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View Full Version : Ortiz versus Mayweather


SouthStndJunkie
09-17-2011, 08:29 PM
Coming up.

SouthStndJunkie
09-17-2011, 08:29 PM
Anyone else watching?

spdirty
09-17-2011, 08:34 PM
No not gonna give mayweather a dime of my money...looking for updates...hope Ortiz kicks his ass.

gunns
09-17-2011, 08:37 PM
No not gonna give mayweather a dime of my money...looking for updates...hope Ortiz kicks his ass.

Me too.

SouthStndJunkie
09-17-2011, 08:37 PM
No not gonna give mayweather a dime of my money...looking for updates...hope Ortiz kicks his ass.

I'm not giving him a dime of my money until he fights Paq.

I've got a nice feed if you want me to PM it to you.

Elway 4 Life
09-17-2011, 08:38 PM
Go to firstrowsports.tv and you won't have to pay. :)

spdirty
09-17-2011, 08:41 PM
I'm not giving him a dime of my money until he fights Paq.

I've got a nice feed if you want me to PM it to you.

Appreciate that but I'm posting on the 3G network with 1 bar of service from my phone...Qwest/Centurylink screwed me bad and I don't have any Internet right now.

Agree though...not till he fights paq.

Circle Orange
09-17-2011, 08:47 PM
Direct TV wants $59.99...if it's only a two rounder, you won't get your money's worth. Besides, I'm betting it will be repeated later in the week, probably on ESPN.

SouthStndJunkie
09-17-2011, 08:48 PM
I'm done paying that much money for fights....unless it is a huge mega fight.

TDmvp
09-17-2011, 08:55 PM
http://www.firstrowsports.tv/watch/84459/2/watch-hbo-boxing:-mayweather-vs-ortiz.html

TDmvp
09-17-2011, 09:03 PM
GO Ortiz !!!

SouthStndJunkie
09-17-2011, 09:03 PM
Mayweather took the first 2 rounds.

Rolandftw
09-17-2011, 09:07 PM
Mayweather dominated round 3. Looks like he's in control of the fight.

TDmvp
09-17-2011, 09:11 PM
Lame

SouthStndJunkie
09-17-2011, 09:11 PM
Holy **** what a crazy finish to the fight.

Rolandftw
09-17-2011, 09:11 PM
Mayweather was getting dominated in the 4th until that cheap penalty by the ref.

Elway 4 Life
09-17-2011, 09:12 PM
Mayweather is a big ol POS.

TDmvp
09-17-2011, 09:13 PM
Mayweather = Pos ...

Rolandftw
09-17-2011, 09:13 PM
Definitely cheap. But hey he doesn't lose. He wouldn't have been able to go 12 rounds with Ortiz, but didn't have to worry about it.

TDmvp
09-17-2011, 09:13 PM
Dude is Fing Gutless ...

troya900
09-17-2011, 09:14 PM
**** I hate Mayweather he is such a piece of **** what a ****ing pussy

Elway 4 Life
09-17-2011, 09:15 PM
Completely legal but so chicken ****.

Rolandftw
09-17-2011, 09:15 PM
Incredibly stupid of Ortiz to drop his guard for a second though...

Elway 4 Life
09-17-2011, 09:16 PM
If there is a GOD he will let the Paqi and Mayweather fight happen. Mayweather will get his....

Ratboy
09-17-2011, 09:18 PM
hahaha

troya900
09-17-2011, 09:18 PM
I hope Mayweather ends up with a ****ing bullet in his head someday

SouthStndJunkie
09-17-2011, 09:18 PM
Larry Merchant to Mayweather: "I wish I was 50 years younger and I would kick your ass."

Rolandftw
09-17-2011, 09:20 PM
Yeah, watching the replay makes Mayweather look like a coward. It might be legal but it's total bull****. No one will respect him, after this. Kills his legacy.

spdirty
09-17-2011, 09:21 PM
So what happened?

Rolandftw
09-17-2011, 09:23 PM
Basically, Ortiz got penalized a point for a headbutt. After being separated, Ortiz and Mayweather patted gloves (to show no hard feelings i'm guessing), and a half second after that Mayweather hit him with a couple head shots to Ko him.

Elway 4 Life
09-17-2011, 09:24 PM
Ortiz headbutted Floyd so the ref stops the fight and takes a point from Ortiz. The ref restarts the fight and Ortiz gos over to him with his hands down to apologize and Floyd knocks him out.

SouthStndJunkie
09-17-2011, 09:26 PM
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Elway 4 Life
09-17-2011, 09:27 PM
Now that I've had time to digest what i've just seen its not all that surprising that Floyd did that. Ortiz was starting to tag him and floyd was doing very little damage. I think the puss that Floyd is saw his way out. He is without a doubt a very smart crafty fighter. I just hope the Manny fight happens

TDmvp
09-17-2011, 09:27 PM
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spdirty
09-17-2011, 09:30 PM
Ortiz headbutted Floyd so the ref stops the fight and takes a point from Ortiz. The ref restarts the fight and Ortiz gos over to him with his hands down to apologize and Floyd knocks him out.

Wow...that really is chicken****.

Doggcow
09-17-2011, 09:31 PM
I'd be ****ing livid if I paid for this ****.

BroncoInferno
09-17-2011, 09:35 PM
Floyd is a goddamn p***Y. Sucker punched Ortiz, then called out an 80 year old man. ****ing p***Y ass b****. Floyd was winning the fight, but Ortiz was starting to get to his ass. He better fight Manny the ****in p***Y.

TDmvp
09-17-2011, 09:36 PM
I've watched thousands of fights in my life and that has got to be the most BS thing I have ever seen happen in the ring.

Next to parachute man that is the craziest thing I ever seen and total B.S.

vonqkilla
09-17-2011, 09:36 PM
What did floyd say to larry?

Elway 4 Life
09-17-2011, 09:37 PM
I'd be ****ing livid if I paid for this ****.

No ****!! That's why i will never pay for a Boxing fight again.

BroncoInferno
09-17-2011, 09:38 PM
I usually hate Larry Merchant's slow talking ass, but good for him calling out Floyd's punk ass bitch ass. **** Floyd. Ortiz was getting to him. He'll never fight Manny now. Manny will get his ass if Ortiz was starting to get to him.

Doggcow
09-17-2011, 09:38 PM
And you wonder why this sport is in peril.

vonqkilla
09-17-2011, 09:41 PM
I dont blaim floyd one bit for seizing the opportunity, same thing bengals did last week. I would do the same thing after a blatant head butt. F ortiz.

swaiy
09-17-2011, 09:41 PM
Not defending Mayweather but, I just don't see how that headbutt was an accident. The guy had his gloves down while he did it.

BroncoInferno
09-17-2011, 09:42 PM
To be fair, it was a very good card overall. The first three fights were good, though the last two were horse****. Gomez was beating Canelo then got stopped when he had his hands up...he was stoic about it, knew he would get robbed....then Floyd's pussy ass sucker punched Ortiz. Floyd was winning, make no mistake, but that was a bitch ass move. Then calling out an 80 year old man? What a bitch. I've always favored Floyd against Manny, but if Ortiz was starting to get to him.....goddamn. Floyd will fins an excuse not to fight him. Pussy.

cabronco
09-17-2011, 09:44 PM
I'd be ****ing livid if I paid for this ****.

Ya no kidding, me too. What got me was the expressionless ref. He saw the first punch and then the right and didnt look to try and stop Mayweather? It was too late any ways at that point I guess.

Why didnt the ref make Mayweather go to his corner since he called time out to take the point away ? I couldnt see it that clear?

Chicken sh!t out of Mayweather for sure. I dont know why Ortiz felt he had to man hug after the incident? Touch gloves then carry on.

BroncoInferno
09-17-2011, 09:45 PM
I dont blaim floyd one bit for seizing the opportunity, same thing bengals did last week. I would do the same thing after a blatant head butt. F ortiz.

Yeah, I have no idea why Ortiz lunged with the head. He was getting some good shots in. Still....he apologized, then Floyd made a bitch ass move and sucker punched him, then called out an 80 year old man. What a bitch. I'll tell you what though....if Ortiz was starting to get to him, Manny will have a field day. Floyd will find some excuse not to fight him though, the pussy.

maven
09-17-2011, 09:53 PM
that was like watching the wwe, lol. The fighters make up, ref is talking to someone, then blam Ortiz gets knocked out and the ref is like huh

Elway 4 Life
09-17-2011, 09:55 PM
that was like watching the wwe, lol. The fighters make up, ref is talking to someone, then blam Ortiz gets knocked out and the ref is like huh

:rofl:

cabronco
09-17-2011, 10:02 PM
that was like watching the wwe, lol. The fighters make up, ref is talking to someone, then blam Ortiz gets knocked out and the ref is like huh

That pretty much sums it up...lol..then Ortiz smiles and Floyd runs his mouth all the way to the bank !

NUB
09-17-2011, 10:04 PM
How did Alvarez look? I've been watching him knock around fighters on his way for awhile now. Promising talent.

BroncoDoug
09-17-2011, 10:09 PM
What did floyd say to larry?

He basically told him that HBO should of fired him a long time ago, and that he doesn't know **** about boxing, and to get out of his face...

gunns
09-17-2011, 10:23 PM
No ****!! That's why i will never pay for a Boxing fight again.

I stopped way back when I ordered Tyson against Michael Spinx. A minute and a half.

Mayweather will not fight Manny. He's nothing but a pussy.

BroncoInferno
09-17-2011, 10:33 PM
How did Alvarez look? I've been watching him knock around fighters on his way for awhile now. Promising talent.

I thought Gomez won 4 of the 5 rounds they fought, and that is only giving Alvarez credit for the bull**** 1st round knockdown. In other words, I woulda had Gomez in a shut out before the total bull**** stoppage. Honestly, I think Canelo would have stopped him eventually, but c'mon! The stoppage was absolute horse**** when it happened. Morales-Cano was the best fight of the night. Good card overall.

BroncoInferno
09-17-2011, 10:34 PM
Boxing is still far, FAR superior to MMA, which always ends up in two men in the coitus position.

Perry1977
09-17-2011, 11:00 PM
Boxing is still far, FAR superior to MMA, which always ends up in two men in the coitus position.

LOL. ^ this.

yerner
09-17-2011, 11:26 PM
Boxing is still far, FAR superior to MMA, which always ends up in two men in the coitus position.

You mean like a real fight? Boxing is a joke tonight. Again.

NUB
09-17-2011, 11:40 PM
I thought Gomez won 4 of the 5 rounds they fought, and that is only giving Alvarez credit for the bull**** 1st round knockdown. In other words, I woulda had Gomez in a shut out before the total bull**** stoppage. Honestly, I think Canelo would have stopped him eventually, but c'mon! The stoppage was absolute horse**** when it happened. Morales-Cano was the best fight of the night. Good card overall.

Just saw the fight for myself. Not really all that different from some other Alvarez fights. The kid is still raw, but he brings with him a lot of power. I think Gomez was totally rocked by the uppercut and the following cross. The ref probably should have let it continue further just to see if he could recover, but five rounds in... those bombs weren't going to stop. Alvarez can throw those type of punches non-stop at that point in fights. I think Gomez was a few punches away from losing his guard and then taking some serious shots.

dsmoot
09-18-2011, 02:19 AM
I hope Mayweather ends up with a ****ing bullet in his head someday

WOW. Is this something you act out.

BroncoInferno
09-18-2011, 04:49 AM
that was like watching the wwe, lol. The fighters make up, ref is talking to someone, then blam Ortiz gets knocked out and the ref is like huh

To be fair to Cortez (the ref), Floyd didn't do anything illegal. It was just a b**** move.

BroncoInferno
09-18-2011, 04:52 AM
Just saw the fight for myself. Not really all that different from some other Alvarez fights. The kid is still raw, but he brings with him a lot of power. I think Gomez was totally rocked by the uppercut and the following cross. The ref probably should have let it continue further just to see if he could recover, but five rounds in... those bombs weren't going to stop. Alvarez can throw those type of punches non-stop at that point in fights. I think Gomez was a few punches away from losing his guard and then taking some serious shots.

Yeah, like I said, I think Canelo would have stopped Gomez eventually. And he did get rocked, BUT he still was defending himself, and considering he was probably winning the fight at that point (or should have been), he should have gotten the benefit of the doubt.

BroncoInferno
09-18-2011, 04:53 AM
You mean like a real fight? Boxing is a joke tonight. Again.

A real fight is two men rolling around in a scissors lock for five minutes? MMA just markets itself better. Boring sport. The boxing card last night was actually excellent.

Traveler
09-18-2011, 06:30 AM
Mayweather would take Pac-Man as long as he's clean, no problem. As to the fight, while it's a sorry way to end it, what the heck was Ortiz thinking by not protecting himself after the first punch?

OABB
09-18-2011, 06:56 AM
Mayweather would take Pac-Man as long as he's clean, no problem. As to the fight, while it's a sorry way to end it, what the heck was Ortiz thinking by not protecting himself after the first punch?

manny is clean. always has been you idiot. it was a bout taking blood. manny agreed to change all the rules and give in to pussyweather and pussyweather ran away

try researching something before you post about it mmmkay?

StugotsIII
09-18-2011, 07:11 AM
Boxing is still far, FAR superior to MMA, which always ends up in two men in the coitus position.

Boxing is a complete and total joke.

Traveler
09-18-2011, 08:43 AM
manny is clean. always has been you idiot. it was a bout taking blood. manny agreed to change all the rules and give in to p***Yweather and p***Yweather ran away

try researching something before you post about it mmmkay?

must have missed that. still, you don't have to be such an asshole just to make your point. Blood doping, you do know what that is dickhead!

Mayweather would still whip his ass though.

OrangeSe7en
09-18-2011, 08:47 AM
manny is clean. always has been you idiot. it was a bout taking blood. manny agreed to change all the rules and give in to p***Yweather and p***Yweather ran away

try researching something before you post about it mmmkay?

When did he agree to the timeline that was mandated?

OABB
09-18-2011, 09:14 AM
must have missed that. still, you don't have to be such an a-hole just to make your point. Blood doping, you do know what that is dickhead!

Mayweather would still whip his ass though.

sorry. itchy vagina this morning. manny would win, thats why hes ducking the fight.

OrangeSe7en
09-18-2011, 09:16 AM
sorry. itchy vagina this morning. manny would win, thats why hes ducking the fight.

Why are you dodging my question? When did Manny agree to the timeline that was mandated?

Elway 4 Life
09-18-2011, 09:17 AM
must have missed that. still, you don't have to be such an a-hole just to make your point. Blood doping, you do know what that is dickhead!

Mayweather would still whip his ass though.

Please put the pipe down sir. Thank you.

OABB
09-18-2011, 09:18 AM
When did he agree to the timeline that was mandated?

during the last negotiations...after manny agreed mayweathers camp denied that a fight was even being scheduled and than the story faded. mayweather has a lot of fanboys because he is a good boxer who is undeafeted.

he picks his competition and tries everything to piss out from manny. manny has game and will fight anyone anytime. thia fight is clear good vs. evil and evil is dirty and scared. whats sad is that people think manny roids which is simply not true.

OrangeSe7en
09-18-2011, 09:23 AM
during the last negotiations...after manny agreed mayweathers camp denied that a fight was even being scheduled and than the story faded. mayweather has a lot of fanboys because he is a good boxer who is undeafeted.

he picks his competition and tries everything to piss out from manny. manny has game and will fight anyone anytime. thia fight is clear good vs. evil and evil is dirty and scared. whats sad is that people think manny roids which is simply not true.

The last thing I remember Manny definitively agreeing to was trying to compromise on the timeline. I'll just assume, since it's drugtesting, a prescribed timeline is there for a reason. I don't remember anything saying that Manny agreed to the originally prescribed timeline and I dont remember it ever being determined whether there were or werent talks when you said. But Ill be ther first to admit that I dont fixate over this. If Im wrong about any of this, let me know.

OABB
09-18-2011, 09:28 AM
The last thing I remember Manny definitively agreeing to was trying to compromise on the timeline. I'll just assume, since it's drugtesting, a prescribed timeline is there for a reason. I don't remember anything saying that Manny agreed to the originally prescribed timeline and I dont remember it ever being determined whether there were or werent talks when you said. But Ill be ther first to admit that I dont fixate over this. If Im wrong about any of this, let me know.

it never became official because mayweather ran frim the negotiations. but it was reported. the mere dact that mayweather was asking for special rules is a sign of fear. mayweather knows he has never fought anyone like manny. it took him multipke rounds to beat hatton and oscar, two guys destroyed by pacman in short order.

mayweather is a pussy, and the only p4p thing he owns is biggest pussy.

OrangeSe7en
09-18-2011, 09:39 AM
it never became official because mayweather ran frim the negotiations. but it was reported. the mere dact that mayweather was asking for special rules is a sign of fear. mayweather knows he has never fought anyone like manny. it took him multipke rounds to beat hatton and oscar, two guys destroyed by pacman in short order.

mayweather is a p***Y, and the only p4p thing he owns is biggest p***Y.

OK, and you're not a Manny fanboy who is worse than the Floyd fanboys that you complain about. Thanks for answering my questions.

Bronx33
09-18-2011, 09:44 AM
This is exactly why i haven't paid a dime towards any PPV boxing since tyson.

Lestat
09-18-2011, 09:44 AM
Ortiz asked for that. mofo was running his mouth about Floyd being overrated and his undefeated record being against out of prime and lesser class boxers than floyd is.

i would have knocked that punk's ass out and stood over him while calling him a little *****.

i'm not floyd's biggest fan by any stretch but until someone beats him and i don't think Manny will. he's the best in the world and he'll keep on raking in the $$$.

AmericanBroncFan
09-18-2011, 09:49 AM
Ortiz asked for that. mofo was running his mouth about Floyd being overrated and his undefeated record being against out of prime and lesser class boxers than floyd is.

i would have knocked that punk's ass out and stood over him while calling him a little *****.

i'm not floyd's biggest fan by any stretch but until someone beats him and i don't think Manny will. he's the best in the world and he'll keep on raking in the $$$.

floyd will NEVER be respected as a GREAT fighter like Ali and others. Those men had class and would fight anybody, not dodge fighters their whole career like floyd. He waited for Mosley and De la hoya to be has beens before fighting them among other classless moves. America's Champion is Manny right now

Lestat
09-18-2011, 10:02 AM
America's sweetheart is Manny, America's champion is Floyd.

to be the man you gotta beat the man and the man right now pound for pound is Floyd.
Manny is very good but until he beats Floyd he can't take the crown officially.

Floyd play's his role very well, he's got the most sponsors, he draws the most money and ppv buys and he's got the biggest mouth. he sells himself and his fights well.

Manny can market himself as a golden boy type because his fighting style lends itself to being exciting. Floyd has to be the bad guy to sell his fights because his style is more relaxed and methodical. to most newer boxing fans that equates to boring, so they tune in to watch him get his ass kicked.

now i'm a huge Ali fan and love him. but he essentially tortured Floyd Patterson in a fight for refusing to call him Ali.
every great boxer in history has had classless moments. it happens when you get men with big egos in a ring and tell them they have to beat people to maintain their manhood(boxing wise).

RhymesayersDU
09-18-2011, 10:03 AM
Just downloaded this fight, can't wait to see the shenanigans.

troya900
09-18-2011, 10:10 AM
Why are you dodging my question? When did Manny agree to the timeline that was mandated?

Agree to the timeline mandated? You act as if this is some boxing rule and it's not. Manny of course would do what boxing requires and it's been reported that Manny would take the test up to a few weeks before the fight and immediately after the fight. So you're telling me that isn't good enough for bitchweather? He's scared about getting that first loss plain and simple.

OABB
09-18-2011, 10:31 AM
OK, and you're not a Manny fanboy who is worse than the Floyd fanboys that you complain about. Thanks for answering my questions.

I am absolutely a manny fanboy. Because I like great boxers. Manny will go down as one of the best ever. If you deny that you are TGN stupid.

Mayweather is a pussy. a giant vagina faced pussy.


just the facts man. sorry.

OrangeSe7en
09-18-2011, 10:34 AM
Agree to the timeline mandated? You act as if this is some boxing rule and it's not. Manny of course would do what boxing requires and it's been reported that Manny would take the test up to a few weeks before the fight and immediately after the fight. So you're telling me that isn't good enough for b****weather? He's scared about getting that first loss plain and simple.

No, dumbass. It was pretty clear I was referring to a prescribed timeline for drug testing.

OrangeSe7en
09-18-2011, 10:35 AM
floyd will NEVER be respected as a GREAT fighter like Ali and others. Those men had class and would fight anybody, not dodge fighters their whole career like floyd. He waited for Mosley and De la hoya to be has beens before fighting them among other classless moves. America's Champion is Manny right now

Neither will Manny. Its because boxing is a dying sport and when Ali and others faught, it wasnt.

OABB
09-18-2011, 10:58 AM
Neither will Manny. Its because boxing is a dying sport and when Ali and others faught, it wasnt.

Manny is all ready in the discussion for greatest of all time. Boxings problems could be saved if Mayweather wasn't such a flava clown pussy and fought manny. In the old days, men fought for pride. Boxing has been hijacked by pussies. Manny is the people's champ because he is good and a good man. He fights anytime anywhere and represents his people with class. Mayweather is brandon marshall.

Elway 4 Life
09-18-2011, 11:35 AM
In no way shape or form could Floyd beat Manny. Floyd would lose decisively. With all the controversy of this fight the table is set for Floyd to finally try and prove that he is the best. I just hope his puss ass doesn't back out again.

OrangeSe7en
09-18-2011, 11:37 AM
In no way shape or form could Floyd beat Manny. Floyd would lose decisively. With all the controversy of this fight the table is set for Floyd to finally try and prove that he is the best. I just hope his puss ass doesn't back out again.

This always happens. People get distracted by flurries of punches and totally underestimate defense and counterpunching.

McDman
09-18-2011, 11:43 AM
Boxing is still far, FAR superior to MMA, which always ends up in two men in the coitus position.

Unfortunately in terms of big cards and premier events it isn't close. I enjoy boxing much more but what fights is everyone going to pay to see? I know the only one I'm paying for is Manny Vs. Mayweather which isn't going to happen.

Boxing goes as the heavyweight division goes and right now that's int he sh1tter. The Klitschkos (sp?) refused to fight each other and they have been the only relevant heavyweights in a while. Lewis was good but no one else could fight him.

McDman
09-18-2011, 11:46 AM
I am absolutely a manny fanboy. Because I like great boxers. Manny will go down as one of the best ever. If you deny that you are TGN stupid.

Mayweather is a p***Y. a giant vagina faced p***Y.


just the facts man. sorry.

He may be a pussy but he is probably the best fighter we've seen in a loooong time. I'd love to see Manny beat his ass but I don't know if it would go down like that.

I seriously doubt there going to fight.

RhymesayersDU
09-18-2011, 08:55 PM
Just watched the fight, tons of blame to go around to each fighter and the referee.

Anyways, I find all the Mayweather hate a little over the top. I mean, I understand he's a prick and an easy guy to dislike, but I think the idea that Manny would just wipe the floor with his is outrageous. To me that looks like a fight that would be great and probably go the distance. Would be a rare boxing match worth paying for.

extralife
09-18-2011, 10:00 PM
floyd will NEVER be respected as a GREAT fighter like Ali and others. Those men had class and would fight anybody, not dodge fighters their whole career like floyd. He waited for Mosley and De la hoya to be has beens before fighting them among other classless moves. America's Champion is Manny right now

Ali was in many ways the most classless athlete of all time. People don't really remember that. He is revered now because he was great, because he was frank, because of the Vietnam thing, and because now he has Parkinson's.

NUB
09-18-2011, 10:54 PM
This always happens. People get distracted by flurries of punches and totally underestimate defense and counterpunching.

Mayweather's defense is stupid-good, but he has not faced anybody that has a comparable combination of speed, power and stamina that Pacquiao has. Mayweather is dodging fights because he wants to protect his record, though. That should be very obvious; it's the reason he retired, the reason he is fighting the old or inexperienced in his return, and the reason he is avoiding Pacquiao. He could beat Pacquiao, sure, but everyone know he could just as easily lose to him. I think Mayweather getting stunned vs. an old Mosley scared the Pacquiao fight right out of him, IMO.

OrangeSe7en
09-18-2011, 11:06 PM
Mayweather's defense is stupid-good, but he has not faced anybody that has a comparable combination of speed, power and stamina that Pacquiao has. Mayweather is dodging fights because he wants to protect his record, though. That should be very obvious; it's the reason he retired, the reason he is fighting the old or inexperienced in his return, and the reason he is avoiding Pacquiao. He could beat Pacquiao, sure, but everyone know he could just as easily lose to him. I think Mayweather getting stunned vs. an old Mosley scared the Pacquiao fight right out of him, IMO.

I actually think its the other way. I think Pacquiao's flurries of punches would leave himself open more than people want to think and against someone with great defense and counter punching, it could get ugly early. I think this is actually more likely than what you said. I could be wrong of course, but its also true that Pacquiao has never faced anyone like Mayweather. I think Mayweather's skillset is a little more unique. He's seen variations of Pacquiao, although perhaps more toned down.

Also, you could be right about Mayweather trying to protect his record but I doubt it. Mayweather doesn't take unnecessary risks. He fights that way and he picks fights that way. I think Mayweather probably feels he could beat a clean Pacquiao (perhaps even a juiced Pacquiao), but lets say he loses to Pacquiao. Suddenly, Floyd is less of a draw. The whole point is to make money and Floyd can do that better in the long term by not taking unnecessary risks. A payday with Pacquiao could be huge but its not like Mayweather doesnt earn on fights like Ortiz and over time that also adds up.

NUB
09-19-2011, 12:11 AM
Neither fighter has faced someone comparable. That is why they are the top two. Pacquiao wants to fight and has demonstrated moves to do so. It is Mayweather who keeps moving the goalposts. Neither fighter is juicing, that's not why Mayweather keeps dodging. Pacquiao agreed to Mayweather's terms once only for him to then move them about again. He has also lied considerably about talks. These are all the usual signs of a fighter dodging. Pacquiao has shown all the reverse signs through his career: he has made dramatic weight changes, he has fought the very best that he could, and he has re-fought the very best multiple times. Mayweather just took out a young boxer in Ortiz. Who is Pacquiao fighting in November? Top 5 boxer in Marquez who has nearly beaten Pacquiao twice. The Filipino isn't dodging anyone and that's how history will remember the two.

BroncoInferno
09-19-2011, 06:18 AM
Unfortunately in terms of big cards and premier events it isn't close. I enjoy boxing much more but what fights is everyone going to pay to see? I know the only one I'm paying for is Manny Vs. Mayweather which isn't going to happen.

Boxing goes as the heavyweight division goes and right now that's int he sh1tter. The Klitschkos (sp?) refused to fight each other and they have been the only relevant heavyweights in a while. Lewis was good but no one else could fight him.

One word: marketing. You have to give Dana White credit; he is a marketing genius. He's actually conviced people that watching two men rolling around on the ground hugging each other is entertaining. Unfortunately, boxing is plagued by the dinosaur mentality of guys like Bob Arum. He could learn a thing or two from White.

BroncoInferno
09-19-2011, 06:27 AM
I actually think its the other way. I think Pacquiao's flurries of punches would leave himself open more than people want to think and against someone with great defense and counter punching, it could get ugly early. I think this is actually more likely than what you said. I could be wrong of course, but its also true that Pacquiao has never faced anyone like Mayweather. I think Mayweather's skillset is a little more unique. He's seen variations of Pacquiao, although perhaps more toned down.

Also, you could be right about Mayweather trying to protect his record but I doubt it. Mayweather doesn't take unnecessary risks. He fights that way and he picks fights that way. I think Mayweather probably feels he could beat a clean Pacquiao (perhaps even a juiced Pacquiao), but lets say he loses to Pacquiao. Suddenly, Floyd is less of a draw. The whole point is to make money and Floyd can do that better in the long term by not taking unnecessary risks. A payday with Pacquiao could be huge but its not like Mayweather doesnt earn on fights like Ortiz and over time that also adds up.

First of all, if Mayweather and Manny fight, I'm picking Mayweather in a competitive but clear decision win. His defense and counterpunching is too good. That said, Manny is MUCH more defensively responsible since he settled in to fighting at welterweight. Fighting the bigger guys, he's fighting much more cautiously and as a result has barely had a clean punch landed against him since his last fight with Marquez. Cotto got in some good blows in the first 3 to 4 rounds of their fight, but that's pretty much it. Manny has improved his defense tremendously. That's one reason why I think that if they ever do fight, it's going to be more of a chess match than a great action fight. I expect Manny will try to time Mayweather and dart in for a quick one-two and get out of the pocket before Mayweather can counter. Ultimately, though, I think Mayweather will land enough of his counters cleanly to win the decision. I hope I'm wrong, because Floyd really is a dispiccable human being.

Spider
09-19-2011, 06:33 AM
Ortiz broke the cardinal rule..........Protect yourself at all times ..Paid the price.... Paq destroys mayweather in 2 rounds

RhymesayersDU
09-19-2011, 06:33 AM
I think Mayweather getting stunned vs. an old Mosley scared the Pacquiao fight right out of him, IMO.

If this is true that's pretty ****ty. I mean, I watched the Mosley fight and Mosley had 1 good round and Mayweather easily won the rest of the fight. If that's all it took, that sucks because we all want to see the Pac fight.

Spider
09-19-2011, 06:37 AM
floyd will NEVER be respected as a GREAT fighter like Ali and others. Those men had class and would fight anybody, not dodge fighters their whole career

Deloyha same way , He didnt duck anyone

oubronco
09-19-2011, 06:44 AM
I liked it when they used to show title fights on ABC for free

spdirty
09-19-2011, 07:27 AM
Don't really even want to talk about what would happen in a fight till it happens. It's all just speculation tll it happens. I think mayweather is waiting for paq to slow down and that terrible disease to settle in a little more with Freddy Roach before he agrees to fight him. I'd actually prefer the fight to not happen in that case because I'd rather not see the fight than see mayweather beat paq.

Jason in LA
09-19-2011, 11:30 AM
The backlash against Floyd is very interesting. What ever the issue is, people are going to take the other side.

Ortiz's blow was much worse than Floyd's, because what Ortiz did was 100% illegal and classless. He was getting beat every round. Somebody said earlier in this thread that his punches were starting to get to Floyd in the 4th round, so Floyd found a cheap way out because he wouldn't be able to make it through 12 rounds. I didn't see it like that at all. In the exchange leading to the headbutt, Ortiz had Floyd in the corner, throwing punches and missing with every one of them, and that's when he threw the headbutt. Seems that he knew that he was being out classed, and if he didn't do something drastic then Mayweather was just going to win every round easily. That fight was on it's way to being a one sided boring fight. So Ortiz tried something extremely drastic, which was illegal and unsportsman like.

The head butt pissed Mayweather off, and I'd say that Ortiz's apologies did nothing to calm Mayweather down. I'd say that Mayweather's thinking was that one sucker punch deserved another. But the big difference is, Mayweather's sucker punch was 100% legal. No question about it. He was pissed, he saw an opening that was within the rules, and he straight Deebow-ed homie. Knocked him the **** out!

I'm not saying that what Mayweather did was cool, but the backlash against him is causing his haters to ignore what Ortiz did. If Ortiz had done real damage with that headbutt and softened Mayweather up with it and then knocked him out right after it, there wouldn't be too many people who would have a problem with the headbutt. It would be like the end justifying the means. The headbutt was illegal, but if it helped Ortiz win the fight, the Mayweather haters wouldn't have a problem with it.

Lets not make Ortiz out to being some sort of victim. What he did was cowardly, and he got what was coming to him afterward. Don't cheap shot somebody and then expect to be a victim when that person cheapshots you back.

Jason in LA
09-19-2011, 11:35 AM
floyd will NEVER be respected as a GREAT fighter like Ali and others. Those men had class and would fight anybody, not dodge fighters their whole career like floyd. He waited for Mosley and De la hoya to be has beens before fighting them among other classless moves. America's Champion is Manny right now

Ali was hated during his career and from the way that I've heard the history, there was a big backlash against him.

I wouldn't say that Mayweather waited until Mosley and de la Hoya were old. He was fighting in lower weight classes during the prime of those other twos careers. And I'd take Mayweather over either of those guys during the primes of their careers. I always thought that de la Hoya was very overrated, and that he was more of a huge draw than a great fighter. And Mosely got outclassed a few times during the prime of his career.

OABB
09-19-2011, 11:50 AM
The backlash against Floyd is very interesting. What ever the issue is, people are going to take the other side.

Ortiz's blow was much worse than Floyd's, because what Ortiz did was 100% illegal and classless. He was getting beat every round. Somebody said earlier in this thread that his punches were starting to get to Floyd in the 4th round, so Floyd found a cheap way out because he wouldn't be able to make it through 12 rounds. I didn't see it like that at all. In the exchange leading to the headbutt, Ortiz had Floyd in the corner, throwing punches and missing with every one of them, and that's when he threw the headbutt. Seems that he knew that he was being out classed, and if he didn't do something drastic then Mayweather was just going to win every round easily. That fight was on it's way to being a one sided boring fight. So Ortiz tried something extremely drastic, which was illegal and unsportsman like.

The head butt pissed Mayweather off, and I'd say that Ortiz's apologies did nothing to calm Mayweather down. I'd say that Mayweather's thinking was that one sucker punch deserved another. But the big difference is, Mayweather's sucker punch was 100% legal. No question about it. He was pissed, he saw an opening that was within the rules, and he straight Deebow-ed homie. Knocked him the **** out!

I'm not saying that what Mayweather did was cool, but the backlash against him is causing his haters to ignore what Ortiz did. If Ortiz had done real damage with that headbutt and softened Mayweather up with it and then knocked him out right after it, there wouldn't be too many people who would have a problem with the headbutt. It would be like the end justifying the means. The headbutt was illegal, but if it helped Ortiz win the fight, the Mayweather haters wouldn't have a problem with it.

Lets not make Ortiz out to being some sort of victim. What he did was cowardly, and he got what was coming to him afterward. Don't cheap shot somebody and then expect to be a victim when that person cheapshots you back.


mostly because Mayweather has been ducking manny. I think if he wasn't such a giant vagina who was mentally weak, people would have more respect for him.


Pussies won't be respected. It's pretty much that simple.

HOwever I do agree that what Mayweather did in the Ortiz fight was justified and fair. although p***Yish. But he's a p***Y, so no real surprise.

BroncoInferno
09-19-2011, 11:57 AM
I agree that Ortiz was classless, too, Jason. Honestly, Ortiz has always proven to be mentally fragile (see the Maidana fight). It was just strange that when lunged with the head when he was having his best moment of the fight (and you are wrong...he DID land several of those punches). Then his reaction after the fight was odd, he seemed more relieved that it was over than anything. I don't think he likes boxing or getting hit too much. Wouldn't surprise me if we don't hear from him for a year or so while he's living off his purse.

And Joe Cortez deserves a lot of blame, too. He did not make it very clear that time was back in play (I wasn't sure myself watching on TV). Ortiz was looking to him for instructions, and Cortez was looking outside of the ring. He didn't even see the punches land, just had an "oh ****" look on his face when he saw Ortiz land on the ground. So, Floyd certainly does not get 100% blame for what happened.

All that said, the bottom line is that Floyd knew Ortiz was looking towards the ref for instructions and sucker punched him. I'd give him the benefit of the doubt if he didn't have a long history of being a classless thug, but he does. But the newest low was calling out an 80 year old man and getting in his face. I'm no fan of Larry Merchant, but that proved what Mayweather's all about. Hell, Merchant was in the middle of complimenting his performance when he started going off on him. No defense for trying to bully an 80 year old man. The **** is low.

Jason in LA
09-19-2011, 12:08 PM
mostly because Mayweather has been ducking manny. I think if he wasn't such a giant vagina who was mentally weak, people would have more respect for him.

As it is, Mayweather fans tend to side with him because of his hype or some sort of cult hero worship.

Pussies won't be respected. It's pretty much that simple.

HOwever I do agree that what Mayweather did in the Ortiz fight was justified and fair. although p***Yish. But he's a p***Y, so no real surprise.

The issue that I have with the whole thing is that people seem like they need to pick a side, and what ever happens, they're sticking to their side. So anybody that hates Floyd, it doesn't matter what the issue is, they'll take the other side.

Perfect example is the drug testing issue. If a more likable athlete had taken Mayweather's stance on demanding Olympic style drug testing, his cause would be championed and people would welcome it because of all the drug issues. If it was the other way around with Floyd and Manny, where Manny was demanding the drug tests and Floyd was saying no, everybody who is saying that Floyd is using the drug testing to avoid the fight would change their tune. They would all say that Manny is great for trying to clean up the sport and that Floyd should do the right thing and take the drug test. Hell, if most other athletes would take the stance that Floyd is taking, their cause would be championed by the public. But Floyd is hated for it.

Now I try to be objective. I'm usually slanted to one side, but I try not to go on the extremes of one side because I believe that the truth is usually somewhere in the middle. At first I didn't like that Manny wouldn't compromise much on the drug testing, and it seemed like he had something to hide. The report that I read said that at first he would only agree to blood testing up to 30 days before the fight, and his reasons for not wanting to give blood 2 days before the fight were very weak. So I was on Floyd's side.

But the last report I heard said that Manny agreed to give blood five days before the fight. Okay, that's a big compromise. I'd say that Floyd should go ahead and take that. Close enough. So now I'm starting to lean toward Floyd just not wanting to take the fight.

I'd say that I've stayed objective to the situation, where most people just can't. They hate Floyd so much that they can't give an objective opinion on the situation.

If Ortiz had suckered punched Mayweather and knocked him out, the Mayweather haters would love it and put all the blame on Mayweather for not keeping his guard up. But it's the other way around, so everybody is hating on Mayweather.

OrangeSe7en
09-19-2011, 05:02 PM
Neither fighter has faced someone comparable. That is why they are the top two. Pacquiao wants to fight and has demonstrated moves to do so. It is Mayweather who keeps moving the goalposts. Neither fighter is juicing, that's not why Mayweather keeps dodging. Pacquiao agreed to Mayweather's terms once only for him to then move them about again. He has also lied considerably about talks. These are all the usual signs of a fighter dodging. Pacquiao has shown all the reverse signs through his career: he has made dramatic weight changes, he has fought the very best that he could, and he has re-fought the very best multiple times. Mayweather just took out a young boxer in Ortiz. Who is Pacquiao fighting in November? Top 5 boxer in Marquez who has nearly beaten Pacquiao twice. The Filipino isn't dodging anyone and that's how history will remember the two.

I dont think that's true. I think Floyd has seen more guys who had hand speed comparable to Pacquiao and who could throw combinations than Pacquiao has seen who are comparable to Mayweather.

One of the reasons for that is because Pacquaio's style is more exciting than Mayweather's. Most boxers grow up liking offense and most pans would rather pay to see action. But for Mayweather, boxing was the family business and he's been hardwired to fight a different way than practically anyone.

OABB
09-19-2011, 05:27 PM
The issue that I have with the whole thing is that people seem like they need to pick a side, and what ever happens, they're sticking to their side. So anybody that hates Floyd, it doesn't matter what the issue is, they'll take the other side.

Perfect example is the drug testing issue. If a more likable athlete had taken Mayweather's stance on demanding Olympic style drug testing, his cause would be championed and people would welcome it because of all the drug issues. If it was the other way around with Floyd and Manny, where Manny was demanding the drug tests and Floyd was saying no, everybody who is saying that Floyd is using the drug testing to avoid the fight would change their tune. They would all say that Manny is great for trying to clean up the sport and that Floyd should do the right thing and take the drug test. Hell, if most other athletes would take the stance that Floyd is taking, their cause would be championed by the public. But Floyd is hated for it.

Now I try to be objective. I'm usually slanted to one side, but I try not to go on the extremes of one side because I believe that the truth is usually somewhere in the middle. At first I didn't like that Manny wouldn't compromise much on the drug testing, and it seemed like he had something to hide. The report that I read said that at first he would only agree to blood testing up to 30 days before the fight, and his reasons for not wanting to give blood 2 days before the fight were very weak. So I was on Floyd's side.

But the last report I heard said that Manny agreed to give blood five days before the fight. Okay, that's a big compromise. I'd say that Floyd should go ahead and take that. Close enough. So now I'm starting to lean toward Floyd just not wanting to take the fight.

I'd say that I've stayed objective to the situation, where most people just can't. They hate Floyd so much that they can't give an objective opinion on the situation.

If Ortiz had suckered punched Mayweather and knocked him out, the Mayweather haters would love it and put all the blame on Mayweather for not keeping his guard up. But it's the other way around, so everybody is hating on Mayweather.

the thing is..Manny wouldn't havr made accusations in the first place. he certainly wouldn't ask for a whole new and special set of rules. he would have just laced thrm up and fought. also, if he was to do such a pussy thing, I highly doubt mayweather would have compromised.

mayweather is scared and I have always told you that. I likr you and your take, but you are missing the big point.

Jason in LA
09-19-2011, 08:33 PM
the thing is..Manny wouldn't havr made accusations in the first place. he certainly wouldn't ask for a whole new and special set of rules. he would have just laced thrm up and fought. also, if he was to do such a p***Y thing, I highly doubt mayweather would have compromised.

mayweather is scared and I have always told you that. I likr you and your take, but you are missing the big point.

Whether Manny would or would not have done that is besides the point. The point is if he did take that stance people would have supported him. If a number of other athletes had taken that stance they would have been applauded by the public. But Floyd does it and he's a pussy. People can't be objective when it comes to Floyd. It's pretty silly.

dsmoot
09-19-2011, 09:08 PM
America's sweetheart is Manny, America's champion is Floyd.

to be the man you gotta beat the man and the man right now pound for pound is Floyd.
Manny is very good but until he beats Floyd he can't take the crown officially.

Floyd play's his role very well, he's got the most sponsors, he draws the most money and ppv buys and he's got the biggest mouth. he sells himself and his fights well.

Manny can market himself as a golden boy type because his fighting style lends itself to being exciting. Floyd has to be the bad guy to sell his fights because his style is more relaxed and methodical. to most newer boxing fans that equates to boring, so they tune in to watch him get his ass kicked.

now i'm a huge Ali fan and love him. but he essentially tortured Floyd Patterson in a fight for refusing to call him Ali.
every great boxer in history has had classless moments. it happens when you get men with big egos in a ring and tell them they have to beat people to maintain their manhood(boxing wise).

Patterson was disrespectful to Ali even after Ali called him on it. Floyd antagonized him. Ali was generally respectful to past champions but Floyd crossed the line trying to get in Ali's head and paid for it. Don't demonize Ali for what happened. Floyd asked for it. Ali took no cheap shots and fought within the rules.

BroncoInferno
09-20-2011, 04:50 AM
Whether Manny would or would not have done that is besides the point. The point is if he did take that stance people would have supported him. If a number of other athletes had taken that stance they would have been applauded by the public. But Floyd does it and he's a p***Y. People can't be objective when it comes to Floyd. It's pretty silly.

I think Manny gets the benefit of the doubt because he's always respectful to people and shows class. Mayweather is a thug who hits women, picks fights with 80 year old men and security guards, and viciously curses out his daddy on TV. Like the other poster said, Manny wouldn't do that sort of thing. The fact that Mayweather would is precisely why he doesn't get more support. If Manny beat women and acted like a general thug, he wouldn't get support either. People ARE being objective....they are judging Floyd based on his actions over a long period of time.

OABB
09-20-2011, 06:41 AM
I think Manny gets the benefit of the doubt because he's always respectful to people and shows class. Mayweather is a thug who hits women, picks fights with 80 year old men and security guards, and viciously curses out his daddy on TV. Like the other poster said, Manny wouldn't do that sort of thing. The fact that Mayweather would is precisely why he doesn't get more support. If Manny beat women and acted like a general thug, he wouldn't get support either. People ARE being objective....they are judging Floyd based on his actions over a long period of time.

this. and also hes a pussy.

Jason in LA
09-20-2011, 07:08 AM
People ARE being objective....

People are not being objective at all. Like I said, if Ortiz had beaten Mayweather in the same fashion as Mayweather won, they would applaud the guy. What ever side of the issue that Mayweather falls on, the public will automatically take the other side, no matter what the issue is. That's not being objective. That's like the definition of not being objective. It's pretty silly. Take Mayweather totally out of it, and say that it was two fighters that the public does not know about, I don't think people would take the side of the guy who got knocked out. But add Mayweather's name, and people will just take the other side.

I guess my point is that if people are taking the other side just because they hate Mayweather, then go ahead and say that. But don't construct a logical argument based on that. If you have motives that's going to put you on one side, and that's going to stop you from being objective, then go ahead and state that and I'd entertain the argument.

BroncoInferno
09-20-2011, 07:20 AM
People are not being objective at all. Like I said, if Ortiz had beaten Mayweather in the same fashion as Mayweather won, they would applaud the guy. What ever side of the issue that Mayweather falls on, the public will automatically take the other side, no matter what the issue is. That's not being objective. That's like the definition of not being objective. It's pretty silly.

Yeah, you just ignored everything I typed about Mayweather's classless, thuggish behavior in the past. THAT'S why people don't give him the benefit of the doubt. Because he tries to bully 80 year old men and security guards, hits women (in front of his children, no less), verbally disrespects his opponents, burns large amounts of money on camera when so many people are in dire economic straits, viciously curses out his dad on TV....sorry, dude. It's perfectly reasonable and objective to judge people using their recent actions as a guide. YOU'RE the one who is not being objective. If the legal sucker-punch were the only thing on his douchebag resume, you would have a point. Then you might could say he deserves the benefit of the doubt. But it's not. So you don't have a point. People are properly and understandably judging Floyd in light of his past (recent past, too) actions. You have no idea how people would have responded if Ortiz had sucker-punched Mayweather; that is only your perception. I can only speak for myself, but I would say it's bush league no matter who it was.

Jason in LA
09-20-2011, 08:05 AM
Yeah, you just ignored everything I typed about Mayweather's classless, thuggish behavior in the past. THAT'S why people don't give him the benefit of the doubt. Because he tries to bully 80 year old men and security guards, hits women (in front of his children, no less), verbally disrespects his opponents, burns large amounts of money on camera when so many people are in dire economic straits, viciously curses out his dad on TV....sorry, dude. It's perfectly reasonable and objective to judge people using their recent actions as a guide. YOU'RE the one who is not being objective. If the legal sucker-punch were the only thing on his douchebag resume, you would have a point. Then you might could say he deserves the benefit of the doubt. But it's not. So you don't have a point. People are properly and understandably judging Floyd in light of his past (recent past, too) actions. You have no idea how people would have responded if Ortiz had sucker-punched Mayweather; that is only your perception. I can only speak for myself, but I would say it's bush league no matter who it was.

I didn't ignore what you typed. I don't feel that's enough to be totally slanted to one side on any given issue.

I'm being 100% objective. I'm judging this situation on it's own. Actually, I don't see how anybody can look at this argument and say that I'm not being objective. I'm not adding past emotions to this. I'm judging this as an isolated incident and I'm not taking into account who is involved. I'm not basing my argument on a hatred for a guy. Really thinking about it, it's a silly statement to say that I'm not being objective. Like I stated earlier in this thread, at first on was on Mayweather's side on the drug testing issue because Manny's reasons for not doing it were weak. But then Manny agreed to most of what Mayweather wanted, so I felt it was close enough and Mayweather should agree to that. But he hasn't, so I'm more on Manny's side at this point. I'm looking at the situation without the emotions and making a judgement while most people were againt Mayweather from day 1 just because it's Mayweather. That's 100% unobjective.

Jason in LA
09-20-2011, 08:08 AM
I'm curious, what is everybody's opinion on Ortiz's actions? The Mayweather haters, which is just about everybody, isn't saying much about him.

RhymesayersDU
09-20-2011, 08:22 AM
Ortiz's headbutt was completely blatant and his interview after the fact where he tried to explain it was complete bull****.

It's easy to hate Mayweather but the blame goes to both fighters and the ref in how the fight ended.

Jason in LA
09-20-2011, 08:29 AM
Ortiz's headbutt was completely blatant and his interview after the fact where he tried to explain it was complete bull****.

It's easy to hate Mayweather but the blame goes to both fighters and the ref in how the fight ended.

I can accept this argument much more than one that just goes off on Mayweather. Blame goes to both of them and the ref too, and I'd say that Ortiz is the most to blame.

OABB
09-20-2011, 08:48 AM
I'm curious, what is everybody's opinion on Ortiz's actions? The Mayweather haters, which is just about everybody, isn't saying much about him.

ortiz is a punk and mayweather was justified. my judgement of mayweather is completely objectuve and is based off of what and who he is. I have fought with you before about it and you were convinced manny was hiding something or on roids.

Im glad you are coming around, but your objectivity is latent.

BroncoInferno
09-20-2011, 08:52 AM
I'm curious, what is everybody's opinion on Ortiz's actions? The Mayweather haters, which is just about everybody, isn't saying much about him.

See post #104 for my comments on Ortiz.

I think we'll have to agree to disagree that his past actions should play no part in how you judge this situation. A guy that builds up a lot of good will gets the benefit of the doubt when he does something out of line, and rightfully so. I don't see how that isn't objective. I would say it was out of line no matter who it was, but I probably wouldn't be as hard on someone who doesn't constantly behave like a douche and a thug. That's totally fair. Reaping what you sow and all that.

BroncoInferno
09-20-2011, 08:56 AM
Forget about the legal sucker punch for a moment, Jason. What are your thoughts on the Larry Merchant incident?

Jason in LA
09-20-2011, 10:48 AM
ortiz is a punk and mayweather was justified. my judgement of mayweather is completely objectuve and is based off of what and who he is. I have fought with you before about it and you were convinced manny was hiding something or on roids.

Im glad you are coming around, but your objectivity is latent.

When somebody picks a side based on the players involved and not what actually happened, that's not being objective. Not even close. If Mayweather was not a part of this discuss, and your point of view changed, that means that you're not being objective.

The way that I'm looking at this situations, you could plug in any two fighters and I'd still come up with the same opinion about the situation. That's because I'm being objective.

The reason why I changed my stance on the Manny/Floyd situation was not because of anything that I read on this message board. I did not agree with Manny's stance at the beginning, and to me it seemed like he had something to hide, not that Floyd was ducking the fight. Manny's reasoning for not wanting to give blood within 30 days of the fight was very suspect, where Floyd had nothing to hide by doing it within 2 days. But Manny changed his stance by being willing to do it 5 days within the fight (I read that report somewhere). That wasn't what Floyd wanted, but I feel that's more than close enough. Since Manny drastically changed his stance, I changed my stance. If Floyd won't accept that then it does appear that he is ducking the fight. He's getting nearly everything he wants, so take the damn fight.

I can be objective about it because I'm really not on any side. But most people who are entrenched in the anti Floyd camp is more than likely not going to be objective about it. This thread is proof of that.

Jason in LA
09-20-2011, 10:54 AM
Forget about the legal sucker punch for a moment, Jason. What are your thoughts on the Larry Merchant incident?

Floyd was wrong. I can understand his stance, because he's not the only boxer that hates Merchant. I heard yesterday that Oscar de la Hoya once tried to get HBO to fire Merchant. Merchant can come off as a dickhead, which he is. Kind of like Jim Gray. But even though Floyd may be justified in thinking that Merchant doesn't give him a fair shake or that HBO should fire him, you can't say those things. It was classless. If he didn't want to do the interview then he should have just declined, which he has every right to do. But to go off on a guy before he was even provoked, that was just bad form.

NUB
09-20-2011, 10:59 AM
Mayweather is dodging, there really is no question of this. He's not just moving the goalposts in concerns to negotiations, there have been times when he has straight up lied about any talks at all. He has done everything to avoid a fight and he basically demonstrates all the classic signs of ducking. He wants to protect his record, that's why he fought Mosley and why he fought Ortiz. His record is his legacy; just look at how he talks and presents himself. Imagine Mayweather with one loss, he is not the same guy from a personality standpoint. It means everything to him.

ozomulsion
09-20-2011, 02:57 PM
Those who continue to complain about Mayweather’s punches to Victor Ortiz’s undefended face Saturday need to watch the replay on HBO on Saturday. Referee Joe Cortez very clearly can be heard twice shouting “Let’s go!” and moving his hands together to suggest the boxers fight. More than four seconds elapses from the time that Cortez says “Let’s go!” until Mayweather throws a punch. This is clearly on Ortiz.

There are also many, including HBO’s Larry Merchant, chiding Mayweather for a lack of sportsmanship for punching Ortiz. But Ortiz blatantly head butted Mayweather and no one is chiding him for his lack of sportsmanship. People are defending Ortiz, who intentionally head butted several times in the fight and had a point deducted, and chiding Mayweather, who threw a legal punch when time was in. That doesn’t make a lot of sense.

The same people will continue to bit** about Mayweather no matter what.

Jason in LA
09-20-2011, 05:40 PM
Those who continue to complain about Mayweather’s punches to Victor Ortiz’s undefended face Saturday need to watch the replay on HBO on Saturday. Referee Joe Cortez very clearly can be heard twice shouting “Let’s go!” and moving his hands together to suggest the boxers fight. More than four seconds elapses from the time that Cortez says “Let’s go!” until Mayweather throws a punch. This is clearly on Ortiz.

There are also many, including HBO’s Larry Merchant, chiding Mayweather for a lack of sportsmanship for punching Ortiz. But Ortiz blatantly head butted Mayweather and no one is chiding him for his lack of sportsmanship. People are defending Ortiz, who intentionally head butted several times in the fight and had a point deducted, and chiding Mayweather, who threw a legal punch when time was in. That doesn’t make a lot of sense.

The same people will continue to bit** about Mayweather no matter what.

That's pretty much what I've been saying.

I'd say that Mayweather was super pissed over the dirty head butt, and he he saw his chance, legally, he took it and took it big time.

OABB
09-20-2011, 05:48 PM
When somebody picks a side based on the players involved and not what actually happened, that's not being objective. Not even close. If Mayweather was not a part of this discuss, and your point of view changed, that means that you're not being objective.

The way that I'm looking at this situations, you could plug in any two fighters and I'd still come up with the same opinion about the situation. That's because I'm being objective.

The reason why I changed my stance on the Manny/Floyd situation was not because of anything that I read on this message board. I did not agree with Manny's stance at the beginning, and to me it seemed like he had something to hide, not that Floyd was ducking the fight. Manny's reasoning for not wanting to give blood within 30 days of the fight was very suspect, where Floyd had nothing to hide by doing it within 2 days. But Manny changed his stance by being willing to do it 5 days within the fight (I read that report somewhere). That wasn't what Floyd wanted, but I feel that's more than close enough. Since Manny drastically changed his stance, I changed my stance. If Floyd won't accept that then it does appear that he is ducking the fight. He's getting nearly everything he wants, so take the damn fight.

I can be objective about it because I'm really not on any side. But most people who are entrenched in the anti Floyd camp is more than likely not going to be objective about it. This thread is proof of that.


if you were objective, you would have believed me that filipinos are very supersticious about giving blood...

Lestat
09-20-2011, 06:39 PM
he beat the absolutely breaks off Patterson and could have landed the kill shot at any time he wished.
he chose not to to send a clear message.

i'm not trying to demonize Ali, i would have likely done the same thing.
but what Floyd did was also within the rules and wasn't a cheap shot.

yet he's a pussy for winning the fight and putting Ortiz on his ass.
Patterson was disrespectful to Ali even after Ali called him on it. Floyd antagonized him. Ali was generally respectful to past champions but Floyd crossed the line trying to get in Ali's head and paid for it. Don't demonize Ali for what happened. Floyd asked for it. Ali took no cheap shots and fought within the rules.

Jason in LA
09-20-2011, 08:39 PM
if you were objective, you would have believed me that filipinos are very supersticious about giving blood...

That argument is as lame as it gets, which is why I sided with Mayweather at that time. After Manny agreed to blood testing, I leaned toward his side on the issue. I felt that Manny had compromised enough for Meayweather to take the fight.

You haven't stated one legit reason how I haven't been objective.

RhymesayersDU
09-20-2011, 08:52 PM
That argument is as lame as it gets, which is why I sided with Mayweather at that time. After Manny agreed to blood testing, I leaned toward his side on the issue.

You haven't stated one legit reason how I haven't been objective.

Hey now, I'm very superstitious about black cats and walking underneath ladders.

OABB
09-20-2011, 09:13 PM
its not lame at all. some fighters deink their piss. its not wise to insult somebodies heritage especially when they put their lives in danger. you may think its silly and thats fine, but none of us are brave enough to step into a ring, so we shouldnt judge. my wife is filipino and I assure you that its a legit superstition.

Jason in LA
09-20-2011, 09:20 PM
I'm judging, and it's a lame excuse. Think about it, what if he said that he was superstitious about giving urine for that drug test, are we going to let him slide? Or if he was superstitious in having somebody watch him get his hands wrapped? This is a legitimate sport with millions of dollars on the line, so he needs to get over those superstitions. He should take the test, and I'm glad that he agreed to it. Actually, he never disagreed to giving blood. He just wouldn't agree to do it in a time frame that it could be tested. But he did end up agreeing to do it five days within the fight.

And please don't make this into me insulting somebody's heritage. That's a pretty lame angle.

OABB
09-20-2011, 09:25 PM
I'm judging, and it's a lame excuse. He should take the test, and I'm glad that he agreed to it. Actually, he never disagree to giving blood. He just wouldn't agree to do it in a time frame that it could be tested. But he did end up agreeing to do it five days within the fight.

he believes giving blood will sap his power. is it lame?... maybe...

lets put it this way, if floyd believes that praying to god helps him, what would you think if pacman said he couldnt pray the day of the fight? I know thats not a great analogy, but it makes the point.

dont think for one second that floyd isnt aware of mannys beliefs and is using it for an edge.

Jason in LA
09-20-2011, 09:29 PM
he believes giving blood will sap his power. is it lame?... maybe...

lets put it this way, if floyd believes that praying to god helps him, what would you think if pacman said he couldnt pray the day of the fight? I know thats not a great analogy, but it makes the point.

dont think for one second that floyd isnt aware of mannys beliefs and is using it for an edge.

You're right, that's not a great analogy. Actually, it's a very bad one. You should find an analogy that makes sense and then we can argue the point.

I don't think that Floyd was using the blood test to play against Manny's beliefs. Floyd went to the Olympic style blood testing before the proposed fight with Manny.

OABB
09-20-2011, 10:05 PM
You're right, that's not a great analogy. Actually, it's a very bad one. You should find an analogy that makes sense and then we can argue the point.

I don't think that Floyd was using the blood test to play against Manny's beliefs. Floyd went to the Olympic style blood testing before the proposed fight with Manny.

many fighters dont believe in having sex before a fight either. maybe a semen sample?

troya900
09-20-2011, 10:12 PM
All manny has to do is what boxing requires. The fact manny's agreed to more than that and bitchweather still avoids the fight shows bitchweather is scared ****less at getting that 1 loss against manny

ozomulsion
09-20-2011, 10:59 PM
Why are people trivializing what obviously was an intentional head butt against Floyd Mayweather Jr. by Victor Ortiz? Do you remember a middleweight by the name of Gerald McClellan? He was the best fighter in the world until an intentional head butt turned him into a vegetable. How about Andre Dirrell? Remember him? Arthur Abraham’s foul may have ended his promising career. Or what about Wilfredo Benitez? He was defeating Ray Leonard until a head butt by Leonard late in the fight left him disoriented. If someone is willing to foul that blatantly, who’s to say he won’t try again? What good is a million dollars if you have headaches the rest of your life?

Jason in LA
09-20-2011, 11:08 PM
many fighters dont believe in having sex before a fight either. maybe a semen sample?

I guess.

Jason in LA
09-20-2011, 11:11 PM
Why are people trivializing what obviously was an intentional head butt against Floyd Mayweather Jr. by Victor Ortiz? Do you remember a middleweight by the name of Gerald McClellan? He was the best fighter in the world until an intentional head butt turned him into a vegetable. How about Andre Dirrell? Remember him? Arthur Abraham’s foul may have ended his promising career. Or what about Wilfredo Benitez? He was defeating Ray Leonard until a head butt by Leonard late in the fight left him disoriented. If someone is willing to foul that blatantly, who’s to say he won’t try again? What good is a million dollars if you have headaches the rest of your life?

The way I see it, that head butt had a purpose. It was to hurt Mayweather so that Ortiz could have a chance. Losing the point didn't matter because Mayweather was going to easily out point him. Since he couldn't hit Mayweather much, that was the only way that he could hurt him. So Mayweather knocked his ass out for it. That's what he gets.

RhymesayersDU
09-21-2011, 06:25 AM
many fighters dont believe in having sex before a fight either. maybe a semen sample?

I'm guessing you'll want to take Manny's. You sly dog.

OABB
09-21-2011, 07:47 AM
I'm guessing you'll want to take Manny's. You sly dog.

no. wouldnt want to sap his strength. I want him ready for the fight.

oh..thats right...mayweather is a scared little girl who wont fight and than says he is p4p the best.


no wonder you like him.

maybe you want to eat his pussy?

extralife
09-21-2011, 05:57 PM
this is a pretty high quality conversation.