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lostknight
10-02-2011, 04:32 PM
Just watched a second of the presser. Someone asked about why they didn't use Tebow.

"We did it once, and we lost yardage, and therefore it didn't prove to be beneficial" is John Fox's official statement on Tebow.

Ladies and Gentlemen, I give you the Broncos front office and head coach. The Matt Milan led Lions are starting to look more and more like a analog for our current situation.

Anyone who thinks that this front office is going to honestly evaluate the QB situation, discard that thought now.

Que
10-02-2011, 04:34 PM
Am starting to understand why Carolina picked ahead of us last year...

go_broncos
10-02-2011, 04:34 PM
Just watched a second of the presser. Someone asked about why they didn't use Tebow.

"We did it once, and we lost yardage, and therefore it didn't prove to be beneficial" is John Fox's official statement on Tebow.

Ladies and Gentlemen, I give you the Broncos front office and head coach. The Matt Milan led Lions are starting to look more and more like a analog for our current situation.

Anyone who thinks that this front office is going to honestly evaluate the QB situation, discard that thought now.

:gus:

frerottenextelway
10-02-2011, 04:35 PM
This isn't good for my alcoholism.

maven
10-02-2011, 04:35 PM
Lets pick up the worst NFL coach in football last year and make him OURS!

OrangeSe7en
10-02-2011, 04:36 PM
Just watched a second of the presser. Someone asked about why they didn't use Tebow.

"We did it once, and we lost yardage, and therefore it didn't prove to be beneficial" is John Fox's official statement on Tebow.

Ladies and Gentlemen, I give you the Broncos front office and head coach. The Matt Milan led Lions are starting to look more and more like a analog for our current situation.

Anyone who thinks that this front office is going to honestly evaluate the QB situation, discard that thought now.

It sounds like Fox actually was glad it lost a yard and that he was hoping that would shut the fanbase up. Guess again. It's about to get super loud in Denver.

Hamrob
10-02-2011, 04:36 PM
Definitely seems like Fox believes all Tebow can do...is run it up the middle. What an idiot. He has found his Jake Delhome in Kyle Orton.

Archer81
10-02-2011, 04:36 PM
Wait...Tebow loses a single yard because the play was ****ing obvious and you decide it would NOT help to have him in later?

What ****ing bull**** is this?

:Broncos:

24champ
10-02-2011, 04:37 PM
Am starting to understand why Carolina picked ahead of us last year...

2-18 since last year. :nono:

Rohirrim
10-02-2011, 04:37 PM
As Aaron Rodgers just tried to drill into Broncos fans heads, it's a passing league. And they're still crying for the running QB who can't get out of the backfield. :rofl:

Archer81
10-02-2011, 04:38 PM
2-18 since last year. :nono:


Was Carolina 1-15 or 2-14 last year?


:Broncos:

maven
10-02-2011, 04:39 PM
Wait...Tebow loses a single yard because the play was ****ing obvious and you decide it would NOT help to have him in later?

What ****ing bull**** is this?

:Broncos:

This is our NFL coach! Get use to stupid!

Hilarious!

Agamemnon
10-02-2011, 04:40 PM
As Aaron Rodgers just tried to drill into Broncos fans heads, it's a passing league. And they're still crying for the running QB who can't get out of the backfield. :rofl:

You are a retard. There really is no other explanation for a post like this.

eddie mac
10-02-2011, 04:41 PM
Get the winner back from Chicago.

strafen
10-02-2011, 04:42 PM
Definitely seems like Fox believes all Tebow can do...is run it up the middle. What an idiot. He has found his Jake Delhome in Kyle Orton.

Well, I'm not clear where we were at that point on the field, but I don't think that's where you would want to use Tebow, right?
The idea is to use him at the goal line, where you need to score points, or inside the 20 for that matter...

Rabb
10-02-2011, 04:42 PM
un****ing real

ant1999e
10-02-2011, 04:43 PM
You are a retard. There really is no other explanation for a post like this.

Most of his posts are retarded.

maher_tyler
10-02-2011, 04:43 PM
Did he really say that?? Wow the booing is gonna be vicious next week..not only for Orton but for Fox to. Don't talk to us like were ****in stupid. I'm hating this hiring more and more the more he talks!

Rohirrim
10-02-2011, 04:44 PM
You are a retard. There really is no other explanation for a post like this.

Keep stroking that unicorn. :wave:

Greatspirits
10-02-2011, 04:44 PM
Hey, this is what EFX had planned all along, sticking with Orton gives us the best chance to lose, therefore we're still in the Luck sweepstakes. God forbid we put in Tebow and win a few games. It'll be interesting to see what happens after next week after we lose to the Chargers. Everyone will be screaming for a change by then.

Rabb
10-02-2011, 04:46 PM
Did he really say that?? Wow the booing is gonna be vicious next week..not only for Orton but for Fox to. Don't talk to us like were ****in stupid. I'm hating this hiring more and more the more he talks!

honestly when I heard it live, I about **** myself...it is pretty clear to me that they wanted to satisfy the fans and prove a point

they sure did prove that point, that he has no ****ing clue what he is doing

I am still willing to give the guy the season, but this bullheaded crap is unreal and it makes me firmly believe what I have thought/said all along, when Orton goes down or is pulled Quinn is what we will see, not TT.

Ratboy
10-02-2011, 04:46 PM
This guy is a joke.

We're going to be stuck with this tool for awhile too.

strafen
10-02-2011, 04:47 PM
Just watched a second of the presser. Someone asked about why they didn't use Tebow.

"We did it once, and we lost yardage, and therefore it didn't prove to be beneficial" is John Fox's official statement on Tebow.

Ladies and Gentlemen, I give you the Broncos front office and head coach. The Matt Milan led Lions are starting to look more and more like a analog for our current situation.

Anyone who thinks that this front office is going to honestly evaluate the QB situation, discard that thought now.Fire Fox!

BroncoBuff
10-02-2011, 04:47 PM
Someone asked why they didn't use Tebow more.
"We did it once, and we lost yardage, and therefore it didn't prove to be beneficial" is John Fox's official statement on Tebow.

Seriously? Pretty weird.

Think that through ... "we did IT once." Unless the specific wording of the question was lost, then it sounds like Fox considers Tebow a one-trick pony, a novelty.

Ratboy
10-02-2011, 04:49 PM
At this point, I think Eric Studesville would have been a better option.

Hamrob
10-02-2011, 04:49 PM
As Aaron Rodgers just tried to drill into Broncos fans heads, it's a passing league. And they're still crying for the running QB who can't get out of the backfield. :rofl:That's funny...in college Tim Tebow threw for 88 TD's. Orton threw for 64 TD's. We won't even get into their rushing stats.

Also, why don't you take a look at their QB ratings for the last 2 preseason's. Yeah. Tebow's better. Wow!

SoCalBronco
10-02-2011, 04:50 PM
It sounds like Fox actually was glad it lost a yard and that he was hoping that would shut the fanbase up. Guess again. It's about to get super loud in Denver.

Yep...I mentioned this in the other thread. They are running plays that are BY DESIGN low percentage. A QB draw into the heart of the front cannot reasonably succeed, its obviously designed as an out for the staff to say "see" to the fans.

OrangeSe7en
10-02-2011, 04:50 PM
Seriously? Pretty weird.

Think that through ... "we did IT once." Unless the specific wording of the question was lost, then it sounds like Fox considers Tebow a one-trick pony, a novelty.

If this is true, then it makes Elway out to be someone who is disengenuous. Last year, Elway was said that if the coach was anti-Tebow, he probably wasnt the right coach for the Broncos.

Its now pretty obvious that Fox is anti-Tebow.

maven
10-02-2011, 04:51 PM
Think that through ... "we did IT once." Unless the specific wording of the question was lost, then it sounds like Fox considers Tebow a one-trick pony, a novelty.

This head coach idiot ran with Jake Delhomme for so many years and when he finally pulled the plug it was Matt "I ****ing suck" Moore. This guy is f'n stupid.

strafen
10-02-2011, 04:53 PM
<TABLE border=0 cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=center>http://cache.filehippo.com/img/ex/1287__firefox_35.png </TD><TD vAlign=center>Firefox

</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

MacGruder
10-02-2011, 04:55 PM
If this is true, then it makes Elway out to be someone who is disengenuous. Last year, Elway was said that if the coach was anti-Tebow, he probably wasnt the right coach for the Broncos.

Its now pretty obvious that Fox is anti-Tebow.

Oh no.. Fox loves Tebow.. but to play Tebo has to become a QB he isn't.. and he never will be... but that's Tebow's fault.

Rohirrim
10-02-2011, 04:56 PM
That's funny...in college Tim Tebow threw for 88 TD's. Orton threw for 64 TD's. We won't even get into their rushing stats.

Also, why don't you take a look at their QB ratings for the last 2 preseason's. Yeah. Tebow's better. Wow!

I really don't give a **** about the numbers a QB gets out of playing the spread in college. They don't translate to the NFL.

lostknight
10-02-2011, 04:59 PM
The Broncos have zero interest in developing Tebow. None. Ziltch.

ScottXray
10-02-2011, 05:01 PM
Putting Tebow in on FIRST down in our half of the field is where that was called.
1. At that point we had just moved the chains, and the offense was moving the ball. It breaks the FLOW of the game to insert TT at that point. It wasted a down and was a stupid call.

2. They called a QB run up the middle. WTF? No misdirection , no effort to confuse the Defense. With TT in the GB defense was OBVIOUSLY going to crash the line as they expected run. They did and we lost a yard. So it is TTs fault that he didn't fool anyone?

3. Not putting him ( TT) in, in the 4th quarter when the game was out of reach is another decision I can't fathom. Letting Orton get garbage stats and a late game TD so he appears to have better statistics is the only reason I can see. Maybe the rest of the Offense just didn't want to be embarased by TT throwing a pick or turning it over? I don't care. They made enough other mistakes that letting Tebow get a little time under center should have been considered.

4. Despite the score I actually think that the Broncos defense just ran into a Very hot team and QB in Rodgers today. He was putting the ball into some really tight spaces and no matter what the D did the ball seemed to just go their way. Overall the D blew three plays and was pretty tight in most coverage. It just wasn't their day.

5. Orton played decently well, but as usual he had a turnover that gave the other team points ( the pick six) and swung momentum their way. The Fells turnover was not his fault, in fact was a good play by Orton, but the last pick ( off Decker) was more Ortons fault for throwing it to a bad spot (Decker had to reach up, inside and backwards to try to make the play and it took a bounce down and off his knee for the pick) then anyones .

I think coach Fox is doing well with the Defense...but his decisions are making me start to dislike him and wish we had a better HC.

24champ
10-02-2011, 05:01 PM
Was Carolina 1-15 or 2-14 last year?


:Broncos:

I stand corrected, Fox was 2-14 last year and is 3-17 since last year.

Orange4Life
10-02-2011, 05:04 PM
Wow. This is just sad. I'm going to be booing my ass off next week with this kind of attitude

Crushaholic
10-02-2011, 05:09 PM
Fox knows defenses, not offenses. So, he gets a pass for the remark. BTW, how 'bout that defense? It sure was great, when...

Oh, never mind...:gus:

HAT
10-02-2011, 05:11 PM
The Broncos have zero interest in developing Tebow. None. Ziltch.

You couldn't be more wrong.

Captain 'Dre
10-02-2011, 05:12 PM
This isn't good for my alcoholism.

I think you mean this isn't good for your sobriety. It's probably GREAT for your alcoholism.

HAT
10-02-2011, 05:12 PM
I think coach Fox is doing well with the Defense...

Wut?

RhymesayersDU
10-02-2011, 05:14 PM
Wait...Tebow loses a single yard because the play was ****ing obvious and you decide it would NOT help to have him in later?

What ****ing bull**** is this?

:Broncos:

Exactly. Even McD learned that when you line up Tebow and it's obvious you're going to run, it's going to get stuffed.

Either start the guy or put him in and be creative.

SonOfLe-loLang
10-02-2011, 05:15 PM
This is unreal. Ok, so one play with Tebow didnt work. How about the hundreds that didnt work with Orton?

TheReverend
10-02-2011, 05:19 PM
You couldn't be more wrong.

Dude, no offense, but you're like 0-10000 billion.

Bob has a better track record of "Calling it" than you do.

maven
10-02-2011, 05:22 PM
This is unreal. Ok, so one play with Tebow didnt work. How about the hundreds that didnt work with Orton?

Orton gives Denver the best chance to win. As you can see from that one play by Tebow, he gives us no chance.

Goobzilla
10-02-2011, 05:24 PM
They better have cops in riot gear at the stadium on Sunday. If we come out with the same old same old it's going to be ugly.

WolfpackGuy
10-02-2011, 05:25 PM
Sucking for Luck is in full effect.

BlaK-Argentina
10-02-2011, 05:27 PM
I'm seriously asking myself if this is a nightmare or not.

This guy can't be serious. Please tell me this is a joke.

Steve Prefontaine
10-02-2011, 05:28 PM
Once. Good sample size Fox.

Drek
10-02-2011, 05:29 PM
So I guess when Elway talked about asking coaching candidates what they thought of Tebow it was to eliminate the guys who might actually want to play him.

Good to know. Suck for Luck in full effect within the FO.

WolfpackGuy
10-02-2011, 05:31 PM
They will not play Teboz until the 9th or 10th game when he has no chance in hell of hitting that escalator.

ScottXray
10-02-2011, 05:34 PM
Wut?

I mean Compared to last year.

Yes, We got lit up like a Xmas tree today....but a large part of it was Rodgers was just ON. I think we just don't have the talent to stay with GB and no matter who they played today he would have shredded the other teams D. As they said in the commentary, he was going to keep the foot on the pedal and keep going for points ALL game, so they didn't have a team come back on them again. They did that today for the first time, and the Broncos happened to be the opponent.

If Orton had played 70% as well as Rodgers did we might have had a chance to try to stay with them. Instead he played like Orton always does...make the safe plays, ( that weren't) and take what their defense gives...

Frankly our line blocked really well for him today, but Orton isn't Rodgers and Can't make those throws like him.

MacGruder
10-02-2011, 05:36 PM
It amazes me that people can forget the difference leadership makes when Tebow plays versus Orton.. especially after watching it when Tebow started last season...

Jesterhole
10-02-2011, 05:36 PM
One or two more losses and Fox won't be able to defend starting Orton. At that point, we're playing for next year and need to figure out if we should draft a QB. Of course at this point, it looks like that is a yes, because they don't want to give Tebow a chance.

maven
10-02-2011, 05:38 PM
Sucking for Luck is in full effect.

yep, it sure looks like it.

Drek
10-02-2011, 05:48 PM
They will not play Teboz until the 9th or 10th game when he has no chance in hell of hitting that escalator.

I don't think that is even true anymore. How they used him today and reacted to questions (like this quote) makes me think they will only use Tebow in situations they know he'll fail at. He'll never get a real start unless our starting OL gets hit with serious injuries.

The current brain trust have no interest in a Tim Tebow led Broncos franchise.

Simple Jake
10-02-2011, 05:48 PM
Did anyone else see the dumbass faces he was making on the sidelines.. shrugging his shoulders and holding his hands up after every play.. god he makes me sick

maher_tyler
10-02-2011, 05:49 PM
Anyone catch what Rodney Harrison said before the Ravens Jets game? About the Vikings situation. Something like doing the rest of the team an injustice by sticking with the vet over the rookie when the vet clearly isn't cutting it?? Can't remember exactly what he said but it was something like that. It's exactly how we all feel as Broncos fans!!

bpc
10-02-2011, 05:52 PM
Just watched a second of the presser. Someone asked about why they didn't use Tebow.

"We did it once, and we lost yardage, and therefore it didn't prove to be beneficial" is John Fox's official statement on Tebow.

Ladies and Gentlemen, I give you the Broncos front office and head coach. The Matt Milan led Lions are starting to look more and more like a analog for our current situation.

Anyone who thinks that this front office is going to honestly evaluate the QB situation, discard that thought now.

That sounds like McD's stance on Peyton Hillis.

cabronco
10-02-2011, 05:52 PM
Did Fox watch any film on Tebow from last year, like the red zone !

I picked a bad week to quit shooting up heroin.

If their master plan is suck4Luck, they prolly screwed the pooch on that too, by winning a game this year. There's a few potential 0'fers out there with a better chance.

Man when I heard we had a few plays for Tebow, I instantly thought heck ya tim in the RZ ! That one play was exact replica of McD from last years debacle.

I think we need to get rid of McCoy before Fox though. Especially if we do have a shot at Luck or any other top teir qb next year. I would like to see Tebow play in consecutive games first and see what we have with him. I know its an upgrade over Orton, imo.

TheReverend
10-02-2011, 05:58 PM
Did Fox watch any film on Tebow from last year, like the red zone !

I picked a bad week to quit shooting up heroin.

If their master plan is suck4Luck, they prolly screwed the pooch on that too, by winning a game this year. There's a few potential 0'fers out there with a better chance.

Man when I heard we had a few plays for Tebow, I instantly thought heck ya tim in the RZ ! That one play was exact replica of McD from last years debacle.

I think we need to get rid of McCoy before Fox though. Especially if we do have a shot at Luck or any other top teir qb next year. I would like to see Tebow play in consecutive games first and see what we have with him. I know its an upgrade over Orton, imo.

LOL

ColoradoDarin
10-02-2011, 06:02 PM
That quote is worse than Elway's "only one game" tweet about Orton.

MVPlaya II - Electric Boogaloo
10-02-2011, 06:04 PM
Did Fox watch any film on Tebow from last year, like the red zone !

I picked a bad week to quit shooting up heroin.

If their master plan is suck4Luck, they prolly screwed the pooch on that too, by winning a game this year. There's a few potential 0'fers out there with a better chance.

Man when I heard we had a few plays for Tebow, I instantly thought heck ya tim in the RZ ! That one play was exact replica of McD from last years debacle.

I think we need to get rid of McCoy before Fox though. Especially if we do have a shot at Luck or any other top teir qb next year. I would like to see Tebow play in consecutive games first and see what we have with him. I know its an upgrade over Orton, imo.

Thats another point I'm trying to make. Regardless of WHO we draft at QB, this staff/management/office will get NO WHERE.

Mike McCoy...?

houghtam
10-02-2011, 06:23 PM
Putting Tebow in on FIRST down in our half of the field is where that was called.
1. At that point we had just moved the chains, and the offense was moving the ball. It breaks the FLOW of the game to insert TT at that point. It wasted a down and was a stupid call.

2. They called a QB run up the middle. WTF? No misdirection , no effort to confuse the Defense. With TT in the GB defense was OBVIOUSLY going to crash the line as they expected run. They did and we lost a yard. So it is TTs fault that he didn't fool anyone?

3. Not putting him ( TT) in, in the 4th quarter when the game was out of reach is another decision I can't fathom. Letting Orton get garbage stats and a late game TD so he appears to have better statistics is the only reason I can see. Maybe the rest of the Offense just didn't want to be embarased by TT throwing a pick or turning it over? I don't care. They made enough other mistakes that letting Tebow get a little time under center should have been considered.

4. Despite the score I actually think that the Broncos defense just ran into a Very hot team and QB in Rodgers today. He was putting the ball into some really tight spaces and no matter what the D did the ball seemed to just go their way. Overall the D blew three plays and was pretty tight in most coverage. It just wasn't their day.

5. Orton played decently well, but as usual he had a turnover that gave the other team points ( the pick six) and swung momentum their way. The Fells turnover was not his fault, in fact was a good play by Orton, but the last pick ( off Decker) was more Ortons fault for throwing it to a bad spot (Decker had to reach up, inside and backwards to try to make the play and it took a bounce down and off his knee for the pick) then anyones .

I think coach Fox is doing well with the Defense...but his decisions are making me start to dislike him and wish we had a better HC.

I agree with everything except the bolded. "The ball just seemed to go their way" means they score 30 points. The Green Bay offense scored 6 touchdowns. I'll have to re-watch the game to confirm, but I remember seeing GB receivers open play after play. Of course I didn't scream at the tv or anything, since Orton has finally sucked the last bit of soul out of my very existence, but if I HAD screamed, I would have been yelling at Moore and Dawkins, who got beat deep more than once, and Willhite (who?) and Vaughn (who?), who got turned around so many times I thought they were going to turn a triple Lutz.

This defense got a little better up front, but a LOT worse in the secondary during the offseason. Now we have more things to worry about than just the running offense, passing offense, red zone offense and special teams

Drek
10-02-2011, 06:27 PM
That sounds like McD's stance on Peyton Hillis.

McDaniels at least gave Hillis multiple attempts a game for three games before dog housing him. He even gave him an entire second half to rape the Chiefs later on that same season.

McDaniels completely ****ed the pooch here but at least he started 6-0 and gave guys like Hillis several attempts before blackballing them.

TheDave
10-02-2011, 06:34 PM
Looks like I picked the wrong day to stop sniffing glue...

broncswin
10-02-2011, 06:57 PM
looks like I picked the wrong day to end my foot fetish...singed Rex Ryan

~Crash~
10-02-2011, 07:02 PM
As Aaron Rodgers just tried to drill into Broncos fans heads, it's a passing league. And they're still crying for the running QB who can't get out of the backfield. :rofl:

thank you ...but here is the deal Tebow just might be good if worked with so I have not gave up on him but I do somewhat agree.

UberBroncoMan
10-02-2011, 07:02 PM
That sounds like McD's stance on Peyton Hillis.

Ruh Roh. Sad thing is, you're right.

hambone13
10-02-2011, 07:11 PM
Yep...I mentioned this in the other thread. They are running plays that are BY DESIGN low percentage. A QB draw into the heart of the front cannot reasonably succeed, its obviously designed as an out for the staff to say "see" to the fans.

It's infuriating. It was a blatant slap in the face IMO. It's hard to get behind a guy that does something that asinine. It's not like he's walking in here with Belichick stats over the last decade. It was truly a dick move.

BroncoLover
10-02-2011, 07:13 PM
Lets pick up the worst NFL coach in football last year and make him OURS!

That was there mantra they came up with to get Luck :yayaya:

peacepipe
10-02-2011, 07:14 PM
well considering tebows strong tendency to run,they probably figured best to make it a run play.

~Crash~
10-02-2011, 07:16 PM
Wow. This is just sad. I'm going to be booing my ass off next week with this kind of attitude

Cutler was right I think he said Broncos Fans are a 5. Ha!

~Crash~
10-02-2011, 07:17 PM
really boooooooooooooooooo if we are winning.

robbieopperude
10-02-2011, 08:27 PM
I think we are going to see 5 or 6 starts from Tebow at the end of the season to see what we have with him. If he doesn't succeed and goes 1 and 5 or 0 and 6 you can pretty much mark down a pick of either Jones or Barkley. I still don't think we are going to get the number 1 pick with the Colts, Seattle, KC, and a surprising Minnesota team in the running. What would Minni do with Ponder?

robbieopperude
10-02-2011, 08:28 PM
Jacksonville is going to be in the running for that pick too depending on how they fair against the Colts.

TheReverend
10-02-2011, 08:32 PM
Jacksonville is going to be in the running for that pick too depending on how they fair against the Colts.

They're not even close to that bad, imo

Maximus
10-02-2011, 08:35 PM
You are a retard. There really is no other explanation for a post like this.

I wish I was a admin over here I would ban your IP so quick! You don't know **** about your own team! I know more about the Broncos than you! Make 1 good football take... I dare you!!

barryr
10-02-2011, 08:37 PM
The Broncos won't be bad enough to draft Luck, but sticking with Orton will get them close. He is a backup QB who would be good if only played a game or 2, but his weaknesses are too often exposed the more he plays. The Packers secondary has been roasted all year and even they didn't respect Orton. They gambled on the short stuff not worried about the long passes so much.

Orange4Life
10-02-2011, 08:40 PM
Cutler was right I think he said Broncos Fans are a 5. Ha!

Go cheer for the bears then douche. I"m as big a fan as any. I don't care who plays as long as they are playing well. When the EFX says **** like this you're damn right I'll boo.

maher_tyler
10-02-2011, 08:42 PM
It's infuriating. It was a blatant slap in the face IMO. It's hard to get behind a guy that does something that asinine. It's not like he's walking in here with Belichick stats over the last decade. It was truly a dick move.

Kinda like lining him up as slot receiver!! This FO is getting on my last nerve!! Hope they're having fun is all i can say! The booing is going to be BAD next week!!

Agamemnon
10-03-2011, 04:43 AM
I wish I was a admin over here I would ban your IP so quick! You don't know **** about your own team! I know more about the Broncos than you! Make 1 good football take... I dare you!!

You know more about my team than me? You keep saying we should keep starting Orton. Do you know he's in the last year of his contract? Do you know that starting him in what is clearly a rebuilding year is completely pointless? Do you know that Tebow played far better than most rookie QBs do in their first three starts? Clearly you don't.

Seriously man, shut the **** up and go root for your mediocre team that has zero chance of winning anything meaningful. You don't know ****. You are a ****ing moron like virtually every Raiders fan to ever walk the face of the Earth.

BroncoBuff
10-03-2011, 05:49 AM
"We did it once, and we lost yardage, and therefore it didn't prove to be beneficial" is John Fox's official statement on Tebow.

Like always ... Fox News is bad news.

Dendave
10-03-2011, 05:53 AM
Henne got hurt maybe we could trade Orton to Miami?

montrose
10-03-2011, 06:07 AM
Instead of packaging assests for Luck, how about making a deal for the one guy who can fix this mess:

http://cdn.bleacherreport.net/images_root/slides/photos/000/858/791/redskins-mike-shanahan_display_image.jpg?1302738793

jhns
10-03-2011, 06:08 AM
Instead of packaging assests for Luck, how about making a deal for the one guy who can fix this mess:

http://cdn.bleacherreport.net/images_root/slides/photos/000/858/791/redskins-mike-shanahan_display_image.jpg?1302738793

One can only dream...

Fox is not going to last long. I liked his offseason and hate that I am now finding out he can't coach for ****.

Jesterhole
10-03-2011, 06:14 AM
Fox is pretty much dead to me at this point. Now I just have to wonder how many years we will have to suck...two, three....before he gets fired and we get to try again.

In the mean time, he'll have run off Tim Tebow, who will finally get his chance with another team and prove to be a winner.

Sad time to be a Broncos fan

ol#7
10-03-2011, 06:18 AM
I think Fox will be here two years. Then he will only have 1 year left on the books and Shanny and McDimwitts contracts will also have been history after this year.

Of course, now I am gun shy about any future hire they might bring in. This is how franchises get run into the ground for the long haul.

Rabb
10-03-2011, 06:19 AM
Someone less lazy than me please answer this, are we paying any other coach other than Fox at this point? I cannot remember if we settled with McD and finished with Shanny.

Edit: Jinx ol#7, thanks

ol#7
10-03-2011, 06:20 AM
Someone less lazy than me please answer this, are we paying any other coach other than Fox at this point? I cannot remember if we settled with McD and finished with Shanny.

I believe we are actually paying 3 coaches this year. This is it for the Shanny and McD money if I am not mistaken, but they were pretty hush hush about the final details on McD's Departure.

edit: Double Jinx!

bendog
10-03-2011, 06:22 AM
Wait...Tebow loses a single yard because the play was ****ing obvious and you decide it would NOT help to have him in later?

What ****ing bull**** is this?

:Broncos:

you just answered the tebow question without knowing it. Outstanding. LOL

strafen
10-03-2011, 06:25 AM
Instead of packaging assests for Luck, how about making a deal for the one guy who can fix this mess:

http://cdn.bleacherreport.net/images_root/slides/photos/000/858/791/redskins-mike-shanahan_display_image.jpg?1302738793
i don't care what anybody says, the man can coach! :strong:

jhns
10-03-2011, 06:28 AM
you just answered the tebow question without knowing it. Outstanding. LOL

Only it resulted in far better results when he got full games. You like losing with your hero at QB though. You can't be helped.

tsiguy96
10-03-2011, 06:32 AM
mcdaniels settled, hes not owed anything.

bendog
10-03-2011, 06:33 AM
No team can run consistenty from the shotgun in the NFL. Tebow is slower than 9 guys on GB's defense. Den ran for 5.2 yds per carry out of a traditional set. The difference is that the running back is moving forward at the snap, and gets to the line a step faster than Tebow can out of the shot gun.

Can tebow play in the nfl? Maybe. But not out of the shotgun. They're now 3 games below .500. Elway will have no choice but to tell Fox to play the guy soon. Maybe throw him to the lions.

jhns
10-03-2011, 06:36 AM
No team can run consistenty from the shotgun in the NFL. Tebow is slower than 9 guys on GB's defense. Den ran for 5.2 yds per carry out of a traditional set. The difference is that the running back is moving forward at the snap, and gets to the line a step faster than Tebow can out of the shot gun.

Can tebow play in the nfl? Maybe. But not out of the shotgun. They're now 3 games below .500. Elway will have no choice but to tell Fox to play the guy soon. Maybe throw him to the lions.

Tebow put up more points than Orton. This team was much better with him.

You are just as dumb as the worst head coach in the NFL. Good job.

Rabb
10-03-2011, 06:38 AM
They're now 3 games below .500. Elway will have no choice but to tell Fox to play the guy soon. Maybe throw him to the lions.

from what I have seen from this FO so far, Quinn will get a shot before Tebow

Old Dude
10-03-2011, 06:48 AM
I guess what amazes me is that our secondary gets lit up like a Christmas tree and here we are on Monday, going on and on and on about our QB.

Orton isn't very good but we have far more serious problems to address with our upcoming top-5 pick in the 2012 draft.

tsiguy96
10-03-2011, 06:50 AM
I guess what amazes me is that our secondary gets lit up like a Christmas tree and here we are on Monday, going on and on and on about our QB.

Orton isn't very good but we have far more serious problems to address with our upcoming top-5 pick in the 2012 draft.

yes, this is true. we need to address a LOT of **** in the draft. however the glaring hole at QB may be on the roster and on the sidelines, yet people think its not as important. not to mention the fact that hes a 2nd year 1st round QB who has shown potential to be very good, yet fox is starting the old veteran who cant win games and is a free agent after this wasted year is over.

jhns
10-03-2011, 06:53 AM
I guess what amazes me is that our secondary gets lit up like a Christmas tree and here we are on Monday, going on and on and on about our QB.

Orton isn't very good but we have far more serious problems to address with our upcoming top-5 pick in the 2012 draft.

The secondary has an injured Champ and nothing else we can do about it. The QB position has been complete **** and we have a QB on this roster that has proven he is more productive in live games. Of course QB is what gets talked about. The other positions will be talked about more as we have a chance to fix them(in the offseason).

WolfpackGuy
10-03-2011, 06:55 AM
Everyone knew the Broncos were going to have to light it up to keep pace with Green Bay.

Instead, Bore-ton tosses 3 picks, of which one was returned for a TD, as well as making the Packers's terrible pass defense look competent.

AlphaSeirra
10-03-2011, 06:56 AM
Keep stroking that unicorn. :wave:

Come on guys, the horse boy is not really retarded,,,,

he's just let ole Tommy Lee blue-flash him to often.... Hilarious!

Drek
10-03-2011, 06:58 AM
I guess what amazes me is that our secondary gets lit up like a Christmas tree and here we are on Monday, going on and on and on about our QB.

Orton isn't very good but we have far more serious problems to address with our upcoming top-5 pick in the 2012 draft.

This amazes you?

To paraphrase Rick Patino: Steve Atwater isn't walking through that door. Louis Wright isn't walking through that door. Billy Thompson isn't walking through that door. Hell, Darrien Gordon and Ray Crockett aren't even walking through that door.

There are no answers on this roster for our DB problems. None. That is abundantly clear.

But at QB where we've gotten **** play for our first four games there just so happens to be a former 1st rounder, former Heismann winner, former two time national champion. Sitting and watching.

Would starting Tebow change us getting our asses kicked in Green Bay? Sure as hell wouldn't. But it might have changed the outcome against Oakland. Or Tennessee. And it might change the outcome against San Diego. Even if it doesn't, at least there is a future with Tebow. There is no future with Orton.

Its not even about playing Tebow either. I'd take Quinn because at least there is some upside left there. Not as much as Tebow for sure, but there might still be a reserve of untapped potential we can extract. Orton does nothing for us and is on a one year deal. Why do we insist on playing him? Surely its not to win football games.

AlphaSeirra
10-03-2011, 07:04 AM
This head coach idiot ran with Jake Delhomme for so many years and when he finally pulled the plug it was Matt "I ****ing suck" Moore. This guy is f'n stupid.

Oh, but don't forget that last season he drafted neutered lame's Jimmy 'da pickle' Clausen.

Then he started him and kept him for 10 games.

After a 3 TD to 9 Ints start, ole Foxy finally figured out that maybe 'da pickle' was a mistake.

Sharp as a tac, that one is.... ^5

TotallyScrewed
10-03-2011, 07:38 AM
This amazes you?

To paraphrase Rick Patino: Steve Atwater isn't walking through that door. Louis Wright isn't walking through that door. Billy Thompson isn't walking through that door. Hell, Darrien Gordon and Ray Crockett aren't even walking through that door.

There are no answers on this roster for our DB problems. None. That is abundantly clear.

But at QB where we've gotten **** play for our first four games there just so happens to be a former 1st rounder, former Heismann winner, former two time national champion. Sitting and watching.

Would starting Tebow change us getting our asses kicked in Green Bay? Sure as hell wouldn't. But it might have changed the outcome against Oakland. Or Tennessee. And it might change the outcome against San Diego. Even if it doesn't, at least there is a future with Tebow. There is no future with Orton.

Its not even about playing Tebow either. I'd take Quinn because at least there is some upside left there. Not as much as Tebow for sure, but there might still be a reserve of untapped potential we can extract. Orton does nothing for us and is on a one year deal. Why do we insist on playing him? Surely its not to win football games.

Why not put either Quinn or Tebow out there in the late third and 4th quarter? It was abundantly clear that the Broncos were not coming back in this game by half time. Let Orton try for most of the third and then give the backups a chance to learn. It's not like Denver saved face by keeping the game close.

TonyR
10-03-2011, 07:41 AM
Instead of packaging assests for Luck, how about making a deal for the one guy who can fix this mess...

To be fair, and I'm certainly not apologizing for Fox's results last year and so far this year, but the guy has 5 playoff wins in the last 10 years. Mike Shanahan has 1.

TailgateNut
10-03-2011, 07:51 AM
You know more about my team than me? You keep saying we should keep starting Orton. Do you know he's in the last year of his contract? Do you know that starting him in what is clearly a rebuilding year is completely pointless? Do you know that Tebow played far better than most rookie QBs do in their first three starts? Clearly you don't.

Seriously man, shut the **** up and go root for your mediocre team that has zero chance of winning anything meaningful. You don't know ****. You are a ****ing moron like virtually every Raiders fan to ever walk the face of the Earth.


LOL

TailgateNut
10-03-2011, 07:55 AM
I guess what amazes me is that our secondary gets lit up like a Christmas tree and here we are on Monday, going on and on and on about our QB.

Orton isn't very good but we have far more serious problems to address with our upcoming top-5 pick in the 2012 draft.

It's always the QB. He should have stopped the well oiled Packer O.

I forgive him for the first interception, but the second was all on him.

Rabb
10-03-2011, 07:56 AM
I forgive him for the first interception, but the second was all on him.

ROFL!

bendog
10-03-2011, 07:56 AM
Why not put either Quinn or Tebow out there in the late third and 4th quarter? It was abundantly clear that the Broncos were not coming back in this game by half time. Let Orton try for most of the third and then give the backups a chance to learn. It's not like Denver saved face by keeping the game close.

Because Fox has to credibly tell the players to keep trying their best on every play until the season is totally lost. Look, if they somehow beat the bolts in Den next week, they're only one game out of first place with a bye and then Mia coming up. Nobody ever got better at anything by quitting. If they're eliminated from contention, then the team can look to 2013.

DrFate
10-03-2011, 08:09 AM
If they're eliminated from contention, then the team can look to 2013.

Is there any reason they aren't playing next year?

:D

ScottXray
10-03-2011, 08:16 AM
Because Fox has to credibly tell the players to keep trying their best on every play until the season is totally lost. Look, if they somehow beat the bolts in Den next week, they're only one game out of first place with a bye and then Mia coming up. Nobody ever got better at anything by quitting. If they're eliminated from contention, then the team can look to 2013.

By that method of reasoning, we should keep Orton playing until we are at least 3 games behind in the division. After next week we might be a full 2.5 out. But we have no division games until week 9 at Oakland. which means that Orton will start until then and we have to lose those two games for him to get yanked.

Which ties right in to the Escalators in TTs contract , if that has any bearing
on why Tebow isn't getting any time.

Maybe this is the plan...but it sucks that the FO would consider such a suck fest without even trying to see if there is anything there to look at .

Dedhed
10-03-2011, 08:19 AM
I forgive him for the first interception, but the second was all on him.

You can't seriously be this dumb. I know you're an Orton apologist willing to go to extreme lengths to cling to hope that Tebow isn't better than Orton, but this is beyond apologist dumb and goes straight to truly idiotic.

TailgateNut
10-03-2011, 08:24 AM
You can't seriously be this dumb. I know you're an Orton apologist willing to go to extreme lengths to cling to hope that Tebow isn't better than Orton, but this is beyond apologist dumb and goes straight to truly idiotic.

I forgive him just like forgiving you once for being an asshole. You've surpassed the allowable asshole limit.

AlphaSeirra
10-03-2011, 08:27 AM
No team can run consistenty from the shotgun in the NFL. Tebow is slower than 9 guys on GB's defense. Den ran for 5.2 yds per carry out of a traditional set. The difference is that the running back is moving forward at the snap, and gets to the line a step faster than Tebow can out of the shot gun.

Can tebow play in the nfl? Maybe. But not out of the shotgun. They're now 3 games below .500. Elway will have no choice but to tell Fox to play the guy soon. Maybe throw him to the lions.

All of that INCORRECT :bs: sounds real good/smart, just as long as you don't actually look at the results of Tebow's NFL rushing.

(for now, we'll just ignore Tim's Rookie NFL & Bronco Team rushing records)

2010 43 for 227 yds, 5.3 ypc with 6 TD's and ZERO lost possession fumbles.
That was better production than the Bucs All Pro FB Mike 'A-Train' Alstott had as a rookie.

2011 Preseason:
Passing 20 of 31 for 310 yds, 64.5%, 10 yds/Att, 15.5 yds/Comp, 1 TD, 0 Ints, Rating 108.3
Rushing 8 for 55 yds, 6.9 ypc, 2 TD's, 0 lost poss fumbles.

Unlike what many think/claim, Tim only ran the ball 20% of the time.
But so what on the 20% runs, cause they went for 6.9 FREAKIN' yds/play on average.

Tim had the best Bronco yds/carry in the 2010 season, all positions.
Tim had the best Bronco yds/carry in the 2011 preseason, all positions.
Makes sense to NOT USE THAT MUCH NEEDED RUSHING TALENT, doesn't it? :nutkick

PS

Most of Tim's Bronco snaps were actually not taken from the shotgun, but a lot of lead-azz Orton's are.

peacepipe
10-03-2011, 08:28 AM
I'm waiting to see what happens if Orton gets benched, & the QB that everyone sees taking his place is Brady Quinn.

Drek
10-03-2011, 08:43 AM
It's always the QB. He should have stopped the well oiled Packer O.

I forgive him for the first interception, but the second was all on him.

What the **** was the first interception then? Divine providence?

He threw a football directly at the only CB in recent history to rival Champ Bailey in year after year consistency. The ONE guy in Green Bay's secondary that he should absolutely, no excuses, know the exact location of on every pass. Damn near hits him with the ****ing football.

Thats cool though. Who cares that it went back for an easy six, right?

That might have been the second worst play of Orton's career (first being the inexplicable drop with zero contact against Oakland with a wide open TE ready for the go ahead touchdown pass to fall in his lap).

bendog
10-03-2011, 08:45 AM
By that method of reasoning, we should keep Orton playing until we are at least 3 games behind in the division. After next week we might be a full 2.5 out. But we have no division games until week 9 at Oakland. which means that Orton will start until then and we have to lose those two games for him to get yanked.

Which ties right in to the Escalators in TTs contract , if that has any bearing
on why Tebow isn't getting any time.

Maybe this is the plan...but it sucks that the FO would consider such a suck fest without even trying to see if there is anything there to look at .

If by some miracle they beat the bolts, they're only two games out. There's the bye and then Den plays in Mia and the Bolts have to play the jests in NJ. Then, they're only one out.

I might hit the bar for an iced tea and catch the first half of next week's game, since my wife and kid will be gone. Like I said, I saw the Oak game and then yesterday's. The team's gotten better under Fox. I'm seeing the defense gang tackling and sticking guys. I'm seeing Willis making teams get two bodies on him before he'll go down.

Nobody gets better at anything unless they keep trying. The players know whether Orton or Tebow gives them a better chance in each game. Fox can't publicly say that unless its the truth, because players will talk to guys like Schefter.

Patience. Orton's gone after this year. It's not gonna take may games to see whether Tebow has learned to play under center. Hopefully, he's gotten his ass in gear and is working at it. If he hasn't then the franchise will have to make one of those really big decisions. Do they give him another offseason to work, or go another direction? I think it's gotta be draft a qb. But it'd be on the level of two one's for tensi, the ralston mutiny and hiring Miller, or firing shanny. Obviously trading for Elway was the biggest decision ever made for the broncos. But if Tebow looks bad, and they cut him, and he goes onto a Steve Young like rebirth, it'll be bad.

Cosmo
10-03-2011, 08:50 AM
I think the thing that pisses me off most is the whole "snaps from under center" bullcrap.

Orton takes very few snaps from under center because he sucks at it. He gives away screen passes because his drop back on screens is so distinct (he shuffles backwards). He tends to audible out of under center to shotgun due to the fact that he can't deal with blitzes on a 5 step drop back play.

Its retarded that this team argues that Tebow needs more practice under center when its obvious that we don't play under center enough to warrant it. 80% of the time we are under center, its a run or play action pass, which Tebow can do fine.

If Tebow isn't playing after the bye, i'm done for the season. Can't deal with watching Orton. My brother in law was laughing his ass off yesterday as I predicted every move Orton made before he made them, even the picks. He's boring, average and doesn't win.

WolfpackGuy
10-03-2011, 08:57 AM
What the **** was the first interception then? Divine providence?

He threw a football directly at the only CB in recent history to rival Champ Bailey in year after year consistency. The ONE guy in Green Bay's secondary that he should absolutely, no excuses, know the exact location of on every pass. Damn near hits him with the ****ing football.

Thats cool though. Who cares that it went back for an easy six, right?

That might have been the second worst play of Orton's career (first being the inexplicable drop with zero contact against Oakland with a wide open TE ready for the go ahead touchdown pass to fall in his lap).

That one was just sad.

I only caught the replay and can't recall the receiver as I watched very little of the game, but it was a better pass for Woodson!

Tombstone RJ
10-03-2011, 08:58 AM
I really don't give a **** about the numbers a QB gets out of playing the spread in college. They don't translate to the NFL.

you sure about that brosef?

Dedhed
10-03-2011, 08:59 AM
I'm waiting to see what happens if Orton gets benched, & the QB that everyone sees taking his place is Brady Quinn.

I'm guessing it will look something like what we saw from Quinn against Arizona.

Drek
10-03-2011, 08:59 AM
That one was just sad.

I only caught the replay and can't recall the receiver as I watched very little of the game, but it was a better pass for Woodson!

They had Decker out in the flat, Woodson didn't even try to stick with him, he just jumped the route and walked into the end zone with the ball. Orton went first read, only read, and threw a **** pass that wasn't close to the mark.

Yet don't play Tebow because we're not sure if he's ready to read NFL defenses and he isn't consistently accurate.

Guess what? Orton definitely can't read defenses and he's consistently inaccurate. Way to resolve those questions!

ScottXray
10-03-2011, 09:01 AM
If by some miracle they beat the bolts, they're only two games out. There's the bye and then Den plays in Mia and the Bolts have to play the jests in NJ. Then, they're only one out.

I might hit the bar for an iced tea and catch the first half of next week's game, since my wife and kid will be gone. Like I said, I saw the Oak game and then yesterday's. The team's gotten better under Fox. I'm seeing the defense gang tackling and sticking guys. I'm seeing Willis making teams get two bodies on him before he'll go down.

Nobody gets better at anything unless they keep trying. The players know whether Orton or Tebow gives them a better chance in each game. Fox can't publicly say that unless its the truth, because players will talk to guys like Schefter.

Patience. Orton's gone after this year. It's not gonna take may games to see whether Tebow has learned to play under center. Hopefully, he's gotten his ass in gear and is working at it. If he hasn't then the franchise will have to make one of those really big decisions. Do they give him another offseason to work, or go another direction? I think it's gotta be draft a qb. But it'd be on the level of two one's for tensi, the ralston mutiny and hiring Miller, or firing shanny. Obviously trading for Elway was the biggest decision ever made for the broncos. But if Tebow looks bad, and they cut him, and he goes onto a Steve Young like rebirth, it'll be bad.

All of that is fine, but the fact that they continued with Orton through the 4th quarter yesterday, down by >30 points, is something I can't fathom.

Obviously they have no confidence in Either backup (T/Q) because they wouldn't put them in even though the game was over in every way but clock. Why not see if one or the other can actually run the offense?

Worried about the team psyche, then fine TELL the team that this is no refelection on Orton, just that you need to find out who can execute or not with the first team. At that poijnt it was an exhibition game only.

:clown:

Tombstone RJ
10-03-2011, 09:07 AM
All of that is fine, but the fact that they continued with Orton through the 4th quarter yesterday, down by >30 points, is something I can't fathom.

Obviously they have no confidence in Either backup (T/Q) because they wouldn't put them in even though the game was over in every way but clock. Why not see if one or the other can actually run the offense?

Worried about the team psyche, then fine TELL the team that this is no refelection on Orton, just that you need to find out who can execute or not with the first team. At that poijnt it was an exhibition game only.

:clown:

Nah, if I'm Fox I sit Orton and I put Tebow in because he's the only QB on the roster with a long term contract. He doesn't need to explain jack crap to the team. They are down by 30 points, it's time to see something different.

Gort
10-03-2011, 09:07 AM
This amazes you?

To paraphrase Rick Patino: Steve Atwater isn't walking through that door. Louis Wright isn't walking through that door. Billy Thompson isn't walking through that door. Hell, Darrien Gordon and Ray Crockett aren't even walking through that door.

There are no answers on this roster for our DB problems. None. That is abundantly clear.

But at QB where we've gotten **** play for our first four games there just so happens to be a former 1st rounder, former Heismann winner, former two time national champion. Sitting and watching.

Would starting Tebow change us getting our asses kicked in Green Bay? Sure as hell wouldn't. But it might have changed the outcome against Oakland. Or Tennessee. And it might change the outcome against San Diego. Even if it doesn't, at least there is a future with Tebow. There is no future with Orton.

Its not even about playing Tebow either. I'd take Quinn because at least there is some upside left there. Not as much as Tebow for sure, but there might still be a reserve of untapped potential we can extract. Orton does nothing for us and is on a one year deal. Why do we insist on playing him? Surely its not to win football games.

brace yourself! this may be aneurysm inducing, but what if Fox/Elway is evaluating Orton as our QBOTF and how he performs this season will dictate whether or not they give him a multi-year, multi-multi-million dollar contract during the offseason as a backup plan in case they don't get Luck in the draft? scary prospect, i know, but what if that's what is really going on.

Rascal
10-03-2011, 09:08 AM
I can't help but laugh

Gort
10-03-2011, 09:08 AM
Nah, if I'm Fox I sit Orton and I put Tebow in because he's the only QB on the roster with a long term contract. He doesn't need to explain jack crap to the team. They are down by 30 points, it's time to see something different.

i think Fox would have brought Tebow into the game again, but we didn't have another 1st down from our own 27 the whole game!

;)

Rascal
10-03-2011, 09:10 AM
I guess what amazes me is that our secondary gets lit up like a Christmas tree and here we are on Monday, going on and on and on about our QB.

Orton isn't very good but we have far more serious problems to address with our upcoming top-5 pick in the 2012 draft.

You old guys are smart.

Drek
10-03-2011, 09:34 AM
brace yourself! this may be aneurysm inducing, but what if Fox/Elway is evaluating Orton as our QBOTF and how he performs this season will dictate whether or not they give him a multi-year, multi-multi-million dollar contract during the offseason as a backup plan in case they don't get Luck in the draft? scary prospect, i know, but what if that's what is really going on.

If so then they should all be fired because Orton isn't the QB of the now, let alone QBOTF.

DrFate
10-03-2011, 09:39 AM
what if Fox/Elway is evaluating Orton as our QBOTF

Save me a ton of money the next few years on Sunday Ticket...

Pony Boy
10-03-2011, 09:49 AM
29293

TonyR
10-03-2011, 09:51 AM
you sure about that brosef?

Can you name an Urban Meyer QB who's been successful in the NFL? Maybe there is one that I don't know about?

Tombstone RJ
10-03-2011, 09:52 AM
Can you name an Urban Meyer QB who's been successful in the NFL? Maybe there is one that I don't know about?

Grossman? I keed... Isn't Cam Newton a spread offense QB?

DrFate
10-03-2011, 09:54 AM
Isn't Cam Newton a spread offense QB?

People keep ignoring this fact...

Cpntrips
10-03-2011, 10:01 AM
29293

LOL! I think that may be how he is thinking right about now.

BroncoBuff
10-03-2011, 10:02 AM
what if Fox/Elway is evaluating Orton as our QBOTF and how he performs this season will dictate whether or not they give him a multi-year, multi-multi-million dollar contract during the offseason.

Aaaaah, MY EYES!!!

Galt, you realize we can't un-read that, right?

BroncoBuff
10-03-2011, 10:04 AM
Can you name an Urban Meyer QB who's been successful in the NFL? Maybe there is one that I don't know about?

Haven't you heard? Jim Harbaugh has confidence in Alex Smith.

teknic
10-03-2011, 10:08 AM
I think the thing that pisses me off most is the whole "snaps from under center" bullcrap.

Orton takes very few snaps from under center because he sucks at it. He gives away screen passes because his drop back on screens is so distinct (he shuffles backwards). He tends to audible out of under center to shotgun due to the fact that he can't deal with blitzes on a 5 step drop back play.

Its retarded that this team argues that Tebow needs more practice under center when its obvious that we don't play under center enough to warrant it. 80% of the time we are under center, its a run or play action pass, which Tebow can do fine.

If Tebow isn't playing after the bye, i'm done for the season. Can't deal with watching Orton. My brother in law was laughing his ass off yesterday as I predicted every move Orton made before he made them, even the picks. He's boring, average and doesn't win.

That's a really good point. The biggest complaints about Tebow are that he hasn't had a lot of experience dropping back from center and has erratic accuracy on short passes.

Do the same people that complain about Tebow even watch Orton play? Or do they just check his stat line and see that he threw for 300yds? Because honestly, Orton's accuracy is terrible. Orton's lucky to have a guy like Lloyd that has the ability to adjust to poor throws and make unbelievable catches.

Not only that, but Orton also tends to lock on to Lloyd, throw into double coverage often, and also misses reads down the field often. In all fairness, I don't know what the play calls are, or the progression of the reads, but I don't think the play call was to miss the guy running wide open 20yds down the field and either throw to Lloyd in double coverage or dump it off to a RB.

We have the best (college) shotgun QB of all time sitting on the bench, yet we play the immobile and frustrating Kyle Orton and let him throw it out of the shotgun the entire game...???

Gort
10-03-2011, 10:12 AM
That's a really good point. The biggest complaints about Tebow are that he hasn't had a lot of experience dropping back from center and has erratic accuracy on short passes.

Do the same people that complain about Tebow even watch Orton play? Or do they just check his stat line and see that he threw for 300yds? Because honestly, Orton's accuracy is terrible. Orton's lucky to have a guy like Lloyd that has the ability to adjust to poor throws and make unbelievable catches.

Not only that, but Orton also tends to lock on to Lloyd, throw into double coverage often, and also misses reads down the field often. In all fairness, I don't know what the play calls are, or the progression of the reads, but I don't think the play call was to miss the guy running wide open 20yds down the field and either throw to Lloyd in double coverage or dump it off to a RB.

We have the best (college) shotgun QB of all time sitting on the bench, yet we play the immobile and frustrating Kyle Orton and let him throw it out of the shotgun the entire game...???

did you see Orton scramble for the 1st down yesterday? the grass on my lawn grew 2" in the time it took him to get there.

GreeleyGrizzley
10-03-2011, 10:15 AM
I saw the scramble in person, and laughed out loud. Right there in section 122. You should've seen these Packers fans, looking at me like I was crazy. I know I looked it. I just saw Orton run for a first down, what other reaction was there.

Jay3
10-03-2011, 10:35 AM
No team can run consistenty from the shotgun in the NFL. Tebow is slower than 9 guys on GB's defense. Den ran for 5.2 yds per carry out of a traditional set. The difference is that the running back is moving forward at the snap, and gets to the line a step faster than Tebow can out of the shot gun.

That would be illegal procedure. RB can't be moving forward at the snap of the ball. In fact, he's at a slight disadvantage because he has an exchange to make.

There's a reason wildcat worked for running plays -- it's a very efficient way to run (off of direct snap). The problem is that against traditional wildcat the defense can stack against run.

Drek
10-03-2011, 10:51 AM
Grossman? I keed... Isn't Cam Newton a spread offense QB?

Cam Newton is a spread QB. He actually started out at Florida, as Tim Tebow's backup. He left because he's a poor character idiot and because he was FAR inferior to Tebow and so wasn't going to play until Tebow left.

But Cam was a #1 overall pick and he's throwing for >300 yards a game in a two TE offense. Tebow? Obviously not NFL ready, don't even let him step on the field. Never mind that he was far superior to Newton in college and was the most dynamic player in college football for three straight seasons, while Newton only started one year of D1A football.

He's also at least Newton's peer as a pure athlete, but again, lets keep the facts out of this.

TonyR
10-03-2011, 10:58 AM
^ I don't know, Drek, I recall a couple of guys beating out a guy named Tom Brady at Michigan, too. College performance does not even begin to predict NFL results. And Newton clearly doesn't have some of Tebow's flaws. You didn't hear nearly as many "experts" saying Newton wasn't a pro prospect the way you did with Tebow. There's probably a reason for that.

Lolad
10-03-2011, 10:59 AM
brace yourself! this may be aneurysm inducing, but what if Fox/Elway is evaluating Orton as our QBOTF and how he performs this season will dictate whether or not they give him a multi-year, multi-multi-million dollar contract during the offseason as a backup plan in case they don't get Luck in the draft? scary prospect, i know, but what if that's what is really going on.

I belies this is what they are doing because fox has said

We need our starting quarterback to get experience for us to improve. That's the idea behind that. You know he needs to get better in our system," Fox said. "I know he gets judged on the past couple of years, but we're trying to get him better in our system and use that experience to get better."

The FO thinks this is Orton's 1st year learning a "new" system. They will resin him for at least 3 years

Hulamau
10-03-2011, 11:28 AM
I guess what amazes me is that our secondary gets lit up like a Christmas tree and here we are on Monday, going on and on and on about our QB.

Orton isn't very good but we have far more serious problems to address with our upcoming top-5 pick in the 2012 draft.

An Oasis of reason in a sea of hysteria!

Fox made a stupid off the cuff remark about playing Tebow one play and it didn't work. But that wasn't how it was at all. Read the Denver post and other reports this morning. Besides Fox forte isn't public speaking nor is he known for his pithy nuanced statements to the press, that much is obvious. But it doesn't make him a bad coach and nothing he has done so far confirms that he is.

Its far too early for that assessment and the shrill crowd here needs to go look in your bathroom mirror, slap yourselves in the face while saying three times ..."'I'm over-reacting like a spoiled whiny school girl" then go about your day.

They had practiced all week for Tebow to have a significant roll at QB in sparking the run game with some passing too. But when we got lit up so early, followed by Orton's untimely pick 6 and that followed quickly by the special teams being asleep at the wheel and giving up the onsides kick and another quick 7 we were down 21- 3 and our whole game plan to slow the Packers jugger-naught by using Tebow to spark a ball control run game went up in flames!!

Even Tebow said so afterward and that the plan to use him a lot was scuddled because 'once it turned into a pure passing game shoot out there wasn't the opportunity ... ' for him to come in.

Yes it would have been emotionally satisfying to see Tebow when all was lost, and I can understand the sentiment, but with such a highly charged atmosphere around Tebow and Orton Id rather see him come in with a plan and in a game we can possibly win.

There was no winning that game yesterday, specially with Champ out! The two prior weeks it was painfully apparent to the entire NFL that our secondary is a sieve without Champ to at least slow things down to a contest.

When you are forced to play one late round rookie DB, one rookie FA DB and a second year FA along with a washed up utterly useless starting corner in Goodman against the receiving corp of the Packers with a red hot Rogers at QB in Lambeau Field you're gonna get pretty much just what we got.

Maybe it could have been two scores less painful without the obvious INTs that Orton should not have thrown, but we were pretty much toast with that secondary on the field no matter what Orton and the offense did yesterday.

Was Fox smart in not throwing Tebow into an obvious deep come back scenario where he would have to pass all day?? A solid argument can be made either way. One for the experience Tebow would get ... unpleasant though that would likely have been, and argument two .. Why risk ruining the guy when he is under such a microscope all ready by throwing him into a hopeless situation in which his main asset is largely neutralized going in during a game that is lost?

In any event, this team is in rebuilding mode and desperately thin in the secondary and without the one guy there that is critical to provide any glue at all to prevent these run away games against good passing teams. Tebow will get his chance and likely sooner than later. But if Fox throws him in too early he risks losing a lot of the lockeroom too who still hold out hopes of making it at least respectable this year?

Tebow wasn't the answer nor even the question yesterday.

Tombstone RJ
10-03-2011, 11:33 AM
^ I don't know, Drek, I recall a couple of guys beating out a guy named Tom Brady at Michigan, too. College performance does not even begin to predict NFL results. And Newton clearly doesn't have some of Tebow's flaws. You didn't hear nearly as many "experts" saying Newton wasn't a pro prospect the way you did with Tebow. There's probably a reason for that.

His mechanics are the main reason Tebow is not as well liked as Newton. Tebow is a lefty with a long delivery. Neither of those help him. Newton on the other hand "looks" more pro-ready due to his delivery and he's a better pure athlete.

Rohirrim
10-03-2011, 11:35 AM
An Oasis of reason in a sea of hysteria!

Fox made a stupid off the cuff remark about playing Tebow one play and it didn't work. But that wasn't how it was at all. Read the Denver post and other reports this morning. Besides Fox forte isn't public speaking nor is he known for his pithy nuanced statements to the press, that much is obvious. But it doesn't make him a bad coach and nothing he has done so far confirms that he is.

Its far too early for that assessment and the shrill crowd here needs to go look in your bathroom mirror, slap yourselves in the face while saying three times ..."'I'm over-reacting like a spoiled whiny school girl" then go about your day.

They had practiced all week for Tebow to have a significant roll at QB in sparking the run game with some passing too. But when we got lit up so early, followed by Orton's untimely pick 6 and that followed quickly by the special teams being asleep at the wheel and giving up the onsides kick and another quick 7 we were down 21- 3 and our whole game plan to slow the Packers jugger-naught by using Tebow to spark a ball control run game went up in flames!!

Even Tebow said so afterward and that the plan to use him a lot was scuddled because 'once it turned into a pure passing game shoot out there wasn't the opportunity ... ' for him to come in.

Yes it would have been emotionally satisfying to see Tebow when all was lost, and I can understand the sentiment, but with such a highly charged atmosphere around Tebow and Orton Id rather see him come in with a plan and in a game we can possibly win.

There was no winning that game yesterday, specially with Champ out! The two prior weeks it was painfully apparent to the entire NFL that our secondary is a sieve without Champ to at least slow things down to a contest.

When you are forced to play one late round rookie DB, one rookie FA DB and a second year FA along with a washed up utterly useless starting corner in Goodman against the receiving corp of the Packers with a red hot Rogers at QB in Lambeau Field you're gonna get pretty much just what we got.

Maybe it could have been two scores less painful without the obvious INTs that Orton should not have thrown, but we were pretty much toast with that secondary on the field no matter what Orton and the offense did yesterday.

Was Fox smart in not throwing Tebow into an obvious deep come back scenario where he would have to pass all day?? A solid argument can be made either way. One for the experience Tebow would get ... unpleasant though that would likely have been, and argument two .. Why risk ruining the guy when he is under such a microscope all ready by throwing him into a hopeless situation in which his main asset is largely neutralized going in during a game that is lost?

In any event, this team is in rebuilding mode and desperately thin in the secondary and without the one guy there that is critical to provide any glue at all to prevent these run away games against good passing teams. Tebow will get his chance and likely sooner than later. But if Fox throws him in too early he risks losing a lot of the lockeroom too who still hold out hopes of making it at least respectable this year?

Tebow wasn't the answer nor even the question yesterday.

Not to mention how good of a passer Aaron Rodgers is. Some of those passes were jaw droppers.

Drek
10-03-2011, 11:39 AM
^ I don't know, Drek, I recall a couple of guys beating out a guy named Tom Brady at Michigan, too. College performance does not even begin to predict NFL results. And Newton clearly doesn't have some of Tebow's flaws. You didn't hear nearly as many "experts" saying Newton wasn't a pro prospect the way you did with Tebow. There's probably a reason for that.

Yeah. Newton is a story they can push in a positive light, while Tebow is one they push in the negative.

Tim Tebow was miles ahead of Newton in college. Even Newton's Heismann year was inferior to what Tebow did as a sophomore. Yet somehow the physics of throwing a football and running completely change when you get to the NFL?

Its all about what skin you have in the game. Much of the sports media chose that Tebow's run away success in college and heart on his sleeve religious views made him great fodder for a "can't succeed" plot line where they run him into the ground repeatedly.

Newton not succeeding is no big deal, everyone just assumes he's Akili Smith 2.0 and move on. So any success he has is worth promoting.

All the media "experts" rant about how Tebow can't play QB and has all these flaws, ignoring that most of those flaws are held by other mobile "gunslinger" type QBs like Favre, Elway, Young, Staubach, etc..

Everyone ignores when people like Bill Parcells, Dan Reeves, Rich Gannon, Steve Young (who initially hated on Tebow like no one else), Bill Belichick, etc. comment on Tebow and talk about all his potential. Those opinions from highly qualified people on the QB position in the NFL, not just some dude who once played FB in the NFL or some guy who watches college football games and sells himself as an "analyst", are always suppressed and never talked about because to do so acknowledges a serious flaw in how the NFL front offices run their business and how the media has been selling us Tim Tebow.

His mechanics are the main reason Tebow is not as well liked as Newton. Tebow is a lefty with a long delivery. Neither of those help him. Newton on the other hand "looks" more pro-ready due to his delivery and he's a better pure athlete.

No he's not.

Newton ran a faster 40 yard time. Tebow had a better 10 yard time, vertical, and 3 cone drill. From a pure athlete standpoint Tebow destroys Newton inside 20 yards. Until Newton can open up his long stride Tebow is faster and more explosive than him.

You know, the kinds of situations in which a QB is asked to run in the NFL.

One would think that after seeing Tebow run roughshod over a top 5 defense in Oakland last year that people would stop discounting his athleticism, but no, he's still supposedly not enough of an athlete to run in the NFL.

Dedhed
10-03-2011, 11:45 AM
^ I don't know, Drek, I recall a couple of guys beating out a guy named Tom Brady at Michigan, too. College performance does not even begin to predict NFL results. And Newton clearly doesn't have some of Tebow's flaws. You didn't hear nearly as many "experts" saying Newton wasn't a pro prospect the way you did with Tebow. There's probably a reason for that.

Name another NFL QB who Lloyd Carr made successful from Michigan. It only takes one.

And how many of those experts were calling Tom Brady a pro prospect. We all saw Tebow with our own eyes last year, and people making arguments like this just either refuse to accept that we saw a raw effective QB, exactly like Newton's been, or they just dismiss the 3 starts out of hand; while calling Newton God after his 3 starts.

TailgateNut
10-03-2011, 11:51 AM
All of that INCORRECT :bs: sounds real good/smart, just as long as you don't actually look at the results of Tebow's NFL rushing.

(for now, we'll just ignore Tim's Rookie NFL & Bronco Team rushing records)

2010 43 for 227 yds, 5.3 ypc with 6 TD's and ZERO lost possession fumbles.
That was better production than the Bucs All Pro FB Mike 'A-Train' Alstott had as a rookie.

2011 Preseason:
Passing 20 of 31 for 310 yds, 64.5%, 10 yds/Att, 15.5 yds/Comp, 1 TD, 0 Ints, Rating 108.3
Rushing 8 for 55 yds, 6.9 ypc, 2 TD's, 0 lost poss fumbles.

Unlike what many think/claim, Tim only ran the ball 20% of the time.
But so what on the 20% runs, cause they went for 6.9 FREAKIN' yds/play on average.

Tim had the best Bronco yds/carry in the 2010 season, all positions.
Tim had the best Bronco yds/carry in the 2011 preseason, all positions.
Makes sense to NOT USE THAT MUCH NEEDED RUSHING TALENT, doesn't it? :nutkick

PS

Most of Tim's Bronco snaps were actually not taken from the shotgun, but a lot of lead-azz Orton's are.


Could you post this drivel again, I wasn't able to read it the first 100 times.

Slurp, slurp!

TonyR
10-03-2011, 12:45 PM
Not to mention how good of a passer Aaron Rodgers is. Some of those passes were jaw droppers.

As I said in another thread today, he/they did the same thing to Atl in the playoffs last year with a similar result.

Dedhed
10-03-2011, 01:11 PM
Not to mention how good of a passer Aaron Rodgers is. Some of those passes were jaw droppers.

My favorite part of the game yesterday was listening to Phil Simms backpedal from his take that Rodgers wasn't going to be good in the NFL because of his motion.

And then praising the new motion because it's more fluid and less prototypical.

Black96WS6
10-03-2011, 01:19 PM
Just watched a second of the presser. Someone asked about why they didn't use Tebow.

"We did it once, and we lost yardage, and therefore it didn't prove to be beneficial"

Utterly ridiculous statement. So you tried it ONCE and just because it didn't work that time, you just give up on it, never to try again??

What would Fox have done after Peyton Manning's first season then? You know, the one where he threw all those interceptions?

"Well, Peyton didn't have a great 1st season, so, we're going in another direction next year. I've traded Peyton to the Raiders for a high 3rd round draft choice next year..."

Drek
10-03-2011, 01:30 PM
Not to mention how good of a passer Aaron Rodgers is. Some of those passes were jaw droppers.

So deep passing kicked our asses yesterday?

Funny that the QB on our team with the best deep ball happens to be the guy we took in the first round last year. Most scouts, even those down on him, praised his deep ball. But in a league all about throwing bombs we'll go with the guy who throws to his first check down as soon as he finishes his drop.

Black96WS6
10-03-2011, 01:34 PM
http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTuot4NeRJcMsbcxbL-66zG47xafaGzrxwas3da6c0-OWQqrCFitw

John Fox....makes Mike Shanahan....look like Vince Lombardi.

:afro:

TheDave
10-03-2011, 01:36 PM
So deep passing kicked our asses yesterday?



No a deadly accurate QB did it with a vertical spread game that Tebow couldn't run to save his life. Aaron Rodgers is probably the most accurate QB in the game, and that is saying something with the likes of Brady, Manning, and Brees still around.

Sorry boss, but no matter how strong the McD is in you, there is no way you think Tebow is anywhere near as accurate as any of those guys.

peacepipe
10-03-2011, 01:39 PM
I'm guessing it will look something like what we saw from Quinn against Arizona.

what?! you telling me fans will be biased in there judgement & ignore the 2 other games he played.

MplsBronco
10-03-2011, 01:40 PM
No a deadly accurate QB did it with a vertical spread game that Tebow couldn't run to save his life. Aaron Rodgers is probably the most accurate QB in the game, and that is saying something with the likes of Brady, Manning, and Brees still around.

Sorry boss, but no matter how strong the McD is in you, there is no way you think Tebow is anywhere near as accurate as any of those guys.

If Tebow gets his chance and succeeds, will you go away? Please?

TheDave
10-03-2011, 01:41 PM
If Tebow gets his chance and succeeds, will you go away? Please?

Nope... If we cut him will you?

TheReverend
10-03-2011, 01:42 PM
No a deadly accurate QB did it with a vertical spread game that Tebow couldn't run to save his life. Aaron Rodgers is probably the most accurate QB in the game, and that is saying something with the likes of Brady, Manning, and Brees still around.

Sorry boss, but no matter how strong the McD is in you, there is no way you think Tebow is anywhere near as accurate as any of those guys.

One small problem with this:

Completely ignoring Rogers performance, against Campbell (who was busy handing off to throw), Andy Dalton in his 2nd ever NFL start (after a lockout season), and Matt Hasselbeck (with a brand new system in a brand new supporting cast, with Britt injured most of the game etc), we gave up a 106.8 QBR, 67.7% completion, 5 TDs and forced no interceptions.

So by "small problem" with your post I really mean, "completely wrong".

Doggcow
10-03-2011, 01:43 PM
Utterly ridiculous statement. So you tried it ONCE and just because it didn't work that time, you just give up on it, never to try again??

What would Fox have done after Peyton Manning's first season then? You know, the one where he threw all those interceptions?

"Well, Peyton didn't have a great 1st season, so, we're going in another direction next year. I've traded Peyton to the Raiders for a high 3rd round draft choice next year..."

LOL You think he would have made it through a season?

More like "Well we tried passing, but he threw an incompletion, so we're going to cut him"

teknic
10-03-2011, 01:44 PM
Fox made a stupid off the cuff remark about playing Tebow one play and it didn't work. But that wasn't how it was at all. Read the Denver post and other reports this morning. Besides Fox forte isn't public speaking nor is he known for his pithy nuanced statements to the press, that much is obvious. But it doesn't make him a bad coach and nothing he has done so far confirms that he is.

I do like the guy, he was my pick to replace McD. But for a veteran coach, his clock management is unacceptable. Taking a knee to end the half yesterday with 30s and all three timeouts was a bonehead move. We were already losing and the Packers got the ball to start the second half.

I really wish Fox would just play Tebow and appease the fanbase. Most of us have realized that the Broncos have too many issues to be competing for a super bowl this year, and in all likelihood will end up drafting in the top 10-15. Orton's gone at the end of the season anyways, if Tebow tanks we should end up with a decent draft pick, or if he succeeds, the Broncos can concentrate on drafting defense. In my opinion, the difference between Orton starting or Tebow starting is 2-3 wins. On a season where you're probably not going to sniff .500, I could care less about watching Orton eek out a few extra wins (not that I think he would).

TheDave
10-03-2011, 01:44 PM
One small problem with this:

Against Campbell (who was busy handing off to throw), Andy Dalton in his 2nd ever NFL start (after a lockout season), and Matt Hasselbeck (with a brand new system in a brand new supporting cast, with Britt injured most of the game etc), we gave up a 106.8 QBR, 67.7% completion, 5 TDs and forced no interceptions.

So by "small problem" with your post I really mean, "completely wrong".

Rev your trying way too hard to be right... None of what you said has anything to do with my post.

MVPlaya II - Electric Boogaloo
10-03-2011, 01:47 PM
No a deadly accurate QB did it with a vertical spread game that Tebow couldn't run to save his life. Aaron Rodgers is probably the most accurate QB in the game, and that is saying something with the likes of Brady, Manning, and Brees still around.

Sorry boss, but no matter how strong the McD is in you, there is no way you think Tebow is anywhere near as accurate as any of those guys.

I really don't think you know Tebow at all. He's an accurate passer if ANYTHING.

Didn't Tebow run a spread in college and set records with it?

MplsBronco
10-03-2011, 01:48 PM
Nope... If we cut him will you?

If we cut him and he goes on to succeed somewhere else, I just might. You see, it's not Tebow over team for me. I want Tebow to play because I think it is in the best long term interest of the Broncos, whether he succeeds or fails. At least we would know what we have.

If the FO continues to F this up and cut/trade him and he goes on to tear it up somewhere else, I will question why I would give a damn about this team anymore until there are serious changes at the top.

You have a vendetta against Tebow and state that he will suck as if it fact when it is simply your lousy opinion.

TheDave
10-03-2011, 01:48 PM
I really don't think you know Tebow at all. He's an accurate passer if ANYTHING.

Like I said... Another MacGruder/AphaSieera Handle

Rohirrim
10-03-2011, 01:49 PM
So deep passing kicked our asses yesterday?

Funny that the QB on our team with the best deep ball happens to be the guy we took in the first round last year. Most scouts, even those down on him, praised his deep ball. But in a league all about throwing bombs we'll go with the guy who throws to his first check down as soon as he finishes his drop.

I didn't say anything about "deep" passes, although those looked pretty damn good. I was more impressed with the tiny windows he could zip it into. I've never seen anything approaching that kind of accuracy out of Tebow. I doubt the coaching staff has either.

MVPlaya II - Electric Boogaloo
10-03-2011, 01:50 PM
Like I said... Another MacGruder/AphaSieera Handle

Anytime you need to change the subject off of football, I think you've realized that you have no idea what you're talking about.

And nope.

Drek
10-03-2011, 01:50 PM
No a deadly accurate QB did it with a vertical spread game that Tebow couldn't run to save his life. Aaron Rodgers is probably the most accurate QB in the game, and that is saying something with the likes of Brady, Manning, and Brees still around.

Sorry boss, but no matter how strong the McD is in you, there is no way you think Tebow is anywhere near as accurate as any of those guys.

You do know that almost all the same criticisms of Tebow were made of Rodgers right?

Throws funny. Check.
His college coach never developed an NFL QB. Check.
He's inaccurate/has no touch on short passes. Check.
Spent most of college in shotgun. Check.
Too willing to run with the football, exposes himself to hits. Check.

Both happen to throw one of the most beautiful deep balls I've ever seen by the way. I'm not comparing Tebow to Rodgers as of yesterday, but coming out of college they had a mountain of similarities.

TheReverend
10-03-2011, 01:51 PM
Rev your trying way too hard to be right... None of what you said has anything to do with my post.

You responded to the part of his post that was talking defense... and your response certainly doesn't reflect the reality that our defense has been making every QB look like an all pro no matter how pedestrian they've been.

Feel free to go back to talking about Tebow though. That's proven productive.

MVPlaya II - Electric Boogaloo
10-03-2011, 01:52 PM
You do know that almost all the same criticisms of Tebow were made of Rodgers right?

Throws funny. Check.
His college coach never developed an NFL QB. Check.
He's inaccurate/has no touch on short passes. Check.
Spent most of college in shotgun. Check.
Too willing to run with the football, exposes himself to hits. Check.

Both happen to throw one of the most beautiful deep balls I've ever seen by the way. I'm not comparing Tebow to Rodgers as of yesterday, but coming out of college they had a mountain of similarities.

except Tebow's intangibles and leadership >>>

TheDave
10-03-2011, 01:52 PM
If we cut him and he goes on to succeed somewhere else, I just might.

Fair enough... why don't you get a head start and root for the Rams. From what I can tell the Only guy that buys tebow 100% is coaching over there now.

You have a vendetta against Tebow and state that he will suck as if it fact when it is simply your lousy opinion.

Because I like most people do not believe he is an NFL QB... I have a vendetta. The desperation in some of you is amazing to watch.

TheDave
10-03-2011, 01:53 PM
You responded to the part of his post that was talking defense... and your response certainly doesn't reflect the reality that our defense has been making every QB look like an all pro no matter how pedestrian they've been.

Feel free to go back to talking about Tebow though. That's proven productive.

No I responded to the part that said we lost to the deep ball... Try reading it again.

Pony Boy
10-03-2011, 01:53 PM
No a deadly accurate QB did it with a vertical spread game that Tebow couldn't run to save his life. Aaron Rodgers is probably the most accurate QB in the game, and that is saying something with the likes of Brady, Manning, and Brees still around.
Sorry boss, but no matter how strong the McD is in you, there is no way you think Tebow is anywhere near as accurate as any of those guys.

Whats funny is to look back and see Alex Smith was taken #1 that year by the 49ers, what's worse is QB Matt Jones was taken as a wr in front of Rogers.

MplsBronco
10-03-2011, 01:55 PM
Fair enough... why don't you get a head start and root for the Rams. From what I can tell the Only guy that buys tebow 100% is coaching over there now.



Because I like most people do not believe he is an NFL QB... I have a vendetta. The desperation in some of you is amazing to watch.

No, your schtick is old and tired, probably because you are also. You and Merril Hoge should hang out sometime. I am sure that would be a very enlightening conversation the two of you would have.

Again, you are stating things as fact "most people do not believe he is an NFL QB" when it is a lousy opinion or flat out lie.

TheDave
10-03-2011, 01:56 PM
You do know that almost all the same criticisms of Tebow were made of Rodgers right?



No they were not... your memory keeps getting worse. In case you forgot Tebow as easily the most controversial QB comming out of the draft. Rogers, on the other hand spent most of the offseason being touted as a possibility for the #1 pick.

Meanwhile tebow was often spoken of as a 3rd round pick.

TheDave
10-03-2011, 01:58 PM
No, your schtick is old and tired, probably because you are also. You and Merril Hoge should hang out sometime. I am sure that would be a very enlightening conversation the two of you would have.

Again, you are stating things as fact "most people do not believe he is an NFL QB" when it is a lousy opinion or flat out lie.

Yep... I'm in the moinority.

Meanwhile your boy and his skills are 3rd string. But I'm the one who doesn't get it.

OK... Good luck with that.

zdoor
10-03-2011, 02:01 PM
No they were not... your memory keeps getting worse. In case you forgot Tebow as easily the most controversial QB comming out of the draft. Rogers, on the other hand spent most of the offseason being touted as a possibility for the #1 pick.

Meanwhile tebow was often spoken of as a 3rd round pick.

While this is true to my recollection. Most of the same things said about Tebow were definitely said about Newton...

TheReverend
10-03-2011, 02:01 PM
No I responded to the part that said we lost to the deep ball... Try reading it again.

Yes, you then focus on Rogers accuracy etc... so I replied showing you we gave poor quality QBs a 67.7 completion % and 106.8 QBRs before Rogers even realized we were on the schedule.

teknic
10-03-2011, 02:03 PM
No a deadly accurate QB did it with a vertical spread game that Tebow couldn't run to save his life. Aaron Rodgers is probably the most accurate QB in the game, and that is saying something with the likes of Brady, Manning, and Brees still around.

Sorry boss, but no matter how strong the McD is in you, there is no way you think Tebow is anywhere near as accurate as any of those guys.

C'mon, give Tebow some credit, will you? Throwing the deep ball is one of Tebow's best assets. His ability to run may cause other teams to play closer to the line of scrimmage, or to leave a defender to spy for most of the game, which opens up the long pass. Tebow will read the deep route first, and if it's not there, he likes to run. I don't think that's a bad thing, a power running game and deep passing game are good complements. The play action would be deadly.

I happen to like the idea of Tebow throwing a few bombs to Lloyd every game. I can tell you this, if Tebow had been playing yesterday, Lloyd could have walked that long pass from the flea flicker into the endzone.

24champ
10-03-2011, 02:03 PM
Yep... I'm in the moinority.

Meanwhile your boy and his skills are 3rd string. But I'm the one who doesn't get it.

OK... Good luck with that.

Dave, I ask this with respect.

Are you actually defending Orton and this regime?

DrFate
10-03-2011, 02:07 PM
Dave, I ask this with respect.

Are you actually defending Orton and this regime?

he hates Tebow - that much I know. Normally his ramblings are not sufficiently coherent to draw further conclusions

MplsBronco
10-03-2011, 02:08 PM
Yep... I'm in the moinority.

Meanwhile your boy and his skills are 3rd string. But I'm the one who doesn't get it.
OK... Good luck with that.

Again, stating lies as fact.

MplsBronco
10-03-2011, 02:11 PM
Yep... I'm in the moinority.
Meanwhile your boy and his skills are 3rd string. But I'm the one who doesn't get it.

OK... Good luck with that.

Oh, and if most don't think he will be an NFL QB, then why was he projected 3rd rounder, as stated in a previous post by you. Funny, I wouldn't think someone who can't play in the league would be drafted in the 3rd round. You make no sense.

OABB
10-03-2011, 02:12 PM
Again, stating lies as fact.

That's what The Dave does. but It's not his fault. He was born with a bad brain that makes him depressed AND stupid. He has a brain worm. He will tell you all about it sometime.

Methinks the worm is eating the logic centers of his brain.

24champ
10-03-2011, 02:14 PM
That's what The Dave does. but It's not his fault. He was born with a bad brain that makes him depressed AND stupid. He has a brain worm. He will tell you all about it sometime.

Methinks the worm is eating the logic centers of his brain.

TheDave is smarter than you ever will be, bud.

TheDave
10-03-2011, 02:17 PM
Dave, I ask this with respect.

Are you actually defending Orton and this regime?

No... Unfortunately I don't think we have anyone good enough to consider a franchise QB. I realize this ruffles some people feathers but II'm not alone.

Our only hope is finding someone in the draft.

TheDave
10-03-2011, 02:19 PM
Oh, and if most don't think he will be an NFL QB, then why was he projected 3rd rounder, as stated in a previous post by you. Funny, I wouldn't think someone who can't play in the league would be drafted in the 3rd round. You make no sense.

Because that is what a project is... you take a flyer on them and see of they will develop.

I don't think he will... You do. I have no idea why this is such a big deal for you.

TheDave
10-03-2011, 02:20 PM
Again, stating lies as fact.

You sure thats a lie? 'Cause acording to the local media that what he is.

TheDave
10-03-2011, 02:21 PM
TheDave is smarter than you ever will be, bud.

He reminds me so much of some of the delinquents I've taught... ;D

24champ
10-03-2011, 02:21 PM
No... Unfortunately I don't think we have anyone good enough to consider a franchise QB. I realize this ruffles some people feathers but II'm not alone.

Our only hope is finding someone in the draft.

That may be, but I don't understand why we can't find out if Tebow is that guy or not. I think most people want to see him in that role, see if he can do it or not. If not, then everyone can move on.

MplsBronco
10-03-2011, 02:21 PM
Because that is what a project is... you take a flyer on them and see of they will develop.

I don't think he will... You do. I have no idea why this is such a big deal for you.

That's fine, keep it at that. I don't know of anyone in here claiming he will be a pro-bowler, winner of multiple SBs. Hell, I don't know if he will succeed. I just want to see what he has on the field. You and others on here state as fact that he will suck when the fact is you don't know.

TheDave
10-03-2011, 02:25 PM
That may be, but I don't understand why we can't find out if Tebow is that guy or not. I think most people want to see him in that role, see if he can do it or not. If not, then everyone can move on.

I have no problem with starting him after the Bye. He showed up to camp unpreparred and Orton earned the right to start the season.

at 1-4 Orton has officially lost said right and Tebow should get another shot.

I just do not have a lot of faith in him unless they radically shange the system and unfortunately, I have not seen anything telling me that they will do this.

teknic
10-03-2011, 02:27 PM
Because that is what a project is... you take a flyer on them and see of they will develop.

I don't think he will... You do. I have no idea why this is such a big deal for you.

It would be nice if he actually had a chance to "develop" though. Throwing to the practice squad isn't particularly useful.

TheReverend
10-03-2011, 02:28 PM
I have no problem with starting him after the Bye. He showed up to camp unpreparred and Orton earned the right to start the season.

at 1-4 Orton has officially lost said right and Tebow should get another shot.

I just do not have a lot of faith in him unless they radically shange the system and unfortunately, I have not seen anything telling me that they will do this.

Missing even a limited off-season worth of reps is on the FO.

OABB
10-03-2011, 03:02 PM
TheDave is smarter than you ever will be, bud.


Heres a quiz...
Do you believe depression comes from living a life that is depressing, or from an imaginary worm in your brain from birth?

fontaine
10-03-2011, 03:40 PM
You do know that almost all the same criticisms of Tebow were made of Rodgers right?

Throws funny. Check.
His college coach never developed an NFL QB. Check.
He's inaccurate/has no touch on short passes. Check.
Spent most of college in shotgun. Check.
Too willing to run with the football, exposes himself to hits. Check.

Both happen to throw one of the most beautiful deep balls I've ever seen by the way. I'm not comparing Tebow to Rodgers as of yesterday, but coming out of college they had a mountain of similarities.

That's interesting because Rogers ended up changing his delivery/throwing motion a few years ago. Simms went at length about it in the game.

Archer81
10-03-2011, 03:43 PM
That's interesting because Rogers ended up changing his delivery/throwing motion a few years ago. Simms went at length about it in the game.


And Rodgers became what he is when he started doing what felt comfortable rather than what a typical QB does.

Lesson there, I think. Tebow, fix your foot placement. Throw it the way you throw it. The rest will follow.

:Broncos:

Rohirrim
10-03-2011, 03:46 PM
No... Unfortunately I don't think we have anyone good enough to consider a franchise QB. I realize this ruffles some people feathers but II'm not alone.

Our only hope is finding someone in the draft.

Yep. We have one 1st string QB who would make a solid backup QB elsewhere, and two QBs who can't take the job away from him.

Rohirrim
10-03-2011, 03:47 PM
That's interesting because Rogers ended up changing his delivery/throwing motion a few years ago. Simms went at length about it in the game.

Yeah. He did. I found it an interesting point.

Hulamau
10-03-2011, 04:11 PM
Not to mention how good of a passer Aaron Rodgers is. Some of those passes were jaw droppers.

No kidding Rohirrim, the only thing stopping me from cheering was he wasn't wearing Orange and Blue!

Many of those passes were simply indefensible! He was a maestro in the groove with a bevy of top receivers to boot yesterday.

On the bright side we did pressure him more than he has been all year and our oline protected Orton quite well from GB vaunted rush.

The problem was, without Champ and having Cox screw up as well as Squid go down the last preseason game and then Champ still being out left us we with a gaping truck size RAPE hole in the secondary that everyone in the league knew about the last two weeks so it was a field day for GB and Rogers.

No contest... Orton didn't help himself with two bad INTs particularly the ill advised Pick 6 and the two short passes such as the one when we had a wide open TD as with Lloyd in the end zone.

We are what we are a rebuilding team with some signs of real improvement and a temporary but glaring weakness in the secondary now that any top tier passing team with a truly elite QB like Rogers will exploit all day long no matter what other style points we get for incremental interim 'improvement's'

The Key for some of the guys here to spare their adrenal glands the unnecessary stress burn out is to get a grip and a more realistic perspective of where we are in this rebuild process and adjust their week-to-week expectations accordingly.

Calling for Fox and Elway to be 'fired' now at this stage of their first Lockout delayed season is the very height of laughably childish idiocy and tantrum-laden numbskulllery!!

Hulamau
10-03-2011, 04:34 PM
No... Unfortunately I don't think we have anyone good enough to consider a franchise QB. I realize this ruffles some people feathers but I'm not alone.

Our only hope is finding someone in the draft.

Quoted for truth .. at this stage. 'Maybe' Tim can become that guy for us and I hope so!. He isnt close yet though and that is the truth, tegardless of how much all of us would love that to be true including TheDave. I know for sure has nothing against Tebow.. but Tim is not yet a complete QB at this level.

I agree at some point we have to see what he can do and se if he can develop of we have to move on quickly next year, but I have hunch Fox/Elway are not complete idiots and that they are NOT ANTI-TEBOW either as some of the guys here seem to assume. He sees a kid who has all the intangibles and also a team of veterans that wants to win now as well!

The dumbest thing Fox could do is bow to the pressures of a rabid and totally misinformed fan bases demands during his first lockout shortened season with so little time to develop Tim in their system, and yet choose him over Orton when Orton clearly beat him out and has the backing of the vast majority of the lockeroom!

Choosing Orton over Tim now doesn't mean they value Orton long term more than Tim, only that right now he has earned the right to lead the team FOR NOW and has earned that right inside that lockeroom most importantly. It doesn't mean Orton is a great QB or the answer for us... he is neither .. but at least at the outset of the season he earned the start. Soon that might change.

You want to lose the team fast before Fox even gets them out of the gate, then do that and give Tebow the reins when he hasn't earned it and before Orton has clearly lost it or while the team still has a chance to rebound and conceivably make a run for the playoffs! That is the very best way to prove to the players you are easily manipulated by an utterly fickle and ...at least to some degree ..unfortunately with a large segment of ignorant and knee-jerk reactionary members of the fan base .... there are exceptions of course.

Tebow will get his shot soon enough, if and when the die is cast on this season, which might be a few games after the bye if it keeps up like this? On the other hand, we might pull one out this week against SD get a bye to regroup some and string together a 60-40 record the rest of the way in which case Orton will likely be the guy a while longer...

Eventually this year, Id like to see what Tebow can really do as well, but not before he's ready and the situation truly supports it with the guys in the locker room as well with everyone behind him 100%.

Agamemnon
10-03-2011, 04:39 PM
I know for sure has nothing against Tebow.. but Tim is not yet a complete QB at this level.


Of course he's not. It takes years to become a complete quarterback. The guy needs to start getting experience on the field to develop and so we can see if he even has the potential to be one.

Hulamau
10-03-2011, 04:50 PM
I do like the guy, he was my pick to replace McD. But for a veteran coach, his clock management is unacceptable. Taking a knee to end the half yesterday with 30s and all three timeouts was a bonehead move. We were already losing and the Packers got the ball to start the second half.

I really wish Fox would just play Tebow and appease the fanbase. Most of us have realized that the Broncos have too many issues to be competing for a super bowl this year, and in all likelihood will end up drafting in the top 10-15. Orton's gone at the end of the season anyways, if Tebow tanks we should end up with a decent draft pick, or if he succeeds, the Broncos can concentrate on drafting defense. In my opinion, the difference between Orton starting or Tebow starting is 2-3 wins. On a season where you're probably not going to sniff .500, I could care less about watching Orton eek out a few extra wins (not that I think he would).

That's a fair point and it will likely come to that sooner rather than later, but Fox is far more concerned with satisfying the 53 guys in the locker room than anyone in the press or the fans at this point.

It gives Tim more time to get more comfortable in this system with the long Lockout and his obvious weakness and allow Fox to avoid looking like he is panicking and caving into to a bunch of knee jerk fans. It will happen before long ... maybe a half season longer than some here would like but at some point Tim will get his shot to see if he can do it.

There isn't a vet in that room that can't identify with Orton too at this point and would feel the slight if Fox just dumped him in a panic before it is obviously in the best interest of this season, every guy in that locker room and the future of this franchise to do so.

Tombstone RJ
10-03-2011, 04:54 PM
Yeah. Newton is a story they can push in a positive light, while Tebow is one they push in the negative.

Tim Tebow was miles ahead of Newton in college. Even Newton's Heismann year was inferior to what Tebow did as a sophomore. Yet somehow the physics of throwing a football and running completely change when you get to the NFL?

Its all about what skin you have in the game. Much of the sports media chose that Tebow's run away success in college and heart on his sleeve religious views made him great fodder for a "can't succeed" plot line where they run him into the ground repeatedly.

Newton not succeeding is no big deal, everyone just assumes he's Akili Smith 2.0 and move on. So any success he has is worth promoting.

All the media "experts" rant about how Tebow can't play QB and has all these flaws, ignoring that most of those flaws are held by other mobile "gunslinger" type QBs like Favre, Elway, Young, Staubach, etc..

Everyone ignores when people like Bill Parcells, Dan Reeves, Rich Gannon, Steve Young (who initially hated on Tebow like no one else), Bill Belichick, etc. comment on Tebow and talk about all his potential. Those opinions from highly qualified people on the QB position in the NFL, not just some dude who once played FB in the NFL or some guy who watches college football games and sells himself as an "analyst", are always suppressed and never talked about because to do so acknowledges a serious flaw in how the NFL front offices run their business and how the media has been selling us Tim Tebow.



No he's not.

Newton ran a faster 40 yard time. Tebow had a better 10 yard time, vertical, and 3 cone drill. From a pure athlete standpoint Tebow destroys Newton inside 20 yards. Until Newton can open up his long stride Tebow is faster and more explosive than him.

You know, the kinds of situations in which a QB is asked to run in the NFL.

One would think that after seeing Tebow run roughshod over a top 5 defense in Oakland last year that people would stop discounting his athleticism, but no, he's still supposedly not enough of an athlete to run in the NFL.

I'm not discounting Tebow's athleticism bro. I'm just acknowledge that Newton is black and Tebow is white. So take that my friend. :approve:

Rock Chalk
10-03-2011, 06:10 PM
This isn't good for my alcoholism.

On the contrary, its probably epically good for your alcoholism :)

Momentum
10-03-2011, 06:18 PM
As Aaron Rodgers just tried to drill into Broncos fans heads, it's a passing league. And they're still crying for the running QB who can't get out of the backfield. :rofl:

Quoted for truth.

Gort
10-03-2011, 06:29 PM
Quoted for truth.

why do you think Tebow is a running QB? he threw for 9000+ yards in college. Elway threw for 9300+ yards in college. was he a running QB too?

there's alot of bending of the truth by the anti-Tebow faction these days. it doesn't make sense to me. is there some sort of collective amnesia about what we saw at the end of last season? or what Tebow did in college? or is it just easier for some people to pigeon hole him and file him away as a gimmick-play player?

Dedhed
10-03-2011, 06:46 PM
Tim is not yet a complete QB at this level.


Of course he isn't, but Orton doesn't even have that as a possibility, and Tebow is never going to become one sitting on the bench.

BabyTO
10-04-2011, 12:31 AM
We feel Kyle Orton is our starting quarterback," Fox said. "We need our starting quarterback to get experience for us to improve. That's the idea behind that. You know he needs to get better in our system.

i guess when orton throws those game ending pick 6s it doesnt matter and he can just keep going and throw more interceptions. i cant believe this retard actually said the stuff he said on tebow. its so obvious that fox this fat turd doesn't want tebow to succeed.

our best bet right now is to hope that orton keeps playing, and that he keeps playing the way he does. because he's not gonna be pulled, and we're not gonna win. then hopefully we will get rid of those 3 stooges (elway, fox, orton) at once, when the season ends. if fox plays tebow this season it might help save his fat ass and thats not what i want, because this team will never have a winning record with fox coaching. i dont know how he still got a job after what he did in carolina. holy ****

Atwater His Ass
10-04-2011, 03:00 AM
Not trying to defend Orton, but why do people keep saying "game ending pick 6"?

Denver was able to pull back to 21-17 afterwards. I would almost argue that the team was looking ok at this point, all things considered. I'd say the collapse happened when GB scored at the end of the first half, going 80 yards in under 3 minutes. Game was over at that point, only to be confirmed with their opening drive in the 3rd quarter.

BabyTO
10-04-2011, 03:26 AM
Not trying to defend Orton

:homer:

the way you argue such thing as a game ending pick six doesn't exist. unless it happens with 1 second left on the clock and you're ahead by 6 points

to argue that orton cant be blamed since we never really were IN the game is not really helping ortons case all that much. its kind of his job to keep us in the game and help us win. and right now he sucks at it. with the running game we had yesterday, the receivers making plays the way they did, and the pass protection and all that considered, i'm 100% sure with tebow in at QB we would have performed way better. not saying we would have definitely won, because we played the packers and with them its more how your defense performs. but we would have definitely performed better. but hey, orton gives opponents uh i mean us the best chance to win :clown:

cutthemdown
10-04-2011, 03:35 AM
I still think Elway might throw Xandars out and make a bigger GM hire. Just a guess. Didn't want to do it this yr because of the lockout, Xandars knew the players better then a new guy would have had time to do.

Still some scapegoats left to use IMO.

Fire Elway, no way he hasn't done that bad. Miller looks like a solid pick, not sure about the other guys yet but miller looks good. Next yr we need to find another stud in the first round. Do that a few yrs and a row and it will make a big difference.

BabyTO
10-04-2011, 04:20 AM
I still think Elway might throw Xandars out and make a bigger GM hire. Just a guess. Didn't want to do it this yr because of the lockout, Xandars knew the players better then a new guy would have had time to do.

Still some scapegoats left to use IMO.

Fire Elway, no way he hasn't done that bad. Miller looks like a solid pick, not sure about the other guys yet but miller looks good. Next yr we need to find another stud in the first round. Do that a few yrs and a row and it will make a big difference.

elway is a glorified intern. they hired him to get into that twitter thing, announce things and handle the public relations stuff. he doesn't know **** about the players we drafted, that's our talent scouts, they've been scouting those players for years. elway doesnt even know the name of our current players. bunknee? hardy? Ha!

he's absolutely useless, just somebody the fans can relate to and to improve our image. and his comments on tebow suggest that he's 100% with fox on this issue. and if he is then we need go get rid of this clown as well. they're more busy with trying to be right and prove everyone that orton is the right guy instead of doing everything possible to make sure this team wins games. dont wait until the season is over before you admit a mistake, do it now, watch what tebow does. at least you can say that you tried everything if nothing works out, and then you can move on in the offseason and get a new franchise QB, if tebow plays that poorly. but his 2010 performance would suggest to me that he is our franchise QB

Blueflame
10-04-2011, 04:46 AM
elway is a glorified intern. they hired him to get into that twitter thing, announce things and handle the public relations stuff. he doesn't know **** about the players we drafted, that's our talent scouts, they've been scouting those players for years. elway doesnt even know the name of our current players. bunknee? hardy? Ha!

he's absolutely useless, just somebody the fans can relate to and to improve our image. and his comments on tebow suggest that he's 100% with fox on this issue. and if he is then we need go get rid of this clown as well. they're more busy with trying to be right and prove everyone that orton is the right guy instead of doing everything possible to make sure this team wins games. dont wait until the season is over before you admit a mistake, do it now, watch what tebow does. at least you can say that you tried everything if nothing works out, and then you can move on in the offseason and get a new franchise QB, if tebow plays that poorly. but his 2010 performance would suggest to me that he is our franchise QB

It's sad that anyone identifying himself as a "Bronco fan" nonchalantly disses the player who did the most for the franchise.

Obviously you're very young. But you just lost all credibility with me. Dismissed.

fontaine
10-04-2011, 04:49 AM
And Rodgers became what he is when he started doing what felt comfortable rather than what a typical QB does.

Lesson there, I think. Tebow, fix your foot placement. Throw it the way you throw it. The rest will follow.

:Broncos:

Sure, I agree. Tebow isn't going to fail in the NFL as a QB because of his footwork/mechanics. If he does fail it'll be for the same reasons as any other QB in not being able to read defenses/where the pressure is coming from, adjusting to the speed to secondaries, being accurate enough to complete passes to tighter windows than in college, and adjusting to the pass rush.

There are plenty of QBs that can do what Rogers does with a clean pocket, plenty of time and good WRs. Hell, Orton was 10 out of 10 against a weak secondary when the OL did a fantastic job and his WRs adjusted to his throws in the 2nd Quarter.

But what seperates Rogers/Brady is that they are still damn good under pressure, against the blitz, different coverages because they've got the mental aspect of the game locked down so they can still take that quick 5 step drop and release/make quick decisions when they have to.

Can Tebow do that? Who the hell knows? But he's got a great plan B in being able to rely on his running ability when things break down.

THAT'S why I think Tebow starting makes us a better offense. Not because he's going to be a good pocket passer in this 2nd year, but because we already know Orton fails misereably and consistently under any kind of pressure from the front 7. His completion % goes down to less than 40% in those situations where as Tebow can simply tuck it and run instead of throwing ints, fumbling, throwing the ball away or taking a sack.

In the very least that ability keeps drives alive.

fontaine
10-04-2011, 05:08 AM
And even if we draft a QB high next year (which we probably will), why throw him into the starting lineup?

Tebow will play this year, and even if we draft a QB next year, Tebow will still probably start to give the rookie some time.

Or if Tebow completely craps out this season, or starts demanding a trade (which could happen, wouldn't that be fun?) the FO goes with bringing in another veteran like Carson Palmer while the next year rookie sits and develops.

BabyTO
10-04-2011, 05:11 AM
It's sad that anyone identifying himself as a "Bronco fan" nonchalantly disses the player who did the most for the franchise.

Obviously you're very young. But you just lost all credibility with me. Dismissed.
what does one thing have to do with the other? because he was a great player im forced to say hes great at everything he does in his life now until he dies and even beyond that? talk about a homer :pigsfly:

Rabb
10-04-2011, 05:12 AM
Listening to the Duke over the last couple days on the radio and on his show, it's becoming more clear to me that I don't think he is much of an Orton fan either. They specifically asked about switching QBs and not once did I hear him flat out say "Kyle is our guy, end of story" it was an open-ended "we will evaluate every week" thing. He also mentioned that he thinks Tim knows the playbook and offense as well as anyone else and that he can do things the others simply cannot. On his show he also seemed pretty irritated about the pick six.

Maybe I just wasn't paying attention before, but Elway sure didn't seem to be backing anyone 100% really. It makes me wonder if this truly is in Fox's hands right now.

Blueflame
10-04-2011, 05:31 AM
what does one thing have to do with the other? because he was a great player im forced to say hes great at everything he does in his life now until he dies and even beyond that? talk about a homer :pigsfly:

Yes, I'm an Elway homer. Most Broncos fans are. You're free to think what you want. And I'm free to think you're wrong.

fontaine
10-04-2011, 05:44 AM
Listening to the Duke over the last couple days on the radio and on his show, it's becoming more clear to me that I don't think he is much of an Orton fan either. They specifically asked about switching QBs and not once did I hear him flat out say "Kyle is our guy, end of story" it was an open-ended "we will evaluate every week" thing. He also mentioned that he thinks Tim knows the playbook and offense as well as anyone else and that he can do things the others simply cannot. On his show he also seemed pretty irritated about the pick six.

Maybe I just wasn't paying attention before, but Elway sure didn't seem to be backing anyone 100% really. It makes me wonder if this truly is in Fox's hands right now.

Yeah I got the same impression. Elway kep talking about not turning the ball over and evaluating the QB position week to week.

It made a pretty strong change from the usual "Orton gives us the best chance to win" company line.

Tebow will get his start soon enough I think.

strafen
10-04-2011, 05:52 AM
:homer:

the way you argue such thing as a game ending pick six doesn't exist. unless it happens with 1 second left on the clock and you're ahead by 6 points

to argue that orton cant be blamed since we never really were IN the game is not really helping ortons case all that much. its kind of his job to keep us in the game and help us win. and right now he sucks at it. with the running game we had yesterday, the receivers making plays the way they did, and the pass protection and all that considered, i'm 100% sure with tebow in at QB we would have performed way better. not saying we would have definitely won, because we played the packers and with them its more how your defense performs. but we would have definitely performed better. but hey, orton gives opponents uh i mean us the best chance to win :clown:It was obvious that the Packers passing defense was a major flaw in their game.
Wish we've had a QB to engage in a shootout with them. We don't have the defense and the offensive power to compete at that level...

strafen
10-04-2011, 05:55 AM
Listening to the Duke over the last couple days on the radio and on his show, it's becoming more clear to me that I don't think he is much of an Orton fan either. They specifically asked about switching QBs and not once did I hear him flat out say "Kyle is our guy, end of story" it was an open-ended "we will evaluate every week" thing. He also mentioned that he thinks Tim knows the playbook and offense as well as anyone else and that he can do things the others simply cannot. On his show he also seemed pretty irritated about the pick six.

Maybe I just wasn't paying attention before, but Elway sure didn't seem to be backing anyone 100% really. It makes me wonder if this truly is in Fox's hands right now.

I don't know why people assume is Elway running the show.
Sure he's our VP of Football Operations, but he's got nothing to say who plays QB and who doesn't. That's all Fox's job.
Elway is NOT the head coach...

jhns
10-04-2011, 06:00 AM
Not trying to defend Orton, but why do people keep saying "game ending pick 6"?

Denver was able to pull back to 21-17 afterwards. I would almost argue that the team was looking ok at this point, all things considered. I'd say the collapse happened when GB scored at the end of the first half, going 80 yards in under 3 minutes. Game was over at that point, only to be confirmed with their opening drive in the 3rd quarter.

Without the pick six(and the following onside kick), they have two less TDs...

Rabb
10-04-2011, 06:00 AM
I don't know why people assume is Elway running the show.
Sure he's our VP of Football Operations, but he's got nothing to say who plays QB and who doesn't. That's all Fox's job.
Elway is NOT the head coach...

no, I get that...honestly I didn't know what to assume with the new front office after the way the last couple years worked

ol#7
10-04-2011, 06:06 AM
what does one thing have to do with the other? because he was a great player im forced to say hes great at everything he does in his life now until he dies and even beyond that? talk about a homer :pigsfly:

Oh noes, you have lost all credibility with blueflame!

Dont you know you cant go against the immortal John Elway? He can do no wrong just ask Janet....

You are to apologize by eating at his restaurant and admitting it is a an out of body experience to digest and make waste from food passed down by a God!

BabyTO
10-04-2011, 06:08 AM
Yes, I'm an Elway homer. Most Broncos fans are. You're free to think what you want. And I'm free to think you're wrong.
you didnt ask me when you did that survey Ha!
we're not talking about the QB john elway, we're talking about the guy in the front office right now. i guess if he released von miller you'd still celebtrate the guy because of how great of a QB he was right? :oyvey:

tsiguy96
10-04-2011, 06:17 AM
Listening to the Duke over the last couple days on the radio and on his show, it's becoming more clear to me that I don't think he is much of an Orton fan either. They specifically asked about switching QBs and not once did I hear him flat out say "Kyle is our guy, end of story" it was an open-ended "we will evaluate every week" thing. He also mentioned that he thinks Tim knows the playbook and offense as well as anyone else and that he can do things the others simply cannot. On his show he also seemed pretty irritated about the pick six.

Maybe I just wasn't paying attention before, but Elway sure didn't seem to be backing anyone 100% really. It makes me wonder if this truly is in Fox's hands right now.

i agree completely, he has worked one on one with tebow, how many guys who have worked with tebow alone didnt like him or believe he couldnt do it? elway doesnt seem to continue the party line of "he gives us the best chance" hes more of a neutral answer, which i think will allow the transition to tebow to be easier.

Circle Orange
10-04-2011, 10:09 AM
Sure, I agree. Tebow isn't going to fail in the NFL as a QB because of his footwork/mechanics. If he does fail it'll be for the same reasons as any other QB in not being able to read defenses/where the pressure is coming from, adjusting to the speed to secondaries, being accurate enough to complete passes to tighter windows than in college, and adjusting to the pass rush.

There are plenty of QBs that can do what Rogers does with a clean pocket, plenty of time and good WRs. Hell, Orton was 10 out of 10 against a weak secondary when the OL did a fantastic job and his WRs adjusted to his throws in the 2nd Quarter.

.

Generally this is true, except Rodgers does NOT have a top O line. He gets rid of the ball quickly. Brady's guys hold so long he can eat lunch back there. The guy always has a five yard pocket cushion to pitch and throw. Shoot, the pats don't even RUN the ball...they just line up and hurl it around in the hurry up offense. Rodgers can run like the wind and has athletic moves Brady can only dream of. I've seen Brady on sprints, and he's no different than Orton. Gangly, flat footed and slow. But people never want to accept the fact that 'hero' qbs often don't accomplish much more than average ones on a game by game basis. Give any guy time, he looks awesome.

Dendave
10-04-2011, 11:08 AM
Jason LaCanfora reports that the Dolphins have reached out to David Garrard and Jake Delhomme. No deal has been made yet, as both veterans are looking for part of their contract to be guaranteed.

Trade them Orton

TailgateNut
10-04-2011, 11:12 AM
Jason LaCanfora reports that the Dolphins have reached out to David Garrard and Jake Delhomme. No deal has been made yet, as both veterans are looking for part of their contract to be guaranteed.

Trade them TimBoy

FIFY

OABB
10-04-2011, 11:15 AM
FIFY

Again, why would we trade our best qb and not the guy who has 8 turnovers in four games?

why do you hate the broncos?

bendog
10-04-2011, 11:59 AM
why do you think Tebow is a running QB? he threw for 9000+ yards in college. Elway threw for 9300+ yards in college. was he a running QB too?

there's alot of bending of the truth by the anti-Tebow faction these days. it doesn't make sense to me. is there some sort of collective amnesia about what we saw at the end of last season? or what Tebow did in college? or is it just easier for some people to pigeon hole him and file him away as a gimmick-play player?

Maybe it was the "nobody carries the ball [on the goal] but me" thing. For christ's sake they played him in shotgun for three gimmick weeks. They'll put him in when there's no reason to play the games except the schedule says they have to. Then, we'll see how rough he really is, or isn't

Tombstone RJ
10-04-2011, 12:01 PM
FIFY

you'd love that wouldn't you. Then you could snuggle and spoon your pillow knowing Tebow is no longer a Bronco. don't forget to suck that thumb.

jhns
10-04-2011, 12:01 PM
Maybe it was the "nobody carries the ball [on the goal] but me" thing. For christ's sake they played him in shotgun for three gimmick weeks. They'll put him in when there's no reason to play the games except the schedule says they have to. Then, we'll see how rough he really is, or isn't

It is always funny when people that don't watch games try to tell you what happened in those games.

BabyTO
10-04-2011, 01:05 PM
Jason LaCanfora reports that the Dolphins have reached out to David Garrard and Jake Delhomme. No deal has been made yet, as both veterans are looking for part of their contract to be guaranteed.

Trade them Orton
if were lucky the fins might give up a subway sandwich for orton

bendog
10-04-2011, 01:14 PM
if were lucky the fins might give up a subway sandwich for orton

Only if we paid him his salary.

Atwater His Ass
10-04-2011, 02:16 PM
Without the pick six(and the following onside kick), they have two less TDs...

C'mon, you're reaching. You can't possibly blame the onside kick on Orton. Holy ****. Is it his fault to when the defense can't make a stop? Look, Orton's trash, we all know that (some of us a lot sooner than others), but not everthing is his fault, as convienent as it is to say so, espcially with all the bandwagon Orton haters now.

It was 21-17 with less than 4 minutes to play in the first half. That's ****ing in the game, regardless of "if's" and "but's".

jhns
10-04-2011, 02:37 PM
C'mon, you're reaching. You can't possibly blame the onside kick on Orton. Holy ****. Is it his fault to when the defense can't make a stop? Look, Orton's trash, we all know that (some of us a lot sooner than others), but not everthing is his fault, as convienent as it is to say so, espcially with all the bandwagon Orton haters now.

It was 21-17 with less than 4 minutes to play in the first half. That's ****ing in the game, regardless of "if's" and "but's".

There is no onside kick withput that pick six. We would have been winning without that pick six. It isn't like Orton ever wins when we are down at half... I'm pretty sure there is a post article from last week that says it has never happened here. That would mean we were out of the game at half.

Blueflame
10-04-2011, 03:15 PM
you didnt ask me when you did that survey Ha!
we're not talking about the QB john elway, we're talking about the guy in the front office right now. i guess if he released von miller you'd still celebtrate the guy because of how great of a QB he was right? :oyvey:

Nah... investing a first rounder on a player and then releasing him less than 2 years later requires the incompetence level of your hero McDaniels. Elway's nowhere near that inept.

go_broncos
10-04-2011, 03:21 PM
FIFY

you and your posts are a joke..

Rigs11
10-04-2011, 03:34 PM
wow now they are blaming the onside kick on orton? What a bunch of clowns.

Jay3
10-04-2011, 03:42 PM
It was a Pick 14 by Orton! A new invention.

peacepipe
10-04-2011, 03:52 PM
Nah... investing a first rounder on a player and then releasing him less than 2 years later requires the incompetence level of your hero McDaniels. Elway's nowhere near that inept.It wouldn't be the 1st time,Green bay Packers HC mike McCarthy cut CB ahmad Carroll 2 yrs after having been drafted #25 in the 1st rd 2 yrs earlier.

Atwater His Ass
10-04-2011, 03:54 PM
There is no onside kick withput that pick six. We would have been winning without that pick six. It isn't like Orton ever wins when we are down at half... I'm pretty sure there is a post article from last week that says it has never happened here. That would mean we were out of the game at half.

21-17 isn't in the game? News to me.

QB responsible for a mental lapse by special teams? Fantastic.

Guess it's Orton's fault that we ever scored at all. I mean, if we didn't, we wouldn't have had to kick off and give GB back the ball which allowed Rodgers and GB to score. Damn the offense for putting points on the board.

Must be his fault for the coin toss too. I mean, if we would have won it, GB wouldn't have gotten the ball to start the 2nd half and then promptly march down and score another TD.

Blueflame
10-04-2011, 04:17 PM
It wouldn't be the 1st time,Green bay Packers HC mike McCarthy cut CB ahmad Carroll 2 yrs after having been drafted #25 in the 1st rd 2 yrs earlier.

Yep...and McDaniels reached for A. Smith (giving up a first rounder) then cut him.

But Elway isn't gonna release Von Miller and Baby TO's suggestion that he might was.... well, absurd.

The disrespect some are showing toward Elway (who paid his dues for the Broncos franchise) is... very disappointing to me. John deserves better. (JMHO)

Archer81
10-04-2011, 04:20 PM
Yep...and McDaniels reached for A. Smith (giving up a first rounder) then cut him.

But Elway isn't gonna release Von Miller and Baby TO's suggestion that he might was.... well, absurd.

The disrespect some are showing toward Elway (who paid his dues for the Broncos franchise) is... very disappointing to me. John deserves better. (JMHO)


As a player, yes. As an exec, no. Even though I do agree that the "elway is a ****ing idiot" thread was complete ridiculous.

:Broncos:

OABB
10-04-2011, 04:21 PM
21-17 isn't in the game? News to me.

QB responsible for a mental lapse by special teams? Fantastic.

Guess it's Orton's fault that we ever scored at all. I mean, if we didn't, we wouldn't have had to kick off and give GB back the ball which allowed Rodgers and GB to score. Damn the offense for putting points on the board.

Must be his fault for the coin toss too. I mean, if we would have won it, GB wouldn't have gotten the ball to start the 2nd half and then promptly march down and score another TD.

Pick 6's have no bearing on games whatsoever. Just like 8 turnovers in 4 games dont. Solid take.

peacepipe
10-04-2011, 04:25 PM
Yep...and McDaniels reached for A. Smith (giving up a first rounder) then cut him.

But Elway isn't gonna release Von Miller and Baby TO's suggestion that he might was.... well, absurd.

The disrespect some are showing toward Elway (who paid his dues for the Broncos franchise) is... very disappointing to me. John deserves better. (JMHO)I meant no disrespect to elway.

Dagmar
10-04-2011, 04:29 PM
The disrespect some are showing toward Elway (who paid his dues for the Broncos franchise) is... very disappointing to me. John deserves better. (JMHO)

Elway has done nothing but chastise the fan base for having an opinion. He has not earned my respect as an exec. Good player DOESN'T mean good exec, there are countless examples.