wrong,

So nobody thinks our Defense is visibly playing with more intensity since Tebow has started?

It's pretty plain to see if you're willing to look. It's no coincidence that the defense happened to gel at the same time Tebow took over the starting job.

Broncbow
11-28-2011, 11:13 AM
Yup, the last two games the offense hasn't exactly been keeping the defense off the field. But the myth perpetuates unabated...

First it was Orton Tebow debate, now its defense verses Tebow. When tebows own coach has Tebows hands tied regarding the passing game, until he unties them to bring the team back from behind to then time them back up again, is that really an indictment on Tebow production wise? Really?

In all actuallity Tebows production is relegated to how the defense performs.

The fact Tebow is keeping up with what the defense allows the opponent to score, speaks volumes in regards to the impact his presence makes, Orton ceartainly could not keep up, not only that He was putting the team in deficits with his turnovers.

Again Tebow is the pivot point from which the winning success has swung. it is what it is.

Agamemnon
11-28-2011, 11:17 AM
First it was Orton Tebow debate, now its defense verses Tebow. When tebows own coach has Tebows hands tied regarding the passing game, until he unties them to bring the team back from behind to them time them back up again, is that really an indictment on Tebow production wise? Really?

You have a point. One that I've made a few times myself. But let's not pretend Tebow hasn't struggled at times.

Peoples Champ
11-28-2011, 11:26 AM
Again Tebow is the pivot point from which the winning success has swung. it is what it is.



Correct,

We just need to let the guys on espn know this because they say we should be embarrassed to think we can win with Tebow at QB.

Smilin Assassin
11-28-2011, 11:26 AM
It's not handball, it's a team sport.

Bottom line is the entire team has stepped up.

Defense, Offense, Special teams.

The difference is that instead of a QB that folds when the game's on the line, we have a playmaker.

Peoples Champ
11-28-2011, 11:27 AM
You have a point. One that I've made a few times myself. But let's not pretend Tebow hasn't struggled at times.


He has struggled a lot actually, but his motivation to correct his mistakes and hold himself accountable has gotten the respect of the team. Which is causing the team to buy into itself and win as a Team. This is a team sport lets remember.

Broncbow
11-28-2011, 11:39 AM
You have a point. One that I've made a few times myself. But let's not pretend Tebow hasn't struggled at times.

What do you expect from the scheme and the fact Tebow has had only what 2 months to play with the starters? Young receivers with butterfingers at that.

Defense has struggled too.

Allowing 24 points in the first half of the Detroit game, not to mention allowing Stafford to possess his best QB rating of the season?

Defense allowed 284 yards passing average in half of the games Tebow has started. 7 TD's passing alone in those games.


Thing is they have allowed nearly half those yards and TD's in the other half of the games.

With Tom Brady on the horizon passing defense needs to step it up. There ceartainlyy is room for improvement with the defense as well as Tebow, my Beef is with the scheme not allowing Tebow to be all he can be I the passing game, while being relegated to what the defense is doing.

Peoples Champ
11-28-2011, 11:44 AM
What do you expect from the scheme and the fact Tebow has had only what 2 months to play with the starters? Young receivers with butterfingers at that.

Defense has struggled too.

Allowing 24 points in the first half of the Detroit game, not to mention allowing Stafford to possess his best QB rating of the season?

Defense allowed 284 yards passing average in half of the games Tebow has started. 7 TD's passing alone in those games.


Thing is they have allowed nearly half those yards and TD's in the other half of the games.

With Tom Brady on the horizon passing defense needs to step it up. There ceartainlyy is room for improvement with the defense as well as Tebow, my Beef is with the scheme not allowing Tebow to be all he can be I the passing game, while being relegated to what the defense is doing.


I think we stepped up huge yesterday, but yes we will have to step it up for brady.

It seemed like all of Rivers completions were against great coverage, just great passes that were barely gotten off before the rush.

Brady will do this too, but just keep applying the pressure we have been and there is a good chance we can contain him, not stop him.

Broncbow
11-28-2011, 11:47 AM
The difference is that instead of a QB that folds when the game's on the line, we have a playmaker.

That is indeed the biggest difference, fact that the defense is playing better may have more to do with the continuity resulting from more playing time in the system than with Tebows influence, does that really matter?

Fact that Tebow is influencing the defense to play better, and is in fact the playmaker that has been the difference between losing and winning should remove all doubt as to what Time it is.

What time is it? Tebow Time~!!

Play2win
11-28-2011, 11:50 AM
Tebow is a nice game manager and the defense is playing lights out. Actually, Tebow is effectively playing a pretty good Trent Dilfer.

Peoples Champ
11-28-2011, 11:52 AM
That is indeed the biggest difference, fact that the defense is playing better may have more to do with the continuity resulting from more playing time in the system than with Tebows influence, does that really matter?

Fact that Tebow is influencing the defense to play better, and is in fact the playmaker that has been the difference between losing and winning should remove all doubt as to what Time it is.

What time is it? Tebow Time~!!


Good point, the more rest they are getting is enabling them to play with higher intensity. But this is the first time in a long time that I have seen the Denver broncos have this intensity with their Defense. I am actually excited to watch them now instead of expecting to get ran all over on sundays.

Tebow is not the sole reason, but I do think he has some small reason to do with it, which shows the ESPN tebow haters that we can win with Tebow.

Agamemnon
11-28-2011, 11:52 AM
What do you expect from the scheme and the fact Tebow has had only what 2 months to play with the starters? Young receivers with butterfingers at that.

Defense has struggled too.

Allowing 24 points in the first half of the Detroit game, not to mention allowing Stafford to possess his best QB rating of the season?

Defense allowed 284 yards passing average in half of the games Tebow has started. 7 TD's passing alone in those games.


Thing is they have allowed nearly half those yards and TD's in the other half of the games.

With Tom Brady on the horizon passing defense needs to step it up. There ceartainlyy is room for improvement with the defense as well as Tebow, my Beef is with the scheme not allowing Tebow to be all he can be I the passing game, while being relegated to what the defense is doing.

I expect Tebow to have struggles like every other young developing QB, and I agree that the scheme hasn't been helping him. But in the end I'm not one of the people who think all of Tebow's issues are other peoples' fault. The thing is that that is okay. I believe in the guy completely, but he has a lot to improve on at the same time. That's part of the deal with every QB trying to make it in the NFL, doubly so with one who played in a college offense that is so far removed from what is considered "pro style".

Seriously dude you need to reign in the worship of the guy. Acknowledge that he's human. Believe in him, root for him (which is what I do), but don't ****ing worship him. That turns people off like nothing else around here. Hopefully the coaches start calling a gameplan that is more friendly to his passing style, and at the same time hopefully Tebow can get better with what the are asking him to do, even if it is far from ideal. Overcoming adversity is a huge thing in sports, and that's what Tebow is facing right now with the current offensive philosophy. He needs to overcome it (we started seeing him do just that this last game by the way).

Agamemnon
11-28-2011, 11:56 AM
Tebow is a nice game manager and the defense is playing lights out. Actually, Tebow is effectively playing a pretty good Trent Dilfer.

Trent Dilfer was a dominant runner? I must've missed that...

LetsGoBroncos
11-28-2011, 11:59 AM
the team knows that Tebow would stick his neck on the line for anyone on the team, and they are doing the same for him.

Exactly. Everyone's level of play has risen

Dedhed
11-28-2011, 12:01 PM
I expect Tebow to have struggles like every other young developing QB, and I agree that the scheme hasn't been helping him. But in the end I'm not one of the people who think all of Tebow's issues are other peoples' fault. The thing is that that is okay.

This is the crux of the issue surrounding Tebow and where the "haters" and the "boners" out themselves every time.

For the "Haters" any struggle is a sure sign that he can't be successful in the NFL.

For the "Boners" any struggle is a laid at the feet of someone else.

"Haters" can't view his struggles in the light of a realistic growth curve. "Boners" can't admit to any struggles.

Agamemnon
11-28-2011, 12:05 PM
This is the crux of the issue surrounding Tebow and where the "haters" and the "boners" out themselves every time.

For the "Haters" any struggle is a sure sign that he can't be successful in the NFL.

For the "Boners" any struggle is a laid at the feet of someone else.

"Haters" can't view his struggles in the light of a realistic growth curve. "Boners" can't admit to any struggles.

It's like monkeys hurling feces at each other really...

Broncbow
11-28-2011, 12:35 PM
Seriously dude you need to reign in the worship of the guy. Acknowledge that he's human.

My bad. The pass that hit Royal on the numbers was about a half an inch over to the right from the center of his chest. The pass that bounced off of Rosarios numbers was an inch to the left off from center of the numbers. The 170 foot pass to Decker was one foot too high. The spin move Tebow made should have been to the left rather than right he would have not only made the inteded Tackler miss, but the one behind him as well. Is that better?;D

Rohirrim
11-28-2011, 12:39 PM
The Timmy Badger. I like that. :thumbs:

Inkana7
11-28-2011, 12:42 PM
My bad. The pass that hit Royal on the numbers was about a half an inch over to the right from the center of his chest. The pass that bounced off of Rosarios numbers was an inch to the left off from center of the numbers. The 170 foot pass to Decker was one foot too high. The spin move Tebow made should have been to the left rather than right he would have not only made the inteded Tackler miss, but the one behind him as well. Is that better?;D

Stop.

Peoples Champ
11-28-2011, 12:43 PM
The Timmy Badger. I like that. :thumbs:

He's like the honey badger because nobody wants to tackle him.

iforgotmypassword
11-28-2011, 12:50 PM
Another point I don't think has been touched on. Matt Prater has been an absolute monster in pinning the oppenent deep.

Dedhed
11-28-2011, 12:50 PM
It's like monkeys hurling feces at each other really...
In the case of Hoge, it's like watching a retarded monkey hurl feces at himself.

It's pretty funny to watch his face get red and see his head spin with emotion every time he has to try to explain why Tebow doesn't deserve any credit.

Agamemnon
11-28-2011, 12:52 PM
My bad. The pass that hit Royal on the numbers was about a half an inch over to the right from the center of his chest. The pass that bounced off of Rosarios numbers was an inch to the left off from center of the numbers. The 170 foot pass to Decker was one foot too high. The spin move Tebow made should have been to the left rather than right he would have not only made the inteded Tackler miss, but the one behind him as well. Is that better?;D

You really are MacGruder aren't you? ::)

Peoples Champ
11-28-2011, 12:58 PM
Another point I don't think has been touched on. Matt Prater has been an absolute monster in pinning the oppenent deep.

and colquitt.

It really has been a team effort. The TEBOW EFFECT IS FOR REAL !

Broncbow
11-28-2011, 01:39 PM
You really are MacGruder aren't you? ::)


No, you had it coming, and don't be a poor sport about it either.

Don't mistake me making an allowance for a young player to develope past the growing pains of being a seasoned vet, as worship.

If I had said Tebow does not need developing then you assuming I am worshipping Tebow has credence, how can I not take your comment as a joke considering the incredulous nature of it?

I have been redundant as all get out about exposing Fox for stunting Tebows development into a seasoned vet? Why on earth would I be sweating his need to be further developed if I worshipped him as being something other than human?

Thing is with so many looking to write off Tebows impact, not to mention the impact of the scheme on Tebow, I find it difficult to join in on the Elway frey that is refusing to give an allowance to a player who for all intents and purposes may as well be a rookie playing in his 9th 1/2 game without a No.1 receiver.

Watching so many go aha see he is not playing like a seasoned vet who has had years to get in synch with his receiving corp and scheme, he has not won a Super Bowl, while looking for any reason under the sun to write him off, well I charge on the scene like a crusader in defense.

I am a fan, I have been have been accused of many things, worship? If you seen me worship, you would clearly know what I am doing here is nothing of the sort. True worship for me is reflected in dance, I am not dancing, this is war~!!:charge:

What will you do without Tebow?

Spider
11-28-2011, 02:04 PM
No, you had it coming, and don't be a poor sport about it either.

Don't mistake me making an allowance for a young player to develope past the growing pains of being a seasoned vet, as worship.

If I had said Tebow does not need developing then you assuming I am worshipping Tebow has credence, how can I not take your comment as a joke considering the incredulous nature of it?

I have been redundant as all get out about exposing Fox for stunting Tebows development into a seasoned vet? Why on earth would I be sweating his need to be further developed if I worshipped him as being something other than human?

Thing is with so many looking to write off Tebows impact, not to mention the impact of the scheme on Tebow, I find it difficult to join in on the Elway frey that is refusing to give an allowance to a player who for all intents and purposes may as well be a rookie playing in his 9th 1/2 game without a No.1 receiver.

Watching so many go aha see he is not playing like a seasoned vet who has had years to get in synch with his receiving corp and scheme, he has not won a Super Bowl, while looking for any reason under the sun to write him off, well I charge on the scene like a crusader in defense.

I am a fan, I have been have been accused of many things, worship? If you seen me worship, you would clearly know what I am doing here is nothing of the sort. True worship for me is reflected in dance, I am not dancing, this is war~!!:charge:

What will you do without Tebow? when I read your post .........